Author Topic: College Fraternities  (Read 325 times)

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Offline TAC

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College Fraternities
« on: April 07, 2021, 03:30:10 PM »
Seems every year there are more and more stories like this:

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/crime/college-sophomores-hazing-death-ruled-an-accident-from-fatal-ethanol-intoxication/ar-BB1fpcEm?li=BBnbfcL

I feel like I've read about a half dozen in the last 6 months.

With a son going to college next year, these stories literally make me sick. Such a needless tragedy. I have already told him that should he decide to pledge a fraternity, he will be footing his own tuition bill.

I went to college and saw the whole Greek thing. I didn't pledge, but had two roommates that did, and they both stole from me while doing so. However I was not privy to every gory detail that went into it. A big secret I guess.



Yeah yeah, I know fraternities and sororities all take part in fundraising and community projects, but that doesn't mean anything to me if you are endangering your incoming members' lives.

I feel like colleges turn a blind eye to this. I don't think they really give a shit honestly. I don't know of Greek chapters buy their way in or not. It feels like they do, because no college is scrutinizing any pledging it seems.


What say you?

Do any of you have experiences? Near death hazing rituals?  Was it worth it to wear the colors?
would have thought the same thing but seeing the OP was TAC i immediately thought Maiden or DT related
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Offline KevShmev

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Re: College Fraternities
« Reply #1 on: April 07, 2021, 04:02:18 PM »
People who were in them swear by them, like making friends for life and blah, blah, blah, but they seem more like a cult to me.  The whole idea of hazing, while hilarious when you watch films like Old School and Animal House, has too much room for disaster, especially nowadays where the average drunk college idiot probably wants it to be as over the top as possible so they can record it on their phone and show it to their social media friends. 

Offline Grappler

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Re: College Fraternities
« Reply #2 on: April 07, 2021, 04:25:03 PM »
I never joined one and hated the Greek system.  People who were a part of it often looked down on those who weren't.  I didn't like the idea of having to be friendly or respect people just because they are frat brothers.  I didn't want to have friendships forced on me.

That being said, I did meet a group of guys in my dorm and we lived together in a huge house off campus that we rented.  They became my best friends and I have so many great memories with them.  You don't have to pledge just to make friends.

Offline Adami

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Re: College Fraternities
« Reply #3 on: April 07, 2021, 04:30:57 PM »
I work in a university and I cannot stand frats.

That said, there are academic and other types of frats but overall I wouldn’t mind eliminating the whole system of them.
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Offline cramx3

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Re: College Fraternities
« Reply #4 on: April 07, 2021, 04:49:04 PM »
Went to Penn State, a big frat school.  You can easily find plenty of examples of people dying from hazing or excessive drinking and hiding it leaving the person to die to try to avoid getting in trouble.  I don't think the University likes it or tolerates it at all.  It's a bit more complicated, but the greek system is slowly dying there because of all the issues and the following hammer downs from the university. I kind of expect the greek system to not even exist in the future.

Now my own experience and opinion... the frat parties were a lot of fun as a freshman.  Free parties with free booze, live bands, tons of people, just an a huge party environment in these huge mansions.  A few friends rushed a frat in my dorm so I got to go to some of their rush events like stripper night, jello wrestling... which were some of my favorite moments from college.  But I could never actually be in a frat.  The idea that you have to be torchered for a full semester and then literally pay dues just to have friendships seemed to be not genuine to me.  2/3 of the friends who rushed frats freshman year didn't return to Penn State for sophomore year due to not keeping grades.  The other person ended up being a total loser IMO and our friends all cut ties with him during sophomore year.  We didn't return to the frat parties either after freshman year.  It wasn't so fun once you realized how shitty the people are once they don't really want you to join their club.

I have no issue of the greek system dying.

That said, there are academic and other types of frats but overall I wouldn’t mind eliminating the whole system of them.

