Author Topic: Distant Memories - New live release  (Read 93383 times)

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Offline faizoff

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Re: Distant Memories - New live release
« Reply #665 on: November 28, 2020, 08:21:41 PM »
I'm listening to the stream until I get the artbook, listening to the live album though really wants me to get watch along with the performance.
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Offline Madman Shepherd

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Re: Distant Memories - New live release
« Reply #666 on: November 28, 2020, 08:37:43 PM »
Scenes remains a magical album and The Spirit Carries On is probably DT’s finest achievement.  We all have our favourites (mine is Learning To Live) but I can’t imagine anyone listening to TSCO and not enjoying it to some degree. It’s their most successful melodic, accessible song attempt, pretty much perfection.

One of my least favorite DT songs.  :-X

I guess I don't hate it, and I do like that people enjoy it, but for my money a song like Along for the Ride is 100 times better.

Offline ytserush

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Re: Distant Memories - New live release
« Reply #667 on: November 28, 2020, 08:41:49 PM »
Had the album been embraced by the fanbase, they would have easily done it. However, it was very polarizing. Why put the money into recording a live version of an album that a lot of fans didn't care for?

If you believe in something that strongly, you have the conviction to see it through and not cave to fan pressure. They were all in until about midway through that tour and then they caved and fell back on Images and Words 25. Not to make this about Portnoy because he absolutely has nothing to do with it, but he would have fought for it. It was even better live musically.

But there are times when it is necessary to admit defeat.

They tried. They did the record, the tour, many fans hated it.

I think it is unfair to blame them for not insisting anymore.

I disagree with that. With the amount of effort that went into it, to pull the plug on it like that kind of leaves a bad taste. If it was earlier in their career, maybe I might feel differently, but the band wasn't going to break up because of it in 2016. I think they kind of took the easy way out with it but that's just me.

Offline Herrick

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Re: Distant Memories - New live release
« Reply #668 on: November 28, 2020, 09:27:23 PM »
Had the album been embraced by the fanbase, they would have easily done it. However, it was very polarizing. Why put the money into recording a live version of an album that a lot of fans didn't care for?

If you believe in something that strongly, you have the conviction to see it through and not cave to fan pressure. They were all in until about midway through that tour and then they caved and fell back on Images and Words 25. Not to make this about Portnoy because he absolutely has nothing to do with it, but he would have fought for it. It was even better live musically.

But there are times when it is necessary to admit defeat.

They tried. They did the record, the tour, many fans hated it.

I think it is unfair to blame them for not insisting anymore.

I disagree with that. With the amount of effort that went into it, to pull the plug on it like that kind of leaves a bad taste. If it was earlier in their career, maybe I might feel differently, but the band wasn't going to break up because of it in 2016. I think they kind of took the easy way out with it but that's just me.

Bosk already made an insightful post as to why they didn't record a live DVD but as far as the band abandoning The Astonishing...is there any official or non-official word that they dropped The Astonishing in the middle of the tour? Were they planning on playing the entire album throughout 2016 & 2017?

The Astonishing is a looooong album. It's a lot for the band (and the fans who weren't into it) to endure something of that magnitude for an entire year + however many months of live shows.

DT seem to be well off financially but they're not Metallica. If The Astonishing tour wasn't doing as well as their normal tours, I couldn't fault them for going back to what works.
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Offline Siddhartha

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Re: Distant Memories - New live release
« Reply #669 on: November 29, 2020, 01:45:16 AM »
Watched the whole thing yesterday with my girlfriend, and the Blue Ray is just great.

My only complain about the production is that I would have loved more John Myung camera time. About the performance, I don't like them playing to a click track.

Apart from these things, the rest is simply spectacular. It is not one of those videos that change the camara angle each 0,5 seconds. Here you can really see what's going on. They filmed the concert beautifully. And the band sounds great. In the Presence of Enemies, A Night to Remember and At Wits End are glorious highlights.

Very very happy with the release.

Offline erwinrafael

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Re: Distant Memories - New live release
« Reply #670 on: November 29, 2020, 06:24:48 AM »
If the band never said publicly that they play to a click, would people even notice?

Offline ReaperKK

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Re: Distant Memories - New live release
« Reply #671 on: November 29, 2020, 06:39:10 AM »
I think so. People complained that MP would speed up songs live but I think that's part of the fun and energy of being in a live environment.

