Author Topic: John Petrucci - Terminal Velocity (Fall 2020)  (Read 19062 times)

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Offline darkshade

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Re: John Petrucci - Terminal Velocity (Fall 2020)
« Reply #350 on: September 17, 2020, 08:52:00 PM »
Anyone else enjoying the new JP album more than the last 3 Dream Theater albums?


If I had to rank the 4 albums you're referring to here:


1. Distance Over Time
2. Terminal Velocity
3. Dream Theater



The Astonishing

I don't know if I'll ever listen to TA ever again. DT12 was so bland, cold, and uninspiring, I never listen to IT. I give DoT points for trying, and at least they sound a little better on that album. The only reason why ADTOE alright is because the drums are fashioned to be similar to MP's drumming, but if MP played the drums under that music it would sound 10x better; too many awkward or jarring moments that don't seem to make much sense, compositionally-speaking. Too much "look we can just play all this complex stuff now in crazy odd-time signatures with no restrictions" and it sounds cold and mechanical. A lot of people say Mangini is robotic or stiff sounding, but I think there's no one in the band that can re-create the energy, groove, and flow that MP brought to the band's sound. I'm all for change and evolution in a band's sound, but if there's a lineup change, it can make or break the band, depending on how the band operates and the direction their new music goes. I think similarly with Opeth, once the classic lineup of My Arms/Still Life through Ghost Reveries broke up, it hasn't been the same since. If DT called themselves JP & Friends and Opeth was Akerfeldt's solo band, I would be a lot less critical of the output.

On Terminal Velocity, I hear the spirit of Dream Theater, for the first time since I first listened to BC&SL 11 years ago. Sometimes I hear sprinkles of it on Neal Morse related projects, but TV was the icing too (but not the cake.) I'm still digesting the album, as it sent me on a DT kick so I haven't listened to the album enough yet to speak on individual tracks, but it sounds great, I look forward to listening to it again, can't really say that about DT lately.

Offline Dedalus

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Re: John Petrucci - Terminal Velocity (Fall 2020)
« Reply #351 on: September 17, 2020, 10:40:26 PM »
Anyone else enjoying the new JP album more than the last 3 Dream Theater albums?


If I had to rank the 4 albums you're referring to here:


1. Distance Over Time
2. Terminal Velocity
3. Dream Theater



The Astonishing

I don't know if I'll ever listen to TA ever again. DT12 was so bland, cold, and uninspiring, I never listen to IT. I give DoT points for trying, and at least they sound a little better on that album. The only reason why ADTOE alright is because the drums are fashioned to be similar to MP's drumming, but if MP played the drums under that music it would sound 10x better; too many awkward or jarring moments that don't seem to make much sense, compositionally-speaking. Too much "look we can just play all this complex stuff now in crazy odd-time signatures with no restrictions" and it sounds cold and mechanical. A lot of people say Mangini is robotic or stiff sounding, but I think there's no one in the band that can re-create the energy, groove, and flow that MP brought to the band's sound. I'm all for change and evolution in a band's sound, but if there's a lineup change, it can make or break the band, depending on how the band operates and the direction their new music goes. I think similarly with Opeth, once the classic lineup of My Arms/Still Life through Ghost Reveries broke up, it hasn't been the same since. If DT called themselves JP & Friends and Opeth was Akerfeldt's solo band, I would be a lot less critical of the output.

On Terminal Velocity, I hear the spirit of Dream Theater, for the first time since I first listened to BC&SL 11 years ago. Sometimes I hear sprinkles of it on Neal Morse related projects, but TV was the icing too (but not the cake.) I'm still digesting the album, as it sent me on a DT kick so I haven't listened to the album enough yet to speak on individual tracks, but it sounds great, I look forward to listening to it again, can't really say that about DT lately.

Dude, you really DISLIKE the idea of Dream Theater without Mike Portnoy.  :rollin

Offline darkshade

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Re: John Petrucci - Terminal Velocity (Fall 2020)
« Reply #352 on: September 18, 2020, 10:50:21 AM »
Dude, you really DISLIKE the idea of Dream Theater without Mike Portnoy.  :rollin

It's not for lack of giving Mangini-era DT a chance. Four chances in fact, and they got me with ADTOE because it was the closest to sounding like something MP might have been a part of, so it didn't seem like they lost a step, but in hindsight, ADTOE and beyond was a big drop off in quality, in writing and also production. For me, Mangini's style is too stiff with no pocket, and is just a hired gun (and seems to act that way) instead of being a contributing member (yes, I know he wrote some stuff for DoT). I think MP was right about needing a break, even if it was just him who was burnt out on the band, but the rest of the band needs the grounding of MP to make their overly complex ideas work without sounding like a computer playing the music. Think about it, a 2-5 year break would have ended in 2012-2015, we'd probably already have had 2-3 new DT albums and they would all have been better than The Astonishing or DT12.

