Poll

Who is your favorite NFL Team

Arizona Cardinals
0 (0%)
Atlanta Falcons
2 (2.9%)
Baltimore Ravens
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Buffalo Bills
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Carolina Panthers
3 (4.3%)
Chicago Bears
5 (7.1%)
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Cleveland Browns
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Dallas Cowboys
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Denver Broncos
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Detroit Lions
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Green Bay Packers
7 (10%)
Houston Texans
1 (1.4%)
Indianapolis Colts
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Jacksonville Jaguars
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2 (2.9%)
Los Angeles Chargers
1 (1.4%)
Los Angeles Rams
1 (1.4%)
Miami Dolphins
2 (2.9%)
Minnesota Vikings
4 (5.7%)
New England Patriots
7 (10%)
New Orleans Saints
0 (0%)
New York Giants
3 (4.3%)
New York Jets
3 (4.3%)
Oakland Raiders
1 (1.4%)
Philadelphia Eagles
4 (5.7%)
Pittsburgh Steelers
4 (5.7%)
San Francisco 49ers
4 (5.7%)
Seattle Seahawks
3 (4.3%)
Tampa Bay Buccaneers
1 (1.4%)
Tennessee Titans
1 (1.4%)
Washington Redskins
1 (1.4%)

Total Members Voted: 70

Author Topic: 2018 NFL Thread - Russell Wilson - "Notoriously Dirty Player"  (Read 37766 times)

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Re: 2018 NFL Thread v. Philadelphia Freedom
« Reply #105 on: February 07, 2018, 04:50:26 PM »
 :facepalm: :facepalm: :facepalm:

This is really the first time since the 2009 season that we've seen the inner squabbling behind the Patriot curtain.
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Offline KevShmev

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Re: 2018 NFL Thread v. Philadelphia Freedom
« Reply #106 on: February 07, 2018, 04:56:29 PM »

And Josh is definitely a weasel.

That is putting it nicely, and I definitely believe the story about Kraft making him an offer he couldn't refuse just to screw the Colts.  Kinda sad that an owner who has been this successful would be so vindictive, but it just reinforces why so many people hate the Patriots.  The franchise as a whole is just not likable.

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Re: 2018 NFL Thread v. Philadelphia Freedom
« Reply #107 on: February 07, 2018, 04:58:56 PM »
Josh is the bad guy, not Kraft.  We do not know all the pieces and until you have his John Hancock, it's not a deal. 
“I don't like country music, but I don't mean to denigrate those who do. And for the people who like country music, denigrate means 'put down'.” - Bob Newhart

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Re: 2018 NFL Thread v. Philadelphia Freedom
« Reply #108 on: February 07, 2018, 04:59:53 PM »
Kev, it didn't have anything to do with the Colts, Kev. Kraft is protecting himself (and keeping Brady happy) against Belichick leaving, which will be sooner than later.
would have thought the same thing but seeing the OP was TAC i immediately thought Maiden or DT related
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Re: 2018 NFL Thread v. Philadelphia Freedom
« Reply #109 on: February 07, 2018, 05:03:11 PM »
Josh is the bad guy, not Kraft.  We do not know all the pieces and until you have his John Hancock, it's not a deal.

That's horse hockey.  Assistants had signed with Indy since McDaniels had verbally committed to going there.  I get that Boston fans don't care about the Colts getting screwed, but he totally screwed those assistants, who are now stuck there coaching under an as-yet-to-be-named head coach. That is not what they signed up for.

Kev, it didn't have anything to do with the Colts, Kev. Kraft is protecting himself (and keeping Brady happy) against Belichick leaving, which will be sooner than later.

I don't buy that for a second.  It was out there a month ago about McDaniels going to Indy.  Kraft waited to the last possible moment to make him that offer he couldn't refuse, because he knew it would screw Indy in the worst possible way. 

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Re: 2018 NFL Thread v. Philadelphia Freedom
« Reply #110 on: February 07, 2018, 05:04:43 PM »
Josh screwed the assistants not Kraft.  Kraft needs only to look out for his team, not the Colts.
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Re: 2018 NFL Thread v. Philadelphia Freedom
« Reply #111 on: February 07, 2018, 05:56:37 PM »
Here's something I don't get. Why is this any different than Belichick resigning as HC of NYJ 18 years ago? Seems like what he did was even worse, and while it was shocking I don't recall him getting even a fraction of the flack that JMD is getting now. I guess I just can't help but think that this is now suddenly worse because people already hate the Patriots. Belichick at the time was simply a former failed coach who did something peculiar. Nobody really cared much. JMD is emblematic of the Patriots organization in 2018, and thus he's now history's greatest monster.
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Re: 2018 NFL Thread v. Philadelphia Freedom
« Reply #112 on: February 07, 2018, 06:08:54 PM »
Kev, it didn't have anything to do with the Colts, Kev. Kraft is protecting himself (and keeping Brady happy) against Belichick leaving, which will be sooner than later.

