POLL: What Is Your Favorite Four-Album Run by Rush?

[Stadler]

Signals through Hold Your Fire

Yeah, I'm one of the weird ones too. I just love their 80s stuff.

It's such a great stretch of albums. I think the only one most people have an issue with is HYF and it's pretty much due to one song. I could just as easily put MP through PoW but HYF has 7 songs I could rank in my top 50 whereas MP has only 4.

"Most people"?  I get that there are fans of the '80s material, but I don't think there's any way to generalize about Rush fans.  Looking at Signals through HYF, Signals is the only album that I'd rank in the top half of the catalog.  HYF is certainly the worst of the so-called "synth era" albums, but that's not only because of one song.  The only songs I even bother with on that album are Mission and, to a much lesser extent, Time Stand Still.  There are moments in some of the other songs, but every time I listen to that album, it literally makes me sad.  After two straight disappointing albums, I so wanted HYF to be a comeback album and, for a while, I pretended to like it.  But I remember playing it for a friend who was, at best, a casual Rush fan.  His reaction was, "if that weren't a Rush album, you would hate it."  That comment threw me because I had no response because I realized he was right.  Fortunately, the "comeback" album did come two years later.

By that I assume you mean Tai Shan; I find the hate for that song to be, odd.  I can't prove it, but I suspect if Geddy hadn't trashed it, it wouldn't be as reviled as it is.

I disliked it LONG before I ever heard Geddy speak poorly of it.

But in all fairness, you slagged the entire album more or less.   I can't understand someone listening to that record and saying "wow, what a great album; too bad it has Tai Shan on it!"    We're not exactly talking about "Whodunnit?" or "Cannibal Surf Babe" or something like that.  I actually think it's a beautiful song, and while the instrumentation isn't of my first choice, I think HYF is a beautiful collection of ballads screaming to get out.

[allewartenaufdaslicht_]

With Neil returning from his jazz extravaganza and Buddy Rich-infused relearned drum technique on Test For Echo (which is played in traditional grip from start to finish by the way), the incredible 4 year hiatus after the big tragedy of the band and finally the loud, heavy and definitive big bang of a return that is Vapor Trails with the heartbreaking story it conveys, I just had to go with Test For Echo, Vapor Trails, Snakes & Arrows and Clockwork. This choice is a hard one indeed but it was a no brainer for me.

A homeward angel on the fly
A wave toward the clearing sky

- even just reading these words makes me shiver...

[kirksnosehair]

I know the group beginning with AFTK will probably win this, but my favorite Rush album is 2112 so I had to pick the group that begins there.


That said, this is another group that had an extraordinary album run from Fly By Night through Moving Pictures


Might be the best/longest run of high-quality albums by any prog rock group ever. 

[Setlist Scotty]

Went with Hemispheres-Signals. Prefer Signals over AFtK by a country mile. Only other option that I really considered was MP-PoW.

[Fritzinger]

With Neil returning from his jazz extravaganza and Buddy Rich-infused relearned drum technique on Test For Echo (which is played in traditional grip from start to finish by the way), the incredible 4 year hiatus after the big tragedy of the band and finally the loud, heavy and definitive big bang of a return that is Vapor Trails with the heartbreaking story it conveys, I just had to go with Test For Echo, Vapor Trails, Snakes & Arrows and Clockwork. This choice is a hard one indeed but it was a no brainer for me.

A homeward angel on the fly
A wave toward the clearing sky

- even just reading these words makes me shiver...

I stand by my choice, but for exactly those reasons, Vapor Trails is and will always be my undisputed number 1 Rush album 

[HOF]

Signals through Hold Your Fire

Yeah, I'm one of the weird ones too. I just love their 80s stuff.

It's such a great stretch of albums. I think the only one most people have an issue with is HYF and it's pretty much due to one song. I could just as easily put MP through PoW but HYF has 7 songs I could rank in my top 50 whereas MP has only 4.

