Author Topic: Shang Chi (Disney/MCU) Spoiler thread  (Read 7233 times)

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Offline Adami

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Re: Shang Chi (Disney/MCU) Spoiler thread
« Reply #35 on: September 07, 2021, 11:58:59 AM »
So a few more random thoughts.

I agree that the ending was rushed and way too over the top, but the general idea was good. Just wished it was executed better.

I was very pleasantly surprised at how much Chinese was actually spoken in the film. I was nervous it would just be a lot of English in thick accents. However, I also think there was too much English in thick accents at the end. When Awkwafina is around, I get it. But when it was just Shang Chi and his dad at the end, I think that should have been all in Chinese. Just a minor issue with me.

I read this as "The Brain" from Pinky & The Brain.

That’s fair. I read all of your posts as Pinky.  :-*
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Re: Shang Chi (Disney/MCU) Spoiler thread
« Reply #36 on: September 07, 2021, 11:59:55 AM »
 :lol

Damn.  I thought I would have been Peter Griffin.
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Offline Adami

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Re: Shang Chi (Disney/MCU) Spoiler thread
« Reply #37 on: September 07, 2021, 12:00:52 PM »
I'll be dead honest I wasn't expecting any Chinese with subtitles so that surprised me. I mean it's just convenient writing to assume that a mysical Chinese land from another dimension speaks Chinese accented English. Of course, this is in a Universe where many alien societies also conveniently speak English so....

If you're referring to aliens seen in the GOTG films and in Captain Marvel, it's explained away that the characters who travel between planets/speak to different species have translator implants and so we hear what they hear (in English, as Peter Quill and Carol Danvers are our protagonists in their respective films) as a means to make it easier for us to understand.

-Marc.

Well that's just lazy writing.

At least there's an explanation. I don't think any such explanation was ever given out, on-screen/in-canon for much of the Star Trek tv series, where sometimes some species do speak their native tongues but a large majority of them read/speak English.

Then again, in the MCU, the universal translator doesn't always work because the Guardians didn't quite know what Groot was saying, outside of Rocket, for much of the first film, although Thor knew Groot's language enough to understand him.

I just think it's easier not to think too much about it when it comes to sci-fi and fantasy stories. The audience sees/reads/hears languages in English for the sake of the audience and not for any in-universe reason most of the time, so I'm fine with just suspending my disbelief.

-Marc.

As far as I can tell, Star Trek also has a universal translator. Its use makes no sense, since the way they said it works, you're really supposed to be hearing the original language and then a translation, but such is life.
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Re: Shang Chi (Disney/MCU) Spoiler thread
« Reply #38 on: September 07, 2021, 12:01:20 PM »
Do you guys find that you focus more on the little things that bother you during the flim or after when you think about what you just saw?
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Re: Shang Chi (Disney/MCU) Spoiler thread
« Reply #39 on: September 07, 2021, 12:04:13 PM »
Star Trek used the universal translator approach as well, even centered episodes around its lack of functionality and efficiency (Darmok). So the MCU writers are being even lazier by stealing the idea :p

Offline Adami

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Re: Shang Chi (Disney/MCU) Spoiler thread
« Reply #40 on: September 07, 2021, 12:27:12 PM »
Do you guys find that you focus more on the little things that bother you during the flim or after when you think about what you just saw?

I think it depends on the film. A bad film, I will notice a lot of flaws. Like the lack of helicopter sound at the end of Army of the Dead. But a good film you generally will ignore or not notice little things. With Shang Chi, it wasn't so much a flaw as just something that would have created more emotional impact.
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Offline Lonk

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Re: Shang Chi (Disney/MCU) Spoiler thread
« Reply #41 on: September 07, 2021, 12:34:27 PM »
I'll be dead honest I wasn't expecting any Chinese with subtitles so that surprised me. I mean it's just convenient writing to assume that a mysical Chinese land from another dimension speaks Chinese accented English. Of course, this is in a Universe where many alien societies also conveniently speak English so....