I don't buy that for a second.  It was out there a month ago about McDaniels going to Indy.  Kraft waited to the last possible moment to make him that offer he couldn't refuse, because he knew it would screw Indy in the worst possible way.

would have thought the same thing but seeing the OP was TAC i immediately thought Maiden or DT related
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Re: 2018 NFL Thread v. Philadelphia Freedom
« Reply #113 on: February 07, 2018, 06:14:42 PM »
Here's something I don't get. Why is this any different than Belichick resigning as HC of NYJ 18 years ago? Seems like what he did was even worse, and while it was shocking I don't recall him getting even a fraction of the flack that JMD is getting now. I guess I just can't help but think that this is now suddenly worse because people already hate the Patriots. Belichick at the time was simply a former failed coach who did something peculiar. Nobody really cared much. JMD is emblematic of the Patriots organization in 2018, and thus he's now history's greatest monster.


No doubt.  It's amplified to the nth degree because it's the Pat's.


Is John Elway and Eli Manning scumbags since they forced the teams that drafted them to trade them?
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Re: 2018 NFL Thread v. Philadelphia Freedom
« Reply #114 on: February 07, 2018, 07:40:56 PM »
It's not like McD has a spotless track record though; he's been involved in cheating scandals with two different organizations. It makes sense to me that some have been critical of him for this because even I thought he was a weasel before he stiffed the Colts, but then again I'm a Denver fan. It seems like that whole incident he was involved in with Denver really flew under the radar since they were terrible that year.

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Re: 2018 NFL Thread v. Philadelphia Freedom
« Reply #115 on: February 07, 2018, 08:13:27 PM »
It's not like Bill Belichick had a checkered past.  How's that work out?
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Re: 2018 NFL Thread v. Philadelphia Freedom
« Reply #116 on: February 07, 2018, 10:31:17 PM »
Here's something I don't get. Why is this any different than Belichick resigning as HC of NYJ 18 years ago? Seems like what he did was even worse, and while it was shocking I don't recall him getting even a fraction of the flack that JMD is getting now. I guess I just can't help but think that this is now suddenly worse because people already hate the Patriots. Belichick at the time was simply a former failed coach who did something peculiar. Nobody really cared much. JMD is emblematic of the Patriots organization in 2018, and thus he's now history's greatest monster.

The difference is that Belichick lost his first head coaching job due to the Browns moving/seizing operations. It had nothing to do with his coaching since it looked like the Browns were headed in the right direction. Also, while here in NY he got a lot of crap for his decision, his reasoning was fair (uncomfortable with the ownership situation due to the death of Leon Hess) and he at least had the balls to actually stand at the podium and make a statement. Now let’s look at McDaniels, a guy who was fired from his first head coaching job because he quite frankly did a terrible job. Very few coaches get a second chance to prove themselves as a HC, and even less get a third chance. He ignored his agent, who told him it would be a bad idea to decline the Colts job at the last second, and eventually his agent dropped him. And he has yet to give his reasoning, leaving his selected personnel high and dry. Also, if there was a “handshake agreement” that he would be the successor to Belichick, that could also potentially be in violation of the Rooney Rule.
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Re: 2018 NFL Thread v. Philadelphia Freedom
« Reply #117 on: February 07, 2018, 10:42:23 PM »
Here's something I don't get. Why is this any different than Belichick resigning as HC of NYJ 18 years ago? Seems like what he did was even worse, and while it was shocking I don't recall him getting even a fraction of the flack that JMD is getting now. I guess I just can't help but think that this is now suddenly worse because people already hate the Patriots. Belichick at the time was simply a former failed coach who did something peculiar. Nobody really cared much. JMD is emblematic of the Patriots organization in 2018, and thus he's now history's greatest monster.


No doubt.  It's amplified to the nth degree because it's the Pat's.


Is John Elway and Eli Manning scumbags since they forced the teams that drafted them to trade them?

