Sons of Apollo (feat. Portnoy & Sherinian)

[MirrorMask]

Let's do it!

Okay, we're going to start a death metal band and do a photo shoot of us watching TV in our boxers.

And for the ultimate shock... the logo must be clear to read!

[TAC]

  The fact that the music is so good makes it all the more frustrating that Mike and Derek have conducted themselves so poorly toward the fans and others during this.  They really have a good, solid product.  But it is tainted by all the negativity and unprofessionalism that those two have pushed to the forefront in their public dealings, and that casts a shadow over the whole thing that is hard to shake off.  Really, really stupid move on their part.

So I generally like to think I'm above such trivial things, but this has really affected my receptiveness to the whole thing. I'm kind of surprised.

I've semi listened a couple times on Spotify but I just can't really get into it right now. I am not ready to buy it "just because".

[bill1971]

More bands should be like these guys

[bosk1]

  The fact that the music is so good makes it all the more frustrating that Mike and Derek have conducted themselves so poorly toward the fans and others during this.  They really have a good, solid product.  But it is tainted by all the negativity and unprofessionalism that those two have pushed to the forefront in their public dealings, and that casts a shadow over the whole thing that is hard to shake off.  Really, really stupid move on their part.

So I generally like to think I'm above such trivial things, but this has really affected my receptiveness to the whole thing. I'm kind of surprised.

I've semi listened a couple times on Spotify but I just can't really get into it right now. I am not ready to buy it "just because".

I wouldn't buy it "just because" either.  I would buy it if I listened to it and liked what I heard, which is what I do with my music purchases in general (although, like most people, if a band has enough of a track history with me that I have good reason to believe I will like it even without hearing a single note, I will buy it without hearing it first).  And that said, I totally get your response that, at least right now, the antics of Mike and/or Derek have affected your receptiveness and willingness to buy.  That's exactly what I was getting at.  I know you aren't the only one.  And it's a shame, because people are missing out on some good music, and the band is missing out on some album and ticket sales opportunities as a result, and they have no one to blame but Mike/Derek.

[Anxiety35]

As I type this, most here have given the album a 5,6,or 7 rating.

It's grown some on me. I never disliked it. Maybe I had different expectations? I don't know. Maybe they will come into their own a little more over a tour in 2018 and maybe write some on tour. I don't for a moment think that this debut has all this band has to offer.

I will say this. I hear a lot of what could be Russell Allen vocals. Would he have been a better fit than Soto?

[bill1971]

  The fact that the music is so good makes it all the more frustrating that Mike and Derek have conducted themselves so poorly toward the fans and others during this.  They really have a good, solid product.  But it is tainted by all the negativity and unprofessionalism that those two have pushed to the forefront in their public dealings, and that casts a shadow over the whole thing that is hard to shake off.  Really, really stupid move on their part.

So I generally like to think I'm above such trivial things, but this has really affected my receptiveness to the whole thing. I'm kind of surprised.

I've semi listened a couple times on Spotify but I just can't really get into it right now. I am not ready to buy it "just because".

I wouldn't buy it "just because" either.  I would buy it if I listened to it and liked what I heard, which is what I do with my music purchases in general (although, like most people, if a band has enough of a track history with me that I have good reason to believe I will like it even without hearing a single note, I will buy it without hearing it first).  And that said, I totally get your response that, at least right now, the antics of Mike and/or Derek have affected your receptiveness and willingness to buy.  That's exactly what I was getting at.  I know you aren't the only one.  And it's a shame, because people are missing out on some good music, and the band is missing out on some album and ticket sales opportunities as a result, and they have no one to blame but Mike/Derek.

I am on this boat too. I heard the songs online a few times. It looks like on You tube they removed them. Aside from Labyrinth I don't care if I ever hear them again. The pool has been pissed in so to speak. Yes, can I enjoy a nice swim? Yes  Will I even see or smell the piss? Probably not, but I will know it's there. So no album sale for me and no seeing them live. I know I am one person and "my loss...blah blah blah" but that is how I feel.

[TAC]

I wouldn't buy it "just because" either.  I would buy it if I listened to it and liked what I heard, which is what I do with my music purchases in general (although, like most people, if a band has enough of a track history with me that I have good reason to believe I will like it even without hearing a single note, I will buy it without hearing it first).  And that said, I totally get your response that, at least right now, the antics of Mike and/or Derek have affected your receptiveness and willingness to buy.  That's exactly what I was getting at.  I know you aren't the only one.  And it's a shame, because people are missing out on some good music, and the band is missing out on some album and ticket sales opportunities as a result, and they have no one to blame but Mike/Derek.

So, a couple other things...

JSS is a major draw for me here. He owns a TAC Top 5 Vocal for me. But he's not allowed to do anything on this. So that's a minus.

And I am frankly not a fan of Derek, his antics notwithstanding. I never thought he was right for DT. Ever. Doing a tour on short notice was fine, but when he became an actual member, I did not agree. I truly wish he was not part of this project.
I mean, he's (up until now) always handled his dismissal with nothing but class, and he seems to have taken his time with DT and has propelled himself into a much better keyboard player, so there's that.

