DT15: A View From The Top Of The World (Timeline for DT15)

[bosk1]

Not sure whether there are plans for a third single.  I haven't heard anything.  But I also haven't asked.

[Chomesuque]

If you put Awake for example and then go straight to ADTOE or DT12, the downgrade is immediately obvious, at least to my ears.

I've actually did that last week and couldn't stop wondering how that could happen with 25 years worth of experience and new technologies. It really doesn't make any sense.

That’s not just DT though, that’s music in general.  Petrucci himself has even commented on the fact that we constantly push visuals forward like, dvd, blu-ray, 4K and beyond but music has gone the other way with the new technology making things worse.  There’s not much money in albums anymore so people don’t spend a ton of money on making them sound great especially when it’s likely just going to end up as some super compressed version on someone’s phone.  If you listen to 80’s albums in general, they sound way better than modern albums.

This is so wrong that is in the involuntary parody territory, sorry. I can understand the case for dynamic range and macro dynamics, but that's it. The money argument makes zero sense, considering a lot of amazing production technology is rather cheap (even more compared to the analogic equivalents), or literally free; yes, a microphone in the thousands of dollars range is good, but it's useless if the rest of choices are bad.

It's completely dependant of the aesthetic, too. Jazz dudes aren't afraid of incorporating Electronic music (Sungazer, DOMi & JD Beck, and Mark Guiliana are pretty popular in the scene) or Hip-Hop influences (everyone and their mother is playing Dilla beats), for example. While the Rock and Metal dudes throw a tantrum when they see a guitar with 8-strings, or a drummer who can play in time, so, back on topic, it's no surprise the aesthetic had no sonic evolution. And even then, Metal albums do sound clearer and better than they did in the '80s, especially when comparing small acts.

So Petrucci was talking out of his arse then when he said sound quality is going backwards while visual quality is getting better and better?  Not my words, the words of one of the world’s top musicians.  You think that people are spending the same amount of money making albums as they used to?

Considering how goddamn boomer-y it sounds, I don't care if John Petrucci or Paul McStraty the 5 licks pentatonic player says it. It's not a fair argument because the availability of recording and production technology is totally different to what it was in the '80s or even '90s; I dare to say it would be silly to spend absurd amounts of money to get a similar (or possibly worse) result than a cheaper one.
Latest Iron Maiden sounds worse than the average bedroom Prog project, and Iron Maiden definitely have a big budget, and the album was mixed by the supposedly competent Kevin Shirley.

Music production isn't getting worse in quality; a lot of Pop albums sound IMMENSELY clear and detailed (BTS and Ariana Grande instantly come to mind), even with a loud master; and going for the '80s thing, Carly Rae Jepsen's Emotion and The Weeknd's After Hours sound clearer than many of the albums of the '80s Pop acts.

Thief are a pretty small band, and The 16 Deaths Of My Master has an impressive production.

So yes, I definitely think Petrucci is talking bullshit. It takes no effort to see that sound quality isn't getting "less clear/defined" or worse, and again and again, technology is incredibly accessible, and that's good.

Yeah, as much as I love JP, I would not give that much credit to this because opinions can vary a lot according to the person, the genre, the direction of the band etc. and to be fair the production of DT12 from DoT has really weird choices even if I like the albums. I mean, it's not gospel truth.

And yes, the new Maiden album sounds awful to me, sonically and musically. I can't wrap my head around how they can be so rich and still have horrible videos and covers in some cases (you know, Dance of Death, Different World...) and production like Senjutsu (I get the old school vibe but it really just sounds flat).

[Glasser]

Well, I officially have a favorite new song even though I love them all.

Edit: And i forgot to say what song, haha! Sleeping Giant.

[bosk1]

Which one?

[Glasser]

Which one?

Sleeping Giant

[bosk1]

Good call (not that there are any bad ones).  That buzzsaw riff is really cool.  And Jordan's "steel drum" patch is oddly fitting.

