Author Topic: Coronavirus Thread v.2  (Read 191182 times)

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Offline darkshade

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Re: Coronavirus Thread v.2
« Reply #2030 on: September 16, 2021, 07:49:50 PM »
Ivermectin? Yeah, third world countries desperate got to extremes.

Japan is a third world country?

and you do know WHY 3rd world countries aren't getting the vaccines... right?

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Re: Coronavirus Thread v.2
« Reply #2031 on: September 16, 2021, 07:51:19 PM »
Ivermectin? Yeah, third world countries desperate got to extremes.

Japan is a third world country?

and you do know WHY 3rd world countries aren't getting the vaccines... right?

Isn’t Japan over 50% vaccinated?

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Offline darkshade

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Re: Coronavirus Thread v.2
« Reply #2032 on: September 16, 2021, 07:51:32 PM »
Hospitals do not have the manpower to staff the hospital nevermind a new branch. This is common knowledge throughout the work industry.

Makes sense since so many nurses have quit since the pandemic started, for one reason or another. They were going to do it in NYC, for example, but the overflow never happened.

Stress made them quit and the overflow is real. Not imaginary.

Some, sure. Many quit because they don't want the experimental government dope injected into their bodies.

What was stated as imaginary?? The makeshift hospital built last year in NYC wasn't needed.

What's many?  5%

5% can be a big number considering how many hospitals there are in the US.
Not to mention the number of med students who changed their minds.

Offline darkshade

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Re: Coronavirus Thread v.2
« Reply #2033 on: September 16, 2021, 07:51:58 PM »
Ivermectin? Yeah, third world countries desperate got to extremes.

Japan is a third world country?

and you do know WHY 3rd world countries aren't getting the vaccines... right?

Isn’t Japan over 50% vaccinated?

Isn't the US?

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Re: Coronavirus Thread v.2
« Reply #2034 on: September 16, 2021, 07:52:58 PM »
Ivermectin? Yeah, third world countries desperate got to extremes.

Japan is a third world country?

and you do know WHY 3rd world countries aren't getting the vaccines... right?

Nope.

https://www.poynter.org/fact-checking/2021/japan-has-not-approved-ivermectin-as-a-covid-treatment-and-its-still-using-the-moderna-vaccine/
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Offline El Barto

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Re: Coronavirus Thread v.2
« Reply #2035 on: September 16, 2021, 07:53:46 PM »
I didn't shift goal posts. I offered an option that was on the table in the beginning of the pandemic but doesn't seem to be now.
You were implying that it's not necessary because the conspiracy is working.  As has been stated, there are other reasons why they're not a valid option. Moreover, the fact is that people are dying, and people are compromising medical outcomes because of a lack of available resources.

However, I'm A-OK with your suggestion. Setup makeshift MASH units in parking lots and treat unvaccinated Covid patients with any resources in excess of what's necessary for less voluntary cases. I think we've reached a fair compromise.  :tup
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Offline darkshade

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Re: Coronavirus Thread v.2
« Reply #2037 on: September 16, 2021, 08:00:07 PM »
Trials and approving and using is a big difference. Why would you take that over an approved vaccine? 
I don't like country music, but I don't mean to denigrate those who do. And for the people who like country music, denigrate means 'put down'.” - Bob Newhart
So wait, we're spelling it wrong and king is spelling it right? What is going on here? :lol -- BlobVanDam
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Offline darkshade

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Re: Coronavirus Thread v.2
« Reply #2038 on: September 16, 2021, 08:01:03 PM »
I didn't shift goal posts. I offered an option that was on the table in the beginning of the pandemic but doesn't seem to be now.
You were implying that it's not necessary because the conspiracy is working.  As has been stated, there are other reasons why they're not a valid option. Moreover, the fact is that people are dying, and people are compromising medical outcomes because of a lack of available resources.

