Author Topic: How and why is Garth Brooks the second best selling music artist in the USA?  (Read 4434 times)

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Offline Stadler

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There is some STRONG musicianship on some of those records, both in the name artists - Brad Paisley, Keith Urban, Vince Gill - and in the backup players - Reggie Young, for one.  There is also some excellent songwriting. 

I've heard a few Urban songs on Youtube (maybe 6 or 7) and they're formulaic, generic and samey modern country-pop stuff. I didn't see any diversity.

And like many bands, what you hear on the radio or on YouTube isn't necessarily the full breadth of his catalogue. I'm not a fan of many/most of his hits/singles, myself, but I've seen him four times, including twice within maybe ten feet (I have pictures of him holding my daughter's hand while he signed autographs from the stage after one of his shows).  The man can play guitar. 

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The Beatles have never clicked for me. Of all the songs I've heard, and admittedly, I haven't heard a lot, I'd rank them from meh to so boring I have to change the station. Other bands from that era like Pink Floyd and Led Zeppelin are far superior.

I couldn't name or even recognise a Garth Brooks song. Taylor Swift, Shania Twain, and Carrie Underwood are the only country related music I can tolerate.

But what I'd really like to know is does WildRanger write his own threads?

If this is the de facto country thread, I’m just here to say that the best country-related singer is Alison Krauss hands down.
I absolutely love Alison Krauss (one of the purest voices in all of music), but for me, she isn't really a country singer.  She's bluegrass (which is related in some ways, but very different in others).

True, it’s country-related but not really country (I first started hearing her on Country Music TV for what it’s worth). At any rate, she’s amazing.

Offline kirksnosehair

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There is some STRONG musicianship on some of those records, both in the name artists - Brad Paisley, Keith Urban, Vince Gill - and in the backup players - Reggie Young, for one.  There is also some excellent songwriting. 

I've heard a few Urban songs on Youtube (maybe 6 or 7) and they're formulaic, generic and samey modern country-pop stuff. I didn't see any diversity.

And like many bands, what you hear on the radio or on YouTube isn't necessarily the full breadth of his catalogue. I'm not a fan of many/most of his hits/singles, myself, but I've seen him four times, including twice within maybe ten feet (I have pictures of him holding my daughter's hand while he signed autographs from the stage after one of his shows).  The man can play guitar.


Yeah, I've got no interest in his music at all but there is no question Keith Urban is a top-notch guitar player. 

Offline romdrums

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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_highest-certified_music_artists_in_the_United_States

It's really surprising to see that George Strait (another country guy) has sold more records than Bruce Springsteen's in the US.
Is he really bigger than Springsteen? Do his live shows have a bigger attendance than Springsteen? I doubt it.

Define what "bigger" means.  They're both 5'10", but Google suggests Strait weighs a bit more.  Why do you constantly ask these sorts of comparative questions based on subjective terms that have no set definition?

If "bigger" means person who sold more records in the U.S., then you've answered your own question.

Concert attendance?  Putting aside the single-show comparison previously mentioned, according to setlist.fm, Springsteen played 1,108 concerts between 2002-2021.  By contrast, Strait played only 360 concerts over the same period of time, so it would seem axiomatic that Springsteen's attendance is greater unless Strait, on average, draws 3x as many people to each show.  Attendance per show?  Heck if I know.  However, what does concert attendance have to do with record sales, which is what prompted your question in the first place?

If we want to know who has the bigger concert attendance, don't we also need to compare the average height and weight of a Bruce Springsteen concertgoer with the average height and weight of a George Strait concertgoer?

Also, do hats count when we're measuring bigness? Because that could be a significant game-changer in favor of Strait and his audience.

Everything is bigger in Texas.  That is entirely objective.
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Offline 425

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Also, do hats count when we're measuring bigness? Because that could be a significant game-changer in favor of Strait and his audience.

Everything is bigger in Texas.  That is entirely objective.

This has major implications for all Strait's exes.
And if spirit's a sign,
Then it's only a matter of time

Offline WildRanger

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Sure, it's not a big deal to me at all. I like but don't love both of those artists. I probably wouldn't pay for a stadium ticket for either, whereas I'd definitely pay stadium prices for my favorite artists, most of whom probably get less than 1/10th the attendance of either of those.

I just find it interesting how immensely popular country music is in the US, and how difficult it is for some people, including Americans who move in non-country-loving cultural circles, to believe that.