[Glasser]

Good call (not that there are any bad ones).  That buzzsaw riff is really cool.  And Jordan's "steel drum" patch is oddly fitting.

Yes! And JP's solo around the 8 minute mark, WOW!!! The overall dynamics are outstanding!!!

[Chomesuque]

Good call (not that there are any bad ones).  That buzzsaw riff is really cool. And Jordan's "steel drum" patch is oddly fitting.

Sounds interesting!

[the keyboard wizard]

Which one?

Sleeping Giant

Mine is Transcending Time but I have to admit that Sleeping Giant is well composed.

[LKap13]

Which one?

Sleeping Giant

Mine is Transcending Time but I have to admit that Sleeping Giant is well composed.

You liking this album more than DoT?

[Glasser]

Which one?

Sleeping Giant

Mine is Transcending Time but I have to admit that Sleeping Giant is well composed.

You liking this album more than DoT?

Yes, but I'm not taking anything away from DoT. This is easily my favorite DT album in years and ties my all-time fave ADTOE. It just keeps getting better.

[dream75]

it is very strange that for no one the best is the suite…

[RMGadelha]

Which one?

Sleeping Giant

Mine is Transcending Time but I have to admit that Sleeping Giant is well composed.

You liking this album more than DoT?

Yes, but I'm not taking anything away from DoT. This is easily my favorite DT album in years and ties my all-time fave ADTOE. It just keeps getting better.

ADTOE might not be my all-time favourite (that's 6DOIT), but it's definitely up there and it's my favourite album with MM, so this sounds very intersting.

[bosk1]

it is very strange that for no one the best is the suite…

[GasparXR]

it is very strange that for no one the best is the suite…

I think they mean that no one has said the epic is their favourite song yet. (don't remember if anyone's said that yet either)

[bosk1]

it is very strange that for no one the best is the suite…

I think they mean that no one has said the epic is their favourite song yet. (don't remember if anyone's said that yet either)

Oh.  Well, only two people have said what their favorite is.  So, I guess it is literally true that "no one" has said that song is their favorite.  But out of such a small sample size, that doesn't really say anything. 

[dream75]

it is very strange that for no one the best is the suite…

I think they mean that no one has said the epic is their favourite song yet. (don't remember if anyone's said that yet either)

Oh.  Well, only two people have said what their favorite is.  So, I guess it is literally true that "no one" has said that song is their favorite.  But out of such a small sample size, that doesn't really say anything. 

You are actually right    Which is your favorite? 

[devieira73]

That brazilian reviewer cited Sleeping Giant and the title track as the 2 best songs of the album (in no particular order). By the way, also they would be between the best songs of DT's entire career.

[bosk1]

it is very strange that for no one the best is the suite…

I think they mean that no one has said the epic is their favourite song yet. (don't remember if anyone's said that yet either)

Oh.  Well, only two people have said what their favorite is.  So, I guess it is literally true that "no one" has said that song is their favorite.  But out of such a small sample size, that doesn't really say anything. 

You are actually right    Which is your favorite? 

It's too early to have one.  In no particular order, The Alien, Sleeping Giant, Awaken the Master, and the epic are all up there.  But I haven't digested them enough to have a favorite yet. 

[IDontNotDoThings]

If you put Awake for example and then go straight to ADTOE or DT12, the downgrade is immediately obvious, at least to my ears.

I've actually did that last week and couldn't stop wondering how that could happen with 25 years worth of experience and new technologies. It really doesn't make any sense.

That’s not just DT though, that’s music in general.  Petrucci himself has even commented on the fact that we constantly push visuals forward like, dvd, blu-ray, 4K and beyond but music has gone the other way with the new technology making things worse.  There’s not much money in albums anymore so people don’t spend a ton of money on making them sound great especially when it’s likely just going to end up as some super compressed version on someone’s phone.  If you listen to 80’s albums in general, they sound way better than modern albums.

