Author Topic: Ticketmaster finally going down?  (Read 15656 times)

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Offline Setlist Scotty

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Ticketmaster finally going down?
« on: September 24, 2018, 12:31:10 PM »
I sure hope Ticketblaster is going down. I always knew they were scum, but never realized how bad it was until I read this article a couple days ago:
https://www.cbc.ca/news/business/a-public-relations-nightmare-ticketmaster-recruits-pros-for-secret-scalper-program-1.4828535

Thoughts?
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Offline Stadler

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Re: Ticketmaster finally going down?
« Reply #1 on: September 24, 2018, 12:45:51 PM »
Well, the upshot of all of this is going to be higher ticket prices for everyone, across the board, and likely something like the way the airline books tickets.  You will be at a show where you paid $375 dollars for a seat through the box office, and the person to your left will have paid $450, and the guy on the right will have paid $175, all to the same box office.

Tickets have an after market in part because they are priced so low to begin with (finite supply of seats is another, but that kind of gets minimized as the general price goes up).   

Either way, we pay.   

Offline Grappler

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Re: Ticketmaster finally going down?
« Reply #2 on: September 24, 2018, 01:16:33 PM »
The re-selling thing doesn't really bother me as much as the claim that Ticketmaster doesn't release all of the tickets at once.  They hold back sections to create artificial demand and then adjust pricing on the fly.  We all know that we battle re-sellers and bots for tickets.  But to know that we're battling them for a limited number of seats and not the full venue allotment of seats really sucks.

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Re: Ticketmaster finally going down?
« Reply #3 on: September 24, 2018, 01:34:02 PM »
I just have never understood why things have to be so deceptive in the first place. There should be a lot more sections for shows, especially near the front. in an arena and want front 3 rows on the floor? That's $400. Want next 5? That's $250. Want to the end of the first orchestra? That's $150. Rest of the orchestra $100.

If you think about it it's just stupid that the front row and last row at the other end of the very long floor go for the same price to begin with.

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Re: Ticketmaster finally going down?
« Reply #4 on: September 24, 2018, 01:45:38 PM »
I sure hope Ticketblaster is going down. I always knew they were scum, but never realized how bad it was until I read this article a couple days ago:
https://www.cbc.ca/news/business/a-public-relations-nightmare-ticketmaster-recruits-pros-for-secret-scalper-program-1.4828535

Thoughts?

I think most people who buy and follow ticket sales have figured this was happening.  Also, I would never have used the ticketmaster resell part because it is almost always more expensive than Stubhub and they don't allow you to sell tickets under face value unless the tickets are all sold so it's really not a good tool for the end user IMO.  I don't think this will be the end of them though.  They've had plenty of scandals already.  It would be nice if this helps clean things up though and makes it better for the user (which I feel Livenation's use of selecting the actual seat has done).  But I don't expect things to get any better from this.

Offline El Barto

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Re: Ticketmaster finally going down?
« Reply #5 on: September 24, 2018, 02:03:06 PM »
This won't hurt Ticketmaster for the simple reason that Ticketmaster's customers have no reason to complain.

And for the record, if TM did go down we'd all suffer as a result. I think it's nothing short of miraculous that competition has been able to emerge in the ticketing world. However, the truth is that TM generally beats the ever-loving shit out of its competitors. AXS? Christ, those guys are terrible. TM beats the competition, and the competition milks the same exorbitant service fees anyway, so they don't actually save us anything.

Best plan is simply to learn how to play the game. I've done exceptionally well with tickets over the last dozen or so years.
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Re: Ticketmaster finally going down?
« Reply #6 on: September 24, 2018, 02:06:02 PM »
Oh totally agree about AXS, I absolutely hate buying tickets through them but my local club venue only uses them so I am stuck sometimes.  I got tickets through them last week and they want 15 dollars to ship you a ticket, are you fucking kidding me?  Now I have to use their shitty app to present my ticket at the venue.

Offline ytserush

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Re: Ticketmaster finally going down?
« Reply #7 on: September 30, 2018, 12:53:22 PM »
Not really news.

 But I've been done with ticketbastard (Still ignoring their settlement emails too.) since Rush retired.

Been going to shows that either don't use ticketbastard or I wait and get tickets the day of the show. (Though it's more a case of seeing bands that don't use them.)

I used to get a lot more bent out of shape over this but I don't let it bother me now. For the most part, I just refuse to buy in anymore.