Offline hunnus2000

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Re: John Petrucci - Terminal Velocity (Fall 2020)
« Reply #353 on: September 18, 2020, 12:23:53 PM »
Dude, you really DISLIKE the idea of Dream Theater without Mike Portnoy.  :rollin

It's not for lack of giving Mangini-era DT a chance. Four chances in fact, and they got me with ADTOE because it was the closest to sounding like something MP might have been a part of, so it didn't seem like they lost a step, but in hindsight, ADTOE and beyond was a big drop off in quality, in writing and also production. For me, Mangini's style is too stiff with no pocket, and is just a hired gun (and seems to act that way) instead of being a contributing member (yes, I know he wrote some stuff for DoT). I think MP was right about needing a break, even if it was just him who was burnt out on the band, but the rest of the band needs the grounding of MP to make their overly complex ideas work without sounding like a computer playing the music. Think about it, a 2-5 year break would have ended in 2012-2015, we'd probably already have had 2-3 new DT albums and they would all have been better than The Astonishing or DT12.

Somehow I doubt you have given the MM era a chance. You sound like you're just star-struck with MP. It was AFTER MP left the band that JR and JLB got to breath and to me, that gave new life to the music.

Offline Dedalus

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Re: John Petrucci - Terminal Velocity (Fall 2020)
« Reply #354 on: September 18, 2020, 12:26:12 PM »
Dude, you really DISLIKE the idea of Dream Theater without Mike Portnoy.  :rollin

It's not for lack of giving Mangini-era DT a chance. Four chances in fact, and they got me with ADTOE because it was the closest to sounding like something MP might have been a part of, so it didn't seem like they lost a step, but in hindsight, ADTOE and beyond was a big drop off in quality, in writing and also production. For me, Mangini's style is too stiff with no pocket, and is just a hired gun (and seems to act that way) instead of being a contributing member (yes, I know he wrote some stuff for DoT). I think MP was right about needing a break, even if it was just him who was burnt out on the band, but the rest of the band needs the grounding of MP to make their overly complex ideas work without sounding like a computer playing the music. Think about it, a 2-5 year break would have ended in 2012-2015, we'd probably already have had 2-3 new DT albums and they would all have been better than The Astonishing or DT12.

Or they could be horrible like SC or BCSL. We don't know.

I will not buy this so easily.   :)

Offline darkshade

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Re: John Petrucci - Terminal Velocity (Fall 2020)
« Reply #355 on: September 18, 2020, 01:21:19 PM »
Dude, you really DISLIKE the idea of Dream Theater without Mike Portnoy.  :rollin

It's not for lack of giving Mangini-era DT a chance. Four chances in fact, and they got me with ADTOE because it was the closest to sounding like something MP might have been a part of, so it didn't seem like they lost a step, but in hindsight, ADTOE and beyond was a big drop off in quality, in writing and also production. For me, Mangini's style is too stiff with no pocket, and is just a hired gun (and seems to act that way) instead of being a contributing member (yes, I know he wrote some stuff for DoT). I think MP was right about needing a break, even if it was just him who was burnt out on the band, but the rest of the band needs the grounding of MP to make their overly complex ideas work without sounding like a computer playing the music. Think about it, a 2-5 year break would have ended in 2012-2015, we'd probably already have had 2-3 new DT albums and they would all have been better than The Astonishing or DT12.

Somehow I doubt you have given the MM era a chance. You sound like you're just star-struck with MP. It was AFTER MP left the band that JR and JLB got to breath and to me, that gave new life to the music.

Well I have. I've bought every DT album with Mangini the week, if not the day, of release. I've listened to them each many times. For a while, I thought it was my music tastes changing, as I've moved away from progressive rock as my main listening pleasure for a while now, but I still get a kick out of every DT album from WDADU all the way through BC&SL. Both those last 2 MP albums are great albums, not their best, but still great. Still trying new things, whether you like it or not. Since then, there has been no evolution in the band's sound. It was established on ADTOE and DT12, basically a nostalgia trip through IaW/Awake every time, with some of the modern sounds mixed in, a particular formula repeated for 4 albums now, and no where near as good as those 2 albums.

