Sons of Apollo (feat. Portnoy & Sherinian)

[metrojam]

Really enjoy this album. Not sure why people believed the hype of it "redefining prog" or whatever, that's just usual pre-album hype that most artists do. It's akin to metal artists saying "this is the heaviest album we've ever done". To me, it's just foolish to buy into that.

Anyway...
Great album. No, it's nothing new, but it balances prog and hard rock/metal nicely and, to be completely honest, I found it more interesting and satisfying than both DT12 and Astonishing. Vocals are good, instrumentally it's great without too much 'wank'. Love Derek's sound, brings a lot of atmosphere. There are some real standout moments on the album aswell... the incredible bass solo on Opus Maximus instantly springs to mind as one. The singles are the weakest tracks, but they work better in the context of the album.

In short, not sure what people are complaining about. Plenty of prog here with a welcome dash of hard rock/metal to give it some 'balls' (no ass though ).

Highlights include:
God of the Sun
Labyrinth
Divine Addiction (deep purple? love it anyway, so catchy)
Opus Maximus

I agree totally with that. God of the sun is a brilliant opener and the highlight for me but there are some other good metal/prog songs throughout (apart from the totally unneccessary Figaro's Whore).
Enjoying it and think it will be one of those albums that grows on you with more listens. Don't quite understand all the negativity in here for it, but thinking again, yes I do, as its more "personal" than actual "musical" negativity, I suspect!!

[nobloodyname]

Far less fuss about Figaro's Whore had it simply been part of the next track rather than being split out.

[Kwyjibo]

Don't quite understand all the negativity in here for it, but thinking again, yes I do, as its more "personal" than actual "musical" negativity, I suspect!!

For sure there are people who don't like it because of the persons involved and their actions, but this goes both ways, there will be fanboys who will declare everything MP and the rest do as album of the year, no matter the actual quality. And then there are a lot of people in between.

Reading the reviews and opinions here I can't know what they are based on, so I take them for what they probably are, the opinions of someone who listened to the record and made up his own mind about it.

[metrojam]

Don't quite understand all the negativity in here for it, but thinking again, yes I do, as its more "personal" than actual "musical" negativity, I suspect!!

For sure there are people who don't like it because of the persons involved and their actions, but this goes both ways, there will be fanboys who will declare everything MP and the rest do as album of the year, no matter the actual quality. And then there are a lot of people in between.

Reading the reviews and opinions here I can't know what they are based on, so I take them for what they probably are, the opinions of someone who listened to the record and made up his own mind about it.

Thats a very fair point. I have no axes to grind either for or against MP and DS and have listened to it with a totally open mind and I like it a lot whilst agreeing its not anywhere near up there with DT's finest moments (but i.m.o. [if that is allowed in here these days!!] its better than their last 2).

[wolfking]

I probably won't bother buying this, but sampled God of the Sun to see if sampling something might change that.  Nothing flash. Ron's solo was great and I didn't mind the TOT style section after that, but the song felt disjointed.  That part I just mentioned didn't work around the rest of the song, it's like two different songs.  It's like they said, "oh shit, this is just a standard hard rock song, better throw some DT stuff in there in the middle to say we are all prog and shit."

[wolfking]

New video;

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tG7hYazcfOw

After hearing this and God of the Sun, is this album just Mike copying sections of This Dying Soul over and over?

[Kwyjibo]

I probably won't bother buying this, but sampled God of the Sun to see if sampling something might change that.  Nothing flash. Ron's solo was great and I didn't mind the TOT style section after that, but the song felt disjointed.  That part I just mentioned didn't work around the rest of the song, it's like two different songs.  It's like they said, "oh shit, this is just a standard hard rock song, better throw some DT stuff in there in the middle to say we are all prog and shit."

This is my main gripe, some of the songs just don't flow well and some of the proggier parts just feel tacked on for the sake of being proggy.

When the first two songs were released I complained and asked where the prog was. Now I think less prog would have made this record stronger as I enjoy the rocking parts much more then the proggy bits.

[wolfking]

I probably won't bother buying this, but sampled God of the Sun to see if sampling something might change that.  Nothing flash. Ron's solo was great and I didn't mind the TOT style section after that, but the song felt disjointed.  That part I just mentioned didn't work around the rest of the song, it's like two different songs.  It's like they said, "oh shit, this is just a standard hard rock song, better throw some DT stuff in there in the middle to say we are all prog and shit."

