Coronavirus Thread v.2

[Ben_Jamin]

I'm really quite confused about all the articles you see about children these days. Yes more of them seem to be getting hospitalized but I just have to wonder is that because they are one of the bigger unvaccinated populations? And are the outcomes worse than these children see from any other type of respiratory infections that ravage schools and daycares year after year?

It just feels like we are not getting to that level with the data. There's the alarmist headline about "think of the children" and that's it. As a parent it's hard to make a decision about what risks you're comfortable with when the media seem so alarmist without ever wanting to give the full story.

First off, you should always take your kids to the doctor if they are not feeling good.

My brother did that with his adopted son, because he thought he caught his strep. But, the doctor said, the boy has a "Summer Cold" and that the clinic he went to told him they've been seeing a lot of kids with this.

[jingle.boy]

"Summer Cold"??  You mean, like ... COVID??

[Ben_Jamin]

"Summer Cold"??  You mean, like ... COVID??

No. The doctor at their Tribal Clinic is the one that told them this. That's all they told him.


I am thinking he means the "Summer Cold" that children usually develop around this time.

[Grappler]

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/kids-sick-covid-are-filling-children-s-hospitals-areas-seeing-n1276238

Her hospital has treated Covid in children ages from 3-week-olds to 17-year-olds in recent weeks. Iheagawara said that for the past month, her unit has had to treat 25 or 26 patients in a space designed for 20. And things are getting worse

Arkansas Children’s Hospital in Little Rock had 23 patients under 18 admitted to its system last week. Ten were in the ICU and five were on ventilators.

St. Louis Children’s Hospital in Missouri saw 13 kids come to the ER for Covid in the last week of July, and then it saw 20 who needed beds in the first week of August.

At Texas Children’s Hospital in Houston, Covid positivity rates have risen from around 3 percent to above 10 percent among kids. The number of hospitalized children was in the single digits several weeks ago but rose to more than 30 last week.

Louisiana Gov. John Bel Edwards said Friday that there are 13 children hospitalized with Covid at Children's Hospital New Orleans, including six under the age of 2. Four children are in the ICU, including a 3-month-old boy, a 23-month-old girl, an 8-year-old girl and a 17-year-old boy.

I think it's about the same as adults - some will be fine, some will need to be hospitalized.  But the general idea is the same - try to stay healthy, because the hospitals are running out of room, even for kids.  Bottom line is that it's mostly preventable, which is the message i'm getting from the media.  It's not that kids are NEVER hospitalized - some have cancer, some have heart or other problems.  If kids wear masks when needed and the adults in the household are vaccinated, then it's less of a chance of them getting sick.   

We're doing a little more with my kids this year compared to last year, since my wife and I are both vaccinated.  I've read that the Delta variant does make kids sicker than the original strain that went around last year, which gives me some worry, but we also can't make them live in a bubble again either.

[Stadler]

So more and more employers are requiring the vaccine to maintain employment.  Most allow for health/religious exemptions.  Some are going to allow weekly testing for those who do not want the vaccine.

https://www.nbcnews.com/business/business-news/united-airlines-will-require-all-67-000-u-s-employees-n1276156?cid=sm_npd_nn_tw_ma


I have to say that while I do not believe in forcing people to get vaccinated, I do believe in the ability for an employer to ensure the safety of their employees.  From comments I'm reading, it seems many people believe they have a "right" to employment.

I'm happy to see United take this stance.  Interestingly, their rate of vaccination among employees appears higher than among healthcare workers.   

It's one of those instances where having a free market can be a good thing... Want to work? Get a Vax... And you're absolutely right that an employer has a right to protect their staff and customers. asses from being sued by someone who got Covid working or shopping there..

Fixed..

That's the only reason why businesses are giving a crap about Covid and having to vaccinate.

 If nobody was allowed to sue, I am sure they wouldn't care at all whether someone is vaccinated or not. As that is not their reliability to worry about. That would be on the customer to know the risks involved in waking inside their business.

