Author Topic: "Official" Lost Not Forgotten (official bootlegs) thread  (Read 113248 times)

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Offline adastra

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Re: "Official" Lost Not Forgotten (official bootlegs) thread
« Reply #560 on: April 27, 2022, 08:58:54 PM »
I heard the Lice In NYC  version of A Change of Seasons today for the first time.
Oh man, what a mess  :D

It did so much good for that song that It had more time to get matured before recorded.
I didn´t like the vocals or lyrics on this early version. And the intro was all over the place.
There was something that I actually really liked;  The almost Luca Turillish unison solo before the Crimson Sunset.  But yeah, I think it was good idea to drop it.

What a great recording this Live In NYC is!
 
Stay by my side / as I fade / so you can point to the end of my struggle /and the twilight of eternal days / at the low, dark edge of life.

Offline Madman Shepherd

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Re: "Official" Lost Not Forgotten (official bootlegs) thread
« Reply #561 on: April 28, 2022, 06:15:51 AM »
Also, the bit about it being understood is a bit iffy.  I don't remember what tour it was, but I remember seeing that they had back to back shows scheduled in Calgary.  Knowing that this was a thing that DT did, and thinking they might cover a Rush album since they were in Canada, I came very close to buying plane tickets and a ticket for the second night.  Fortunately, I didn't do it because the set list for the second night was did not feature a cover performance (and yes, this was while MP was still in the band).
After the 2002 Barcelona show when they did MoP for the very first time, MP made it very clear that those cover album shows would only happen when they did two-night-stands at Evening With shows. Those shows in Calgary were part of Prog Nation 2008 which had 3 bands opening, so DT was only doing a 90 minute set to begin with. It's given they weren't gonna do a cover album at those shows.

Made it clear how and to whom?  The several dozen people who were regularly on the MP forums?  It ultimately didn't matter for me, but I had heard hearsay about the whole "second night" thing, but I had no inkling that there were caveats.  And, in any event, this gets back to the original point, which is that, except for the most super dialed-in fans, the "second night" thing (much less the stipulations)....

I hate to say it but that would have been a perfect time for a press release, maybe complete with a flowchart about when a 2nd night would always, sometimes be used to cover an album in its entirety.

Offline hefdaddy42

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Re: "Official" Lost Not Forgotten (official bootlegs) thread
« Reply #562 on: April 28, 2022, 07:42:59 AM »
Also, the bit about it being understood is a bit iffy.  I don't remember what tour it was, but I remember seeing that they had back to back shows scheduled in Calgary.  Knowing that this was a thing that DT did, and thinking they might cover a Rush album since they were in Canada, I came very close to buying plane tickets and a ticket for the second night.  Fortunately, I didn't do it because the set list for the second night was did not feature a cover performance (and yes, this was while MP was still in the band).
After the 2002 Barcelona show when they did MoP for the very first time, MP made it very clear that those cover album shows would only happen when they did two-night-stands at Evening With shows. Those shows in Calgary were part of Prog Nation 2008 which had 3 bands opening, so DT was only doing a 90 minute set to begin with. It's given they weren't gonna do a cover album at those shows.

Made it clear how and to whom?  The several dozen people who were regularly on the MP forums?  It ultimately didn't matter for me, but I had heard hearsay about the whole "second night" thing, but I had no inkling that there were caveats.  And, in any event, this gets back to the original point, which is that, except for the most super dialed-in fans, the "second night" thing (much less the stipulations) was not well-known or regularly understood by most folks who bought tickets to DT shows.  Again, it ultimately didn't matter for me, and I certainly knew there was no guarantee about the show I considered (which is the primary reason I didn't pull the trigger on the tickets).  However, if I had gone to a DT show and had gotten a bunch of Pink Floyd covers, I'd have been crazy pissed.
Not sure what to say.  It was made known by the band (MP) to the fans who know things through the ways that those things are made known.  People who don't make it a point to keep up or know stuff, didn't know.  *shrugs*
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Offline Stadler

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Re: "Official" Lost Not Forgotten (official bootlegs) thread
« Reply #563 on: April 28, 2022, 07:50:01 AM »
Iron Maiden faced the same sort of controversy; now it's sort of an unwritten rule (since broken by COVID and the introduction of Senjutsu into the setlist) that the band alternates tours; album tours feature an album-heavy setlist and the off-cycle tours are "hits" tours.  And it's the same deal; "not everyone is a member of the fanclub".  "Not everyone is on line."   "Not everyone has ears."