"Most people"?  I get that there are fans of the '80s material, but I don't think there's any way to generalize about Rush fans.  Looking at Signals through HYF, Signals is the only album that I'd rank in the top half of the catalog.  HYF is certainly the worst of the so-called "synth era" albums, but that's not only because of one song.  The only songs I even bother with on that album are Mission and, to a much lesser extent, Time Stand Still.  There are moments in some of the other songs, but every time I listen to that album, it literally makes me sad.  After two straight disappointing albums, I so wanted HYF to be a comeback album and, for a while, I pretended to like it.  But I remember playing it for a friend who was, at best, a casual Rush fan.  His reaction was, "if that weren't a Rush album, you would hate it."  That comment threw me because I had no response because I realized he was right.  Fortunately, the "comeback" album did come two years later.

By that I assume you mean Tai Shan; I find the hate for that song to be, odd.  I can't prove it, but I suspect if Geddy hadn't trashed it, it wouldn't be as reviled as it is.

I disliked it LONG before I ever heard Geddy speak poorly of it.

But in all fairness, you slagged the entire album more or less.   I can't understand someone listening to that record and saying "wow, what a great album; too bad it has Tai Shan on it!"    We're not exactly talking about "Whodunnit?" or "Cannibal Surf Babe" or something like that.  I actually think it's a beautiful song, and while the instrumentation isn't of my first choice, I think HYF is a beautiful collection of ballads screaming to get out.

Tai Shan is definitely one I heard and thought “that’s objectively bad” the first time I heard it (yes, yes, just my opinion). But somehow Open Secrets is even worse. That said, I do like most of HYF. 

Also, I love Cannibal Surf Babe.

[TAC]

Tai Shan was awful the first time I heard it too. I wasn't aware that Geddy didn't care for it.

[Stadler]

What is it about Tai Shan that is so bad?  It's not the worst lyric on the album.  It's not the worst music on the album (though it might be the most sparse in terms of guitar), it's not the worst melody...  I just don't get it.   


I love that line:  "I stood at the top of the mountain... and China sang to me."   When I toured Austria I had a very similar feeling.



By the way, I hated Cannibal Surf Babe for the longest time, then I sort of got it and now it's one of my favorites from that album (which is also a favorite).

[TAC]

What is it about Tai Shan that is so bad?  It's not the worst lyric on the album.  It's not the worst music on the album (though it might be the most sparse in terms of guitar), it's not the worst melody...  I just don't get it.   

Dammit Stadler! If you fucking make me listen to Tai Shan I'm not gonna be happy!

[pg1067]

Did you just call... Grace Under Pressure AND Power Windows two... disappointing albums?

Yes...coming on the heels of the amazing run from 2112 through Signals, GUP and POW were massive disappointments.

But in all fairness, you slagged the entire album more or less.   I can't understand someone listening to that record and saying "wow, what a great album; too bad it has Tai Shan on it!"    We're not exactly talking about "Whodunnit?" or "Cannibal Surf Babe" or something like that.  I actually think it's a beautiful song, and while the instrumentation isn't of my first choice, I think HYF is a beautiful collection of ballads screaming to get out.

I get your point, and it makes sense.  I don't particularly like the album as a whole, so it's hardly surprising that Tai Shan is part of that, but it would strike me as odd if someone generally liked the album and hated TS.  Also, I kinda like Whodunnit? (assuming you're talking about the Genesis song).      Never heard or heard of Cannibal Surf Babe, though.

[HOF]

What is it about Tai Shan that is so bad?  It's not the worst lyric on the album.  It's not the worst music on the album (though it might be the most sparse in terms of guitar), it's not the worst melody...  I just don't get it.   


I love that line:  "I stood at the top of the mountain... and China sang to me."   When I toured Austria I had a very similar feeling.



By the way, I hated Cannibal Surf Babe for the longest time, then I sort of got it and now it's one of my favorites from that album (which is also a favorite).

I think a big part of it is the soft, shimmery keyboards and Asian instrument samples. It’s hard to call a melody good or bad but something about the way Geddy sings it just sounds awkward. I probably don’t hate it as much as I did when I first heard it though. There’s a line that a lot of HYF straddles between earnestness and schmaltz, and this one and Second Nature (not sure why I said Open Secrets before. I like that one a lot) just seem to cross too far over onto the schmaltz side (I’d also put Lock and Key on that side of the line as well).

