Author Topic: Distance Over Time - TWO Years on...  (Read 11347 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Ben_Jamin

  • Posts: 12335
  • Gender: Male
  • I'm just a man, thrown into existence by the gods
Re: Distance Over Time - TWO Years on...
« Reply #175 on: January 25, 2021, 08:22:42 AM »
I get what you're saying, but that is a recent trend of wanting to stay within certain confines. It doesn't matter if the music is fast, slow, heavy, ballad, everything in the Mangini era has this general feel and mood and it's generally cold and serious, which is opposite to most of DT's first 8 or so albums, where there was a sense of fun and adventure, while showcasing many moods and emotions. As I said I think SC started that, but it's been a gradual shift, as I said, BC&SL was still plenty diverse.

And maybe, the band likes basking in that Cold and Serious mood and feel.

I don't know but, S2N has a sense of fun.
Oh, and Viper King is really cold and serious..

See, that's the irony. The one song that is not cold and serious is relegated to being a bonus track. I never said cold and serious is a bad thing, though, but it's the rule, not the exception these days in DT's music.

What do you mean by cold and serious?
I don't know how they can be so proud of winning with them odds. - Little Big Man

"We can't rewrite history. We can learn our own history, and share it with other people. While, we learn, from them, their history." -Me,Myself,I

Offline DarkLord_Lalinc

  • pr0nman extraordinaire
  • DTF.org Alumni
  • ****
  • Posts: 11552
  • Gender: Male
  • Hostages love me
Re: Distance Over Time - TWO Years on...
« Reply #176 on: January 27, 2021, 10:36:20 AM »
DARK MASTER WITHIN I WILL FIGHT FOR YOU
Quote from: TioJorge
MAN FUCK YOU KUJA.
Quote from: hefdaddy42
The Darklord is amazing

Online geeeemo

  • Posts: 498
  • Gender: Female
Re: Distance Over Time - TWO Years on...
« Reply #177 on: January 27, 2021, 10:48:21 AM »
I think I like cold and serious. For me happy and fun isn't usually what I want from metal or rock.  But that is just me.  :angry:

Dark Master is a top 3!

Offline Ben_Jamin

  • Posts: 12335
  • Gender: Male
  • I'm just a man, thrown into existence by the gods
Re: Distance Over Time - TWO Years on...
« Reply #178 on: January 27, 2021, 11:20:50 AM »
I think I like cold and serious. For me happy and fun isn't usually what I want from metal or rock.  But that is just me.  :angry:

Dark Master is a top 3!

Happy and Fun in Metal is fantastic, and energetic as all hell....Power Metal is this very definition of Fun and Happy in metal, but it's more Energetic and Uplifting. It's the anthem to Triumph.

Prog Rock, like Yes and Genesis, is usually melodic and use happy melodies, reminds me of Bob Ross and his happy little trees.  :lol

Basically, Dream Theater uses the Metal Tone, in the guitars, bass, and drums. And adds in the Melodicness of Prog Rock, with the Keyboards. More so back then, as Kevin Moore, used a lot of those happy sounding tones. Until the next album, where he said, I am just using these tones, and no other tones. Now Awake, is the album I would consider to have that Cold and Serious sound.
I don't know how they can be so proud of winning with them odds. - Little Big Man

"We can't rewrite history. We can learn our own history, and share it with other people. While, we learn, from them, their history." -Me,Myself,I

Offline Stadler

  • DTF.org Alumni
  • ****
  • Posts: 28089
  • Gender: Male
  • Pointing out the "unfunny" since 2017!
Re: Distance Over Time - TWO Years on...
« Reply #179 on: January 27, 2021, 11:43:07 AM »
I think I like cold and serious. For me happy and fun isn't usually what I want from metal or rock.  But that is just me.  :angry:

Dark Master is a top 3!

Nothing you listen to makes you wish you were in a convertable screaming down the highway at 65 mph with the top down?   :)

Online geeeemo

  • Posts: 498
  • Gender: Female
Re: Distance Over Time - TWO Years on...
« Reply #180 on: January 27, 2021, 01:16:45 PM »
I think I like cold and serious. For me happy and fun isn't usually what I want from metal or rock.  But that is just me.  :angry:

Dark Master is a top 3!

