Author Topic: The Last Dance  (Read 2421 times)

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Offline MinistroRaven

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The Last Dance
« on: April 20, 2020, 05:59:52 PM »

Offline hefdaddy42

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Re: The Last Dance
« Reply #1 on: April 21, 2020, 08:06:57 AM »
Watched the first 2 episodes Sunday night.  It was great to relive some of my favorite sports memories, while learning new things about it at the same time.

Can't wait for next Sunday night for episodes 3 and 4!
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Offline MinistroRaven

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Re: The Last Dance
« Reply #2 on: April 21, 2020, 03:55:54 PM »
Watched the first 2 episodes Sunday night.  It was great to relive some of my favorite sports memories, while learning new things about it at the same time.

Can't wait for next Sunday night for episodes 3 and 4!

I am watching on Netflix, sadly I have to wait until Monday. But yeah, Iam also reliving the memories of my childhood with this docuseries. Can't wait for next 2 episodes.

It's ridiculous how little Pippen made (financially) for a contract of 7 years,  and I wonder why Michael never talk for Pippen. Is that something that the leader of the team doesn't do?


Offline hefdaddy42

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Re: The Last Dance
« Reply #3 on: April 22, 2020, 11:54:57 AM »
It's ridiculous how little Pippen made (financially) for a contract of 7 years,  and I wonder why Michael never talk for Pippen. Is that something that the leader of the team doesn't do?
No.  A player's contract is between him, his agent, and the front office.  No other players have anything to do with it.

It is definitely sad that he wasn't being compensated fairly, but at the same time, his dumb ass signed that shitty contract.
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Offline MinistroRaven

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Re: The Last Dance
« Reply #4 on: April 22, 2020, 12:52:01 PM »
You are right, it made sad for him
« Last Edit: April 25, 2020, 03:06:20 PM by MinistroRaven »

Offline contest_sanity

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Re: The Last Dance
« Reply #5 on: April 25, 2020, 03:04:11 PM »
I mean, yeah, he signed it -- but he also had an underlying injury history, came from poverty, and had two disabled family members to take care of. He also didn't have the endorsement dollars that Michael had either. At the very least the owner could have eventually re-negotiated the contract. It's like a young rapper who signs a shitty contract because it's the first time anybody's ever put any money in front of them. Yeah, they signed it, and maybe they should have been more educated, but the label is still being exploitative, just like Reinsdorf knew he was taking advantage of Scottie.

Offline gmillerdrake

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Re: The Last Dance
« Reply #6 on: April 25, 2020, 05:24:04 PM »
Yeah. The wife and I are watching. I posted in the NBA thread that all this is doing is reinforcing the fact that Lebron.....Kobe.....those guys are/we’re really good but they’re not in the same category as Jordan. He....Tiger Woods.....Gretzky, Lemieux......they’re on a different level than their ‘peers’
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Offline MinistroRaven

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Re: The Last Dance
« Reply #7 on: April 27, 2020, 05:19:56 PM »
Last 2 episodes were so great to watch.

Offline faizoff

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Re: The Last Dance
« Reply #8 on: April 27, 2020, 09:39:52 PM »
Going to watch this once it's all done. Only heard amazing things about it.
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Offline gmillerdrake

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Re: The Last Dance
« Reply #9 on: April 27, 2020, 09:41:47 PM »
Really good stuff. And they all have a point about the way the game was played in that era. This last couple generations wouldn’t have been able to handle it. I know this veers off into the old debate like with every other sport......each era being better or whatever......but that game back then was much more physical and tougher to play and excel in.
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Offline hefdaddy42

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Re: The Last Dance
« Reply #10 on: April 28, 2020, 01:52:16 PM »
If Jordan played in today's era, he would average close to 50 points a game.
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Offline gmillerdrake

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Re: The Last Dance
« Reply #11 on: April 28, 2020, 05:37:13 PM »
If Jordan played in today's era, he would average close to 50 points a game.

Agreed. This series is just reminding me of how freaking incredible he was.
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Offline MinistroRaven

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Re: The Last Dance
« Reply #12 on: May 04, 2020, 07:27:08 PM »
Two more great episodes.
Do you think there's more to the story of why MJ retired the first time or was only the pressure of the press?
If everything motivates him to win against Magic, Bord, against their Olympics teammates, against Ewing, Barkley, why the pressure of the press took a heavy toll on Michael?

Offline gmillerdrake

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Re: The Last Dance
« Reply #13 on: May 05, 2020, 11:36:13 AM »
Do you think there's more to the story of why MJ retired the first time or was only the pressure of the press?

 why the pressure of the press took a heavy toll on Michael?

