Author Topic: Star Wars Discussion Thread v.The Last Jedi  (Read 24856 times)

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Offline Adami

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Re: Star Wars Discussion Thread v.The Last Jedi
« Reply #770 on: August 07, 2018, 05:09:15 PM »
Wow.  It's like you are a homeless person and Star Wars is a downtown Seattle sidewalk.  You just can't help crapping all over it, can you?

Actually, it's more like Cool Chris is Cool Chris, and SW is like homeless people in Seattle.
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Offline Destiny Of Chaos

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Re: Star Wars Discussion Thread v.The Last Jedi
« Reply #771 on: August 10, 2018, 10:49:45 AM »
This trilogy is a mess. JJ set things up nicely with TFA.... then TLJ happens..... I couldn't be any less excited for Episode 9.....the magic is gone. They're making movies for the sake of making movies now.

I also heard that they might make 2 movies out of episode 9....... do they not know what an "episode" is?

Offline TheOutlawXanadu

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Re: Star Wars Discussion Thread v.The Last Jedi
« Reply #772 on: August 10, 2018, 11:07:53 AM »
This trilogy is a mess. JJ set things up nicely with TFA.... then TLJ happens..... I couldn't be any less excited for Episode 9.....the magic is gone. They're making movies for the sake of making movies now.

I also heard that they might make 2 movies out of episode 9....... do they not know what an "episode" is?

In fairness, while the corporate overlords at Disney and Lucasfilm are probably just making movies for the almighty dollar, the people on the ground who are putting the films together seem to really enjoy it. Everyone from JJ to Rian to Kasdan loves Star Wars. That doesn't mean the films can't stink, but I don't think they stink because of a lack of care. I'm not totally sure how Rian thought The Last Jedi was the best possible film for the series, but his heart was in the right place. Just my two cents.
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Offline Cool Chris

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Re: Star Wars Discussion Thread v.The Last Jedi
« Reply #773 on: August 10, 2018, 11:12:31 AM »
This trilogy is a mess. JJ set things up nicely with TFA.... then TLJ happens.....

I've always seen this as a big issue when different directors get assigned to do different movies in a series. For better or worse (let's not get in to it here) Eps 1-3 felt like a series because the same team worked on all three, from the director, writer, and producer to the sound guys on down. Eps 4-6 had different directors and producers and developing technology, but it was still Lucas at the top so the vision didn't change. hen different directors come on to a series they (rightly or wrongly) they give their film their vision, and if it doesn't mesh with the preceding movies, it can make the series feel disjointed.

I also heard that they might make 2 movies out of episode 9

It's the formula now. See Twilight/Harry Potter/Hunger Games.
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Offline kaos2900

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Re: Star Wars Discussion Thread v.The Last Jedi
« Reply #774 on: August 10, 2018, 11:16:09 AM »
This trilogy is a mess. JJ set things up nicely with TFA.... then TLJ happens..... I couldn't be any less excited for Episode 9.....the magic is gone. They're making movies for the sake of making movies now.

I also heard that they might make 2 movies out of episode 9....... do they not know what an "episode" is?

Care to share where you heard about splitting episode 9 because this is the first I'm hearing of it.

And I couldn't disagree more with the rest of the post. It has never been a better time to be Star Wars fan. You can not like the movies but I don't think anyone can question the level of passion thatRyan Johnson and JJ Abrams have about Star Wars. Even Solo was a good film hampered by an abysmal marketing strategy.

Offline bosk1

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Re: Star Wars Discussion Thread v.The Last Jedi
« Reply #775 on: August 10, 2018, 11:24:10 AM »
Care to share where you heard about splitting episode 9 because this is the first I'm hearing of it.

I saw an article about that yesterday.  It said that it was being considered because of the amount of content, but not that a final decision had been made.  The dilemma apparently is that with the story they want to tell, they have more than enough footage for one film.  So they are either going to have to make massive cuts, which could impact the quality of the story, or spread it out into two films, which could dilute the quality of the story. 
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Offline Cool Chris

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Re: Star Wars Discussion Thread v.The Last Jedi
« Reply #776 on: August 10, 2018, 11:32:21 AM »
So they are either going to have to make massive cuts, which could impact the quality of the story, or spread it out into two films, which could dilute the quality of the story. 