Nothing you listen to makes you wish you were in a convertable screaming down the highway at 65 mph with the top down?   :)

For me it is some sort of rebelliousness. It's safe rebellion. So, the music that gets my juices flowing is the edgier harder, or emotive where I can "get it out". I love to go screaming down the highway with that. Especially in spring. Those first few warm sunny days. My old favorite was...Roadhouse Blues by the Doors.

Offline darkshade

  • Posts: 3426
  • Gender: Male
Re: Distance Over Time - TWO Years on...
« Reply #181 on: January 27, 2021, 06:03:33 PM »
I think I like cold and serious. For me happy and fun isn't usually what I want from metal or rock.  But that is just me.  :angry:

Dark Master is a top 3!

Happy and Fun in Metal is fantastic, and energetic as all hell....Power Metal is this very definition of Fun and Happy in metal, but it's more Energetic and Uplifting. It's the anthem to Triumph.

Prog Rock, like Yes and Genesis, is usually melodic and use happy melodies, reminds me of Bob Ross and his happy little trees.  :lol

Basically, Dream Theater uses the Metal Tone, in the guitars, bass, and drums. And adds in the Melodicness of Prog Rock, with the Keyboards. More so back then, as Kevin Moore, used a lot of those happy sounding tones. Until the next album, where he said, I am just using these tones, and no other tones. Now Awake, is the album I would consider to have that Cold and Serious sound.

In some ways this is what I was getting at. I got into Dream Theater after already being into metal and rock music. They were more of a gateway band into the progressive and jazz world for me, but what kept me coming back years after getting into them as a teenager, was their approach of mixing metal with progressive and a bit of soloing. Now cut out most of the long soloing, they stick to the dark, serious tone to everything, but its not what I liked about Dream Theater in the first place.

Awake was a harder edged album, compared to what came before, but aside from a couple of songs, they weren't cold and serious, but had many moments of fun and moments of optimism among the darkness, and of course they were still heavy prog mode, too. I don't really see the band being cold and serious until Systematic Chaos... but BC&SL showed us that it was not to be that way, but then Portnoy left. DT12 was, to me, the biggest offender of this cold and serious approach, and part of it is the production.

In contrast, Train of Thought is not cold and serious, not even Vacant, while serious, is a beautiful melody. Train of Thought is kick ass. Metallica's 80s albums are heavy and riff laden, but I wouldn't call the music cold and serious, it is kick ass.
« Last Edit: January 27, 2021, 06:12:24 PM by darkshade »

Offline nobloodyname

  • Posts: 797
Re: Distance Over Time - TWO Years on...
« Reply #182 on: January 27, 2021, 11:48:03 PM »
I've been nodding along in agreement with several of your posts but I think you've lost me here. Awake (one of my bottom three DT albums) I'd say is incredibly "cold and serious". I'd add detached and aloof to that, too. None of that is inherently bad, it's just how I perceive the album. But! I'd also describe it as suffocating and oppressive.

Train of Thought, which is one of my top three DT albums, I'd absolutely describe as "cold and serious" but I don't find it "suffocating and oppressive".

 It's incredible how albums can such an effect on us and how we can also arrive at such different viewpoints.
Gamer, rocker, humanist, womble.
@spacedyemeerkat

Offline Stadler

  • DTF.org Alumni
  • ****
  • Posts: 28089
  • Gender: Male
  • Pointing out the "unfunny" since 2017!
Re: Distance Over Time - TWO Years on...
« Reply #183 on: January 28, 2021, 05:54:16 AM »
I think I like cold and serious. For me happy and fun isn't usually what I want from metal or rock.  But that is just me.  :angry:

Dark Master is a top 3!