This is so wrong that is in the involuntary parody territory, sorry. I can understand the case for dynamic range and macro dynamics, but that's it. The money argument makes zero sense, considering a lot of amazing production technology is rather cheap (even more compared to the analogic equivalents), or literally free; yes, a microphone in the thousands of dollars range is good, but it's useless if the rest of choices are bad.

It's completely dependant of the aesthetic, too. Jazz dudes aren't afraid of incorporating Electronic music (Sungazer, DOMi & JD Beck, and Mark Guiliana are pretty popular in the scene) or Hip-Hop influences (everyone and their mother is playing Dilla beats), for example. While the Rock and Metal dudes throw a tantrum when they see a guitar with 8-strings, or a drummer who can play in time, so, back on topic, it's no surprise the aesthetic had no sonic evolution. And even then, Metal albums do sound clearer and better than they did in the '80s, especially when comparing small acts.

So Petrucci was talking out of his arse then when he said sound quality is going backwards while visual quality is getting better and better?  Not my words, the words of one of the world’s top musicians.  You think that people are spending the same amount of money making albums as they used to?

If you're talking about the interview I'm thinking of (DT12-era explaining his excitement for the HDTracks master), that's not what he said. He said that while video quality has gotten better over the past few decades (VHS to DVD to BluRay), we still buy CDs at 16-bit & 44.kHz the same we did in the 80s & 90s.He didn't say audio quality has gotten worse, & he certainly didn't say that recording quality has gotten worse, only that the audio quality sold to us has stagnated until HDTracks.

[Max Kuehnau]

Exactly.

[wasteland]

Hey Bosk, just out of curiosity: how many people do you figure have heard the album at this stage? Less than 100? More than 100 but less than 200?

[dream75]

it is very strange that for no one the best is the suite…

I think they mean that no one has said the epic is their favourite song yet. (don't remember if anyone's said that yet either)

Oh.  Well, only two people have said what their favorite is.  So, I guess it is literally true that "no one" has said that song is their favorite.  But out of such a small sample size, that doesn't really say anything. 

You are actually right    Which is your favorite? 

It's too early to have one.  In no particular order, The Alien, Sleeping Giant, Awaken the Master, and the epic are all up there.  But I haven't digested them enough to have a favorite yet.

Interesting… so do you think The Alien is on the same level as the suite? 

[Glasser]

it is very strange that for no one the best is the suite…

The title track is basically 5 songs within itself. A complete masterpiece.

[dream75]

it is very strange that for no one the best is the suite…

The title track is basically 5 songs within itself. A complete masterpiece.

Wow 5 songs?  Intro, metal part, acoustic part, Mozart moment and grand finale? 

[jayvee3]

it is very strange that for no one the best is the suite…

The title track is basically 5 songs within itself. A complete masterpiece.

Sounds great, can’t wait to hear it!

Out of interest, does the epic have sub-heading titles for the different sections like in some of the other epics (ACOS, 8V, IT), or more just one big song like the Count of Tuscany? No issue if that is info you can’t share, was just interested 😊

[Glasser]

it is very strange that for no one the best is the suite…

The title track is basically 5 songs within itself. A complete masterpiece.

Sounds great, can’t wait to hear it!

Out of interest, does the epic have sub-heading titles for the different sections like in some of the other epics (ACOS, 8V, IT), or more just one big song like the Count of Tuscany? No issue if that is info you can’t share, was just interested 😊

No but I have not seen a hard copy yet. Im pretty sure all promo listeners see it as one title.

[jayvee3]

it is very strange that for no one the best is the suite…

The title track is basically 5 songs within itself. A complete masterpiece.

Sounds great, can’t wait to hear it!

Out of interest, does the epic have sub-heading titles for the different sections like in some of the other epics (ACOS, 8V, IT), or more just one big song like the Count of Tuscany? No issue if that is info you can’t share, was just interested 😊

No but I have not seen a hard copy yet. Im pretty sure all promo listeners see it as one title.

Awesome, appreciate the info great man  Was never a huge deal, but they always had some cool titles for the sub headings..

