Author Topic: 2019 set list and tour discussion (**KEEP ALL SPOILERS HERE**)  (Read 57821 times)

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Offline krands85

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Re: 2019 set list and tour discussion (**KEEP ALL SPOILERS HERE**)
« Reply #1435 on: January 13, 2020, 10:30:44 AM »
I clicked the above link, did a Dutch to English translate, and got their cookie info.  Then clicked on the 'hier' to get to the article, but have no clue where it is.

Care to help, please?

Quote
Dream Theater is sometimes heavenly beautiful but vocally inadequate ★★★ ☆☆

What is the guitar in the hands of John Petrucci an angel instrument: sometimes beautiful and sparklingly beautiful, then again flaming and strict. The American progmetal band Dream Theater is pretty much built around the same dualism. The men play complicated, opera-like rock with poetic, sometimes enigmatic texts about the human condition.

In the keyboards, the different time signature and the hammering arpeggios you can always hear the progrock tradition, from Emerson, Lake and Palmer to Yes. But Dream Theater can also bite with hard, deliciously sucking metal riffs, which are elevated to art in the interplay of Petrucci with wonder bassist John Myung and drummer Mike Mangini, one of the fastest drummers in the world.

Dream Theater has been a band for music technicians since its foundation in the late 1980s. Last year the album Distance over Time was released , which reaches out to a somewhat less imported audience. The Afas Live also runs full for those fresh songs on Saturday evening, in addition to the obligatory mountain of old work. It is not disappointing: catchy sing-along metal tracks such as Paralyzed and Untethered Angel sound good. Especially thanks to that crystal-clear guitar from Petrucci, which can play so emotionally and melodically and then tear away again at splintering solos.

Unfortunately, Dream Theater is also plagued by problems. James LaBrie's voice is insufficient for the musical splendor of his bandmates. He sings wretchedly, in a limited register. And at the detailed commemoration of the record Metropolis Pt. 2: Scenes from a Memory , which appeared twenty years ago, gives LaBrie epic songs like Home a somewhat ugly hatch. That's a shame, because musically Dream Theater plays wonderfully beautiful for almost three hours, for heart and head, with a razor-sharp hall sound. We must be honest: that is actually enough for a heartwarming rock evening.
Whoaaaahh, ohhh, ohhhhh. Whoaaaahh, ohhhhh, ohhhhhh. Waaah, ahhh, haaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaowwwwww

Offline DragonAttack

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Re: 2019 set list and tour discussion (**KEEP ALL SPOILERS HERE**)
« Reply #1436 on: January 13, 2020, 11:59:20 AM »
^
Thank you.

And, 'Wow!?!'...."wretchedly"....?

Bad night?  He certainly wasn't that way in DC and Baltimore last year.
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Offline jadiggerdt

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Re: 2019 set list and tour discussion (**KEEP ALL SPOILERS HERE**)
« Reply #1437 on: January 13, 2020, 12:06:38 PM »
Labries voice is "toured" do death, The band is touring way to much to be consistent every show, it is fatigue and james suffers The most. Amsterdam and Germany he was very bad
Its not good for James to start with UA as a opener. Hard to sing.

Hopefully it will be better next week  :smiley:

Offline Nachtmerrie

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Re: 2019 set list and tour discussion (**KEEP ALL SPOILERS HERE**)
« Reply #1438 on: January 13, 2020, 12:44:20 PM »
Labries voice is "toured" do death, The band is touring way to much to be consistent every show, it is fatigue and james suffers The most. Amsterdam and Germany he was very bad
Its not good for James to start with UA as a opener. Hard to sing.

Hopefully it will be better next week  :smiley:

I went to the Oberhausen show yesterday and I just can't agree with this. I agree he was struggling with some of the new songs (UA being the best example), especially the higher notes. The older songs (both the regular set and SFAM) were very good if not great. I've seen them live five times over the last few years and he never sounded better to my ears.
In addition to his vocal perfomance I really liked the energy he put into the show and the interaction with the other guys.