From what I've seen in the documentary.....that life looked miserable. Confined to a hotel room because he literally could not step outside without thousands of people swarming him....everywhere he went. Getting asked the exact same questions over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over  and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over  and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over day after day after day after day after day after day after day after day after day after day after day after day after day after day after day after day after day after day after day after day after day after day after day after day after day after day after day after day after day after day after day after day after day after day after day after day after day.

I can see how that'd eventually wear someone down. Yeah, it's nice to make a lot of money but how much could he actually enjoy it at the time? Zero privacy. I totally thing he retired because of what Magic Johnson said....the media and the attention he received from everyone drove him from the game.
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Offline Cool Chris

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Re: The Last Dance
« Reply #14 on: May 05, 2020, 11:40:04 AM »
Do you think there's more to the story of why MJ retired the first time or was only the pressure of the press?

Temporary suspension due to his excessive gambling :)
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Offline gmillerdrake

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Re: The Last Dance
« Reply #15 on: May 05, 2020, 11:43:02 AM »
Do you think there's more to the story of why MJ retired the first time or was only the pressure of the press?

Temporary suspension due to his excessive gambling :)

If that truly was the case then that was a heck of a cover up. 'If' that was the reason.....it would have leaked by now and had more legs that just rumor and innuendo.
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Offline Cool Chris

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Re: The Last Dance
« Reply #16 on: May 05, 2020, 11:49:17 AM »
It's possible. They've covered up rigging the 1985 draft so Ewing could go to the Knicks all these years. :p
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Offline KevShmev

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Re: The Last Dance
« Reply #17 on: May 05, 2020, 12:06:02 PM »
Do you think there's more to the story of why MJ retired the first time or was only the pressure of the press?

 why the pressure of the press took a heavy toll on Michael?

From what I've seen in the documentary.....that life looked miserable. Confined to a hotel room because he literally could not step outside without thousands of people swarming him....everywhere he went. Getting asked the exact same questions over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over  and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over  and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over day after day after day after day after day after day after day after day after day after day after day after day after day after day after day after day after day after day after day after day after day after day after day after day after day after day after day after day after day after day after day after day after day after day after day after day after day.

I can see how that'd eventually wear someone down. Yeah, it's nice to make a lot of money but how much could he actually enjoy it at the time? Zero privacy. I totally thing he retired because of what Magic Johnson said....the media and the attention he received from everyone drove him from the game.

If that is the case, imagine him playing nowadays when the media and overall attention is 100 times worse thanks to social media, the 24-hours new cycle, internet yappers like us :lol, etc.  I would never question Jordan's greatness, but he had it easy back then compared to athletes nowadays.

Offline gmillerdrake

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Re: The Last Dance
« Reply #18 on: May 05, 2020, 12:42:09 PM »
If that is the case, imagine him playing nowadays when the media and overall attention is 100 times worse thanks to social media, the 24-hours new cycle, internet yappers like us :lol, etc.  I would never question Jordan's greatness, but he had it easy back then compared to athletes nowadays.

I disagree. Yeah, social media is a bear and difficult to deal with but Lebron does not and Kobe did not have to deal with the crowds and demand that Jordan faced. They faced the same pressure on the court and the pressure to win.......and how each handled that is a fun debate.....but the popularity and 'star power' of MJ far exceeded anything Lebron or Kobe faced or had.
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Offline KevShmev

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Re: The Last Dance
« Reply #19 on: May 05, 2020, 08:45:55 PM »
If that is the case, imagine him playing nowadays when the media and overall attention is 100 times worse thanks to social media, the 24-hours new cycle, internet yappers like us :lol, etc.  I would never question Jordan's greatness, but he had it easy back then compared to athletes nowadays.

I disagree. Yeah, social media is a bear and difficult to deal with but Lebron does not and Kobe did not have to deal with the crowds and demand that Jordan faced. They faced the same pressure on the court and the pressure to win.......and how each handled that is a fun debate.....but the popularity and 'star power' of MJ far exceeded anything Lebron or Kobe faced or had.

Well, yes, the MJ brand far exceeds anything else we've ever seen in sports, but what I mean is, had he played in the social media/24-hour news cycle era, his behavior (gambling, etc.) would have faced a lot more scrutiny, which might have affected his brand in a negative way, and there is no way of knowing how he would have reacted to that.  The only little criticism he faced back in the day was, "when will he win a championship."  Everything else about him was untouchable and people often looked at you like you were crazy if you weren't an MJ fan who didn't think he could walk on water. 

Offline MinistroRaven

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Re: The Last Dance
« Reply #20 on: May 12, 2020, 05:52:50 AM »
Next week 2 last episodes. That makes me sad.

Interesting to see how MJ found motivation out of everything that happened or out of everything that was said around him. And also how he pushed ALL of his teammates to be better ALL the time even making him look like a tyrant. WOW.

