Official 2017-2018 NHL Thread v. Break the Ice

[TheCountOfNYC]

An expansion team will play for the Stanley Cup. This is absolute madness.

[TAC]

Amazing. I hope they win it.

[Accelerando]

Me too...unless they end up playing Tampa 

[TheCountOfNYC]

Me too...unless they end up playing Tampa 

For me it’s the opposite. I want them to win it all especially if they play Tampa.

[Accelerando]

Geez, we can’t win the respect! 

If we play Vegas, people will root for Vegas for the fairy tale story.

Even if it wasn’t Vegas, people will still root against us because we’re not Original 6 or Canadian. We’re a god damn team from Florida!

[dparrott]

I'd be an ecstatic fan if they had a better name.

[SchecterShredder]

 So I'm actually in Vegas right now for a work conference that starts tomorrow. I was at Dick's Sporting goods shortly after the game ended, and it was a mad spree of people buying conference champs shirts and other merch. I think i was the only person of about 200 in line who just needed another damn pair of shorts.

[TAC]

So you bought Conference Championship shorts? 

[SchecterShredder]

So you bought Conference Championship shorts? 

Lol. Well, considering i have an Oilers logo in my tattoo sleeve... no, no i didn't.

[jingle.boy]

Personally, I hate this.  And objectively, I don't think it's good for the Vegas fans, Seattle fans or for the league in general - and it sucks for about 15 other teams/cities who have had to suffer through years/decades of a lack of success.  To see the 'perfect storm' of the Golden Knights is a bitter pill.  Save a couple of salary cap issues, this is a team of players that were no better then 3/4th line, or 3rd defence-pair.  How does a team like that make the Cup final? 
1) A handful of players stepped up to become 'top-line' players (Marchessault/Karlson); Schmidt on D.
2) The rest of the team has consistently punched out of their weight class
3) Terrific coaching
4) Sad to say, but the Vegas shooting last fall brought about a camaraderie and bonding that has given them a balanced team all season.

They beat Winnipeg by playing mistake-free (where the Jets had a few issues), a forecheck that is stunningly good, and Flower Power stealing 2 of those games.  Good on them for that. 

However, the team has nowhere to go but down next year and Seattle fans are going to expect at least some level of success.  I fear the backlash against the franchises if there isn't success.

Don't get me wrong, what they (players, coaches, management) have collectively accomplished is beyond impressive.  And yes, I'm bitter because Toronto is one of those many teams that haven't tasted much success in a long time.

[gmillerdrake]

yeah.....this perfect storm of circumstances that has led to this season/post season for Vegas will not bleed over to next season. It really has been a situation where they’re getting max payoff from each player/position/coach. Just don’t see that surviving the summer and holding momentum. Too many variables will change.

[mikeyd23]

Personally, I hate this.  And objectively, I don't think it's good for the Vegas fans, Seattle fans or for the league in general - and it sucks for about 15 other teams/cities who have had to suffer through years/decades of a lack of success.  To see the 'perfect storm' of the Golden Knights is a bitter pill.  Save a couple of salary cap issues, this is a team of players that were no better then 3/4th line, or 3rd defence-pair.  How does a team like that make the Cup final? 
1) A handful of players stepped up to become 'top-line' players (Marchessault/Karlson); Schmidt on D.
2) The rest of the team has consistently punched out of their weight class
3) Terrific coaching
4) Sad to say, but the Vegas shooting last fall brought about a camaraderie and bonding that has given them a balanced team all season.

They beat Winnipeg by playing mistake-free (where the Jets had a few issues), a forecheck that is stunningly good, and Flower Power stealing 2 of those games.  Good on them for that. 

However, the team has nowhere to go but down next year and Seattle fans are going to expect at least some level of success.  I fear the backlash against the franchises if there isn't success.

Don't get me wrong, what they (players, coaches, management) have collectively accomplished is beyond impressive.  And yes, I'm bitter because Toronto is one of those many teams that haven't tasted much success in a long time.