[bosk1]

Yeah, we do not have physical copies.  For DT, what I usually get is a link to stream it from a secure site one song at a time.  So I don't even have downloadable files.  On the site, the epic reads as one track.  I don't recall it being broken down into movements on the track listing either.  But there are definitely discernable parts to it that have their own identities, like most of DT's mega-epics. 

[TheBarstoolWarrior]

I am very intrigued about the new epic and how it is going to differ from IT, ACOS, 8VM. I assume the band has made a conscious effort to give this new one its own identity.

[darkshade]

it is very strange that for no one the best is the suite…

I think they mean that no one has said the epic is their favourite song yet. (don't remember if anyone's said that yet either)

Oh.  Well, only two people have said what their favorite is.  So, I guess it is literally true that "no one" has said that song is their favorite.  But out of such a small sample size, that doesn't really say anything. 

I recall after Octavarium came out, after the first couple of listens, I wouldn't have called the title track my favorite, it was probably TROAE or Panic Attack. Epics need more time to sink in. I remember finishing my very first listen of the title track very well, and my thought was something like, "well that happened". Couldn't even remember what I listened to.

Now, I think Octavarium is the best song DT ever made. Not saying the epic is always the best song on an album, but give it some time. (also DT15 isn't out yet, so there is no general consensus on anything)

[Glasser]

it is very strange that for no one the best is the suite…

I think they mean that no one has said the epic is their favourite song yet. (don't remember if anyone's said that yet either)

Oh.  Well, only two people have said what their favorite is.  So, I guess it is literally true that "no one" has said that song is their favorite.  But out of such a small sample size, that doesn't really say anything. 

I recall after Octavarium came out, after the first couple of listens, I wouldn't have called the title track my favorite, it was probably TROAE or Panic Attack. Epics need more time to sink in. I remember finishing my very first listen of the title track very well, and my thought was something like, "well that happened". Couldn't even remember what I listened to.

Now, I think Octavarium is the best song DT ever made. Not saying the epic is always the best song on an album, but give it some time. (also DT15 isn't out yet, so there is no general consensus on anything)

Trial of Tears is my favorite song on Falling into Infinity and I consider it an epic. Lines in the Sand is my 2nd favorite.

[TAC]

FII was and is a three song EP for me.

Lines In The Sand
Peruvian Skies
Trial Of Tears


I'll take the Budokan version of Hollow Years.

[Glasser]

FII was and is a three song EP for me.

Lines In The Sand
Peruvian Skies
Trial Of Tears


I'll take the Budokan version of Hollow Years.

Agreed! Peruvian Skies is my 3rd favorite! I don’t mind New Millennium
 tbh. But yes, it would have been a killer ep.

[the keyboard wizard]

Which one?

Sleeping Giant

Mine is Transcending Time but I have to admit that Sleeping Giant is well composed.

You liking this album more than DoT?

TBH, I kinda hated Distance over Time: I have completely rejected it since the first listening (at first I thought I had been handed over a demo as the production was muddy, some editing choices were strange). On the contrary, I liked DT15 instantly. I'm not loving it, it's not THE prog album of the decade and couldn't stand the comparison with the golden age (from WDADU to ToT). But it's easily the best album of the band since...let's say ToT (not to mention the Astonishing which for me is one of the greatest album of DT but is more a side project from JP and JR than a band effort). The production is one of the best if not the best. What a pleasure to hear what John Myung has to say without trying hard to discover where the bass is hidden. What a relief to see that Mangini can astonish us and can sound great (well you can hear that in the singles).

Yes it's a "classic DT album" and is like everything the band has done since Systematic Chaos. Yes, it's the same formula, the same sound but I don't know, the songs are better composed and less messy than the other albums. It seems they have finally found their sound.

As for the epic, for me it's a better version of Illumination Theory but has the same defaults (5 parts fitted into one without abrupt transitions, 5 parts that could have been developped and turned into 5 separate songs).

I'm publishing my review next week in French btw after having listened to the album since mi August (thanks noxon btw) a countless number of times and after having listened to the entire discography to see where the album fits well.