Offline Anguyen92

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Re: Ticketmaster finally going down?
« Reply #8 on: September 30, 2018, 03:03:23 PM »
Let's see here.  Out of the five concerts that I'm going to this year, I've only used Ticketmaster once to get a ticket and that one show, which is Owl City, I was a bit mad about paying it because of the additional "service fee."  I paid $36.00 for the ticket, but $11.00 of that was in fees and I'm like, "What the heck do you guys do to warrant that charge?"  I mean if the consumers are more well-informed by Live Nation/Ticketmaster on what they do to warrant tacking this fee and it is actually justified, I don't think people would be as angry about paying fees that's at least a third of the face value ticket price.  They will still be angry nonetheless since, well, no one wants to pay any additional fees on top of the face value of the ticket.

Oddly enough, me paying $36.00 is in the middle in terms of how much I paid for a ticket this year.  I've paid only $25-$26.00 using another site but those were in smaller venues filling around 300-500 people (seeing Big Wreck and Myles Kennedy) and I paid $40 and $50 and that was at a discounted price using Groupon (seeing Lindsey Stirling/Evanescence with an orchestra, and going to see the Trans-Siberian Orchestra).

Offline El Barto

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Re: Ticketmaster finally going down?
« Reply #9 on: October 02, 2018, 09:24:55 AM »
Oh totally agree about AXS, I absolutely hate buying tickets through them but my local club venue only uses them so I am stuck sometimes.  I got tickets through them last week and they want 15 dollars to ship you a ticket, are you fucking kidding me?  Now I have to use their shitty app to present my ticket at the venue.
Yep. Twenty-five dollars to see Haken, plus 6.80 for my convenience, plus 2 more for handling, plus 2.5 for a stamp. And the AXS website is awful. But down with Ticketbastard, I guess?  :lol
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Offline Stadler

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Re: Ticketmaster finally going down?
« Reply #10 on: October 02, 2018, 10:17:05 AM »
Let's see here.  Out of the five concerts that I'm going to this year, I've only used Ticketmaster once to get a ticket and that one show, which is Owl City, I was a bit mad about paying it because of the additional "service fee."  I paid $36.00 for the ticket, but $11.00 of that was in fees and I'm like, "What the heck do you guys do to warrant that charge?"  I mean if the consumers are more well-informed by Live Nation/Ticketmaster on what they do to warrant tacking this fee and it is actually justified, I don't think people would be as angry about paying fees that's at least a third of the face value ticket price.  They will still be angry nonetheless since, well, no one wants to pay any additional fees on top of the face value of the ticket.

Oddly enough, me paying $36.00 is in the middle in terms of how much I paid for a ticket this year.  I've paid only $25-$26.00 using another site but those were in smaller venues filling around 300-500 people (seeing Big Wreck and Myles Kennedy) and I paid $40 and $50 and that was at a discounted price using Groupon (seeing Lindsey Stirling/Evanescence with an orchestra, and going to see the Trans-Siberian Orchestra).

Wait a second, though;  it's only "tacked on"  if you can buy that ticket for $25.00 somewhere else.   If the end price of the ticket is the same no matter where you go, then it matters not if it is "$36.00 for the ticket and $0.00 fees" or "$1.00 for the ticket and $35.00 for fees".  Part of the deal a couple years ago was that they weren't "transparent enough", so they added the detail.  Now, the detail is bad.   

Couple that with the fact that concert tickets are literally the only common marketable good with a significant, regular secondary market (which means that the pricing is well below that which should  be based on supply and demand) and it makes me scratch my head, for real.  The alternative is not in any possible universe a $25.00 ticket with no fee. 

Offline El Barto

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Re: Ticketmaster finally going down?
« Reply #11 on: October 02, 2018, 10:25:22 AM »
Let's see here.  Out of the five concerts that I'm going to this year, I've only used Ticketmaster once to get a ticket and that one show, which is Owl City, I was a bit mad about paying it because of the additional "service fee."  I paid $36.00 for the ticket, but $11.00 of that was in fees and I'm like, "What the heck do you guys do to warrant that charge?"  I mean if the consumers are more well-informed by Live Nation/Ticketmaster on what they do to warrant tacking this fee and it is actually justified, I don't think people would be as angry about paying fees that's at least a third of the face value ticket price.  They will still be angry nonetheless since, well, no one wants to pay any additional fees on top of the face value of the ticket.

