NBA thread 2018-2019 v. Raptors are Champs

[Azyiu]

Actually, according to what I've been reading it's Melo + cash cosiderations for draft rights to some international player. Chicago gets money and Houston gets the roster spot they needed to sign Faried.

Yes, I understand Houston's motive, but I don't get Chicago's. They saved so little money... but, they can keep Melo and move him for another trade.

[Samsara]

Actually, according to what I've been reading it's Melo + cash cosiderations for draft rights to some international player. Chicago gets money and Houston gets the roster spot they needed to sign Faried.

Yes, I understand Houston's motive, but I don't get Chicago's. They saved so little money... but, they can keep Melo and move him for another trade.

They are going to outright release him in two weeks. Which is the reason I don't understand (like you) why Chicago would do it in the first place. I mean, why even bother?

[Nekov]

They got a Million in cash. As far as I understand, the only thing the owner of the Bulls cares about is money, so it makes sense from that point of view.

[Azyiu]

via Imgflip Meme Generator

[Lonk]

I know Harden is a great offensive player and 61 points is a huge night, but doing so on 17/38 FG, 5/20 3pt, while also taking 25 free throws is not that impressive to me. Him and Westbrook are my least favorite top-tier players to watch.

[bosk1]

I know Harden is ... offensive

This is not news.

[Samsara]

Sucks that Vic Oladipo went down. Love watching that guy play. He's so driven. Hope it is a quick recovery, but sounds and looks like he is done until next year.

Not at all impressed with Harden. Never really have been. He's good, but his stats are inflated in D'Antoni's free-wheeling system. And he's the only guy on the team right now that can score. But going 5-20 on threes, and 17-38 overall...I mean, come on man.

A big thank you to Lebron for sitting tonight. Hopefully my Wolves can beat the Bron-less Lakers in Los Angeles. This whole year for the Wolves has been so frustrating. 4-9 with the Butler drama. They've gone 19-15 since then, but they've only been healthy for probably 10 of those 24 games. Even now - Teague (starting PG) is out (AGAIN...he has two long streaks of games missed), Covington (starting SF) is and has been out for a few weeks now. It's hard to make up ground in the west when two of your starters are not playing. Not to mention Rose going down for a bit, and now Tyus Jones (backup PG) being out indefinitely. To be 23-24 after all that, plus a coaching change, is pretty damn good. But just as I think they are about to turn the corner, something else happens. Hopefully they can get back to .500 tonight, and then get healthy and push for a playoff spot.

[bosk1]

Not at all impressed with Harden. Never really have been. He's good, but his stats are inflated in D'Antoni's free-wheeling system. And he's the only guy on the team right now that can score. But going 5-20 on threes, and 17-38 overall...I mean, come on man.

I respect the skill, but not the opportunism.  25 free throws in a game where at least half should have been no calls because he initiated the contact?  Come on!  The NBA really needs to come up with a "Harden rule" along the lines of:  "Where a shooter alters his shooting motion with the apparent intent to initiate contact, and incidental contact occurs as a result, the defensive player who made the incidental contact shall not be deemed to have committed a foul."  I'm tired of him saying, "if you don't want me to get to the line, don't foul me." 

[jingle.boy]

The whole jumping in to a defender just to get a foul is BS.  Same thing when contact is after the ball has left the shooter's hands.

[Samsara]

I respect the skill, but not the opportunism.  25 free throws in a game where at least half should have been no calls because he initiated the contact?  Come on!  The NBA really needs to come up with a "Harden rule" along the lines of:  "Where a shooter alters his shooting motion with the apparent intent to initiate contact, and incidental contact occurs as a result, the defensive player who made the incidental contact shall not be deemed to have committed a foul."  I'm tired of him saying, "if you don't want me to get to the line, don't foul me."

Completely agree. They made a rule that makes it an offensive foul if a player kicks a defender while shooting (aka the Reggie Miller rule). Why not do the same thing with Harden? No jumping into a player to initiate that contact. If its already a rule, it needs to be enforced. If its not, you create it. Very simple.

[jingle.boy]

I see lots of shooters doing it.  At least once a game.

[Samsara]

I see lots of shooters doing it.  At least once a game.

Tolliver on the Wolves does it, and got rang up for it a few games ago. It needs to be better enforced. I saw the Wolves all starting to do the Harden move too, and then it stopped. I'm thinking when Ryan Saunders took over for Thibs, he put an end to that. Good.

[Azyiu]

Looks like CP3 will be back either this Sunday vs the Magic or next Tuesday against the Pels; and try to re-injure himself all over again   

[Samsara]

From a 4-9 start, and then jettisoning Butler (thank God), the Wolves have gone 20-15, despite regularly playing without two of their primary rotation guys (Teague - starting PG, Covington - starting SF), and two of the most used backups - Derrick Rose and Tyus Jones. Oh, and another coaching change. Pretty remarkable that an NBA team in the Western Conference, with all the early season drama, all the injuries, and a coaching change, now stands at 24-24, and is on the cusp of re-taking a playoff spot. Shows a lot about the heart of my Timberwolves team, particularly Karl-Anthony Towns.