Businesses I am sure are tired of having to change their overall processes of how they do business. There isn't a permanent process now, it's constantly shifting to something new the business has to abide by. Some arent able to accommodate to the new policies in place as it would take time for them to set up the process to do business.

It's rough on the small businesses to accommodate to these conditions. Some do not have the available resources to adapt to these and those were the ones that ended up closing their doors.

But people DO have the right to sue; that's the premise in a free society.  You get to do what you want, but if you cause harm* to someone else, you may have consequences.

*harm - I mean that in the legal sense, not in the sense that it has come to mean in the identity politics discussion.  I mean physical, quantifiable - in extent and dollars - and measurable.  I don't mean getting your precious feelings hurt.

You gotta wonder when the medical insurance industry will play their hand... I mean the cost of one covid patient in the ice for two weeks has to be equal to a few thousand vaccines... The math has to play out heavily in favor of vaccination for them, they gotta have something in the works. Just pondering out loud.

That just makes me wonder why healthcare has to be so expensive and not something we could just use easily without having to pay someone for all us humans to utilize?

I find that aspect one of the messed up things of our current world.

How is it, healthcare is a privilege and people are wanting to use it as a privilege and deny others access to it all because that person does not want to take some new life saving technology?

What do you mean by "not something we could just use easily without having to pay someone for all us humans to utilize?"  Obamacare was supposed to drive out cost, but that didn't happen, because they didn't bother to address it.   They didn't remove the state-by-state jurisdiction over insurance.  They didn't address the pharmaceutical issue (in fact, they cut a deal GUARANTEEING the pharmaceuticals tens of billions in profits to not "torpedo" their deal).  There are other areas to address this issue as well.   

I also don't follow the last part; depending on where you sit on the debate (I am an advocate for single payer, by the way; yes it's an exception to my normal fiscal approach to things, but I think it's a necessary one) healthcare is a privilege or a right; if it's a privilege, then it absolutely should follow - if one is interested in consistency - that we could demand vaccination if one wants to avail themselves of those privileges.  If it's a right, then we cannot demand vaccination as a precursor to receiving that right, since by definition one is entitled to it.  The funny thing is, if you subscribe to the accepted wisdom of the ideology, the "privilege" people are the one's saying we shouldn't demand vaccination, and the "right" people are the one's saying we should.   

[emtee]

Our facility is now 56% Covid. We have another Central FL facility that is 93% Covid. Another one (my former location) is 69%. We came nowhere near these numbers at the worst peak of the pandemic. Not even close.

They are paying us a sizeable hourly bonus, which is nice, but mandating weekends because the volume is so astronomically high, the supplies run out by mid Saturday afternoon. If the northern states mirror what we are dealing with down here, in a couple weeks, hold on tight.

I'm so ready for this to be over.

[cramx3]

Our facility is now 56% Covid. We have another Central FL facility that is 93% Covid. Another one (my former location) is 69%. We came nowhere near these numbers at the worst peak of the pandemic. Not even close.

They are paying us a sizeable hourly bonus, which is nice, but mandating weekends because the volume is so astronomically high, the supplies run out by mid Saturday afternoon. If the northern states mirror what we are dealing with down here, in a couple weeks, hold on tight.

I'm so ready for this to be over.

The difference is the peak for maybe the north was last winter where FL and a lot of the south may be seeing the peak right now as those areas mostly escaped the harshness of last winter we up north experienced.  I think this week will continue to see a rise and then this wave will plateau.  Of course that doesn't mean there won't be more pain for some time though.  I can't imagine how difficult this has and will continue to be for healthcare workers. 

Also, I have no idea if my thought is true about peaking soon.  I'm basing it on the trends from the UK where the spike took about 6 or so weeks to plateau.  We are approaching that timeline but I think it will take a bit longer as our vaccination rate is not as good as the UK.  Things are definitely going to get a bit worse and that's only amplified by the hospitals being overwhelmded.  But this is also localized.  The hospitals are not an issue for me locally for example.  While cases are going up, it's not nearly the same as what FL and other states are experiencing.  NJ still hasn't imposed the mask mandate for example.  I really think they are trying to do their best to let this wave plateau and not have to enforce rules again.  The problem is, what if it doesn't plateau soon?  If my thoughts are incorrect (entirely possible, I'm no expert here just another internet junkie) then things really are going to get bad again.