From a business standpoint, while they're still crying all the way to the bank, the band's popularity and sales, from what I've seen, has been steadily declining since MP left. From what I can tell, SC and BC&SL was the band's peak in popularity this side of 1992-1994. While it may be my perspective, everyone I know personally who casually enjoyed DT when MP was still in the band, has completely dropped out and have no interest in post-MP DT. Everywhere I look online, there are countless fans expressing the same criticisms I am here, and much more harshly than I am. So I am not the only one who is critical or has lost interest in the band's newer material; or feels very hurt towards the band for ruining (imo of course) the band's canon instead of honoring a founding member's wishes to take a break to find new inspiration, perhaps heal wounds as time heals all (cough JLB) and come back recharged.

Offline darkshade

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Re: John Petrucci - Terminal Velocity (Fall 2020)
« Reply #356 on: September 18, 2020, 01:30:24 PM »

Or they could be horrible like SC or BCSL. We don't know.

I will not buy this so easily.   :)

We don't know, but with a break and possibly new perspectives, MP likely wouldn't have wanted to repeat what they did on those two albums. Let's not also forget, rock and metal has taken a tumble these last 10 years, if you look outside the bubble of these genres. No where near as popular as it was in the 90s/00s. The musical landscape was a lot different in 2015 or so, compared to the late-2000s, so if they came back with MP around 2015, they might have tried different things. MP has stated they always tried not to repeat themselves, or sound similar to the previous album. I have to imagine many of the ideas from the last 4 albums would be on these hypothetical 2010s DT albums with MP, as he was more of the visionary in the band than JP is, as well as the arranger of many of DT's songs. I've always acknowledged that there is gold in the Mangini albums, but it's clear that no one in the band currently are creative song-writers/composers, and lots of the magic in the first 10 albums is because of MP's input, whatever it may have been. This can be verified with the many behind the scenes/making-of vids released by DT and Neal Morse in years past.

I disagree that SC and BC&SL are 'horrible'. They're pretty fun records, and really not much of a step down from the previous few albums. You can tell a little that they seem a little burnt out (MP obviously) and JLB is like a hired gun on Black Clouds, so a break wouldn't have been the worst decision.

Offline Dedalus

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Re: John Petrucci - Terminal Velocity (Fall 2020)
« Reply #357 on: September 18, 2020, 02:20:24 PM »

Or they could be horrible like SC or BCSL. We don't know.

I will not buy this so easily.   :)

We don't know, but with a break and possibly new perspectives, MP likely wouldn't have wanted to repeat what they did on those two albums. Let's not also forget, rock and metal has taken a tumble these last 10 years, if you look outside the bubble of these genres. No where near as popular as it was in the 90s/00s. The musical landscape was a lot different in 2015 or so, compared to the late-2000s, so if they came back with MP around 2015, they might have tried different things. MP has stated they always tried not to repeat themselves, or sound similar to the previous album. I have to imagine many of the ideas from the last 4 albums would be on these hypothetical 2010s DT albums with MP, as he was more of the visionary in the band than JP is, as well as the arranger of many of DT's songs. I've always acknowledged that there is gold in the Mangini albums, but it's clear that no one in the band currently are creative song-writers/composers, and lots of the magic in the first 10 albums is because of MP's input, whatever it may have been. This can be verified with the many behind the scenes/making-of vids released by DT and Neal Morse in years past.

I disagree that SC and BC&SL are 'horrible'. They're pretty fun records, and really not much of a step down from the previous few albums. You can tell a little that they seem a little burnt out (MP obviously) and JLB is like a hired gun on Black Clouds, so a break wouldn't have been the worst decision.

Well, buying and listening to records is not necessarily give them a chance. It takes a little more than that, like an open mind.

Considering everything you wrote, your opinion about MP and about the other guys, I really think that the possibility of you enjoying anything done by the band without MP is practically zero.

But it's OK. No one have to like anything, at the end of the day.

