Steven Wilson solo career thread - v. The Harmony Codex in 2023!

[KevShmev]

It’s refreshing to hear a musician/public figure actually give an honest opinion rather than fashion the least offensive response possible for a given situation. So much stuff feels like a PR statement nowadays where you can’t express an honest thought without some kind of backlash.

I'm inclined to agree with this. While it was refreshing to see a seemingly healthy artist/media relationship in the prog community, pulling the whole "We're fans like you" card, sometimes it gets too close for comfort. For instance, hell will freeze over on the day The Prog Report publish a review that isn't gushing about a Morse/Portnoy release. They come across as enormous fanboys.

As much as I love the music of Neal Morse and TA, I have to admit that I chuckled when I saw that one of the Prog Report reviews of the new TA was by a guy who sorta works for Radiant Records. 

[Stadler]

Steven's always been this way, and it's never sat easy with me. In PT he was always knocking other prog bands, going so far as to call The Flower Kings and Spock's Beard "the death of music". Then the Insurgentes documentary was almost unwatchable with all his obnoxious opinions, like shooting the iPod with the rifle. When he went full retro-prog, he still went out of his way to (stupidly) insist his music was jazz. Now this.

His whole schtick around always asserting that he's "above" his audience by insisting that he's not one of them has gotten stale, and is very omega of him. I'm tired of it. I don't like this album, and I didn't like To The Bone very much either. For me personally, I think it's just time to move on.

Seems like most of the musicians we think of as very artistic always seems to be a little eccentric, quirky, and, well, arrogant.  Those attributes can make them a bit insufferable at times, but they are also why they create such great art.  Prince, one of Wilson's music heroes, was similar in that regard.  There is a self-confidence to their arty persona that can oft-putting, for sure.

Except... Steven Wilson is not Prince.  Not by a long shot.

[Samsara]

I am a fan of Porcupine Tree -- specifically, Stupid Dream, IA, Deadwing, and Anesthetize. But while I have always been interested in what Steven Wilson does as a solo artists, comments he has made over the years have made it difficult for a fan like me (who much prefers him the band setting of PT) to really give his solo work support.

He slighted Dream Theater back in the day, and this EVH thing...I know what SW was trying to say, he just didn't say it very well. He should have known it would cause a reaction.

But his comments about (really paraphrasing here) about not being as enamored with guitar, and more focused on pop music...dude may not care, but the only reason so many people started paying serious attention to him was because of Porcupine Tree -- specifically, IA and Deadwing. A heavier sound, a guitar-based sound, and boom, major label interest and push.

I credit him for following his muse. I really do, even if I am not as fond of it. But he really needs to shut his mouth.

[The Letter M]

It’s refreshing to hear a musician/public figure actually give an honest opinion rather than fashion the least offensive response possible for a given situation. So much stuff feels like a PR statement nowadays where you can’t express an honest thought without some kind of backlash.

I'm inclined to agree with this. While it was refreshing to see a seemingly healthy artist/media relationship in the prog community, pulling the whole "We're fans like you" card, sometimes it gets too close for comfort. For instance, hell will freeze over on the day The Prog Report publish a review that isn't gushing about a Morse/Portnoy release. They come across as enormous fanboys.

As much as I love the music of Neal Morse and TA, I have to admit that I chuckled when I saw that one of the Prog Report reviews of the new TA was by a guy who sorta works for Radiant Records. 

 
I noticed that! He gets kind of defensive about Radiant Records as well. I'm sure he means well, but when I brought up how the Radiant Records/Metal Blade releases of Neal's albums have a lesser quality of package than their Inside Out releases, he said something about how Radiant doesn't cheapen out on releases (but if you've seen the differences, you'd know what I'm talking about, especially with TA's Whirld Tour 2010 and KaLIVEoscope box sets).

-Marc.

[KevShmev]

Seems like most of the musicians we think of as very artistic always seems to be a little eccentric, quirky, and, well, arrogant.  Those attributes can make them a bit insufferable at times, but they are also why they create such great art.  Prince, one of Wilson's music heroes, was similar in that regard.  There is a self-confidence to their arty persona that can oft-putting, for sure.

Except... Steven Wilson is not Prince.  Not by a long shot.
[/quote]

Good thing that I didn't say that he was.