I think that the situation with both of those QB's is miles away from this. They were both very forthcoming with their views on their situations. The problem with this one is that he seemingly led the team on, and possibly used it as leverage for better compensation from his current owner. Sure, this happens in every day Life, but the overall implications are vastly different.
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Re: 2018 NFL Thread v. Philadelphia Freedom
« Reply #118 on: February 08, 2018, 04:18:21 AM »
I dont agree. They forced their way ou but it's ok because they were honest? Josh leveraged his way to less money and less power?
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Re: 2018 NFL Thread v. Philadelphia Freedom
« Reply #119 on: February 08, 2018, 06:15:28 AM »
I don't like what those QBs did, and I don't like what JMcD did, but none of them are "scumbags" for doing so.  I just wonder if what Josh did was even the best decision for himself, long term.  I don't think the QB's decisions were as hurtful to themselves in the long run.

They talked about this on sports radio this morning and Boomer brought up how the quote out there is BB is going to "open the world" to Josh.  So, he didn't show him his ways before?   :lol Maybe that's why many of BB's assistants fail as head coaches.

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Re: 2018 NFL Thread v. Philadelphia Freedom
« Reply #120 on: February 08, 2018, 06:17:06 AM »

I think that the situation with both of those QB's is miles away from this. 

Yep. The situations aren't remotely comparable.

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Re: 2018 NFL Thread v. Philadelphia Freedom
« Reply #121 on: February 08, 2018, 06:20:32 AM »
Bullshit they are not.  Listen I'm not saying Josh is not wrong but don't give me that both those QB's did not pull crap to get out of their situation.  It's equally as bad.  Sorry.  You both are wrong.
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Re: 2018 NFL Thread v. Philadelphia Freedom
« Reply #122 on: February 08, 2018, 06:33:41 AM »
Bullshit they are not.  Listen I'm not saying Josh is not wrong but don't give me that both those QB's did not pull crap to get out of their situation.  It's equally as bad.  Sorry.  You both are wrong.

The only way they are comparable would've been if either had negotiated a deal, and agreed, then walked away from it less than 8 hours before the announced pressed.  Joe, your offsides on this one. Apples and oranges. Elway/Manning exercised their only means of leverage to do what was right for their career; McDaniels accepted a last minute counter-offer.
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Re: 2018 NFL Thread v. Philadelphia Freedom
« Reply #123 on: February 08, 2018, 06:59:58 AM »
Seem to me you guys lean towards the players more.  I think the coaches should have that flexibility as well.  I only abhor owners.  I  personally do not belive a player has a right to pick where they want to go until they hit free agency.  They deserve it.  Rookie should not have that.

Again, I think Josh was wrong here.  I don't deny that at all but lets look at the players on those teams that these 2 QB's shunned.  It's as equal as these coaches that were screwed by Josh.
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Offline Destiny Of Chaos

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Re: 2018 NFL Thread v. Philadelphia Freedom
« Reply #124 on: February 08, 2018, 07:09:30 AM »
I wasn't too keen on Indy firing Chuck Pagano considering that his franchise QB played zero snaps this year, so I can't help but feel a little bit of karma playing out.  Wasn't nice for McDaniels to string them along only to change his mind, but he technically didn't break any rules. And personally speaking, I'd rather be head coach in waiting for Kraft, then the head coach for Irsay, if that's indeed what McDaniels' based his decision on.   

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Re: 2018 NFL Thread v. Philadelphia Freedom
« Reply #125 on: February 08, 2018, 07:13:34 AM »
People always want to justify why one is not the same.  Bad is bad.  People want to argue because they do not like a certain team and excuse others for their digressions.  Bad is bad.  Josh should have dropped out early.  it's oblivious he had reservations and waffled and when Kraft stepped up, he bit.  I think some of this was Kraft realizing that after Bill's actions in the SB he may need a back up plan when he didn't think so before.


DOC, I think he's a good coach that the ownership and past GM, Griggson(SP?) let down.  How has Luck been out this long?  He's too young, they mismanaged his injury.  Such a shame.  He really was the next big QB.
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Re: 2018 NFL Thread v. Philadelphia Freedom
« Reply #126 on: February 08, 2018, 07:26:36 AM »
People always want to justify why one is not the same.  Bad is bad.  People want to argue because they do not like a certain team and excuse others for their digressions.  Bad is bad.  Josh should have dropped out early.  it's oblivious he had reservations and waffled and when Kraft stepped up, he bit.  I think some of this was Kraft realizing that after Bill's actions in the SB he may need a back up plan when he didn't think so before.