[TAC]

I get your point, and it makes sense.  I don't particularly like the album as a whole, so it's hardly surprising that Tai Shan is part of that, but it would strike me as odd if someone generally liked the album and hated TS.

I'm guilty of this. "Generally like" might be a bit strong, but for the most part, I don't mind most of HYF. There's a handful of songs that I do indeed like.

But I find it hard to get through any of the 80's albums (Signals through Hold Your Fire) without skipping a number of tracks on each.

[King Postwhore]

I consider myself a Rush nut but I see Tai Shan as shippable.

[DTA]

Signals through Hold Your Fire

Yeah, I'm one of the weird ones too. I just love their 80s stuff.

It's such a great stretch of albums. I think the only one most people have an issue with is HYF and it's pretty much due to one song. I could just as easily put MP through PoW but HYF has 7 songs I could rank in my top 50 whereas MP has only 4.

By that I assume you mean Tai Shan; I find the hate for that song to be, odd.  I can't prove it, but I suspect if Geddy hadn't trashed it, it wouldn't be as reviled as it is.  I don't LOVE it, but I do love HYF, and it doesn't ruin the album for me or anything.   I actually prefer it over "Turn The Page".

You're probably correct in that Geddy's comments on the song have colored a lot of fans' opinion of it. I feel like the same thing happens with FII due to Portnoy's comments about it. I personally don't mind Tai Shan (in fact I find Second Nature to be the true dud from that album) but the world-music Enya-vibe does feel out of place to me on such a heavily synthesized album. Turn The Page is awesome however and contains the coolest Geddy bass line

[Stadler]

What is it about Tai Shan that is so bad?  It's not the worst lyric on the album.  It's not the worst music on the album (though it might be the most sparse in terms of guitar), it's not the worst melody...  I just don't get it.   


I love that line:  "I stood at the top of the mountain... and China sang to me."   When I toured Austria I had a very similar feeling.



By the way, I hated Cannibal Surf Babe for the longest time, then I sort of got it and now it's one of my favorites from that album (which is also a favorite).

I think a big part of it is the soft, shimmery keyboards and Asian instrument samples. It’s hard to call a melody good or bad but something about the way Geddy sings it just sounds awkward. I probably don’t hate it as much as I did when I first heard it though. There’s a line that a lot of HYF straddles between earnestness and schmaltz, and this one and Second Nature (not sure why I said Open Secrets before. I like that one a lot) just seem to cross too far over onto the schmaltz side (I’d also put Lock and Key on that side of the line as well).

See, I LOVE Second Nature.  That melody:  "It ought to be second nature... at lesat that's what I feel..." is probably one of my favorite moments on the entire record.  I LOVE that melody.   There IS schmaltz to that record, and I think I wrote this above: it's a record of ballads if you ask me (and in keeping with the idea of titles as themes, I think it fits:  "Hold Your Fire", meaning make love not war, so to speak).   For all the keyboard shimmer of that record, if you asked me "what ONE Rush record would you like to hear done unplugged", it would be Hold Your Fire.   "Mission" as an acoustic ballad?  Yes please!!!!   

[Stadler]

I consider myself a Rush nut but I see Tai Shan as shippable.

I love you, man.  I really do. 

[TAC]

I consider myself a Rush nut but I see Tai Shan as shippable.

I love you, man.  I really do.

I think I started and stopped like 3 or 4 responses to King's post. Like Shippable back to China? Shippable to New Hampshire?
Stuff like that.

[Stadler]

I consider myself a Rush nut but I see Tai Shan as shippable.

I love you, man.  I really do.

I think I started and stopped like 3 or 4 responses to King's post. Like Shippable back to China? Shippable to New Hampshire?
Stuff like that.

Maybe I'm just used to it, but it oddly makes a sort of sense.   

[HOF]

What is it about Tai Shan that is so bad?  It's not the worst lyric on the album.  It's not the worst music on the album (though it might be the most sparse in terms of guitar), it's not the worst melody...  I just don't get it.   


I love that line:  "I stood at the top of the mountain... and China sang to me."   When I toured Austria I had a very similar feeling.



By the way, I hated Cannibal Surf Babe for the longest time, then I sort of got it and now it's one of my favorites from that album (which is also a favorite).