 
I noticed that! He gets kind of defensive about Radiant Records as well. I'm sure he means well, but when I brought up how the Radiant Records/Metal Blade releases of Neal's albums have a lesser quality of package than their Inside Out releases, he said something about how Radiant doesn't cheapen out on releases (but if you've seen the differences, you'd know what I'm talking about, especially with TA's Whirld Tour 2010 and KaLIVEoscope box sets).

Yeah, he is a nice guy, but he gets super defensive about Radiant on the Neal FB page (or did back when I was still on there). I heard from more than one person who said he would PM them privately and ask them to take down posts that were critical of Radiant. 

[Stadler]

Seems like most of the musicians we think of as very artistic always seems to be a little eccentric, quirky, and, well, arrogant.  Those attributes can make them a bit insufferable at times, but they are also why they create such great art.  Prince, one of Wilson's music heroes, was similar in that regard.  There is a self-confidence to their arty persona that can oft-putting, for sure.

Except... Steven Wilson is not Prince.  Not by a long shot.

Good thing that I didn't say that he was.
[/quote]

No, you didn't; I was more making the point that you can at least argue that Prince has standing to be that way.  Outside of the prog world (and even within the prog world, to some) it's "Steven who?"

[KevShmev]

  I was more making the point that you can at least argue that Prince has standing to be that way.  Outside of the prog world (and even within the prog world, to some) it's "Steven who?"

Serious question: arrogance and/or super confidence has more standing if you have mainstream success?

[King Postwhore]

Why does that matter. You make what you want. People still buy it. 

I'd rather make a living doing what I love at the moment.  Millions or not both were well off.

[Stadler]

  I was more making the point that you can at least argue that Prince has standing to be that way.  Outside of the prog world (and even within the prog world, to some) it's "Steven who?"

Serious question: arrogance and/or super confidence has more standing if you have mainstream success?

I don't know if I would say it that way.  It's not really about "mainstream success", and more about the body of work.   There's a fine line between eccentric genius and dick.  I think it goes without saying that Prince is an eccentric genius.  There are tens if not hundreds of musicians that will say "Well, if Prince suggests you do something, you kind of do it, he knows what he's talking about."   I'll leave it to you where you put Steven Wilson on that continuum.   

[Peter Mc]

  I was more making the point that you can at least argue that Prince has standing to be that way.  Outside of the prog world (and even within the prog world, to some) it's "Steven who?"

Serious question: arrogance and/or super confidence has more standing if you have mainstream success?

I don’t know about more standing but, if I’m Prince in his heyday, a super rich megastar and working my way through the world’s hottest women, there’s a good chance I would become a bit of an asshole (if I’m not one already). 

Steven Wilson has grown in popularity but kind of has that tag of “the biggest musician you’ve never heard of”.  He is now someone who has top 10 albums, appears on tv getting interviewed (not the big prime time chat shows but stuff like breakfast tv) and can play decent sized venues.  Much more so than he ever did with Porcupine Tree, who played the University circuit.  He is not a megastar though, he can go pretty much anywhere he wants unrecognised, he doesn’t have paparazzi camped outside his house, he’s not super rich or dating the hottest women in the world.  If he’s an asshole, it’s because he was always an asshole, not because fame and fortune changed him.

[Fritzinger]

It’s refreshing to hear a musician/public figure actually give an honest opinion rather than fashion the least offensive response possible for a given situation. So much stuff feels like a PR statement nowadays where you can’t express an honest thought without some kind of backlash.

I'm inclined to agree with this. While it was refreshing to see a seemingly healthy artist/media relationship in the prog community, pulling the whole "We're fans like you" card, sometimes it gets too close for comfort. For instance, hell will freeze over on the day The Prog Report publish a review that isn't gushing about a Morse/Portnoy release. They come across as enormous fanboys.

As much as I love the music of Neal Morse and TA, I have to admit that I chuckled when I saw that one of the Prog Report reviews of the new TA was by a guy who sorta works for Radiant Records. 

 
I noticed that! He gets kind of defensive about Radiant Records as well. I'm sure he means well, but when I brought up how the Radiant Records/Metal Blade releases of Neal's albums have a lesser quality of package than their Inside Out releases, he said something about how Radiant doesn't cheapen out on releases (but if you've seen the differences, you'd know what I'm talking about, especially with TA's Whirld Tour 2010 and KaLIVEoscope box sets).

