Would society let me starve if I didn't wear a mask?

[MirrorMask]

Did we just mention the systematic extermination of jews from a brutal and idiotic regime with a hardon for race purity while discussing the possibility to keep somehow trace of who gets vaccinated during a pandemic and therefore is not anymore a potential danger to other persons they interact with?

Not everything is a slippery slope, let's keep real folks.

[Skeever]

OP is a very scared person who is deeply frightened of the world around him and should seek professional help regarding his fears and paranoias. Not sure anyone of us can help here.

[Dublagent66]

OP is a very scared person who is deeply frightened of the world around him and should seek professional help regarding his fears and paranoias. Not sure anyone of us can help here.

Is that your professional, expert opinion?  The OP wasn't asking for help.

[Skeever]

OP is a very scared person who is deeply frightened of the world around him and should seek professional help regarding his fears and paranoias. Not sure anyone of us can help here.

Is that your professional, expert opinion?  The OP wasn't asking for help.

Either the medical question about the safety of the vaccines or the pattern of fear and paranoia demonstrated in the other thread should be addressed by a professional, in the form case medical, and in the latter case psychological.

[Stadler]

Yeah, I don't think we need to psychoanalyze someone just because they might take a different position than us; there's enough of that on Twitter for god's sake.

Most of this is going to work itself out.   95% of the time, it's going to be a choice; what matters to me more, showing my vaxx papers, or having that Tito's in that particular bar?   There's going to be places that care, there's going to be places that don't give a rat's ass, and the particles (the people) are going to sort themselves out.   Me?  I'm trying to find a lanyard or a pin from an old conference - you know what I mean; that plastic covering that your name tag goes into at a work function - and hell yeah, I'm putting my vaxx card in there. I'm wearing it like a backstage pass, m-----f------s.  Your mileage may vary, and that's how "free" populations of 330 million people with the right of "life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness" work.

[darkshade]

Did we just mention the systematic extermination of jews from a brutal and idiotic regime with a hardon for race purity while discussing the possibility to keep somehow trace of who gets vaccinated during a pandemic and therefore is not anymore a potential danger to other persons they interact with?

Not everything is a slippery slope, let's keep real folks.

So it's only socially acceptable to compare Trump to Nazis, but not other politicians and bureaucrats?

[Dave_Manchester]

Did we just mention the systematic extermination of jews from a brutal and idiotic regime with a hardon for race purity while discussing the possibility to keep somehow trace of who gets vaccinated during a pandemic and therefore is not anymore a potential danger to other persons they interact with?

It's only ever a matter of time:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwin%27s_law

As for the OP, I'm still not clear on the issue. Or rather his position on it. Given this whole hunger strike thing is part of a crusade for personal liberty then it seems to me he should WANT society and the government to not give a shit if he chooses to do it. This ought to be his ideal scenario:

OP:  "I'm going to starve myself to death in protest at being forced to wear a mask!"

Everyone else: "You do that champ"

Yet he seems to want people to step in; to create a "chain reaction" as he put it. It's the oddest pro-freedom idea I've ever come across. I can respect if not agree with hesitation about vaccines but the 'thought experiment' in the original post is uneccesarily confusing. When Americans are talking about America as if it's an authoritarian police state I think you're taking a shitload for granted.

[Skeever]

Yeah, I don't think we need to psychoanalyze someone just because they might take a different position than us; there's enough of that on Twitter for god's sake.

Telling someone they seem like they need help =/= psychoanalyzing. darkshade seems like has is suffering from a lot of fears about the world around him that do not seem founded and only professional help (both of the medical and psychological variety) (rather than, you know, guys on a Dream Theater forum) could help him untangle all of the information he has found fueling this on the far corners of the internet.

[Lonk]

Yeah, I don't think we need to psychoanalyze someone just because they might take a different position than us; there's enough of that on Twitter for god's sake.