This is my main gripe, some of the songs just don't flow well and some of the proggier parts just feel tacked on for the sake of being proggy.

When the first two songs were released I complained and asked where the prog was. Now I think less prog would have made this record stronger as I enjoy the rocking parts much more then the proggy bits.

This was evident to be before the prog section was even over, just sounds like two completely different songs altogether.

[SwedishGoose]

Don't quite understand all the negativity in here for it, but thinking again, yes I do, as its more "personal" than actual "musical" negativity, I suspect!!

For sure there are people who don't like it because of the persons involved and their actions, but this goes both ways, there will be fanboys who will declare everything MP and the rest do as album of the year, no matter the actual quality. And then there are a lot of people in between.

Reading the reviews and opinions here I can't know what they are based on, so I take them for what they probably are, the opinions of someone who listened to the record and made up his own mind about it.

Thats a very fair point. I have no axes to grind either for or against MP and DS and have listened to it with a totally open mind and I like it a lot whilst agreeing its not anywhere near up there with DT's finest moments (but i.m.o. [if that is allowed in here these days!!] its better than their last 2).

Opinions are totally fine... glad you like it

Personally I love The Astonishing and find it to be DTs crowning achievement.
I put all three Mangini albums over the last three albums DT did with Portnoy.
I put Sons of Apollo below all albums by Dream Theater. Below the Neal Morse Band. Below Flying Colours. Below Transatlantic. Below Winery Dogs.

I think I would put it above Adrenaline Mob and Metal Allegiance but thats about it at this point.

[devieira73]

Just to give one more opinion about the album, I think it's excelent and rouhgly describing it, it indeed seems a cross beetwen BC&SL and FII. I do think it's well composed and arranged. By the way, I don't understand at all the argument of "there's no real songwritters in this band". From what I know, Ron, Derek, Billy and Jeff all have solo albums (from Derek and Billy I have and I think they're very good) in which they wrote almost everything on them (I only don't know if its Jeff's case). I liked a lot the production of the album, it has a good mix, clarity with heaviness and a great drum sound.
I also think that predominant style of the album is prog metal, very influenced by classic rock and some newer metal.
The only relative flaws on the album are that it is a bit safe, it lacks some "WTF" or "I never heard anything like that before" moments, but not much of a problem to me, because the music is really good; and Jeff vocal's, although very enjoyable, it seems that could have been a bit more explored in its range.

[cramx3]

New video;

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tG7hYazcfOw

After hearing this and God of the Sun, is this album just Mike copying sections of This Dying Soul over and over?

It's funny how all the videos are in this same room, this time they just have some drapes and different lighting.  It feels like the guys were together for one week and threw this whole thing together.  And honestly, the album sounds that way as well.  I gave it a listen on my way in this morning.  It's not bad by any means, certainly not redefining anything either.  That's OK.   The sound kind of feels like what DT might have sounded if they continued following MP's lead.  Definitely has some BCSLness to it and more metal than prog overall, but there's no doubt after listening to the whole album that I'd consider them a prog metal band, they are.

I have two main gripes with the album and that's just that it sounds thrown together as I mentioned, there doesn't seem to be any heart or soul in the music, at least I don't sense any of that.  My other issue is JSS.  His vocals aren't cutting it for me.  I feel like he is the safe singer.  He isn't bad and he doesn't ruin the music, but he also doesn't lift it up either.  There's definitely a few awkward sounding "yea!"s throughout the album as well that just seem weird.  Fine live, but on the recording I wish it wasn't there.   Now I don't think the vocal melodies help JSS either, there's very few vocal hooks that had me wanting to sing along or come back cause it was stuck in my head (Alive may be the only one).  Now maybe this also comes back to making me feel like there is no heart/soul to this music, because I don't feel connected to the vocals.

Having gotten the negative out of the way, let's get to the positive.  The music is heavy and definitely rocking.  I think the music is mostly fantastic.  I am most impressed with Bumblefoot.  I hadn't heard any of his other music so I didn't know what to expect, but I am pleasantly surprised.  Some of his solos are really impressive and he's got some sick riffage going on in some songs.  I've always liked Billy's bass playing, but I think he takes a back seat here besides a few spots.  It works well, he's not in your face at all which I think, from reading this thread, that some people expected and would likely be turned off by.  DS also has some really cool spots and solos.  I enjoyed hearing his playing again.  MP is MP, he sounds just like I expect him to at this point of his career.  There's tons of DT like parts in the album that clearly have MP written all over it.  Stuff like that doesn't bother me as long as it sounds good.  I think it mostly does here.