If you're referring to aliens seen in the GOTG films and in Captain Marvel, it's explained away that the characters who travel between planets/speak to different species have translator implants and so we hear what they hear (in English, as Peter Quill and Carol Danvers are our protagonists in their respective films) as a means to make it easier for us to understand.

-Marc.

So, I started reading about this and it looks like they hinted at this in GOTG and Captain Marvel. I guess I just never really thought of it, but here is a scene from Captain Marvel where they reference a Universal Translator.

https://youtu.be/tGYFUrVD94k?t=9
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Offline Adami

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Re: Shang Chi (Disney/MCU) Spoiler thread
« Reply #42 on: September 07, 2021, 12:37:18 PM »
I'll be dead honest I wasn't expecting any Chinese with subtitles so that surprised me. I mean it's just convenient writing to assume that a mysical Chinese land from another dimension speaks Chinese accented English. Of course, this is in a Universe where many alien societies also conveniently speak English so....

If you're referring to aliens seen in the GOTG films and in Captain Marvel, it's explained away that the characters who travel between planets/speak to different species have translator implants and so we hear what they hear (in English, as Peter Quill and Carol Danvers are our protagonists in their respective films) as a means to make it easier for us to understand.

-Marc.

So, I started reading about this and it looks like they hinted at this in GOTG and Captain Marvel. I guess I just never really thought of it, but here is a scene from Captain Marvel where they reference a Universal Translator.

https://youtu.be/tGYFUrVD94k?t=9

Yup, it's just one of those things you can't think about very much. Or else you'll start wondering how Iron Man, Dr. Strange, and Peter Parker all perfectly understood the non-human Guardians or even Thanos for that matter.
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Re: Shang Chi (Disney/MCU) Spoiler thread
« Reply #43 on: September 07, 2021, 01:27:41 PM »
For translations, I've always thought that The Hunt for Red October did it best.  For the first few minutes on the sub, everyone was speaking Russian.  Then, as the KGB officer was reading a passage from a book, the camera zoomed in on his mouth, and then everything switched to English, and then the camera panned back.  The insinuation being that the characters were still speaking Russian to each other, but the movie audience wouldn't have to read subtitles the whole movie.  I found that to be a very good way of melding the convenience of no subtitles, with the 'reality' the characters would still be speaking their native language.
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Offline Adami

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Re: Shang Chi (Disney/MCU) Spoiler thread
« Reply #44 on: September 07, 2021, 02:08:08 PM »
:lol

Damn.  I thought I would have been Peter Griffin.

Depends on the post.  :justjen
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Re: Shang Chi (Disney/MCU) Spoiler thread
« Reply #45 on: September 07, 2021, 02:40:08 PM »
:lol

Damn.  I thought I would have been Peter Griffin.

Depends on the post.  :justjen

:getoffmylawn:    :lol
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Offline lordxizor

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Re: Shang Chi (Disney/MCU) Spoiler thread
« Reply #46 on: September 15, 2021, 05:34:09 AM »
Finally saw this last night. I quite enjoyed it. One of the better MCU origin films. Yeah the third act was an over the top CGI fest, but that's par for the course at this point. I normally can't stand Akwafina and she was pretty good in this role.

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Re: Shang Chi (Disney/MCU) Spoiler thread
« Reply #47 on: September 26, 2021, 03:46:35 PM »
For translations, I've always thought that The Hunt for Red October did it best.  For the first few minutes on the sub, everyone was speaking Russian.  Then, as the KGB officer was reading a passage from a book, the camera zoomed in on his mouth, and then everything switched to English, and then the camera panned back.  The insinuation being that the characters were still speaking Russian to each other, but the movie audience wouldn't have to read subtitles the whole movie.  I found that to be a very good way of melding the convenience of no subtitles, with the 'reality' the characters would still be speaking their native language.

That's a great scene, and yeah, one of the best examples of letting the audience know about "the switch".  Switching languages, flipping the translator switch in your head, however you want to think of it.  Probably the best example, actually.