I think a big part of it is the soft, shimmery keyboards and Asian instrument samples. It’s hard to call a melody good or bad but something about the way Geddy sings it just sounds awkward. I probably don’t hate it as much as I did when I first heard it though. There’s a line that a lot of HYF straddles between earnestness and schmaltz, and this one and Second Nature (not sure why I said Open Secrets before. I like that one a lot) just seem to cross too far over onto the schmaltz side (I’d also put Lock and Key on that side of the line as well).

See, I LOVE Second Nature.  That melody:  "It ought to be second nature... at lesat that's what I feel..." is probably one of my favorite moments on the entire record.  I LOVE that melody.   There IS schmaltz to that record, and I think I wrote this above: it's a record of ballads if you ask me (and in keeping with the idea of titles as themes, I think it fits:  "Hold Your Fire", meaning make love not war, so to speak).   For all the keyboard shimmer of that record, if you asked me "what ONE Rush record would you like to hear done unplugged", it would be Hold Your Fire.   "Mission" as an acoustic ballad?  Yes please!!!!

That would be interesting. Have you heard Jacob Moon’s (mostly) acoustic rendition of Time Stand Still?

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=ED3O1WXOJhw

[Mladen]

Hems, PEW, MP, Signals

Four great albums. How can I not choose this one?

[Zydar]

I almost chose that one, but I prefer AFTK a tad more than Signals.

[Dream Team]

H - S

[Stadler]

What is it about Tai Shan that is so bad?  It's not the worst lyric on the album.  It's not the worst music on the album (though it might be the most sparse in terms of guitar), it's not the worst melody...  I just don't get it.   


I love that line:  "I stood at the top of the mountain... and China sang to me."   When I toured Austria I had a very similar feeling.



By the way, I hated Cannibal Surf Babe for the longest time, then I sort of got it and now it's one of my favorites from that album (which is also a favorite).

I think a big part of it is the soft, shimmery keyboards and Asian instrument samples. It’s hard to call a melody good or bad but something about the way Geddy sings it just sounds awkward. I probably don’t hate it as much as I did when I first heard it though. There’s a line that a lot of HYF straddles between earnestness and schmaltz, and this one and Second Nature (not sure why I said Open Secrets before. I like that one a lot) just seem to cross too far over onto the schmaltz side (I’d also put Lock and Key on that side of the line as well).

See, I LOVE Second Nature.  That melody:  "It ought to be second nature... at lesat that's what I feel..." is probably one of my favorite moments on the entire record.  I LOVE that melody.   There IS schmaltz to that record, and I think I wrote this above: it's a record of ballads if you ask me (and in keeping with the idea of titles as themes, I think it fits:  "Hold Your Fire", meaning make love not war, so to speak).   For all the keyboard shimmer of that record, if you asked me "what ONE Rush record would you like to hear done unplugged", it would be Hold Your Fire.   "Mission" as an acoustic ballad?  Yes please!!!!

That would be interesting. Have you heard Jacob Moon’s (mostly) acoustic rendition of Time Stand Still?

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=ED3O1WXOJhw

YES!!!   THAT'S EXACTLY WHAT I'M TALKING ABOUT.  How wistful and melancholy is that lyric, set to that acoustic background?  I don't love everything Moon does with Rush, and I'd love to hear Alex do that, but that's exactly what I was thinking of when I said it.

If I ever get to meet them (Alex or Geddy) I would consider if there was a way to tastefully and respectfully suggest that to them.  Maybe as a tribute of sorts to the lyrics of Neil Peart;  there's no record in their catalogue IMO where the lyrics are so tonally different than the music.  Lyrically that album is, to me, so soft and warm and open and honest, yet the music is probably the most... electronic, forward-looking and futuristic of their work.

[HOF]

What is it about Tai Shan that is so bad?  It's not the worst lyric on the album.  It's not the worst music on the album (though it might be the most sparse in terms of guitar), it's not the worst melody...  I just don't get it.   


I love that line:  "I stood at the top of the mountain... and China sang to me."   When I toured Austria I had a very similar feeling.



By the way, I hated Cannibal Surf Babe for the longest time, then I sort of got it and now it's one of my favorites from that album (which is also a favorite).

