The state of the forum?

[Skeever]

It would suck to see the forum go away. I don't post much anymore (I just don't care much about DT or prog in general anymore), but I've been posting here under this account and under a previous account for over a decade and there are still quite a few people I only know how to get ahold of here. I like forums and I do think forums still hold some advantages over discords and facebook groups.  If this place does close I just want to make sure I get invited to whatever legacy forum someone decides to launch. I suppose many of us still have registrations at fiveeightforums.com (which is thankfully a lot more mature and less toxic than it was even 5 years ago) but new registrations there have been closed for many years as the community has grown privately.

[wolfking]

The thought of this place not existing almost makes me cry, seriously.

Even though it doesn't seem to be the issue, I'd donate a lot of money to help keep it going if that's what it meant.

[emtee]

Honestly, when MP closed his forum down I was truly depressed. I spent so much time there. The truth was--it was an addiction. It turned out to be a positive for me as I converted the time I wasted there into productive time. I began writing. Hell, I was writing every day on his site anyway, why not start a novel? I just completed my 4th book and am outlining and researching for my 5th. Yes it would suck if this place were to shut down, but many of you might discover that it could become beneficial for you.

[wolfking]

Honestly, when MP closed his forum down I was truly depressed. I spent so much time there. The truth was--it was an addiction. It turned out to be a positive for me as I converted the time I wasted there into productive time. I began writing. Hell, I was writing every day on his site anyway, why not start a novel? I just completed my 4th book and am outlining and researching for my 5th. Yes it would suck if this place were to shut down, but many of you might discover that it could become beneficial for you.

Nah, it won't be, trust me.  Well done to you though.

[Cool Chris]

Novels that will be written by forum members when the board shuts down:

I Have Never Heard of That, and Other Things That Didn't Exist Prior to 1982, by TAC
The Comma, an Appreciation, by Stadler

[The Walrus]

Novels that will be written by forum members when the board shuts down:

I Have Never Heard of That, and Other Things That Didn't Exist Prior to 1982, by TAC
The Comma, an Appreciation, by Stadler

 

[Adami]

Novels that will be written by forum members when the board shuts down:

I Have Never Heard of That, and Other Things That Didn't Exist Prior to 1982, by TAC
The Comma, an Appreciation, by Stadler

A Rebuttal, of Stadler by Adami

[Northern Lion]

Novels that will be written by forum members when the board shuts down:

I Have Never Heard of That, and Other Things That Didn't Exist Prior to 1982, by TAC
The Comma, an Appreciation, by Stadler

 

I haven't been on this forum very long yet, but I can already say that I would miss it and everyone I am starting to get to know, if it were gone.

[noxon]

Yep, there aren't many good forums left, and let's face it, most FB group pages dedicated to a single group or artist kinda suck, a) because there is never a good way to organize it neatly like you can a normal forum like this one, and b) most admins/mods of those group pages have that stupid rule where you can only start topics that are about the artist to whom the page is dedicated (with rare exceptions).  Imagine this forum being one where we could only have threads about Dream Theater 99% of the time. That is what most group FB pages are like, and is a big reason why most are a waste of time as those pages just became ejaculation sessions to the artist rather than a page with real discussions.

While this is to a certain extent true, you also have to consider this;
Old style forums were really "the entire social network" of its time, so when you compare you have to compare groups or subreddits to subforums, not the entire forum. So a band specific subreddit or group on facebook (say, my Dream Theater group, for instance) is really the equivalent of the Dream Theater subforum here. Yes, that group will have a certain amount of "echo chamber" in it, but you can join as many groups about as many topics as you want. Of course, it gets harder to form "bonds" as the social networks have just become that much bigger... But they're also serving different functions. And things just evolve. I mean, some of us "oldies" will still look back at newsgroups and BBS's as the golden age of group communication, and forums are a far inferior version of newsgroups and bbs's Facebook and reddit are just the natural evolution that is inevitable, and I'm sure that in 10 years time there's gonna be new ways and sites to do this kind of thing on.

I spend most of my "interacting with people online" on facebook, reddit and discord nowadays. That's where it's easiest to reach a bigger amount of people. The activity on forums has gone down, and it's increasingly harder to recruit new members. I have access to hundreds of thousands of people on our social media, and even if only 10% of them interact with us (and each other) at any given point, that's still many times more than on this forum. And my "job", as it were, is to create engagement.

[ariich]

Chill dudes, the forum isn't going anywhere, as noted by Nick and indeed right there in bosk's original post that prompted this thread.

[Shadow Ninja 2.0]

rich said the forum is canceled everyone

[lonestar]

rich said the forum is canceled everyone

[ariich]

You guys.