Oddly enough, me paying $36.00 is in the middle in terms of how much I paid for a ticket this year.  I've paid only $25-$26.00 using another site but those were in smaller venues filling around 300-500 people (seeing Big Wreck and Myles Kennedy) and I paid $40 and $50 and that was at a discounted price using Groupon (seeing Lindsey Stirling/Evanescence with an orchestra, and going to see the Trans-Siberian Orchestra).

Wait a second, though;  it's only "tacked on"  if you can buy that ticket for $25.00 somewhere else.   If the end price of the ticket is the same no matter where you go, then it matters not if it is "$36.00 for the ticket and $0.00 fees" or "$1.00 for the ticket and $35.00 for fees".  Part of the deal a couple years ago was that they weren't "transparent enough", so they added the detail.  Now, the detail is bad.   

Couple that with the fact that concert tickets are literally the only common marketable good with a significant, regular secondary market (which means that the pricing is well below that which should  be based on supply and demand) and it makes me scratch my head, for real.  The alternative is not in any possible universe a $25.00 ticket with no fee.
Nah, it's still just tacked on money. If you go to buy a car that's advertized for 35k, and the guy tells you "here it is, the final price is 35k, but you can't drive it without a key and we charge $4,000 for those," you'd be pissed off. "Well, I'll just buy it from the secondary market!" "Yes sir. There's a Keyhub right down the street. They'll sell you the car for 129k."

And it wasn't just about transparency. Some of the charges were for kickbacks (facility maintenance fee), which insured their monopoly. Some were just stupidly exorbitant because they could get away with it. The $2.50 stamp I just bought would have been $7 ten years ago.

Look, I think much of the Ticketmaster bashing is unwarranted, but the fees are bullshit and arbitrary.
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Offline Stadler

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Re: Ticketmaster finally going down?
« Reply #12 on: October 02, 2018, 10:40:39 AM »
Let's see here.  Out of the five concerts that I'm going to this year, I've only used Ticketmaster once to get a ticket and that one show, which is Owl City, I was a bit mad about paying it because of the additional "service fee."  I paid $36.00 for the ticket, but $11.00 of that was in fees and I'm like, "What the heck do you guys do to warrant that charge?"  I mean if the consumers are more well-informed by Live Nation/Ticketmaster on what they do to warrant tacking this fee and it is actually justified, I don't think people would be as angry about paying fees that's at least a third of the face value ticket price.  They will still be angry nonetheless since, well, no one wants to pay any additional fees on top of the face value of the ticket.

Oddly enough, me paying $36.00 is in the middle in terms of how much I paid for a ticket this year.  I've paid only $25-$26.00 using another site but those were in smaller venues filling around 300-500 people (seeing Big Wreck and Myles Kennedy) and I paid $40 and $50 and that was at a discounted price using Groupon (seeing Lindsey Stirling/Evanescence with an orchestra, and going to see the Trans-Siberian Orchestra).

Wait a second, though;  it's only "tacked on"  if you can buy that ticket for $25.00 somewhere else.   If the end price of the ticket is the same no matter where you go, then it matters not if it is "$36.00 for the ticket and $0.00 fees" or "$1.00 for the ticket and $35.00 for fees".  Part of the deal a couple years ago was that they weren't "transparent enough", so they added the detail.  Now, the detail is bad.   

Couple that with the fact that concert tickets are literally the only common marketable good with a significant, regular secondary market (which means that the pricing is well below that which should  be based on supply and demand) and it makes me scratch my head, for real.  The alternative is not in any possible universe a $25.00 ticket with no fee.
Nah, it's still just tacked on money. If you go to buy a car that's advertized for 35k, and the guy tells you "here it is, the final price is 35k, but you can't drive it without a key and we charge $4,000 for those," you'd be pissed off. "Well, I'll just buy it from the secondary market!" "Yes sir. There's a Keyhub right down the street. They'll sell you the car for 129k."

And it wasn't just about transparency. Some of the charges were for kickbacks (facility maintenance fee), which insured their monopoly. Some were just stupidly exorbitant because they could get away with it. The $2.50 stamp I just bought would have been $7 ten years ago.

Look, I think much of the Ticketmaster bashing is unwarranted, but the fees are bullshit and arbitrary.

That car analogy isn't really accurate though; if it's $35k, it's $35k, whether $4k is a key fee or not.    I think the point that isn't being fully digested - and I think you know this, because I believe we've talked about it before - is that it's not about what "Ticketbastard" is taking, it's what YOU'RE PAYING.   If the secondary market is charging $100 a ticket on a $36 box office ticket, where we should be looking is at the $64 delta, not the $11 fee.   The only people that should  be pissed off about the $11 is the artist, because that's where the money is coming from, not you.   

