"Classic" album appreciation thread - the '80s

[Kwyjibo]

Bruce Dickinson is the definite metal singer and frontman and here's one testimony of many why that is so. And the rest of the band aren't bad either. Iconic album by an iconic band.

[Stadler]

And Stadler's standard interjection that ""Total Eclipse" has to be part of the discussion" in 3... 2... 1...

"Total Eclipse" has to be part of the discussion.  The band wanted it on there instead of Gangland, and for me, even though it was a b-side, it's probably my favorite Iron Maiden song ever. 

This was my first concert (literally; they opened for Priest) and can be fairly said to have changed my (musical) life.   By the way, as "tired" as some claim it to be, "Number of the Beast" live on this tour might just be the energy highlight of the show.  The crowd around me took it up a notch during that song.  It was ELECTRIC (and yes, Bruce pulled off the scream for the most part). 

[pg1067]

Iron Maiden - Number of the Beast

Songs:
-Invaders
-Children of the Damned
-The Prisoner
-22 Acacia Avenue
-The Number of the Beast
-Run to the Hills
-Gangland
-Hallowed Be Thy Name

Yeah, I know that even posting a track list is somewhat controversial.  But that's the one I'm going with.

The track list is controversial?  Come on....

"Total Eclipse" has to be part of the discussion.

Rolling my eyes (without laughing)....


Not much to say that hasn't been said.  The only "weak link" is Children of the Damned, and that's only because everything else is better.

[TAC]

The Number Of The Beast is a life changing album for me. It is without a doubt the coolest album ever made.

I love Gangland and Total Eclipse will always be a B side to me (sorry Stads!)

I remember Iron Maiden coming here with Judas Priest. I wasn't allowed to go to concerts yet, but in less than a year, I would finally see Iron Maiden on the PoM tour.



And for discussion purposes.....

Bruce Dickinson has always said they never had any media support. I strongly maintain that without MTV and the video to Run To The Hills, Iron maiden would not be where they are today. Bruce's rants on the subject always bugged me, especially in the 80's.

[ReaperKK]

Ok so I've never listened to Iron Maiden, is Number Of The Beast a good starting point?

[Max Kuehnau]

Ok so I've never listened to Iron Maiden, is Number Of The Beast a good starting point?

I guess so yes (add Piece Of Mind too if you want)

[The Walrus]

Ok so I've never listened to Iron Maiden, is Number Of The Beast a good starting point?

Bruce's first album, the band's third - perfect starting point. If you like it, go in chronological order. That 4 album run starting with Number is ridiculously good.

[Stadler]

And for discussion purposes.....

Bruce Dickinson has always said they never had any media support. I strongly maintain that without MTV and the video to Run To The Hills, Iron maiden would not be where they are today. Bruce's rants on the subject always bugged me, especially in the 80's.

That's true; that video - with Bruce with the forearm spikes, then cutting to the old time footage of Indians on horses - was a big part of the draw for me.  And it didn't start there:  they played excerpts from the "Live At The Rainbow" (with Paul Di'Anno) video, too.    "Iron Maiden" and "Wrathschild" were both played in the first 50 videos EVER played on MTV (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_first_music_videos_aired_on_MTV)

[TAC]

Those rainbow vids were my first exposure to them on MTV. MTV played Wrathchild a LOT.  I used to think that that band looked so f'n cool.

[bosk1]

Ok so I've never listened to Iron Maiden, is Number Of The Beast a good starting point?

Short answer:  Yes, BUT...

Here's the thing:  It is a landmark album.  But it is a product of its time.  And that may understandably keep it from clicking for you.  It's a good listen.  But it isn't even close to their best.  Way back when DT were first planning on covering an entire Maiden album, their thought process was along the lines of [and I'm paraphrasing what they have said]:  "We felt like Piece of Mind was a stronger album, and we liked it better.  But Number of the Beast is such a classic that we felt that, if we were going to cover an entire Maiden album, we had to go that route instead."