Anyway, we saw it Friday night in a cinema, so that was cool.  I loved it, she loved it.  Very Asian, very action, very CGI, very fun.  The dragon fight threatened to be too over-the-top so they kinda kept it short so now it feels rushed but whatever, it was very fun.

Yay for Wong, the obvious way to connect Shang-Chi to the rest of the MCU.

Offline jammindude

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Re: Shang Chi (Disney/MCU) Spoiler thread
« Reply #48 on: October 16, 2021, 06:43:19 PM »
Just saw it finally. I was really impressed.

Some sites have been reporting that the MCU is on a downturn and I just don’t see it at all. Between this and the Eternals trailer…I think we’re heading for something even bigger.
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Re: Shang Chi (Disney/MCU) Spoiler thread
« Reply #49 on: November 14, 2021, 03:15:55 PM »
Just watched it. Was fine. Not in any way bad.

Loved all the creatures, esp the dragons. The soul-sucking thing was cool. I didn't really feel anything after about half way through.

Enjoyed Eternals more.
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Re: Shang Chi (Disney/MCU) Spoiler thread
« Reply #50 on: November 14, 2021, 04:57:12 PM »
I enjoyed it much more on the second go, especially the fight scenes, so well choreographed

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Re: Shang Chi (Disney/MCU) Spoiler thread
« Reply #51 on: November 14, 2021, 05:25:18 PM »
At some point, I'll be re-watching it with jingle.daughter (since she didn't join us in the theaters) - but probably not until Christmas break.  Very much looking forward to seeing it again, for precisely the reason you stated, Cheffy
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Re: Shang Chi (Disney/MCU) Spoiler thread
« Reply #52 on: November 14, 2021, 07:45:18 PM »
I thought it was great. That being said, I probably won't watch it again, but I'm looking forward to seeing the characters in the future. I had a good time.

But that expository dialogue from Katy... @!$# Can these high paid MCU writers (or any other writers in Hollywood who write the same shit) seriously not think of a way to convey that these two are friends of many years other than "we've been friends for 10 years"? "Oh we have, I must have forgotten."

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Re: Shang Chi (Disney/MCU) Spoiler thread
« Reply #53 on: November 15, 2021, 09:10:32 AM »
Finally saw this.  Very entertaining!  Maybe middle of the MCU pack or slightly above, for my tastes, after one viewing.  Definitely a CGI-fest in the final battle, but hey, what are you going to do?  The design on the Dweller in Darkness was horrifying.  I liked the mid-credits scene, as well.  The martial arts action was unbelievable.

Will re-watch as soon as possible.
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Re: Shang Chi (Disney/MCU) Spoiler thread
« Reply #54 on: November 15, 2021, 09:45:20 AM »
I thought it was a great movie.  I like when Marvel pulls in the cultural elements (Black Panther) and puts their superhero in a world that is true to where they live and how they have been raised.  It makes it more interesting than standard superhero lore.

I had read virtually nothing about the film prior to watching it.  So I was really thrown for a loop when the dialogue was in Chinese at the beginning, and started futzing with my Roku to see if the audio track had been changed from English.   :lol


Offline bosk1

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Re: Shang Chi (Disney/MCU) Spoiler thread
« Reply #55 on: November 15, 2021, 10:21:18 AM »
Having seen it a second time now, I still feel about the same as when I initially posted after seeing it in theaters:
Was loving the movie up to about the mid-point.  When they were locked away and heard strange sounds coming from somewhere, I guessed that it was Trevor and whispered that to my daughter.  I was giddy when it turned out to be him.  But almost immediately right after that, everything seemed so forced.  It was visually stunning, and incredibly well-choreographed.  But the writing and acting seemed very forced and contrived from that point forward. 