Could being the appropriate word. It could also mean there is too much (potentially unnecessary or uninteresting) material and the script could use a good trimming.

My examples are not good analogies because they are based on novels as their source material. But Deathly Hallows isn't any longer or more dense than its three predecessors. Mockingjay is equivalent in size and narrative to Hunger Games/Catching Fire.
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Offline bosk1

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Re: Star Wars Discussion Thread v.The Last Jedi
« Reply #777 on: August 10, 2018, 11:52:58 AM »
So they are either going to have to make massive cuts, which could impact the quality of the story, or spread it out into two films, which could dilute the quality of the story. 

Could being the appropriate word. It could also mean there is too much (potentially unnecessary or uninteresting) material and the script could use a good trimming.

My examples are not good analogies because they are based on novels as their source material. But Deathly Hallows isn't any longer or more dense than its three predecessors. Mockingjay is equivalent in size and narrative to Hunger Games/Catching Fire.

Oh, of course.  We obviously don't know anything about the existing content and how necessary it is or isn't.  I'm just paraphrasing what the article said is all.

I didn't read the Harry Potter books, but the two films for the finale felt bloated and unnecessary.  Mockingjay, on the other hand, felt well-paced spread over two films.  For splitting a chapter in a film's series into multiple films, I don't have strong feelings one way or the other.  It just depends on whether or not it is executed effectively.  If they give us Ep. IX in one film and it works well, great.  If they give it to us in two films and it works well, great.
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Offline kaos2900

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Re: Star Wars Discussion Thread v.The Last Jedi
« Reply #778 on: August 10, 2018, 11:55:55 AM »
Bosk you nailed it. I'm all for what makes for the best movie/story. Of course if they split it you'll have a contingent of "fans" shaking their fist at ol' greedy Disney. IF they split it I'd call part 1 Episode 9 and part two Episode 10. Having a 10 film story feels just as good as three separate trilogies. Of course they have already started filming so you'd think they would have made a decision by now.

Offline TheOutlawXanadu

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Re: Star Wars Discussion Thread v.The Last Jedi
« Reply #779 on: August 10, 2018, 02:09:32 PM »
Bosk you nailed it. I'm all for what makes for the best movie/story. Of course if they split it you'll have a contingent of "fans" shaking their fist at ol' greedy Disney. IF they split it I'd call part 1 Episode 9 and part two Episode 10. Having a 10 film story feels just as good as three separate trilogies. Of course they have already started filming so you'd think they would have made a decision by now.

It's funny how the number ten has a certain ring to it, doesn't it? I agree that ten films feels like a nice, round number. Then again, Russell Westbrook won the MVP because he averaged a nice, round triple-double, which now seems kind of silly in hindsight, so maybe nine is better. :lol
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Re: Star Wars Discussion Thread v.The Last Jedi
« Reply #780 on: August 10, 2018, 04:00:01 PM »
Nine episodes is kinda cool because it's "a trilogy of trilogies".  Ten would also be cool.

Just as long as they don't do it as two films and call them Episode IX, Part 1 and Episode IX, Part 2.  That would be dumb.

Offline bosk1

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Re: Star Wars Discussion Thread v.The Last Jedi
« Reply #781 on: August 10, 2018, 04:03:58 PM »
Just as long as they don't do it as two films and call them Episode IX, Part 1 and Episode IX, Part 2.  That would be dumb.

If it is two films, I fully expect them to do it that way.  And I'm not sure what is so "dumb" about that.
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Re: Star Wars Discussion Thread v.The Last Jedi
« Reply #782 on: August 10, 2018, 04:22:25 PM »
It's dumb because the films are not based on books or any other existing medium, and thus are not already split into defined episodes.  In episodic storytelling, an episode is just the next installment of the story.  The next episode is Episode IX.  If there's one after that, it's Episode X.

The Harry Potter films and the Hunger Games films were based on books that were adapted to film.  Since they split the final film of each series, and stories already had names, then it made perfect sense to call the parts Part 1 and Part 2.  But the next Star Wars episode is just the next episode.  If it's split into two films, they will be the next two episodes.