Good post, I agree. I'd also add that (if I'm not mistaken) they changed the expansion rules for Vegas and clearly (1) they either made the rules too advantageous for Vegas or (2) the other GMs didn't fully know how to prepare for the expansion draft. Or maybe a combo of both things.

Who knows, anyway - only the NHL could manage to have a first year expansion team in a salary cap league compete for the championship. It's both frustrating and impressive.

[pg1067]

Personally, I hate this.  And objectively, I don't think it's good for the Vegas fans, Seattle fans or for the league in general - and it sucks for about 15 other teams/cities who have had to suffer through years/decades of a lack of success.  To see the 'perfect storm' of the Golden Knights is a bitter pill.  Save a couple of salary cap issues, this is a team of players that were no better then 3/4th line, or 3rd defence-pair.  How does a team like that make the Cup final? 
1) A handful of players stepped up to become 'top-line' players (Marchessault/Karlson); Schmidt on D.
2) The rest of the team has consistently punched out of their weight class
3) Terrific coaching
4) Sad to say, but the Vegas shooting last fall brought about a camaraderie and bonding that has given them a balanced team all season.

They beat Winnipeg by playing mistake-free (where the Jets had a few issues), a forecheck that is stunningly good, and Flower Power stealing 2 of those games.  Good on them for that. 

However, the team has nowhere to go but down next year and Seattle fans are going to expect at least some level of success.  I fear the backlash against the franchises if there isn't success.

Don't get me wrong, what they (players, coaches, management) have collectively accomplished is beyond impressive.  And yes, I'm bitter because Toronto is one of those many teams that haven't tasted much success in a long time.

Good post, I agree. I'd also add that (if I'm not mistaken) they changed the expansion rules for Vegas and clearly (1) they either made the rules too advantageous for Vegas or (2) the other GMs didn't fully know how to prepare for the expansion draft. Or maybe a combo of both things.

Who knows, anyway - only the NHL could manage to have a first year expansion team in a salary cap league compete for the championship. It's both frustrating and impressive.

I am SO done with this Vegas thing.  I've heard folks mention how the changed the expansion draft rules and, while that may be true, as Jingle said (and as I posted a few pages ago), none of the guys on Vegas's roster seemed particularly impressive as of a year ago.  They'll be all but obligated to keep the same rules in place for Seattle, so that'll be interesting.

Speaking of Seattle, what does the NHL do in terms of divisions when Seattle joins?  Right now, the NHL has three 8-team divisions and one 7-team division.  Putting Seattle in the Central would be dumb for any number of reasons, so does a current Pacific Division team move to the Central?  If so, is it the Coyotes (the geographically closest team to any Central Division team, but a team that plays in a city that is on Pacific time 2/3 of the year)?  Or does the NHL go through yet another round of realignment?

[jingle.boy]

Don't forget that AZ is actually in Mountain time - they just don't recognize DST.  So, from Nov-March (most of the regular season), they are only 1-hour different from most of the Central teams.

I don't see bigger re-alignment.  Being 1 time zone away ain't too much of an issue.  Even two time zones is manageable - Jets were in with the Canucks and Kings back in the Smythe Division days.

[Nick]

yeah.....this perfect storm of circumstances that has led to this season/post season for Vegas will not bleed over to next season. It really has been a situation where they’re getting max payoff from each player/position/coach. Just don’t see that surviving the summer and holding momentum. Too many variables will change.

While you are correct in the idea that the over-performance by... well... everyone likely won't keep up forever it is balances by one big thing. Going into the season you had to think that for several years Las Vegas would be seen as a tough sell to free agents. Now? Cup or no cup they can be seen as a serious contender and should have no problem getting people into a system that is shown to have a rock solid foundation.