Yeah, there's definitely those that while are frats don't really fall under the type of frats that TAC is referring too.  I've got no issues with the academic frats.  I don't recall those being the ones with houses at PSU but more like clubs.

Offline Anguyen92

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Re: College Fraternities
« Reply #5 on: April 07, 2021, 05:32:06 PM »
Man, I don't think Cal Poly Pomona had any fraternities.  Then again, they were the kind of college where you get in, take your courses, and go home.  Not really a place where stuff like Fraternities can really have a huge impact on the college life at Cal Poly Pomona.

I do recall when I got back into Cal Poly Pomona in 2014 and wanted to join the accounting club that there were two clubs.  One called CPSA where you go the weekly meeting, eat a slice of pizza, and watch a professional do a presentation about their day-to-day routine (one of them worked for the FBI or did something in forensic accounting).  Note, because of my horrible attention span, I used that as a excuse to take a nap if the presentation didn't have anything worthwhile to keep me awake.  They had some pretty cool looking shirts that I wore for a good while after I graduated.  The other accounting club was an academic frat called Beta Alpha Psi.  That one had a more rigorous requirements to be a certified member there (grades, attendance to the weekly meetings, doing community stuff, etc.).  I don't think that club had a toxic environment and I worked with a few members for some group projects that I had classes with and they were cool people to be around.

Offline El Barto

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Re: College Fraternities
« Reply #6 on: April 07, 2021, 06:13:47 PM »
I can't help but think that maybe on a forum of people who were all, at least at some point, Dream Theater fans is probably not the most likely place to get first hand knowledge about fraternities. 
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Offline Vmadera00

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Re: College Fraternities
« Reply #7 on: April 07, 2021, 06:15:02 PM »
I can't help but think that maybe on a forum of people who were all, at least at some point, Dream Theater fans is probably not the most likely place to get first hand knowledge about fraternities.

 :rollin

Offline TAC

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Re: College Fraternities
« Reply #8 on: April 07, 2021, 06:38:22 PM »
I can't help but think that maybe on a forum of people who were all, at least at some point, Dream Theater fans is probably not the most likely place to get first hand knowledge about fraternities.

Hah!

Yeah, I was just throwing it out there. Those news stories really get me going.
would have thought the same thing but seeing the OP was TAC i immediately thought Maiden or DT related
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Offline KevShmev

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Re: College Fraternities
« Reply #9 on: April 07, 2021, 07:11:07 PM »
I can't help but think that maybe on a forum of people who were all, at least at some point, Dream Theater fans is probably not the most likely place to get first hand knowledge about fraternities.

 :lol :lol

Offline Ben_Jamin

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Re: College Fraternities
« Reply #10 on: April 07, 2021, 07:30:20 PM »
https://youtu.be/1_4G449s1SQ

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Offline Cool Chris

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Re: College Fraternities
« Reply #11 on: April 07, 2021, 09:12:49 PM »
tl;dr but my college experience was horrible. It's been 25 years and I still don't like to think about it, to the point where I almost ignored this thread entirely. So... that being said, I was in a fraternity in college. I transferred to UW after two years at another school, and only joined because my roommate was joining as well. My experience was a bit different, as I pledged as a jaded 20 year old junior instead of a wide-eyed freshman, and I didn't live there. We had an apartment literally 2 buildings over. The fraternity was never an important aspect of my life like it is/was for many. It is hard to comment on it objectively. I think there are positive aspects to the Greek culture and community, but I also think the college system should be blown up and reduced down to:

Man, I don't think Cal Poly Pomona had any fraternities.  Then again, they were the kind of college where you get in, take your courses, and go home.

There was no 'hazing' as I would define it. As pledges we were wacked once, Chip Diller style, and were forced to jump in to a pool in December (in WA, remember). Hazing by definition maybe, but more of a mole hill than a mountain. There were plenty of drunken parties, which I frown upon now as alcohol has had terrible effects on my life and shouldn't be treated in the manner as it usually is at these parties. Yet I met the second most wonderful and important woman* in my life at a frat party. I also did more destructive drinking and philandering at clubs than I ever did at the frat house. So, who knows? 

