Author Topic: Social media: The Death Knell of Society  (Read 7953 times)

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Offline Stadler

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Re: Social media: The Death Knell of Society
« Reply #70 on: March 18, 2019, 01:19:17 PM »
I think there is a kernel of really profound truth in that second paragraph.   I don't quite feel we've adopted a "gullible" attitude; I don't think people are "falling for" things, per se.  But I do think that some have "gamed" the system in a way, by turning it into a personal MORAL failure to be critical (in the classic sense) of facts.    I don't know why ANYONE wouldn't be apoplectic over the vernacular "MY truth".  There is no "my truth".   When I see "my truth" I see bullying, I see marketing, I see deception.   To varying degrees, I grant you, but I see a way of warping the perception of the message.   If I'm right, if my information has veracity, I shouldn't have to couch it with the warning that this is "my truth", and wrap it with the Kevlar that social media has provided us for "opinions".   

That's the biggest "sin" of social media, if you ask me.  It used to be that "opinions were like assholes; everyone's got one", the "asshole" analogy being apt, because it implicitly said that opinions were best kept to oneself.  Not today; we have to declare everything, and we're at the point now - see the "New Zealand" discussion in another thread - where if you DON'T declare your opinion for all to see, you're branded, factually, with an adverse position. Think about that; you're being judged if you DON'T take, actively, the position perceived as "right" by the audience in question.

That should bother some of you a lot more than it apparently does.

but what I don't like about your approach is you seem to turn it right back around into shaming people for just HAVING an opinion.

That might be what it "seems", but it's not what it does.  Nowhere in there is there any shaming of having the opinion.  In fact, just the opposite, as I clearly say that EVERYONE has an opinion, and, implicitly, that they are entitled to that.   I fully cop to shaming someone for thinking their opinion carries any weight whatsoever in influencing the behavior of others.   

Offline cramx3

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Re: Social media: The Death Knell of Society
« Reply #71 on: March 18, 2019, 01:29:48 PM »
I fully cop to shaming someone for thinking their opinion carries any weight whatsoever in influencing the behavior of others.

Yup, and that's what bothers me most about social media.  But not just for thinking their opinion carries weight, because it almost does in some way.  Once you put your opinion out there and get likes or supportive comments, doesn't your opinion then carry some weight at least in your own bubble?  That's what turns me off so much about this, if you say "Trump sucks" and get 100 likes, aren't you then more likely to do something similar again?  You begin to feel not only that others agree with you, but that your opinion becomes truth because you got so many likes.  But of course, this is all in a bubble, your opinion still doesn't carry weight but you feel this empowerment. 

Offline XeRocks81

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Re: Social media: The Death Knell of Society
« Reply #72 on: March 18, 2019, 01:48:45 PM »
I deleted that last post because I was going down a bad road, I don't know wich of us is in a mood today (most likely me) but Stadler is triggering my fight or flight reflex so I'll just stop now because the conversation was actually good, carry on.

Offline Stadler

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Re: Social media: The Death Knell of Society
« Reply #73 on: March 18, 2019, 02:09:03 PM »
I fully cop to shaming someone for thinking their opinion carries any weight whatsoever in influencing the behavior of others.

Yup, and that's what bothers me most about social media.  But not just for thinking their opinion carries weight, because it almost does in some way.  Once you put your opinion out there and get likes or supportive comments, doesn't your opinion then carry some weight at least in your own bubble?  That's what turns me off so much about this, if you say "Trump sucks" and get 100 likes, aren't you then more likely to do something similar again?  You begin to feel not only that others agree with you, but that your opinion becomes truth because you got so many likes.  But of course, this is all in a bubble, your opinion still doesn't carry weight but you feel this empowerment.

Then there's all the spiraling that comes of that.  You DON'T think Trump sucks?  Well, then you must be insane, racist, uneducated, etc. - a personal attack - because you can't possibly be normal and smart and have an opposing view, because I'M normal and smart and... it's a vicious circle. 

Offline Adami

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Re: Social media: The Death Knell of Society
« Reply #74 on: March 18, 2019, 02:10:48 PM »
I fully cop to shaming someone for thinking their opinion carries any weight whatsoever in influencing the behavior of others.

Yup, and that's what bothers me most about social media.  But not just for thinking their opinion carries weight, because it almost does in some way.  Once you put your opinion out there and get likes or supportive comments, doesn't your opinion then carry some weight at least in your own bubble?  That's what turns me off so much about this, if you say "Trump sucks" and get 100 likes, aren't you then more likely to do something similar again?  You begin to feel not only that others agree with you, but that your opinion becomes truth because you got so many likes.  But of course, this is all in a bubble, your opinion still doesn't carry weight but you feel this empowerment.