[TAC]

Yep, there aren't many good forums left, and let's face it, most FB group pages dedicated to a single group or artist kinda suck, a) because there is never a good way to organize it neatly like you can a normal forum like this one, and b) most admins/mods of those group pages have that stupid rule where you can only start topics that are about the artist to whom the page is dedicated (with rare exceptions).  Imagine this forum being one where we could only have threads about Dream Theater 99% of the time. That is what most group FB pages are like, and is a big reason why most are a waste of time as those pages just became ejaculation sessions to the artist rather than a page with real discussions.

While this is to a certain extent true, you also have to consider this;
Old style forums were really "the entire social network" of its time, so when you compare you have to compare groups or subreddits to subforums, not the entire forum. So a band specific subreddit or group on facebook (say, my Dream Theater group, for instance) is really the equivalent of the Dream Theater subforum here. Yes, that group will have a certain amount of "echo chamber" in it, but you can join as many groups about as many topics as you want. Of course, it gets harder to form "bonds" as the social networks have just become that much bigger... But they're also serving different functions. And things just evolve. I mean, some of us "oldies" will still look back at newsgroups and BBS's as the golden age of group communication, and forums are a far inferior version of newsgroups and bbs's Facebook and reddit are just the natural evolution that is inevitable, and I'm sure that in 10 years time there's gonna be new ways and sites to do this kind of thing on.

I spend most of my "interacting with people online" on facebook, reddit and discord nowadays. That's where it's easiest to reach a bigger amount of people. The activity on forums has gone down, and it's increasingly harder to recruit new members. I have access to hundreds of thousands of people on our social media, and even if only 10% of them interact with us (and each other) at any given point, that's still many times more than on this forum. And my "job", as it were, is to create engagement.

That's great Noxon, but I don't even know WTF reddit and discord are, man. And you're basically just doing PR for the band.
Nothing wrong with that.

I came here to talk DT in 2004. This is a great place to talk with people, not at them.

Sorry, I don't mean to sound like a dick, but I read your post and I felt you were dismissing what this forum means to everyone, as all have posted.

[TAC]

Novels that will be written by forum members when the board shuts down:

I Have Never Heard of That, and Other Things That Didn't Exist Prior to 1982, by TAC
The Comma, an Appreciation, by Stadler

Nice!! 

[KevShmev]

Yep, there aren't many good forums left, and let's face it, most FB group pages dedicated to a single group or artist kinda suck, a) because there is never a good way to organize it neatly like you can a normal forum like this one, and b) most admins/mods of those group pages have that stupid rule where you can only start topics that are about the artist to whom the page is dedicated (with rare exceptions).  Imagine this forum being one where we could only have threads about Dream Theater 99% of the time. That is what most group FB pages are like, and is a big reason why most are a waste of time as those pages just became ejaculation sessions to the artist rather than a page with real discussions.

While this is to a certain extent true, you also have to consider this;
Old style forums were really "the entire social network" of its time, so when you compare you have to compare groups or subreddits to subforums, not the entire forum. So a band specific subreddit or group on facebook (say, my Dream Theater group, for instance) is really the equivalent of the Dream Theater subforum here. Yes, that group will have a certain amount of "echo chamber" in it, but you can join as many groups about as many topics as you want. Of course, it gets harder to form "bonds" as the social networks have just become that much bigger... But they're also serving different functions. And things just evolve. I mean, some of us "oldies" will still look back at newsgroups and BBS's as the golden age of group communication, and forums are a far inferior version of newsgroups and bbs's Facebook and reddit are just the natural evolution that is inevitable, and I'm sure that in 10 years time there's gonna be new ways and sites to do this kind of thing on.

I spend most of my "interacting with people online" on facebook, reddit and discord nowadays. That's where it's easiest to reach a bigger amount of people. The activity on forums has gone down, and it's increasingly harder to recruit new members. I have access to hundreds of thousands of people on our social media, and even if only 10% of them interact with us (and each other) at any given point, that's still many times more than on this forum. And my "job", as it were, is to create engagement.

Things evolve, yes, but forums and group pages often become more about the community than anything else, and who wants to bounce from 199 FB pages just to talk other bands, especially when the odds of the same people being on all of the same pages is slim to none. 

To me, the unique thing about this forum is the wide range of opinions on music, which has a lot to do with the band.  DT has a lot of metal fans, a lot of prog fans, a lot of rock fans, etc., so you get fans from different musical backgrounds, so to speak.  Contrast that to say the old Spock's Beard forum I used to visit in the early 2000's which had a lot of nice people, but nearly everyone there was a prog fan first and foremost, and while there is nothing wrong with that, it made it difficult to talk a lot of music that wasn't prog.  Sure, the vast majority of band threads that get a lot of activity here are prog and/or metal, but there are plenty of threads about bands not from those genres that have had a lot of chatter. 

