Author Topic: Rolitics in music  (Read 7335 times)

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Offline Mladen

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Re: Portnoy is NOT coming back
« Reply #35 on: August 15, 2020, 09:12:17 AM »
We should rename the thread to "Rolitics in music" and move it do general music discussion. YtseJam had no idea what he would unleash upon us.  :lol

It's still a more interesting discussion than "Portn0i bacc in Dream Theatre!", though.

Offline Orbert

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Re: Portnoy is NOT coming back
« Reply #36 on: August 15, 2020, 09:25:51 AM »
Everybody uses social media differently, and everybody has different political beliefs, and everyone has different degrees to which they like to share their political beliefs on social media.  Celebrities are no different.

Mostly, I don't pay a lot of attention to what celebrities do or say politically.  If they're musicians, I care about their music; if they're actors, I care about their movies or television work.  What I've noticed is that if they're in the public eye for doing or saying something I agree with, I think to myself "that's cool" and move on without giving it another thought.  When they do something I don't agree with, I sometimes think "I wish they'd keep their politics to themselves."  I don't actually care that much, but it sticks out more if it's something you disagree with.

Like if George Clooney is in the news for helping starving children in Africa (or was that Brad Pitt?), I think "Cool, use your celebrity status to shine some light on something."  If Ted Nugent plays at an NRA benefit for a bunch of Trumpers wearing MAGA hats and starts blabbing into the microphone, I think "Shut the fuck up, Ted.  Stick to playing guitar."
« Last Edit: August 15, 2020, 10:50:57 AM by Orbert »

Offline Kotowboy

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Re: Portnoy is NOT coming back
« Reply #37 on: August 15, 2020, 09:32:05 AM »
Anyone who supports trump needs to fuck off anyway.

Offline Ben_Jamin

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Re: Portnoy is NOT coming back
« Reply #38 on: August 15, 2020, 10:03:51 AM »
All I know is - If i was in a successful band and my career was going just great -

- I would ONLY talk about music. Even if you genuinely believe what you are saying RE : Religion or Politics - It just has too much potential

to blow up in your face.

Well, they're people and should be treated as people. He knows it was going to blow up, yet he did it anyways because he has a voice and can say it on HIS page. Why follow a person just to bash them, that behavior is mental.
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Offline hunnus2000

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Re: Portnoy is NOT coming back
« Reply #39 on: August 15, 2020, 10:06:29 AM »
So what did MP say that's so controversial? I'm sincerely asking - I really don't know.

Offline MirrorMask

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Re: Portnoy is NOT coming back
« Reply #40 on: August 15, 2020, 10:20:38 AM »
So what did MP say that's so controversial? I'm sincerely asking - I really don't know.

After talking always about music - and after maybe having hinted as such not so long ago - he made ONE post, prefacing that he knew that it's a thorny issue when musicians talk politics and that it could cost him some fans, that he supported Biden for future USA president since he doesn't personally or politically likes Trump.

That's it, basically, he did it with longer words but all he said, between posts only about music, was "I know it's controversial and I might lose some fans for talking politics, but I support Biden 'cause I don't like Trump".
« Last Edit: August 15, 2020, 03:27:09 PM by MirrorMask »
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Offline Kotowboy

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Re: Portnoy is NOT coming back
« Reply #41 on: August 15, 2020, 01:07:52 PM »
It SHOULD be more controversial if he DID support Trump.

Anyone that supports Trump is a confirmed racist sexist homophobic xenophobic piece of shit.

Offline hunnus2000

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Re: Portnoy is NOT coming back
« Reply #42 on: August 15, 2020, 01:40:56 PM »
So what did MP say that's so controversial? I'm sincerely asking - I really don't know.

After talking always about music - and after maybe having hinted as such not so long ago - he made ONE post, prefacing that he knew that it's a thorny issue when musicians talk politics and that it could cost him so fan, that he supported Biden for future USA president since he doesn't personally or politically likes Trump.

That's it, basically, he did it with longer words but all he said, between posts only about music, was "I know it's controversial and I might lose some fans for talking politics, but I support Biden 'cause I don't like Trump".

That's it? Pho reel?

So back to my original question - what was so controversial about that comment that would trigger some people (not you) by his statement and state that he should shut his pie hole? I would say man up and don't be such a snowflake........

Offline Dream Team

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Re: Portnoy is NOT coming back
« Reply #43 on: August 15, 2020, 02:33:28 PM »
It SHOULD be more controversial if he DID support Trump.