Offline hefdaddy42

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Re: The Last Dance
« Reply #21 on: May 12, 2020, 12:15:36 PM »
Probably the best 2 episodes thus far.

Looking forward to the finale this weekend!
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Offline XeRocks81

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Re: The Last Dance
« Reply #22 on: May 12, 2020, 07:34:23 PM »
I never paid that much attention to Michael Jordan before watching this, I'm not a sports guy.   He's a fascinating personality,  I've really never seen anyone so driven to win.  You hear that all the time about athletes but him... it's astounding.    I could never stand to be around someone like that, like I said sports was never my thing but as a study of a person It's incredible and I can see why people were obsessed with him.

Offline XeRocks81

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Re: The Last Dance
« Reply #23 on: May 12, 2020, 07:41:14 PM »
also it's weird how history shakes out,  I was 12-13 when MJ retired and played baseball and I remember that even if I didn't follow sports,  he was that big a deal back then EVERYONE knew about that.   But it's only now that I know his dad was murdered horribly right at the same time.   Obviously it was a known thing but when they reported on MJ in mainstream media that bit was often left out, only thing reamining is "isn't it weird that he just up and left to play baseball that one time?" when there was all this context
« Last Edit: May 12, 2020, 10:39:06 PM by XeRocks81 »

Offline Cool Chris

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Re: The Last Dance
« Reply #24 on: May 12, 2020, 10:21:19 PM »
I've really never seen anyone so driven to win.  You hear that all the time about athletes but him... it's astounding. 

Some people have it, some people don't. You can't teach it, and I am not sure you can acquire it.

I am not watching this, and I was ambivalent about him at the time. I grew up rooting for the Showtime Lakers, and enjoyed rooting against the Piston Bad Boys. When the Bulls started dominating, I was anti-dynasty, and was relieved when he left and the Rockets won their two titles (and because they were a fun team to watch), then was annoyed to see another 3-peat. I never liked Jordan as a player, because he was so damn dominating. Which is a lame reason to dislike someone. But I always respected him.

I remember years ago there was a discussion where some black athletes and activists were saying it was imperative for them to give back to their communities. And I don't remember if it was explicitly said, or merely implied, but Jordan was all "eh, no, I earned this money, I will do with it whatever I want, and I don't need you to tell me what I need to do with it." I appreciated his forthrightness.
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Offline KevShmev

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Re: The Last Dance
« Reply #25 on: May 13, 2020, 07:19:02 AM »
In that regard, Michael Jordan and Scottie Pippen are notoriously bad tippers.  Pippen's nickname in Chicago restaurants, bars and whatnot was "Scottie No-Tippin' Pippen." :lol :lol

I remember hearing the story years ago of the time Jordan and Barkley golfed and after Barkley tipped his caddie, when he asked MJ if he was going to tip his, Jordan's response was, "he got to carry my bag; that was his tip."  I already thought Jordan was an a-hole, and hearing that story just reinforced that belief.  Barkley then tipped Jordan's caddie out of his own pocket.

Offline Phoenix87x

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Re: The Last Dance
« Reply #26 on: May 13, 2020, 08:01:24 AM »
Never was really into basketball, but the documentary is awesome. I love seeing the story behind the story.

Offline gmillerdrake

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Re: The Last Dance
« Reply #27 on: May 13, 2020, 01:31:18 PM »
In that regard, Michael Jordan and Scottie Pippen are notoriously bad tippers.  Pippen's nickname in Chicago restaurants, bars and whatnot was "Scottie No-Tippin' Pippen." :lol :lol

I remember hearing the story years ago of the time Jordan and Barkley golfed and after Barkley tipped his caddie, when he asked MJ if he was going to tip his, Jordan's response was, "he got to carry my bag; that was his tip."  I already thought Jordan was an a-hole, and hearing that story just reinforced that belief.  Barkley then tipped Jordan's caddie out of his own pocket.

Must be an elite athlete thing because it's widely known Tiger Woods leaves horrid tips as well. Having worked for tips until my late 20's I near always over tip....unless the rare occasion that the service is SO bad there's no other choice than to just leave the minimum tip. But you really have to suck for me to get to that point  :lol
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Offline KevShmev

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Re: The Last Dance
« Reply #28 on: May 13, 2020, 02:12:22 PM »
Yep, I have heard that about Tiger Woods as well.  He was probably saving up for all of those waitresses he had to pay off to keep quiet about their trysts once his life got exposed...but that's another story for another thread. :lol

Offline MinistroRaven

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Re: The Last Dance
« Reply #29 on: May 25, 2020, 03:52:17 PM »
Finally I watched last 2 episodes.
Great serie. I am glad they were able to release it now and not later as it was supposed.