Offline hunnus2000

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Re: Distant Memories - New live release
« Reply #672 on: November 29, 2020, 09:17:07 AM »
I recently saw a video of MM explaining why the band uses a click. Apparently, the reason they use a click (and I'm sure some of you already know this) is because of the video, lighting and audio effects need to be intricately timed. Any change in tempo could compromise the presentation so I don't have any issue with this. I do however find it amusing that MP would encourage players to use a click in his drum videos but would be the one to lose the tempo.

Offline Siddhartha

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Re: Distant Memories - New live release
« Reply #673 on: November 29, 2020, 10:13:29 AM »
Of course people will notice even without saying. A performance to a click track is way different than without one. It's way less organic and rigid. It's closer to an album.

Also there isn't even necesary to have a developed musical ear to notice, there are a lot of tells. The triggered voice choirs perfectly on time, the lack of need for the players to change effects or patches to change the sounds of guitars and keyboard, the right tempo matching with the video art on the screen...

Offline Siddhartha

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Re: Distant Memories - New live release
« Reply #674 on: November 29, 2020, 10:22:56 AM »
I do however find it amusing that MP would encourage players to use a click in his drum videos but would be the one to lose the tempo.

I don't know the exact quote you mention, but maybe he was talking about spending some of your practice time playing to a click, which would be good advice.

Live situations I think should be different. If you speed up or slow down it may be that you are not loosing your tempo, but reacting to the room and the audience energy.  Making it more organic, making it live.

To me that's more interesting than having a great video presentation to go with the show.

But once you start doing it, I would think it might be difficult to go back, because of the convenience. It's more lazy, but for sure it's nice to have all your effects and patches programed to enter at the right time and not have to think of that.

Online MirrorMask

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Re: Distant Memories - New live release
« Reply #675 on: November 29, 2020, 10:27:22 AM »
While on one hand the click track surely helps, it's also a train that can't be stopped. Once it starts, it starts. Without a click you can come back from any screwup or unforeseen incident on stage, with a click track you have to go through it no matter what.
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Offline hunnus2000

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Re: Distant Memories - New live release
« Reply #676 on: November 29, 2020, 10:58:57 AM »
I do however find it amusing that MP would encourage players to use a click in his drum videos but would be the one to lose the tempo.

I don't know the exact quote you mention, but maybe he was talking about spending some of your practice time playing to a click, which would be good advice.

Live situations I think should be different. If you speed up or slow down it may be that you are not loosing your tempo, but reacting to the room and the audience energy.  Making it more organic, making it live.

To me that's more interesting than having a great video presentation to go with the show.

But once you start doing it, I would think it might be difficult to go back, because of the convenience. It's more lazy, but for sure it's nice to have all your effects and patches programed to enter at the right time and not have to think of that.

It was during one of his drum tutorials and he was showing how to play the kick drums to one of their songs and I completely agree with you, it's a good idea for any musician to use a click whilst practicing.

As far as DT's use of a click, yeah you would have to scale back the production but the precision of the musical parts would indeed make it challenging. I wonder if they would need to go back to floor monitors if they did this.

Offline Ben_Jamin

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Re: Distant Memories - New live release
« Reply #677 on: November 29, 2020, 11:22:20 AM »
Of course people will notice even without saying. A performance to a click track is way different than without one. It's way less organic and rigid. It's closer to an album.

Also there isn't even necesary to have a developed musical ear to notice, there are a lot of tells. The triggered voice choirs perfectly on time, the lack of need for the players to change effects or patches to change the sounds of guitars and keyboard, the right tempo matching with the video art on the screen...

You mean every Symphonic Metal Band.  :lol :lol


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Offline Setlist Scotty

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Re: Distant Memories - New live release
« Reply #678 on: November 29, 2020, 11:27:50 AM »
Bosk already made an insightful post as to why they didn't record a live DVD but as far as the band abandoning The Astonishing...is there any official or non-official word that they dropped The Astonishing in the middle of the tour? Were they planning on playing the entire album throughout 2016 & 2017?
They were gonna play it through the end of 2016, but there was never any promise of them continuing the tour in 2017. I'd honestly be surprised for them to do that anyway, given that they had been playing it throughout all of 2016. That said, they did cave  to a degree towards the end of the last leg of the tour. At that point, they dropped 5 songs from TA and added a 3 song encore of AIA, TSCO and PMU.
 