*This woman felt her sorority was an integral part of her college experience and growth and development on the whole. She was very active there, and was VP at some point. She felt it provided her with friendships and sisterhood that she never had up till then. For that, I am happy her sorority existed for her.
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Offline jingle.boy

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Re: College Fraternities
« Reply #12 on: April 08, 2021, 05:20:10 AM »
Thankfully, fraternities aren't really a thing up here - or at least, they weren't when I was in Uni.  Only the losers went into the (only) frat in my university... like, you had to join a club to make friends?!?!?  IMO, a fraternity offered nothing that people couldn't collectively do/plan on their own.

:dunno:
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Online Chino

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Re: College Fraternities
« Reply #13 on: April 08, 2021, 05:53:33 AM »
Based on my experience, I think fraternities are pretty dumb. Most of the people I couldn't stand in college were all hardcore into the frat life. Maybe it's not the case everywhere, but at my school most of the frats just seemed like a club you paid a couple hundred bucks a month to for friendship and kegs. I'm sure they vary by school and region, but most of the ones I was around were really just a bunch of dudes trying to get laid as a collective unit. They'd do a toy drive or something like once a month to keep up their rep with the community, and even those were drunken fiascos. I feel like I'm not one to talk though seeing as I was banned from my university and nearly died without ever even entertaining the thought of joining a frat.

I will say though. I could name you a half dozen people right now who are on pretty good career trajectories because of frat connections they had and have maintained since graduating. 

Offline hefdaddy42

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Re: College Fraternities
« Reply #14 on: April 08, 2021, 06:33:51 AM »
I was a GDI, but a close friend went through with pledging and joining a frat, so I was around it.

I'm content with my GDI status.
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Offline TAC

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Re: College Fraternities
« Reply #15 on: April 08, 2021, 06:41:29 AM »
Based on my experience, I think fraternities are pretty dumb. Most of the people I couldn't stand in college were all hardcore into the frat life. Maybe it's not the case everywhere, but at my school most of the frats just seemed like a club you paid a couple hundred bucks a month to for friendship and kegs. I'm sure they vary by school and region, but most of the ones I was around were really just a bunch of dudes trying to get laid as a collective unit. They'd do a toy drive or something like once a month to keep up their rep with the community, and even those were drunken fiascos. I feel like I'm not one to talk though seeing as I was banned from my university and nearly died without ever even entertaining the thought of joining a frat.

I will say though. I could name you a half dozen people right now who are on pretty good career trajectories because of frat connections they had and have maintained since graduating. 
tl;dr but my college experience was horrible. It's been 25 years and I still don't like to think about it, to the point where I almost ignored this thread entirely. So... that being said, I was in a fraternity in college. I transferred to UW after two years at another school, and only joined because my roommate was joining as well. My experience was a bit different, as I pledged as a jaded 20 year old junior instead of a wide-eyed freshman, and I didn't live there. We had an apartment literally 2 buildings over. The fraternity was never an important aspect of my life like it is/was for many. It is hard to comment on it objectively. I think there are positive aspects to the Greek culture and community, but I also think the college system should be blown up and reduced down to:

Man, I don't think Cal Poly Pomona had any fraternities.  Then again, they were the kind of college where you get in, take your courses, and go home.

There was no 'hazing' as I would define it. As pledges we were wacked once, Chip Diller style, and were forced to jump in to a pool in December (in WA, remember). Hazing by definition maybe, but more of a mole hill than a mountain. There were plenty of drunken parties, which I frown upon now as alcohol has had terrible effects on my life and shouldn't be treated in the manner as it usually is at these parties. Yet I met the second most wonderful and important woman* in my life at a frat party. I also did more destructive drinking and philandering at clubs than I ever did at the frat house. So, who knows? 