Look, the world isn't perfect.  Short of sending out a mailer with each ticket there is ALWAYS someone who is going to have more information than the person next to them.  This isn't like people are being evicted from their homes without notice.  I think this is a sort of "entitlement" issue; there was a time, in my lifetime, that you had NO WAY of knowing what was being played until the notes were struck.  And if you were a Kiss fan and got ALL of Lick It Up and only a handful of the "classic hits" - which happened to me in '83 - too bad, so sad.  There's likely to be SOMEONE pissed at every show; the best any band can do is stick to their guns and hope that the net/net of the "oh yeahs!" outweigh the "oh shits".

EDIT:  Hef said it a lot nicer and a lot more succintly.  :) :)

Online HOF

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Re: "Official" Lost Not Forgotten (official bootlegs) thread
« Reply #564 on: April 28, 2022, 09:45:00 AM »
I feel like I sort of lit the fuse and got away with this thread. It’s not a crime against humanity or anything, and at some point I think these were reasonably well advertised as being special shows on the second night. And lots of bands have done covers type shows on special occasions (DT had done that before even with the Ronnie Scott’s gig which I think was really cool). I think for me it’s more the specific albums they covered. Master of Puppets and Number of the Beast? Zero interest in hearing that. I actually do like Dark Side of the Moon, and the portions of that show that I’ve seen sounded good. I think I’d still have been disappointed if for some reason that were the only of the two nights I could have gone to, but I at least could have enjoyed it probably (all theoretical of course, I wasn’t in position to see any of those shows).

Offline Madman Shepherd

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Re: "Official" Lost Not Forgotten (official bootlegs) thread
« Reply #565 on: April 28, 2022, 09:55:55 AM »
Also, the bit about it being understood is a bit iffy.  I don't remember what tour it was, but I remember seeing that they had back to back shows scheduled in Calgary.  Knowing that this was a thing that DT did, and thinking they might cover a Rush album since they were in Canada, I came very close to buying plane tickets and a ticket for the second night.  Fortunately, I didn't do it because the set list for the second night was did not feature a cover performance (and yes, this was while MP was still in the band).
After the 2002 Barcelona show when they did MoP for the very first time, MP made it very clear that those cover album shows would only happen when they did two-night-stands at Evening With shows. Those shows in Calgary were part of Prog Nation 2008 which had 3 bands opening, so DT was only doing a 90 minute set to begin with. It's given they weren't gonna do a cover album at those shows.

Made it clear how and to whom?  The several dozen people who were regularly on the MP forums?  It ultimately didn't matter for me, but I had heard hearsay about the whole "second night" thing, but I had no inkling that there were caveats.  And, in any event, this gets back to the original point, which is that, except for the most super dialed-in fans, the "second night" thing (much less the stipulations) was not well-known or regularly understood by most folks who bought tickets to DT shows.  Again, it ultimately didn't matter for me, and I certainly knew there was no guarantee about the show I considered (which is the primary reason I didn't pull the trigger on the tickets).  However, if I had gone to a DT show and had gotten a bunch of Pink Floyd covers, I'd have been crazy pissed.
Not sure what to say.  It was made known by the band (MP) to the fans who know things through the ways that those things are made known.  People who don't make it a point to keep up or know stuff, didn't know.  *shrugs*

Was it made known outside of Portnoy's site though?

Offline gzarruk

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Re: "Official" Lost Not Forgotten (official bootlegs) thread
« Reply #566 on: April 28, 2022, 10:28:17 AM »
I feel like I sort of lit the fuse and got away with this thread. It’s not a crime against humanity or anything, and at some point I think these were reasonably well advertised as being special shows on the second night. And lots of bands have done covers type shows on special occasions (DT had done that before even with the Ronnie Scott’s gig which I think was really cool). I think for me it’s more the specific albums they covered. Master of Puppets and Number of the Beast? Zero interest in hearing that. I actually do like Dark Side of the Moon, and the portions of that show that I’ve seen sounded good. I think I’d still have been disappointed if for some reason that were the only of the two nights I could have gone to, but I at least could have enjoyed it probably (all theoretical of course, I wasn’t in position to see any of those shows).