Anyone that supports Trump is a confirmed racist sexist homophobic xenophobic piece of shit.

This shit is totally inappropriate for the non-P/R forum.

Offline LudwigVan

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Re: Portnoy is NOT coming back
« Reply #44 on: August 15, 2020, 03:33:09 PM »
It wouldn’t be appropriate in the P/R forum either.
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Offline hunnus2000

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Re: Portnoy is NOT coming back
« Reply #45 on: August 15, 2020, 04:52:45 PM »
It may be inappropriate - but it's entirely true!  ;D

Offline MinistroRaven

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Re: Portnoy is NOT coming back
« Reply #46 on: August 15, 2020, 05:46:17 PM »
We should rename the thread to "Rolitics in music" and move it do general music discussion. YtseJam had no idea what he would unleash upon us.  :lol

It's still a more interesting discussion than "Portn0i bacc in Dream Theatre!", though.

Done

Offline hefdaddy42

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Re: Portnoy is NOT coming back
« Reply #47 on: August 15, 2020, 06:23:44 PM »
It SHOULD be more controversial if he DID support Trump.

Anyone that supports Trump is a confirmed racist sexist homophobic xenophobic piece of shit.
FFS Kotowboy. That is quite enough of that.

In this thread you can talk about various things, but not politics - there is a whole subforum for that. And you CERTAINLY don't need to be making such ignorant sweeping statements as that.
Hef is right on all things. Except for when I disagree with him. In which case he's probably still right.

Offline Madman Shepherd

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Re: Rolitics in music
« Reply #48 on: August 15, 2020, 07:18:36 PM »
The vast majority of people who hate politics in music also happen to love Ted Nugent and Trapt, thus confirming they actually just dont like politics in music when its stuff they disagree with.

Kind of like people who just hate the media but just happen to love multiple media outlets that dominate the airwaves.

Of course, this is purely anecdotal but I bet if there was a legit study I would be proven right.



And then those same people would blast studies and back up their claim with other studies.

Anyway....

Offline SystematicThought

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Re: Rolitics in music
« Reply #49 on: August 15, 2020, 08:23:23 PM »
I think that’s usually true for both sides of the political spectrum. If an artist supports what you support, you look down on those who don’t agree and don’t like it, and don’t like when an artist voice supports for something you don’t agree with.

Just speaking from experience. My dad hates Bruce Springsteen and won’t even give him credit for his songwriting ability and live performances because of his political views, but doesn’t have a problem with right leaning artists speaking out. Then you have people that hate Morissey because of his conservative views (on the left, I usually see people say there is something wrong with the artist mentally if they support the right)
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Offline Madman Shepherd

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Re: Rolitics in music
« Reply #50 on: August 15, 2020, 08:36:13 PM »
I guess my point is if someone has a problem with what somebody is saying, by all means, share your opinion that the other person's opinion is wrong. But if you hate what somebody says, it's pretty bad form to completely contradict yourself and say that NO musician should share their opinion and then be A-OK with musicians sharing their opinions that line up with yours. That just shows a degree of cognitive dissonance

I hate Pepsi but I don't go around saying I hate all Cola because I actually really like Coca-Cola. I just happen to hate Pepsi.

Offline SystematicThought

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Re: Rolitics in music
« Reply #51 on: August 15, 2020, 08:53:20 PM »
I agree with that 100%
God have mercy on a man
Who doubts what he's sure of.
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Offline Trav86

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Re: Rolitics in music
« Reply #52 on: August 16, 2020, 05:40:55 AM »
Since JP exclusively follows all the big names from Fox News, and right wing pundits, politicians and the Republican Party page on Twitter and Instagram, I would guess he supports Trump. And seeing as how in an interview back in 2016, the interviewer asked Mangini about the election and he said “thank God for Wikileaks” or something close to that. This was at the time when Wikileaks was putting out the Hillary Clinton emails. So, by that statement I would presume he was a Trump supporter.

My point is that you shouldn’t judge musicians, or anyone, by their political leanings. And don’t assume too much. Just enjoy the music and let people be themselves.
« Last Edit: August 16, 2020, 05:51:06 AM by Trav86 »
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Offline hunnus2000

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Re: Portnoy is NOT coming back
« Reply #53 on: August 16, 2020, 08:21:16 AM »
All I know is - If i was in a successful band and my career was going just great -

- I would ONLY talk about music. Even if you genuinely believe what you are saying RE : Religion or Politics - It just has too much potential

to blow up in your face.