*This woman felt her sorority was an integral part of her college experience and growth and development on the whole. She was very active there, and was VP at some point. She felt it provided her with friendships and sisterhood that she never had up till then. For that, I am happy her sorority existed for her.

Thanks guys. I don't know what I was really looking for in starting this thread, but I felt like I needed to relieve some stress after reading about another student dying at college.

I enjoy reading everyone's thoughts and experiences.
would have thought the same thing but seeing the OP was TAC i immediately thought Maiden or DT related
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Offline Stadler

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Re: College Fraternities
« Reply #16 on: April 08, 2021, 07:34:59 AM »
I was a GDI, but a close friend went through with pledging and joining a frat, so I was around it.

I'm content with my GDI status.

It's in remission?  Do you still have to take penicillin? 

Offline hefdaddy42

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Re: College Fraternities
« Reply #17 on: April 08, 2021, 07:36:19 AM »
I was a GDI, but a close friend went through with pledging and joining a frat, so I was around it.

I'm content with my GDI status.

It's in remission?  Do you still have to take penicillin?
I do.  I partied pretty hard back in those days.
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Offline Stadler

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Re: College Fraternities
« Reply #18 on: April 08, 2021, 07:53:48 AM »
Wow, so this shit just seems to fall into my lap.   WTF.

Not a member of a frat.  Roommate in college was, roommate after college was (different frat) and two of my closest friends in the world are (same as the after college roommate; we all went to school together).  My daughter is now a member of a sorority.  I don't know if you'd call it a 'frat' per se, but ex-wife's new husband was in a secret society in college.

There are two sides to the coin.   

People are joiners. We want to be part of something bigger than we are.  You don't need to subscribe to too many newspapers to see that on a daily basis.   Sometimes those "bigger" things need sustenance, so if you want to call it "paying for friends" I think there are enough other people that can frame it differently - and more positively - than that.

I didn't pledge; I don't know what my friends did to get in, but I have to be honest, it couldn't have been a lot worse than what some of the rest of us did just as a "normal" part of college life.   I don't know if college was the "best" time of my life, but it is the time I grew the most as a human being.  It was the first time I was out of my little cocoon, meeting people who didn't know - implicitly or not - my background or where I came from.   It was the first time I really had to bear the full consequences of my life and my decisions and my actions.  At a large state school in the 80's, NO ONE was holding my hand.  No one gave a SHIT whether I succeeded or failed.   Eventually I manned up; it took a while and not without a fair amount of hard discussions (with myself) either in a church pew or in a men's room stall.   If having the feeling of an organization behind you that has your back is how you get through that, who are we to judge?   

When my daughter started in on the "sorority" thing, I had the same reaction as TAC.   NFW, this ain't happnin', and you're on your own.  Parents here have to make their own decisions, of course, but in my case, I had to reckon that it was happening with, or without, my support or help.  And so I decided to buy in and trust her.   In hindsight, it has been a good thing, over all.  She was able to get into alternate housing, and had access to a separate, cheaper, but higher quality meal plan (something like 60% of students on her campus are in a frat/sorority of some kind, if memory serves).   She has learned that life isn't all classes, doing your nails, and watching One Direction videos.  She has obligations that aren't her first choice, and aren't on her schedule (kind of like life).  While she's made new friends, her core friends are those she new BEFORE joining the sorority, and that friendship has only gotten stronger for the shared experience.   (Bear in mind that a lot of this is just me piecing together; the hardest lesson - BY FAR - that I've had to learn as a parent is that these creatures that you've birthed, clothed, fed and ass-wiped eventually have a life of their own and it's HARD after a certain point to know all of what goes on and why.)

And of course, I'm selfish; for some reason, her school has a decent number of famous* actresses that are alums; while none are in her sorority, I'm still holding out that I would at some point get to meet one of my celebrity crushes through my kid's social network.  :)   (An actress I write about a fair amount here went to her school.)