Nothing you listen to makes you wish you were in a convertable screaming down the highway at 65 mph with the top down?   :)

For me it is some sort of rebelliousness. It's safe rebellion. So, the music that gets my juices flowing is the edgier harder, or emotive where I can "get it out". I love to go screaming down the highway with that. Especially in spring. Those first few warm sunny days. My old favorite was...Roadhouse Blues by the Doors.

I love that time of year.   Aerosmith or the Stones are good choices (for me) for those days.   

Offline TAC

  • DTF.org Alumni
  • ****
  • Posts: 49033
  • Gender: Male
  • Kip Rolled
Re: Distance Over Time - TWO Years on...
« Reply #184 on: January 28, 2021, 06:21:33 AM »
My convertible music would be Accept.
would have thought the same thing but seeing the OP was TAC i immediately thought Maiden or DT related
Winger Theater Forums................or WTF.  ;D

Offline kirksnosehair

  • DTF.org Alumni
  • ****
  • Posts: 8337
  • Gender: Male
  • Bryce & Kylie's Grandpa
    • The ANABASIS - Music Making a Difference
Re: Distance Over Time - TWO Years on...
« Reply #185 on: January 28, 2021, 01:11:27 PM »
In contrast, Train of Thought is not cold and serious


The first song is basically a fuck you to other musicians who have slagged Dream Theater
The next one is about the horrors of alcoholism
The third track is all about making sacrifices even when you don't want to
The fourth track is pretty much a fuck you to Mike Portnoy's stepfather, who was apparently an emotionally abusive prick
Vacant is very sad
Stream of Consciousness is a minor-key instrumental
In The Name of God is a screed against Islamic Terrorism


I'm not sure they could make a more cold and serious album if they tried? 

Offline hefdaddy42

  • Et in Arcadia Ego
  • Global Moderator
  • *****
  • Posts: 43461
  • Gender: Male
  • Postwhore Emeritus
Re: Distance Over Time - TWO Years on...
« Reply #186 on: January 28, 2021, 01:43:35 PM »
In contrast, Train of Thought is not cold and serious


The first song is basically a fuck you to other musicians who have slagged Dream Theater
The next one is about the horrors of alcoholism
The third track is all about making sacrifices even when you don't want to
The fourth track is pretty much a fuck you to Mike Portnoy's stepfather, who was apparently an emotionally abusive prick
Vacant is very sad
Stream of Consciousness is a minor-key instrumental
In The Name of God is a screed against Islamic Terrorism


I'm not sure they could make a more cold and serious album if they tried?
Agreed.
Hef is right on all things. Except for when I disagree with him. In which case he's probably still right.

Offline Max Kuehnau

  • Emotionless Brainiac
  • Posts: 1978
  • Gender: Male
  • Doomed to be a man this world forgot
Re: Distance Over Time - TWO Years on...
« Reply #187 on: January 28, 2021, 02:13:02 PM »
In contrast, Train of Thought is not cold and serious


The first song is basically a fuck you to other musicians who have slagged Dream Theater
The next one is about the horrors of alcoholism
The third track is all about making sacrifices even when you don't want to
The fourth track is pretty much a fuck you to Mike Portnoy's stepfather, who was apparently an emotionally abusive prick
Vacant is very sad
Stream of Consciousness is a minor-key instrumental
In The Name of God is a screed against Islamic Terrorism


I'm not sure they could make a more cold and serious album if they tried?
Agreed.
They can, and they did IMHO. And especially musically and technically speaking. (More technically complicated, colder, more sterile, cleaner execution) Just saying.
"Life's greatest battles often are fought alone"

Offline hefdaddy42

  • Et in Arcadia Ego
  • Global Moderator
  • *****
  • Posts: 43461
  • Gender: Male
  • Postwhore Emeritus
Re: Distance Over Time - TWO Years on...
« Reply #188 on: January 28, 2021, 02:23:52 PM »
In contrast, Train of Thought is not cold and serious


The first song is basically a fuck you to other musicians who have slagged Dream Theater
The next one is about the horrors of alcoholism
The third track is all about making sacrifices even when you don't want to
The fourth track is pretty much a fuck you to Mike Portnoy's stepfather, who was apparently an emotionally abusive prick
Vacant is very sad
Stream of Consciousness is a minor-key instrumental
In The Name of God is a screed against Islamic Terrorism


I'm not sure they could make a more cold and serious album if they tried?
Agreed.
They can, and they did IMHO. And especially musically and technically speaking. (More technically complicated, colder, more sterile, cleaner execution) Just saying.
If you say so.  But you're an emotionless brainiac, so what do you know?