-Marc.

Agreed, I can only judge the vinyl releases and the InsideOut releases have a better packaging quality than f.e. Similtude and Adventure. Then again, InsideOut doesn't do triple gatefolds for 3LP albums, but used to stuff them into a normal gatefold. I'm quite content that now they release 3LP albums in a gatefold, a single sleeve and a slipcase around the two (The Absolute Universe, TFK's Islands,...).

[Fritzinger]

For everyone who pre-ordered the touring edition of TFB in October 2019 at Bravado/Universal, I just received a mail concerning this.

Dear Friedrich,

We regret to inform you, that the vinyl of „THE FUTURE BITES (LTD. VINYL EDITION - GERMAN VERSION)" has not been manufactured in the way we advertised it.
       
It was advertised as:
- Silver album 12” vinyl  +  Black standard 7’’ vinyl
The product we sent you wrongly was:
- Black standard album 12” vinyl  +  Red 7’’ vinyl
 
In the coming weeks we will provide you with a free of charge copy of the Silver Vinyl. We cannot confirm an exact date, but plan to do ship this to you in the first 2 weeks of March.
We sincerely regret the disappointment and inconvenience this issue has caused for you!
 
You do not need to return the black vinyl. We will not send you another 7" in the standard black colour. You already have the 7" in the higher-quality special red colour and also own the black album.
       
Thanks a lot for your patience & support
Your Steven Wilson Shop Team

[Elite]

dude may not care, but the only reason so many people started paying serious attention to him was because of Porcupine Tree -- specifically, IA and Deadwing. A heavier sound, a guitar-based sound, and boom, major label interest and push.

Yet he's a bigger artist right now than Porcupine Tree ever was, so I don't know whether this is important at all. Musicians and bands change through time, same happens to Steven Wilson. The PT comparisons really are old; he's been off that for 10 years already.

[Fritzinger]

The PT comparisons really are old; he's been off that for 10 years already.

Tell that to MP warriors 

[kirksnosehair]

  I was more making the point that you can at least argue that Prince has standing to be that way.  Outside of the prog world (and even within the prog world, to some) it's "Steven who?"

Serious question: arrogance and/or super confidence has more standing if you have mainstream success?

Well, gee, let me think about this for a second.  Some relatively unknown dude from a band with a very weird name who were LUCKY to sell MAYBE 20k or 30k copies of their best albums acts like a complete fucking tool almost every time he's interviewed going out of his way to diss musicians who can play fucking circles around him while beating off to a porn video, compared to a person who has sold hundreds of millions of albums and is widely regarded as one of the greatest musicians to ever record an album...who has more standing to be "arrogant" ? 

Boy, that's a really tough one there, yep, you got us with that one.  wow


That might be sarcasm

[KevShmev]

Steven Wilson has grown in popularity but kind of has that tag of “the biggest musician you’ve never heard of”.  He is now someone who has top 10 albums, appears on tv getting interviewed (not the big prime time chat shows but stuff like breakfast tv) and can play decent sized venues.  Much more so than he ever did with Porcupine Tree, who played the University circuit.  He is not a megastar though, he can go pretty much anywhere he wants unrecognised, he doesn’t have paparazzi camped outside his house, he’s not super rich or dating the hottest women in the world.  If he’s an asshole, it’s because he was always an asshole, not because fame and fortune changed him.

Fair points, but three asshole-ish remarks, if we want to call them that (the TA comments 20 years ago, the GVF comments, and the EVH comment), do not make an asshole, IMO. And he did apologize to Wolfgang, which a true asshole wouldn't have done.  But I get that some are dug in on this and that is fine.  It is what it is.

[Samsara]

Yet he's a bigger artist right now than Porcupine Tree ever was,

No, I don't think that's true. For example, on the tour for The Incident, he played The Warfield Theater in San Francisco. Capacity is just under 3,000 people. The last time he played San Francisco, he played The Filmore, which has a capacity of 800.

Interestingly, once he left PT behind, he played The Filmore, worked his way up to playing The Warfield again in 2015 as a solo artist, and then when he last played San Francisco in 2018, he had to downgrade back to The Filmore. So if anything, his popularity as a solo artist is declining.