Me and my brother had a fantastic evening with SFAM being our main reason to travel to Germany on a Sunday evening.
The sound was very good (also very loud, even with earprotection) and well balanced with honorable mention for Mangini drumsound. So much better compared to the albums, especially his snare. They should really hire Nolly Getgood for the next album ;)


Offline bosk1

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Re: 2019 set list and tour discussion (**KEEP ALL SPOILERS HERE**)
« Reply #1439 on: January 13, 2020, 01:15:01 PM »
The comments on UA are interesting to me.  Last time I saw them, James seemed to struggle with it a bit as well.  But then after that, he was great.  Don't get me wrong--he wasn't "bad" by any stretch on that one.  I would compare it to LSFNY.  On that disk, James sounds to me like he is struggling just a bit to find his power and control on the first couple of songs.  But then about 3 or 4 songs in, he sounds great. I have always felt like it was just a case of getting warmed up and loosening up a bit after the first part of the show, which is perfectly normal for singers, even when they have done a proper per-show warmup.  But I asked James about it after the show, and specifically asked whether he felt like it took him a song or two to really feel warmed up and get going.  He shrugged it off and said he felt great the entire show. 
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Offline Mladen

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Re: 2019 set list and tour discussion (**KEEP ALL SPOILERS HERE**)
« Reply #1440 on: January 13, 2020, 03:05:59 PM »
I feel like he likes to get encouragement from a fan more that "I noticed you struggled in the first two songs." He's had his share of criticism, so maybe even something mild or constructive might be a bit much for him sometimes.

However, that actually is something I noticed on the DT12 tour as well. James started to shine only from The Looking glass onward. The first three songs weren't as spectacular on both shows I saw back then. He could hardly reach the one high note in The Shattered fortress, but continued to nail Trial of tears and the Awake stuff.

EDIT: Yes, it wasn't possible for me to avoid spoilers after all.  :lol

Offline Elite

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Re: 2019 set list and tour discussion (**KEEP ALL SPOILERS HERE**)
« Reply #1441 on: January 13, 2020, 03:12:28 PM »
I feel like from what I've seen live this Saturday, that JLB struggles too much with the higher register in such a way that it becomes almost like 'yelling'; uncontrolled and quite often (slightly) out of tune (and some times a lot so). It's also clear that he doesn't really have the strength in his vocal chords anymore, which is a shame, because on the more restrained moments (the large chunk of The Astonishing is a prime example), like Through Her Eyes, he is very, very good still. I don't think Dream Theater writes their music with the strengths or weaknesses of their front-man in mind and their music could probably be better translated to a live setting if they write the vocal melodies in a lower register. Give the man more dynamics as well, he's either at the top of his lungs, or very restrained.
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Offline bosk1

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Re: 2019 set list and tour discussion (**KEEP ALL SPOILERS HERE**)
« Reply #1442 on: January 13, 2020, 03:28:05 PM »
I feel like he likes to get encouragement from a fan more that "I noticed you struggled in the first two songs." He's had his share of criticism, so maybe even something mild or constructive might be a bit much for him sometimes.

Well, sure.  And I was much more tactful than to suggest he wasn't quite up to snuff on the first song.  I was just paraphrasing here.
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Offline V_R11

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Re: 2019 set list and tour discussion (**KEEP ALL SPOILERS HERE**)
« Reply #1443 on: January 14, 2020, 04:12:45 AM »
I feel like from what I've seen live this Saturday, that JLB struggles too much with the higher register in such a way that it becomes almost like 'yelling'; uncontrolled and quite often (slightly) out of tune (and some times a lot so). It's also clear that he doesn't really have the strength in his vocal chords anymore, which is a shame, because on the more restrained moments (the large chunk of The Astonishing is a prime example), like Through Her Eyes, he is very, very good still. I don't think Dream Theater writes their music with the strengths or weaknesses of their front-man in mind and their music could probably be better translated to a live setting if they write the vocal melodies in a lower register. Give the man more dynamics as well, he's either at the top of his lungs, or very restrained.