It's telling, of course, that kirk's opinion, with which I agreed, definitely took into account the lyrics, while your opinion apparently does not.  To which album are you referring?
Hef is right on all things. Except for when I disagree with him. In which case he's probably still right.

Offline bosk1

  • King of Misdirection
  • Administrator
  • *****
  • Posts: 9640
  • Bow down to Boskaryus
Re: Distance Over Time - TWO Years on...
« Reply #189 on: January 28, 2021, 02:27:05 PM »
I agree with "they can."  Of course they can/could.  But "they did?"  Which album?  ???  Although KNH is slightly off on a couple of his takes of what the songs are about, his general point is pretty spot on.  Which album is more "cold and serious" than TOT?
"The Supreme Court of the United States has descended from the disciplined legal reasoning of John Marshall and Joseph Story to the mystical aphorisms of the fortune cookie."

Offline hefdaddy42

  • Et in Arcadia Ego
  • Global Moderator
  • *****
  • Posts: 43461
  • Gender: Male
  • Postwhore Emeritus
Re: Distance Over Time - TWO Years on...
« Reply #190 on: January 28, 2021, 02:31:36 PM »
I agree with "they can."  Of course they can/could.  But "they did?"  Which album?  ???  Although KNH is slightly off on a couple of his takes of what the songs are about, his general point is pretty spot on.  Which album is more "cold and serious" than TOT?
Maybe Six Degrees.  Because of JP's hair.

??
Hef is right on all things. Except for when I disagree with him. In which case he's probably still right.

Offline Max Kuehnau

  • Emotionless Brainiac
  • Posts: 1978
  • Gender: Male
  • Doomed to be a man this world forgot
Re: Distance Over Time - TWO Years on...
« Reply #191 on: January 28, 2021, 02:34:37 PM »
I agree with "they can."  Of course they can/could.  But "they did?"  Which album?  ???  Although KNH is slightly off on a couple of his takes of what the songs are about, his general point is pretty spot on.  Which album is more "cold and serious" than TOT?
Well, IMHO, any Mangini era album could be described as that, but I was going for the general sound of DT12 as an example, because as far as I remember, the sound of DT12 had been descibed as being sterile and cold. And IMHO again, DT12 and ADTOE feature some of the most difficult sections in a DT piece to date. (during Outcry and Illumination Theory), far harder than Portnoy era DT. But these are just my quarters and dimes.
"Life's greatest battles often are fought alone"

Offline Max Kuehnau

  • Emotionless Brainiac
  • Posts: 1978
  • Gender: Male
  • Doomed to be a man this world forgot
Re: Distance Over Time - TWO Years on...
« Reply #192 on: January 28, 2021, 02:35:07 PM »
I agree with "they can."  Of course they can/could.  But "they did?"  Which album?  ???  Although KNH is slightly off on a couple of his takes of what the songs are about, his general point is pretty spot on.  Which album is more "cold and serious" than TOT?
Maybe Six Degrees.  Because of JP's hair.

??

 :rollin :rollin Thanks for the laughs.
"Life's greatest battles often are fought alone"

Offline DarkLord_Lalinc

  • pr0nman extraordinaire
  • DTF.org Alumni
  • ****
  • Posts: 11552
  • Gender: Male
  • Hostages love me
Re: Distance Over Time - TWO Years on...
« Reply #193 on: January 28, 2021, 02:41:49 PM »
I agree with "they can."  Of course they can/could.  But "they did?"  Which album?  ???  Although KNH is slightly off on a couple of his takes of what the songs are about, his general point is pretty spot on.  Which album is more "cold and serious" than TOT?
Well, IMHO, any Mangini era album could be described as that, but I was going for the general sound of DT12 as an example, because as far as I remember, the sound of DT12 had been descibed as being sterile and cold. And IMHO again, DT12 and ADTOE feature some of the most difficult sections in a DT piece to date. (during Outcry and Illumination Theory), far harder than Portnoy era DT. But these are just my quarters and dimes.