Musicians and bands change through time, same happens to Steven Wilson. The PT comparisons really are old; he's been off that for 10 years already.

No doubt they all change. Again, if any of his fans take offense at my critiques, it's just opinion. No offense intended. I don't think the comparisons are old though. Porcupine Tree, as much as Steven Wilson tries to distance himself from it (except when the reissues make him money), was a special band. 10 years later or not, people will always compare him to Porcupine Tree, because that's what put him on the map. He owes his success to that band.

As I said earlier, I respect Steven Wilson following his muse. I really do. If he doesn't like guitar-based rock any longer, that's his call, of course. But his snide comments once in a while are stupid, particularly for a guy who no one would know about had it not been for the band he was a mainstay and creative leader in that he shelved so he could, essentially, become a solo artist on the back of their success and have a built-in audience. In a way, he hurt the careers of everyone else in Porcupine Tree -- people who worked just as hard as him to build that band up, particularly once they got signed to a major label.

[Zantera]

I'd say the Van Halen comments are really the only comments I can think of that he's made that seemed a bit tasteless. There's a time and place for things and considering people are still mourning Eddie Van Halen and his passing was somewhat recently, whether you like or dislike his music, it wasn't really the best time to express dislike for his guitar playing style and the movement he inspired. A bit foot-in-mouth syndrome.

Him throwing shade at Transatlantic is fair if he feels that way but also hypocritical and funny considering he went onto make Raven and Grace. You don't have to like every band in your musical neighborhood but considering you still share a lot of fans you know it will still piss people off. Not liking Greta Van Fleet isn't really a big deal either because opinions are opinions.

[Buddyhunter1]

Kinda goes to show how underwhelming the new album is that most of the conversation here is still about Steven Wilson's comments that he made prior to its release.

[Elite]

I think Steven Wilson's relative success is more visible in Europe then? Over here ever subsequent tour has been larger. He's been headlining festival, drawing huge crowds for solo tours. All things that didn't happen when Porcupine Tree were still active. At the beginning, his first tours, there might have been less people in the audience (though I remember the sold-out GFD show in 013), but the last time I saw him on the TTB tour (both Amsterdam and Copenhagen), it was packed.

[Stadler]

Steven Wilson has grown in popularity but kind of has that tag of “the biggest musician you’ve never heard of”.  He is now someone who has top 10 albums, appears on tv getting interviewed (not the big prime time chat shows but stuff like breakfast tv) and can play decent sized venues.  Much more so than he ever did with Porcupine Tree, who played the University circuit.  He is not a megastar though, he can go pretty much anywhere he wants unrecognised, he doesn’t have paparazzi camped outside his house, he’s not super rich or dating the hottest women in the world.  If he’s an asshole, it’s because he was always an asshole, not because fame and fortune changed him.

Fair points, but three asshole-ish remarks, if we want to call them that (the TA comments 20 years ago, the GVF comments, and the EVH comment), do not make an asshole, IMO. And he did apologize to Wolfgang, which a true asshole wouldn't have done.  But I get that some are dug in on this and that is fine.  It is what it is.

There's more than three, though, no? 

[Stadler]

I think Steven Wilson's relative success is more visible in Europe then? Over here ever subsequent tour has been larger. He's been headlining festival, drawing huge crowds for solo tours. All things that didn't happen when Porcupine Tree were still active. At the beginning, his first tours, there might have been less people in the audience (though I remember the sold-out GFD show in 013), but the last time I saw him on the TTB tour (both Amsterdam and Copenhagen), it was packed.

What venues, though?   His latest tour dates have St. David's Hall in Cardiff, and the Hammersmith Apollo.   2,000 and about 5,500 if memory services.  In 2018, he was playing similar, and smaller, venues here in the States.  Popular is relative; we were talking Prince before, and when he played Connecticut - NOT a large market - he basically rented out the entire Mohegan Sun arena - a 10,000 seat room - and sold all the tickets himself, handled all the staging himself...   he basically hosted a backyard party for 10,000 people.  We're not comparing apples and oranges here.

[Zantera]

What I will say is it will be interesting to see what an impact (if any) this album and future tour will have on his popularity. Just look at his instagram for how hard he's been promoting this album. I don't know how many new fans he will gain for the old fans he will lose but it will be very curious to see if he continues down this rabbit hole or if he crawls back to something more prog rock sounding.