Straigh being ahead of The Rolling Stones might be the most surprising thing about the list of best selling music artists in the US. According to RIAA, Strait has sold 69 million album, while Stones have sold 66.5. RS has a much longer career than Strait.
Sometimes I really think RIAA certifications about album sales are not accurate.


Offline hefdaddy42

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Sometimes I really think RIAA certifications about album sales are not accurate.
Because they don't fit your expectations?
Hef is right on all things. Except for when I disagree with him. In which case he's probably still right.

Offline WildRanger

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Sometimes I really think RIAA certifications about album sales are not accurate.
Because they don't fit your expectations?

Nope. I just doubt them.
For example, according to RIAA Iron Maiden's The Number of the Beast went only one Platinum in the US, and I don't belive it's true because that album has sold over 14 million copies worldwide, so it's hard to believe that it hasn't sold at least 2 million copies in such a big market as America to this day, since it was a very popular and hyped album at the time.
Also according to RIAA Bowie's "Ziggy Stardust" went only Gold in the US and I think it's impossible since it was a huge album at the time.




Offline Stadler

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Sometimes I really think RIAA certifications about album sales are not accurate.
Because they don't fit your expectations?

Nope. I just doubt them.
For example, according to RIAA Iron Maiden's The Number of the Beast went only one Platinum in the US, and I don't belive it's true because that album has sold over 14 million copies worldwide, so it's hard to believe that it hasn't sold at least 2 million copies in such a big market as America to this day, since it was a very popular and hyped album at the time.
Also according to RIAA Bowie's "Ziggy Stardust" went only Gold in the US and I think it's impossible since it was a huge album at the time.

Actually, Wildranger is on to something here.   It's my understanding that bands have to resubmit their records for "recalculation" (that's not the right word, but I can't remember the correct word); it's not done automatically.  There were rumblings not too long ago that Peter Criss and Ace Frehley were going to sue (now that they have been bought out of the Kiss organization) to, among other things, get some of the early albums recertified.  The first three records are "only" gold, Alive! is "only" gold, and Creatures is "only" gold.   Especially Alive!, wildly named as one of the best live albums of all time, it strains credulity that it is only gold.  I don't know what the legal agreement is - and that's very important - but the rumor is that Gene and Paul aren't interested in recertifying because it would mean additional payments to Ace and Pete. 

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That's interesting Stadler.
would have thought the same thing but seeing the OP was TAC i immediately thought Maiden or DT related
Winger Theater Forums........or WTF.  ;D
TAC got a higher score than me in the electronic round? Honestly, can I just drop out now? :lol

Offline Stadler

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It's hard to find a cite that doesn't have a bunch of nonsense ("Gene and Paul don't want re-certify because it would be a blow to their ego to find out they've sold half of what they claim to have sold!" which is bullshit), but just googling "Kiss album recertification" gets you where you want to go.

In any event, it's clear that the record co. and/or artist have to pay for the audit for re-certification.  That alone tells me that the RIAA is suspect since it's not an automatic indicator of albums sold.

Offline 425

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Sure, it's not a big deal to me at all. I like but don't love both of those artists. I probably wouldn't pay for a stadium ticket for either, whereas I'd definitely pay stadium prices for my favorite artists, most of whom probably get less than 1/10th the attendance of either of those.

I just find it interesting how immensely popular country music is in the US, and how difficult it is for some people, including Americans who move in non-country-loving cultural circles, to believe that.

Straigh being ahead of The Rolling Stones might be the most surprising thing about the list of best selling music artists in the US. According to RIAA, Strait has sold 69 million album, while Stones have sold 66.5. RS has a much longer career than Strait.
Sometimes I really think RIAA certifications about album sales are not accurate.

The Rolling Stones have had a longer career in terms of years, but Strait has released the same number of studio albums. I think it's also reasonable to believe that Strait's fans are more likely to buy all his albums, including each new one as it comes out, while the Stones' fans are more likely to buy only the albums of a certain, "classic," period.