Then there's all the spiraling that comes of that.  You DON'T think Trump sucks?  Well, then you must be insane, racist, uneducated, etc. - a personal attack - because you can't possibly be normal and smart and have an opposing view, because I'M normal and smart and... it's a vicious circle.

And I would say the same thing to you as, I presume (might be wrong), you'd tell a minority who is being verbally attacked by (insert whatever hate group we're all supposed to be okay with). Such is life. Talk to them if you can, and if you can't, suck it up.
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Offline cramx3

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Re: Social media: The Death Knell of Society
« Reply #75 on: March 18, 2019, 02:13:39 PM »
My example was "Trump sucks' but you change that to "Trump rocks" and you get a similar response and next thing you know the two previous friends now have their social media hoardes who agree with each of their sides and now these two hate each other.  Just keep me out of this cycle.  I don't mind having political discussions but when "likes" and the publicity comes in, I don't want to be involved.

Offline Adami

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Re: Social media: The Death Knell of Society
« Reply #76 on: March 18, 2019, 02:15:35 PM »
My example was "Trump sucks' but you change that to "Trump rocks" and you get a similar response and next thing you know the two previous friends now have their social media hoardes who agree with each of their sides and now these two hate each other.  Just keep me out of this cycle.  I don't mind having political discussions but when "likes" and the publicity comes in, I don't want to be involved.

I keep my friend list relatively pruned and I turn off notifications for everybody (except George Takei). So I'm never dealing with any of that stuff. If I want to know what's going on with someone, i can go to their page. If I don't like, I can leave their page and not be bothered.
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Offline cramx3

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Re: Social media: The Death Knell of Society
« Reply #77 on: March 18, 2019, 02:30:03 PM »
My example was "Trump sucks' but you change that to "Trump rocks" and you get a similar response and next thing you know the two previous friends now have their social media hoardes who agree with each of their sides and now these two hate each other.  Just keep me out of this cycle.  I don't mind having political discussions but when "likes" and the publicity comes in, I don't want to be involved.

I keep my friend list relatively pruned and I turn off notifications for everybody (except George Takei). So I'm never dealing with any of that stuff. If I want to know what's going on with someone, i can go to their page. If I don't like, I can leave their page and not be bothered.

Yea totally, I've found the people who are essentailly my above examples and just stopped following them.  I don't need to watch that stuff play out, just makes me dislike them on both sides and Id rather not have negative feelings towards people I otherwise generally like.

Offline The Walrus

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Re: Social media: The Death Knell of Society
« Reply #78 on: March 18, 2019, 05:37:08 PM »
Yea I saw your post on facebook about deleting people, I hear ya man.  I get some friend requests and if I never met or talked to you to know who you are, I am not accepting it. I've got a few of those from progpower before too.  Facebook to me is too personal.  I don't mind if someone follows me on instagram or twitter, I don't find those social media platforms to be as personal as facebook and I don't need to follow back.  The other option which I've used on people who I know yet do not enjoy following, is to just unfollow them.  There's definitely people I know and even like but just have no interest in following their daily opinion posts that I am not interested in seeing so I can stay friends but just not have to see their latest radical article post and opinion mixed in with my music news (which I think is essentially all I follow anymore on facebook)

Also, I get a bit bothered myself with my own obsession with "likes".  I need to admit I get my own joy and pleasure when I post a video on twitter and it gets a like.  I don't have many followers on that platform (well any really, but twitter is my least engaged social media) so when I make an edited gaming video and someone likes it, I do feel an enjoyment out of that.  It definitely messes with my mind in ways that maybe our minds aren't capable of, yet.

Agreed with all of this, right down to being bothered by my own obsession with it. I sometimes like a whole bunch of things if only to let that person know that, hey, I haven't totally forgotten about you even though we rarely talk, but then I think, "Why am I doing that if..." and down the rabbit hole I go, questioning friendships and having an existential crisis.  :lol I'm thinking about getting rid of it entirely now that I've gotten past the thought that not having Facebook = not having friends. I can see everyone when I see 'em, and if not, well... such is life.
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Offline cramx3

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Re: Social media: The Death Knell of Society
« Reply #79 on: March 18, 2019, 05:48:10 PM »
It's funny because I think you are one of the only people I even comment on using facebook  :lol  I find myself mostly uninterested in sharing things on facebook, I've done my summer concert series of photos and videos for a few years now, but I don't really share status's or opinions and have begun to hardly post pictures anymore.  Facebook has just become the most uninteresting social media for me, yet I comment on all your shit because I find it not that far off from this forum in that you talk about music that no one else I know talks about, same with like the progpower group and DTF group.  Things like that are what keep me using it (well and folllowing my interests).