Still, a good movie.  If it were as consistently good all the way through as the first half, it would definitely be up near the top, probably just behind the Avengers films and Homecoming.  As it is, it is somewhere nearer to the bottom with Black Panther.  I don't expect Marvel to hit a home run every time.  A few walks and infield singles are just fine in the grand scheme of things.  Film-wise, phase 4 is pretty pedestrian so far, so I'm glad I'm not expecting huge things.  It's Marvel.  It's fun.  And getting so much right about Chinese culture is a nice bonus.

Still kinda felt the same about how the film was divided too.  With the Trevor reveal, I was like "Yay, Trevor!  Love me some Trevor!"  But then every scene he was in just felt like it went nowhere. 

Overall, I just found it hard to be invested in the characters and the conflict.  But then again, that is often a "problem" with the standalone solo superhero movies, IMO.  Iron Man was a really good movie.  But it wasn't great.  What made the character and his conflicts great was that they built far beyond what we saw in the first film.  And to different degrees, I think that's true of most of the films.  So, I'm not necessarily knocking this film for it.  I just don't overly care for Shang Chi or Katy...yet.  But I look forward to seeing how they fit into the bigger picture as time goes on. 

I will say this though as a criticism, and I have no idea whether this is a popular or unpopular opinion, but here goes:  I continue to be frustrated by Akwafina's casting.  Having seen her in a few different things now, I think she is developing into a pretty good actress.  She can be perfectly believable being quirky, sincere, and a whole range of other things.  That said, it seems like she also has a really difficult time shedding her past (or those that write for her do).  She consistently (not just in this movie) has lines of dialog where it feels like her only job is to drop gratuitous, crass profanity that sounds like a 12 year old that just discovered swear words.  It's both offputting and unnecessary.  And the other issue I have in this film in particular is that I feel like they tried to do a bit too much with her, without her character having earned it.  And it is, again, unnecessary.  She is GREAT as a sidekick.  I feel like she significantly elevates the movie as a sidekick.  She doesn't need to be more than that, and I feel like the movie actually suffers a bit from trying to make her more than that.  It's cool that Marvel has been leaning into presenting women as strong and independent.  It often works great (e.g. virtually every female character in Black Panther), even if it may sometimes feel a bit too on the nose.  But there's no need to try to do that with every major female character in every film.  And this was a case where, IMO, it didn't work.
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Re: Shang Chi (Disney/MCU) Spoiler thread
« Reply #56 on: November 15, 2021, 10:42:34 AM »
Watched the Making of last night, good stuff. The attention to detail surrounding the fight scenes, and everything in general as it pertained to Chinese culture, was done with as much respect as possible. I love that Marvel does this, and that respect is reflected in all the main actors.

Offline bosk1

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Re: Shang Chi (Disney/MCU) Spoiler thread
« Reply #57 on: November 15, 2021, 10:54:24 AM »
On D+?  I was looking for something like that under "extras" when I watched it Friday night, but there wasn't anything there.
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Re: Shang Chi (Disney/MCU) Spoiler thread
« Reply #58 on: November 15, 2021, 10:56:37 AM »
On D+?  I was looking for something like that under "extras" when I watched it Friday night, but there wasn't anything there.

It's under the Marvel Studios Assembled series. They also got Black Widow which was really good as well. Never get enough of Florence Pugh. Gonna watch the What If? one when I get home today

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Re: Shang Chi (Disney/MCU) Spoiler thread
« Reply #59 on: November 15, 2021, 11:05:57 AM »
I love those.  They give me so much greater of an appreciation for the films. 
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Re: Shang Chi (Disney/MCU) Spoiler thread
« Reply #60 on: November 15, 2021, 11:22:53 AM »
Watched the Making of last night, good stuff. The attention to detail surrounding the fight scenes, and everything in general as it pertained to Chinese culture, was done with as much respect as possible. I love that Marvel does this, and that respect is reflected in all the main actors.

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Re: Shang Chi (Disney/MCU) Spoiler thread
« Reply #61 on: November 15, 2021, 11:30:42 AM »
Watched the Making of last night, good stuff. The attention to detail surrounding the fight scenes, and everything in general as it pertained to Chinese culture, was done with as much respect as possible. I love that Marvel does this, and that respect is reflected in all the main actors.