BTW - I completely agree! There are plenty of examples of entertainers (actors/musicians) compromising their careers because of a statement or divulging their political views. It does nothing but alienate the fans.

That said - I recognize that everyone has a right to an opinion even if I don't like the message.

Offline Kotowboy

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Re: Rolitics in music
« Reply #54 on: August 16, 2020, 11:36:37 AM »
Yeah it's like well respected actors or musicians with great careers - out of the blue - just say potentially inflammatory / offensive things. . .

Just say No Comment.

Offline ZirconBlue

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Re: Rolitics in music
« Reply #55 on: August 18, 2020, 10:44:40 AM »


MP's Facebook post:

With a few exceptions in the past, I generally try to avoid posting about politics as it usually sparks heated debates and can sometimes even result in losing some fans...but I’ve recently decided to no longer silence my disdain for Trump as I find him a truly despicable human being and a danger to our country’s intergrity and democracy (see my Gimme Some Truth video https://youtu.be/AOzgIs9pT1A)
So with that, I feel it’s OK for me to share my support for Joe Biden and am very excited by his pick for VP running mate w Kamala Harris 👏
I personally was hoping it would be her as I think she really strengthens the ticket and will help also strengthen some of Biden’s weaknesses that some people have concerns over...
This is probably the most important election in US history, so get out and VOTE! #BidenHarris2020 #ByeDon #PleaseMakeAmericaGreatAgain
(and please keep the discussions and comments here civil!!!! 🙏)

Offline Orbert

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Re: Rolitics in music
« Reply #56 on: August 18, 2020, 10:49:28 AM »
Yeah it's like well respected actors or musicians with great careers - out of the blue - just say potentially inflammatory / offensive things. . .

Just say No Comment.

I just don't understand that mentality.  Everyone has their opinions, and everyone has the right to express them.  Celebrities are no different.  What, just because you become famous, you're not allowed to express your opinion anymore?  Obviously these people don't care what effect it may or may not have on their celebrity status, so why does it bother you so much?

Offline hunnus2000

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Re: Rolitics in music
« Reply #57 on: August 18, 2020, 11:16:46 AM »


MP's Facebook post:

With a few exceptions in the past, I generally try to avoid posting about politics as it usually sparks heated debates and can sometimes even result in losing some fans...but I’ve recently decided to no longer silence my disdain for Trump as I find him a truly despicable human being and a danger to our country’s intergrity and democracy (see my Gimme Some Truth video https://youtu.be/AOzgIs9pT1A)
So with that, I feel it’s OK for me to share my support for Joe Biden and am very excited by his pick for VP running mate w Kamala Harris 👏
I personally was hoping it would be her as I think she really strengthens the ticket and will help also strengthen some of Biden’s weaknesses that some people have concerns over...
This is probably the most important election in US history, so get out and VOTE! #BidenHarris2020 #ByeDon #PleaseMakeAmericaGreatAgain
(and please keep the discussions and comments here civil!!!! 🙏)

I couldn't agree with him more!

Offline MirrorMask

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Re: Rolitics in music
« Reply #58 on: August 18, 2020, 11:58:37 AM »
For the record, Mike has made posts about music (or DT / DT members) way more controversial than that one about his support for Biden  :D
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Offline Ben_Jamin

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Re: Rolitics in music
« Reply #59 on: August 18, 2020, 03:49:40 PM »
Yeah it's like well respected actors or musicians with great careers - out of the blue - just say potentially inflammatory / offensive things. . .

Just say No Comment.

I just don't understand that mentality.  Everyone has their opinions, and everyone has the right to express them.  Celebrities are no different.  What, just because you become famous, you're not allowed to express your opinion anymore?  Obviously these people don't care what effect it may or may not have on their celebrity status, so why does it bother you so much?

It shows how mental people get when Idolizing. Losing all sense of humanity with celebrities that they get treated as Gods that can do no wrong.  Which leads to what happened with MP having to block some obsessive fans. Social Media is full of these people who go to great lengths just to talk some pretty obscene stuff (It's down right just hurtful, slander).


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Offline Orbert

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Re: Rolitics in music
« Reply #60 on: August 18, 2020, 04:08:28 PM »
I guess.  Like I said, I tend not to notice if it's something I agree with, and it sticks out a bit more if it's something I don't agree with, but mostly I just don't care.  But I know that there are people at the other end of the spectrum.  People destroying their Michael Jackson albums when certain allegations came up in the media.  People blacklisting The Dixie Chicks after Natalie Maines shot her mouth off about something.  Hey, if it makes them feel better, fine.  If it was something I really felt strongly about, I probably wouldn't buy any more of their music, especially nowadays when there are so many other options, but I'm not going to destroy what I already have.