I also just find instagram to be a much better platform for following my friends in terms of that personal level that facebook used to be.  Since I don't follow bands much on instagram or anything that's really of my interests (those things I follow on facebook or twitter) my instagram feed is almost all just stuff posted from my friends and since it's a simpler format, you don't get the huge political rants or the arguing in the comments.  It's just my friends sharing their experiences and I can find some level of enjoying that and also sharing my own on that platform.

Offline The Walrus

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Re: Social media: The Death Knell of Society
« Reply #80 on: March 18, 2019, 06:10:36 PM »
And that's the rub isn't it? There's that inherent human element of "Well I'm kinda curious what's going on over here with so-and-so" and actually having the means to do that. We all like some level of interaction or understanding what's going on in 'the world' whatever that might refer to and with something as ubiquitous as social media (or even just Facebook at this point) it's so tough to find that 'sweet spot.'  :lol
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Offline cramx3

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Re: Social media: The Death Knell of Society
« Reply #81 on: March 18, 2019, 07:11:57 PM »
And don't forget the ads

Now, I shouldn't be talking too much given where I work (in online advertising) but mixing those targeted ads with your content really is a new way of advertising that really gets people these days and also manipulates in ways traditional advertising did not (which also had an effect on people with manipulation when TV ads started).

Offline Stadler

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Re: Social media: The Death Knell of Society
« Reply #82 on: March 19, 2019, 04:08:22 AM »
I deleted that last post because I was going down a bad road, I don't know wich of us is in a mood today (most likely me) but Stadler is triggering my fight or flight reflex so I'll just stop now because the conversation was actually good, carry on.

And yet, you're the one guy that I most want to hear from, because - and this is not an attack, just an observation, correct me if I'm wrong - I think you might be fine with using social media to force people to (pretend to be) "tolerant".   I'm fascinated by whatever rationale allows you to accept forcing someone else to think like you do.   Wouldn't you hate it if someone FORCED you to think like they do? 

Do you think it was just to force that kid in Sarasota to miss the prom (it's THE prom, by the way, not "prom") because of his unfunny and distasteful joke?

Offline Harmony

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Re: Social media: The Death Knell of Society
« Reply #83 on: July 29, 2019, 09:16:14 AM »
I'm posting this as a semi-apology to Stadler.  I'm still not sure I'm going to say that social media is the death knell of society but after watching Netflix's 'The Great Hack', I'm pretty much convinced that social media is the death knell of free and fair elections.

Has anyone else seen it yet?
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Offline Stadler

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Re: Social media: The Death Knell of Society
« Reply #84 on: August 02, 2019, 10:53:57 AM »
No, but I promise I'll be watching it this weekend...

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Re: Social media: The Death Knell of Society
« Reply #85 on: August 02, 2019, 11:45:40 AM »
Excellent.  Everybody should watch it.  I'm going to watch it again soon.  I have to admit that when the whole Cambridge Analytica and Facebook issue was front and center in the news media, I kind of allowed my mind to glaze over and I didn't pay much attention.  That's bad, really bad.  It is so frustrating sometimes.  There are so many issues that people need to understand and delve more deeply into but honestly, my brain is on overload much of the time just trying to keep my head above water.

But this issue is important.  And definitely worth the time and effort.  And FTR, I do understand that documentaries often have a slant that is far away from reality.  But from what I've been able to learn away from The Great Hack, it appears to be at least getting the facts correct.
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Offline cramx3

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Re: Social media: The Death Knell of Society
« Reply #86 on: August 02, 2019, 11:58:24 AM »
I should check it out too, I had never heard of it until your post, but if its about facebook and user data collection and selling then it interests me.  Also, reminds me of that app that makes you look old that was a huge fad a week or so ago.  Apparently that app's user agreement that everyone agreed to who used it allowed that company to access all sorts of user data and guess where they sent it?  To russia, also that user agreement allows them to use your likeness and pictures apparently for promotional purpose  :facepalm: and almost every single american was using it.  I saw it being discussed in my work IT security chat room, scary shit man.  Like the app is cool and I enjoyed looking at other's pictures and would love to see my own for fun, but I'm glad I read about that before downloading the app because I don't want to see my face pop up next to some propaganda down the road some day.