[bosk1]

TAC, I'm not trying to dissuade you and get you to buy the album if you aren't feeling it.  But in response to a couple of your points:

JSS is a major draw for me here. He owns a TAC Top 5 Vocal for me. But he's not allowed to do anything on this. So that's a minus.

I disagree with the bolded.  I think he did exactly what the songs called for, and I really like most of the vocal choices.  There is a lot of soul and nuance to what he does on this album, and I think his voice brings a lot of personality to the songs.

And I am frankly not a fan of Derek, his antics notwithstanding. I never thought he was right for DT. Ever. Doing a tour on short notice was fine, but when he became an actual member, I did not agree. I truly wish he was not part of this project.

Yeah, I get that.  As I said in my review, there are times where I feel like he is too up front, and if one doesn't like his style, that is definitely an issue.  But that said, there are PLENTY of moments where I think he nailed the mood perfectly and really compliments Thal's guitar playing.  As with my comments on Soto's vocals, there is a lot that is really cool in Derek's playing on this album that won't really be picked up on from just a casual listen.  Just like a DT album, there is a lot of nuance and layering that I think it is hard to pick up on without multiple listens.

[TAC]

I will give it the time it deserves at some point.

[Lethean]

My problems with this album are many. At this point, I don't think MP and DS and their behavior are contributing to my feelings on it anymore. It's always possible that there is something in there subconsciously. More likely, I think I just feel more free to express my dislike than I would have if they hadn't turned me off by their behavior.

I really disliked Adrenaline Mob, but when it came out, I still felt very loyal to MP. I didn't like some of the things he had said online, but I chalked it up to him having made a really big mistake that he regretted, and though he wasn't handling it well, I felt for him. I wanted to support him. I wasn't on his forum then, but in my online comments elsewhere, I held back about describing my dislike. And I went to see Adrenaline Mob live, because I liked Mike and wanted to support him.

Now, my feelings towards Mike are all over the place really. I'm very disappointed by what's been going on lately, but I think that just like I supported Adrenaline Mob even though I didn't like it, if I really liked this album, I would have acknowledged that I liked it even though I didn't plan on supporting it. I would lament that such great music was tainted.

But I truly do not like this. I agree with Tac about JSS. I've heard vocals by him that were really strong and that I like a lot, but here it seems so lifeless. And the songs, I really just don't think it's good stuff. I agree with that one review that talked about the lack of originality. It's one thing if a song reminds you of another band here or there, or if there are a couple moments on an album that sound really close to something else. But with this album, it's all over the place. Every song, multiple times in each song, to where barely any time goes by that something doesn't just scream at me with it's similarities to specific parts or riffs or melodies. It's all too much, and at the end of the day I just don't find much to enjoy.  It doesn't seem to have much in the way of dynamics either. I know there's heavy parts, there's a ballad, there's simple and complex but none of it makes me feel anything other than "isn't this over yet?"

[Stadler]

I like a lot this pic of DT. This to me genuinely represented both them and their style:

See, if I had to buy an album, unheard, and all I had to go on was that picture, or any of the other ones above, I would go with that picture.   I'm like 90% sure I went to college with the guy second from the left, and I play softball with the guy on the right. 

[Stadler]

That's definitely better. It still lacks their personality. They're (mostly) goofy funny dudes. I think the metal community should really embrace things like goofiness and being a normal person.

Devin Townsend is already doing that 

And....   the pendulum swings too far the other way.

I was JUST getting into him, what with "Deep Peace" from London, and then this...

[New World Rushman]

IMHO, this is the only way 50-60 year old guys should do band pics.



 

This has got to be the best band photo I've ever seen. 

If I recall the story correctly, the reason they're all smiling is because Alex had one of those fart machines that makes a different fart noise when you press the button.

I am not making this up.

[cramx3]

Those certainly work for getting me to smile

[Ben_Jamin]

That's definitely better. It still lacks their personality. They're (mostly) goofy funny dudes. I think the metal community should really embrace things like goofiness and being a normal person.

Devin Townsend is already doing that 

And....   the pendulum swings too far the other way.

I was JUST getting into him, what with "Deep Peace" from London, and then this...

Haha then I dont think he's for you. It's a part of him and he's not afraid to show it. I'd like to see your reaction to Z2 live. With the giant poozers.

[bosk1]

What on earth is a "giant poozer?" 

[Orbert]

I was just thinking the same thing, but maybe I don't want to know...

[The Walrus]

Can't disagree with any of that, Lethean - great post.

[TAC]

But I truly do not like this. I agree with Tac about JSS. I've heard vocals by him that were really strong and that I like a lot, but here it seems so lifeless. 

He sings fantastically. Don't think that can be denied. But I just don't think these songs really call for a vocal tour de force, which he is absolutely capable of. Similar to JLB on SC and BC&SL. He sings great, for what he is asked to sing. But unfortunately is not given the space to show what he can really do.