Most of this is going to work itself out.   95% of the time, it's going to be a choice; what matters to me more, showing my vaxx papers, or having that Tito's in that particular bar?   There's going to be places that care, there's going to be places that don't give a rat's ass, and the particles (the people) are going to sort themselves out.   Me?  I'm trying to find a lanyard or a pin from an old conference - you know what I mean; that plastic covering that your name tag goes into at a work function - and hell yeah, I'm putting my vaxx card in there. I'm wearing it like a backstage pass, m-----f------s.  Your mileage may vary, and that's how "free" populations of 330 million people with the right of "life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness" work.

https://www.amazon.com/Pack-Immunization-Vaccination-Waterproof-Resealable/dp/B092DB3W6Q/ref=sr_1_1_sspa?crid=J0P0RWHXPX0D&dchild=1&keywords=vaccine+card+holder+3x4&qid=1619788974&sprefix=vaccine%2Caps%2C162&sr=8-1-spons&psc=1&spLa=ZW5jcnlwdGVkUXVhbGlmaWVyPUExUUdKVkYyMkVQQVhaJmVuY3J5cHRlZElkPUEwMjcxMjc4M05OMEQ2UzVDQzlZNyZlbmNyeXB0ZWRBZElkPUEwMDI4MDU1TTI0OFdRQjhLVFgxJndpZGdldE5hbWU9c3BfYXRmJmFjdGlvbj1jbGlja1JlZGlyZWN0JmRvTm90TG9nQ2xpY2s9dHJ1ZQ==

[King Postwhore]

Dave, we live in a world of extremes where rumors seem to be taken for truths. The reality always lands in the gray but each side seems to live in the black and white only.  I feel like I'm in the minority these days.

[darkshade]

Yeah, I don't think we need to psychoanalyze someone just because they might take a different position than us; there's enough of that on Twitter for god's sake.

Telling someone they seem like they need help =/= psychoanalyzing. darkshade seems like has is suffering from a lot of fears about the world around him that do not seem founded and only professional help (both of the medical and psychological variety) (rather than, you know, guys on a Dream Theater forum) could help him untangle all of the information he has found fueling this on the far corners of the internet.

If I feared anything, I would get the vaccine.

Low IQ people resort to name calling or bully tactics when they disagree with what they see and read.

[Skeever]

Yeah, I don't think we need to psychoanalyze someone just because they might take a different position than us; there's enough of that on Twitter for god's sake.

Telling someone they seem like they need help =/= psychoanalyzing. darkshade seems like has is suffering from a lot of fears about the world around him that do not seem founded and only professional help (both of the medical and psychological variety) (rather than, you know, guys on a Dream Theater forum) could help him untangle all of the information he has found fueling this on the far corners of the internet.

If I feared anything, I would get the vaccine.

Low IQ people resort to name calling or bully tactics when they disagree with what they see and read.

I have done nothing but say that you seem scared, and that you should seek professional help (talk to a doctor about the vaccine, maybe talk to a psychologist about all your fears). That is not "name calling".

But you've just called me an "low IQ person". So, there you go. But, like I said, don't ask us. Ask a professional.

[darkshade]

Yeah, I don't think we need to psychoanalyze someone just because they might take a different position than us; there's enough of that on Twitter for god's sake.

Telling someone they seem like they need help =/= psychoanalyzing. darkshade seems like has is suffering from a lot of fears about the world around him that do not seem founded and only professional help (both of the medical and psychological variety) (rather than, you know, guys on a Dream Theater forum) could help him untangle all of the information he has found fueling this on the far corners of the internet.

If I feared anything, I would get the vaccine.

Low IQ people resort to name calling or bully tactics when they disagree with what they see and read.

I have done nothing but say that you seem scared, and that you should seek professional help (talk to a doctor about the vaccine, maybe talk to a psychologist about all your fears). That is not "name calling".

But you've just called me an "low IQ person". So, there you go. But, like I said, don't ask us. Ask a professional.

You've said everything but "idiot" in so many words. I didn't call you a low IQ person, I said that is what people with a low IQ tend to do.

[Skeever]

OK. Now go talk to a professional who can help you untangle all this information you've found.