DOC, I think he's a good coach that the ownership and past GM, Griggson(SP?) let down.  How has Luck been out this long?  He's too young, they mismanaged his injury.  Such a shame.  He really was the next big QB.

I agree. Other than drafting Luck and TY Hilton, they have messed up literally every other facet of running a football team over the past few years.


And I know that the wait for your coach strategy worked for the 49ers last year, as Kyle Shanahan made good on his verbal and signed on, but my solution for this would be simple.  NO team can interview or sign a new head coach until AFTER the Super Bowl.   Think about how exciting this week would be if all 7 or 8 teams with HC vacancies were having interviews scrambling to get their guy. 

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Re: 2018 NFL Thread v. Philadelphia Freedom
« Reply #127 on: February 08, 2018, 07:35:20 AM »
There was talk on our local radio stations saying they should do that.
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Re: 2018 NFL Thread v. Philadelphia Freedom
« Reply #128 on: February 08, 2018, 07:43:36 AM »
I'm still not going to begrudge JMD for doing what he felt was best for him and his family. He never signed and those assistants shouldn't have signed until he did.

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Re: 2018 NFL Thread v. Philadelphia Freedom
« Reply #129 on: February 08, 2018, 07:56:10 AM »
^^^ Kinda leaning there.

First, I don't think the QB and JMD situations are the same.   Manning and Elway both said, in advance, that they would not play for the team expected to draft them.   The team that DID draft them did so with full disclosure and full knowledge.    They knew the risk going in.

Having said that, I don't know that what JMD did was so egregious.  Perfect?  No.   But what would you have him do?  Decline the better offer, move his family, and then be miserable and second-guessing?  That the assistants signed is unfortunate, but I think Kaos has is right.  They are adults and they took the risk.   Now, some of this is subject to change, depending on what was actually said, but still.  I think if this was St. Louis, and Joe McOffensive Coordinator, instead of the Patriots and Josh McDaniel, we wouldn't be talking about this.

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Re: 2018 NFL Thread v. Philadelphia Freedom
« Reply #130 on: February 08, 2018, 07:59:39 AM »
A bad move by the Colts was announcing these assistants signed before announcing the head coach.  They never should have done that.
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Offline El Barto

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Re: 2018 NFL Thread v. Philadelphia Freedom
« Reply #131 on: February 08, 2018, 08:41:59 AM »
Here's something I don't get. Why is this any different than Belichick resigning as HC of NYJ 18 years ago? Seems like what he did was even worse, and while it was shocking I don't recall him getting even a fraction of the flack that JMD is getting now. I guess I just can't help but think that this is now suddenly worse because people already hate the Patriots. Belichick at the time was simply a former failed coach who did something peculiar. Nobody really cared much. JMD is emblematic of the Patriots organization in 2018, and thus he's now history's greatest monster.

The difference is that Belichick lost his first head coaching job due to the Browns moving/seizing operations. It had nothing to do with his coaching since it looked like the Browns were headed in the right direction. Also, while here in NY he got a lot of crap for his decision, his reasoning was fair (uncomfortable with the ownership situation due to the death of Leon Hess) and he at least had the balls to actually stand at the podium and make a statement. Now let’s look at McDaniels, a guy who was fired from his first head coaching job because he quite frankly did a terrible job. Very few coaches get a second chance to prove themselves as a HC, and even less get a third chance. He ignored his agent, who told him it would be a bad idea to decline the Colts job at the last second, and eventually his agent dropped him. And he has yet to give his reasoning, leaving his selected personnel high and dry. Also, if there was a “handshake agreement” that he would be the successor to Belichick, that could also potentially be in violation of the Rooney Rule.
Bill was hated in Cleveland. Bill Bellicose? "Bill Belichick's five-year reign of error is over.''? "The Voice of Doom?" He fired Kosar and saddled them with Andre Risen. He lost six of his last seven games, and each season was worse than the one before,  finishing 36-44. Model certainly could have taken him to Baltimore, where he would have gone to a place where he was less despised, but chose not to.

And while people keep citing his agent dropping him, it's important to note that he also represented Indy's GM. I think it's safe to say loyalty factored into this. Moreover, what reason did the agent have to stick with him anyway? He simply saw him as no longer profitable to his bottom line.