As Stadler has argued, it may be that RIAA is inaccurate sometimes, but I don't think you can just assume inaccuracy when a certain number doesn't fit your vague assessment of artists' relative popularity (in this case, it's already clear that you're inclined to underrate the popularity of country artists, since you've repeatedly underrated them on metrics that don't come from RIAA, like concert attendance). I think you need specific evidence about a certain case before you say, "Such and such is inaccurate."
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Offline pg1067

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For example, according to RIAA Iron Maiden's The Number of the Beast went only one Platinum in the US, and I don't belive it's true because that album has sold over 14 million copies worldwide, so it's hard to believe that it hasn't sold at least 2 million copies in such a big market as America to this day, since it was a very popular and hyped album at the time.

Let's start with a couple basic points:

1. You don't live and never have lived in the United States.  Right?
2. You aren't of an age that you could have had any awareness of what was going on with respect to TNOTB "at the time."  Right?

So...what exactly is your basis for stating so conclusively what things were like in the U.S. in the early '80s?

As someone with far better perspective than you about such things, let me assure you that TNOTB was neither "very popular" nor "very hyped" "at the time."  Prior to TNOTB, Maiden was a nothing artist in the states.  TNOTB was released in March 1982.  Maiden never played in the U.S. prior to 1981, and, in 1981, played 40 shows in the U.S. - primarily as an opening band for UFO.  Even if someone in the U.S. liked Maiden prior to TNOTB, they were unfamiliar with the new singer on TNOTB (who was not yet with the band on any of its U.S. dates in 1981).  Certainly, TNOTB had success in the U.S. "at the time," but Maiden was still an opening act at that point, and metal was not all that popular in general.  TNOTB didn't even get certified Gold until after POM was released, and it didn't get certified Platinum until after SIT was released.

I also find it amusing that you're blindly accepting whatever source told you that TNOTB has sold 14 million copies worldwide but are doubting the RIAA certification number.  What's your source for the 14 million sales figure?

I too would be surprised if, at some point in the last 35 years, TNOTB hasn't sole another million copies in the U.S. (if for no other reason that folks have replaced their original vinyl and cassette copies with CDs and, in some cases, have re-bought a vinyl copy).  However, Stadler's point is well-taken,** and it wouldn't surprise me if Maiden and its management have no real interest in jumping through hoops for RIAA certifications.


The Rolling Stones have had a longer career in terms of years, but Strait has released the same number of studio albums. I think it's also reasonable to believe that Strait's fans are more likely to buy all his albums, including each new one as it comes out, while the Stones' fans are more likely to buy only the albums of a certain, "classic," period.

Moreover, the Stones weren't really an album band; they were a singles band.  I'm not a fan, but I was surprised that I didn't know any more than two (maybe three) songs on any Stones album.

I think it's also worth pointing out that the Stones have only released four studio albums in the last 30 years, whereas (if the info on Wiki is accurate), George Strait has been consistently and regularly releasing studio albums for 40 years.


** - If you look at the RIAA data for Stones albums, four of their early albums that hit Platinum status (Out of Our Heads, Aftermath, Beggars Banquet and Let It Bleed) hit that status on the same date:  October 20, 1989.  Their next set of albums (Sticky Fingers, Exile on Main St., Goat's Head Soup and It's Only Rock 'n' Roll) received their Platinum certifications on May 31, 2000.  Starting with Black & Blue, Stones albums got their initial Platinum certifications around the time they were released (although many received subsequent certifications on...you guessed it...May 31, 2000).  Pretty clearly, these 1989 and 2000 certifications were the result of pushes made by the band management and/or record companies.
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Offline Stadler

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Anecdotally, I believe Mick Jagger sees the benefit of having multi-platinum albums.   He gets paid, and it makes the catalogue - which they have moved at least twice - more valuable.  It's in Mick's best interest to recertify, and so it doesn't surprise me in the least that the Stones redo those periodically.

Also, it should be noted that it might not be the RIAA that is faulty; garbage in, garbage out.  We know Soundscan does a big part of the heavy lifting, but it's not perfect.  There's also the "equivalents":  how does a stream count? How do double LPs count?  How do box sets count? 

Offline King Postwhore

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I read pg's past and though, "Why would he bring The New Kids On The Block into this?"  Only to do a double take on TNOTB. :lol

This brain of mine.......
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Offline pg1067

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I read pg's past and though, "Why would he bring The New Kids On The Block into this?"  Only to do a double take on TNOTB. :lol

This brain of mine.......

 :lol :lol :lol

For the future, you can rest assured that I will never "bring The New Kids on the Block into" ANYTHING.   :biggrin:
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