We live with "bullshit" fees all day every day and don't give a crap about it.   Apple charges $1000 for a phone BECAUSE THEY CAN.   It's not a build-up price, cost of parts, labor, plus a modest 5% profit and boom!  That gets you to about $200.   Everyone that is buying an iPhone pays an $800 "service fee" of sorts and most do so gladly.   Parking in the city.   Almost all markup.   Fast food; that 32oz. Mountain Dew that kid just polished off is about a 98% markup for the franchise. 

The only caveat is, I agree that there ought to be more scrutiny about the practices and any kickbacks.   I have yet to ask him but a close friend is a senior guy at a venue around here, and I literally have not once been able to buy a ticket for a show at that arena from the initial sale at the box office.    It's crazy how even mid-tier artists seem to sell out in minutes.   Keith Urban (more than a mid-tier artist here) sold out TWO shows, 12,000 seats each, in about 16 minutes.   But I was luckily able to access the secondary market - right there on the ticket seller's website! - immediately, and had the option of purchasing a $96 pit ticket for only $400!  Lucky me!  THAT I have a problem with, and so should Keith Urban, frankly.

Offline Setlist Scotty

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Re: Ticketmaster finally going down?
« Reply #13 on: October 02, 2018, 11:29:01 AM »
Keith Urban (more than a mid-tier artist here) sold out TWO shows, 12,000 seats each, in about 16 minutes.   But I was luckily able to access the secondary market - right there on the ticket seller's website! - immediately, and had the option of purchasing a $96 pit ticket for only $400!  Lucky me!  THAT I have a problem with, and so should Keith Urban, frankly.
To me, the fees are an annoyance, but something I can put up with for the most part. But what Stads says above is what really gets under my skin, and why I would like to see Ticketblaster be brought down, beside of course the fact that it is a virtual monopoly due to the ways they manipulated the market over time.

And I agree that all artists should have an issue with that. Iron Maiden does, and they've taken matters into their own hands to see to it that the scalping of tickets is pretty much done away with, although it is more time consuming when you arrive at the venue. Still, I'd be willing to sacrifice the extra time just to be assured that my money is not going to some scalper instead of the band.

The sad thing is, the only way to put a stop to this sort of thing would be laws instituted by the government. I say this because I remember how Pearl Jam fought Ticketblaster 20+ years ago, and despite their high profile and name, they eventually had to give up the fight. Perhaps if a huge number of major artists all banded together and fought against Ticketblaster, maybe something could be accomplished. But even then, I'm in doubt. Given that Ticketblaster likely has lobbyists in DC, it would probably take a long time before something could be done to stop them, but I'd like to think that the news report I cited might instigate this, even tho I have my doubts of anything of real substance ever developing against them.
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Offline El Barto

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Re: Ticketmaster finally going down?
« Reply #14 on: October 02, 2018, 11:44:11 AM »
Keith Urban (more than a mid-tier artist here) sold out TWO shows, 12,000 seats each, in about 16 minutes.   But I was luckily able to access the secondary market - right there on the ticket seller's website! - immediately, and had the option of purchasing a $96 pit ticket for only $400!  Lucky me!  THAT I have a problem with, and so should Keith Urban, frankly.
To me, the fees are an annoyance, but something I can put up with for the most part. But what Stads says above is what really gets under my skin, and why I would like to see Ticketblaster be brought down, beside of course the fact that it is a virtual monopoly due to the ways they manipulated the market over time.

And I agree that all artists should have an issue with that. Iron Maiden does, and they've taken matters into their own hands to see to it that the scalping of tickets is pretty much done away with, although it is more time consuming when you arrive at the venue. Still, I'd be willing to sacrifice the extra time just to be assured that my money is not going to some scalper instead of the band.

The sad thing is, the only way to put a stop to this sort of thing would be laws instituted by the government. I say this because I remember how Pearl Jam fought Ticketblaster 20+ years ago, and despite their high profile and name, they eventually had to give up the fight. Perhaps if a huge number of major artists all banded together and fought against Ticketblaster, maybe something could be accomplished. But even then, I'm in doubt. Given that Ticketblaster likely has lobbyists in DC, it would probably take a long time before something could be done to stop them, but I'd like to think that the news report I cited might instigate this, even tho I have my doubts of anything of real substance ever developing against them.
Ticketmaster can only be sued by their customers, and neither us nor Maiden qualify. TM's exclusive customer is the concert promoter, and he has no reason to rock the boat.