I think you're talking about something entirely different than what the others are talking about. When you say "cold and serious", you're talking about the apparent "sterility" of DT12 soundwise, I think? That falls 100% in the realm of subjectivity and interpretation, whereas they are talking about the music in Train of Thought to be thematically darker which is basically not something so debatable as it's closer to a fact than an opinion.

Also, I really can't see how a challenging instrumental section would translate as something "cold and serious". Not trying to be a prick, but I think the perspectives you are offering, although incredibly valid of course, are far off from the point of the conversation.  :D
Quote from: TioJorge
MAN FUCK YOU KUJA.
Quote from: hefdaddy42
The Darklord is amazing

Offline Max Kuehnau

  • Emotionless Brainiac
  • Posts: 1978
  • Gender: Male
  • Doomed to be a man this world forgot
Re: Distance Over Time - TWO Years on...
« Reply #194 on: January 28, 2021, 02:53:26 PM »
I don't disagree with the point about the darkness of the lyrical subject matter. That, I'm sure is the case on Train Of Thought. Musically though, not entirely sure. Still an interesting result of what seemed to be challenging times for the band. (and back to D/T, some of the heaviness of TOT, and the relative speed of the writing process) definitely carried over to D/T in some ways IMHO.

Btw: The tour for Train Of Thought was the last DT tour I attended while MP was in the band. After having attended both the 6D and Met2 tours, boy what a contrast it was, to say the least. The mood of the tour was dark to me back then too (as was TOT itself, emotionally speaking.)
"Life's greatest battles often are fought alone"

Offline JRuless

  • Posts: 134
Re: Distance Over Time - TWO Years on...
« Reply #195 on: January 29, 2021, 12:27:52 AM »

Btw: The tour for Train Of Thought was the last DT tour I attended while MP was in the band. After having attended both the 6D and Met2 tours, boy what a contrast it was, to say the least. The mood of the tour was dark to me back then too (as was TOT itself, emotionally speaking.)

I agree! Look at LaB, the whole stage setting has a dark mood. Its very simple too. I like it! The look and feel of Portnoys equipment was impressive with the heavy trainheads

Offline darkshade

  • Posts: 3426
  • Gender: Male
Re: Distance Over Time - TWO Years on...
« Reply #196 on: January 30, 2021, 08:36:30 PM »
To me they're doing their best Metallica meets Pantera played by Dream Theater on Train of Thought, and to me I don't see it as dark or cold, but aggressive and energetic, the riffs on ToT... JP is the riff master on that album compared to Mangini era JP. I always think of the basic chugga chugga main riff of The Enemy Inside as the most stock riff of modern DT. Which is why I'm surprised at his new album and the new LTE single, he's still got that in him. Jordan's keys over the last few albums also sound more serious, and dark, than in the 00s.

As for Awake, aside from The Mirror which is really just aggressive, I don't find the darker moments dark, as much as sad. They have a sad, longing feeling to them, it's in the keys. The album, along with IaW, is also of its time, that post-80s, early-mid 90s feel that is present in most popular music of the time period (early/mid 80s-1994). I don't feel that from modern DT albums, for the most part. The only dark song they did prior to Systematic Chaos is Disappear.

BTW this is all based on the music. I don't really put too much weight on lyrical content in DT's music, and I also don't find DT's music very dark relative to other music out there.

Offline DoctorAction

  • Posts: 788
  • Everyday Glory
Re: Distance Over Time - TWO Years on...
« Reply #197 on: January 31, 2021, 02:52:01 AM »
I'm not sure about cold and serious. DT are quite an earnest band, for the most part, and always have been. There are almost no all-out joy or jokey songs. Warmth and fun tends to come out in musical style and feels. Eg. Zappa-isms in instrumental breaks, ragtime piano, LITS, Just Let Me Breathe, Viper King, S2N, TDEN, ITPOE.

