Author Topic: How much truth is there to this tweet/meme?  (Read 643 times)

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Online Chino

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How much truth is there to this tweet/meme?
« on: March 14, 2018, 06:43:19 AM »
I kind of hate myself for posting this, but this one kind of hit me hard.



I'd like to not turn this into a "capitalism" discussion in the context of this post, but rather keep the discussion about the current situation of both parties in a house having to work the hours and travel the distances that they do.

For those that don't know, I'm 29 and my girlfriend of 4 years is 27. We own a home together and both work in professional environments. The image above describes our current living situation perfectly and it's borderline depressing more often than I'd like it to be. Her job is stressful as hell (and 70 hour work weeks lately) and even though I'm home at 5:00pm on the dot every day, I maintain the house and property. Any contention that we ever experience in our relationship is rooted in the image above, and the idea of having a kid seems to magnify it that much more.

How do you guys with more life experience deal with this? Do you even feel like your lives fall into the above category? Did it always feel that way, or is it a more recent phenomenon?

Online sylvan

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Re: How much truth is there to this tweet/meme?
« Reply #1 on: March 14, 2018, 07:01:07 AM »
I talk about this stuff a lot with some of my friends, who are closer to your life than mine. Marriage, kids, mortgage... RESPONSIBILITIES. And I can't help but wonder (especially when one specific friend tells me how much he hates his life), WHY do it? I understand that people need to work and support themselves, but people cross that line all the time when they tell themselves that they NEED these things they work so hard for. But do you need them? It seems like a lot of people do certain things in life because they think that's what they are SUPPOSED to do. Like taking on more and more responsibilities unnecessarily. It's all up to you and whether or not you think it's worth it... a fair trade. Are financial responsibilities (with all due respect, I've read some things you've posted about how you feel about your work, and what you get from it, and I can't for the life of me understand how two people working in a corporate environment are not financially VERY comfortable) worth the misery, stress, and missing time with the person you want to spend time with the most?

Offline cramx3

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Re: How much truth is there to this tweet/meme?
« Reply #2 on: March 14, 2018, 07:16:51 AM »
Chino, did you hear back about the potential baby on the way?  just wondering if this is rooted in something more personal cause I don't recall (maybe I missed it) what came of your situation you posted about previously.

Anyway, I totally understand where you are coming from.  I don't know how parents today do it.  Well, I think a lot do it but neglecting their kids in some way personally, but I can't sit here and blame bad parenting because I can only imagine how hard it is today to raise a family. 

And I can't help but wonder (especially when one specific friend tells me how much he hates his life), WHY do it?

This is a big reason why I am so far removed from the idea of having kids.  Not a single one of my friends who are fathers seem to be enjoying their life in any way.  Literally they say they wish they were in my shoes.  And maybe it's a grass is always greener thing, but it's so one sided, I don't really get the opposite feeling at all from ANY of my parent friends. 

Sadly, I think it comes down to the choices we make and what we feel we need to do to be happy in life.  If that means the wife doesn't work and we make less money, then so be it.  If it means you both work and only see the kids for bedtime and you think that's what makes having kids worth it so you can raise them into a more comfortable money situation, then so be it.  If you have to move somewhere else where the lifestyle is easier (I've got to say, from my travels, the NYC metro area life style is not as easy as most of the US).  I guess at the end of the day, to do something you want to do in life you have to make sacrifices along the way.

Online Chino

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Re: How much truth is there to this tweet/meme?
« Reply #3 on: March 14, 2018, 07:47:40 AM »
Chino, did you hear back about the potential baby on the way?  just wondering if this is rooted in something more personal cause I don't recall (maybe I missed it) what came of your situation you posted about previously.

No baby on the way. Doc said the insanely late period is due to the birth control.

WHY do it? I understand that people need to work and support themselves, but people cross that line all the time when they tell themselves that they NEED these things they work so hard for. But do you need them? It seems like a lot of people do certain things in life because they think that's what they are SUPPOSED to do.