And let's be clear that the artists are just as in with ticket scalping as the scalpers. That's why The Who has a VIP package for every precious metal, gemstone, and radioactive isotope. Personally, I'd rather have some greasy douchebag rip me off for $400 than the artist, but that's what's happening here.

Also, at the top end the artists are essentially just contractors anyway. If BMG offers Urban $100,000,000 for a sixty date tour he's not going to bite the hand that feeds him, and BMG is damn sure going to make their money back. At that point TM's $30 surcharges are a drop in the bucket. 
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Offline Cool Chris

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Re: Ticketmaster finally going down?
« Reply #15 on: October 02, 2018, 09:59:42 PM »
If you go to buy a car that's advertized for 35k, and the guy tells you "here it is, the final price is 35k, but you can't drive it without a key and we charge $4,000 for those," you'd be pissed off.

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Offline deggs37

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Re: Ticketmaster finally going down?
« Reply #16 on: October 02, 2018, 10:02:24 PM »
Oh totally agree about AXS, I absolutely hate buying tickets through them but my local club venue only uses them so I am stuck sometimes.  I got tickets through them last week and they want 15 dollars to ship you a ticket, are you fucking kidding me?  Now I have to use their shitty app to present my ticket at the venue.
Yep. Twenty-five dollars to see Haken, plus 6.80 for my convenience, plus 2 more for handling, plus 2.5 for a stamp. And the AXS website is awful. But down with Ticketbastard, I guess?  :lol

I've never seen someone be such a fan of Ticketmaster. Just because AXS is worse doesn't mean Ticketmaster can't also be bad. Are they paying you to say this? Or are they holding you hostage? Blink twice if you need us to send help.
« Last Edit: October 02, 2018, 10:09:05 PM by deggs37 »

Offline ErHaO

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Re: Ticketmaster finally going down?
« Reply #17 on: October 03, 2018, 04:05:17 AM »
I just have never understood why things have to be so deceptive in the first place. There should be a lot more sections for shows, especially near the front. in an arena and want front 3 rows on the floor? That's $400. Want next 5? That's $250. Want to the end of the first orchestra? That's $150. Rest of the orchestra $100.

If you think about it it's just stupid that the front row and last row at the other end of the very long floor go for the same price to begin with.

It is very odd to me that this isn't the case. Over here, most if not all seated shows have a clear price distinction based on the location of the seat. That said, in Arenas/big venues the middle part is usually non-seated.

Offline Stadler

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Re: Ticketmaster finally going down?
« Reply #18 on: October 03, 2018, 07:28:06 AM »
I just have never understood why things have to be so deceptive in the first place. There should be a lot more sections for shows, especially near the front. in an arena and want front 3 rows on the floor? That's $400. Want next 5? That's $250. Want to the end of the first orchestra? That's $150. Rest of the orchestra $100.

If you think about it it's just stupid that the front row and last row at the other end of the very long floor go for the same price to begin with.

It is very odd to me that this isn't the case. Over here, most if not all seated shows have a clear price distinction based on the location of the seat. That said, in Arenas/big venues the middle part is usually non-seated.

Be careful what you ask for; I will bet you one of those seats that if they do start to do more "seat specific" pricing - ala airlines - it's not the back seats that are going to go down.  It will be the front seats going UP.  That's really what this is all about; many (most?) of those front seats are what fuel the after-market.   The floor seating, for example, is priced for those back seats, not the front ones.

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Re: Ticketmaster finally going down?
« Reply #19 on: October 03, 2018, 08:05:17 AM »
I just have never understood why things have to be so deceptive in the first place. There should be a lot more sections for shows, especially near the front. in an arena and want front 3 rows on the floor? That's $400. Want next 5? That's $250. Want to the end of the first orchestra? That's $150. Rest of the orchestra $100.

If you think about it it's just stupid that the front row and last row at the other end of the very long floor go for the same price to begin with.

It is very odd to me that this isn't the case. Over here, most if not all seated shows have a clear price distinction based on the location of the seat. That said, in Arenas/big venues the middle part is usually non-seated.