Yeah, this is pretty much how I feel. Love the guy and at his prime he might be my favorite vocalist ever. Even today, despite struggling in some heavy and high stuff, James still absolutely shines in softer moments. Wait For Sleep last tour? Magic. Singing aside, I like his stage presence, he really does connect with his audience. That's the kind of thing I missed when seeing Haken, for example.
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Offline IgnotusPerIgnotium

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Re: 2019 set list and tour discussion (**KEEP ALL SPOILERS HERE**)
« Reply #1444 on: January 14, 2020, 04:31:23 AM »
I don't think Dream Theater writes their music with the strengths or weaknesses of their front-man in mind and their music could probably be better translated to a live setting if they write the vocal melodies in a lower register. Give the man more dynamics as well, he's either at the top of his lungs, or very restrained.

Well said,also do you guys remember the first song of his first solo album..it's called His Voice from Mullmuzzler..the verse in this song  where James sing is quite low register but he has this warm, pleasant and distinct LaBrie voice that fits him like a glove in my opinion.. nowadays it is what it is but definitely the band should utilize his strengths of his voice and not unnecessary strain it more..

Offline Bentower

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Re: 2019 set list and tour discussion (**KEEP ALL SPOILERS HERE**)
« Reply #1445 on: January 14, 2020, 04:48:51 AM »
I feel like from what I've seen live this Saturday, that JLB struggles too much with the higher register in such a way that it becomes almost like 'yelling'; uncontrolled and quite often (slightly) out of tune (and some times a lot so). It's also clear that he doesn't really have the strength in his vocal chords anymore, which is a shame, because on the more restrained moments (the large chunk of The Astonishing is a prime example), like Through Her Eyes, he is very, very good still. I don't think Dream Theater writes their music with the strengths or weaknesses of their front-man in mind and their music could probably be better translated to a live setting if they write the vocal melodies in a lower register. Give the man more dynamics as well, he's either at the top of his lungs, or very restrained.

Yeah, this is pretty much how I feel. Love the guy and at his prime he might be my favorite vocalist ever. Even today, despite struggling in some heavy and high stuff, James still absolutely shines in softer moments. Wait For Sleep last tour? Magic. Singing aside, I like his stage presence, he really does connect with his audience. That's the kind of thing I missed when seeing Haken, for example.

Agreed on the Haken part; as much as I like them, their live shows haven't been exactly emotive.

Having said that, I have shed a few tears to Red Giant, so it is possible.

Offline Max Kuehnau

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Re: 2019 set list and tour discussion (**KEEP ALL SPOILERS HERE**)
« Reply #1446 on: January 14, 2020, 05:03:11 AM »
I feel like from what I've seen live this Saturday, that JLB struggles too much with the higher register in such a way that it becomes almost like 'yelling'; uncontrolled and quite often (slightly) out of tune (and some times a lot so). It's also clear that he doesn't really have the strength in his vocal chords anymore, which is a shame, because on the more restrained moments (the large chunk of The Astonishing is a prime example), like Through Her Eyes, he is very, very good still. I don't think Dream Theater writes their music with the strengths or weaknesses of their front-man in mind and their music could probably be better translated to a live setting if they write the vocal melodies in a lower register. Give the man more dynamics as well, he's either at the top of his lungs, or very restrained.

Yeah, this is pretty much how I feel. Love the guy and at his prime he might be my favorite vocalist ever. Even today, despite struggling in some heavy and high stuff, James still absolutely shines in softer moments. Wait For Sleep last tour? Magic. Singing aside, I like his stage presence, he really does connect with his audience. That's the kind of thing I missed when seeing Haken, for example.

Agreed on the Haken part; as much as I like them, their live shows haven't been exactly emotive.