It seems to me that celebrities are just easier targets for people who want to stir up shit in the first place.  They know that x million people follow them, so if they post something "clever" then it will be read by all those people, and some people just can't resist an audience.  Going on someone's Twitter or Facebook page and starting shit seems like one of the more advanced cases of people in need of a life.

Offline darkshade

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Re: Rolitics in music
« Reply #61 on: August 18, 2020, 05:41:24 PM »
Not a supporter of Trump, but if Portland and Minneapolis are what to expect if the Democrats win the White House and win back the Senate, the days of getting rid of Trump amidst a pandemic, will seem like the good ol days in comparison. You can't put the genie of social unrest, rioting, looting, and mass murder in the streets, back in the magic lamp, just because you won an election.

Offline ZirconBlue

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Re: Rolitics in music
« Reply #62 on: August 19, 2020, 03:44:05 PM »


Not a supporter of Trump, but if Portland and Minneapolis are what to expect if the Democrats win the White House and win back the Senate, the days of getting rid of Trump amidst a pandemic, will seem like the good ol days in comparison. You can't put the genie of social unrest, rioting, looting, and mass murder in the streets, back in the magic lamp, just because you won an election.



You're using an example of what is actually happening under Trump as what will happen under a different administration?!

Offline darkshade

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Re: Rolitics in music
« Reply #63 on: August 19, 2020, 04:28:16 PM »


Not a supporter of Trump, but if Portland and Minneapolis are what to expect if the Democrats win the White House and win back the Senate, the days of getting rid of Trump amidst a pandemic, will seem like the good ol days in comparison. You can't put the genie of social unrest, rioting, looting, and mass murder in the streets, back in the magic lamp, just because you won an election.


You're using an example of what is actually happening under Trump as what will happen under a different administration?!

What is happening? I don't follow the weekly broadcast news narratives and social media hysteria of the day.
I already stated that Democrats winning a couple of elections in 80 days isn't going to make everything go away, in fact, based on their actions (or in-action) in NYC, Chicago, Minneapolis, Portland, and Seattle this year, among other cities, as well as all of California and New Jersey, New York, it is entirely possible they turn the US into nationwide Portland and NYC currently. If they magically make everything better, or the news media downplays their coverage of coronavirus as well as the peaceful protests, then this whole year has been a coup attempt to remove the President because they couldn't get him on Russian collusion or properly impeach him over something their current nominee for President actually did as VP and admitted to on camera. It's very obvious.

Offline Trav86

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Re: Rolitics in music
« Reply #64 on: August 19, 2020, 06:02:29 PM »


Not a supporter of Trump, but if Portland and Minneapolis are what to expect if the Democrats win the White House and win back the Senate, the days of getting rid of Trump amidst a pandemic, will seem like the good ol days in comparison. You can't put the genie of social unrest, rioting, looting, and mass murder in the streets, back in the magic lamp, just because you won an election.


You're using an example of what is actually happening under Trump as what will happen under a different administration?!

What is happening? I don't follow the weekly broadcast news narratives and social media hysteria of the day.
I already stated that Democrats winning a couple of elections in 80 days isn't going to make everything go away, in fact, based on their actions (or in-action) in NYC, Chicago, Minneapolis, Portland, and Seattle this year, among other cities, as well as all of California and New Jersey, New York, it is entirely possible they turn the US into nationwide Portland and NYC currently. If they magically make everything better, or the news media downplays their coverage of coronavirus as well as the peaceful protests, then this whole year has been a coup attempt to remove the President because they couldn't get him on Russian collusion or properly impeach him over something their current nominee for President actually did as VP and admitted to on camera. It's very obvious.

For someone who says that they’re not a supporter of Trump...
Can't we find the minds
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Offline darkshade

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Re: Rolitics in music
« Reply #65 on: August 20, 2020, 05:07:52 AM »


Not a supporter of Trump, but if Portland and Minneapolis are what to expect if the Democrats win the White House and win back the Senate, the days of getting rid of Trump amidst a pandemic, will seem like the good ol days in comparison. You can't put the genie of social unrest, rioting, looting, and mass murder in the streets, back in the magic lamp, just because you won an election.


You're using an example of what is actually happening under Trump as what will happen under a different administration?!