[lonestar]

It's not society letting you starve, it's individual businesses expressing their freedom of choice in how they want to protect themselves, their employees and clientele. Restaurants not allowing you in barefoot or with Fifi your emotional support chihuahua isn't restricting your freedom, it's them protecting the health of their food, their kitchen, and in the end your dining experience

[Nekov]

It's not society letting you starve, it's individual businesses expressing their freedom of choice in how they want to protect themselves, their employees and clientele. Restaurants not allowing you in barefoot or with Fifi your emotional support chihuahua isn't restricting your freedom, it's them protecting the health of their food, their kitchen, and in the end your dining experience

[hunnus2000]

It's not society letting you starve, it's individual businesses expressing their freedom of choice in how they want to protect themselves, their employees and clientele. Restaurants not allowing you in barefoot or with Fifi your emotional support chihuahua isn't restricting your freedom, it's them protecting the health of their food, their kitchen, and in the end your dining experience

I would like to add that these same businesses are highly regulated either at a federal or local  level for restaurants. Some cities have strict no smoking laws within certain establishments. Do you see smokers grumbling about personal freedoms? Want your kid to go to school? Get them vaccinated although there are some ridiculous exceptions. How about seat belt laws?

In Darkshade's example and he doesn't want to wear a mask, I say - 'Tear yo ass' and I will move on and if you get sick, I would yawn and move on.

[MirrorMask]

Yeah, smokers are the best example. I mean, I don't smoke, never have, never will, I don't understand how kids today can start to smoke while they're being told how dangerous it is and seeing how it's being forbidden everywhere.

But it was not always like that. I'm not-young enough to have lived in the times when you went to the pub and there was a cloud inside and you came home with your freshly worn clothes STINKING. Then 20 years ago or so we told smokers "You can't smoke inside, go outside and if it's winter, wear a coat, not my problem".

And what did smokers do? THEY ROLLED WITH IT. No protests, no freedoms stolen, no marches, no complaints, no defying acts of "civil disobedience". They took their coats and went outside to smoke in the cold.

Learn from smokers.

[Elite]

Simple question.

No, it's not.

If I don't want to support food being delivered to my house and would rather support local businesses, but refuse to wear a mask inside grocery stores, restaurants, or convenient stores, does the United States society let me starve to death because wearing a mask is for "the good of society"?

Depends on what you're willing to do against it, I suppose.

I say yes, because a lot of Americans are apathetic, stupid and scaredy cats over everything. The US government allows the kinds of food to be sold that cause cancer, they also allow cigarettes to be sold to the general public, despite the common knowledge that they kill half a million Americans every single year.

Yes, and? If it's common knowledge that cigarettes kill you, then don't smoke. It's not that difficult there. The main take-away here is the first sentence though. What exactly makes you think Americans are apathetic, stupid and scared?

I think this is more philosophical that political and I can't post in the political section anyway. Just a weird thought that popped into my head.

You know there's this thread where you can grant permission to post in P/R, right? It's a weird thought indeed.

[hefdaddy42]

Dude, if you'd rather not eat than wear a mask, then fucking starve.  It's your body, so you make the choices for it that you can.  Get pierced, get tattooed, get malnourished, go crazy.  You do you, boo.

Meanwhile, on the advice of my medical professional, I got the vaccine and will continue to wear a mask in appropriate situations.

[Stadler]

Yeah, smokers are the best example. I mean, I don't smoke, never have, never will, I don't understand how kids today can start to smoke while they're being told how dangerous it is and seeing how it's being forbidden everywhere.

But it was not always like that. I'm not-young enough to have lived in the times when you went to the pub and there was a cloud inside and you came home with your freshly worn clothes STINKING. Then 20 years ago or so we told smokers "You can't smoke inside, go outside and if it's winter, wear a coat, not my problem".

And what did smokers do? THEY ROLLED WITH IT. No protests, no freedoms stolen, no marches, no complaints, no defying acts of "civil disobedience". They took their coats and went outside to smoke in the cold.

Learn from smokers.

I don't think it's relevant to this particular aspect of the conversation, but it's important to note that smokers CAN still smoke, and there are bars - McGlinchey's in Philly comes to mind - that are full smoking bars, and regulate their food sales (the criteria in Philly) to maintain that status.  The difference is that there's a different feel to the vaccines; I don't know if it's because smoking has been around for a long time, or that we all know someone who has or does smoke, but there's far less vitriol and judgment when it comes to smoking.  I don't see "IQ" coming up in too many conversations about smoking.