Offline bosk1

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Re: Star Wars Discussion Thread v.The Last Jedi
« Reply #783 on: August 10, 2018, 04:45:27 PM »
Overthinking it, dude.
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Offline Adami

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Re: Star Wars Discussion Thread v.The Last Jedi
« Reply #784 on: August 10, 2018, 05:19:52 PM »
I think there's also a psychological element to it. Since the early 80's, it's been described as 9 movies. At the time, people thought all we'd get is 3 of those nine. Then in the early 2000's, it was a 2nd trilogy. Still sticking to the idea of a final 9. Then, in 2018......with almost 40 years of 9 being in the social zeitgeist, to have it be 10, is....psychologically....unsettling. It's a matter of priming and changing that information so late in the game. If it hadn't been considered 3 sets of 3, thus 9, for so many decades, it wouldn't matter.
« Last Edit: August 10, 2018, 07:55:09 PM by Adami »
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Offline countoftuscany42

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Re: Star Wars Discussion Thread v.The Last Jedi
« Reply #785 on: August 10, 2018, 09:02:18 PM »
Overthinking it, dude.
But that’s the point though? The “Episode” only really exists to help differentiate the films especially in context to the timeline of the story. Each film is an episode, it just becomes redundant if you add in another part to an episode. You might as well just list them all as Star Wars: The Phantom Menace, etc up to Star Wars: (Episode IX title) parts 1 and 2 without using Episode in the title. If an Episode can be two films, using Episode to differentiate them makes no sense when there are already more specific titles the movies are known by

Offline Phoenix87x

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Re: Star Wars Discussion Thread v.The Last Jedi
« Reply #786 on: August 10, 2018, 09:13:17 PM »
This trilogy is a mess. JJ set things up nicely with TFA.... then TLJ happens..... I couldn't be any less excited for Episode 9.....the magic is gone. They're making movies for the sake of making movies now.

I also heard that they might make 2 movies out of episode 9....... do they not know what an "episode" is?

I completely agree. I really enjoyed 7 and thought it was excellent, but think 8 is hot steaming dogshit, So I could care less about 9.
« Last Edit: August 11, 2018, 06:07:12 PM by Phoenix87x »
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Offline gmillerdrake

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Re: Star Wars Discussion Thread v.The Last Jedi
« Reply #787 on: August 11, 2018, 09:12:06 PM »
I’ve thoroughly enjoyed both 7 and 8. I thought JJ did a great job with 7 considering the pressure behind that release.....and with every watch of TLJ it gets better and better in my eyes. Outside of being a good SW movie I think it’s just a really good movie in general.
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Re: Star Wars Discussion Thread v.The Last Jedi
« Reply #788 on: August 13, 2018, 03:44:56 PM »
I disliked TLJ when I saw it the first time. Put a lot of thought in, liked it a whole lot better the second time, and again the third time. That said, I still don't "like" how certain things happened. I can nitpick three things in particular - how they handled Luke (there was a better, and more fitting way to do it, IMO), Rose (not needed), and "Super Leia." But again, I still enjoy it.

Frankly, for my money, the best Star Wars movie ever made (after Empire) is Rogue One. I am an absolute Rogue One fanboy. Brilliant war movie set within the Star Wars universe.
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Offline Phoenix87x

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Re: Star Wars Discussion Thread v.The Last Jedi
« Reply #789 on: August 13, 2018, 04:53:23 PM »
Rogue one I enjoyed a lot as well. I though Mads did a fantastic job, and Krenick was a solid villain. Absolutely LOVED the final space battle. Just a cool, different kind of SW movie. Despite not having any Jedis or anything, I felt like it really delivered.
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Offline Logain Ablar

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Re: Star Wars Discussion Thread v.The Last Jedi
« Reply #790 on: August 14, 2018, 02:19:45 AM »
For me, Rogue One has been the best of the new batch. Maybe that's because it's the one that felt most like the OT. One criticism I'd have is that there are just too many characters to keep up with and care about, but apart from that it's a really good fun adventure.

Solo was enjoyable, but forgettable. (The more I think about that cameo at the end, it felt wrong and out of place. Just an excuse to leave a trailing thread to stitch in to some future movie.)

I enjoyed TFA, as I saw it as a kind of resetting of what SW should be, so I was reasonably forgiving of the some of the copy and paste criticisms that have been directed at it. I was always going into TLJ with higher expectations, but unfortunately it was a big disappointment for me.

I'm sorry to say that TLJ has dampened my enthusiasm for 9. I'm sure I'll bring the kids to see it when it comes out, but the eagerness has gone, and I certainly won't be going to the midnight show like we did for TLJ.

