Marvel Cinematic Universe thread v3 (no recent spoilers)

[Adami]

True, but it wasn't really explored within the MCU.  Most MCU viewers are not comic readers or even MCU TV viewers, but regular cinema-going types.  Their familiarity with the MCU begins and ends with what they've seen in the movies.  Some people saw the Darkhold and knew exactly what it was and what it meant, but most people saw a book, apparently of magic spells or something.  I'm just saying that it would have helped to get into that a bit more.

I watched every episode of Agents of Shield and knew about the Darkhold, or at least the version of it in the TV series, and I still thought Wanda's turn was pretty sudden and almost ridiculous.  If they didn't really have time to explore or explain that, then that's because of the tendency to cram way too much into each MCU movie.  Wanda went from one of my favorite characters (largely due to WandaVision) to "WTF is she on about?"

Indeed.

It's not about whether or not it makes some logical sense, but if it is a pay off or a surprise.

This was a surprise, not a pay off since there was almost nothing leading up to it.

[Lonk]

There was supposed to be a scene (That didn't make the final cut) in the opening moments of the movie, showing Mordor being killed by Wanda, which was supposed to show us she had been corrupted by the book.

Honestly, her drastic turn doesn't bother me, it was the weak motivation she was given by a weak plot.

[Orbert]

  Her drastic turn bothered me because of the weak motivation she was given by the weak plot.

[Adami]

That really is the crux of it that I forgot.

It's not that it makes NO sense that she could possibly be corrupted by that book. For me, at least, it's that her motivation to go evil directly contradicts her entire emotional arc in WandaVision.

[hefdaddy42]

I watched every episode of Agents of Shield and knew about the Darkhold, or at least the version of it in the TV series, and I still thought Wanda's turn was pretty sudden and almost ridiculous.  If they didn't really have time to explore or explain that, then that's because of the tendency to cram way too much into each MCU movie.  Wanda went from one of my favorite characters (largely due to WandaVision) to "WTF is she on about?"

Her turn WAS sudden and ridiculous.  Kind of like much of the rest of the film.

[MirrorMask]

Catched up on all the latest movies.

The Shang-Chi one was surprisingly cool and fresh, I really enjoyed it.

Eternals was ok I guess but it was looooooooong. Way too long.

Guardians of the Galaxy 3 was cool, but not as fresh as the first one.

The Marvels is an absolute disaster. By far and away the worst MCU movie. Every movie, if not great, was just good enough to be somehow entertaining, you turn off the brain for a couple of hours and enjoy the ride. This one had no redeeming quality and some seriously "what the hell the writers were thinking" moments. Absolutely irredimeable, Love and Thunder in comparison is The Godfather II.

[jammindude]

Catched up on all the latest movies.

The Shang-Chi one was surprisingly cool and fresh, I really enjoyed it.

Eternals was ok I guess but it was looooooooong. Way too long.

Guardians of the Galaxy 3 was cool, but not as fresh as the first one.

The Marvels is an absolute disaster. By far and away the worst MCU movie. Every movie, if not great, was just good enough to be somehow entertaining, you turn off the brain for a couple of hours and enjoy the ride. This one had no redeeming quality and some seriously "what the hell the writers were thinking" moments. Absolutely irredimeable, Love and Thunder in comparison is The Godfather II.

Wow. I’m just floored by that assessment of The Marvels.  You could flip The Marvels with Love and Thunder in your last paragraph and that would be accurate for me.

I currently hold that Love and Thunder is the only completely irredeemable “bad” Marvel movie.  The next two worst movies are The Eternals and MOM, and I consider them to be simply there. If I were watching an MCU marathon, I would not skip them. But I think I only own L&T because my collection would technically have a hole without it. That was a terrible film.  The Marvels actually brought me more than just a little bit of joy, and I was sad that such a charming and well made film got raked over the coals like it did.  It’s probably my #3 post-Endgame film.

[soupytwist]

I saw the show mentioned in another thread but makes more sense to put this opinion on here.  IMO Agents of Shield was a much better way for Marvel to run a TV show than the recent MCU shows.  AoS having the MCU movie storylines running in the background of the show, sometimes playing a bigger role was perfect (AoS reacting to the snap would have been interesting!).  The key was there wasn't too much crossover, so while they existed together - they were their own separate identities.  I'd much rather Marvel tried this again, than more 6 episode one shot shows that add way to much lore from the general MCU.

[Orbert]

I liked the idea of Agents of Shield, and mostly thought the execution was pretty good, too.  The problem was that the original concept -- a TV series with stories unfolding in sync with the MCU -- was practically doomed to failure, because it became harder and harder to coordinate the timelines.  It started off great, with the Hydra reveal pretty well synched, but it turned out much easier for the movies to get off schedule, and it turned out that while the guys running the TV show tried to communicate and coordinate with the MCU filmmakers, it wasn't reciprocated.  There was never even an acknowledgement in the MCU regarding Coulson's updated "status".  So Agents of Shield just went off and did their own thing.  But I liked most of what they did.  The Ghost Rider arc was pretty cool, as was the Framework arc.  We even got some reasonably interesting stories with the Kree, and some time-jumping that allowed them to tie in some other MCU characters.