Having said that, I have shed a few tears to Red Giant, so it is possible.
referring to what's bolded, I'm not overly familiar with Haken, and it's your opinion that they're not emotive (which I respect of course), but: Do concerts actually have to be emotive? (it's hard for me to imagine, that's why I ask, and I'm not an emotional person at all)
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Offline Bentower

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Re: 2019 set list and tour discussion (**KEEP ALL SPOILERS HERE**)
« Reply #1447 on: January 14, 2020, 05:33:02 AM »
I feel like from what I've seen live this Saturday, that JLB struggles too much with the higher register in such a way that it becomes almost like 'yelling'; uncontrolled and quite often (slightly) out of tune (and some times a lot so). It's also clear that he doesn't really have the strength in his vocal chords anymore, which is a shame, because on the more restrained moments (the large chunk of The Astonishing is a prime example), like Through Her Eyes, he is very, very good still. I don't think Dream Theater writes their music with the strengths or weaknesses of their front-man in mind and their music could probably be better translated to a live setting if they write the vocal melodies in a lower register. Give the man more dynamics as well, he's either at the top of his lungs, or very restrained.

Yeah, this is pretty much how I feel. Love the guy and at his prime he might be my favorite vocalist ever. Even today, despite struggling in some heavy and high stuff, James still absolutely shines in softer moments. Wait For Sleep last tour? Magic. Singing aside, I like his stage presence, he really does connect with his audience. That's the kind of thing I missed when seeing Haken, for example.

Agreed on the Haken part; as much as I like them, their live shows haven't been exactly emotive.

Having said that, I have shed a few tears to Red Giant, so it is possible.
referring to what's bolded, I'm not overly familiar with Haken, and it's your opinion that they're not emotive (which I respect of course), but: Do concerts actually have to be emotive? (it's hard for me to imagine, that's why I ask, and I'm not an emotional person at all)

Not necessarily, sometimes it's sufficient if the band kicks ass, but when it comes to prog metal my favourite bands are ones that do move me. I'm talking DT, Fates Warning, Pain of Salvation, Andromeda and to some extent Symphony X as well.

Offline DragonAttack

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Re: 2019 set list and tour discussion (**KEEP ALL SPOILERS HERE**)
« Reply #1448 on: January 14, 2020, 07:31:56 AM »
As to setlist changes...since they did such a beautiful cover of 'Tears' years ago, it would have been a wonderful homage to have done this a couple of times in recent days.
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Offline jadiggerdt

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Re: 2019 set list and tour discussion (**KEEP ALL SPOILERS HERE**)
« Reply #1449 on: January 14, 2020, 07:48:49 AM »

Offline Max Kuehnau

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Re: 2019 set list and tour discussion (**KEEP ALL SPOILERS HERE**)
« Reply #1450 on: January 14, 2020, 08:08:34 AM »
Review from Oberhausen https://www.soundz.nl/metalband-dream-theater/
I don't speak any Dutch, but (given I'm German) I think the headline would translate as "Has Dream Theater's popularity ended?" (I think it didn't though)
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Offline pg1067

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Re: 2019 set list and tour discussion (**KEEP ALL SPOILERS HERE**)
« Reply #1451 on: January 14, 2020, 09:50:09 AM »
Review from Oberhausen https://www.soundz.nl/metalband-dream-theater/
I don't speak any Dutch, but (given I'm German) I think the headline would translate as "Has Dream Theater's popularity ended?" (I think it didn't though)

The first paragraph of the article (from Google Translate):

"Is the popularity of Dream Theater waning?  It appears so.  Unlike ten years ago, the band is no longer able to sell out the pop stages in the Netherlands.  Even with the legendary album "Metropolis, Pt. 2: Scenes from a Memory Ēas an eye catcher, the band around master guitarist and Sena European Guitar Award winner John Petrucci will not sell out the AFAS Live venue.  Dream Theater plays no less and puts on a sublime show full of highlights."

A subsequent paragraph:  "Broken by the loss of Neil Peart, drummer of Rush and most important inspiration for the band, Dream Theater sometimes has a difficult time, but fun is what ultimately prevails.  Singer James Labrie, dressed in a black metal shirt, makes love with his microphone stand (with cool skull!) as if it were his wife and plays the audience in his own unique way."