Offline kirksnosehair

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Re: College Fraternities
« Reply #19 on: April 09, 2021, 01:51:04 PM »
I never went to college.  But both of my brothers AND two of my nephews all went to ivy league schools.  None of them joined a frat.  Both of my brothers considered it and my youngest brother actually agreed to pledge but when he found out what the hazing was going to entail he changed his mind.  It seems that one of the kids who pledged the year before my bother started at this school was -during hazing in his freshman year- forced to drink 7-times the legal limit of alcohol and ended up dying on the living-room floor of the frat house.  Here's this poor kid laying on the floor, completely unresponsive, while partygoers thought it would be a good idea to paint his face black and red with sharpies, except they never tried to render assistance and he ended up dying right there on the living room floor of the frat house.  The school ended up closing down all of the "on campus" frat houses and not too long after that they also ended all ties to the "off campus" frat houses.  Nobody was charged with anything but the parents are suing the school for wrongful death and word around the federal courthouse is the college is going to settle for an "undisclosed amount" while making no public admissions of responsibility. 


I only know about the case because Mrs. NoseHair's law firm is handling it and she works for the primary attorney on the case so she's typed out all the briefs and filings.  If it weren't for the pandemic I wouldn't know anything about it because she'd be working at the office, not at home, but I overhear all the telephone conversations so I know most of the details of the case.  It was in the national news a few years ago when the kid died. I can't go into detail about it or name the school for obvious reasons as the case has not yet officially settled but it's on the cusp of settlement for a pretty huge amount of money.


I'm not against Frats, necessarily, but I think there need to be some rules or something maybe some kind of supervision, that will curtail this kind of recklessness at these Frats.  Can you imagine sending your kid off to college only to get a visit a few weeks later by a couple of staff from the school notifying you that your kid has died in a hazing gone wrong?  Pretty sure I'd completely lose my shit.

Offline cramx3

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Re: College Fraternities
« Reply #20 on: April 09, 2021, 01:58:42 PM »
The story at PSU was very similar to that.  Due to previous issues similar, the school forced the frats to have security cameras in the houses common areas and because of that, and even though the frat tried to destroy the cameras, they were still able to recover the video of the hazing of the dead student from alcohol poisoning and it's disgusting what those people did and then tried to cover up.

Offline Herrick

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Re: College Fraternities
« Reply #21 on: April 09, 2021, 02:37:55 PM »
How exactly do they go about forcing these kids to drink themselves to death?
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Offline kirksnosehair

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Re: College Fraternities
« Reply #22 on: April 09, 2021, 02:41:10 PM »
peer pressure, intimidation, ridicule.


I think the operative word in all of this is: KIDS








Offline El Barto

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Re: College Fraternities
« Reply #23 on: April 09, 2021, 02:57:04 PM »
How exactly do they go about forcing these kids to drink themselves to death?
If you're asking how they're responsible, it's what Kirk said. Kids are herd animals.

If you're asking about the mechanics of it, alcohol comes on gradually enough that you can get out ahead of yourself. It's generally not the beer you're drinking that will push you over the edge, but the one you drank before. All you're doing right now is picking up steam for the inevitable catastrophe.
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Offline kirksnosehair

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Re: College Fraternities
« Reply #24 on: April 09, 2021, 03:04:02 PM »
The thing with alcohol poisoning too is there's no antidote like there is for, say, opioid overdose.  I can inject a fucking pound of heroin and a quick dose or two of Narcan can bring me back from the edge of death.


There is no equivalent for alcohol.  Once you "get out ahead of yourself" as Barto pointed out, you're in deep shit.  Charcoal and stomach pumping can only remove what has NOT been digested and moved into the bloodstream.   Most people who drink a lethal amount of alcohol (anywhere from .31 to .45 BAC depending on gender and body mass) it's very difficult to prevent it from ending your life.