I think a big part of it is the soft, shimmery keyboards and Asian instrument samples. It’s hard to call a melody good or bad but something about the way Geddy sings it just sounds awkward. I probably don’t hate it as much as I did when I first heard it though. There’s a line that a lot of HYF straddles between earnestness and schmaltz, and this one and Second Nature (not sure why I said Open Secrets before. I like that one a lot) just seem to cross too far over onto the schmaltz side (I’d also put Lock and Key on that side of the line as well).

See, I LOVE Second Nature.  That melody:  "It ought to be second nature... at lesat that's what I feel..." is probably one of my favorite moments on the entire record.  I LOVE that melody.   There IS schmaltz to that record, and I think I wrote this above: it's a record of ballads if you ask me (and in keeping with the idea of titles as themes, I think it fits:  "Hold Your Fire", meaning make love not war, so to speak).   For all the keyboard shimmer of that record, if you asked me "what ONE Rush record would you like to hear done unplugged", it would be Hold Your Fire.   "Mission" as an acoustic ballad?  Yes please!!!!

That would be interesting. Have you heard Jacob Moon’s (mostly) acoustic rendition of Time Stand Still?

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=ED3O1WXOJhw

YES!!!   THAT'S EXACTLY WHAT I'M TALKING ABOUT.  How wistful and melancholy is that lyric, set to that acoustic background?  I don't love everything Moon does with Rush, and I'd love to hear Alex do that, but that's exactly what I was thinking of when I said it.

If I ever get to meet them (Alex or Geddy) I would consider if there was a way to tastefully and respectfully suggest that to them.  Maybe as a tribute of sorts to the lyrics of Neil Peart;  there's no record in their catalogue IMO where the lyrics are so tonally different than the music.  Lyrically that album is, to me, so soft and warm and open and honest, yet the music is probably the most... electronic, forward-looking and futuristic of their work.

If they were to ever do more Rush stuff together (like if they toured another project or something), it would be very cool if they did acoustic arrangements with just the two of them. I agree that acoustic versions for HYF songs would put a new spin on an album of songs that were maybe a bit over-produced and coldly electronic.

[ytserush]

What is it about Tai Shan that is so bad?  It's not the worst lyric on the album.  It's not the worst music on the album (though it might be the most sparse in terms of guitar), it's not the worst melody...  I just don't get it.   


I love that line:  "I stood at the top of the mountain... and China sang to me."   When I toured Austria I had a very similar feeling.



By the way, I hated Cannibal Surf Babe for the longest time, then I sort of got it and now it's one of my favorites from that album (which is also a favorite).

At this point, the hating on Tai Shan seems to have taken on a mythical status since Geddy and Alex half-seriously said that they should not have recorded it. It's almost like a sanctioned hate at this point.

I still hate Cannibal Surf Babe. Though I have to admit the live version on the Afraid  of Sunlight Deluxe version is almost good.

[DTA]

What is it about Tai Shan that is so bad?  It's not the worst lyric on the album.  It's not the worst music on the album (though it might be the most sparse in terms of guitar), it's not the worst melody...  I just don't get it.   


I love that line:  "I stood at the top of the mountain... and China sang to me."   When I toured Austria I had a very similar feeling.



By the way, I hated Cannibal Surf Babe for the longest time, then I sort of got it and now it's one of my favorites from that album (which is also a favorite).

At this point, the hating on Tai Shan seems to have taken on a mythical status since Geddy and Alex half-seriously said that they should not have recorded it. It's almost like a sanctioned hate at this point.

I still hate Cannibal Surf Babe. Though I have to admit the live version on the Afraid  of Sunlight Deluxe version is almost good.

Tai Shan is the You Not Me of Rush. If MP had never said anything about the background of YNM, it'd probably have a lot better reputation than it does (because it's an awesome song with a great riff and catchy vocal melodies).

[TAC]

Tai Shan is the You Not Me of Rush. If MP had never said anything about the background of YNM, it'd probably have a lot better reputation than it does (because it's an awesome song with a great riff and catchy vocal melodies).