But so far locally, the deaths per day is under 10 for awhile now.  Not seeing the 100+ from the initial wave and 80+ from the winter wave.  To me, that shows the vaccine is working.  Cases are going to always happen, but once we have that initial protection, the deaths aren't going wild. 

Now if only Desantis could push FL to get vaccinated ASAP ...

[hunnus2000]

Looks like vaccine mandates or "requirements" are about to be a thing.

About fucking time! 

[cramx3]

More data about how well the vaccines are working:

https://www.cnn.com/us/live-news/coronavirus-pandemic-vaccine-updates-08-09-21/h_9c6a79bada1c3b54c7d873635394a789

As of Aug. 2, more than 164 million people in the United States were fully vaccinated against Covid-19, according to the CDC. Fewer than 0.001% of those individuals — 1,507 people — died and fewer than 0.005% — 7,101 people — were hospitalized with Covid-19.
...
About three-quarters (74%) of all reported breakthrough cases were among seniors age 65 or older. Of the roughly 1,500 people who died, one in five passed away from something other than Covid-19 even though they had a breakthrough case of the virus, according to the CDC.

I keep seeing on social media, posts about how "the vaccines aren't working" and I don't understand why people believe a spike in cases has much to do with the effectiveness of the vaccines.

[jingle.boy]

The vaccines are definitely working .... for the time being.  But with the unvaccinated population being a virtual petrie dish to breed variants, it's only a matter of time they don't perform as well.  The virus ain't stupid.

FYI, here in Ontario, we haven't lifted our mask mandates ... and cases have doubled in the past couple of weeks from being under 200 daily, to now over 400.  I'm not as concerned about the raw case count - it's the data behind the case count that matters (imo).  How many are from vax'd vs unvax'd?  How many were from symptomatic testing?  How many are hospitalized / ICU / fatal?  I wish this kind of data would be reported.  There's a website available, but it takes a bit of investigation to get thru.  One thing I did see, of the total active cases in Ontario, 68% are in the age group 30 and under.  UNDER.   

[cramx3]

The vaccines are definitely working .... for the time being.  But with the unvaccinated population being a virtual petrie dish to breed variants, it's only a matter of time they don't perform as well.  The virus ain't stupid.

FYI, here in Ontario, we haven't lifted our mask mandates ... and cases have doubled in the past couple of weeks from being under 200 daily, to now over 400.  I'm not as concerned about the raw case count - it's the data behind the case count that matters (imo).  How many are from vax'd vs unvax'd?  How many were from symptomatic testing?  How many are hospitalized / ICU / fatal?  I wish this kind of data would be reported.  There's a website available, but it takes a bit of investigation to get thru.  One thing I did see, of the total active cases in Ontario, 68% are in the age group 30 and under.  UNDER.  

I'm sure boosters will be thing in the future at this point, but it seems like that was always inevitable with the way this mutates.  I'd imagine the current vaccines will do a good job preventing death for awhile, but will get worse at preventing illness more quickly.  And while it's easy to blame the chosen unvaccinated, I think the issue is much larger than that.  There's just no way to vaccinate the entire world population to prevent a mutation.  It's just not possible.  I don't think the chosen unvaccinated are helping by any means, but the logistical and monetary situation regarding the entire planet, just makes it unfeasible.

As to what I bolded, I'd guess that's because they are unvaccinated.  Besides the children too young, it seems a lot of under 30s feel they are healthy and don't want the vaccine.  Not sure that holds true in Canada, but certainly in the US, our young feel invincible.

[jingle.boy]

The vaccines are definitely working .... for the time being.  But with the unvaccinated population being a virtual petrie dish to breed variants, it's only a matter of time they don't perform as well.  The virus ain't stupid.