Offline cramx3

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Re: College Fraternities
« Reply #25 on: April 09, 2021, 03:18:54 PM »
How exactly do they go about forcing these kids to drink themselves to death?

It's not exactly force, but peer pressure and part of rushing a frat.  In the PSU scenario, the pledges need to complete "the gauntlet".

Quote
Penn State student Timothy Piazza was injured falling down stairs after taking part in "The Gauntlet," which was part of the initiation process at Beta Theta Pi fraternity.

"The Gauntlet" was a series of drinking stations where pledges had to consume various kinds of alcohol very quickly.

First, the pledges were told to collectively finish a bottle of vodka.

Once that was complete, the pledges were lined up outside the fraternity house. Each pledge entered the house, then did a shot of vodka, then ran down a hallway to shotgun a beer. One fraternity brother explained "shotgunning" a beer involves poking a hole in the side to drink from, and opening the top of the beer to make it easier to drink fast.

From there, the pledges had to drink from a wine bag while fraternity brothers poured beer on them.

At the last station, pledges were told to make a shot in beer pong -- a traditional drinking game involving cups of beer and ping pong balls. If they missed, they had to chug a beer.

A fraternity brother told police each pledge performed "The Gauntlet" in about two minutes.

https://www.pennlive.com/news/2017/05/they_call_it_the_gauntlet_what.html

I love to play drinking games and have fun, but nothing in the above sounds fun, yet these "kids" and I do mean kids as these are freshman so about 18 years old, are almost forced to do this.  Otherwise they are not getting initiated into the frat.

Offline Cool Chris

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Re: College Fraternities
« Reply #26 on: April 09, 2021, 03:31:20 PM »
Jesus, Keith Moon thinks those people need to ease up on the alcohol consumption.

There was plenty of drinking at my fraternity and plenty of "encouragement" to do so, but there was nothing like that. Honestly all the drinking related activities I can recall we're good natured. If you didn't drink enough or fast enough you were just called the pu**y and then everyone moved on.
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Offline El Barto

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Re: College Fraternities
« Reply #27 on: April 09, 2021, 03:41:37 PM »
Jesus, Keith Moon thinks those people need to ease up on the alcohol consumption.

There was plenty of drinking at my fraternity and plenty of "encouragement" to do so, but there was nothing like that. Honestly all the drinking related activities I can recall we're good natured. If you didn't drink enough or fast enough you were just called the pu**y and then everyone moved on.
I honestly didn't think it sounded all that bad, but it depends on how many pledges there are to finish the bottle up front. If there are 10 pledges that's only 6oz, and most people can drink that without much trouble. If there are only three then, yeah, they're probably in deep shit. If the same rule applies to drinking the bag of wine, it shouldn't be that terrible unless they're tragically inept at beer pong.

As a member of ten, I'm pretty sure I could handle 5 shots of vodka, a beer, ~1/3 bottle of wine, and then a few cups of beers without being too worse for ware. I'd be fucked up, and I'd regret it in a few hours, but I'd be a long, long ways from fatally intoxicated.
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Offline Cool Chris

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Re: College Fraternities
« Reply #28 on: April 09, 2021, 04:05:12 PM »
Ha I missed the "collectively" in that part about finishing the bottle of vodka!

Also most 18-year-olds aren't going to know what their tolerance level is, how their body is going to react to any level of alcohol.
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Re: College Fraternities
« Reply #29 on: April 09, 2021, 05:22:25 PM »
Jesus, Keith Moon thinks those people need to ease up on the alcohol consumption.

There was plenty of drinking at my fraternity and plenty of "encouragement" to do so, but there was nothing like that. Honestly all the drinking related activities I can recall we're good natured. If you didn't drink enough or fast enough you were just called the pu**y and then everyone moved on.
I honestly didn't think it sounded all that bad, but it depends on how many pledges there are to finish the bottle up front. If there are 10 pledges that's only 6oz, and most people can drink that without much trouble. If there are only three then, yeah, they're probably in deep shit. If the same rule applies to drinking the bag of wine, it shouldn't be that terrible unless they're tragically inept at beer pong.