And here's another big piece of the puzzle that I would include when considering modern Maiden:  They are the quintessential LIVE band.  Their live performances are second to none.  Seriously.  There are only a small handful of bands where, if a fan asked me what to listen to to sample the band, I would recommend a live album instead of a studio album.  So if you want to check Maiden out and see if they are for you, I would recommend sitting down and watching either of these:  (1) Rock In Rio, or (2) En Vivo!  You can find both complete shows on YouTube in HD with good sound.  Honestly, either one of them will do.  I was skeptical of En Vivo!, but a former forum member said it was perhaps THE definitive Maiden live show, and after challenging that view, I watched it and agreed with him.  I think it is the stronger of the two.  But most people you ask would probably go with Rock in Rio.  But you can't go wrong either way.  If you check out one or both of those and you still don't really care for Iron Maiden, I think it is very safe to say that they just aren't for you.  But if you are open to what they do, those will totally hook you.

[The Walrus]

Bosk loves The Final Frontier. Don't trust his judgment on NOTB. It's one of their best. 

[bosk1]

Bosk loves The Final Frontier. Don't trust his judgment on NOTB. It's one of their best. 

I'm not saying it isn't.  I probably rank it around #4 or #5 myself.  But I would not even attempt to argue with anyone who has it at #1.  I'm just saying that, as a NEW fan, it might not be the best place to start, that's all. 

[MirrorMask]

I will never, ever argue the huge, seminal and massive historical importance of The Number of the Beast, but I always favored Piece of Mind and Seventh Son.

It's like with Metallica - yeah, of course Master is where it's at, but I prefer Ride the Lightning.

[TAC]

TNOTB places 3 songs in my Top 10 Maiden songs, including #1.

I understand Bosk's point that a live version of these tracks may not sound as dated as the album itself. It just shows how strong the songs actually are.

[The Walrus]

Bosk loves The Final Frontier. Don't trust his judgment on NOTB. It's one of their best. 

I'm not saying it isn't.  I probably rank it around #4 or #5 myself.  But I would not even attempt to argue with anyone who has it at #1.  I'm just saying that, as a NEW fan, it might not be the best place to start, that's all.

In my defense you did say, "But it isn't even close to their best."

A new fan? My dude. NOTB has Run To The Hills, the title track, and Hallowed Be Thy Name on it. If that's not a great starting place for a new Maiden fan I don't know what is. It was one of my firsts, anyway. I went in chronological order because I was a weird kid

[KevShmev]

Ok so I've never listened to Iron Maiden, is Number Of The Beast a good starting point?

As good as any. It's a solid record by a solid band, nothing more.

[bosk1]

In my defense you did say, "But it isn't even close to their best."

True, but 2 things in response:  (1) In MY defense, although I didn't expressly say it right in that part of my post, I strongly implied that everything in my post was tempered by "in the opinion of this fan" and (2) You don't need to say "in my defense," because there's nothing to defend.  I don't disagree with you much on NOTB's stature.  Not at all.  It's just that...

A new fan? My dude. NOTB has Run To The Hills, the title track, and Hallowed Be Thy Name on it. If that's not a great starting place for a new Maiden fan I don't know what is.

Totally.  Again, it just comes down to the fact that, as an album, it sounds dated.  For a long-time fan, or for a fan who just isn't bothered by that, it isn't an issue at all.  Either way, the strength of the songs is there.  I just think that, for someone just getting into the band, a more modern performance of those songs (along with a sampling of other songs in the live set) is more likely to give them a better picture of the band.  I think most fans agree that Maiden is second-to-none live.  And I know for me at least, as much as I love their studio albums now, I reach for their live albums more than their studio ones.

[The Walrus]

Man it doesn't sound any more dated than any of their other classic 80s records.  I don't think live matters, at least I never take it into account; if a new fan is digging into their music the focus should be on the recordings that will or will not stand up to the test of time rather than some live footage taken when perhaps one of the members might have had an off day and doesn't sound as good as when they recorded the song 30 years ago in their youth. Just my two cents. He can do what he wants 

[bosk1]

Man it doesn't sound any more dated than any of their other classic 80s records. 

Exactly.  Which is why I would ALWAYS recommend any of their live albums over any of their '80s studio albums for a new fan. 