However, I'm A-OK with your suggestion. Setup makeshift MASH units in parking lots and treat unvaccinated Covid patients with any resources in excess of what's necessary for less voluntary cases. I think we've reached a fair compromise.  :tup

Never needed because so many deaths occurred in nursing homes in these densely populated areas like NYC, LA, Detroit, to make the death count seem worse for the US (not coincidentally for political purposes)

As long as they got the same resources in the parking lots, as they do inside, don't bother my ass. All is not lost on DTF  ;D
but I think hospitals being "overflowed" is just another Big Lie from the government/media establishment.

Offline darkshade

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Re: Coronavirus Thread v.2
« Reply #2039 on: September 16, 2021, 08:03:11 PM »
Trials and approving and using is a big difference. Why would you take that over an approved vaccine?

What covid vaccine is approved by anyone with authority to do so? Covid vaccines are not FDA approved, not any available to the public.

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Re: Coronavirus Thread v.2
« Reply #2040 on: September 16, 2021, 08:07:02 PM »
Trials and approving and using is a big difference. Why would you take that over an approved vaccine?

What covid vaccine is approved by anyone with authority to do so? Covid vaccines are not FDA approved, not any available to the public.

Come on man.

https://www.fda.gov/news-events/press-announcements/fda-approves-first-covid-19-vaccine#:~:text=Today%2C%20the%20U.S.%20Food%20and,years%20of%20age%20and%20older.
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Offline Bolsters

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Re: Coronavirus Thread v.2
« Reply #2041 on: September 16, 2021, 08:08:29 PM »
Duck Duck Go is just as untrustworthy, and tend to give you similar results as Google and Bing does.
Which search engines do you trust?

Offline darkshade

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Re: Coronavirus Thread v.2
« Reply #2042 on: September 16, 2021, 08:32:00 PM »
Duck Duck Go is just as untrustworthy, and tend to give you similar results as Google and Bing does.
Which search engines do you trust?

None, really.

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Re: Coronavirus Thread v.2
« Reply #2043 on: September 16, 2021, 08:41:23 PM »
Actually, my first mistake was reading and responding to a post of Darkshade's.

Searched him on Duck Duck Go, first page there syas he's full of shit too.

Yeah, that's exactly where I pulled that quote from.  Joke's on you Darkshade, I don't trust the Google either ... just used it as a ubiquitous verb.

It's the outright dismissal of my post and the content posted because someone did a google search on the doctor, when those people have no medical degrees I am aware of, that is a problem. Search engine companies, news media outlets, and politicians also have no medical degrees either

Do YOU have a medical degree?  By your own logic, I shouldn't pay attention to the information you're spreading.

Duck Duck Go is just as untrustworthy, and tend to give you similar results as Google and Bing does.

No, I don't have a medical degree, which is why I posted a link to an interview with someone who does.
Don't shoot the messenger, they say. Don't shoot the message, either.

Well then don’t shoot me as a messenger, or my message. I simply posted a quote of an independent assessment of the good Doctor’s accuracy of claims and statements.

Duck Duck Go is just as untrustworthy, and tend to give you similar results as Google and Bing does.
Which search engines do you trust?

None, really.

Then where do you find your information, and how do you decide what/whom to trust? Im genuinely and sincerely curious here
That's a word salad - and take it from me, I know word salad
I fear for the day when something happens on the right that is SO nuts that even Stadler says "That's crazy".
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Re: Coronavirus Thread v.2
« Reply #2044 on: September 16, 2021, 08:41:48 PM »
No offense to anyone with kids, but the flu kills more children each year than covid has in all its existence. That is not my opinion.
Take care of your kids, but let's stop letting the fear porn control our actions.

Source please?  Not that I don’t totally trust your claims, but you already confirmed you’re not a medical professional so .... :biggrin:

Also, just imagine how many more deaths it would be without flu vaccines!
That's a word salad - and take it from me, I know word salad
I fear for the day when something happens on the right that is SO nuts that even Stadler says "That's crazy".
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Re: Coronavirus Thread v.2
« Reply #2045 on: September 16, 2021, 08:42:06 PM »
The flu comes back every year and we are not immune. Civid is 5 times more dangerous. You like rolling the dice?