I do it because it allows me to live the life I want to live. We could work easy jobs, be content with a combined $70K a year, have an apartment and no property to maintain, and never experience the stresses of having kids... but that life would bore me to death if I knew I was capable of more.

I take on the responsibilities to get what I want. I like woodworking and building remote control trucks. It's hard to do that in an apartment. I like being able to afford a couple of vacations every year. I like being able to go see any concert or show I want without ever having to back out because of price (except at The Met) or an inability to get time off from work. I like not having to share walls, a ceiling, or a floor with neighbors. I like the fact I haven't worked a minute past 4:00pm or a weekend day in 4 years now. I want a kid because I want to have a kid.

Offline El Barto

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Re: How much truth is there to this tweet/meme?
« Reply #4 on: March 14, 2018, 08:14:18 AM »
Chino, did you hear back about the potential baby on the way?  just wondering if this is rooted in something more personal cause I don't recall (maybe I missed it) what came of your situation you posted about previously.

No baby on the way. Doc said the insanely late period is due to the birth control.
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Offline Stadler

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Re: How much truth is there to this tweet/meme?
« Reply #5 on: March 14, 2018, 08:46:27 AM »

I take on the responsibilities to get what I want. I like woodworking and building remote control trucks. It's hard to do that in an apartment. I like being able to afford a couple of vacations every year. I like being able to go see any concert or show I want without ever having to back out because of price (except at The Met) or an inability to get time off from work. I like not having to share walls, a ceiling, or a floor with neighbors. I like the fact I haven't worked a minute past 4:00pm or a weekend day in 4 years now. I want a kid because I want to have a kid.

This hits close to home for me, since it has been a problem for me (in different ways) in both my marriages.   I married late (30-ish) and so I had almost a decade of being a single guy, decent looking, decent coin, and the wherewithal to experience that.   It's cliche, but I really did "work hard, play hard".   I rarely if ever put in less than a 50 or 60 hour week, but I was also rewarded for it.   Then I married and went to work for GE, and things changed.  She liked being part of the "corporate circle".  That took more than 50 or 60 hours to achieve.   Oddly, though, she didn't want to make the sacrifices I needed to to sustain that (I can recall one trip to Disney, she's pushing my daughter in the stroller, and I'm hopping fences and crawling through foliage to try to find one place on that fucking resort that doesn't have music piped in so I can take a conference call). 

I can assure you that nothing comes without a price.  I made some decisions - leaving GE, going to a smaller, boutique firm - to try to shift the dynamic, and promptly got laid off (Thanks, Obama. I'm kidding. Sort of.) from a company that was extremely frustrating to me, and went back to GE.   I tried to navigate the "work hard play hard" - including living in Philly and commuting to Erie every week, for a year - and it finally buried my marriage.  My company was bought, and I got remarried, and I made a conscious decision to pick my spot and stay there.  Meaning, I am going to try to navigate being the number two to a younger, more aggressive number one who is learning what I learned about a decade ago.   I get paid well, I get to make my own hours (more or less, more on that in a minute) and I get to post dumb shit to this board pretty much at my leisure.   But sometimes sacrifices need to be made, and, for example, schedules can't be set in stone (this is where the problems with the new wife come in).   

The one thing I will say, Chino, is your "I've not worked a minute after 4:00 pm in four years" is a gift from God.  I get it, there are other experiences out there, but FOR ME, the idea of a strict 9 to 5 is non-existent IF you want to be anything more than a middle of the pack employee.  Higher management is NOT 9 to 5.   Chino, buddy, I am not saying this is you (I think we've actually talked about this before).  I'm saying IN MY EXPERIENCE, and remember that is mostly GE, a company that chews people up and spits them out for 80% of the pay of other companies.    So my job is at the mercy of my boss (General Counsel of North America) and his boss (General Counsel of the world, headquartered in France).  I sometimes post here at noon, and am on conference calls at 9:00 at night (or 6:00 am, depending).  My wife struggles with this; "just let it go".   Well, that's not an option. 