Online gzarruk

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Re: John Petrucci - Terminal Velocity (Fall 2020)
« Reply #358 on: September 18, 2020, 02:32:11 PM »
We don't know, but with a break and possibly new perspectives, MP likely wouldn't have wanted to repeat what they did on those two albums. Let's not also forget, rock and metal has taken a tumble these last 10 years, if you look outside the bubble of these genres. No where near as popular as it was in the 90s/00s. The musical landscape was a lot different in 2015 or so, compared to the late-2000s, so if they came back with MP around 2015, they might have tried different things. MP has stated they always tried not to repeat themselves, or sound similar to the previous album. I have to imagine many of the ideas from the last 4 albums would be on these hypothetical 2010s DT albums with MP, as he was more of the visionary in the band than JP is, as well as the arranger of many of DT's songs. I've always acknowledged that there is gold in the Mangini albums, but it's clear that no one in the band currently are creative song-writers/composers, and lots of the magic in the first 10 albums is because of MP's input, whatever it may have been. This can be verified with the many behind the scenes/making-of vids released by DT and Neal Morse in years past.

I disagree that SC and BC&SL are 'horrible'. They're pretty fun records, and really not much of a step down from the previous few albums. You can tell a little that they seem a little burnt out (MP obviously) and JLB is like a hired gun on Black Clouds, so a break wouldn't have been the worst decision.

I have to disagree big time with the bolded. No matter how much MP has told everyone how big of a composer he is, the main writers for DT have always been JP and KM (at first)/JR (since 99). This is no dig at MP, he's clearly a great arranger and producer, not mentioning his drumming, but to say there's no creative songwriter in the band and that Mike was responsible for most of the magic in previous albums is a big big big stretch. If you watch any of the making of documentaries that you are refering to, Mike's musical contributions are almost none, he's there working with stuff other people came up with and he's saying "let's repeat this, go back to this section here, you can double this riff here" and so on. That's what an arranger/producer does (and he's very good at it), but he's in no way capable of handling the bulk of the writing himself for any band, or he would've done it already by now. Every band he's been a part of has had major songriters not named Portnoy (Petrucci, Moore, Rudess, N. Morse, S. Morse, Bumblefoot, Sherinian, Kotzen, the list goes on).

Btw, it's completely fine if you don't like MM era albums, and I'm sorry you can't enjoy them as many people here do (as well as lots of people actually attending the concerts), but you don't have to act like MP was the only good thing to ever happen for this band.

As for the 5 year break thing, it's not even clear what really happened there, as IIRC, he even said that wasn't completely true. What we do know is that he tried to get the A7X gig permanently and gambled with DT for it. It didn't work.
It sounds like, "ruk, ruk, ruk, ruk, ruk." Instead of the more pleasing kick drum sound of, "gzarruk, gzarruk, gzarruk, gzarruk."

Offline darkshade

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Re: John Petrucci - Terminal Velocity (Fall 2020)
« Reply #359 on: September 18, 2020, 03:24:01 PM »
Considering everything you wrote, your opinion about MP and about the other guys, I really think that the possibility of you enjoying anything done by the band without MP is practically zero.

On the contrary, I do enjoy some of ADTOE, and a couple of tracks off the other 3 albums each. The rest is littered with cool parts among (what sound like to me) tired, rehashed, stiff, and cold compositions, with JLB's vocals drenched in effects to cover his deteriorating vocal abilities (I assume)

We don't know, but with a break and possibly new perspectives, MP likely wouldn't have wanted to repeat what they did on those two albums. Let's not also forget, rock and metal has taken a tumble these last 10 years, if you look outside the bubble of these genres. No where near as popular as it was in the 90s/00s. The musical landscape was a lot different in 2015 or so, compared to the late-2000s, so if they came back with MP around 2015, they might have tried different things. MP has stated they always tried not to repeat themselves, or sound similar to the previous album. I have to imagine many of the ideas from the last 4 albums would be on these hypothetical 2010s DT albums with MP, as he was more of the visionary in the band than JP is, as well as the arranger of many of DT's songs. I've always acknowledged that there is gold in the Mangini albums, but it's clear that no one in the band currently are creative song-writers/composers, and lots of the magic in the first 10 albums is because of MP's input, whatever it may have been. This can be verified with the many behind the scenes/making-of vids released by DT and Neal Morse in years past.

I disagree that SC and BC&SL are 'horrible'. They're pretty fun records, and really not much of a step down from the previous few albums. You can tell a little that they seem a little burnt out (MP obviously) and JLB is like a hired gun on Black Clouds, so a break wouldn't have been the worst decision.