Opinions obviously vary a lot depending on who you're asking, but I'd say that 9 out of 10 DT fans would prefer a full DT show over a set with a lot of covers, specially some famous album by other band who has probably played it thousands of times before already. I know some of these classic bands don't tour/exist anymore (Pink Floyd, for example), but I'd think that for the most part if fans wanted to hear X band's music they could attend that band's concert.

I haven't been able to attend a live DT show yet (the only time they ever came here I was a 14 year old that couldn't afford the ticket nor couldn't find anyone to go with), but I know I'd be really disappointed if I went to one of their shows and got an hour worth of some other band's material, just give me my DT :lol

Now, adding one or two covers to your set on special occasions can definitely be a highlight to a particular show (like when they did 21st Century Schizoid Man with Crimson Projekct), but I think those mostly work well as an exception, not the rule. The opposite case was that live album by Sons Of Apollo (not DT, but still related) where while they didn't cover a full classic album, they played a huge selection of random classic rock covers with an orchestra just because. They could've just played a few more things from the Derek-DT era that would've suited that band well or even some more stuff from each of the members' catalog, but instead added a bunch of unnecessary stuff, and some online reviews I read for it called it a very good show, but bloated with a lot of stuff that wasn't needed there.
It sounds like, "ruk, ruk, ruk, ruk, ruk." Instead of the more pleasing kick drum sound of, "gzarruk, gzarruk, gzarruk, gzarruk."

Offline Madman Shepherd

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Re: "Official" Lost Not Forgotten (official bootlegs) thread
« Reply #567 on: April 28, 2022, 10:53:40 AM »
Let me just say, I love the cover albums. I bought all of them. I listened to Darkside quite a bit, mainly because I wasn't really a fan of Pink Floyd and this made me gain an appreciation for them.

I listened to MoP and NotB somewhat. Not the biggest fan of either but I like them. I'm a huge fan of Deep Purple but rarely listen to that one. I was never a fan of the bloviated jam sessions.

With that said, I would not have been happy if I listened to a set consisting of 50% covers of albums I was either unfamiliar with or didn't care for. Since I wasn't in that position, heck yeah I like the cover albums.

But for all the talk about how fans knew. I bet before these things were released on Amazon, less than a quarter of fans had any idea they covered albums in full let alone sold them.

Offline ZirconBlue

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Re: "Official" Lost Not Forgotten (official bootlegs) thread
« Reply #568 on: April 28, 2022, 12:12:52 PM »

Did DT advertise that the second night in a city would feature a cover beyond mentioning it on online forums? I would have to imagine the majority of people going to that second night had no idea a cover was coming.

Not at first, no.  Only when there was a lot of criticism of it after the first couple did Portnoy then make it clear that the second night of two nights in the same city would feature the cover of a classic album.  I know this because we traveled to Chicago for the 2nd night there in 2002, and we never would have bought tickets to go to just the 2nd show had we known that the whole set would be covers.  Not complaining (anymore :lol ), just saying.


I travelled to Chicago (from central Kentucky) for both of those shows, because I knew what they were doing, so I'm not sure how you missed the news.

Offline 425

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Re: "Official" Lost Not Forgotten (official bootlegs) thread
« Reply #569 on: April 28, 2022, 12:22:31 PM »
Iron Maiden faced the same sort of controversy; now it's sort of an unwritten rule (since broken by COVID and the introduction of Senjutsu into the setlist) that the band alternates tours; album tours feature an album-heavy setlist and the off-cycle tours are "hits" tours.  And it's the same deal; "not everyone is a member of the fanclub".  "Not everyone is on line."   "Not everyone has ears."

Look, the world isn't perfect.  Short of sending out a mailer with each ticket there is ALWAYS someone who is going to have more information than the person next to them.  This isn't like people are being evicted from their homes without notice.  I think this is a sort of "entitlement" issue; there was a time, in my lifetime, that you had NO WAY of knowing what was being played until the notes were struck.  And if you were a Kiss fan and got ALL of Lick It Up and only a handful of the "classic hits" - which happened to me in '83 - too bad, so sad.  There's likely to be SOMEONE pissed at every show; the best any band can do is stick to their guns and hope that the net/net of the "oh yeahs!" outweigh the "oh shits".

EDIT:  Hef said it a lot nicer and a lot more succintly.  :) :)

I'm more sympathetic to people who were felt caught off guard by these things before the widespread availability of information like this online. Today, you can very quickly and easily find all the information you want. If the setlist matters that much to you, you can seek out information about it with little difficult and for no expense. If you don't even bother to spend a few minutes seeking out information, I think you should be prepared to live with the consequences of that choice.