[cramx3]

Steven Wilson has grown in popularity but kind of has that tag of “the biggest musician you’ve never heard of”.  He is now someone who has top 10 albums, appears on tv getting interviewed (not the big prime time chat shows but stuff like breakfast tv) and can play decent sized venues.  Much more so than he ever did with Porcupine Tree, who played the University circuit.  He is not a megastar though, he can go pretty much anywhere he wants unrecognised, he doesn’t have paparazzi camped outside his house, he’s not super rich or dating the hottest women in the world.  If he’s an asshole, it’s because he was always an asshole, not because fame and fortune changed him.

Fair points, but three asshole-ish remarks, if we want to call them that (the TA comments 20 years ago, the GVF comments, and the EVH comment), do not make an asshole, IMO. And he did apologize to Wolfgang, which a true asshole wouldn't have done.  But I get that some are dug in on this and that is fine.  It is what it is.

There's more than three, though, no?

Go see him live, he might say something on stage to make you cringe a little.  He's just very arrogant.

When he played here, I stood on the side of the stage as they left.  Every member of the band gave me a high five as they walked off stage, except Steven.  Didn't bother me too much at the time, but with all this chat, it kind of makes me think about it again.

[RoeDent]

It’s refreshing to hear a musician/public figure actually give an honest opinion rather than fashion the least offensive response possible for a given situation. So much stuff feels like a PR statement nowadays where you can’t express an honest thought without some kind of backlash.

I'm inclined to agree with this. While it was refreshing to see a seemingly healthy artist/media relationship in the prog community, pulling the whole "We're fans like you" card, sometimes it gets too close for comfort. For instance, hell will freeze over on the day The Prog Report publish a review that isn't gushing about a Morse/Portnoy release. They come across as enormous fanboys.

As much as I love the music of Neal Morse and TA, I have to admit that I chuckled when I saw that one of the Prog Report reviews of the new TA was by a guy who sorta works for Radiant Records. 

I think I know who you're talking about. He's thanked by Neal in the liner notes of the new Transatlantic album.

[Peter Mc]

Steven Wilson has grown in popularity but kind of has that tag of “the biggest musician you’ve never heard of”.  He is now someone who has top 10 albums, appears on tv getting interviewed (not the big prime time chat shows but stuff like breakfast tv) and can play decent sized venues.  Much more so than he ever did with Porcupine Tree, who played the University circuit.  He is not a megastar though, he can go pretty much anywhere he wants unrecognised, he doesn’t have paparazzi camped outside his house, he’s not super rich or dating the hottest women in the world.  If he’s an asshole, it’s because he was always an asshole, not because fame and fortune changed him.

Fair points, but three asshole-ish remarks, if we want to call them that (the TA comments 20 years ago, the GVF comments, and the EVH comment), do not make an asshole, IMO. And he did apologize to Wolfgang, which a true asshole wouldn't have done.  But I get that some are dug in on this and that is fine.  It is what it is.

I’m not saying that he is an asshole, just saying, if he is, then he doesn’t have the same excuse that someone like Prince did.  I usually find him reasonably witty and likeable on stage but fairly dull in interviews so I don’t really read a lot of his stuff.  I do get the impression that he’s a bit up his own arse though at times.

[Skeever]

The problem with Steven's attitude for me is when you combine it with music that simply does not live up to someone who acts like their own music is so profound. Maybe if he had stopped at Porcupine Tree, I would feel differently. But I simply do not think his solo output is all that special to begin with. It is certainly very good. It is not leaps and bounds better than the best work of his peers (in prog). It's, at best, on par (with some of it).

[Peter Mc]

Going back to the actual album.  I had a listen to it today after having a bit of a break from it due to Transatlantic.  Not sure whether this has just allowed the songs to settle a bit but I enjoyed it quite a bit, the songs sounded a lot more catchy and memorable.  Maybe there’s hope for it yet!

[DTA]

I love that ugly guitar that comes in midway through Eminent Sleaze. I bounce between this song, Personal Shopper, and Man Of The People being my favorites so far but I truly love the whole thing. His best solo work by far imo.