[BlackInk]

I liked but never really loved AoS, but I remember the slow buildup to Age of Ultron and then the "it's time to bring in the Avengers" line from Coulson in the episode right before Age of Ultron premiered. That was such an amazing experience at the time.

[hefdaddy42]

I think that once the relationship between show and films was abandoned and it was clear that the show was living on borrowed time - the last 3 seasons or so - it really got fun.  A lot of the things that happened on those episodes were just batshit crazy, and it was awesome.

[Orbert]

Yeah, AoS came back from cancellation or probable cancellation more times than I would've thought possible, but it was crazy fun pretty much all the way to the end.  That might even have been intentional.  Since it apparently wasn't tied to MCU canon anymore, they just went nuts with the storylines.  The Lighthouse, Planet Kitson, Deke, Enoch... heck, there were a bunch of really interesting characters that they came up with, including more versions of Coulson than you might think.

[Lonk]

Agatha series confirmed for Sept. 18

https://twitter.com/Marvel/status/1790494367016427660?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Etweet


Daredevil is set to come out on March, 2025.

[Orbert]

So another side character from a spin-off TV series gets her own show, meanwhile we have to wait another year for freakin' Daredevil. 

[Adami]

So another side character from a spin-off TV series gets her own show, meanwhile we have to wait another year for freakin' Daredevil. 

The two don't see related.

Also, the Agatha show was likely mostly done before Disney made their change to focus on quality of quantity. So, it's unlikely you'll get much more of these types of spin offs of spin offs shows, unless there's a really good reason.

[Orbert]

Probably not related, although it wouldn't surprise me if the Echo show pushed Daredevil back, at least to rewrite some stuff.  Mostly I'm just annoyed because there are shows I'm a bit more excited about that are seemingly being delayed so things I don't care about can be developed.  I know, first world problems for sure.

[Adami]

Probably not related, although it wouldn't surprise me if the Echo show pushed Daredevil back, at least to rewrite some stuff.

Not sure. I do know that it initially shut down cause of the strikes and then when the brass started looking at what was being shot/written, they did not love it so the did a rehaul. Hopefully for the best.

[Adami]

Probably not related, although it wouldn't surprise me if the Echo show pushed Daredevil back, at least to rewrite some stuff.  Mostly I'm just annoyed because there are shows I'm a bit more excited about that are seemingly being delayed so things I don't care about can be developed.  I know, first world problems for sure.

I get that frustration. I'm just not sure how much any of its related. If Disney decided to cancel Agatha, I doubt Daredevil would come out earlier, you know?

I want things to come out when they're ready to be released. The last few years have shown us what rushing out content resulted in. I'm glad Iger is pushing against that (which I gather was the other Bob's directive in the first place) and I'm hoping the waits are worthwhile. Daredevil has a lot to live up to. I'm not expecting to be better than season 1 and 3 or even as good. I'm just hoping it's worthy of the cast and characters returning.

[ZirconBlue]

Yeah, they did a major revamp on the show during the writers strike, including putting a new showrunner in charge, so there's no way we were getting it any time soon. 

[ZirconBlue]

In other news, Variety is reporting that Natasha Lyonne has been cast in an as-yet-unnamed role in the Fantastic 4 movie.

[The Letter M]

IIRC, Daredevil: Born Again was stopped and redone to include more of the things from the Netflix series after fans responded to wanting to see characters and events from that series in the show, and after Echo, and the Disney+ Timeline canonizing the Netflix shows, it was a good move to re-do production on DDBA. I think it'll be for the best.

As for more spin-off shows of "side characters", we are still getting Iron Heart next year, which was supposed to come out late last year, I think, and then pushed to 2024, and now 2025 with the slowing-down of releases. There were up to 4 or 5 shows planned for this year and next year, but it now seems they'll all be spread out. I think we'll get 2 or 3 live action shows, and maybe 2 animated shows per year, tops, and we've already gotten X-Men '97 and Echo for 2024, leaving Agatha All Along and possibly What If? Season 3 later this year. Next year will see DDBA and Iron Heart, and probably X-Men '97's follow-up. Still no sign on Spider-Man: Freshman Year (if it's still happening), or the rumored second season of Moon Knight.

I'm definitely all for the pulling-back of quantity to help focus on quality, so hopefully this will help them put out stuff that matters, and tells good stories.

-Marc.

[ZirconBlue]

A new Vision series has been announced for 2026, with Terry Matalas as showrunner. 

[hefdaddy42]

A new Vision series has been announced for 2026, with Terry Matalas as showrunner.

That is very interesting.

[Adami]

Yea. While Picard season 3 is far and away the best season of Picard, I didn't love it on the first watch but liked it more on the second watch.

He did very poorly with plot but did a great great job with character. So if he can continue that good character work and not go too JJ on the plot elements, then it can be great.

[hefdaddy42]

Yea. While Picard season 3 is far and away the best season of Picard, I didn't love it on the first watch but liked it more on the second watch.

He did very poorly with plot but did a great great job with character. So if he can continue that good character work and not go too JJ on the plot elements, then it can be great.

Even better, I loved 12 Monkeys.