I've heard a lot of bullshit the last 10 games or so about the Wolves playing teams with an injured star (Lakers, etc.). Well, the T-Wolves are shorthanded by missing FOUR of their regular players, including three of which that play starter minutes...and yet they are still 20-15 since getting rid of Butler in a ridiculously competitive Western Conference.

I don't expect the Wolves to win tonight down four guys headed into Utah on the second night of a back-to-back. But I'm a pretty proud fan that the team has scratched and clawed its way back to .500 after that 4-9 start and all the injuries, drama, and coaching change.

[bosk1]

Good win by the Wolves last night.

[Lonk]

Now Davis wants to be traded. He still has another year left under contract and could help another team, but I’m sure Pelicans will ask for too much to trade him.

[Azyiu]

AD suddenly asked to be traded to a winner... hmm... KD + Cousins to NO for AD sounds good to me 

[Nekov]

Now Davis wants to be traded. He still has another year left under contract and could help another team, but I’m sure Pelicans will ask for too much to trade him.

They can't ask for too much. AD is a game changer and has been showing it for the past 2 years. Lakers and Celtics will be the first to call since AD has been linked with those teams already. I could see the knicks trying to get in the conversation as well. Not sure who else has good enough assets to interest NOLA

[TheOutlawXanadu]

The Lakers might have the upper hand right now because the Celtics simply cannot trade for Davis unless they trade Kyrie for him, IIRC. Both Davis and Kyrie are on a specific kind of contract that you can only have one of per team, or something.

The problem is that the Lakers young assets have lost a lot of value. Also, teams have not been listening to team-specific trade requests recently. Paul George went to the Thunder, Kawhi to the Raptors, etc. This will be interesting!

[Nekov]

The Lakers might have the upper hand right now because the Celtics simply cannot trade for Davis unless they trade Kyrie for him, IIRC. Both Davis and Kyrie are on a specific kind of contract that you can only have one of per team, or something.

This is correct. The Celtics need to wait until July or somehow deal Irving to another team.

The problem is that the Lakers young assets have lost a lot of value. Also, teams have not been listening to team-specific trade requests recently. Paul George went to the Thunder, Kawhi to the Raptors, etc. This will be interesting!

Interesting how it's always the Lakers right? But hey, only minor tampering with PG which resulted in a fine worth half a million which is change money for them...

[Nekov]

And as some guy on Twitter is saying, shouldn't the NBA do something about Klutch Sports? There should be some sort of conflict of interest there since we all know Lebron is the guy who manages that even if Rich Paul is the president.

[Samsara]

Since most of the folks posting in this thread are hoops junkies, I need to ask this.

When is the last time you remember a team down (at the same) TWO STARTERS (PG and SF), the 6th man (PG/SG), and a relied on rotation backup PG?

So down four key rotational players, continually, for a half a dozen games?

And for 23 STRAIGHT GAMES, being without at least two of those rotational players?

Welcome to my world with the Minnesota Timberwolves. I am so pissed off we lost two games of a home-in-home set with Utah, but then Jim Petersen on the Wolves broadcast last night brought that 23 straight games stat to my attention, and I'm actually pretty surprised we're ONLY two games under .500 at 24-26, particularly given the Butler drama and the coaching change.

Then I started thinking about injuries, and I don't honestly recall a team being without four rotation players in recent history. Usually its one guy, maybe two, but FOUR? We're running with our FOURTH STRING PG at this point, and have LUOL DENG in rotation at SF at this point. Its crazy.

[Nekov]

Well, that's classic thibbs running players to the ground. This is what happens. You'll eventually come from under it though. I think you have a good chance to make it in the playoffs if you guys get healthy.

[bosk1]

Well, that's classic thibbs running players to the ground. This is what happens. You'll eventually come from under it though. I think you have a good chance to make it in the playoffs if you guys get healthy.

Speaking of running players into the ground, I'm kind of baffled by Kerr's decision to resort to a 9-man rotation for the Warriors for the last two games and to play is starters so many minutes.  I know Jerebko missed both of those games, but still odd that Cook and Bell did not get any time at all.  I haven't seen Kerr comment on it (although maybe he has somewhere that I haven't seen).  I wonder it that will continue tonight at Indiana as well.

[Samsara]

Well, that's classic thibbs running players to the ground. This is what happens. You'll eventually come from under it though. I think you have a good chance to make it in the playoffs if you guys get healthy.

When Gibson got tossed and Dieng had to leave with a hip pointer, we were down SIX rotation players on Friday night. It was insane.