Personally, I can't relate to this at all, or the kind of people Madman Shepherd mentioned who call themselves superfans but don't know a lot of relatively basic information about the band. I'm not saying this to be judgmental about the way people enjoy their hobbies, they can do what they want (so long as they accept the natural consequences of their choices), but I like to learn and read about artists I listen to a lot, so I'm always surprised when alleged superfans don't seem to have read anything at all.
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Online HOF

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Re: "Official" Lost Not Forgotten (official bootlegs) thread
« Reply #570 on: April 28, 2022, 12:47:08 PM »
I do think those of us engaged in online forums about the band are probably the nerdiest of the nerdy, so I wouldn’t really expect everyone to be that engaged, even many who call themselves big fans. There are also different age groups who may consume different amounts of online information. Though I will say I’m not sure there are too many other avenues for becoming a fan of DT outside of online exposure. I guess video games (since Guitar Hero).

Offline Stadler

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Re: "Official" Lost Not Forgotten (official bootlegs) thread
« Reply #571 on: April 28, 2022, 01:04:44 PM »
Iron Maiden faced the same sort of controversy; now it's sort of an unwritten rule (since broken by COVID and the introduction of Senjutsu into the setlist) that the band alternates tours; album tours feature an album-heavy setlist and the off-cycle tours are "hits" tours.  And it's the same deal; "not everyone is a member of the fanclub".  "Not everyone is on line."   "Not everyone has ears."

Look, the world isn't perfect.  Short of sending out a mailer with each ticket there is ALWAYS someone who is going to have more information than the person next to them.  This isn't like people are being evicted from their homes without notice.  I think this is a sort of "entitlement" issue; there was a time, in my lifetime, that you had NO WAY of knowing what was being played until the notes were struck.  And if you were a Kiss fan and got ALL of Lick It Up and only a handful of the "classic hits" - which happened to me in '83 - too bad, so sad.  There's likely to be SOMEONE pissed at every show; the best any band can do is stick to their guns and hope that the net/net of the "oh yeahs!" outweigh the "oh shits".

EDIT:  Hef said it a lot nicer and a lot more succintly.  :) :)

I'm more sympathetic to people who were felt caught off guard by these things before the widespread availability of information like this online. Today, you can very quickly and easily find all the information you want. If the setlist matters that much to you, you can seek out information about it with little difficult and for no expense. If you don't even bother to spend a few minutes seeking out information, I think you should be prepared to live with the consequences of that choice.

Personally, I can't relate to this at all, or the kind of people Madman Shepherd mentioned who call themselves superfans but don't know a lot of relatively basic information about the band. I'm not saying this to be judgmental about the way people enjoy their hobbies, they can do what they want (so long as they accept the natural consequences of their choices), but I like to learn and read about artists I listen to a lot, so I'm always surprised when alleged superfans don't seem to have read anything at all.

Well, that's a whole 'other topic.  I don't know why we can't all just be "fans". The whole concept of "super fan" strikes me as exceedingly insecure and needy.  It's not a contest, there's not a scorecard and we're not getting paid for it.  But that's just me.

Offline 425

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Re: "Official" Lost Not Forgotten (official bootlegs) thread
« Reply #572 on: April 28, 2022, 01:34:34 PM »
I should clarify; I'm not trying to do that thing where a person tries to prove that they're "more of a fan" than some other person. I definitely agree that that's insecure and needy. And I'm definitely not trying to say that people who seek out more information are somehow better than people who don't. I guess I'm just expressing confusion at a way of doing things that is very alien to me (but I should say that there are a lot of ways in which I'm very unlike most people, so I guess it shouldn't surprise me that much, and if anything my default should be to think that I'm the unusual one).
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Online TAC

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Re: "Official" Lost Not Forgotten (official bootlegs) thread
« Reply #573 on: April 28, 2022, 01:40:50 PM »

Did DT advertise that the second night in a city would feature a cover beyond mentioning it on online forums? I would have to imagine the majority of people going to that second night had no idea a cover was coming.

Not at first, no.  Only when there was a lot of criticism of it after the first couple did Portnoy then make it clear that the second night of two nights in the same city would feature the cover of a classic album.  I know this because we traveled to Chicago for the 2nd night there in 2002, and we never would have bought tickets to go to just the 2nd show had we known that the whole set would be covers.  Not complaining (anymore :lol ), just saying.