Be careful what you ask for; I will bet you one of those seats that if they do start to do more "seat specific" pricing - ala airlines - it's not the back seats that are going to go down.  It will be the front seats going UP.  That's really what this is all about; many (most?) of those front seats are what fuel the after-market.   The floor seating, for example, is priced for those back seats, not the front ones.

Yup, I have and will again pay over face value for a front row of the section ticket.  Guaranteeing your view is important to me for some shows. Especially venues I frequent and know which seats are the best.

Offline El Barto

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Re: Ticketmaster finally going down?
« Reply #20 on: October 03, 2018, 08:19:33 AM »
Oh totally agree about AXS, I absolutely hate buying tickets through them but my local club venue only uses them so I am stuck sometimes.  I got tickets through them last week and they want 15 dollars to ship you a ticket, are you fucking kidding me?  Now I have to use their shitty app to present my ticket at the venue.
Yep. Twenty-five dollars to see Haken, plus 6.80 for my convenience, plus 2 more for handling, plus 2.5 for a stamp. And the AXS website is awful. But down with Ticketbastard, I guess?  :lol

I've never seen someone be such a fan of Ticketmaster. Just because AXS is worse doesn't mean Ticketmaster can't also be bad. Are they paying you to say this? Or are they holding you hostage? Blink twice if you need us to send help.
Not a fan at all. I just recognize that a lot of the arguments against them are dodgy and we could be getting it a lot worse. The reality is that their added fees are right in line with the rest of the market and their interface is much better than those of their competitors.
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Offline El Barto

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Re: Ticketmaster finally going down?
« Reply #21 on: October 03, 2018, 08:23:45 AM »
I just have never understood why things have to be so deceptive in the first place. There should be a lot more sections for shows, especially near the front. in an arena and want front 3 rows on the floor? That's $400. Want next 5? That's $250. Want to the end of the first orchestra? That's $150. Rest of the orchestra $100.

If you think about it it's just stupid that the front row and last row at the other end of the very long floor go for the same price to begin with.

It is very odd to me that this isn't the case. Over here, most if not all seated shows have a clear price distinction based on the location of the seat. That said, in Arenas/big venues the middle part is usually non-seated.

Be careful what you ask for; I will bet you one of those seats that if they do start to do more "seat specific" pricing - ala airlines - it's not the back seats that are going to go down.  It will be the front seats going UP.  That's really what this is all about; many (most?) of those front seats are what fuel the after-market.   The floor seating, for example, is priced for those back seats, not the front ones.
This is correct some of the time. Other times not so much. If you're a scalper any seat in the venue is gold for that Keith Urban show. There's a certain element of risk involved, if the show doesn't sell out then you're in trouble, but if it does those "get-ins" might as well be solid gold.

But the rest of your post is right on. The scalpers have long maintained that the reason they exist is that the tickets are undervalued to begin with, which is certainly true for the good seats. The "fair" alternative, should TM or others decide to go that route, would be an auction system, and I guarantee you none of us would like that.
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Offline El Barto

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Re: Ticketmaster finally going down?
« Reply #22 on: October 03, 2018, 08:28:51 AM »
I just have never understood why things have to be so deceptive in the first place. There should be a lot more sections for shows, especially near the front. in an arena and want front 3 rows on the floor? That's $400. Want next 5? That's $250. Want to the end of the first orchestra? That's $150. Rest of the orchestra $100.

If you think about it it's just stupid that the front row and last row at the other end of the very long floor go for the same price to begin with.

It is very odd to me that this isn't the case. Over here, most if not all seated shows have a clear price distinction based on the location of the seat. That said, in Arenas/big venues the middle part is usually non-seated.

Be careful what you ask for; I will bet you one of those seats that if they do start to do more "seat specific" pricing - ala airlines - it's not the back seats that are going to go down.  It will be the front seats going UP.  That's really what this is all about; many (most?) of those front seats are what fuel the after-market.   The floor seating, for example, is priced for those back seats, not the front ones.

Yup, I have and will again pay over face value for a front row of the section ticket.  Guaranteeing your view is important to me for some shows. Especially venues I frequent and know which seats are the best.
In my case I almost always pay less than face value with scalpers.  Good seats come from TM and are high priced. Get-ins come from scalpers and are generally well under face for the shows I go to. They're simply part of the equation, and you use them when the situation warrants.
Argument, the presentation of reasonable views, never makes headway against conviction, and conviction takes no part in argument because it knows.
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Offline El Barto

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Re: Ticketmaster finally going down?
« Reply #23 on: October 04, 2018, 02:05:16 PM »
Interesting that I stumbled across this while there's a discussion here about TM and scalpers. Here's Trent Reznor's approach. Is this really an improvement?