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Re: Star Wars Discussion Thread v.The Last Jedi
« Reply #791 on: August 14, 2018, 06:13:42 AM »
I liked both Rogue One and TLJ when I first saw them.

I like TLJ more every time I watch it, where as I dislike R1 after every subsequent rewatch to the point where I won't even bother anymore.

TLJ is very well acted, has likable characters and even though the structure of the movie is a bit messy I enjoy the adventure they are on. Cinematography is also great, and I'm behind the changes that it brings to the Skywalker saga, however controversial.

R1 has a great score, and beautiful cinematography but I have a lot of problems with it. Acting is wooden, half the characters look like they are falling asleep in the middle of the scene. They could have chosen to focus on a smaller group of characters, and properly develop them instead of shoving in too many main characters, to the point where some of them have only a few lines of dialogue.

Vader's cameo was unnecessary, although it was great to hear James Earl Jones do the voice one last time. What I'm trying to say is that it's a movie that doesn't need to exist. You are not missing anything if you choose to skip it. Pretty much like Solo, which is a slightly better film.

Offline lordxizor

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Re: Star Wars Discussion Thread v.The Last Jedi
« Reply #792 on: August 14, 2018, 06:17:34 AM »
I really don't get how TLJ can piss off fans so much that they'e almost no longer interested in Star Wars, when the prequels, which range from god-awful at the worst to passable at the best didn't drive them away. I get most of the criticisms of TLJ, and I think many of them could be very valid depending on where they go with Ep 9. But overall I liked the movie a lot.

Offline Grappler

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Re: Star Wars Discussion Thread v.The Last Jedi
« Reply #793 on: August 14, 2018, 07:13:53 AM »
I really don't get how TLJ can piss off fans so much that they'e almost no longer interested in Star Wars, when the prequels, which range from god-awful at the worst to passable at the best didn't drive them away. I get most of the criticisms of TLJ, and I think many of them could be very valid depending on where they go with Ep 9. But overall I liked the movie a lot.

That's exactly how I feel.  It's a movie - who cares if they didn't give Luke super-Jedi powers and let him kick ass on screen like we all thought he would.  I loved that it flipped the entire trilogy on its head.  "You thought TFA was a re-hash of A New Hope?  Well check this out, let's do something radical and completely original......oh, you're still going to complain?"

So yeah, there were silly things like Leia flying around in space, but in all, it was a really neat story and I loved that Luke was so human with tremendous internal conflicts and finally saying "screw it all."  I wonder if the amount of butthurt would be less if Mark Hamill had kept his mouth shut.   :lol

Offline Destiny Of Chaos

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Re: Star Wars Discussion Thread v.The Last Jedi
« Reply #794 on: August 14, 2018, 07:48:24 AM »
The prequels were Star Wars. The tragedy of Anakin was a sight to behold.

The Last Jedi is a complete and total abomination. What a colossal missed opportunity.

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Re: Star Wars Discussion Thread v.The Last Jedi
« Reply #795 on: August 14, 2018, 01:41:09 PM »
The prequels were Star Wars. The tragedy of Anakin was a sight to behold.

The Last Jedi is a complete and total abomination. What a colossal missed opportunity.

More the sight of Anakin was a tragedy to behold.

I defended the prequels for a long time, but they are just flat out poorly made in every way. TLJ wasn’t poorly written, acted, or executed....it just pissed people off.
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Offline Destiny Of Chaos

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Re: Star Wars Discussion Thread v.The Last Jedi
« Reply #796 on: August 14, 2018, 02:47:10 PM »
It wasn't poorly written? A quick google search will show all the poor decisions with the writing

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Re: Star Wars Discussion Thread v.The Last Jedi
« Reply #797 on: August 14, 2018, 04:41:37 PM »
I really don't get how TLJ can piss off fans so much that they'e almost no longer interested in Star Wars, when the prequels, which range from god-awful at the worst to passable at the best didn't drive them away. I get most of the criticisms of TLJ, and I think many of them could be very valid depending on where they go with Ep 9. But overall I liked the movie a lot.

That's exactly how I feel.  It's a movie - who cares if they didn't give Luke super-Jedi powers and let him kick ass on screen like we all thought he would.  I loved that it flipped the entire trilogy on its head.  "You thought TFA was a re-hash of A New Hope?  Well check this out, let's do something radical and completely original......oh, you're still going to complain?"