 
I recently saw a video of MM explaining why the band uses a click. Apparently, the reason they use a click (and I'm sure some of you already know this) is because of the video, lighting and audio effects need to be intricately timed. Any change in tempo could compromise the presentation so I don't have any issue with this.
That's the reason they say, but to be honest, I think it's a bit of a cop out. MM strikes me as being far more naturally disciplined than MP when it comes to drumming, and I imagine that there is little to no need for a click at all. Never mind the mantra that JP follows: What would Rush do? Rush almost *never* used a click track live. Neil says that he only used it sparingly, primarily on the Clockwork Angels tour to help with the string section that was on tour with them. Otherwise, he preferred to avoid the click. And yet, look at how intricate Rush's shows were when it came to lights, video and audio effects. So a click is not needed.
 
 
I do however find it amusing that MP would encourage players to use a click in his drum videos but would be the one to lose the tempo.
As Siddhartha said, it probably depends on the context of what you're quoting. And it makes sense that he would encourage others to use a click during practice. MP himself even used a click when in the studio recording each album. But he never used one live because that's a different setting.
 
 
I think so. People complained that MP would speed up songs live but I think that's part of the fun and energy of being in a live environment.
A performance to a click track is way different than without one. It's way less organic and rigid. It's closer to an album.
Agree with both these posts.
 
 
As far as DT's use of a click, yeah you would have to scale back the production but the precision of the musical parts would indeed make it challenging.
No they wouldn't. Rush proves it's not necessary. It might require the guys themselves to trigger some things as Rush did, and for their lighting/video guys to stay on top of things instead of simply hitting a button to start a certain light or video sequence (again, as Rush did), but it's entirely possible, more live and organic, which is what live performance is all about.
 
 
I wonder if they would need to go back to floor monitors if they did this.
Why? What does that have to do with this discussion?
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Offline hunnus2000

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Re: Distant Memories - New live release
« Reply #679 on: November 29, 2020, 11:45:02 AM »

 
I wonder if they would need to go back to floor monitors if they did this.
Why? What does that have to do with this discussion?

In ear monitors is why I mention this. Each member has a different mix in their ears and I just wonder if that mix would impede their performance. Probably not but I was just curious for the sake of discussion.

Offline KevShmev

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Re: Distant Memories - New live release
« Reply #680 on: November 29, 2020, 11:50:30 AM »
Outside of the Clockwork Angels tour, I believe Red Sector A was the only song Rush played to a click live, which is why you saw Neil Peart wearing headphones for that song only (I know he did in the GUP tour and A Show of Hands concert videos, cannot recall for the later ones).

With all due respect to DT, I don't think they are on Rush's level when it comes to their ability to play an entire concert and also remember the many cues they had to trigger on stage in real time.  The fact that Rush was always able to pull that off while rarely playing to a click was insane.  Rush could have a train wreck like Alex's guitar not working correctly at the Boston show (still no guitar!) and still keep the lighting and triggered music in synch until it was fixed because they were triggering it all in real time and keeping it on schedule with what they were playing at any exact moment.  A band playing to a click would have had to shut it down and start the song all over.

Offline hunnus2000

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Re: Distant Memories - New live release
« Reply #681 on: November 29, 2020, 11:57:22 AM »
Outside of the Clockwork Angels tour, I believe Red Sector A was the only song Rush played to a click live, which is why you saw Neil Peart wearing headphones for that song only (I know he did in the GUP tour and A Show of Hands concert videos, cannot recall for the later ones).

With all due respect to DT, I don't think they are on Rush's level when it comes to their ability to play an entire concert and also remember the many cues they had to trigger on stage in real time.  The fact that Rush was always able to pull that off while rarely playing to a click was insane.  Rush could have a train wreck like Alex's guitar not working correctly at the Boston show (still no guitar!) and still keep the lighting and triggered music in synch until it was fixed because they were triggering it all in real time and keeping it on schedule with what they were playing at any exact moment.  A band playing to a click would have had to shut it down and start the song all over.

If my recall is anything (and there is no guarantee of that) The Weapon was the other. I remember that Neil shuttered at the idea of playing "disco". as he wrote in one of the tour booklets. 

Offline Skeever

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Re: Distant Memories - New live release
« Reply #682 on: November 29, 2020, 12:09:09 PM »
Honestly? Better than I thought.

It's really too bad how heavy the setlist is with seeing stuff because we already have plenty of representation of that live, including ones that I already find to be pretty definitive. But I really like how much life is breathed into the black clouds and systematic chaos selections, as well as the new stuff which sounded great already. If there were more selections from those albums on here, I would probably go ahead and buy this.

Are we ever going to get a live version of the Count of Tusacany?