I don't know, man. We do have ears. You Not Me blew the first time I heard FII. Whatever MP said or didn't say about YNM cannot save the fact that it's a fucking dreadful and embarrassing song in the Dream Theater catalog.

Same with Tai Shan. I don't even know what Geddy said about it,. but I know it sucks.

[Setlist Scotty]

Gotta go with TAC on this one.

[HOF]

Yeah, I’ve never seen/read the Geddy Lee comments about Tai Shan.

[pg1067]

Tai Shan is the You Not Me of Rush. If MP had never said anything about the background of YNM, it'd probably have a lot better reputation than it does (because it's an awesome song with a great riff and catchy vocal melodies).

I don't know, man. We do have ears. You Not Me blew the first time I heard FII. Whatever MP said or didn't say about YNM cannot save the fact that it's a fucking dreadful and embarrassing song in the Dream Theater catalog.

Same with Tai Shan. I don't even know what Geddy said about it,. but I know it sucks.

I disliked Tai Shan the moment I first heard it in 1987.  It and High Water were the culmination of a third straight dud by my favorite band.  That said, I don't view it as vastly worse than most of the rest of the album.

As for You Not Me, when I first heard FII, New Millennium was a jumbled mess, YNM was better, but it was a bit of "WTF is this?!"  After a lot of my favorite bands disappointed me in the early/mid-90s, FII was just another stab in my musical heart.  However, as with Tai Shan, I didn't think YNM was any worse than most of the rest of the album, and I now regard it as one of only five songs on the album worth my time.  I also liked YNM a LOT better one I heard You or Me.

All that said, both Geddy's and MP's comments about these songs made it "fashionable" to hate on these songs in a more vocal manner, and I'd be willing to bet there are casual fans who never gave them much of a chance because of the comments.

[Elite]

You Not Me is easily top half of FII in my book

[fadetoblackdude7]

Ged was minimal with his Tai Shan comment (probably out of respect) but I remember him simply saying that the song was an ‘error’. IIRC he said something similar about Neurotica.

[Stadler]

Tai Shan is the You Not Me of Rush. If MP had never said anything about the background of YNM, it'd probably have a lot better reputation than it does (because it's an awesome song with a great riff and catchy vocal melodies).

I don't know, man. We do have ears. You Not Me blew the first time I heard FII. Whatever MP said or didn't say about YNM cannot save the fact that it's a fucking dreadful and embarrassing song in the Dream Theater catalog.

Same with Tai Shan. I don't even know what Geddy said about it,. but I know it sucks.

I disliked Tai Shan the moment I first heard it in 1987.  It and High Water were the culmination of a third straight dud by my favorite band.  That said, I don't view it as vastly worse than most of the rest of the album.

As for You Not Me, when I first heard FII, New Millennium was a jumbled mess, YNM was better, but it was a bit of "WTF is this?!"  After a lot of my favorite bands disappointed me in the early/mid-90s, FII was just another stab in my musical heart.  However, as with Tai Shan, I didn't think YNM was any worse than most of the rest of the album, and I now regard it as one of only five songs on the album worth my time.  I also liked YNM a LOT better one I heard You or Me.

All that said, both Geddy's and MP's comments about these songs made it "fashionable" to hate on these songs in a more vocal manner, and I'd be willing to bet there are casual fans who never gave them much of a chance because of the comments.

The important point is "no worse than the rest of the album".  I'm sure anything is possible, but I find it hard to believe that one would think "Hold Your Fire" to be a top tier Rush album "but for" Tai Shan.  It's certainly not an outlier on that album.

And YNM is different for me; I wasn't thrown by "Desmond Child" being on there, being a fan of several bands he's worked with in the past (Kiss for example).  But wasn't a song that grabbed me. That and Lines In The Sand were tough sells from day one (and still are to a degree).  The Director's Cut simply reinforced that.   I hear a difference between YNM and the rest of that album that I don't hear with Tai Shan.

[HOF]

I think the first time I heard FII, You Not Me actually stood out as sounding more like previous DT than some of the other tracks. It’s actually one that I grew to like less with time.

[hefdaddy42]

If MP had never said anything about the background of YNM, it'd probably have a lot better reputation than it does (because it's an awesome song with a great riff and catchy vocal melodies).

YNM is awful.