Makes love to the microphone stand as if it were his wife?!?!   :lol :lol

Regarding JLB's singing:

"James LaBrie is performing as expected tonight, and that is extremely changeable. Potentially, the 56-year-old Canadian, not for nothing a good musical friend of Ayreon, has one of the most beautiful voices in the prog metal. His soft voice has been creating a beautiful atmosphere for decades and his biting and spitting outbursts often match the picture Dream Theater is trying to paint. But LaBrie has also grown old and is challenging itself too much. Many swings are false, stretched too long and often unnecessary."

And, later in the article:  "So LaBrie is often wrong when it comes to high notes and strokes, but the rest is of such a level that it doesn't matter that much."

In closing:  "They are less popular, but certainly no less good."
"There's a bass solo in a song called Metropolis where I do a bass solo."  John Myung

Offline Max Kuehnau

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Re: 2019 set list and tour discussion (**KEEP ALL SPOILERS HERE**)
« Reply #1452 on: January 14, 2020, 10:14:46 AM »
Less popular is not true btw, given the chart positions of D/T (2 No. 1's, 17 top 10ers, among others) That makes D/T their best selling album in history as of now, I think.
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Re: 2019 set list and tour discussion (**KEEP ALL SPOILERS HERE**)
« Reply #1453 on: January 14, 2020, 10:16:58 AM »
 :rollin

Also, just looked and they've been playing that same venue for a long time now in the Netherlands.  Not sure there's any indication from that as being less popular these days. 

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Re: 2019 set list and tour discussion (**KEEP ALL SPOILERS HERE**)
« Reply #1454 on: January 14, 2020, 10:18:38 AM »
:rollin

Also, just looked and they've been playing that same venue for a long time now in the Netherlands.  Not sure there's any indication from that as being less popular these days.
and it's fairly large too. Not as big as Ziggo Dome but sizeable enough I guess.
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Re: 2019 set list and tour discussion (**KEEP ALL SPOILERS HERE**)
« Reply #1455 on: January 14, 2020, 10:27:30 AM »
Yea, I'm familiar with it.  I stay at the holiday inn right next to it when I work in Amsterdam.  It's much bigger than anywhere they play in the states.  Also looks like a cool venue, I've never been to a show there sadly.  Been to the Ziggo Dome once, that place is cool too but that's an arena.  AFAS live is huge general admission, such a different type of venue than I'm used to seeing DT at (seated 2k capacity theaters).

Offline Luoto

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Re: 2019 set list and tour discussion (**KEEP ALL SPOILERS HERE**)
« Reply #1456 on: January 14, 2020, 10:54:14 AM »
Less popular is not true btw, given the chart positions of D/T (2 No. 1's, 17 top 10ers, among others) That makes D/T their best selling album in history as of now, I think.

Best chart performance != Best-selling in history ;) Measuring popularity by commercial sales is also not as accurate as it used to be, but there probably hasn't been any notable change.
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Offline pg1067

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Re: 2019 set list and tour discussion (**KEEP ALL SPOILERS HERE**)
« Reply #1457 on: January 14, 2020, 11:16:58 AM »
Less popular is not true btw, given the chart positions of D/T (2 No. 1's, 17 top 10ers, among others) That makes D/T their best selling album in history as of now, I think.

How an album charts isn't necessarily a good indicator of sales.  In the U.S. (the most populous country that has "charts"), DOT only hit #24, which makes it the lowest charting DT album in the U.S. since Octavarium.*  You have to balance this with the higher peak numbers of comparatively less populous countries.**  I have no idea if reliable, overall sales information is available anywhere online.  An album that hits #1, stays there briefly, and then quickly falls off the charts probably isn't going to sell as many copies as an album that peaks in the 20s but stays on the charts for several months.  Also, there's not a clean correlation between album sales and concert attendance.  An artist can continue to have strong album sales but low concert attendance.

* - The top 6 are BC&SL (#6), DT12 (#7), ADTOE (#8), TA (#11), SC (#19) and DOT (#24).  Interestingly (at least to me), SFAM appears to be DT's lowest charting studio album in the U.S. (not including WDADU, which didn't chart at all).  Not sure what conclusions can be drawn from this.