Granted, I gave a good listen this morning, but it's too early to judge as a whole just yet.  But I think it's sitting around 6-7 out of 10 for me.  Musically awesome, but vocally I'm having a hard time enjoying it.

[Art]

Discounting the whole drama surrounding this band here, i like the album. It doesn't reinvent anything (and, for me, it didn't have to), but it's a nice hard-"prog"-rock record.

The only song i don't care much for is Opus Maximus, it feels kinda unnecessary.

On the first listen, JSS gives the stand-out performance here, i think he is singing very well on the album, and he is the element that brings the songs "together".

As for the musicians, Derek is playing very well, Bumblefoot surprised me, i love his tone on the album. MP is giving his standart performance, that works for me. Sheehan is more buried in the mix that i thought, which kinda works. Everybody gives good performances.

I get the later-Symphony X vibe, especially in the production.

All in all, a very fun record to listen.

[Skeever]

This sucks.

[faizoff]

I do here shades of FII, Systematic Chaos and some BCASL. I mean Coming Home's intro sounds like an outtake of SC. I can see where everyone is coming from when they say this part reminds me of that, etc.. There are quite a few of them but I think it is hovering around 7/10 album for me. Time will tell.

Also, really don't care much for that instrumental, not feeling it at all.

[Kwyjibo]

This record could have used some breathy vocals for variety

[Adami]

I listened to the samples, and did the chorus of Alive and Coming Home literally have the exact same melody/call back vocals?

[The Walrus]

They sure do.

[ariich]

Does anyone even slightly like Figraro's Whore? It just seems so pointless.

[rumborak]

That one has the mental nickname "Let it Rock opener" (from Slippery When Wet) for me.

[Nick]

Metal Injection review: https://www.metalinjection.net/reviews/sons-of-apollo-psychotic-symphony

[kaos2900]

quote author=Anguyen92 link=topic=50945.msg2367772#msg2367772 date=1508479594]
Things.

I listened to The Astonishing in the car this morning, because I bought it this week after not hearing it for over a year. I found it very enjoyable!
Oh - and Enigma Machine is actually one of the best tracks from DT12, as far as I'm concerned.

I'm not that interested in wasting my time with this SoA record, but I'll guess I'll put it on some time next week.
[/quote]

I'm actually listening to The Astonishing for the first time in a year or so. I've cut out some tracks and the story still doesn't really work for me, but the important this is the music and vocals are superb and catchy. I still rank this in the bottom third of DT's discography, but there a ton of strong and memorable tracks on this albu.

[Nekov]

On the first listen I enjoyed this much more than I originally thought I would and that's probably becuase of JSS mostly, I really love how the guy sings.

This is my main gripe, some of the songs just don't flow well and some of the proggier parts just feel tacked on for the sake of being proggy.

I've been complaining about this for years with most of the prog bands these days and that includes Haken and DT so I'm not surprised that these guys did the same. I think there's not a lot of bands that

Does anyone even slightly like Figraro's Whore? It just seems so pointless.

I don't even remember listening to it 

[kaos2900]

New video;

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tG7hYazcfOw

After hearing this and God of the Sun, is this album just Mike copying sections of This Dying Soul over and over?

Just turned this on to give it a shot and promptly closed Youtube as soon as the vocals came in. I have no doubt that JSS is good singer but his style on these songs just sounds awful to me.

[gmillerdrake]

I'm going to state my opinion and try not to get banned.

No need for a track by track analysis....as I suspected there are a couple riffs/moments throughout the album that sound cool but that's more or less by default given the level of talent that was in that room for a week jamming.

Outside of those few moments this is a very forgettable CD. I'll probably be fair and listen to it once more all the way through but honestly I can't see how that'd make a difference as it really is just a jam session that was recorded and mixed....and as was speculated in early pages and has been mentioned there are a TON of moments where your mind says 'oh, that sounds like ______ or ______'  It's kind of sad actually.

And to address the sentiment that DS and MP's bravado and 'promotion' of the album was just them hyping the album by stating they're the new kings of prog and they're redefining the genre.....I could dismiss it all as colorful promotion had they not continually insisted to take outright pot shots at specific members of DT. That is where it crossed the line from being 'promotion' to being outright dicks.