Quote
TICKETS FOR COLD AND BLACK AND INFINITE NORTH AMERICA 2018 WILL GO ON SALE MAY 19 EXCLUSIVELY AT THE PHYSICAL WORLD PRESALE
*DENVER MAY 20

What?  Why?  Physical World Presale?
The promise of a world made better by computers and online connectivity has failed us in many ways, particularly when it comes to ticketing.  Everything about the process sucks and everyone loses except the reseller. We’ve decided to try something different that will also likely suck, but in a different way.  We’re hoping many of you will be happy with the results, while some may do what they always do and bitch about it.

Here’s how it works:
You (an actual human being) show up at the box office, interact with the ticket seller (another actual human being) and purchase up to four tickets that will actually be handed to you on the spot.  The tickets will not be available online or anywhere else before or during that day.  All seats (including the best seats) will be available first come, first serve.  You may actually encounter other actual human beings with similar interests likely wearing black clothing during the process and potentially interact with THEM.  The experience has the potential* to be enjoyable.  Nine Inch Nails has always been about bringing people together, living life to the fullest and good times.**

Any remaining tickets will be sold at a later date.

*not guaranteed
**not entirely true

Those of us that are old enough certainly remember camping out for tickets. It was always a blast. Now that we're older how many of us can justify knocking off work to be lined up at a box office a 0500 on a Wednesday morning?
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Re: Ticketmaster finally going down?
« Reply #24 on: October 04, 2018, 02:12:57 PM »
I'll give Trent credit for trying something and I don't know the results of his test, but I must say I have no interest in waiting in a line for tickets.  I just don't have the time to do that for the amount of concerts I attend. 

In my case I almost always pay less than face value with scalpers.  Good seats come from TM and are high priced. Get-ins come from scalpers and are generally well under face for the shows I go to. They're simply part of the equation, and you use them when the situation warrants.

Yup, it's situational.  My point was simply an agreement that there are tickets that are worth more than others even marked at the same price from the retailer.  I really don't have too much dislike for our current system, it typically works in my favor since I've been following ticket trends and concerts for a few years now and I wouldn't want to go back to the old ways personally, even though I am sure those lines could have been fun (I actually had a blast waiting on signing lines at Progpower just because it lend itself to easy and fun discussions with people of similar interests).

Offline Cool Chris

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Re: Ticketmaster finally going down?
« Reply #25 on: October 04, 2018, 02:15:47 PM »
Interesting. A few of the more recent shows I have been to I bought the tickets directly at the box office, but the demand was such that I could just go at any time during the day and get them, and they were all GA so needn't concern myself with seat availability. On the surface I see its merits. First come, first served is often the most equitable method, as it eliminates many other variables. Though guessing when people would begin starting to line up would be a challenge. Would I need to be there at 5:00am? 2:00am? 11:00pm the night before? But to the point above, is this an improvement?
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Offline El Barto

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Re: Ticketmaster finally going down?
« Reply #26 on: October 04, 2018, 02:52:46 PM »
You have to get there ahead of the professional scalpers and the army of homeless people they pay to wait with them. I checked the second Dallas NIN show and there are ~1k tickets available on the secondary market. Scalpers were just a big a problem back in the old days when this was the only show in town.
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Re: Ticketmaster finally going down?
« Reply #27 on: October 04, 2018, 03:02:04 PM »
Dedicated scalpers

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Re: Ticketmaster finally going down?
« Reply #28 on: October 04, 2018, 03:33:09 PM »
Dedicated scalpers
And in this case with good cause. That show is a certain sellout (it's where we saw DT last year). The scalpers and their bums will be able to show up in greater numbers than the fans. NIN has insured that there is no online access other than the scalpers. I suspect that Trent was sincere in wanting to defeat the resellers, but in this case he really handed them an easy win.
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Re: Ticketmaster finally going down?
« Reply #29 on: October 04, 2018, 03:47:10 PM »
Dedicated scalpers
And in this case with good cause. That show is a certain sellout (it's where we saw DT last year). The scalpers and their bums will be able to show up in greater numbers than the fans. NIN has insured that there is no online access other than the scalpers. I suspect that Trent was sincere in wanting to defeat the resellers, but in this case he really handed them an easy win.