ToT was clearly an attempt to be dark, and respect for trying something different. It sounded risible to me but I'd say it was serious but not cold.

The MM era does have a slighty more rigid feel, somehow, but I think that's down to a combination of his ability to be so precise and how clean/rigid JP wants the whole production to be.

D/T has remained my go-to DT record since it came out. Has a more fun, energetic feel than any other of their recent records, AFAIC.

Liveliness above rigidity is probably the key emphasis I'd like to see the band pursue at this point. Real groove above click tracks, atmosphere above cleanliness.
The only true wisdom is in knowing you know nothing.

Offline kirksnosehair

  • DTF.org Alumni
  • ****
  • Posts: 8337
  • Gender: Male
  • Bryce & Kylie's Grandpa
    • The ANABASIS - Music Making a Difference
Re: Distance Over Time - TWO Years on...
« Reply #198 on: February 16, 2021, 11:59:56 AM »
For me, two years into this one, it's settled in pretty far down my list.  I'd rank the studio albums something like this:


01 - Six Degrees of Inner Turbulence (still the band's creative zenith in my opinion)
02 - Images & Words
03 - Scenes From a Memory
04 - A Dramatic Turn of Events (with better production it might be #2)
05 - Train of Thought
06 - Octavarium
07 - Black Clouds and Silver Linings
08 - Falling Into Infinity
09 - Awake
10 - Systematic Chaos
11 - Dream Theater
12 - Distance over Time
13 - When Dream and Day Unite
14 - The Astonishing

Offline bluefox4000

  • Posts: 238
  • Gender: Male
Re: Distance Over Time - TWO Years on...
« Reply #199 on: February 17, 2021, 11:03:26 AM »
I have to say i had a hard time with this album.  went hot and cold on it.....back and forth on it for so long.

when it came on out i wasn't huge on Paralysed or Untethered Angel. 

but.....the new live album helped with this record a lot.

Songs i love.

Unthered Angel
Fall Into The Light
Barstool Warrior
S2N
At wits end
Viper King (it's bonus but i love it)

ok songs

Out of Reach
Pale Blue Dot (always thought this was a bit over hyped......bit too long for long's sake)

Don't Like

Paralyzed
Room 137

but........This album did grow on me a was WAY harder on it 2 years ago.

« Last Edit: February 17, 2021, 12:31:07 PM by bluefox4000 »

Offline kirksnosehair

  • DTF.org Alumni
  • ****
  • Posts: 8337
  • Gender: Male
  • Bryce & Kylie's Grandpa
    • The ANABASIS - Music Making a Difference
Re: Distance Over Time - TWO Years on...
« Reply #200 on: February 17, 2021, 11:36:59 AM »
Safest Dream Theater album in their entire catalog, for better or worse.
A couple of nuggets, mainly the last 3 songs, not counting the bonus track, and Barstool Warrior.
Otherwise, to me its the Mangini era version of Systematic Chaos, but even SC had some surprises.
This album also really showed JLB's age, and I'd rather he go back to the pre-Mangini, dry sound he had on the earlier recordings. He's soaked in effects now.
When the bonus track is the most interesting song, you have to wonder who's steering the ship, if anyone.

How is this a safe Dream Theater album?
What are these nuggets?
James LaBrie was likely the one who chose to be soaked in effects. He always has used effects, the effects he is using this time are just more noticeable in the mix, and I think they work well with the music.
The Bonus Track is an interesting song because it's something they jammed for fun, and then just said screw, let's record this. It's why JP felt to also include the ending they did for At Wit's End during the live rehearsal for the song, and just loved how it all turned out, and it couldn't be replicated again, so he took that recording and added it to the end.