I have to disagree big time with the bolded. No matter how much MP has told everyone how big of a composer he is, the main writers for DT have always been JP and KM (at first)/JR (since 99). This is no dig at MP, he's clearly a great arranger and producer, not mentioning his drumming, but to say there's no creative songwriter in the band and that Mike was responsible for most of the magic in previous albums is a big big big stretch. If you watch any of the making of documentaries that you are refering to, Mike's musical contributions are almost none, he's there working with stuff other people came up with and he's saying "let's repeat this, go back to this section here, you can double this riff here" and so on. That's what an arranger/producer does (and he's very good at it), but he's in no way capable of handling the bulk of the writing himself for any band, or he would've done it already by now. Every band he's been a part of has had major songriters not named Portnoy (Petrucci, Moore, Rudess, N. Morse, S. Morse, Bumblefoot, Sherinian, Kotzen, the list goes on).

Btw, it's completely fine if you don't like MM era albums, and I'm sorry you can't enjoy them as many people here do (as well as lots of people actually attending the concerts), but you don't have to act like MP was the only good thing to ever happen for this band.

As for the 5 year break thing, it's not even clear what really happened there, as IIRC, he even said that wasn't completely true. What we do know is that he tried to get the A7X gig permanently and gambled with DT for it. It didn't work.

I wasn't claiming MP was coming up with the parts, riffs, melodies etc.. most of the time, but he had the vision on how to work with the material and what to do with it. Going by the rest of the band's output outside of DT, and on DT albums without MP, it is obvious to my ears that they are fantastic musicians but lack that IT factor that many artists have without the chops that JP and JR have. Listen to music written by Neal Morse with MP involved, and stuff where MP was not involved (JC: The Exorcist, Spock's Beard, etc...) His presence is very obviously felt in the music and the directions it takes.

I would say my feelings are similar to how old school fans felt about Jordan Rudess joining the band, especially after each successive album with him. Difference is, JR had a big impact on the music, and was stylistically different from Moore and Sherinian, whereas MM seems to be fine being told what to do, what to play, and doesn't bring a whole lot of difference in style like the KM->DS->JR era did, he doesn't sound like Portnoy, but someone from the drummer auditions like Donati or Minneman in DT would have really impacted the band's sound more, I believe.

Offline darkshade

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Re: John Petrucci - Terminal Velocity (Fall 2020)
« Reply #360 on: September 18, 2020, 03:30:47 PM »
I'd like to add I like JLB's work outside DT with Mangini on drums, he also sounds a lot better on those albums *shrugs*

Offline Ben_Jamin

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Re: John Petrucci - Terminal Velocity (Fall 2020)
« Reply #361 on: September 18, 2020, 07:55:07 PM »
I'll give you the fact that MP is a really good arranger, and has a great ear for how a song should go (The queen vocals in Prophets of War). But that doesn't mean he get's the final say in how the song goes, that's up to the songwriter. That was his role in Dream Theater, his dominant attitude just won the arguments over arrangements the others had. And being a music fan first and foremost that is finally living his dream of being in a big band, decided to make Bootlegs, Document every live moment, and all that other stuff. He has a big personality that as things progressed, it began to slowly overshadow the band.

When MP told the other guys he thought it was a good idea to take a hiatus, him suggesting 5 years. The guys let him know their thoughts, and the band let him know it's not just MP, Dream Theater is all 5 guys. The band out voted MP on the hiatus and rather than continue, MP felt it best for himself if he leave the band. Being the OCD guy he is, I would find it hard to not be as involved in matters, and it's harder to hand over control. 

What happened now is likely the band all give more input in the arrangements and direction a song takes.
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Offline Dedalus

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Re: John Petrucci - Terminal Velocity (Fall 2020)
« Reply #362 on: September 19, 2020, 12:48:51 AM »

I have to disagree big time with the bolded. No matter how much MP has told everyone how big of a composer he is, the main writers for DT have always been JP and KM (at first)/JR (since 99). This is no dig at MP, he's clearly a great arranger and producer, not mentioning his drumming, but to say there's no creative songwriter in the band and that Mike was responsible for most of the magic in previous albums is a big big big stretch. If you watch any of the making of documentaries that you are refering to, Mike's musical contributions are almost none, he's there working with stuff other people came up with and he's saying "let's repeat this, go back to this section here, you can double this riff here" and so on. That's what an arranger/producer does (and he's very good at it), but he's in no way capable of handling the bulk of the writing himself for any band, or he would've done it already by now. Every band he's been a part of has had major songriters not named Portnoy (Petrucci, Moore, Rudess, N. Morse, S. Morse, Bumblefoot, Sherinian, Kotzen, the list goes on).