[lonestar]

There's also zero consideration or respect being shown for the low wage workers who are in the unenviable position of enforcing mask mandates, and as someone who has done just that in their second job, I can tell you I'd just as soon see you run face first into the business end of a fast moving truck. I don't fucking care about your freedom, they pay me 15/hr to tell you to put on a mask. I'm not the man, I'm not oppressing you, I'm just doing a fucking job. Just fucking do it and get the fuck over yourself.

Your not that fucking important. Nobody cares..

[ariich]

Then you make a decision.   Be homeless or get the vaccine.

So the CDC is wrong? "Most people who get sick from SARS-CoV-2 wear masks often." or however it's worded.

Masks don't provide much protection to the wearer, they protect other people FROM the wearer.

Good lord it's been a full year now, how do people still not understand this point?

[Ben_Jamin]

If the Government really cared about your life, they wouldn't let you die from starvation rather than the sickness.

To me, what is damn interesting about this is who got richer...and knowing this world is a businesses, these high businesses just made a ton of money off these vaccines, tests, and the demanded supplies. Yet, other businesses we're forced to shut down and stop doing business, many from people that started up their own businesses. The small man got screwed by the big companies big time.

And it's what led to lawsuits here in my State.

The government is only there to keep order of the people. It's why there's laws, rules and order in every government and nation. That's just how our human society works. It's why I also say, there hasn't been a melting pot of many cultures, traditions, and people living in one nation. This is a humanity first since a long while. We have societies beginning to quarrel for control and power of the nation. And when the once majority becomes obsolete, the power struggle begins over who will reign.

The constitution has laws and rules that are meant for all, any man, because in those times, the term "Man" was a shortened term for "Human". It had nothing to do with gender. When you look at past documents you have to remember what the words meant at the time because words do not mean the same as they once did. Like the word Fag.

But I understand what Darkshade is saying, even if I don't fully agree with him, I get it.

Whats funny though is I knew what the responses would be and how it'd end up, because it happens in every damn thing that something like this is even questioned or brought up. And that's the issue some people have with even bringing up a simple question, or even a thought someone might have.

If people think it's stupid, rather than ignoring it, and focusing on the question, they go into personal attacks. That is just human behavior.

But I will say, all this reaction has happened before when the shit hits the fan. People will stay and watch what happens and then die, or people will leave and end up dying. No matter what people die, it's inevitable.


For one, I do not think Darkshade is scared at all. He is just concerned, and those concerns are not what the majority has concerns about. But people are different and in this melting pot will not have the same concerns as others in the nation.

[Skeever]

For one, I do not think Darkshade is scared at all. He is just concerned, and those concerns are not what the majority has concerns about. But people are different and in this melting pot will not have the same concerns as others in the nation.

"Concerns" get brought up with your medical professionals. Don't like what one is telling you, or feel like they're not adequately answering your questions? Get a 2nd opinion, or a 3rd. Talk to as many experts as you need to in order to have all your questions answered so that you can make the right decision for you.

"Fears" get addressed by falling into a rabbit hole of fringe websites and voices and clogging your ears to anything that's not already sucking you into the vacuum. 

[T-ski]

Then you make a decision.   Be homeless or get the vaccine.

So the CDC is wrong? "Most people who get sick from SARS-CoV-2 wear masks often." or however it's worded.

Masks don't provide much protection to the wearer, they protect other people FROM the wearer.

Good lord it's been a full year now, how do people still not understand this point?

The mask also goes over your nose.

The frustration is real.

[MirrorMask]

Then you make a decision.   Be homeless or get the vaccine.

So the CDC is wrong? "Most people who get sick from SARS-CoV-2 wear masks often." or however it's worded.

Masks don't provide much protection to the wearer, they protect other people FROM the wearer.

Good lord it's been a full year now, how do people still not understand this point?

The mask also goes over your nose.

The frustration is real.

I like the joke that I saw going around on the web, something like "We made a mess of the apocalypse in easy mode, no way we're ready for zombies or aliens" 

[Stadler]

Then you make a decision.   Be homeless or get the vaccine.

So the CDC is wrong? "Most people who get sick from SARS-CoV-2 wear masks often." or however it's worded.

Masks don't provide much protection to the wearer, they protect other people FROM the wearer.

Good lord it's been a full year now, how do people still not understand this point?

The mask also goes over your nose.

The frustration is real.

Haha; that's a pet peeve of mine as well.  Wear it or not, but if you choose to wear it, WEAR IT.