And I think context matters a lot when determining whether an album "stands the test of time."  I know for me, I wouldn't have been able to appreciate NOTB or POM as much as those albums deserve, and wouldn't have really felt that they "stand the test of time" just from listening to them with no context of the band as a whole. 

[MirrorMask]

To me Maiden albums don't sound dated at all. Judas Priest's albums, instead, are VEEERY obviously coming from the '80s (those albums actually released in that decade, I mean), but I don't find anything so "gosh, listen how the '80s was strong in this) in stuff like Aces High, Hallowed Be Thy Name or The Evil that Men Do.

[TAC]

Ok so I've never listened to Iron Maiden, is Number Of The Beast a good starting point?

As good as any. It's a solid record by a solid band, nothing more.

Nothing more?? You think you're a slick motherfucker don't you?

[Stadler]

Yeah, I'm in that camp as well.  Maybe it's because I grew up in that era, but I can name ten albums that sound MORE dated than NOTB.  Birch's production - notoriously dry - has stood the test of time from Stormbringer through Seventh Son.

Here's a question:  QUINTESSENTIAL Maiden song?   Not the "best", but the one that perhaps captures the essence of Maiden in a concise way.

I vote:  the title track to this album.  Musically, lyrically, vocally, solo-ly, that might be the quintessential Maiden song. 

[The Walrus]

Yeah, I'm in that camp as well.  Maybe it's because I grew up in that era, but I can name ten albums that sound MORE dated than NOTB.  Birch's production - notoriously dry - has stood the test of time from Stormbringer through Seventh Son.

Here's a question:  QUINTESSENTIAL Maiden song?   Not the "best", but the one that perhaps captures the essence of Maiden in a concise way.

I vote:  the title track to this album.  Musically, lyrically, vocally, solo-ly, that might be the quintessential Maiden song.

Title track or Hallowed.

[pg1067]

And for discussion purposes.....

Bruce Dickinson has always said they never had any media support. I strongly maintain that without MTV and the video to Run To The Hills, Iron maiden would not be where they are today. Bruce's rants on the subject always bugged me, especially in the 80's.

Interesting.  The video for Flight of Icarus was what first turned me onto Maiden.  Also, videos for Iron Maiden (the song) and Wrathchild were played thrice each on MTV's first day (with the former being the 16th ever video played on the channel).  In fairness, though, that was before Bruce joined.

Here's a question:  QUINTESSENTIAL Maiden song?   Not the "best", but the one that perhaps captures the essence of Maiden in a concise way.

I vote:  the title track to this album.  Musically, lyrically, vocally, solo-ly, that might be the quintessential Maiden song. 

The Trooper.  It's almost nothing but "gallop rhythm" and the I-vi-vii chord progression.  And it's got the historical literature lyrics that Harris does/did so well.

[bosk1]

I agree (although I would put Hallowed as #1, and I would probably put NOTB at #3 or #4 with The Trooper and Rime ahead of it).

Yeah, I'm in that camp as well.  Maybe it's because I grew up in that era, but I can name ten albums that sound MORE dated than NOTB.  Birch's production - notoriously dry - has stood the test of time from Stormbringer through Seventh Son.

Here's a question:  QUINTESSENTIAL Maiden song?   Not the "best", but the one that perhaps captures the essence of Maiden in a concise way.

I vote:  the title track to this album.  Musically, lyrically, vocally, solo-ly, that might be the quintessential Maiden song.

Title track or Hallowed.

I agree (although I would put Hallowed as #1, and I would probably put NOTB at #3 or #4 with The Trooper and Rime ahead of it).

[cramx3]

TNOTB was my first full IM album (I had a greatest hits "Edward the Great") so I think it works fine as your intro to the band.  It only has three of their biggest songs on it.  I personally think it's mid tier album for IM, but that just shows how good they are.

[TAC]

And for discussion purposes.....

Bruce Dickinson has always said they never had any media support. I strongly maintain that without MTV and the video to Run To The Hills, Iron maiden would not be where they are today. Bruce's rants on the subject always bugged me, especially in the 80's.