Offline Ruba

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Re: Social media: The Death Knell of Society
« Reply #87 on: August 02, 2019, 12:38:30 PM »
Like the app is cool and I enjoyed looking at other's pictures and would love to see my own for fun, but I'm glad I read about that before downloading the app because I don't want to see my face pop up next to some propaganda down the road some day.

Or "Hot singles near your area"-dating site ad.  :yarr

Offline Implode

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Re: Social media: The Death Knell of Society
« Reply #88 on: August 04, 2019, 08:33:12 AM »
I'm just amazed with how complacent we've gotten with the state of social media. If you told me 10 years ago that Facebook shows you an ad literally every 4 posts, I would've believed the site to be dead and unused.

Offline Super Dude

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Re: Social media: The Death Knell of Society
« Reply #89 on: August 10, 2019, 04:26:40 PM »
tl;dr this entire thread, but I do believe social media has been highly detrimental to society. Not because it's been the death of free society as such, but because it has been the death knell of comity within this society. We just don't get along anymore because nobody goes along anymore. Now that everyone who holds shitty opinions feels emboldened to share it without public repercussions, we live within a society which no longer has any interest in coexistence and egalitarianism.
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Offline The Walrus

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Re: Social media: The Death Knell of Society
« Reply #90 on: January 30, 2020, 10:28:30 AM »
Bump... just wanted to get this out somewhere. For all the negative aspects of social media and all the fears of what it's doing to our society... I found something today that makes up for all of it, personally. My little sister (who passed last October), like a lot of teenagers, made multiple Facebook accounts over the years. I've found 4 so far going back to when she was 13. Has aaaaall kinds of posts from her over the years, across the profiles. The one she posted on a lot when she was 13... my god, almost every single thing she posted made me cry. It's like she wrote everything the same way she spoke.

I've always been fascinated by how Facebook can quickly get someone's page to transform into 'remembering (insert person's name)' and all that. Hers had that memorial only a few days after the news broke. Now it's just a timeless memorial snapshotting all those inconsequential little moments in her life. All the dumb little teenage girl stuff, answering dumb questions kids pass around online, all that... just makes me bawl.

Facebook ain't all that bad... at least not for this crybaby in a grown man's body.
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Offline Stadler

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Re: Social media: The Death Knell of Society
« Reply #91 on: January 30, 2020, 11:01:54 AM »
That post moved me.  Seriously.  Not so much "to tears", but it was impactful.

Offline Cool Chris

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Re: Social media: The Death Knell of Society
« Reply #92 on: January 30, 2020, 06:25:47 PM »
Curious, from the standpoint of a 43 year old who has never had a Facebook account... why would many teenagers have multiple accounts?
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Re: Social media: The Death Knell of Society
« Reply #93 on: January 30, 2020, 06:27:06 PM »
Curious, from the standpoint of a 43 year old who has never had a Facebook account... why would many teenagers have multiple accounts?

They make an account and forget the info so they just make a new account, usually. Generally out of laziness, or they lost access to the email they used to make the first account, etc... carelessness. Or drama with some other kids so they make a new profile. Who knows. :)
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Offline TAC

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Re: Social media: The Death Knell of Society
« Reply #94 on: January 30, 2020, 07:46:32 PM »
What's Facebook?
would have thought the same thing but seeing the OP was TAC i immediately thought Maiden or DT related
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Offline Cool Chris

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Re: Social media: The Death Knell of Society
« Reply #95 on: January 30, 2020, 07:55:45 PM »
Curious, from the standpoint of a 43 year old who has never had a Facebook account... why would many teenagers have multiple accounts?

They make an account and forget the info so they just make a new account, usually. Generally out of laziness, or they lost access to the email they used to make the first account, etc... carelessness. Or drama with some other kids so they make a new profile. Who knows. :)

If you try and sign up again, fb won't say "hey dumbshit, you already have an account!"? Or do you just give them a different email address? Is that each user's only unique identifier?
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Offline Anguyen92

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Re: Social media: The Death Knell of Society
« Reply #96 on: January 31, 2020, 01:05:10 AM »
What's Facebook?

Something that you posts all kinds of random stuff and has quite the clunky interface.  Not too keen on it myself.  Twitter is enough for me to handle when it comes to Social Media and I don't post anything there.  It's something to keep track of when it comes to various interests that I have.