I don't get flu shots and never get the flu..

Just so I beat Stads to it .... correlation is not causation.  I’ve never been in a car accident in my life ... I must not need to ever wear a seatbelt.
That's a word salad - and take it from me, I know word salad
I fear for the day when something happens on the right that is SO nuts that even Stadler says "That's crazy".
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Offline darkshade

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Re: Coronavirus Thread v.2
« Reply #2046 on: September 16, 2021, 08:42:39 PM »
No offense to anyone with kids, but the flu kills more children each year than covid has in all its existence. That is not my opinion.
Take care of your kids, but let's stop letting the fear porn control our actions.

Source please?  Not that I don’t totally trust your claims, but you already confirmed you’re not a medical professional so .... :biggrin:

Also, just imagine how many more deaths it would be without flu vaccines!

I've never said that I'm against vaccines.

Just use Google.

More Dore
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7eTIW3IfVuM

Online jingle.boy

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Re: Coronavirus Thread v.2
« Reply #2047 on: September 16, 2021, 08:46:46 PM »
But you don’t trust Google.
That's a word salad - and take it from me, I know word salad
I fear for the day when something happens on the right that is SO nuts that even Stadler says "That's crazy".
Quote from: Puppies_On_Acid
Remember the mark of a great vocalist is if TAC hates them with a special passion

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Re: Coronavirus Thread v.2
« Reply #2048 on: September 16, 2021, 08:52:25 PM »
I’ll be honest, I had no idea who Jimmy Dore was, so I looked it up (hope you don’t mind that I used Google - Alta Vista was taking too long to refresh).  A comedian!?!?  Seriously?  I take it I can rebut with clips from The Daily Show, and you’ll receive those as legitimate?
That's a word salad - and take it from me, I know word salad
I fear for the day when something happens on the right that is SO nuts that even Stadler says "That's crazy".
Quote from: Puppies_On_Acid
Remember the mark of a great vocalist is if TAC hates them with a special passion

Offline darkshade

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Re: Coronavirus Thread v.2
« Reply #2049 on: September 16, 2021, 08:53:50 PM »
But you don’t trust Google.

I don't. You have to dig through the mud to find the pearl, so to speak. You have to look for conflicting information or things that don't come up on each search engine. I find some stuff easier on one, but not the other. Depends on the search.
Google is the worst. Then Bing. Then DDG. Personally, I still stick with Ask Jeeves. I hear the right uses Gab.

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Re: Coronavirus Thread v.2
« Reply #2050 on: September 16, 2021, 09:02:03 PM »
Wow, there’s a search brand I haven’t heard reference since the Bush presidency. You know they’re owned by the same company that owns The Daily Beast?  How can they be trusted??
That's a word salad - and take it from me, I know word salad
I fear for the day when something happens on the right that is SO nuts that even Stadler says "That's crazy".
Quote from: Puppies_On_Acid
Remember the mark of a great vocalist is if TAC hates them with a special passion

Offline darkshade

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Re: Coronavirus Thread v.2
« Reply #2051 on: September 16, 2021, 09:06:12 PM »
Wow, there’s a search brand I haven’t heard reference since the Bush presidency. You know they’re owned by the same company that owns The Daily Beast?  How can they be trusted??

LOL I don't go on ask jeeves. It was a joke.

Offline Anguyen92

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Re: Coronavirus Thread v.2
« Reply #2052 on: September 16, 2021, 09:06:26 PM »
Trials and approving and using is a big difference. Why would you take that over an approved vaccine?

What covid vaccine is approved by anyone with authority to do so? Covid vaccines are not FDA approved, not any available to the public.

Come on man.

https://www.fda.gov/news-events/press-announcements/fda-approves-first-covid-19-vaccine#:~:text=Today%2C%20the%20U.S.%20Food%20and,years%20of%20age%20and%20older.