[Nekov]

Well, that's classic thibbs running players to the ground. This is what happens. You'll eventually come from under it though. I think you have a good chance to make it in the playoffs if you guys get healthy.

Speaking of running players into the ground, I'm kind of baffled by Kerr's decision to resort to a 9-man rotation for the Warriors for the last two games and to play is starters so many minutes.  I know Jerebko missed both of those games, but still odd that Cook and Bell did not get any time at all.  I haven't seen Kerr comment on it (although maybe he has somewhere that I haven't seen).  I wonder it that will continue tonight at Indiana as well.

Didn't Kerr have a fight during a game with one of them? That would explain one of those cases.

[bosk1]

Nah, back to normal.  Green had the night off, and Kerr still played 12 guys.

[Samsara]

This whole AD thing is predictable and ridiculous. I mean, everyone knew it was coming. I think the Super Max contract is ridiculous and obviously is not a big enough enticement to make most players stay in a place. Unlike a lot of fans, I enjoy the free agency period and trades and all that player movement stuff...to a degree. But this whole forcing your way out of a situation is getting old.

Anthony Davis IF (and that's a big IF) he's healthy is a top-5 player in the league. You can't have those guys just strong-arming their way to wherever they want. I mean, in the 80s through the mid-90s, you had to force Ewing off the Knicks (which I still disagree with). These types of foundational players need to stay where they are. Players in the NBA have WAY too much control. If you're under contract -- you're under contract. Stop holding teams (and fan bases) hostage because you're antsy to go somewhere else. Honor your contract, then move on if that's your desire. Just getting tired of it.

[T-ski]

I agree that the players have taken control of the league, but New Orleans have put absolute junk around Davis.  Outside of Demarcus Cousins for less than a season, what have the Pelicans done to entice him to stay? Yes, Jrue Holiday is a very good player, but look at what Davis has had to work with since he came into the league, it isn't pretty.

[KevShmev]

I don't have any problem with players having this much control.  What is the issue with players having a large say-so in where they get to work?  Sure, it throws off the competitive balance, but that is the league's problem, not that of the players. 

[T-ski]

I don't have any problem with players having this much control.  What is the issue with players having a large say-so in where they get to work?  Sure, it throws off the competitive balance, but that is the league's problem, not that of the players.

players do have a say-so, when they become free agents.

[KevShmev]

I don't have any problem with players having this much control.  What is the issue with players having a large say-so in where they get to work?  Sure, it throws off the competitive balance, but that is the league's problem, not that of the players.

players do have a say-so, when they become free agents.

True, but the problem there is what if you get drafted by a horrible franchise and end up being a good player?  That team can hold on to you for four years, since rookie contracts last two years and teams have the option for the 3rd and 4th years (if I am not mistaken), and you could see four years of your prime going to waste on a terrible team.  I can't blame a player for wanting to get out of that situation.  Anthony Davis' greatness has gone to waste for years on a team that has shown it is incapable of surround him with a good supporting cast.

[T-ski]

I don't have any problem with players having this much control.  What is the issue with players having a large say-so in where they get to work?  Sure, it throws off the competitive balance, but that is the league's problem, not that of the players.

players do have a say-so, when they become free agents.

True, but the problem there is what if you get drafted by a horrible franchise and end up being a good player?  That team can hold on to you for four years, since rookie contracts last two years and teams have the option for the 3rd and 4th years (if I am not mistaken), and you could see four years of your prime going to waste on a terrible team.  I can't blame a player for wanting to get out of that situation.  Anthony Davis' greatness has gone to waste for years on a team that has shown it is incapable of surround him with a good supporting cast.

Davis signed a 5 year extension, he didn't have to, but he did. 

[Nekov]

This whole AD thing is predictable and ridiculous. I mean, everyone knew it was coming. I think the Super Max contract is ridiculous and obviously is not a big enough enticement to make most players stay in a place. Unlike a lot of fans, I enjoy the free agency period and trades and all that player movement stuff...to a degree. But this whole forcing your way out of a situation is getting old.

The Supermax was half a good idea before the Cap spiked. After that it just doesn't makes sense anymore. Players on a regular max still get to make a shitload of money. Plus, the supermax depends on people, players and journalists voting you into the all star game, which is completely ludicrous. The league and the owners should come up with better ways to make smaller markets more enticing.
As T-ski points out, NOLA didn't do a good job putting a good enough team around him. It's harder for a small market to do so, but look at how good Oklahoma has been, even having to let go of Durant and Harden. It can be done if the front office does things the right way, which in today's NBA seems to be less and less likely.

[KevShmev]

Davis signed a 5 year extension, he didn't have to, but he did.

I am aware, but hey, people change their minds all the time, and as I said before, I ultimately do not have a problem with a player trying to dictate where he works, and it goes without saying that teams will do whatever they can to break a contract (releasing or trading someone) as well, so the door swings both ways.