So yeah, there were silly things like Leia flying around in space, but in all, it was a really neat story and I loved that Luke was so human with tremendous internal conflicts and finally saying "screw it all."  I wonder if the amount of butthurt would be less if Mark Hamill had kept his mouth shut.   :lol

Agree.  TLJ is no worse than the 3rd best of the ten Star Wars movies.  Maybe folks just want more pod racing and bitching about sand.
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Offline Cool Chris

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Re: Star Wars Discussion Thread v.The Last Jedi
« Reply #798 on: August 14, 2018, 04:52:30 PM »
Eps 1-3 is a good story told poorly. Eps 7 and 8 is a poor story told well.

Chew on that one for a bit :)
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Offline bosk1

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Re: Star Wars Discussion Thread v.The Last Jedi
« Reply #799 on: August 14, 2018, 05:35:17 PM »
Eps 1-3 is a good story told poorly.

Yeah, for the most part, I agree.

Eps 7 and 8 is a poor story told well.

Eh, not really.  Seems like a pretty good story told pretty well, so far.  But IMO, the jury's still out until we see how it all ends up.  Too early to tell.
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Re: Star Wars Discussion Thread v.The Last Jedi
« Reply #800 on: August 14, 2018, 06:23:26 PM »
That's basically the draw with Episode IX for me, now.  I'm curious to see how well things come together and Episodes VII and VIII went in such completely different directions.

I'll see it anyway, since I've seen them all and have to see how the story ends (or continues, or whatever), but while my excitement about IX is somewhat diminished by VIII, my curiosity about how JJ's gonna pull it off or not mostly makes up for it.

Offline Phoenix87x

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Re: Star Wars Discussion Thread v.The Last Jedi
« Reply #801 on: August 14, 2018, 07:05:18 PM »
If JJ is listening, all I want is for Rey to wake up and walk to the shower and Patrick duffy to be standing there





And its just starts right where Episode 7 left off, and let the past that is 8 die.
« Last Edit: August 14, 2018, 07:14:56 PM by Phoenix87x »
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Re: Star Wars Discussion Thread v.The Last Jedi
« Reply #802 on: August 14, 2018, 07:39:42 PM »
I still remember that scene when it first aired.  Everybody was going "Wait... What?!"  And I just thought "Ha ha, the show was dying without him, so they brought him back, shamelessly.  The whole previous season never happened.  Astounding."  And as the episode played out, it became more and more clear that that was it.  It was just a dream, all in Whatsername's head.

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Re: Star Wars Discussion Thread v.The Last Jedi
« Reply #803 on: August 14, 2018, 07:50:25 PM »
What the hell reference is that?

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Re: Star Wars Discussion Thread v.The Last Jedi
« Reply #804 on: August 14, 2018, 08:24:30 PM »
In 1978, prime-time television got its first "nighttime soap opera".  The show was Dallas, the story of the Ewing family, oil barons in the great state of... you guessed it... Texas.

Prior to Dallas, daytime television was dominated by talk shows, game shows, and "soap operas".  Soap operas were heavily serialized stories with lots of drama and sexual innuendo (but not too much -- this was still the 70's).  But evening belonged to half-hour sitcoms, one-hour police dramas, both strictly episodic, and movies of the week.  To have an evening show that was actually serialized was a breakthrough.  To have it be a drama with sexual innuendo was downright scandalous.  But the time was right, and Dallas was huge.  Since my parents and my girlfriend at the time were both fans, I ended up watching it one way or another.

Patrick Duffy played Bobby, the second-oldest Ewing son, and was tired of being second fiddle to Larry Hagman, the eldest son and basically the star of the show.  So he wanted out of the show, and they killed off his character.

The ratings started to tank.  Hagman's character, J.R., was awesomely evil and brutal and people loved to hate him, but Duffy was the one the ladies loved (see gif above).

So the first episode of the following season, his widow wakes up and hears someone in the shower.  What the...?  She goes into the bathroom, and there's Bobby in the shower.  He says something like "Oh, sorry I woke you up."  Widow/wife is in shock, as is the rest of television-watching America.  Bobby is alive.  The entire previous season was just a dream.  She dreamt the entire season.  It never happened.  And the show went on from there.