Offline KevShmev

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Re: Distant Memories - New live release
« Reply #683 on: November 29, 2020, 12:12:42 PM »

If my recall is anything (and there is no guarantee of that) The Weapon was the other. I remember that Neil shuttered at the idea of playing "disco". as he wrote in one of the tour booklets.

That might be correct, as I seem to recall Neil wearing the headphones on The Weapon as well on the GUP tour video. Sadly, I never got to see them play that live (since it was dropped from the set lists forever by the mid 80's). :( :(

Offline Ben_Jamin

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Re: Distant Memories - New live release
« Reply #684 on: November 29, 2020, 12:15:31 PM »
Here's a good video on Click Tracks from Nick D'Virgilio

https://youtu.be/jrbcVRTT7V0?t=58
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Offline Architeuthis

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Re: Distant Memories - New live release
« Reply #685 on: November 29, 2020, 12:28:58 PM »
Honestly? Better than I thought.



Are we ever going to get a live version of the Count of Tusacany?
I would love to see that!  :tup   I could imagine a spectacular light show during the slow section when JP is doing the volume swells.
I would also like to get a full version of Octavarium.  The one on Score fell short, as I found the orchestra very distracting. I hated how they went into split screens during the Razors edge solo and the antique white guitar just doesn't fit the vibe of that solo for some reason. lol
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Offline Ben_Jamin

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Re: Distant Memories - New live release
« Reply #686 on: November 29, 2020, 12:38:01 PM »
Honestly? Better than I thought.



Are we ever going to get a live version of the Count of Tusacany?
I would love to see that!  :tup   I could imagine a spectacular light show during the slow section when JP is doing the volume swells.
I would also like to get a full version of Octavarium.  The one on Score fell short, as I found the orchestra very distracting. I hated how they went into split screens during the Razors edge solo and the antique white guitar just doesn't fit the vibe of that solo for some reason. lol

The Orchestra in Score is an overall distraction for me. I can't listen to Vacant at all. I actually forgot that it's on that album.  :lol  It was a good idea, that wasn't executed quite well. The orchestra needed more rehearsal time. 
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Offline TheOutlawXanadu

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Re: Distant Memories - New live release
« Reply #687 on: November 29, 2020, 01:11:50 PM »
I watched a few of the songs last night, and overall, I think that Distant Memories is a great package. I found the mix and overall sound of the concert to be excellent. And Petrucci's guitar tone is just... OMG.

I still can't get over so many people sitting in the crowd though. Such a weird thing to see at a metal concert. :lol
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Offline MinistroRaven

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Re: Distant Memories - New live release
« Reply #688 on: November 29, 2020, 01:14:44 PM »
FANTASTIC REVIEW BY BERNARD ROMERO: https://lotsofmuzik.com/dream-theater-distant-memories-live-in-london/

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I watched the concert again and re read this, Beranrd's review is soooo on point!

Offline Setlist Scotty

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Re: Distant Memories - New live release
« Reply #689 on: November 29, 2020, 01:31:58 PM »
With all due respect to DT, I don't think they are on Rush's level when it comes to their ability to play an entire concert and also remember the many cues they had to trigger on stage in real time.
Really? I would think just the opposite. You've got 5 guys verses 3. JR already does so much with his keyboards and has notes on an iPad to keep everything straight. Having a note to hit a specific key at a certain time wouldn't be much to add for the wizard. JL could easily trigger backing vocals since he knows when the chorus is coming and he is already doing the singing. MM is just as capable (if not more so) than Neil to hit an electronic drum pad to cue up certain sound effects. And both JP and JM are extremely on point with everything they do, so I fail to see how they would botch up triggering some cues with their feet.

Don't forget that we're just talking about audio cues. Of course, they could have one of the crew members do it to, just as they could with lighting and video which would obviously be overseen by crew members.
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Offline Progmetty

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Re: Distant Memories - New live release
« Reply #690 on: November 29, 2020, 03:21:07 PM »
Just to be clear here, by "click track" you guys are referring to a mere Metronome, right?
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Offline fadetoblackdude7

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Re: Distant Memories - New live release
« Reply #691 on: November 29, 2020, 03:32:04 PM »
I just watched the entire Blu Ray and it is spectacular! It is a great representation of the tour and Scenes really does resonate well live! The cinematography is lush and there are some great shots and angles - it really does feel like you’re there. It’s obvious that they touched up James’ performance but that’s alright. I also forgot how awesome the video intro to Scenes was, with them introducing the characters 👍 Nightmare and Presence sound massive, and it kicks ass!

My only problem with it was lack of energy from the crowd, but that’s not DT’s fault. Oh well.