FYI, here in Ontario, we haven't lifted our mask mandates ... and cases have doubled in the past couple of weeks from being under 200 daily, to now over 400.  I'm not as concerned about the raw case count - it's the data behind the case count that matters (imo).  How many are from vax'd vs unvax'd?  How many were from symptomatic testing?  How many are hospitalized / ICU / fatal?  I wish this kind of data would be reported.  There's a website available, but it takes a bit of investigation to get thru.  One thing I did see, of the total active cases in Ontario, 68% are in the age group 30 and under.  UNDER.  

As to what I bolded, I'd guess that's because they are unvaccinated.  Besides the children too young, it seems a lot of under 30s feel they are healthy and don't want the vaccine.  Not sure that holds true in Canada, but certainly in the US, our young feel invincible.

Unlikely current stats in Ontario:

People who are fully vaccinated (2 doses / by age)
18-29: 58.1%
12-17: 52.2%

Yes, they are less than the older population groups (64% and higher in 30+ categories), but it's still not a statistical correlation just for the unvax'd.  Something is hitting these younger groups - perhaps it's the carelessness of them, perhaps it's something else.

[TAC]

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/mass-reports-100-breakthrough-coronavirus-case-deaths-as-of-july-31-average-age-was-82-5-years-old/ar-AAN7IPZ?ocid=hplocalnews

[Ben_Jamin]

The vaccines are definitely working .... for the time being.  But with the unvaccinated population being a virtual petrie dish to breed variants, it's only a matter of time they don't perform as well.  The virus ain't stupid.

FYI, here in Ontario, we haven't lifted our mask mandates ... and cases have doubled in the past couple of weeks from being under 200 daily, to now over 400.  I'm not as concerned about the raw case count - it's the data behind the case count that matters (imo).  How many are from vax'd vs unvax'd?  How many were from symptomatic testing?  How many are hospitalized / ICU / fatal?  I wish this kind of data would be reported.  There's a website available, but it takes a bit of investigation to get thru.  One thing I did see, of the total active cases in Ontario, 68% are in the age group 30 and under.  UNDER.  

I'm sure boosters will be thing in the future at this point, but it seems like that was always inevitable with the way this mutates.  I'd imagine the current vaccines will do a good job preventing death for awhile, but will get worse at preventing illness more quickly.  And while it's easy to blame the chosen unvaccinated, I think the issue is much larger than that.  There's just no way to vaccinate the entire world population to prevent a mutation.  It's just not possible.  I don't think the chosen unvaccinated are helping by any means, but the logistical and monetary situation regarding the entire planet, just makes it unfeasible.

As to what I bolded, I'd guess that's because they are unvaccinated.  Besides the children too young, it seems a lot of under 30s feel they are healthy and don't want the vaccine.  Not sure that holds true in Canada, but certainly in the US, our young feel invincible.

It was not possible and how much humans travel could be a big factor in this. Humans spread the virus and one way people spread it is through traveling. When they opened the country, people travelled, and people travelled to the places with high infection rates. People from all the states likely travelled to these places for "Summer Vacations".

And now as the data is revealing, vaccinated people still caught the virus and more than likely because they traveled to these places thinking since they got the vaccine they will be fine.

It's why I feel, shutting down the borders would've been more beneficial in stopping the spread or slowing it and confining it into these places. But, what do I know?...

[Stadler]

Unlikely current stats in Ontario:

People who are fully vaccinated (2 doses / by age)
18-29: 58.1%
12-17: 52.2%

Yes, they are less than the older population groups (64% and higher in 30+ categories), but it's still not a statistical correlation just for the unvax'd.  Something is hitting these younger groups - perhaps it's the carelessness of them, perhaps it's something else.

Percentage of what?   Those add up to 110.3%.   Only Yngwie and Chuck Norris can ACTUALLY give you more than 100%, so what are we looking at?

We need comparison numbers as well: how big are those groups compared to other groups?  (If 50% of starting NFL QBs are vaccinated, that's not that big a deal since there are only 30 teams in the NFL (I'm not counting the Jaguars and the Jets).

And it's fair to point out that there are no COVID variants of high interest and four variants of concern, NONE of which originated in the States. 