** - The two countries where DOT charted at #1 (Germany and Switzerland) have combined populations that are much less than 1/3 of the population of the U.S.
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Offline Nachtmerrie

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Re: 2019 set list and tour discussion (**KEEP ALL SPOILERS HERE**)
« Reply #1458 on: January 14, 2020, 12:44:23 PM »
I feel like from what I've seen live this Saturday, that JLB struggles too much with the higher register in such a way that it becomes almost like 'yelling'; uncontrolled and quite often (slightly) out of tune (and some times a lot so). It's also clear that he doesn't really have the strength in his vocal chords anymore, which is a shame, because on the more restrained moments (the large chunk of The Astonishing is a prime example), like Through Her Eyes, he is very, very good still. I don't think Dream Theater writes their music with the strengths or weaknesses of their front-man in mind and their music could probably be better translated to a live setting if they write the vocal melodies in a lower register. Give the man more dynamics as well, he's either at the top of his lungs, or very restrained.

Exactly how I feel about the higher register. The lower register still fits him perfect. The songs from SC & BCASL are some good examples and the same goes for some of the Distance over Time Songs (no spoiler). Ballads like Trough Her Eyes and One Last Time were perfect.
If they really care for his perfomance they  have to make some hard setlist choices in the future and stop playing songs that are too demanding for his voice.



Offline Tomislav95

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Re: 2019 set list and tour discussion (**KEEP ALL SPOILERS HERE**)
« Reply #1459 on: January 14, 2020, 01:25:31 PM »
Yeah, same.
I'm not surprised he's struggling when singing higher songs from IaW or even SFAM but don't understand what were they thinking with , for example, Untethered Angel. He recorded that song only 2 years (?) ago, he must have struggled in studio as well. However, nothing against him, love him to death. Would like to hear them do a tour with songs only in his middle or low register.
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Offline Thierry

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Re: 2019 set list and tour discussion (**KEEP ALL SPOILERS HERE**)
« Reply #1460 on: January 14, 2020, 01:39:03 PM »
I decided to skip this tour as I canít stand Labrieís live voice anymore. He is off pitch way too often. Too bad cause the latest album is pretty good.

Offline Max Kuehnau

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Re: 2019 set list and tour discussion (**KEEP ALL SPOILERS HERE**)
« Reply #1461 on: January 14, 2020, 01:50:47 PM »
Yeah, same.
I'm not surprised he's struggling when singing higher songs from IaW or even SFAM but don't understand what were they thinking with , for example, Untethered Angel. He recorded that song only 2 years (?) ago, he must have struggled in studio as well. However, nothing against him, love him to death. Would like to hear them do a tour with songs only in his middle or low register.
you could hear them do that if you attended the Met2 tour. Met2 entirely consists of James' middle and low registers I would guess. Most of the other pieces had that too. (in the show I attended in October of 2000, Learning To Live being the exception though.)
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Re: 2019 set list and tour discussion (**KEEP ALL SPOILERS HERE**)
« Reply #1462 on: January 14, 2020, 04:47:51 PM »
Less popular is not true btw, given the chart positions of D/T (2 No. 1's, 17 top 10ers, among others) That makes D/T their best selling album in history as of now, I think.

How an album charts isn't necessarily a good indicator of sales.  In the U.S. (the most populous country that has "charts"), DOT only hit #24, which makes it the lowest charting DT album in the U.S. since Octavarium.*  You have to balance this with the higher peak numbers of comparatively less populous countries.**  I have no idea if reliable, overall sales information is available anywhere online.  An album that hits #1, stays there briefly, and then quickly falls off the charts probably isn't going to sell as many copies as an album that peaks in the 20s but stays on the charts for several months.  Also, there's not a clean correlation between album sales and concert attendance.  An artist can continue to have strong album sales but low concert attendance.

* - The top 6 are BC&SL (#6), DT12 (#7), ADTOE (#8), TA (#11), SC (#19) and DOT (#24).  Interestingly (at least to me), SFAM appears to be DT's lowest charting studio album in the U.S. (not including WDADU, which didn't chart at all).  Not sure what conclusions can be drawn from this.