[cramx3]

I don't know JSS's previous work to speak about what he is capable of, but he definitely seems lifeless on this IMO.  There's nothing interesting in his vocals to me.  By the end of the album I am happy to get an instrumental, his voice makes lsitening to the album tiring and its easily my least favorite thing about the music and album holding it back from anything better than a 7.  I know that's harsh, especially because he isn't bad at all on the album, he just doesn't add anything for me and since his vocals are all the same throughout all the songs, it makes it feel "lifeless" to me.  I don't think the songs call for more, and maybe this is really against the writing of these songs than him himself, but I really struggle with enjoying the vocals. The "Yea!"s throughout the album are also really cheesy to my ears.

[noxon]

This video will enlighten you about poozers. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1NGQjRMXg28

[bosk1]

Every fiber of my being is screaming "DON'T CLICK THAT LINK!!!"

[KevShmev]

Ugh, don't recommend Z2 material to non-Devin fans!  That is like his worst record (or maybe second worst).

[bosk1]

Oh, it's a Devin Townsend thing?  No wonder I'm not familiar.  Well, knowing that, I clicked the link, and...that is the first thing I have ever heard from Devin Townsend that I have actually liked.  Go figure. 

[KevShmev]

Figures.

In all fairness, while Z2 has very few keepers, March of the Poozers is one of them.

[Madman Shepherd]

I don't know JSS's previous work to speak about what he is capable of, but he definitely seems lifeless on this IMO.  There's nothing interesting in his vocals to me.  By the end of the album I am happy to get an instrumental, his voice makes lsitening to the album tiring and its easily my least favorite thing about the music and album holding it back from anything better than a 7.  I know that's harsh, especially because he isn't bad at all on the album, he just doesn't add anything for me and since his vocals are all the same throughout all the songs, it makes it feel "lifeless" to me.  I don't think the songs call for more, and maybe this is really against the writing of these songs than him himself, but I really struggle with enjoying the vocals. The "Yea!"s throughout the album are also really cheesy to my ears.

I wouldn't go that far but I understand completely what your saying.  Just not all that impressive.  Someone said it previously in one of these threads but the album could use more breathy vocals.  Seriously.  It needs some diversity in the vocal department.  Anything really. 

[bill1971]

I wonder how much DS and MP hindered him. One video he was saying him and DS got into it about the vocals. Although he is not what he was one strength of DT is the uniqueness of Labries vocals. The was JSS sings on this he could be replaced by a dozen similar singers such as Russell Allen.

[Schurftkut]

for those complaining about the songs needing more work, Sherinian is already bombarding Bumblefoot with new ideas for the next album. Hopefully they'll get a bit more attention the 2nd time around.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v0OkpXqCPH8

[Cruithne]

It's only because of his involvement with SoA that I now realise that I've had an album with JSS's singing on it for over 20 years, it's just it's Malmsteen's first album and I always skip the songs with vocals! I just don't connect with his voice and that's probably the biggest stumbling block for me.

Honestly though, I'm more than familiar with the rest of the band's prior songwriting efforts and as a result wasn't expecting much in the way of fireworks, I was just waiting to see if the particular combination would produce a spark of something unique. It's ended up being bang average - not at all bad, but hardly soliciting further attention.

Were this the debut of a band of young unknowns I'd be far more interested than I am.

[Architeuthis]

The vocals of JSS have grown on me with this album, except for when he sounds too much like Nickleback ( a band I could never get into).

[TAC]

I wonder how much DS and MP hindered him. One video he was saying him and DS got into it about the vocals. Although he is not what he was one strength of DT is the uniqueness of Labries vocals. The was JSS sings on this he could be replaced by a dozen similar singers such as Russell Allen.

I agree with this, especially the bolded part, but please, no Russ Allen.

[mikeyd23]

I wonder how much DS and MP hindered him. One video he was saying him and DS got into it about the vocals. Although he is not what he was one strength of DT is the uniqueness of Labries vocals. The was JSS sings on this he could be replaced by a dozen similar singers such as Russell Allen.

I agree with this, especially the bolded part, but please, no Russ Allen.

I actually think it was a very wise decision on MP's part not to involve Russ (and I really like his voice). This band has already been referred to as AMob with keys a bunch and I think that would have been even more apparent with Russell singing in this project.

[gzarruk]

for those complaining about the songs needing more work, Sherinian is already bombarding Bumblefoot with new ideas for the next album. Hopefully they'll get a bit more attention the 2nd time around.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v0OkpXqCPH8

Already thinking on the next album? 

[MirrorMask]

Why not. The album is done, the tour is yet to happen, so if they all get along fine and they're pumped for it what's wrong in thinking ahead? always better to work a lot of time on an album, with ideas coming from different writing sessions, than doing it all in a week.

[MirrorMask]

There's nothing wrong with JSS 'cause he's a great singer, and I like his performance on the album, but what if Mike retroactively wishes he didn't "waste" a partnership with Russell Allen on Adrenaline Mob, in order to have him for Sons of Apollo?