There's a lot of focus on the U.S. because I don't know (it's where many of us live?  It's fun to point fingers?) but we're darn near 60% where the world is barely at 30%.  Again, it goes back to our goals and what we're REALLY worried about.

[ProfessorPeart]

Um, Stads, read Jingle's post again. 58% of people aged 18-29 are vaxxed and 52% of people aged 12-17 are vaxxed. No need to add up the percentages as those are different control groups.

And as for Destupid mandating vaccines, he's threatening to not pay school officials that enforce mask mandates. The man has no interest in doing anything to deter this.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/2021/08/09/florida-gov-desantis-threatens-salaries-school-superintendents-school-board-members-mask-mandates/5546215001/

[ariich]

The vaccines are definitely working .... for the time being.  But with the unvaccinated population being a virtual petrie dish to breed variants, it's only a matter of time they don't perform as well.  The virus ain't stupid.

FYI, here in Ontario, we haven't lifted our mask mandates ... and cases have doubled in the past couple of weeks from being under 200 daily, to now over 400.  I'm not as concerned about the raw case count - it's the data behind the case count that matters (imo).  How many are from vax'd vs unvax'd?  How many were from symptomatic testing?  How many are hospitalized / ICU / fatal?  I wish this kind of data would be reported.  There's a website available, but it takes a bit of investigation to get thru.  One thing I did see, of the total active cases in Ontario, 68% are in the age group 30 and under.  UNDER.  

As to what I bolded, I'd guess that's because they are unvaccinated.  Besides the children too young, it seems a lot of under 30s feel they are healthy and don't want the vaccine.  Not sure that holds true in Canada, but certainly in the US, our young feel invincible.

Unlikely current stats in Ontario:

People who are fully vaccinated (2 doses / by age)
18-29: 58.1%
12-17: 52.2%

Yes, they are less than the older population groups (64% and higher in 30+ categories), but it's still not a statistical correlation just for the unvax'd.  Something is hitting these younger groups - perhaps it's the carelessness of them, perhaps it's something else.

That's a little mis-leading - that 64% applies to ages 30-39, but the % gets higher and higher with each age group - it's 91% for ages 70-79 and 93% for over 80s. https://covid19tracker.ca/provincevac.html?p=ON

It's similar in the UK, and so yes, it's almost certainly a combination of vaccination rates and possibly different behaviours (younger people going out and mingling more).

[jingle.boy]

We need comparison numbers as well: how big are those groups compared to other groups?  (If 50% of starting NFL QBs are vaccinated, that's not that big a deal since there are only 30 teams in the NFL (I'm not counting the Jaguars and the Jets).

Why?  What would knowing the precise skew of age brackets tell us?

And it's fair to point out that there are no COVID variants of high interest and four variants of concern, NONE of which originated in the States.

Again, why does that matter?  Why is that "fair"?  The Delta variant is in the US now, why does it matter where it originated?  Alpha originated in Wuhan.  I fail to understand how the origin is relevant.

There's a lot of focus on the U.S. because I don't know (it's where many of us live?  It's fun to point fingers?) but we're darn near 60% where the world is barely at 30%.  Again, it goes back to our goals and what we're REALLY worried about.

I think you answered it yourself - it's probably the country with the largest group of DTF'rs.  There's not a lot of talk about how Spain is handling the pandemic, because I don't know if there are many Spaniards here.

[jingle.boy]

That's a little mis-leading - that 64% applies to ages 30-39, but the % gets higher and higher with each age group - it's 91% for ages 70-79 and 93% for over 80s. https://covid19tracker.ca/provincevac.html?p=ON

That's what I mean to suggest by indicating "64% and higher in 30+ categories", not specifically 64% in 30-39 - I was just lazy and didn't want to list out every age category.    

It's similar in the UK, and so yes, it's almost certainly a combination of vaccination rates and possibly different behaviours (younger people going out and mingling more).

I'm am genuinely curious if there is something physiologically (ie, not just behaviours) that is causing the higher caseload and increased sickness of the <30 crowd.  I mean, we know the Alpha variant didn't hit children as hard as it did adults, so there is evidence the virus has different effects on different age groups.  Is it unreasonable to think that Delta does somehow have a stronger effect on younger people?