[KevShmev]

Steven Wilson has grown in popularity but kind of has that tag of “the biggest musician you’ve never heard of”.  He is now someone who has top 10 albums, appears on tv getting interviewed (not the big prime time chat shows but stuff like breakfast tv) and can play decent sized venues.  Much more so than he ever did with Porcupine Tree, who played the University circuit.  He is not a megastar though, he can go pretty much anywhere he wants unrecognised, he doesn’t have paparazzi camped outside his house, he’s not super rich or dating the hottest women in the world.  If he’s an asshole, it’s because he was always an asshole, not because fame and fortune changed him.

Fair points, but three asshole-ish remarks, if we want to call them that (the TA comments 20 years ago, the GVF comments, and the EVH comment), do not make an asshole, IMO. And he did apologize to Wolfgang, which a true asshole wouldn't have done.  But I get that some are dug in on this and that is fine.  It is what it is.

There's more than three, though, no?

I can't think of any, and I watch and read a lot of his interviews, but YMMV.

Going back to the actual album.  I had a listen to it today after having a bit of a break from it due to Transatlantic.  Not sure whether this has just allowed the songs to settle a bit but I enjoyed it quite a bit, the songs sounded a lot more catchy and memorable.  Maybe there’s hope for it yet!

It's a good album. I won't get as much mileage out of it as I have all of his other new PT/solo albums I have gotten in real time since becoming a fan in '04/'05, but I still like it quite a bit.  And I'd go see him if touring resumed and he came to my town, but this is not an album that would make me want to drive elsewhere to see it, like I did for The Raven when a friend and I drove to Chicago (5 hours each way) to see that show.

[Pettor]

Sometimes I imagine that there's a device called pretentiousmeter. It can basically output an alarm of sort if a discussion or the vibe in a room becomes to pretentious. However all devices needs to be calibrated and that's where I imagine you put Steven and Daniel Gildenlöw alone in a room for 1 hour. Ask them what they think about being part of the prog metal genre and how influenced they are by Yngvie Malmsteen solos.

[Ben_Jamin]

What I find funny about this is... This is a guy who made a song with lyrics "All the MTV and Cod Philosophy" on an album about the state of Children and their Social Disorders.

Daniel Gildenlow, the same with him. He made a song called America...

But Steven has shown his Bowie influence since the start...Radioactive Toy really has a Space Oddity vibe in it's delivery.

[Zantera]

I know there's that "actors on actors" type videos and I would definitely be intrigued to watch Daniel Gildenlöw and Steven Wilson have a discussion. I'm sure they don't particularly care for each other's music (but they might have mutual respect) but they are both big ego's and kinda buy into the 'god' hype created by the fans.

Even though SW is by no means Prince in terms of popularity, he's still 30 years into his career and I'd say for at least a decade now (probably closer to two) he's had a growing fanbase where a lot of people are fanatic to the point of considering him a deity. Heck you have those prog magazines with him on the cover and headlines like "The god of prog" and similar. I'm sure that definitely feeds into his ego and I think many people would probably become bigger dicks in that situation. There's bands that are bigger than Steven Wilson yet doesn't have the same kind of worship around any individual member. Some people live and breathe SW.

[RoeDent]

What I find funny about this is... This is a guy who made a song with lyrics "All the MTV and Cod Philosophy" on an album about the state of Children and their Social Disorders.

14 years ago. More recently than that he was firmly anti-streaming, before he, like all of us should, realized he lost the battle. People change, standards change. We shouldn't hold people (except maybe politicians) to things they said or sung or wrote years ago.

I bet journalists are out to snare him, like many other celebrities, to try and get that faux-controversial scoop, to try and ruin careers.

[Zantera]

What I find funny about this is... This is a guy who made a song with lyrics "All the MTV and Cod Philosophy" on an album about the state of Children and their Social Disorders.

14 years ago. More recently than that he was firmly anti-streaming, before he, like all of us should, realized he lost the battle. People change, standards change. We shouldn't hold people (except maybe politicians) to things they said or sung or wrote years ago.

I bet journalists are out to snare him, like many other celebrities, to try and get that faux-controversial scoop, to try and ruin careers.

I wouldn't say they are out to snare him but clicks is what they are after and drama is what results in clicks. SW can give a wonderful in depth interview about his album for 30 minutes but a comment about how much he dislikes Greta Van Fleet is the perfect headline to get people clicking on the article and commenting.

I still think SW seems like a bit of a dick but I also understand the angle with these headlines.