So it all comes down to choice; I don't think anyone has a gun to their head, but everything in life is a balance of competing interests.   I think I would love to sell the house, ditch the kids and get an apartment in Philly again, hanging at Oscar's Pub, but that's not reality for me at this point.   I'd have to trade too much to get it, and it's stuff that I may never get back.   That's the other thing:  none of this is "moment in time" stuff.  You dump work for nine months to follow that Dead and Company tour, you probably don't have a job when you get back, and you have to address that work gap for the rest of your life. 

Offline gmillerdrake

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Re: How much truth is there to this tweet/meme?
« Reply #6 on: March 14, 2018, 09:16:31 AM »
Not a single one of my friends who are fathers seem to be enjoying their life in any way.  Literally they say they wish they were in my shoes.  And maybe it's a grass is always greener thing, but it's so one sided, I don't really get the opposite feeling at all from ANY of my parent friends. 

As a Father, That's sad to hear. I cannot imagine life without my kids.....nor would I want to. For any 'inconvenience', hardship or tough spot that has surfaced from the responsibilities associated with being a Father......they are outnumbered ten fold by beautiful moments and heart warming experiences that I simply would not trade for anything. Personally, when I see or hear about situations that you describe your buddies going through I can't help but wonder if they actually thought through how having kids was going to change their lives?

I know my wife and I discussed it for some time, nearly the entire (2) years leading into our marriage and we knew that we wanted kids immediately....we had our first son two months before our year anniversary. And while no amount of reading or conversation or documentaries can fully prepare you for parenthood....it simply cannot be explained....we did enter into parenting with the understanding that we were essentially choosing to set aside a lot of our personal wants and desires to have and raise children. Unfortunately, I believe there are a lot of parents out there who cannot get past that aspect of parenting. It's no longer about you....that's a tough pill to swallow....especially if you have selfish tendencies (of which I did/do)



As far as Brian's initial post about Capitalism....I like the concept of Capitalism and if you work hard you can make some $$$ and what not. But especially the past couple years I've grown more and more disenfranchised with where Capitalism has taken our society. I cannot stand the fact that really to keep pace and provide even on a modest level you need a dual income family. I personally don't think that's how families were intended. I'm old school in believing the man is the provider and the woman stays home with the kids. That's probably a whole different thread though. My point is....I think we've entered an era where the perils of Capitalism are in full swing as it's been cultivated and manicured to the point now where the very wealthy are just fleecing the rest of us....and there's little we can do about it other than make 'drastic' lifestyle choices/changes.

   
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Offline Stadler

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Re: How much truth is there to this tweet/meme?
« Reply #7 on: March 14, 2018, 01:10:38 PM »
Not a single one of my friends who are fathers seem to be enjoying their life in any way. 

But that's on them.  I have a kid and now three step kids, and, well, who did you drink beers with before Maiden?    I think it requires us to make hard choices, that's all.   I can't party EVERY night, but I'm fifty now, so like James LaBrie, I need a couple nights off during the week. 

I, like Gary, can't imagine a life without my kids in it.   And more importantly, I wouldn't want to. 

Offline cramx3

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Re: How much truth is there to this tweet/meme?
« Reply #8 on: March 14, 2018, 01:19:58 PM »
Not a single one of my friends who are fathers seem to be enjoying their life in any way. 

But that's on them.  I have a kid and now three step kids, and, well, who did you drink beers with before Maiden?    I think it requires us to make hard choices, that's all.   I can't party EVERY night, but I'm fifty now, so like James LaBrie, I need a couple nights off during the week. 

I, like Gary, can't imagine a life without my kids in it.   And more importantly, I wouldn't want to.

I think you are totally right.  I would also add that every one of my friends deeply loves their children and are also all in the early stages of raising children which may be tougher and less freedom for the parent, they just kind of in general aren't very happy with their current lives due to having no freedom essentially.