 And one thing I've learned from playing sports or even in the workplace....if you're going to talk sh%t and call out people you best be able to back it up. Now that the full album is released and the evidence is free for all to hear it's completely safe to say that they couldn't back up the smack talk at all. Mish mashed elements of prog and chunky rhythms in haphazard time signatures aren't redefining anything....just constitutes another swing and miss for MP. 

[Metro]

I listened to the samples, and did the chorus of Alive and Coming Home literally have the exact same melody/call back vocals?

Yep.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/m6c2qtechpghyo4/Untitled.wav?dl=0

[emtee]

Is there a place to hear this legally before I decide to buy it?

[rumborak]

Google Music has it, I assume so does Spotify.

[gmillerdrake]

Google Music has it, I assume so does Spotify.

if you have an Apple Music account it's on there as well....

[bill1971]

I'm going to state my opinion and try not to get banned.

No need for a track by track analysis....as I suspected there are a couple riffs/moments throughout the album that sound cool but that's more or less by default given the level of talent that was in that room for a week jamming.

Outside of those few moments this is a very forgettable CD. I'll probably be fair and listen to it once more all the way through but honestly I can't see how that'd make a difference as it really is just a jam session that was recorded and mixed....and as was speculated in early pages and has been mentioned there are a TON of moments where your mind says 'oh, that sounds like ______ or ______'  It's kind of sad actually.

And to address the sentiment that DS and MP's bravado and 'promotion' of the album was just them hyping the album by stating they're the new kings of prog and they're redefining the genre.....I could dismiss it all as colorful promotion had they not continually insisted to take outright pot shots at specific members of DT. That is where it crossed the line from being 'promotion' to being outright dicks.

 And one thing I've learned from playing sports or even in the workplace....if you're going to talk sh%t and call out people you best be able to back it up. Now that the full album is released and the evidence is free for all to hear it's completely safe to say that they couldn't back up the smack talk at all. Mish mashed elements of prog and chunky rhythms in haphazard time signatures aren't redefining anything....just constitutes another swing and miss for MP.

You don't get banned here for criticizing MP's work. There was a place that isn't a "thing" anymore that you would.

[Dreammajesty]

i've listend to it till halfway through the fifth song and put an end to it it's boring and meh heard it all before.To me it's more Power Metal style.That's what i call it.Not my cup of tea.

[Samsara]

I bought it on Amazon, and it will be delivered today, but I got the autorip last night apparently. I am currently on my first listen, and up to Lost in Oblivion. So far, I like it. Way too early to really throw out opinions on the album. But it is what I generally expected.

[Stadler]

I'm going to state my opinion and try not to get banned.

No need for a track by track analysis....as I suspected there are a couple riffs/moments throughout the album that sound cool but that's more or less by default given the level of talent that was in that room for a week jamming.

Outside of those few moments this is a very forgettable CD. I'll probably be fair and listen to it once more all the way through but honestly I can't see how that'd make a difference as it really is just a jam session that was recorded and mixed....and as was speculated in early pages and has been mentioned there are a TON of moments where your mind says 'oh, that sounds like ______ or ______'  It's kind of sad actually.

And to address the sentiment that DS and MP's bravado and 'promotion' of the album was just them hyping the album by stating they're the new kings of prog and they're redefining the genre.....I could dismiss it all as colorful promotion had they not continually insisted to take outright pot shots at specific members of DT. That is where it crossed the line from being 'promotion' to being outright dicks.

 And one thing I've learned from playing sports or even in the workplace....if you're going to talk sh%t and call out people you best be able to back it up. Now that the full album is released and the evidence is free for all to hear it's completely safe to say that they couldn't back up the smack talk at all. Mish mashed elements of prog and chunky rhythms in haphazard time signatures aren't redefining anything....just constitutes another swing and miss for MP.

You don't get banned here for criticizing MP's work. There was a place that isn't a "thing" anymore that you would.

No, but sometimes you take a lot of stick (being called a "fan boy" comes to mind) if you deviate from the anti-Mike sentiment on certain topics.   

[SwedishGoose]

Would be interresting with a poll on this one....

I guess we would se some very high score, some very low and most just above the mid point

[erwinrafael]

I can's see how God of the Sun is a good intro when the first thing that came to kind when I heard it is "Home?"

[cramx3]

Metal Injection review: https://www.metalinjection.net/reviews/sons-of-apollo-psychotic-symphony

Pretty much how I feel.  Been listening non stop this morning to get a better feel for the album.