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Does Tony Iommi deserve to be among the guitar greats?

Yes
57 (82.6%)
No
9 (13%)
Unsure
3 (4.3%)

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Offline WildRanger

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Does Tony Iommi deserve to be among the guitar greats?
« on: August 24, 2018, 07:26:45 AM »
What would you say?
And why you think so?

Offline The Walrus

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Re: Does Tony Iommi deserve to be among the guitar greats?
« Reply #1 on: August 24, 2018, 07:30:01 AM »
There are some questions that simply don't need to be asked. This is one of them.

Yes. And I'm not even a Black Sabbath fan.
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Offline Art

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Re: Does Tony Iommi deserve to be among the guitar greats?
« Reply #2 on: August 24, 2018, 09:50:07 AM »
There are some questions that simply don't need to be asked. This is one of them.

Yes.

This.


Offline a51502112

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Re: Does Tony Iommi deserve to be among the guitar greats?
« Reply #3 on: August 24, 2018, 09:53:26 AM »
There are some questions that simply don't need to be asked. This is one of them.

Voila!!!!

Offline wolfking

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Re: Does Tony Iommi deserve to be among the guitar greats?
« Reply #4 on: August 24, 2018, 03:31:24 PM »
WildRanger, can you please give me an explanation in why he wouldn't be a guitar great?

Creator of metal as we know it.  A riff machine where riffs like Children of the Grave, Into the Void, Under the Sun, Black Sabbath, Symptom of the Universe, Iron Man etc. are still heavier than anything released today.

While not being a full blown shredder, his leads are melodic with lots of feel and purpose, with a jazz background that shows at times.  I look at Tony's guitar career more like the Ozzy era is where his riffs are dominant and then from Heaven and Hell through to the end of the Tony Martin era is where while his riffs still are Godly, his lead playing really started to shine.  Lonely is the Word, Over and Over, Born to Lose, Kill in the Spirit World, Keep It Warm, Devil and Daughter, Glory Ride, Jerusalem plus many more all have some of my fav solos ever.
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Offline pg1067

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Re: Does Tony Iommi deserve to be among the guitar greats?
« Reply #5 on: August 24, 2018, 04:00:43 PM »
WildRanger, can you please give me an explanation in why he wouldn't be a guitar great?

Or one of the three people who voted "no."
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Re: Does Tony Iommi deserve to be among the guitar greats?
« Reply #6 on: August 24, 2018, 04:07:52 PM »
WildRanger, can you please give me an explanation in why he wouldn't be a guitar great?

Creator of metal as we know it.  A riff machine where riffs like Children of the Grave, Into the Void, Under the Sun, Black Sabbath, Symptom of the Universe, Iron Man etc. are still heavier than anything released today.

While not being a full blown shredder, his leads are melodic with lots of feel and purpose, with a jazz background that shows at times.  I look at Tony's guitar career more like the Ozzy era is where his riffs are dominant and then from Heaven and Hell through to the end of the Tony Martin era is where while his riffs still are Godly, his lead playing really started to shine.  Lonely is the Word, Over and Over, Born to Lose, Kill in the Spirit World, Keep It Warm, Devil and Daughter, Glory Ride, Jerusalem plus many more all have some of my fav solos ever.

Amen, Brother.
would have thought the same thing but seeing the OP was TAC i immediately thought Maiden or DT related
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Offline MinistroRaven

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Re: Does Tony Iommi deserve to be among the guitar greats?
« Reply #7 on: August 24, 2018, 04:16:05 PM »
WildRanger, can you please give me an explanation in why he wouldn't be a guitar great?

Creator of metal as we know it.  A riff machine where riffs like Children of the Grave, Into the Void, Under the Sun, Black Sabbath, Symptom of the Universe, Iron Man etc. are still heavier than anything released today.

While not being a full blown shredder, his leads are melodic with lots of feel and purpose, with a jazz background that shows at times.  I look at Tony's guitar career more like the Ozzy era is where his riffs are dominant and then from Heaven and Hell through to the end of the Tony Martin era is where while his riffs still are Godly, his lead playing really started to shine.  Lonely is the Word, Over and Over, Born to Lose, Kill in the Spirit World, Keep It Warm, Devil and Daughter, Glory Ride, Jerusalem plus many more all have some of my fav solos ever.