As for the career aspect, his head coaching prospects were the same either way. He takes the Colts job and if he fails he's done. He takes the NE job and if he fails he's done. I'm not sure there's much difference between being a two-time loser and a guy who betrays a team in terms of future job prospects. Whereas if he keeps the Patriots afloat after Bill leaves then the same people bitching about him now will be clamoring to hire him away from NE. It' just a matter of if he wins or loses at his next coaching gig.
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Offline Destiny Of Chaos

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Re: 2018 NFL Thread v. Philadelphia Freedom
« Reply #132 on: February 08, 2018, 09:21:45 AM »
Eagles parade should be entertaining. So happy for this fanbase

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Re: 2018 NFL Thread v. Philadelphia Freedom
« Reply #133 on: February 08, 2018, 09:24:25 AM »
And I disagree with McDaniels' being unhirable because of this.    Someone like Pioli will take him in a heartbeat if he's ever in that position again and the need arises.   He still has stock, and when it comes to "winning or losing", owners will put up with a lot of sins to make that happen.   

El Barto is right; what WILL make him unhirable is his next HC gig.  He fails there, he's likely Dick LeBeau or Dante Scarnecchia, the eternal coordinator.   I wouldn't be surprised if that wasn't - implicitly - part of the conversation.  "I can't promise you the Pats job - Rooney - but if you go to Indy and Luck's shoulder doesn't rehab right, or Brissette isn't the guy, and you fail, I can promise you you WON'T get the Pats - or any - job after that.   Help us finish this out, and you're no worse off, perhaps better off, than any other scenario."

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Re: 2018 NFL Thread v. Philadelphia Freedom
« Reply #134 on: February 08, 2018, 11:33:53 AM »
49ers get the deal done with Garoppolo. 5 years, $137.5.


« Last Edit: February 08, 2018, 01:01:08 PM by Destiny Of Chaos »

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Re: 2018 NFL Thread v. Philadelphia Freedom
« Reply #135 on: February 08, 2018, 11:40:37 AM »
49ers get the deal done with Garoppolo. 5 years, $137.5.

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Re: 2018 NFL Thread v. Philadelphia Freedom
« Reply #136 on: February 08, 2018, 12:31:01 PM »
That rules out Jimmy G. captaining the S.S. Patriot any time soon.  Bill wouldn't pay that for his entire offense.

Offline Destiny Of Chaos

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Re: 2018 NFL Thread v. Philadelphia Freedom
« Reply #137 on: February 08, 2018, 12:39:47 PM »
« Last Edit: February 08, 2018, 01:02:08 PM by Destiny Of Chaos »

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Re: 2018 NFL Thread v. Garoppolo Strikes Gold
« Reply #138 on: February 08, 2018, 01:09:12 PM »
Good for Jimmy G!
“I don't like country music, but I don't mean to denigrate those who do. And for the people who like country music, denigrate means 'put down'.” - Bob Newhart

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Offline Destiny Of Chaos

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Re: 2018 NFL Thread v. Garoppolo Strikes Gold
« Reply #139 on: February 08, 2018, 01:32:34 PM »
This current Patriots run has been absolutely incredible. Below are the 32 teams, sorted by the number of conference championship game appearances over the past 7 seasons:

Seven
New England

Three
San Francisco

Two 
Atlanta
Baltimore
Denver
Green Bay 
Seattle

One
Arizona   
Carolina
Indianapolis   
Jacksonville
Minnesota
N.Y. Giants 
Philadelphia
Pittsburgh

Zero
Buffalo
Chicago
Cincinnati
Cleveland
Dallas
Detroit
Houston
Kansas City
L.A. Chargers
L.A. Rams
Miami
N.Y. Jets
New Orleans 
Oakland
Tampa Bay
Tennessee
Washington 


Even more remarkable is how many conference championship games the Patriots have played in since Brady took over the starting job in 2001. Below is the list over the past 17 seasons:

Twelve
New England

Six
Philadelphia
Pittsburgh

Five 
Indianapolis   

Four
Green Bay 

Three
Atlanta
Baltimore
Carolina
Denver
San Francisco
Seattle
 
Two
Arizona   
Chicago
Minnesota
New Orleans 
N.Y. Giants 
N.Y. Jets

One
Jacksonville
S.D. Chargers
St.L  Rams
Oakland
Tampa Bay
Tennessee

Zero
Buffalo
Cincinnati
Cleveland
Dallas
Detroit
Houston
Kansas City
Miami
Washington 


Love them or hate them, this is excellence sustained, not to mention their 5 Lombardis over the same span.