[Bolsters]

My hope is that if the current administration ever does decide to throw in the towel, the database for the forum would be made available so that another team could take it over. Reddit and Discord have their place but the building of community, level of interaction, and persistence of content is lacking compared to a good ol' fashioned forum. This community would not survive a shift to another format anyway.

[The Walrus]

I love this forum and it was like moving to a bigger city with a whole bunch of new friendly people after MP shut down his forum. It's a varied, fun community and a neverending source of great music imo, which is the chief reason I come here, along with having fun with a bunch of people I'm happy to call friends. Been using forums for over 20 years, since I was a kid; even with social media, forums are the one thing that have been a mainstay for me.

[JustJen]

Feels like bosk's post (link below) got glossed over to the due obvious nature of the thread, but it feels like it is worth unpacking more, no? 

https://www.dreamtheaterforums.org/boards/index.php?topic=55459.msg2679618#msg2679618

Is the forum on borrowed time?

and if so, why? what can we do to salvage this?

[JustJen]

I've been a member of this forum since like 2007, and somehow I did not get banned despite being an utter moron for the first four or five of those.

I know, right? LOL

[JustJen]

It's all about time. It's easy for us to just come on and post. It's harder for them to maintain,  moderate these forums as they get older and real life priorities take over.

I totally get it.

well i'll volunteer to come back and help then.

[JustJen]

Personally I feel like reddit was the bigger killer of forums compared to Facebook.

well yeah but now that reddit finally permabanned me, i need this!

[jingle.boy]

Novels that will be written by forum members when the board shuts down:

I Have Never Heard of That, and Other Things That Didn't Exist Prior to 1982, by TAC
The Comma, an Appreciation, by Stadler

A Rebuttal, of Stadler by Adami

Spell-checking is for Loosah’s by Kingshmegland.

[TAC]

 

[noxon]

That's great Noxon, but I don't even know WTF reddit and discord are, man. And you're basically just doing PR for the band.
Nothing wrong with that.

I came here to talk DT in 2004. This is a great place to talk with people, not at them.

Sorry, I don't mean to sound like a dick, but I read your post and I felt you were dismissing what this forum means to everyone, as all have posted.

Oh, I'm sure it means a great deal to a lot of people, but you also have to be a bit realistic. The old style forums are dying. People just don't see any reason to join anymore. That's not undermining the people that DID join a forum and feel a connection to that forum and the people on it, but there will also be a certain kind of attrition because that's only natural when things get older.

Reddit is the biggest "forum" on the planet right now. It works a bit differently than you're used to (as it highlights relevant content based on a perceived quality as jugded by activity and up/downvotes), but it's basically the "home page" for a lot of people now - this is where they go to discuss whatever. Case in point; DTF has 5600 members amassed over the course of 13 years. The r/Dreamtheater has 16.1k members over 11 years. My DT facebook group has 34k members. It's just a completely different scale. Of course, the forum has played an important part of DT history, but it's no longer the bastion of DT communication as it once was. And that's okay. And for the people who connected on this forum, it'll exist. But my point from the previous post - I'm just seeing the same type reaction here now as I saw when the Ytsejam mailing list and the alt.music.dream-theater group was dying due to the forums... And it's all fine to have nostalgia for the past, but you're missing out if you get -stuck- in the past...

Discord is kinda like IRC, only updated. It's kinda a bit like Slack or Teams, if you've ever tried those. It's a real time chat, with voice or text. If you look at younger bands, they focus on facebook, twitter, twitch, discord and reddit. Discord was what was used to solved the DT treasure hunt I did before Distance Over Time.

I'm doing PR? Not really. I'm building communities. A fan club isn't primarily about -the band-, it's about the fans. Our common interest, the band, is of course what drives a lot of our activities, but it's still about building communities. Which is why we hold our pre show events cities all over the world. Why we feature fans covers on our social media. Hold interactive Q&A sessions. Etc. The treasure hunt wasn't PR for the band, primarily. It was to engage the fans in building connections between them. And the places where I get the most reaction whenever I ask for feedback USED to be the forum, but now it's #1 Facebook, #2 Instagram, #3 Reddit, #4 Discord and #5 Forum.

[jingle.boy]

Now ur gonna have to explain to Tim IRC, Slack, Teams ...

[JayOctavarium]

I've a week away from my 10 year anniversary here. Holy shit. While I know I don't spend as much time on here as I used to, and when I do post I am usually bitching about work, this place is and will always be my internet home. I spend way more time on Reddit and Facebook than I do here,  but if I woke up and Reddit was gone, I'd be okay. If I woke up and DTF was gone...

I wouldn't be.

[wolfking]

My hope is that if the current administration ever does decide to throw in the towel, the database for the forum would be made available so that another team could take it over. Reddit and Discord have their place but the building of community, level of interaction, and persistence of content is lacking compared to a good ol' fashioned forum. This community would not survive a shift to another format anyway.