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Offline Lowdz

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Re: Does Tony Iommi deserve to be among the guitar greats?
« Reply #8 on: August 24, 2018, 04:18:22 PM »
He has to be.
He invented metal. That would be enough in itself but he’s a very good lead player too.

Offline Dave_Manchester

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Re: Does Tony Iommi deserve to be among the guitar greats?
« Reply #9 on: August 24, 2018, 04:18:52 PM »
Not a huge Black Sabbath fan, but yes, Iommi helped change music's course. If there's a Hall of Fame for guitarists he should have a life-sized marble statue in the foyer alongside the likes of Hendrix and Page.

Offline NoseofNicko

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Re: Does Tony Iommi deserve to be among the guitar greats?
« Reply #10 on: August 24, 2018, 07:00:46 PM »
Technically he’s not that great, but he’s one of the best riff writers of all time, so he definitely deserves to be among the guitar greats.

Offline Stadler

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Re: Does Tony Iommi deserve to be among the guitar greats?
« Reply #11 on: August 24, 2018, 09:33:58 PM »
And all that with nine fingers (well, eight full fingers and two halfsies).

Offline gazinwales

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Re: Does Tony Iommi deserve to be among the guitar greats?
« Reply #12 on: August 24, 2018, 10:02:39 PM »
Four people voted No, explain yourself.

Offline ChuckSteak

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Re: Does Tony Iommi deserve to be among the guitar greats?
« Reply #13 on: August 25, 2018, 05:36:27 AM »
Impossible to answer if you can't define what a "guitar great" is. And since that is entirely subjective... well...

Offline KevShmev

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Re: Does Tony Iommi deserve to be among the guitar greats?
« Reply #14 on: August 25, 2018, 07:14:53 AM »
Technically he’s not that great, but he’s one of the best riff writers of all time, so he definitely deserves to be among the guitar greats.

How is he technically not that great? 

By just any measure that matters, Iommi is a great guitarist.

Offline MirrorMask

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Re: Does Tony Iommi deserve to be among the guitar greats?
« Reply #15 on: August 25, 2018, 09:10:44 AM »
He invented heavy metal. Without all of his fingers.

Does that answer the question for you?
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Offline ?

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Re: Does Tony Iommi deserve to be among the guitar greats?
« Reply #16 on: August 25, 2018, 02:54:46 PM »
There are some questions that simply don't need to be asked. This is one of them.

Yes.

This.

Offline NoseofNicko

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Re: Does Tony Iommi deserve to be among the guitar greats?
« Reply #17 on: August 25, 2018, 05:13:42 PM »
Technically he’s not that great, but he’s one of the best riff writers of all time, so he definitely deserves to be among the guitar greats.

How is he technically not that great? 

By just any measure that matters, Iommi is a great guitarist.

Technically as in technical skills.

Offline KevShmev

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Re: Does Tony Iommi deserve to be among the guitar greats?
« Reply #18 on: August 25, 2018, 05:16:51 PM »
What is wrong his technical skills?  Answer: nothing.

Or are you suggesting that his technical skills are lacking because he doesn't feel the need to play 4,599 notes a minute or sit alone in a room and practice scales for 11 hours a day?

Offline gazinwales

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Re: Does Tony Iommi deserve to be among the guitar greats?
« Reply #19 on: August 25, 2018, 06:38:27 PM »
Iommi is more than a 'guitar' great.
He invented metal, down tuning, doom riffs and without him metal would not be as it is today.

He is an immortal guitar player and a living legend.

Offline NoseofNicko

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Re: Does Tony Iommi deserve to be among the guitar greats?
« Reply #20 on: August 25, 2018, 06:45:02 PM »
What is wrong his technical skills?  Answer: nothing.

Or are you suggesting that his technical skills are lacking because he doesn't feel the need to play 4,599 notes a minute or sit alone in a room and practice scales for 11 hours a day?

Lol calm down.

