Author Topic: Racism and Privilege  (Read 12965 times)

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Online Stadler

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Re: Racism and Privilege
« Reply #350 on: May 10, 2021, 01:26:24 PM »
I’m sure most are familiar with this quote by now:

Quote
In his 1963 letter from a Birmingham jail, King wrote: “I have almost reached the regrettable conclusion that the Negro’s great stumbling block in his stride toward freedom is not the White Citizen’s Counciler or the Ku Klux Klanner, but the white moderate, who is more devoted to ‘order’ than to justice; who prefers a negative peace which is the absence of tension to a positive peace which is the presence of justice; who constantly says: ‘I agree with you in the goal you seek, but I cannot agree with your methods of direct action.’”

it’s amazing that King wrote that in 1963 and you could basically use it word for word as a reply on the internet in 2021.

You could and you did.   It's a fallacy to consider that we're in the same state - and that he's talking about the same people - almost 60 years later.  "Justice" means something different in the vernacular of 2021. King's "justice" was predicated on "love", and thus was rooted at least as much socially and theologically than almost solely politically, as it is today.  There was no "vengeance" in King's justice, like there is today.   I believe he was talking more about ignoring the problem, sweeping it under the rug and hoping it would go away, which is the furthest thing from my point.  I think what I said was consistent with what King would call "direct action", but that doesn't mean we bury our heads in the sand and ignore science.   And of course, as is usual with you, you miss the point being made here entirely: while I never spoke to the man myself, I'm fairly confident that he was a man of pragmatism, if nothing else.  If presented with a path to justice, King wouldn't get hung up on his preconceived notions and his need to be "right" and instead would embrace that path to justice with open arms.
« Last Edit: May 10, 2021, 01:44:58 PM by Stadler »

Offline XeRocks81

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Re: Racism and Privilege
« Reply #351 on: May 10, 2021, 01:41:59 PM »
or maybe he was talking about most of on here myself included

Online El Barto

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Re: Racism and Privilege
« Reply #352 on: May 10, 2021, 02:34:43 PM »
I’m sure most are familiar with this quote by now:

Quote
In his 1963 letter from a Birmingham jail, King wrote: “I have almost reached the regrettable conclusion that the Negro’s great stumbling block in his stride toward freedom is not the White Citizen’s Counciler or the Ku Klux Klanner, but the white moderate, who is more devoted to ‘order’ than to justice; who prefers a negative peace which is the absence of tension to a positive peace which is the presence of justice; who constantly says: ‘I agree with you in the goal you seek, but I cannot agree with your methods of direct action.’”

it’s amazing that King wrote that in 1963 and you could basically use it word for word as a reply on the internet in 2021.
You certainly could, and you'd be wrong. I wasn't around in '63, so I can't say if he was right back then, but he wouldn't be right now. The current American idea of justice, you hit me so now I get to hit you back, is flawed, and I don't honestly think he'd be interested in the true meaning of justice, which is the fair and equal treatment of all people, including the assholes. The people who speak for him now sure as hell wouldn't, though.

Moreover, it's the moderates who are actually delivering for him at this point. You can't get 12 radicals on a jury. You have to settle for a cross-section, and those cross-sections, essentially moderate in the aggregate, actually are beginning to provide his flavor of justice.

Also, ‘I agree with you in the goal you seek, but I cannot agree with your methods of direct action.’ is a perfectly acceptable point of view. For one, it's absolutely essential in some cases, and more importantly, assuming it's not is highly counterproductive. How many allies have rioters (of either side) actually made over the last 12 months? How many people have they pissed off?
Argument, the presentation of reasonable views, never makes headway against conviction, and conviction takes no part in argument because it knows.
E.F. Benson

Offline XeRocks81

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Re: Racism and Privilege
« Reply #353 on: May 10, 2021, 02:48:08 PM »
I just think it should give pause and self reflection to everyone even in this time far removed from the 60s.