No online at all?  I thought it was just day 1 sales had to be in person?  Either way, if the scalpers are doing as you say, it kind of defeats the purpose anyway. 

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Re: Ticketmaster finally going down?
« Reply #30 on: October 04, 2018, 06:36:39 PM »
I just have never understood why things have to be so deceptive in the first place. There should be a lot more sections for shows, especially near the front. in an arena and want front 3 rows on the floor? That's $400. Want next 5? That's $250. Want to the end of the first orchestra? That's $150. Rest of the orchestra $100.

If you think about it it's just stupid that the front row and last row at the other end of the very long floor go for the same price to begin with.

It is very odd to me that this isn't the case. Over here, most if not all seated shows have a clear price distinction based on the location of the seat. That said, in Arenas/big venues the middle part is usually non-seated.

Be careful what you ask for; I will bet you one of those seats that if they do start to do more "seat specific" pricing - ala airlines - it's not the back seats that are going to go down.  It will be the front seats going UP.  That's really what this is all about; many (most?) of those front seats are what fuel the after-market.   The floor seating, for example, is priced for those back seats, not the front ones.

Could be, but I was talking about the current situation. I have never attended a seated concert (that was larger than, say 200-300) here where there wasn't a clear class-based price distinction for the seats. But "front" row for large shows almost always are non-seated with a set price. However, that offcourse doesn't stop scalpers, as it is very much a problem for large scale pop concerts, but personally not an issue I have ever witnessed.

I don't know the current situation, but our government is pleading for a form of regulation to protect consumers. An example they gave was that they do not allow reselling tickets for more than 120% of the price (which is in line with the popular service ticketswap, which has the same limitation). I hope they succeed.




Furthermore, I am no big expert on flight tickets, but I do know that there are factors involved that shouldn't apply for concerts. For example, the highly variable fuel prices and direct competition between different companies that offer basically the same product (as in, a flight to the same location around the same time). And off course a huge amount of different agencies that offer the same tickets that determine their own "service" costs (booking via another travel agency thus can alter the price significantly). However, it is possible that in the US there are different systems in place.

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Re: Ticketmaster finally going down?
« Reply #31 on: November 27, 2018, 08:18:25 PM »
I just have never understood why things have to be so deceptive in the first place. There should be a lot more sections for shows, especially near the front. in an arena and want front 3 rows on the floor? That's $400. Want next 5? That's $250. Want to the end of the first orchestra? That's $150. Rest of the orchestra $100.

If you think about it it's just stupid that the front row and last row at the other end of the very long floor go for the same price to begin with.

It is very odd to me that this isn't the case. Over here, most if not all seated shows have a clear price distinction based on the location of the seat. That said, in Arenas/big venues the middle part is usually non-seated.

Be careful what you ask for; I will bet you one of those seats that if they do start to do more "seat specific" pricing - ala airlines - it's not the back seats that are going to go down.  It will be the front seats going UP.  That's really what this is all about; many (most?) of those front seats are what fuel the after-market.   The floor seating, for example, is priced for those back seats, not the front ones.


Over here, depends on the band, the first few rows are reserved usually for VIP seats. I'll get lucky and snap when the VIP ends and snag the seats they didn't sell for VIP.

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Offline TAC

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Re: Ticketmaster finally going down?
« Reply #32 on: November 28, 2018, 12:37:42 PM »
I have a question..

Has anyone ever bought Verified Resale Tickets on Ticketmaster? We are looking at a Celtics game. How are the tickets delivered? Are the mobile only? Print at home? Do you get tickets mailed to you?
would have thought the same thing but seeing the OP was TAC i immediately thought Maiden or DT related
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Re: Ticketmaster finally going down?
« Reply #33 on: November 28, 2018, 12:48:46 PM »
I have a question..

Has anyone ever bought Verified Resale Tickets on Ticketmaster? We are looking at a Celtics game. How are the tickets delivered? Are the mobile only? Print at home? Do you get tickets mailed to you?

TM issues a new bar code, whether i t's print at home, transferred or mailed. I've never done the mailing option for a verified resale though. I've only done print at home or transfer.

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Re: Ticketmaster finally going down?
« Reply #34 on: November 28, 2018, 12:57:11 PM »
So it's safe and legit?
would have thought the same thing but seeing the OP was TAC i immediately thought Maiden or DT related
Winger Theater Forums........or WTF.  ;D
TAC got a higher score than me in the electronic round? Honestly, can I just drop out now? :lol