** - The two countries where DOT charted at #1 (Germany and Switzerland) have combined populations that are much less than 1/3 of the population of the U.S.

Yes, but the way these things are measured has changed a couple times over the last few years to include streaming and stuff like that. I'm too lazy to search for it, but I remember someone here in DTF made the math when these numbers were posted and the "real" measure was much higher than what it ended up being for D/T.

One of the cons of counting online streams here is that a lot of pop/rap/whatever artists release super short albums that get streamed over and over and over by their fanbases and get stuck at the top positions on the charts.
It sounds like, "ruk, ruk, ruk, ruk, ruk." Instead of the more pleasing kick drum sound of, "gzarruk, gzarruk, gzarruk, gzarruk."

Offline pg1067

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Re: 2019 set list and tour discussion (**KEEP ALL SPOILERS HERE**)
« Reply #1463 on: January 14, 2020, 05:30:04 PM »
Less popular is not true btw, given the chart positions of D/T (2 No. 1's, 17 top 10ers, among others) That makes D/T their best selling album in history as of now, I think.

How an album charts isn't necessarily a good indicator of sales.  In the U.S. (the most populous country that has "charts"), DOT only hit #24, which makes it the lowest charting DT album in the U.S. since Octavarium.*  You have to balance this with the higher peak numbers of comparatively less populous countries.**  I have no idea if reliable, overall sales information is available anywhere online.  An album that hits #1, stays there briefly, and then quickly falls off the charts probably isn't going to sell as many copies as an album that peaks in the 20s but stays on the charts for several months.  Also, there's not a clean correlation between album sales and concert attendance.  An artist can continue to have strong album sales but low concert attendance.

* - The top 6 are BC&SL (#6), DT12 (#7), ADTOE (#8), TA (#11), SC (#19) and DOT (#24).  Interestingly (at least to me), SFAM appears to be DT's lowest charting studio album in the U.S. (not including WDADU, which didn't chart at all).  Not sure what conclusions can be drawn from this.

** - The two countries where DOT charted at #1 (Germany and Switzerland) have combined populations that are much less than 1/3 of the population of the U.S.

Yes, but the way these things are measured has changed a couple times over the last few years to include streaming and stuff like that. I'm too lazy to search for it, but I remember someone here in DTF made the math when these numbers were posted and the "real" measure was much higher than what it ended up being for D/T.

One of the cons of counting online streams here is that a lot of pop/rap/whatever artists release super short albums that get streamed over and over and over by their fanbases and get stuck at the top positions on the charts.

I don't disagree (and honestly have no more than the most general idea about what chart position represents), but the ultimate point is that, whatever chart position represents, it's a very different thing from concert attendance.

The article asserted that it appears that DT's popularity is waning.  Possible translation issues aside, I think it's pretty clear from context that the article is talking about popularity in terms of concert attendance, which is not tied (directly or even indirectly) to album sales.  I don't think the article is attempting to make any more of a point than that.  If I'm right, Max's response that "Less popular is not true" because of how DOT performed on various countries' charts doesn't really stand up to scrutiny.  Moreover, given the use of the word "waning" (and again, ignoring issues resulting from the use of Google Translate), the chart positions (at least in the U.S.) bear out the assertion that popularity is waning.  SC hit #19 and was followed by BC&SL at #6, which was the best a DT album ever did on the U.S. charts.  The next two albums performed almost as well (#8 for ADTOE and #7 for DT12), and then the next two albums have shown a steady decline (TA at #11 and DOT at #24.

However, since we're dealing with a Dutch article, it's worth that DT's six most recent studio albums all hit somewhere between #2-4 on the Dutch charts, so the band's chart performance in the Netherlands has been much more consistent than in the U.S.
"There's a bass solo in a song called Metropolis where I do a bass solo."  John Myung

Offline Peter Mc

  • Posts: 535
Re: 2019 set list and tour discussion (**KEEP ALL SPOILERS HERE**)
« Reply #1464 on: January 14, 2020, 07:32:29 PM »
You guys are obviously all going to different DT shows than me because Iíve yet to see a show where La Brie wasnít excellent. Performances range from very good to absolutely superb based on 25 years worth of shows.