As a member of ten, I'm pretty sure I could handle 5 shots of vodka, a beer, ~1/3 bottle of wine, and then a few cups of beers without being too worse for ware. I'd be fucked up, and I'd regret it in a few hours, but I'd be a long, long ways from fatally intoxicated.

I wasn't sure about how many pledges either, but they said they do it in 2 minutes.  That's a lot of alcohol for an 18 year old in a short time... plus if you miss those beer pong shots.... and it's not like that's all they are drinking either.

I think I could do that these days, my tolerance is high enough, but I'm not sure what state I'd be in if my 1st semester freshman year self would be in.

Offline El Barto

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Re: College Fraternities
« Reply #30 on: April 09, 2021, 05:36:05 PM »
Jesus, Keith Moon thinks those people need to ease up on the alcohol consumption.

There was plenty of drinking at my fraternity and plenty of "encouragement" to do so, but there was nothing like that. Honestly all the drinking related activities I can recall we're good natured. If you didn't drink enough or fast enough you were just called the pu**y and then everyone moved on.
I honestly didn't think it sounded all that bad, but it depends on how many pledges there are to finish the bottle up front. If there are 10 pledges that's only 6oz, and most people can drink that without much trouble. If there are only three then, yeah, they're probably in deep shit. If the same rule applies to drinking the bag of wine, it shouldn't be that terrible unless they're tragically inept at beer pong.

As a member of ten, I'm pretty sure I could handle 5 shots of vodka, a beer, ~1/3 bottle of wine, and then a few cups of beers without being too worse for ware. I'd be fucked up, and I'd regret it in a few hours, but I'd be a long, long ways from fatally intoxicated.

I wasn't sure about how many pledges either, but they said they do it in 2 minutes.  That's a lot of alcohol for an 18 year old in a short time... plus if you miss those beer pong shots.... and it's not like that's all they are drinking either.

I think I could do that these days, my tolerance is high enough, but I'm not sure what state I'd be in if my 1st semester freshman year self would be in.
Strangely, I probably would have had a rough time with it at 18. Fifteen would have been no problem at all. Such are the circumstances of life.  :lol
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Re: College Fraternities
« Reply #31 on: April 09, 2021, 05:38:54 PM »
True, I also specifically mentioned 1st semester freshman year, by sophomore year I was able to hold my own.  I didnt drink at all before college so I was pretty lit up after just a few lite beers those first few weeks of college. I guess, by the time you are pledging it's alraedy half way through the semester so my tolerance was probably already decent by then, however, I think it's definitely more than just completing the guantlet.  That probably started the night and then it only kept going after is my guess.

Offline Herrick

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Re: College Fraternities
« Reply #32 on: April 09, 2021, 05:41:24 PM »
peer pressure, intimidation, ridicule.


I think the operative word in all of this is: KIDS

That's crazy that goes on in those places. Equally stupid and sad.

If you're asking how they're responsible, it's what Kirk said. Kids are herd animals.

If you're asking about the mechanics of it, alcohol comes on gradually enough that you can get out ahead of yourself. It's generally not the beer you're drinking that will push you over the edge, but the one you drank before. All you're doing right now is picking up steam for the inevitable catastrophe.

Sorry. I didn't mean to imply those people weren't responsible.

Ha I missed the "collectively" in that part about finishing the bottle of vodka!

Also most 18-year-olds aren't going to know what their tolerance level is, how their body is going to react to any level of alcohol.

Good point. I didn't think about that.
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Re: College Fraternities
« Reply #33 on: April 10, 2021, 06:54:52 AM »
6oz of vodka is the equivalent of six drinks in just a few seconds.  That is where the hazing gets people into trouble.  It's too much alcohol consumed too quickly, before their bodies absorb any of it.