I want to go back to this part here and want to see Darkshade comment on this.

Offline darkshade

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Re: Coronavirus Thread v.2
« Reply #2053 on: September 16, 2021, 09:12:43 PM »
Trials and approving and using is a big difference. Why would you take that over an approved vaccine?

What covid vaccine is approved by anyone with authority to do so? Covid vaccines are not FDA approved, not any available to the public.

Come on man.

https://www.fda.gov/news-events/press-announcements/fda-approves-first-covid-19-vaccine#:~:text=Today%2C%20the%20U.S.%20Food%20and,years%20of%20age%20and%20older.

I want to go back to this part here and want to see Darkshade comment on this.

You mean this?
https://www.fda.gov/vaccines-blood-biologics/comirnaty

https://www.fda.gov/media/144414/download

This is not the vaccine that is being distributed to the public under the EUA.
FDA approval means little to me, either way, especially without long-term data.

https://www.fda.gov/media/150386/download

page 5
“Although COMIRNATY (COVID-19 Vaccine, mRNA) is approved to prevent COVID-19 in individuals 16 years of age and older, there is not sufficient approved vaccine available for distribution to this population in its entirety at the time of reissuance of this EUA,”

Offline Fiery Winds

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Re: Coronavirus Thread v.2
« Reply #2054 on: September 16, 2021, 10:05:58 PM »
You mean this?
https://www.fda.gov/vaccines-blood-biologics/comirnaty

https://www.fda.gov/media/144414/download

This is not the vaccine that is being distributed to the public under the EUA.

Directly from the 2nd link, 2nd page:

Quote
COMIRNATY (COVID-19 Vaccine, mRNA) and the Pfizer-BioNTech COVID-19 Vaccine
have the same formulation and can be used interchangeably to provide the COVID-19
vaccination series*.

*The licensed vaccine has the same formulation as the EUA-authorized vaccine and the products can be
used interchangeably to provide the vaccination series without presenting any safety or effectiveness
concerns. The products are legally distinct with certain differences that do not impact safety or
effectiveness.


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Re: Coronavirus Thread v.2
« Reply #2055 on: September 16, 2021, 10:15:20 PM »
Yes. I see it in your posts daily. 

I see you skipped over the stats.

Seeking truth and rationality is not 'taking crazy pills'

Saying 'unvaxxed' people should be denied services at a hospital is crazy.
Since I'm one of the people suggesting something similar to that, I'll chime in. My stance has been that hospitals should limit ICU space to leave beds in reserve for people who aren't there voluntarily. This isn't spite, or some misguided concept of eugenics (although voluntary eugenics is better referred to as Darwinism). This is basic resource allocation. Seeing somebody with a treatable condition die because antivaxxers are using up the available healthcare pisses me off. It's not "personal responsibility" if other people have to pay for your outcomes.

But what about the makeshift hospitals that were created specifically for covid patient overflow in densely populated areas? Did hospital administrators and state governments give up on that idea because now the pharma donors for our 'elected leaders' got their drugs into the public sphere via EUA?



Also, if you're going to go that route, address my question about why the entire planet is going along with this conspiracy.
https://www.dreamtheaterforums.org/boards/index.php?topic=56501.msg2809936#msg2809936


omg  :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin

Offline MoraWintersoul

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Re: Coronavirus Thread v.2
« Reply #2056 on: September 17, 2021, 04:56:23 AM »
FDA approval means little to me, either way, especially without long-term data.
When firefighters come to put out your house, you don't ask them for long term data about the consequences of having wet walls.

Disease prevention is quite literally the best health care method. Even if you had a cure that can heal 90% of people in the hospitals (which ivermectin isn't), it's far better to have vaccines that keep 90% of people out of the hospital in the first place. HIV is one of the rare viruses that responds to some kind of therapy, to the point where people who have it can now live normal lives, but researchers still want a vaccine against it, because it's far better to just not get sick.