Offline geeeemo

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Re: 2019 set list and tour discussion (**KEEP ALL SPOILERS HERE**)
« Reply #1465 on: January 14, 2020, 07:54:57 PM »
I have seen this show 3x so far. It is true, he is a tad pitchy on UA and BW. But that is it. Scenes is soo good and he hits everything on it!

Offline JRuless

  • Posts: 124
Re: 2019 set list and tour discussion (**KEEP ALL SPOILERS HERE**)
« Reply #1466 on: January 15, 2020, 03:15:06 AM »
:rollin

Also, just looked and they've been playing that same venue for a long time now in the Netherlands.  Not sure there's any indication from that as being less popular these days.
and it's fairly large too. Not as big as Ziggo Dome but sizeable enough I guess.

No not at all! They've played the same venue several times when it was called 'Heineken Music Hall' indeed. As far as I remember (first time seeing them there in 2005 (special 2 nights) it was never sold out, but always filled. And it was crowdy this time, as seen on the stage image at DT Facebook.

For me, much more than the JLB thing, DT has to take in account their (over)mechanical performance and sound. Especially in their new stuff. There seem to be an intended difference in stage sound production between DOT songs and SFAM. DOT sounded like a brickwalled production and SFAM much more dynamic, like the sound engineer was changing presets.

For me it was the first time seeing DT as a machine and it bothered me. Very well oiled, big horsepower. But in no time out of sight as well. I want to see a band with a heart, not a machine.  And I never had that feeling this strong and hopefully it is just me....

Offline nikatapi

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Re: 2019 set list and tour discussion (**KEEP ALL SPOILERS HERE**)
« Reply #1467 on: January 15, 2020, 04:01:25 AM »

For me, much more than the JLB thing, DT has to take in account their (over)mechanical performance and sound. Especially in their new stuff. There seem to be an intended difference in stage sound production between DOT songs and SFAM. DOT sounded like a brickwalled production and SFAM much more dynamic, like the sound engineer was changing presets.

For me it was the first time seeing DT as a machine and it bothered me. Very well oiled, big horsepower. But in no time out of sight as well. I want to see a band with a heart, not a machine.  And I never had that feeling this strong and hopefully it is just me....

I can agree with this. When i saw the band in 2011, they all seemed more relaxed and gave a more genuine feel with their performance. The last show i saw, felt like a good show in terms of performance, but as you said felt like a machine. And this is a general feel i get with the band these days, like it's a professional thing but not genuinely artistic.

Offline jadiggerdt

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Re: 2019 set list and tour discussion (**KEEP ALL SPOILERS HERE**)
« Reply #1468 on: January 15, 2020, 07:08:31 AM »
Well spot on. From Swedish paper today from Stockholm.

https://www.dn.se/kultur-noje/dream-theatre-levererar-mer-teknik-an-spelgladje-pa-cirkus/

Some swedish fans her with + access :)

Offline cminor

  • Posts: 5
Re: 2019 set list and tour discussion (**KEEP ALL SPOILERS HERE**)
« Reply #1469 on: January 15, 2020, 07:44:40 AM »
I have seen this show 3x so far. It is true, he is a tad pitchy on UA and BW. But that is it. Scenes is soo good and he hits everything on it!

I want to add some things. I saw them in Oberhausen last sunday and I agree that JLB had his most pitchy parts in the songs you mentioned (although overall he sang both songs really good that night!) but I do not agree that he hits everything in SFAM. Not at all. He really often hit the notes spot on (which was great!) but then he let his voice drift away. He did this quite frequently, which makes me guess he even did it on purpose.

I also found this video of Home in Amsterdam and to me he basically sings out of tune the whole song. Especially in the first verse and the first bridge (around 3:50 in the video). it seems as if he is some microtones off (to his defence maybe he did not hear the other instruments well?).

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tuUA4jZGofM&t=3m04s