I travelled to Chicago (from central Kentucky) for both of those shows, because I knew what they were doing, so I'm not sure how you missed the news.

Huh..was it advertised somewhere? In 2002, my only way of knowing DT was coming to Boston was when it was announced in a local music paper.
would have thought the same thing but seeing the OP was TAC i immediately thought Maiden or DT related
Winger Theater Forums........or WTF.  ;D
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Offline Stadler

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Re: "Official" Lost Not Forgotten (official bootlegs) thread
« Reply #574 on: April 28, 2022, 01:53:17 PM »
I should clarify; I'm not trying to do that thing where a person tries to prove that they're "more of a fan" than some other person. I definitely agree that that's insecure and needy. And I'm definitely not trying to say that people who seek out more information are somehow better than people who don't. I guess I'm just expressing confusion at a way of doing things that is very alien to me (but I should say that there are a lot of ways in which I'm very unlike most people, so I guess it shouldn't surprise me that much, and if anything my default should be to think that I'm the unusual one).

Well, I never once meant to imply I was talking about you.  I was thinking about those people that need the label but can't even name (let alone having heard) some of their bigger albums.  I would think a DT superfan would at least have heard ALL their records.  We DO have some fans here that are serious and dedicated to the band, but I can't imagine someone like Scotty proclaiming "I'm a superfan!!"   He just is and it speaks for itself (though we'll do it for him! :)). 

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Re: "Official" Lost Not Forgotten (official bootlegs) thread
« Reply #575 on: April 28, 2022, 01:56:13 PM »
Apparently you missed this post..

Quote from: Setlist Scotty
I'm a SUPERFAN!!     I'm a SUPERFAN!!
would have thought the same thing but seeing the OP was TAC i immediately thought Maiden or DT related
Winger Theater Forums........or WTF.  ;D
TAC got a higher score than me in the electronic round? Honestly, can I just drop out now? :lol

Offline Stadler

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Re: "Official" Lost Not Forgotten (official bootlegs) thread
« Reply #576 on: April 28, 2022, 01:58:14 PM »
Hahaha!  :) :) :)

Offline 425

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Re: "Official" Lost Not Forgotten (official bootlegs) thread
« Reply #577 on: April 28, 2022, 02:11:13 PM »
I should clarify; I'm not trying to do that thing where a person tries to prove that they're "more of a fan" than some other person. I definitely agree that that's insecure and needy. And I'm definitely not trying to say that people who seek out more information are somehow better than people who don't. I guess I'm just expressing confusion at a way of doing things that is very alien to me (but I should say that there are a lot of ways in which I'm very unlike most people, so I guess it shouldn't surprise me that much, and if anything my default should be to think that I'm the unusual one).

Well, I never once meant to imply I was talking about you.  I was thinking about those people that need the label but can't even name (let alone having heard) some of their bigger albums.  I would think a DT superfan would at least have heard ALL their records.  We DO have some fans here that are serious and dedicated to the band, but I can't imagine someone like Scotty proclaiming "I'm a superfan!!"   He just is and it speaks for itself (though we'll do it for him! :)).

Got it! That makes a lot of sense to me.
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Re: "Official" Lost Not Forgotten (official bootlegs) thread
« Reply #578 on: April 28, 2022, 02:54:46 PM »

Did DT advertise that the second night in a city would feature a cover beyond mentioning it on online forums? I would have to imagine the majority of people going to that second night had no idea a cover was coming.

Not at first, no.  Only when there was a lot of criticism of it after the first couple did Portnoy then make it clear that the second night of two nights in the same city would feature the cover of a classic album.  I know this because we traveled to Chicago for the 2nd night there in 2002, and we never would have bought tickets to go to just the 2nd show had we known that the whole set would be covers.  Not complaining (anymore :lol ), just saying.


I travelled to Chicago (from central Kentucky) for both of those shows, because I knew what they were doing, so I'm not sure how you missed the news.

Huh..was it advertised somewhere? In 2002, my only way of knowing DT was coming to Boston was when it was announced in a local music paper.

Exactly.  In 2002, I was unaware of any online information source about what DT might be playing.  I only learned this week that MP had actually made a (semi-)public pronouncement at some point about the second night of tour stops.