[pg1067]

Simple question. If I don't want to support food being delivered to my house and would rather support local businesses, but refuse to wear a mask inside grocery stores, restaurants, or convenient stores, does the United States society let me starve to death because wearing a mask is for "the good of society"?

. . .

I think this is more philosophical. . . .

Ok...my philosophical response is that, for the good of the human species, morons should be allowed to die.  How's that?

[Ben_Jamin]

There is an issue with the masks though...that is pollution. There's so many people throwing their masks on the ground and it's causing Ocean Pollution...

Plastic consumption, which has been steadily rising for years, increased significantly as a result of the COVID-19 pandemic.

“Hygiene concerns and greater reliance on take-away food has led to increased use of plastics, particularly plastic packaging,” says Gary Stokes, Director of Operations of OceansAsia. “Meanwhile, a number of measures designed to reduce plastic consumption, like single-use plastic bag bans, have been delayed, paused, or rolled back.”

The use of PPE, in particular face masks, has become a common tool used in preventing the spread of the virus, with many jurisdictions mandating the wearing of masks in public. The production of PPE has expanded in an attempt to meet skyrocketing demand, and PPE waste has also increased dramatically.

Single-use face masks are made from a variety of meltblown plastics and are difficult to recycle due to both composition and risk of contamination and infection. They enter oceans when they are littered, when waste management systems are inadequate or non-existent, or when these systems become overwhelmed due to increased volumes of waste.

https://oceansasia.org/covid-19-facemasks/

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/disposable-mask-pollution-poses-risk-for-coastal-bend-marine-life/vi-BB1cNw5p

[Elite]

There is an issue with the masks though...that is pollution.

This is not a mask issue, it's a people issue. Come on now.

[Nekov]

Then you make a decision.   Be homeless or get the vaccine.

So the CDC is wrong? "Most people who get sick from SARS-CoV-2 wear masks often." or however it's worded.

Masks don't provide much protection to the wearer, they protect other people FROM the wearer.

Good lord it's been a full year now, how do people still not understand this point?

The mask also goes over your nose.

The frustration is real.

I like the joke that I saw going around on the web, something like "We made a mess of the apocalypse in easy mode, no way we're ready for zombies or aliens" 

  So fucking true

[Ben_Jamin]

Simple question. If I don't want to support food being delivered to my house and would rather support local businesses, but refuse to wear a mask inside grocery stores, restaurants, or convenient stores, does the United States society let me starve to death because wearing a mask is for "the good of society"?

. . .

I think this is more philosophical. . . .

Ok...my philosophical response is that, for the good of the human species, morons should be allowed to die.  How's that?

Well, of course, and that moron could die many different ways because they're a moron.

Doesn't do much for society either though, other than they're a moron.


But that's also, not ignorance, because to be a moron, you have to know the consequences and know the risks, yet still do it anyways. Many people whom take these extreme risks for fun, could be considered morons if they die, but if they survive, are they morons or just wild.

Ignorance is not knowing the risks or consequences, because you do not know, that swimming with sharks you become their food or swimming in a river can suck you in and easily drown you.

[Ben_Jamin]

There is an issue with the masks though...that is pollution.

This is not a mask issue, it's a people issue. Come on now.

Since it's a people issue. How can you expect people to abide by rules and laws and other things when people are horrible that they don't realize their actions affect the environment, all our actions affect the world and in turn it affects us.

What we are doing to the environment and earth and depleting these resources causes the Earth to become sick and in turn we becomes sick. It's a living entity and when organisms are sick, their immune systems fight off the cause of the sickness. To Me, this could be the world trying to rid itself of the virus, and that virus is Man.

[Lonk]

There is an issue with the masks though...that is pollution.

This is not a mask issue, it's a people issue. Come on now.

Since it's a people issue. How can you expect people to abide by rules and laws and other things when people are horrible that they don't realize their actions affect the environment, all our actions affect the world and in turn it affects us.

What we are doing to the environment and earth and depleting these resources causes the Earth to become sick and in turn we becomes sick. It's a living entity and when organisms are sick, their immune systems fight of the cause of the sickness. To Me, this could be the world trying to rid itself of the virus, and that virus is Man.

Improving the education system.