Quote
Don't try to BS her about Kevin Moore facts, she will obscure quote you in the face.

type : mora : and delete the spaces for a surprise

Offline hefdaddy42

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Re: Coronavirus Thread v.2
« Reply #2057 on: September 17, 2021, 07:49:22 AM »
This thread is awesome.

 :tup :tup
Hef is right on all things. Except for when I disagree with him. In which case he's probably still right.

Offline Skeever

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Re: Coronavirus Thread v.2
« Reply #2058 on: September 17, 2021, 07:56:47 AM »
FDA approval means little to me, either way, especially without long-term data.

I suspect this is where we disagree, because while we definitely could agree on a number of things, chiefly: corporate boards that run companies like Pfizer being driven by self-interest and profit alone; the government being corrupt; regulatory bodies being imperfect and inconsistent; the media being out of control, and so on, at the end of the day, it's still the best bet to stick with the guidance. Because what is the alternative?

I'm sure we all have tolerances for how closely we follow the guidance. There were things my family did that were not recommended, as I'm sure the same is true for you and your family. But that vaccine? That's the best shot we've got at getting back to normal. At this point, even if the whole thing were one big lie, just to line Pfizer's pockets, I'd take the damn thing, just to get it over with. Because what else can you do? *I* don't believe it's a big lie, in fact I know plenty of people who've been negatively affected, some even fatally. But, just sayin'...

I totally get where you're coming from... that the powers-that-be lie to us when they're at their worst, and even when they're at their best, fail to stop the myriad of incentives from causing terrible chain reactions that lead humanity down paths it would not have deliberately chosen. Sadly, change doesn't happen overnight, and improvements come slowly...  this has been our species from Day Zero. It just takes time.

Offline hunnus2000

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Re: Coronavirus Thread v.2
« Reply #2059 on: September 17, 2021, 08:04:59 AM »
FDA approval means little to me, either way, especially without long-term data.
When firefighters come to put out your house, you don't ask them for long term data about the consequences of having wet walls.

Disease prevention is quite literally the best health care method. Even if you had a cure that can heal 90% of people in the hospitals (which ivermectin isn't), it's far better to have vaccines that keep 90% of people out of the hospital in the first place. HIV is one of the rare viruses that responds to some kind of therapy, to the point where people who have it can now live normal lives, but researchers still want a vaccine against it, because it's far better to just not get sick.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^

I am definitely on board with this! What I don't get is why people are on the ivermectin train. You literally have to have covid before people will say treat me with it. And there is no "long term data" to prove that it does anything with regards prevention or treatment.

Vaccines are our best solution and we have and are collecting plenty of data since the vaccine rollout to confirm that they are effective and safe.

Offline hefdaddy42

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Re: Coronavirus Thread v.2
« Reply #2060 on: September 17, 2021, 08:13:38 AM »
What I don't get is why people are on the ivermectin train.
I think I know this one.

Because they are morons.
Hef is right on all things. Except for when I disagree with him. In which case he's probably still right.

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Re: Coronavirus Thread v.2
« Reply #2061 on: September 17, 2021, 08:35:54 AM »
What I don't get is why people are on the ivermectin train.
I think I know this one.

Because they are morons.

 :heart
This thread is awesome.

 :tup :tup

It really is...it's like a house fire that people keep trying to put out with gasoline.

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Re: Coronavirus Thread v.2
« Reply #2062 on: September 17, 2021, 08:37:23 AM »
Ben, unless you have children and watched them struggle to breathe, being completely helpless in the moment, you cannot comprehend the sheer terror of that experience.  Im not even going to read any more of your bullshit post above.

When presented with the possibility that my child is sick with covid, that is exactly where my thoughts go.  If you think that's wrong, you can just ___ off.  Just yesterday in a neighboring suburb was a "medical freedom rally."   Jackass parents in other suburbs are protesting covid mask mandates in schools ON SCHOOL WALKING ROUTES.  Kids walking to school have to thread their way through parents with signs and shouting.  That is not cool.