[Stadler]

Um, Stads, read Jingle's post again. 58% of people aged 18-29 are vaxxed and 52% of people aged 12-17 are vaxxed. No need to add up the percentages as those are different control groups.

Yeah, thanks for clarifying; that's the part I missed.   

[Stadler]

We need comparison numbers as well: how big are those groups compared to other groups?  (If 50% of starting NFL QBs are vaccinated, that's not that big a deal since there are only 30 teams in the NFL (I'm not counting the Jaguars and the Jets).

Why?  What would knowing the precise skew of age brackets tell us?

For one, it will help with:

I'm am genuinely curious if there is something physiologically (ie, not just behaviours) that is causing the higher caseload and increased sickness of the <30 crowd.  I mean, we know the Alpha variant didn't hit children as hard as it did adults, so there is evidence the virus has different effects on different age groups.  Is it unreasonable to think that Delta does somehow have a stronger effect on younger people?

I've posted articles that behavior isn't the number one driver of how the virus reacts (the New York Times Morning article from about a week or two ago), so there IS something else going on, it's just not clear what it is.

[Ben_Jamin]

Younger people, like those in those age categories, like to explore the world and discover what it is they can accomplish. They strive to find their place in life. How do you do this?....You go out and go places, you go out and experience the world, you don't just stay put at home and worry.

The younger crowds are the ones that are not going to take this, as they are young, wild, and free.

So what do the younger crowds do when the country opens, they traveled and explored the country. Being young and wanting to explore all the world has to offer.

I feel that travel and desire could play a role in the <30 crowd catching the virus.

[ProfessorPeart]

Um, Stads, read Jingle's post again. 58% of people aged 18-29 are vaxxed and 52% of people aged 12-17 are vaxxed. No need to add up the percentages as those are different control groups.

Yeah, thanks for clarifying; that's the part I missed.

No problem. Any chance to have the opportunity to say, 'I corrected Stadler!'. 

[Stadler]

Younger people, like those in those age categories, like to explore the world and discover what it is they can accomplish. They strive to find their place in life. How do you do this?....You go out and go places, you go out and experience the world, you don't just stay put at home and worry.

The younger crowds are the ones that are not going to take this, as they are young, wild, and free.

So what do the younger crowds do when the country opens, they traveled and explored the country. Being young and wanting to explore all the world has to offer.

I feel that travel and desire could play a role in the <30 crowd catching the virus.

I don't know what the proper terminology is, but at that age, up to about 25 or so, there are differences in the brain in terms of risk awareness and risk tolerance.   This isn't new, and is fairly well documented.

[Chino]

Younger people, like those in those age categories, like to explore the world and discover what it is they can accomplish. They strive to find their place in life. How do you do this?....You go out and go places, you go out and experience the world, you don't just stay put at home and worry.

The younger crowds are the ones that are not going to take this, as they are young, wild, and free.

So what do the younger crowds do when the country opens, they traveled and explored the country. Being young and wanting to explore all the world has to offer.

I feel that travel and desire could play a role in the <30 crowd catching the virus.

I don't know what the proper terminology is, but at that age, up to about 25 or so, there are differences in the brain in terms of risk awareness and risk tolerance.   This isn't new, and is fairly well documented.

Pretty sure you're thinking of the frontal lobe's development.

[Stadler]

Um, Stads, read Jingle's post again. 58% of people aged 18-29 are vaxxed and 52% of people aged 12-17 are vaxxed. No need to add up the percentages as those are different control groups.

Yeah, thanks for clarifying; that's the part I missed.

No problem. Any chance to have the opportunity to say, 'I corrected Stadler!'. 

 

[Ben_Jamin]

Younger people, like those in those age categories, like to explore the world and discover what it is they can accomplish. They strive to find their place in life. How do you do this?....You go out and go places, you go out and experience the world, you don't just stay put at home and worry.

The younger crowds are the ones that are not going to take this, as they are young, wild, and free.