Offline PetFish

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Re: Distant Memories - New live release
« Reply #692 on: November 29, 2020, 05:40:08 PM »
Where am I supposed to buy the Blu-Ray?

Amazon is sold out and links from dt.net are just for streaming audio.

https://www.lasercd.com/cd/distant-memories-live-london-3cd2-blu-ray

Spanks very much.

Offline hunnus2000

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Re: Distant Memories - New live release
« Reply #693 on: November 30, 2020, 07:49:10 AM »
Just to be clear here, by "click track" you guys are referring to a mere Metronome, right?

Correct. Digital of course....

Offline Kilgore Trout

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Re: Distant Memories - New live release
« Reply #694 on: November 30, 2020, 08:34:51 AM »
Just to be clear here, by "click track" you guys are referring to a mere Metronome, right?
With the difference that a metronome sticks to one tempo, while a click track follows the tempo changes of a song, if it has any.

Offline Ben_Jamin

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Re: Distant Memories - New live release
« Reply #695 on: November 30, 2020, 11:54:26 AM »
Just to be clear here, by "click track" you guys are referring to a mere Metronome, right?

Correct. Digital of course....

Just to be clear here, by "click track" you guys are referring to a mere Metronome, right?
With the difference that a metronome sticks to one tempo, while a click track follows the tempo changes of a song, if it has any.

Did you guys watch that vid I posted?

It really helps explain exactly what Click Tracks are and how they are used live. It explains how Dream Theater possibly uses them.
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Offline noxon

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Re: Distant Memories - New live release
« Reply #696 on: November 30, 2020, 02:43:59 PM »
Could they play it live without pre-programming everything? Of course. But why would they? It's kinda like some people in their cars - I know how to drive stick, but on the highway I'd rather drive with the automatic, and preferably with the line keeper and adaptive cruise control engaged. Is it because I don't know how to drive without those tools? Of course not, but by using those tools it helps me focus on the stuff I should be focused on - the traffic.

By making a show run through a tool like ProTools, the benefit is everything is already pre programmed - there is no need to worry about pressing the right button to trigger whatever video or backing track or whatever - and when you're doing 100 shows a year this is removal of one potential headache. They want to deliver a specific show.

Offline Max Kuehnau

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Re: Distant Memories - New live release
« Reply #697 on: November 30, 2020, 02:45:22 PM »
Could they play it live without pre-programming everything? Of course. But why would they? It's kinda like some people in their cars - I know how to drive stick, but on the highway I'd rather drive with the automatic, and preferably with the line keeper and adaptive cruise control engaged. Is it because I don't know how to drive without those tools? Of course not, but by using those tools it helps me focus on the stuff I should be focused on - the traffic.

By making a show run through a tool like ProTools, the benefit is everything is already pre programmed - there is no need to worry about pressing the right button to trigger whatever video or backing track or whatever - and when you're doing 100 shows a year this is removal of one potential headache. They want to deliver a specific show.
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Offline hefdaddy42

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Re: Distant Memories - New live release
« Reply #698 on: November 30, 2020, 03:21:42 PM »
By making a show run through a tool like ProTools, the benefit is everything is already pre programmed - there is no need to worry about pressing the right button to trigger whatever video or backing track or whatever - and when you're doing 100 shows a year this is removal of one potential headache. They want to deliver a specific show.
This is my only misgiving about post-Portnoy DT.

They don't do 100 shows.  They do 1 show 100 times.  There is no difference from night to night, it's all the same.  No unique performances, no extended solos, no live magic.  The show I get in Raleigh is EXACTLY the show that people get in NYC or Chicago, down to to the runtime. 

Still very impressive, and I love to see it, but I would much prefer to see them ditch the backing tracks and click. 
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Offline cramx3

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Re: Distant Memories - New live release
« Reply #699 on: November 30, 2020, 03:24:43 PM »
By making a show run through a tool like ProTools, the benefit is everything is already pre programmed - there is no need to worry about pressing the right button to trigger whatever video or backing track or whatever - and when you're doing 100 shows a year this is removal of one potential headache. They want to deliver a specific show.
This is my only misgiving about post-Portnoy DT.

They don't do 100 shows.  They do 1 show 100 times.  There is no difference from night to night, it's all the same.  No unique performances, no extended solos, no live magic.  The show I get in Raleigh is EXACTLY the show that people get in NYC or Chicago, down to to the runtime. 

Still very impressive, and I love to see it, but I would much prefer to see them ditch the backing tracks and click.

Well said.