Safe because they stuck to shorter, concise writing (for them), most of the songs have a generally standard pop structure. They did not allow for any longer instrumental sections, and they upped the old school metal in their sound again, at the detriment of the prog, likely because of mixed reactions to The Astonishing. At least when they upped the metal on Train of Thought it was progressive, in the sense that they were pushing their metal sound forward, as opposed to ripping of Dave Mustaine and James Hetfield's riff styles as they have done from SC to DoT, or trying to sound more like modern acts. When DT get heavy these days, it still sounds like they're trying to stay hip and current within the metal framework, so I don't know why people think that that stopped happening when Portnoy left the band. All they did when MP left was bring back more melodic/major key stuff, which was already happening on BC&SL anyway, on The Best of Times and Count of Tuscany.

I meant nuggets as in "classic tunes among not-so classic songs", not nuggets like on Octavarium or other Portnoy era albums.

Viper King is an example of doing something different, but still cool, something I think the band has earned the right to do. Some say that is what The Astonishing is, and well, OK, but I didn't care for that particular approach, so I'd like to see the band try something else, not take a step back and play it safe. They kind of did the same thing with ADTOE, when you think about it.


No "kind of" about it if you ask me.  I think ADTOE was an intentional homage to their I&W era style.  The album was even criticized (misguidedly, in my opinion) for being a "duplicate" or "imitation" of I&W, but I don't think it was that at all.  I think the band probably realized that in the last few albums with Portnoy they had drifted pretty far from their most successful style and approach, which most agree is the I&W >> Awake >> SFAM >> SDOIT >> ToT >> Octavarium run of albums.   You could stick ADTOE almost anywhere in between two of those albums and apart from the shitty production values, it would sound perfectly at home in that group.  Nothing they've recorded since then would fit as well, though. 

Offline bluefox4000

  • Posts: 238
  • Gender: Male
Re: Distance Over Time - TWO Years on...
« Reply #201 on: February 17, 2021, 12:39:37 PM »
Safest Dream Theater album in their entire catalog, for better or worse.
A couple of nuggets, mainly the last 3 songs, not counting the bonus track, and Barstool Warrior.
Otherwise, to me its the Mangini era version of Systematic Chaos, but even SC had some surprises.
This album also really showed JLB's age, and I'd rather he go back to the pre-Mangini, dry sound he had on the earlier recordings. He's soaked in effects now.
When the bonus track is the most interesting song, you have to wonder who's steering the ship, if anyone.

How is this a safe Dream Theater album?
What are these nuggets?
James LaBrie was likely the one who chose to be soaked in effects. He always has used effects, the effects he is using this time are just more noticeable in the mix, and I think they work well with the music.
The Bonus Track is an interesting song because it's something they jammed for fun, and then just said screw, let's record this. It's why JP felt to also include the ending they did for At Wit's End during the live rehearsal for the song, and just loved how it all turned out, and it couldn't be replicated again, so he took that recording and added it to the end.

Safe because they stuck to shorter, concise writing (for them), most of the songs have a generally standard pop structure. They did not allow for any longer instrumental sections, and they upped the old school metal in their sound again, at the detriment of the prog, likely because of mixed reactions to The Astonishing. At least when they upped the metal on Train of Thought it was progressive, in the sense that they were pushing their metal sound forward, as opposed to ripping of Dave Mustaine and James Hetfield's riff styles as they have done from SC to DoT, or trying to sound more like modern acts. When DT get heavy these days, it still sounds like they're trying to stay hip and current within the metal framework, so I don't know why people think that that stopped happening when Portnoy left the band. All they did when MP left was bring back more melodic/major key stuff, which was already happening on BC&SL anyway, on The Best of Times and Count of Tuscany.

I meant nuggets as in "classic tunes among not-so classic songs", not nuggets like on Octavarium or other Portnoy era albums.

Viper King is an example of doing something different, but still cool, something I think the band has earned the right to do. Some say that is what The Astonishing is, and well, OK, but I didn't care for that particular approach, so I'd like to see the band try something else, not take a step back and play it safe. They kind of did the same thing with ADTOE, when you think about it.