So what do the younger crowds do when the country opens, they traveled and explored the country. Being young and wanting to explore all the world has to offer.

I feel that travel and desire could play a role in the <30 crowd catching the virus.

I don't know what the proper terminology is, but at that age, up to about 25 or so, there are differences in the brain in terms of risk awareness and risk tolerance.   This isn't new, and is fairly well documented.

Oh, okay. Is this a reason why you can't get Car Insurance until you turn 25?

[Chino]

Younger people, like those in those age categories, like to explore the world and discover what it is they can accomplish. They strive to find their place in life. How do you do this?....You go out and go places, you go out and experience the world, you don't just stay put at home and worry.

The younger crowds are the ones that are not going to take this, as they are young, wild, and free.

So what do the younger crowds do when the country opens, they traveled and explored the country. Being young and wanting to explore all the world has to offer.

I feel that travel and desire could play a role in the <30 crowd catching the virus.

I don't know what the proper terminology is, but at that age, up to about 25 or so, there are differences in the brain in terms of risk awareness and risk tolerance.   This isn't new, and is fairly well documented.

Oh, okay. Is this a reason why you can't get Car Insurance until you turn 25?

?? I was insured at 16. It's illegal to drive without it.

[Cool Chris]

Speaking of being corrected, Chad will be happy to know I humbly acknowledge I was wrong. My county is instituting a mask directive (it's not a mandate any longer...) for anyone over 5 in any indoor facility. Didn't think it would come to pass,and certainly not my county being the first in the state.

[Ben_Jamin]

Younger people, like those in those age categories, like to explore the world and discover what it is they can accomplish. They strive to find their place in life. How do you do this?....You go out and go places, you go out and experience the world, you don't just stay put at home and worry.

The younger crowds are the ones that are not going to take this, as they are young, wild, and free.

So what do the younger crowds do when the country opens, they traveled and explored the country. Being young and wanting to explore all the world has to offer.

I feel that travel and desire could play a role in the <30 crowd catching the virus.

I don't know what the proper terminology is, but at that age, up to about 25 or so, there are differences in the brain in terms of risk awareness and risk tolerance.   This isn't new, and is fairly well documented.

Oh, okay. Is this a reason why you can't get Car Insurance until you turn 25?

?? I was insured at 16. It's illegal to drive without it.

Insurance is more than it is when you're 25.

I guess what I mean is...Is this a reason why the rates go down for car insurance when you're 25?

[hunnus2000]

Younger people, like those in those age categories, like to explore the world and discover what it is they can accomplish. They strive to find their place in life. How do you do this?....You go out and go places, you go out and experience the world, you don't just stay put at home and worry.

The younger crowds are the ones that are not going to take this, as they are young, wild, and free.

So what do the younger crowds do when the country opens, they traveled and explored the country. Being young and wanting to explore all the world has to offer.

I feel that travel and desire could play a role in the <30 crowd catching the virus.

I don't know what the proper terminology is, but at that age, up to about 25 or so, there are differences in the brain in terms of risk awareness and risk tolerance.   This isn't new, and is fairly well documented.

Oh, okay. Is this a reason why you can't get Car Insurance until you turn 25?

?? I was insured at 16. It's illegal to drive without it.

When I was a young whipper-snapper, the 25 years old thing was when your car insurance went down in cost. I remember independence day when I my bill reduced significantly because stats showed the kids under 25 were more likely to get into crashes. I have know idea what the criteria is today.

[hunnus2000]

Um, Stads, read Jingle's post again. 58% of people aged 18-29 are vaxxed and 52% of people aged 12-17 are vaxxed. No need to add up the percentages as those are different control groups.

And as for Destupid mandating vaccines, he's threatening to not pay school officials that enforce mask mandates. The man has no interest in doing anything to deter this.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/2021/08/09/florida-gov-desantis-threatens-salaries-school-superintendents-school-board-members-mask-mandates/5546215001/

You know, if I were from another planet or even the other side of the world, I would quickly come to the conclusion that governors such as Disantis and Abbott are actively trying to kill people. Madness! 