Never implied there was anything wrong with his technical skills, there isn’t, I was just saying he’s not one of the most technically skilled guitarists which is a fact. But I never implied that meant he was not one of the greatest guitarists of all time, he is. I don’t think being able to play “4599 notes in a minute” is everything.

Offline KevShmev

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Re: Does Tony Iommi deserve to be among the guitar greats?
« Reply #21 on: August 25, 2018, 08:53:52 PM »

Offline Shadow Ninja 2.0

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Re: Does Tony Iommi deserve to be among the guitar greats?
« Reply #22 on: August 25, 2018, 09:43:35 PM »
Your response did seem a bit over-the-top, dude, especially since it was pretty clear the corpse wasn't saying what you were saying he was saying.

Offline KevShmev

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Re: Does Tony Iommi deserve to be among the guitar greats?
« Reply #23 on: August 25, 2018, 10:07:28 PM »
I agree, I was probably assuming a bit there.  My bad.

Offline wolfking

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Re: Does Tony Iommi deserve to be among the guitar greats?
« Reply #24 on: August 26, 2018, 04:08:07 AM »
As a guitarist that is able to play a lot of Sabbath stuff, Iommi's style, sound and technique is very unique. 

NoseofNicko is somewhat right in saying he isn't technically great, but on the other hand, I don't know what that has to do with anything.  Two of his fretting fingers have rubber tips due to his missing fingertips.  This is a HUGE disadvantage.  Just think about that and then think about what he has been able to do with this setback.  His lead playing relies mainly on pentatonic, minor and some blues.  His jazz influence allows some variety, but nothing really around these scales, it's all in his phrasing mostly, maybe some Dorian in there too at times perhaps.  Can use a tritone too obviously.

He's not doing massive shred runs or three note per string runs up the fretboard with lots of positional switches.  He uses light string due to his disadvantage and is very gentle in his approach.  So no, technically he's no Yngwie but that doesn't matter.  What he's done is amazing and he instantly has his own sound and you know it's him as soon as you hear him.  That beats good technical skill anyday.
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Offline TheCountOfNYC

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Re: Does Tony Iommi deserve to be among the guitar greats?
« Reply #25 on: August 26, 2018, 12:00:07 PM »
Even though I personally think he’s the most overrated guitarist in metal, the impact he has had on the genre is undeniable.
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Offline PowerSlave

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Re: Does Tony Iommi deserve to be among the guitar greats?
« Reply #26 on: August 26, 2018, 01:14:16 PM »
Technical skill = icing

Song writing = cake

Eat too much icing without any cake and it turns into a sweetness overload. Personally, I'll take an awesome cake any day of the week.
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Re: Does Tony Iommi deserve to be among the guitar greats?
« Reply #27 on: August 26, 2018, 01:29:23 PM »
Saying Iommi's playing isn't technical is like saying Alexander Graham Bell's telephone isn't technical.
would have thought the same thing but seeing the OP was TAC i immediately thought Maiden or DT related
Winger Theater Forums........or WTF.  ;D
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Offline Adami

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Re: Does Tony Iommi deserve to be among the guitar greats?
« Reply #28 on: August 26, 2018, 01:39:46 PM »
Saying Iommi's playing isn't technical is like saying Alexander Graham Bell's telephone isn't technical.

Not bad actually. Compared to what was happening at the time, the telephone was very technical. Compared to Iphones, however, not so much. Similar to Tony.
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Re: Does Tony Iommi deserve to be among the guitar greats?
« Reply #29 on: August 26, 2018, 01:41:09 PM »
Saying Iommi's playing isn't technical is like saying Alexander Graham Bell's telephone isn't technical.

Not bad actually. Compared to what was happening at the time, the telephone was very technical. Compared to Iphones, however, not so much. Similar to Tony.

Exactly my point.
would have thought the same thing but seeing the OP was TAC i immediately thought Maiden or DT related
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Offline Adami

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Re: Does Tony Iommi deserve to be among the guitar greats?
« Reply #30 on: August 26, 2018, 01:41:49 PM »
Saying Iommi's playing isn't technical is like saying Alexander Graham Bell's telephone isn't technical.

Not bad actually. Compared to what was happening at the time, the telephone was very technical. Compared to Iphones, however, not so much. Similar to Tony.