Btw, it's completely fine if you don't like MM era albums, and I'm sorry you can't enjoy them as many people here do (as well as lots of people actually attending the concerts), but you don't have to act like MP was the only good thing to ever happen for this band.

As for the 5 year break thing, it's not even clear what really happened there, as IIRC, he even said that wasn't completely true. What we do know is that he tried to get the A7X gig permanently and gambled with DT for it. It didn't work.

Exact.
I think MP is the only non-composer who is reputed to be a genius in composition.  :lol

Offline Peter Mc

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Re: John Petrucci - Terminal Velocity (Fall 2020)
« Reply #363 on: September 19, 2020, 04:21:18 AM »
The guy is clearly a Portnoy fan and thatís cool.  If JP left, and the band continued on, I would probably be saying similar things.  I have enjoyed the post MP albums but even I would say that they have not made an album on the level of the real classic MP era albums. I would also say the last few MP era albums werenít on that level either.  The band has stagnated a little in recent years even if the albums are still very high quality, theyíre not classics imo.

Where I take exception is the idea that all of these people donít have a clue when MP is not there.  Donít get me wrong, whilst MP was never the main composer in DT, I do think he was the guy who steered the ship to a degree.  The bit which really stuck out though was the suggestion that Neal Morse needs him to make his stuff work and that Spockís Beard are evidence of this.  Spockís Beard were incredible and Iím sure, if you ask a lot of people, they would prefer that stuff to Nealís solo material with Portnoy.

Whatís become clear to me since MPís departure is that MP needs great creative people around him like Petrucci, like Neal Morse as he canít do it on his own.  This is evident from the slew of 2nd rate projects heís been involved with in recent years where he is working with people of lesser songwriting ability and is unable to elevate it to anything notable.  So yes, maybe he adds a little bit to DT that Mangini perhaps doesnít but DT and Neal Morse elevate him much more than he elevates them.

Offline utopiarun

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Re: John Petrucci - Terminal Velocity (Fall 2020)
« Reply #364 on: September 19, 2020, 06:14:07 AM »
So, how do we like Terminal Velocity? (trying to steer the conversation back)  ;D

I still love it and listen to it often.

Offline Peter Mc

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Re: John Petrucci - Terminal Velocity (Fall 2020)
« Reply #365 on: September 19, 2020, 08:26:26 AM »
Itís awesome.

Offline darkshade

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Re: John Petrucci - Terminal Velocity (Fall 2020)
« Reply #366 on: September 19, 2020, 09:34:25 AM »
The guy is clearly a Portnoy fan and thatís cool.  If JP left, and the band continued on, I would probably be saying similar things.  I have enjoyed the post MP albums but even I would say that they have not made an album on the level of the real classic MP era albums. I would also say the last few MP era albums werenít on that level either.  The band has stagnated a little in recent years even if the albums are still very high quality, theyíre not classics imo.

Where I take exception is the idea that all of these people donít have a clue when MP is not there.  Donít get me wrong, whilst MP was never the main composer in DT, I do think he was the guy who steered the ship to a degree.  The bit which really stuck out though was the suggestion that Neal Morse needs him to make his stuff work and that Spockís Beard are evidence of this.  Spockís Beard were incredible and Iím sure, if you ask a lot of people, they would prefer that stuff to Nealís solo material with Portnoy.

Whatís become clear to me since MPís departure is that MP needs great creative people around him like Petrucci, like Neal Morse as he canít do it on his own.  This is evident from the slew of 2nd rate projects heís been involved with in recent years where he is working with people of lesser songwriting ability and is unable to elevate it to anything notable.  So yes, maybe he adds a little bit to DT that Mangini perhaps doesnít but DT and Neal Morse elevate him much more than he elevates them.

To clarify, I wasn't saying Neal Morse needs Portnoy to write and arrange music, he was doing just fine in Spock's Beard. I was just pointing out the difference in the sound and energy of the music when Portnoy is involved versus when he's not. I haven't listened to The Exorcist yet, which Portnoy is not a part of, but I heard snippets and it sounds like solid Neal Morse material, musically. On the flip side, I haven't really been excited over any post-DT Portnoy projects besides Neal and Transatlantic, though I haven't heard everything he's done since he left DT. Even the last Transatlantic album was a little underwhelming for me, but that's another story.