No "kind of" about it if you ask me.  I think ADTOE was an intentional homage to their I&W era style.  The album was even criticized (misguidedly, in my opinion) for being a "duplicate" or "imitation" of I&W, but I don't think it was that at all.  I think the band probably realized that in the last few albums with Portnoy they had drifted pretty far from their most successful style and approach, which most agree is the I&W >> Awake >> SFAM >> SDOIT >> ToT >> Octavarium run of albums.   You could stick ADTOE almost anywhere in between two of those albums and apart from the shitty production values, it would sound perfectly at home in that group.  Nothing they've recorded since then would fit as well, though.

say what you want to about ADTOE all of which i agree with, BTW.

but i love it so much more than the last 2 portnoy era albums.

Return to form for me.
« Last Edit: February 17, 2021, 12:55:12 PM by bluefox4000 »

Offline Max Kuehnau

  • Emotionless Brainiac
  • Posts: 1978
  • Gender: Male
  • Doomed to be a man this world forgot
Re: Distance Over Time - TWO Years on...
« Reply #202 on: February 17, 2021, 12:47:24 PM »
Of course, a much needed return to form. Their best to date IMHO. (DT12 as well)
"Life's greatest battles often are fought alone"

Offline bluefox4000

  • Posts: 238
  • Gender: Male
Re: Distance Over Time - TWO Years on...
« Reply #203 on: February 17, 2021, 01:05:35 PM »
Of course, a much needed return to form. Their best to date IMHO. (DT12 as well)

I adore DT12

top 3 honestly.

Offline hunnus2000

  • Posts: 976
Re: Distance Over Time - TWO Years on...
« Reply #204 on: February 17, 2021, 01:09:01 PM »
Of course, a much needed return to form. Their best to date IMHO. (DT12 as well)

I adore DT12

top 3 honestly.

I'm with you Bro! To me, it's everything a DT fan would want. Heavy and melodic.  :metal

Offline Schurftkut

  • Posts: 245
Re: Distance Over Time - TWO Years on...
« Reply #205 on: February 17, 2021, 03:24:04 PM »
ADTOE is top 5 DT for me, mix aside

Offline darkshade

  • Posts: 3426
  • Gender: Male
Re: Distance Over Time - TWO Years on...
« Reply #206 on: February 17, 2021, 04:08:44 PM »
ADTOE has dropped a few pegs with me over the years. It's just under cooked in a lot of spots, or overcooked (Outcry for example) and this is the beginning of JLB being noticeably overproduced on the studio albums (to hide declining ability?)

I feel like all the Mangini albums contain great ideas that never get fleshed out often, if at all. Instead we get other ideas, or technical stuff for the sake of it, and thrown together with no purpose behind it (think an album of Ministry of Lost Souls type songs)
Say what you want about SC->BC&SL, but many of these issues began creeping into the band's music on those 2 albums, before MP left, and never went away.

Offline KevShmev

  • EZBoard Elder
  • *****
  • Posts: 34526
  • Gender: Male
Re: Distance Over Time - TWO Years on...
« Reply #207 on: February 17, 2021, 06:17:29 PM »
My ranking of ADTOE has dropped severely in recent years because of how dry and lifeless the production is.  It sounds good for the mellow songs and sections, but the rocking parts sound like the balls were cut off in post-production.  It's a shame cause the songwriting is mostly damn good on that record, and you can tell they were rejuvenated and ready to kick some ass again, but the sound/mix really let its down.

Offline Dedalus

  • Posts: 557
  • Gender: Male
Re: Distance Over Time - TWO Years on...
« Reply #208 on: February 18, 2021, 01:47:50 AM »
ADTOE is top 5 DT for me, mix aside

I totally agree.

And personally it was an important album for me. Before ADTOE I literally asked myself "why the fuck am I wasting my time with DT?". ADTOE changed my perspective at the time.

Offline Zydar

  • Creep With Tonality
  • DTF.org Alumni
  • ****
  • Posts: 17179
  • Gender: Male
Re: Distance Over Time - TWO Years on...
« Reply #209 on: February 18, 2021, 02:05:50 AM »
ADTOE was a big step up for me after SC and BCSL. I guess they needed that "dramatic event" of MP leaving to shake things up.