If this were to be the case down the track, I'd seriously put my hand up in taking a part in running this place for sure.  I don't get on as much due to work but I'd make time.

[KevShmev]

I have no doubt that many younger peeps have no interest in joining forums like this and would rather just click "like" or "join" on a FB page, but I would bet money that most people on a FB page do it and move on while rarely participating.  Looking at what I assume is your DT page on FB (the one with 34K members), I see it has 21 new posts....today.  Today.  This forum can get 21 posts in like two minutes in the various threads.    So yeah, while the FB pages and whatnot can rack up the numbers of members, the community isn't really there otherwise you'd see a lot more posts in general, and that is what you get at a forum like this.  Maybe we are the old men yelling at the cloud that our way is still better, maybe not, but I will still take this over FB, reddit or whatever any day of the week.

edit (noxon): oops, sorry, pressed the "modify" button instead of the quote button

[wolfking]

Do all those other platforms have the personal factor that this place has?  I like Tim am not up on other platformsbut if Redit has so many more users you think it would be hard to get those personal connections like we get here?  I could be way off.

[Skeever]

I have no doubt that many younger peeps have no interest in joining forums like this and would rather just click "like" or "join" on a FB page, but I would bet money that most people on a FB page do it and move on while rarely participating.  Looking at what I assume is your DT page on FB (the one with 34K members), I see it has 21 new posts....today.  Today.  This forum can get 21 posts in like two minutes in the various threads.    So yeah, while the FB pages and whatnot can rack up the numbers of members, the community isn't really there otherwise you'd see a lot more posts in general, and that is what you get at a forum like this.  Maybe we are the old men yelling at the cloud that our way is still better, maybe not, but I will still take this over FB, reddit or whatever any day of the week.

I've posted at both the discord mentioned here as well as many iterations of the Facebook group. And I don't think it's anywhere near as rich or rewarding as posting at the forum. Those groups just move too fast, and become the territory of people who have nothing better to do than post all day. Especially the discord. since it's in real time, the only way you can become a regular is if you have enough time I basically live on there. I much prefer the forum style, where you can still participate in a conversation at your own pace. talk about community engagement all you want, I think there is a lot more to a community then catering to half a dozen people who have unlimited time for a chat room.

[MirrorMask]

I agree with Noxon's analysis of the trends about social platforms, but still I claim the right to be a grumpy old man and talk about the good old days. Speaking of this, I want bot ICQ and MSN back 

No, seriously, of course these things evolve, and they're different by nature and purpouse; a forum will always be the place where you come for a common interest, and you stay for the community, Noxon is right in pointing out the different numbers but precisely why a forum has fewer partecipants you can get a sense of who's who, and start recognizing people and avatars.

In the end social platforms will be like your favorite albums of a band, you will always love more the ones with whom you started with. I will always love the forum format and I'm just glad I found another one to hang out after the demise of the one where I cyber-lived in my 20s.

[Elite]

My nine year anniversary was 3 days ago

When I joined this forum I was still a teenager. I signed up because I wanted to post my top 50 Dream Theater tracks when that was still a thing I probably never thought I would still be here years later. This forum was here during my studies, before I even met my girlfriend and it has given me so much joy. As Chad pointed out earlier in this thread; for so many people this forum is part of a daily routine. Check updates, chat some stuff, find some music etc. etc. and it's so good to know that no matter what, if I'm absent for a week or so, this place will still be here.

[Evermind]

I agree with Noxon's analysis of the trends about social platforms, but still I claim the right to be a grumpy old man and talk about the good old days. Speaking of this, I want bot ICQ and MSN back 

No, seriously, of course these things evolve, and they're different by nature and purpouse; a forum will always be the place where you come for a common interest, and you stay for the community, Noxon is right in pointing out the different numbers but precisely why a forum has fewer partecipants you can get a sense of who's who, and start recognizing people and avatars.

In the end social platforms will be like your favorite albums of a band, you will always love more the ones with whom you started with. I will always love the forum format and I'm just glad I found another one to hang out after the demise of the one where I cyber-lived in my 20s.

I still use ICQ.

[JustJen]

I agree with Noxon's analysis of the trends about social platforms, but still I claim the right to be a grumpy old man and talk about the good old days. Speaking of this, I want bot ICQ and MSN back 

No, seriously, of course these things evolve, and they're different by nature and purpouse; a forum will always be the place where you come for a common interest, and you stay for the community, Noxon is right in pointing out the different numbers but precisely why a forum has fewer partecipants you can get a sense of who's who, and start recognizing people and avatars.

In the end social platforms will be like your favorite albums of a band, you will always love more the ones with whom you started with. I will always love the forum format and I'm just glad I found another one to hang out after the demise of the one where I cyber-lived in my 20s.

I still use ICQ.

It took me over ten years to realize that it's not pronounced "Ick", but "I Seek You".