I don't see any other member leaving other than MM, maybe JR. MP leaving was a shock, I still sort of can't believe it, though I've accepted it, and if anyone would have left so late in the band's career, it would be him. One thing he's got over the band is his name is not attached to The Astonishing.
« Last Edit: September 19, 2020, 09:42:41 AM by darkshade »

Offline darkshade

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Re: John Petrucci - Terminal Velocity (Fall 2020)
« Reply #367 on: September 19, 2020, 09:36:14 AM »
So, how do we like Terminal Velocity? (trying to steer the conversation back)  ;D

I still love it and listen to it often.

This is all because I compared TV to recent Dream Theater, how it sounds more like 'real' Dream Theater than the last 4 albums, so it is technically on topic.

I listened to it again last night, it's all starting to come together. Some real gems on TV.
Been going through a lot of the DT side projects like Planet X, LTE, solo albums, etc... and I think Terminal Velocity is a top 5 side project album (up there with JP's last album, Moonbabies, The Whirlwind, LTE2)

Offline SjundeInseglet

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Re: John Petrucci - Terminal Velocity (Fall 2020)
« Reply #368 on: September 19, 2020, 10:10:45 AM »
One thing he's got over the band is his name is not attached to The Astonishing.

And that's good because? I think you're projecting your strong distaste for the record on its actual significance and value. From what I can tell, the current DT members are still proud of the work they did on the "The Astonishing" and it's not like any of them is trying to pretend DT never recorded the album. Not one of them has renounced it, that is for sure. I get it that it's an extremely divisive and polarizing record but I, for one, applaud DT (and particularly JP) for having stuck to their guns and having created something that is truly unique in the band's discography. Love it or hate it, you can't deny that.

Offline MoraWintersoul

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Re: John Petrucci - Terminal Velocity (Fall 2020)
« Reply #369 on: September 20, 2020, 05:52:11 AM »
One thing he's got over the band is his name is not attached to The Astonishing.

And that's good because? I think you're projecting your strong distaste for the record on its actual significance and value. From what I can tell, the current DT members are still proud of the work they did on the "The Astonishing" and it's not like any of them is trying to pretend DT never recorded the album. Not one of them has renounced it, that is for sure. I get it that it's an extremely divisive and polarizing record but I, for one, applaud DT (and particularly JP) for having stuck to their guns and having created something that is truly unique in the band's discography. Love it or hate it, you can't deny that.
Yeah. I'm one of those people who dislike TA but it's not embarrassing that they did it or whatever. For most people it's just that one DT album that went too far that they didn't like. It's not a stain on their discography or anything.

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Offline kirksnosehair

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Re: John Petrucci - Terminal Velocity (Fall 2020)
« Reply #370 on: September 21, 2020, 02:10:00 PM »
I think of it as Dream Theater's "Tales from Topographical Oceans"


As for Terminal Velocity - I've kept it in rotation for the last couple of weeks and I like it, but I've already deleted a couple of the tracks.  The slow one doesn't do a lot for me.  And the last couple of tracks feel a little bit on the phoned-in side.  The first 5 or 6 songs are really great, but it falls off after that. 

Offline Peter Mc

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Re: John Petrucci - Terminal Velocity (Fall 2020)
« Reply #371 on: September 21, 2020, 04:04:28 PM »
I think of it as Dream Theater's "Tales from Topographical Oceans"


As for Terminal Velocity - I've kept it in rotation for the last couple of weeks and I like it, but I've already deleted a couple of the tracks.  The slow one doesn't do a lot for me.  And the last couple of tracks feel a little bit on the phoned-in side.  The first 5 or 6 songs are really great, but it falls off after that.

The last one? I donít entirely disagree about the slow song and Snake In My Boot is kind of a throwaway fun track (which I really enjoy as it reminds me of Van Halen) but canít believe youíre throwing in Temple of Circadia.  Thatís one of the absolute highlights for me if not THE absolute highlight.  The two I donít love are the slow song and The Way Things Fall.

Offline hefdaddy42

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Re: John Petrucci - Terminal Velocity (Fall 2020)
« Reply #372 on: September 22, 2020, 07:44:59 AM »
Listen to music written by Neal Morse with MP involved, and stuff where MP was not involved (JC: The Exorcist, Spock's Beard, etc...) His presence is very obviously felt in the music and the directions it takes.
Neal's Spock's Beard output was largely impeccable, and his solo albums (up until he formed the Neal Morse Band) were just written by him.  MP may have helped with some arrangement, but MP's presence had nothing to do with the songwriting.