Exactly my point.

Gotcha. Good point then.
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Offline wolfking

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Re: Does Tony Iommi deserve to be among the guitar greats?
« Reply #31 on: August 26, 2018, 11:34:37 PM »
Saying Iommi's playing isn't technical is like saying Alexander Graham Bell's telephone isn't technical.

Good point.  It's evolution.  I think hence why I feel his lead playing really stepped up more in the 80's.  70's was a lot of blues pentatonic influence and then as the years progressed, you hear a lot more melody and the somewhat 80's style in his leads.
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Offline Elite

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Re: Does Tony Iommi deserve to be among the guitar greats?
« Reply #32 on: August 27, 2018, 02:45:53 AM »
But there's so much evolution in electric(!) guitar playing over the past 90 years (basically the time that electric guitars have existed), that it seems completely biased to give the pioneers of 50-odd years ago a heroic status (Jimi Hendrix always topping every single 'best guitarists ever' poll for example). Like with any instrument that's 'new', it takes time for the people to learn how to play it. There would never have been a Hammerklavier Sonata, if the piano hadn't existed for hundred years before that. The first piano pieces ever written could never possibly as technical as that, simply because people didn't know (yet) how to play the instrument and the cumulative knowledge of players wasn't as widespread as it is today. Hammerklavier was a fucking beast back in the day, now piano students at conservatories are expected to learn that thing.

A similar thing happens with guitars. Remember 'Eruption' by Eddie van Halen? I don't, because I wasn't alive back then, but the point I want to make is that it must have been insane in the seventies, but now it's looked at as a relic in the past - an important milestone, surely, but compared to what some guitarists do now (on a technical level that is!) Eruption isn't nearly as daunting at all. The abundance of good to great guitarists is frankly quite ridiculous and there's maybe hundreds of Youtube guitarists that could play circles around Iommi (again, on a technical level that is!), but those guitarists will never, ever, influence music in a way Iommi has.

Then comes my question in return: what if Iommi had never picked up a guitar? Surely at some point people must have gotten the idea that you could downtune strings or add more distortion. Again, this is evolution. The piano didn't simply 'exist' at some point; humanity went through hundreds of different types of piano before we got an instrument that can have quiet and loud tones, sustained or unsustained and that's actually playable by 2 hands and portable enough to fit in people's homes.

We see it nowadays, with (again electric) guitars 'evolving' to have 7, 8, 9 strings, because why wouldn't we? From a technical standpoint, the cumulative knowledge of how to play an electric guitar is getting so widespread that people will only get better. When was the last time a guitar solo truly amazed you? It's as if we expect our musicians to be able to do anything and everything, simply because we see it too often. You can't play 'Eruption' of guitar? Well, then you're not worth listening to, as there's thousands of people who will play that anyway.

Jeez, I do go on topic on this, didn't I? Thinking about what I read, it might actually deserve its own thread :lol
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Offline MirrorMask

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Re: Does Tony Iommi deserve to be among the guitar greats?
« Reply #33 on: August 27, 2018, 03:00:03 AM »
Then comes my question in return: what if Iommi had never picked up a guitar? Surely at some point people must have gotten the idea that you could downtune strings or add more distortion. Again, this is evolution. The piano didn't simply 'exist' at some point; humanity went through hundreds of different types of piano before we got an instrument that can have quiet and loud tones, sustained or unsustained and that's actually playable by 2 hands and portable enough to fit in people's homes.

Well, but couldn't this be applied to everything? once we invented the cars, sooner or later someone would have figured out we could take machines to the sky. Erase the Wright brothers from existance, someone else would have came up with the plane sooner or later. Have the Titanic dodge the iceberg, another ship would have eventually had a similar accident and only then, and not because of the Titanic, would the standards for safety at sea be improved.

Yes, someone else would have downtuned the guitars sooner or later. Still, it was Tony Iommi who did it, and deserves the historical credit for it.
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Offline cramx3

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Re: Does Tony Iommi deserve to be among the guitar greats?
« Reply #34 on: August 27, 2018, 03:45:31 AM »
duh (to the OP)
« Last Edit: August 27, 2018, 06:47:16 AM by cramx3 »