Oohhh... giddy up!
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Re: Shang Chi (Disney/MCU) Spoiler thread
« Reply #62 on: November 15, 2021, 03:18:18 PM »
Finally saw this.  Very entertaining!  Maybe middle of the MCU pack or slightly above, for my tastes, after one viewing.  Definitely a CGI-fest in the final battle, but hey, what are you going to do?  The design on the Dweller in Darkness was horrifying.  I liked the mid-credits scene, as well.  The martial arts action was unbelievable.

Will re-watch as soon as possible.

The fight on the side of the building was straight out of a Jackie Chan movie, and Katy suddenly singing Hotel California cracked me up.

Also, the actress who played Katy sounded so much like Scarlett Johansson that it was a little distracting.

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Re: Shang Chi (Disney/MCU) Spoiler thread
« Reply #63 on: November 15, 2021, 04:46:46 PM »
.
Also, the actress who played Katy sounded so much like Scarlett Johansson that it was a little distracting.

Awkwafina? I don't hear it at all :lol
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Re: Shang Chi (Disney/MCU) Spoiler thread
« Reply #64 on: November 15, 2021, 05:19:13 PM »
.
Also, the actress who played Katy sounded so much like Scarlett Johansson that it was a little distracting.

Awkwafina? I don't hear it at all :lol

They both kind of have a raspy quality to their voice, so I can understand why someone would think they sound similar, but that's really where it ends I think.

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Re: Shang Chi (Disney/MCU) Spoiler thread
« Reply #65 on: November 15, 2021, 05:38:23 PM »
She sounds like an old Jewish lady. She is absolutely hilarious and what a great role.
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Re: Shang Chi (Disney/MCU) Spoiler thread
« Reply #66 on: November 16, 2021, 07:31:52 AM »
Finally saw this.  Very entertaining!  Maybe middle of the MCU pack or slightly above, for my tastes, after one viewing.  Definitely a CGI-fest in the final battle, but hey, what are you going to do?  The design on the Dweller in Darkness was horrifying.  I liked the mid-credits scene, as well.  The martial arts action was unbelievable.

Will re-watch as soon as possible.

The fight on the side of the building was straight out of a Jackie Chan movie, and Katy suddenly singing Hotel California cracked me up.

Also, the actress who played Katy sounded so much like Scarlett Johansson that it was a little distracting.


Parts of the bus fight also reminded me of Jackie Chan.

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Re: Shang Chi (Disney/MCU) Spoiler thread
« Reply #67 on: November 16, 2021, 10:13:51 AM »
Finally saw this.  Very entertaining!  Maybe middle of the MCU pack or slightly above, for my tastes, after one viewing.  Definitely a CGI-fest in the final battle, but hey, what are you going to do?  The design on the Dweller in Darkness was horrifying.  I liked the mid-credits scene, as well.  The martial arts action was unbelievable.

Will re-watch as soon as possible.

The fight on the side of the building was straight out of a Jackie Chan movie, and Katy suddenly singing Hotel California cracked me up.

Also, the actress who played Katy sounded so much like Scarlett Johansson that it was a little distracting.


Parts of the bus fight also reminded me of Jackie Chan.
My wife, who is not normally into kung-fu films at all, asked during the film if Jackie Chan had helped with the fight choreography.
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Re: Shang Chi (Disney/MCU) Spoiler thread
« Reply #68 on: November 16, 2021, 10:23:44 AM »
I think that's pretty good anecdotal evidence that they achieved what they were going for.
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Re: Shang Chi (Disney/MCU) Spoiler thread
« Reply #69 on: November 16, 2021, 10:25:00 AM »
I think that's pretty good anecdotal evidence that they achieved what they were going for.
Probably so.
Hef is right on all things. Except for when I disagree with him. In which case he's probably still right.