Offline The Walrus

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Re: Social media: The Death Knell of Society
« Reply #97 on: January 31, 2020, 04:33:31 AM »
Curious, from the standpoint of a 43 year old who has never had a Facebook account... why would many teenagers have multiple accounts?

They make an account and forget the info so they just make a new account, usually. Generally out of laziness, or they lost access to the email they used to make the first account, etc... carelessness. Or drama with some other kids so they make a new profile. Who knows. :)

If you try and sign up again, fb won't say "hey dumbshit, you already have an account!"? Or do you just give them a different email address? Is that each user's only unique identifier?

Gotta use a new email address or phone number, yeah.
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Offline Stadler

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Re: Social media: The Death Knell of Society
« Reply #98 on: January 31, 2020, 09:05:28 AM »
I see to recall at one point that it was a violation of the user agreement to use false info or anonymous info to create an account.  Is that true, or a sham? 

I'm not on the Facebooks. 

Offline The Walrus

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Re: Social media: The Death Knell of Society
« Reply #99 on: January 31, 2020, 09:07:25 AM »
I see to recall at one point that it was a violation of the user agreement to use false info or anonymous info to create an account.  Is that true, or a sham? 

I'm not on the Facebooks.

Technically. But it's also a violation of most sites' and games' TOS for kids under 13 to sign up for things as per federal law, but that didn't stop me from signing up for places when I was 7-12 :) :)
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Offline cramx3

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Re: Social media: The Death Knell of Society
« Reply #100 on: January 31, 2020, 09:10:37 AM »
I see to recall at one point that it was a violation of the user agreement to use false info or anonymous info to create an account.  Is that true, or a sham? 

I'm not on the Facebooks.

Technically. But it's also a violation of most sites' and games' TOS for kids under 13 to sign up for things as per federal law, but that didn't stop me from signing up for places when I was 7-12 :) :)

Yea, rules are easily broken in these cases.  Otherwise I'd never get friend requests from spam accounts.

Offline gmillerdrake

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Re: Social media: The Death Knell of Society
« Reply #101 on: October 09, 2020, 08:19:44 PM »
Has anyone watched ‘The Social Dilemma’ on Netflix? It’s a documentary that looks at and discusses social media’s effect on society  and is told by the major players that worked at these firms (Facebook, Google, Twitter etc etc)

It’s utterly frightening
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Offline Phoenix87x

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Re: Social media: The Death Knell of Society
« Reply #102 on: October 09, 2020, 08:44:43 PM »
I did and it was a fascinating watch

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Re: Social media: The Death Knell of Society
« Reply #103 on: October 10, 2020, 01:37:29 AM »
I did and it was a fascinating watch


I did too. ‘Fascinating’ covers it pretty well, but so does ‘frightening’. Watching that makes you realise the world has the potential to go to shit even more thanks to our social medias. I think it’s very important that people watch this one, if only to get a better idea of how the technology that they use works. That said, for the greater good of humanity, it’s vital that the tech industry eventually manages to tame the beast they’ve created..
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Re: Social media: The Death Knell of Society
« Reply #104 on: October 10, 2020, 01:08:47 PM »
Gotta watch that documentary sooner or later.

I still think however that, if done correctly, social media can be a nice thing. Especially Facebook - it's cool to have all your friends / acquaintaces / people you actually care about in one place. How else would you keep up with everyone else from jobs you don't have anymore and schools you don't attend to? do you take a day off work in December and spend it from morning to noon to write a mail to someone, "hey 'sup dude merry Xmas this year I've done this cool trip"? and frankly, do you have that much to say to every ex collegue or random dude you know from concerts to the point that you have to keep up personally and singularly with every one of them? having them all together is more convenient, and you actually interact with those you know better and see what's up with someone you actually care about. Maybe you reconnect over some mutual interest.

Furthermore, all the events being there are another great thing. I don't certainly need Facebook to remind me that 7 months from now I have an Iron Maiden concerts (ha.... if only!), but what about the dozens minor events in the local scene that I enjoy so much? I'd have to browse 25 different sites to know and track them all. On Facebook all the event are an "I'm interested" button click away.

So, if everyone would use Facebook just to keep track of people they actually care about - they're not called "contact", they're called "friends", add, if not literal friends, people you actually know and that are worthy on a generic basis of that name - and follow the events they like and the things they're interested about, it would be so much better. That's how I do it anyway.
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