The ultimate point of all this is that only the most super-dialed in folks knew about this (esp. back at the turn of the century).  This was NOT something that was universally known to the general ticket-buying public.  So that's "how [we] missed the news."
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Offline KevShmev

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Re: "Official" Lost Not Forgotten (official bootlegs) thread
« Reply #579 on: April 28, 2022, 04:54:48 PM »

Did DT advertise that the second night in a city would feature a cover beyond mentioning it on online forums? I would have to imagine the majority of people going to that second night had no idea a cover was coming.

Not at first, no.  Only when there was a lot of criticism of it after the first couple did Portnoy then make it clear that the second night of two nights in the same city would feature the cover of a classic album.  I know this because we traveled to Chicago for the 2nd night there in 2002, and we never would have bought tickets to go to just the 2nd show had we known that the whole set would be covers.  Not complaining (anymore :lol ), just saying.


I travelled to Chicago (from central Kentucky) for both of those shows, because I knew what they were doing, so I'm not sure how you missed the news.

Huh..was it advertised somewhere? In 2002, my only way of knowing DT was coming to Boston was when it was announced in a local music paper.

No, it was not, and anyone saying it was known anywhere is dabbling in revisionist history.  There was no official announcement, no news, no anything. 

The band made no announcements that the second night would feature a cover album prior to the tour.  Once they did Master of Puppets the first time, it was then speculated that the second night in each city getting two shows would get the same treatment, but that was NEVER confirmed by the band or Mike Portnoy ANYWHERE.  Only when they did the Chicago show (the 2nd one where MoP was played) and there was a lot of online blowback, did Portnoy then release an unofficial statement confirming that that would be the case going forward on the rest of that tour.

Anyone saying that that was not the case is either misremembering or talking out of their behinds. :P :P

Offline Cool Chris

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Re: "Official" Lost Not Forgotten (official bootlegs) thread
« Reply #580 on: April 28, 2022, 06:33:34 PM »
...I'm not sure how you missed the news.

There was no official announcement, no news, no anything. 

I say this in jest, Kev, but you aren't sure how we missed the news, despite there not being any? :p
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Offline KevShmev

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Re: "Official" Lost Not Forgotten (official bootlegs) thread
« Reply #581 on: April 28, 2022, 08:22:24 PM »
Now I am confused since that first quote there wasn't mine.  :lol :lol

Offline Cool Chris

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Re: "Official" Lost Not Forgotten (official bootlegs) thread
« Reply #582 on: April 28, 2022, 08:41:43 PM »
Damn quote pyramids!
"Nostalgia is just the ability to forget the things that sucked" - Nelson DeMille, 'Up Country'

Offline ZirconBlue

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Re: "Official" Lost Not Forgotten (official bootlegs) thread
« Reply #583 on: April 29, 2022, 11:05:55 AM »

Did DT advertise that the second night in a city would feature a cover beyond mentioning it on online forums? I would have to imagine the majority of people going to that second night had no idea a cover was coming.

Not at first, no.  Only when there was a lot of criticism of it after the first couple did Portnoy then make it clear that the second night of two nights in the same city would feature the cover of a classic album.  I know this because we traveled to Chicago for the 2nd night there in 2002, and we never would have bought tickets to go to just the 2nd show had we known that the whole set would be covers.  Not complaining (anymore :lol ), just saying.


I travelled to Chicago (from central Kentucky) for both of those shows, because I knew what they were doing, so I'm not sure how you missed the news.

Huh..was it advertised somewhere? In 2002, my only way of knowing DT was coming to Boston was when it was announced in a local music paper.

No, it was not, and anyone saying it was known anywhere is dabbling in revisionist history.  There was no official announcement, no news, no anything. 

The band made no announcements that the second night would feature a cover album prior to the tour.  Once they did Master of Puppets the first time, it was then speculated that the second night in each city getting two shows would get the same treatment, but that was NEVER confirmed by the band or Mike Portnoy ANYWHERE.  Only when they did the Chicago show (the 2nd one where MoP was played) and there was a lot of online blowback, did Portnoy then release an unofficial statement confirming that that would be the case going forward on the rest of that tour.

Anyone saying that that was not the case is either misremembering or talking out of their behinds. :P :P


Well, I would search the mp.com forums, if they were available, but I'm telling you, I did not drive from Central Kentucky to Chicago for a 2-night stay on a whim.  I knew about the 2nd night cover album, and my wife was hoping they'd break out a Rush album.  Alas, it was only Metallica instead.