Yes, he is ok, despite being sick as hell.  But to come down on me so hard is awful and shows me just what kind of person you really are.

I was going to back you up but you beat me to it. We parents just love it when a non-parent can possibly ever try and comprehend what being a parent is like and then have the gall to question our behavior when worried about our kids.

I would have been exactly like Grapp. No question.
So just to be clear on this point, I'm on Grappler's side here. And I suppose by extension, yours as well. I think Ben's remark was somewhat incorrect, but not in the way y'all think. I mostly think it just wasn't really worth saying under the circumstances. Grappler's concerned about his kid, and I'm damn sure not going to knock him for that. Hope things turn out well.  :tup

That said, much like we non-parents can't comprehend this and that and the other, parents seem to have an equally rough go at trying to see things from the non-parent perspective, which, believe it or not, is every bit as valid. Where I think Ben was wrong was that all parents "jump to those assumptions and start to become emotional to where they affect their overall thought process." As I've said before, parenthood makes people lose their fucking minds. Reason is quickly replaced by emotionalism. This is not a bad thing, per se. Parents become what they need to be. Just don't be so quick to dismiss what those of us looking in from the outside have to say. The dispassionate, alternative perspective is just as important, and just as valid.

In this case, it probably wasn't. Grappler's emotional response was quite valid. At the same time, sometimes people like us need to remind parents that maybe $400 on a bulletproof backpack for you kid isn't as wise as dropping the same 4 bills into an investment account for him.

As a parent who has performed the Heimlich maneuver on his own kid, you're both right.  In that moment there's no right answer, it's your moment.  EVERYTHING went through my head, and I was ready to take on the restaurant, Big Oil and the Taliban all in one fell swoop. But then the moment passes and we have to insert ourselves back in the real world, even if the outcome is not to our liking.    "My kid being sick" is not a standard by which others need to operate, and in fact, sometimes - SOMETIMES - it's the others who have the cooler head and the broader vision to maintain perspective.

It goes without saying, Grappler, but I'll say it anyway:  my heart breaks for you.  There is nothing worse than seeing a child suffer (made worse since they don't know basic things like clearing one's nose or chest of congestion, to relieve themselves of discomfort), and I well and truly hope that he recovers fully and quickly. 

Offline El Barto

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Re: Coronavirus Thread v.2
« Reply #2063 on: September 17, 2021, 08:41:33 AM »
What I don't get is why people are on the ivermectin train.
I think I know this one.

Because they are morons.
That's not really fair. While this is an off-label use, and the verdict is still out on whether or not it's effective, it does have promise and is well tolerated. If you buy horse pills from Sneed's Seed and Feed then you're probably an idiot. If you're buying human-grade Ivermectin from a reputable pharmacy then you're really just exploring all of your options. My issue is both sides wrapping it up in more partisan bullshit. It's neither the miracle drug that big-pharma is hiding from us, nor sketchy horse de-wormer.

What I don't get is why the people who are on the Ivermectin bandwagon are terrified of a vaccine that's demonstrably safe and effective in favor of something that's demonstrably neither. I'm also annoyed by the complete avoidance of science insofar as it's concerned. You don't get to take Ivermectin, monoclonal antibodies, and antiestrogens, and then say that Ivermectin kills Covid.
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Re: Coronavirus Thread v.2
« Reply #2064 on: September 17, 2021, 08:53:05 AM »
"My kid being sick" is not a standard by which others need to operate, and in fact, sometimes - SOMETIMES - it's the others who have the cooler head and the broader vision to maintain perspective.

Question to you .... if the reason my kid is sick is directly BECAUSE of the way that others operate, does that change your stance.  Alternatively, let's replace "sick" with "bullied"... does the same perspective or standard apply?
That's a word salad - and take it from me, I know word salad
I fear for the day when something happens on the right that is SO nuts that even Stadler says "That's crazy".
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