[Lonk]

Younger people, like those in those age categories, like to explore the world and discover what it is they can accomplish. They strive to find their place in life. How do you do this?....You go out and go places, you go out and experience the world, you don't just stay put at home and worry.

The younger crowds are the ones that are not going to take this, as they are young, wild, and free.

So what do the younger crowds do when the country opens, they traveled and explored the country. Being young and wanting to explore all the world has to offer.

I feel that travel and desire could play a role in the <30 crowd catching the virus.

I don't know what the proper terminology is, but at that age, up to about 25 or so, there are differences in the brain in terms of risk awareness and risk tolerance.   This isn't new, and is fairly well documented.

Oh, okay. Is this a reason why you can't get Car Insurance until you turn 25?

?? I was insured at 16. It's illegal to drive without it.

When I was a young whipper-snapper, the 25 years old thing was when your car insurance went down in cost. I remember independence day when I my bill reduced significantly because stats showed the kids under 25 were more likely to get into crashes. I have know idea what the criteria is today.

All about risk. Age, where you live, where you drive, how long you had a license, all that can either increase of decrease your insurance cost.

The 25 year old thing I thought was for renting a car, but I believe that's not a thing anymore? Specially because things like Zipcar made it very easy for people to rent cars.

[Ben_Jamin]

Younger people, like those in those age categories, like to explore the world and discover what it is they can accomplish. They strive to find their place in life. How do you do this?....You go out and go places, you go out and experience the world, you don't just stay put at home and worry.

The younger crowds are the ones that are not going to take this, as they are young, wild, and free.

So what do the younger crowds do when the country opens, they traveled and explored the country. Being young and wanting to explore all the world has to offer.

I feel that travel and desire could play a role in the <30 crowd catching the virus.

I don't know what the proper terminology is, but at that age, up to about 25 or so, there are differences in the brain in terms of risk awareness and risk tolerance.   This isn't new, and is fairly well documented.

Oh, okay. Is this a reason why you can't get Car Insurance until you turn 25?

?? I was insured at 16. It's illegal to drive without it.

When I was a young whipper-snapper, the 25 years old thing was when your car insurance went down in cost. I remember independence day when I my bill reduced significantly because stats showed the kids under 25 were more likely to get into crashes. I have know idea what the criteria is today.

All about risk. Age, where you live, where you drive, how long you had a license, all that can either increase of decrease your insurance cost.

The 25 year old thing I thought was for renting a car, but I believe that's not a thing anymore? Specially because things like Zipcar made it very easy for people to rent cars.

 

That's what it was, Car Rentals....

[hefdaddy42]

Younger people, like those in those age categories, like to explore the world and discover what it is they can accomplish. They strive to find their place in life. How do you do this?....You go out and go places, you go out and experience the world, you don't just stay put at home and worry.

The younger crowds are the ones that are not going to take this, as they are young, wild, and free.

So what do the younger crowds do when the country opens, they traveled and explored the country. Being young and wanting to explore all the world has to offer.

I feel that travel and desire could play a role in the <30 crowd catching the virus.

I don't know what the proper terminology is, but at that age, up to about 25 or so, there are differences in the brain in terms of risk awareness and risk tolerance.   This isn't new, and is fairly well documented.

Oh, okay. Is this a reason why you can't get Car Insurance until you turn 25?

?? I was insured at 16. It's illegal to drive without it.

Insurance is more than it is when you're 25.

I guess what I mean is...Is this a reason why the rates go down for car insurance when you're 25?

Not sure about where you live (insurance is regulated by state, so some rules are different state to state), but here in NC there is no magic "age 25" rule.

Most people start driving around 16, and for the first three years the premiums are, well, very high, to say the least.

But it has nothing to do with the actual age.  It has to do with being an inexperienced driver.  If you waited to get your license until you were 25, you would be facing those same exorbitant rates for your first 3 years of driving.  Because a first-time driver aged 25 has no more experience than a first-time driver aged 16.

Assuming you have no accidents, and depending on the vehicle you drive, your rates should come down dramatically after your first three years.