Otherwise, I'm not sure what you're talking about.
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Offline hunnus2000

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Re: John Petrucci - Terminal Velocity (Fall 2020)
« Reply #373 on: September 22, 2020, 08:58:47 AM »
I think of it as Dream Theater's "Tales from Topographical Oceans"


As for Terminal Velocity - I've kept it in rotation for the last couple of weeks and I like it, but I've already deleted a couple of the tracks.  The slow one doesn't do a lot for me.  And the last couple of tracks feel a little bit on the phoned-in side.  The first 5 or 6 songs are really great, but it falls off after that.

The last one? I donít entirely disagree about the slow song and Snake In My Boot is kind of a throwaway fun track (which I really enjoy as it reminds me of Van Halen) but canít believe youíre throwing in Temple of Circadia.  Thatís one of the absolute highlights for me if not THE absolute highlight.  The two I donít love are the slow song and The Way Things Fall.

Are you talking about Out of the Blue? That's another one of my favorites because rarely shows this side of his playing. What I love is that he was able to infuse a progressive section that got me to thinking JP - the Oddfather of Progressive Blues.  :metal

Offline Peter Mc

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Re: John Petrucci - Terminal Velocity (Fall 2020)
« Reply #374 on: September 22, 2020, 10:32:55 AM »
I donít dislike it but, if I was going to skip a song (which I donít at the moment) that would probably be it.  Itís probably the one I least look forward to.

Offline the_silent_man

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Re: John Petrucci - Terminal Velocity (Fall 2020)
« Reply #375 on: September 22, 2020, 05:06:38 PM »
Out of the blue is one of my favourites on the album. Precisely because we never hear that side of Petrucci these days.
There was touches of bluesy/jazzy stuff on the early albums, but not for a long time.

Offline Anxiety35

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Re: John Petrucci - Terminal Velocity (Fall 2020)
« Reply #376 on: September 23, 2020, 11:36:45 AM »
 The Oddfather has really grown on me. The soloing about 2/3 of the way through coupled with the rhythm guitar underneath is stellar.

Sometimes you need to keep hearing songs until they finally click with you.

Offline SoundscapeMN

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Re: John Petrucci - Terminal Velocity (Fall 2020)
« Reply #377 on: September 24, 2020, 07:23:28 PM »
new interview with Pete Pardo of Sea of Tranquility
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hy4swS_u5N8

Offline Max Kuehnau

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Re: John Petrucci - Terminal Velocity (Fall 2020)
« Reply #378 on: September 25, 2020, 07:05:54 AM »
new interview with Pete Pardo of Sea of Tranquility
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hy4swS_u5N8
never knew he interviews people too. (but then again I only know his channel by way of him talking about entire discographies by many artists.)
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Offline darkshade

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Re: John Petrucci - Terminal Velocity (Fall 2020)
« Reply #379 on: September 25, 2020, 11:12:27 AM »
new interview with Pete Pardo of Sea of Tranquility
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hy4swS_u5N8
never knew he interviews people too. (but then again I only know his channel by way of him talking about entire discographies by many artists.)

He interviewed Neal Morse pretty recently too.

Offline the_silent_man

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Re: John Petrucci - Terminal Velocity (Fall 2020)
« Reply #380 on: October 30, 2020, 04:52:26 AM »
Out today in physical format.
Anyone picking it up?

Offline the_silent_man

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Re: John Petrucci - Terminal Velocity (Fall 2020)
« Reply #381 on: October 31, 2020, 07:49:34 AM »
Not been forgotten about already has it?  :lol

Offline darkshade

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Re: John Petrucci - Terminal Velocity (Fall 2020)
« Reply #382 on: October 31, 2020, 08:13:21 AM »
My local shop has it, but I thought I read somewhere that Suspended Animation got a re-release? I don't have that one either and was hoping to get both.

Offline hunnus2000

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Re: John Petrucci - Terminal Velocity (Fall 2020)
« Reply #383 on: October 31, 2020, 08:31:40 AM »
I pre-ordered on Amazon and had the option to download the mp3's which I did. I should be getting the CD in the mail soon provided we still have a postal service.

Offline ytserush

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Re: John Petrucci - Terminal Velocity (Fall 2020)
« Reply #384 on: November 01, 2020, 05:21:58 PM »
Out today in physical format.
Anyone picking it up?

Showed up Friday and I put it on the bottom of the unopened pile. Been stuck on the new Fish album. Still haven't decided it the new material is better than Feast Of Consequences but I think is sounds better.  Very well arranged too.