What is happening? I don't follow the weekly broadcast news narratives and social media hysteria of the day.
I already stated that Democrats winning a couple of elections in 80 days isn't going to make everything go away, in fact, based on their actions (or in-action) in NYC, Chicago, Minneapolis, Portland, and Seattle this year, among other cities, as well as all of California and New Jersey, New York, it is entirely possible they turn the US into nationwide Portland and NYC currently. If they magically make everything better, or the news media downplays their coverage of coronavirus as well as the peaceful protests, then this whole year has been a coup attempt to remove the President because they couldn't get him on Russian collusion or properly impeach him over something their current nominee for President actually did as VP and admitted to on camera. It's very obvious.

For someone who says that they’re not a supporter of Trump...

Just calling a spade a spade.

Offline hefdaddy42

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Re: Rolitics in music
« Reply #66 on: August 20, 2020, 12:46:29 PM »
WE ARE NOT DISCUSSING POLITICS HERE.  THERE IS A WHOLE OTHER SUBFORUM FOR THAT.  KEEP IT THERE.
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Offline YtseJam

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Re: Portnoy is NOT coming back
« Reply #67 on: August 20, 2020, 06:08:04 PM »
Although I loved him in DT, I am glad he is not coming back. He seems to keep making a lot of odd choices in my opinion, including making political posts on social media. When will musicians learn to shut their holes about politics and religion? Anyway, I have a hard time seeing his vision and I'm more interested in seeing what is to come as Mangini is finally out of Portnoy's shadow.

I don’t understand this. Because he’s a musician, he doesn’t have the right to speak his opinion like everyone else does? He’s not using the platform of a musician (like shouting about it on stage) he’s using social media. Millions of people give their political and religious views on social media every day. He’s no different than us.

Or is it because he’s saying something that you don’t agree with?

Why do you assume it is something I don't agree with? I have never been a die hard on political parties. In fact, I fucking hate politics and I listen to bands like DT to escape from all of this bullshit that has torn our country to pieces. People hate each others guts without even knowing them like proven by that post kowtowboy made. All Portnoy did was lose fans and potential revenue over an unecessary social media post. I lose respect for musicians and actors when they preach their personal beliefs. That's not why we're your fans!

And yes they are very different than us. Are you insinuating you are of the same stature as Portnoy? Don't be ridiculous.

Offline Trav86

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Re: Portnoy is NOT coming back
« Reply #68 on: August 20, 2020, 06:36:48 PM »
Although I loved him in DT, I am glad he is not coming back. He seems to keep making a lot of odd choices in my opinion, including making political posts on social media. When will musicians learn to shut their holes about politics and religion? Anyway, I have a hard time seeing his vision and I'm more interested in seeing what is to come as Mangini is finally out of Portnoy's shadow.

I don’t understand this. Because he’s a musician, he doesn’t have the right to speak his opinion like everyone else does? He’s not using the platform of a musician (like shouting about it on stage) he’s using social media. Millions of people give their political and religious views on social media every day. He’s no different than us.

Or is it because he’s saying something that you don’t agree with?

Why do you assume it is something I don't agree with? I have never been a die hard on political parties. In fact, I fucking hate politics and I listen to bands like DT to escape from all of this bullshit that has torn our country to pieces. People hate each others guts without even knowing them like proven by that post kowtowboy made. All Portnoy did was lose fans and potential revenue over an unecessary social media post. I lose respect for musicians and actors when they preach their personal beliefs. That's not why we're your fans!

And yes they are very different than us. Are you insinuating you are of the same stature as Portnoy? Don't be ridiculous.

I didn’t assume anything. I asked if that was the reason.

You don’t have to follow him on social media if you don’t like what he says. You can just listen the music.

I’m not insinuating anything about my stature. Despite his stature, he can speak his mind all he wants. You’re the one with the problem, so it’s on you to be annoyed, offended or ignore. Saying they need to stay out of politics or not give their opinion because of their “stature” and you don’t like it, is bullshit.
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Offline cramx3

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Re: Rolitics in music
« Reply #69 on: August 20, 2020, 06:39:10 PM »
I think that MP being aware that his stance would lose fans is a good starting point to expressing your views. While I personally would rather my favorote artists just stay away from anything controversial, if they feel the need to say something and give reasons why (even if I don't agree) it's hard to just stop being interested in their art because of that. If MP now becomes a political activist, well then yea that changes my feelings but just expressing a feeling and explaining it and why doesn't really bother me.