Edit:  It may have been speculation, rather than official at that point, but I was certain we were going to be getting a cover album on night 2.
« Last Edit: April 29, 2022, 11:11:59 AM by ZirconBlue »

Offline DanLore

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Re: "Official" Lost Not Forgotten (official bootlegs) thread
« Reply #584 on: April 29, 2022, 12:51:50 PM »
This discussion reminded me of the first DT show I attended with my wife.  We went to the 2nd night at The Beacon on 03/28/2002, my third show of that tour.  I have no recollection of how I found out, but I knew we were getting Master of Puppets for the 2nd set.  Even though I had not heard note one of that album before that night, I was open to the experience.  I felt bad for my poor wife however, as this may have been a bit over the top for her very first DT experience.  As the 2nd set started and we got SDOIT, I was stoked, as I would much rather have heard that song than MoP. 

As the DT world found out, we got the best of both worlds that night.  My wife was soon sleeping comfortably on my shoulder about half way through Battery and for the rest of MoP.  (I woke her up for the encores, which she enjoyed.)  She had survived one the longest (if not the longest) DT show ever, and enjoyed the ride almost as much as I did.  She's since been to most of the 20 plus DT shows I've attended, and has loved them all.  Over twenty years later however, she has yet to hear MoP in its entirety. 

Maybe I'll break it out for our anniversary...

DanLore

Offline Stadler

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Re: "Official" Lost Not Forgotten (official bootlegs) thread
« Reply #585 on: April 29, 2022, 01:22:34 PM »
Hey Dan...  hope you're well. 

Offline DanLore

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Re: "Official" Lost Not Forgotten (official bootlegs) thread
« Reply #586 on: April 29, 2022, 01:40:14 PM »
 :tup Hope you're the same!

Offline Cool Chris

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Re: "Official" Lost Not Forgotten (official bootlegs) thread
« Reply #587 on: April 29, 2022, 09:03:14 PM »
... she has yet to hear MoP in its entirety. 

I'm envious  :biggrin:

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Re: "Official" Lost Not Forgotten (official bootlegs) thread
« Reply #588 on: April 30, 2022, 03:43:26 PM »
... she has yet to hear MoP in its entirety. 

I'm envious  :biggrin:

Me too. I would love to hear that album for the first time again.
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Re: "Official" Lost Not Forgotten (official bootlegs) thread
« Reply #589 on: May 02, 2022, 06:20:17 AM »
... she has yet to hear MoP in its entirety. 

I'm envious  :biggrin:

Me too. I would love to hear that album for the first time again.

Haha, I read Chris' comment slightly differently (I'm not the hugest fan of MoP).

Offline hefdaddy42

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Re: "Official" Lost Not Forgotten (official bootlegs) thread
« Reply #590 on: May 02, 2022, 08:14:48 AM »
Also, the bit about it being understood is a bit iffy.  I don't remember what tour it was, but I remember seeing that they had back to back shows scheduled in Calgary.  Knowing that this was a thing that DT did, and thinking they might cover a Rush album since they were in Canada, I came very close to buying plane tickets and a ticket for the second night.  Fortunately, I didn't do it because the set list for the second night was did not feature a cover performance (and yes, this was while MP was still in the band).
After the 2002 Barcelona show when they did MoP for the very first time, MP made it very clear that those cover album shows would only happen when they did two-night-stands at Evening With shows. Those shows in Calgary were part of Prog Nation 2008 which had 3 bands opening, so DT was only doing a 90 minute set to begin with. It's given they weren't gonna do a cover album at those shows.

Made it clear how and to whom?  The several dozen people who were regularly on the MP forums?  It ultimately didn't matter for me, but I had heard hearsay about the whole "second night" thing, but I had no inkling that there were caveats.  And, in any event, this gets back to the original point, which is that, except for the most super dialed-in fans, the "second night" thing (much less the stipulations) was not well-known or regularly understood by most folks who bought tickets to DT shows.  Again, it ultimately didn't matter for me, and I certainly knew there was no guarantee about the show I considered (which is the primary reason I didn't pull the trigger on the tickets).  However, if I had gone to a DT show and had gotten a bunch of Pink Floyd covers, I'd have been crazy pissed.
Not sure what to say.  It was made known by the band (MP) to the fans who know things through the ways that those things are made known.  People who don't make it a point to keep up or know stuff, didn't know.  *shrugs*

Was it made known outside of Portnoy's site though?
Well, at that time there was no facebook or Twitter.  MP talked about it, and it got shared from there in places where such things would get shared, such as what was then DTF.com, and other DT or music related sites that existed at the time.