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Re: How much truth is there to this tweet/meme?
« Reply #9 on: March 14, 2018, 01:35:11 PM »
the early stages of raising children which may be tougher and less freedom for the parent, they just kind of in general aren't very happy with their current lives due to having no freedom essentially.

Yeah....this is tough when you still have 'little' ones. We are just now at the stage where there's some breathing room. Oldest turns 12 next month, then 10 yr old and soon to be 8 year old. They are much more self sufficient to where we don't have to do every little thing for them. I can have days where it's really just a couple conversations with them here and them when they are out and about playing with friends and what not.

Infants and toddlers take a ton of work and it's never ending and exhausting.
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Re: How much truth is there to this tweet/meme?
« Reply #10 on: March 14, 2018, 01:39:06 PM »
Infants and toddlers take a ton of work and it's never ending and exhausting.

I really don't know how you parents do it.  My little sister is due in June for her irish twins.  She's got a lot of work coming her way.  My best friend (the guy who also was drinking with Stadler before the Iron Maiden show) is due for his second kid any day now.  He's already nearly impossible to see and has warned me he may not see me for a very long time now. 

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Re: How much truth is there to this tweet/meme?
« Reply #11 on: March 23, 2018, 06:55:59 AM »
I'm with Gary and Bill on the awesomeness of being a parent, and it's been discussed in other threads.  @ Marc... definitely the early years are trying - especially with twins.  There were times I dearly missed my "freedom" when everything revolved around caring for babies/toddlers.

But, with them being 17 now, and they'll both be out of the house in 6 months ... "single" life is about to come full circle - at a time where we are wiser, more mature, and have the funds/income to enjoy it more.  I honestly couldn't imagine a life where I was single and/or child-less for all of it.

And it goes by in the blink of an eye.  It really does.  I'm not sure if it's a function of aging, or a function of having kids, but time does go faster than it did when I was a teen/20-something.
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Online lordxizor

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Re: How much truth is there to this tweet/meme?
« Reply #12 on: March 23, 2018, 07:53:37 AM »
It's totally because of the kids that time seems to go faster. You don't perceive yourself aging very much, but kids grow up in a flash, so it's obvious how quickly time is going. My oldest just turned 9 which seems bizarre. In my head I still think I'm a young-ish guy with a relatively new marriage. Except that I'm in my mind thirties and have been married for almost 12 years.

On the original topic, most people in the US don't want to admit it, but it's almost completely our own choices that make life expensive and make us super busy and exhausted. We've gotten to the point where certain wants have become so common that we almost think of them as needs (multiple vehicles, smartphones with data plan, a house in the burbs, sports/activities for the kids, etc) or at least don't really stop to think all that hard about the cost financially and of our time and whether it's really worth it or not. I think most of us are just stuck in a cycle of work, take care of kids, sleep, pay bills, repeat, that we don't take time to try to get out of the cycle that frequently makes us unhappy and exhausted.

Offline KevShmev

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Re: How much truth is there to this tweet/meme?
« Reply #13 on: March 23, 2018, 07:57:19 AM »
 

On the original topic, most people in the US don't want to admit it, but it's almost completely our own choices that make life expensive and make us super busy and exhausted. We've gotten to the point where certain wants have become so common that we almost think of them as needs (multiple vehicles, smartphones with data plan, a house in the burbs, sports/activities for the kids, etc) or at least don't really stop to think all that hard about the cost financially and of our time and whether it's really worth it or not. I think most of us are just stuck in a cycle of work, take care of kids, sleep, pay bills, repeat, that we don't take time to try to get out of the cycle that frequently makes us unhappy and exhausted.

Agreed.  I always hear stories about people who complain about working 60-70 hours a week and I think, "Does someone have a gun to your head to where you have to work that many hours?"  Of course not. That is your choice.  Shoot, I work probably 40-42 hours a week and I cannot imagine working any more than that. It can be stressful enough already at times without bludgeoning myself with another 20+ hours of it.