Interesting.  The video for Flight of Icarus was what first turned me onto Maiden.  Also, videos for Iron Maiden (the song) and Wrathchild were played thrice each on MTV's first day (with the former being the 16th ever video played on the channel).  In fairness, though, that was before Bruce joined.

Even if it was before Bruce joined, he certainly reaped the benefits. I remember the World Premiere of Flight Of Icarus.


But in fairness to Iron Maiden, the two opening slots on consecutive Priest tours really helped them as well. As Stadler can attest, maiden were killing it on those tours, especially the '82 one. Tours in those days played everywhere!

[Max Kuehnau]

Ok so I've never listened to Iron Maiden, is Number Of The Beast a good starting point?

Short answer:  Yes, BUT...

Here's the thing:  It is a landmark album.  But it is a product of its time.  And that may understandably keep it from clicking for you.  It's a good listen.  But it isn't even close to their best.  Way back when DT were first planning on covering an entire Maiden album, their thought process was along the lines of [and I'm paraphrasing what they have said]:  "We felt like Piece of Mind was a stronger album, and we liked it better.  But Number of the Beast is such a classic that we felt that, if we were going to cover an entire Maiden album, we had to go that route instead."

And here's another big piece of the puzzle that I would include when considering modern Maiden:  They are the quintessential LIVE band.  Their live performances are second to none.  Seriously.  There are only a small handful of bands where, if a fan asked me what to listen to to sample the band, I would recommend a live album instead of a studio album.  So if you want to check Maiden out and see if they are for you, I would recommend sitting down and watching either of these:  (1) Rock In Rio, or (2) En Vivo!  You can find both complete shows on YouTube in HD with good sound.  Honestly, either one of them will do.  I was skeptical of En Vivo!, but a former forum member said it was perhaps THE definitive Maiden live show, and after challenging that view, I watched it and agreed with him.  I think it is the stronger of the two.  But most people you ask would probably go with Rock in Rio.  But you can't go wrong either way.  If you check out one or both of those and you still don't really care for Iron Maiden, I think it is very safe to say that they just aren't for you.  But if you are open to what they do, those will totally hook you.

I agree bosk, didn't think of that right away when posting my answer to the question. These two are Maiden at their most "engaging" (maybe? I don't know if that word would apply) and powerful

[KevShmev]

Ok so I've never listened to Iron Maiden, is Number Of The Beast a good starting point?

As good as any. It's a solid record by a solid band, nothing more.

Nothing more?? You think you're a slick motherfucker don't you?

Haha, not at all, just giving my honest opinion. I have tried like hell to really like Iron Maiden, but outside of a few songs here and there, they usually leave me baffled and wondering what all of the hype is about.

[MirrorMask]

Here's a question:  QUINTESSENTIAL Maiden song?   Not the "best", but the one that perhaps captures the essence of Maiden in a concise way.

As others have said: either The Number of the Beast, Hallowed Be Thy Name or The Trooper.

[TAC]

Ok so I've never listened to Iron Maiden, is Number Of The Beast a good starting point?

As good as any. It's a solid record by a solid band, nothing more.

Nothing more?? You think you're a slick motherfucker don't you?

Haha, not at all, just giving my honest opinion. I have tried like hell to really like Iron Maiden, but outside of a few songs here and there, they usually leave me baffled and wondering what all of the hype is about.

Yeah, but I could easily say the same thing about U2, but I would certainly not refer to them as merely solid even though I can't really get into them.

[Max Kuehnau]

Here's a question:  QUINTESSENTIAL Maiden song?   Not the "best", but the one that perhaps captures the essence of Maiden in a concise way.

As others have said: either The Number of the Beast, Hallowed Be Thy Name or The Trooper.

and Alexander The Great, The Rime Of The Ancient Mariner and Seventh Son (and probably Dream Of Mirrors) if you were to include their more explorative tendencies as it were  (IMHO)

[TAC]

I think Dream Of Mirrors might be the most overlooked song in their discography.

[bosk1]

On a side note, I'll just say that, looking down the list of albums discussed so far, if I were stranded on a desert island with just those albums, I couldn't complain too much. 

    

[TAC]

Yeah, well there's no complaining in this thread anyway.