There wasn't really any other way to share the info.  They weren't a big enough band with a big enough budget to have such things printed on the tickets just for those shows or cut individual radio/TV commercials for those markets.

We have testimony in this thread from two different people who traveled to shows specifically because they knew what was going to happen.  So the news was out there (or EVENTUALLY got put out there) for the fans who were most connected, and for the fans who weren't connected, it was a surprise.

The only thing I will say is that I don't think anything was said before the first one; I think that was a surprise.  It was definitely weird that they were doing back-to-back nights in the same venue, so I'm sure that at least some fans suspected something special MIGHT happen at some point during the 2-night stand.  But once MP explained what it was, I remember speculating with people online about what kinds of things might be covered whenever new tour stops were announced and new 2-night stands showed up.
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Offline Setlist Scotty

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Re: "Official" Lost Not Forgotten (official bootlegs) thread
« Reply #591 on: May 02, 2022, 10:01:49 AM »
The only thing I will say is that I don't think anything was said before the first one; I think that was a surprise.
Correct, altho IIRC, it was announced that something special would happen at that show.

Here's some pertinent comments from MP taken from the YJR-issue of the MoP official bootleg:
Quote

Dream Theater is playing the 2nd night of a 2 night stand in Barcelona, Spain... After an almost 2 hour 1st set of DT material and a 15 minute intermission, the lights went out and the opening chords to “Battery” began... 50 minutes later, the Spanish crowd had no idea what had hit them! The next day the word was all over the internet and our new tradition to cover a classic album whenever we did a 2 night stand in the same city had been established... but for those 50 minutes in Barcelona, the completely unsuspecting crowd had no way to see it coming... I remember looking into the crowd by the time we started “The Thing That Should Not Be” and seeing people look at each other like “Holy shit... they’re doing the whole fucking thing!!!”
As a basic rule, if you hate it, you must solely blame Portnoy. If it's good, then you must downplay MP's contribution to the band as not being important anyway, or claim he's just lying. It's the DTF way.

Online pg1067

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Re: "Official" Lost Not Forgotten (official bootlegs) thread
« Reply #592 on: May 02, 2022, 01:03:38 PM »
Here's some pertinent comments from MP taken from the YJR-issue of the MoP official bootleg:
Quote
Dream Theater is playing the 2nd night of a 2 night stand in Barcelona, Spain... After an almost 2 hour 1st set of DT material and a 15 minute intermission, the lights went out and the opening chords to “Battery” began... 50 minutes later, the Spanish crowd had no idea what had hit them! The next day the word was all over the internet and our new tradition to cover a classic album whenever we did a 2 night stand in the same city had been established... but for those 50 minutes in Barcelona, the completely unsuspecting crowd had no way to see it coming... I remember looking into the crowd by the time we started “The Thing That Should Not Be” and seeing people look at each other like “Holy shit... they’re doing the whole fucking thing!!!”

That's some pretty major hyperbole.
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Online TAC

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Re: "Official" Lost Not Forgotten (official bootlegs) thread
« Reply #593 on: May 02, 2022, 01:06:16 PM »
Here's some pertinent comments from MP taken from the YJR-issue of the MoP official bootleg:
Quote
Dream Theater is playing the 2nd night of a 2 night stand in Barcelona, Spain... After an almost 2 hour 1st set of DT material and a 15 minute intermission, the lights went out and the opening chords to “Battery” began... 50 minutes later, the Spanish crowd had no idea what had hit them! The next day the word was all over the internet and our new tradition to cover a classic album whenever we did a 2 night stand in the same city had been established... but for those 50 minutes in Barcelona, the completely unsuspecting crowd had no way to see it coming... I remember looking into the crowd by the time we started “The Thing That Should Not Be” and seeing people look at each other like “Holy shit... they’re doing the whole fucking thing!!!”

That's some pretty major hyperbole.

I know, right? :lol


It went VIRAL!!
would have thought the same thing but seeing the OP was TAC i immediately thought Maiden or DT related
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Offline KevShmev

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Re: "Official" Lost Not Forgotten (official bootlegs) thread
« Reply #594 on: May 02, 2022, 01:32:47 PM »
Yep, that is major revisionist history, but I will leave it at that, as I do not want to keep litigating it.