[gmillerdrake]

yeah.....this perfect storm of circumstances that has led to this season/post season for Vegas will not bleed over to next season. It really has been a situation where they’re getting max payoff from each player/position/coach. Just don’t see that surviving the summer and holding momentum. Too many variables will change.

While you are correct in the idea that the over-performance by... well... everyone likely won't keep up forever it is balances by one big thing. Going into the season you had to think that for several years Las Vegas would be seen as a tough sell to free agents. Now? Cup or no cup they can be seen as a serious contender and should have no problem getting people into a system that is shown to have a rock solid foundation.

Very true. And have a ravenous fan base already with a great atmosphere.

[pg1067]

Don't forget that AZ is actually in Mountain time - they just don't recognize DST.  So, from Nov-March (most of the regular season), they are only 1-hour different from most of the Central teams.

I don't see bigger re-alignment.  Being 1 time zone away ain't too much of an issue.  Even two time zones is manageable - Jets were in with the Canucks and Kings back in the Smythe Division days.

Good point re Arizona.

If you had told me a year ago that the Pacific would have two new expansion teams in the next half decade, I'd have thought that was great.  Now maybe not so much.

[mikeyd23]

yeah.....this perfect storm of circumstances that has led to this season/post season for Vegas will not bleed over to next season. It really has been a situation where they’re getting max payoff from each player/position/coach. Just don’t see that surviving the summer and holding momentum. Too many variables will change.

While you are correct in the idea that the over-performance by... well... everyone likely won't keep up forever it is balances by one big thing. Going into the season you had to think that for several years Las Vegas would be seen as a tough sell to free agents. Now? Cup or no cup they can be seen as a serious contender and should have no problem getting people into a system that is shown to have a rock solid foundation.

Very true. And have a ravenous fan base already with a great atmosphere.

I think they will be a highly sought after destination for free agents this summer. Like you guys mentioned they are now automatically considered a contender next year, they have a super fan base and also - what rich athlete wouldn't want to call Vegas home? 

[gmillerdrake]

yeah.....this perfect storm of circumstances that has led to this season/post season for Vegas will not bleed over to next season. It really has been a situation where they’re getting max payoff from each player/position/coach. Just don’t see that surviving the summer and holding momentum. Too many variables will change.

While you are correct in the idea that the over-performance by... well... everyone likely won't keep up forever it is balances by one big thing. Going into the season you had to think that for several years Las Vegas would be seen as a tough sell to free agents. Now? Cup or no cup they can be seen as a serious contender and should have no problem getting people into a system that is shown to have a rock solid foundation.

Very true. And have a ravenous fan base already with a great atmosphere.

I think they will be a highly sought after destination for free agents this summer. Like you guys mentioned they are now automatically considered a contender next year, they have a super fan base and also - what rich athlete wouldn't want to call Vegas home? 

**** all contracts to include monthly penicillin injections

[mikeyd23]

 

[Accelerando]

Let’s go Bolts!

[TheSilentHam]

Let’s go Bolts!

[Accelerando]

We just fucking suck tonight. No excuses. Boneheaded passes. Leaving guys open on the point. Caps had the puck whenever they wanted it. We play like that in game 7, we deserve to lose the ECF.

[jingle.boy]

Caps sure did play determined - just the way a team on the brink of elimination should.

[Nick]

We just fucking suck tonight. No excuses. Boneheaded passes. Leaving guys open on the point. Caps had the puck whenever they wanted it. We play like that in game 7, we deserve to lose the ECF.

It wasn't your best game, but you didn't suck, that game was a result of the Capitals turning everything up to 11 and the Lightning not being able to match. Backs against the wall on Wednesday I expect one hell of a game. I won't see it though, I'll be in Lehigh Valley hopefully watching the Phantoms claw back in their series against Chad's damn Marlies.

[jingle.boy]

We just fucking suck tonight. No excuses. Boneheaded passes. Leaving guys open on the point. Caps had the puck whenever they wanted it. We play like that in game 7, we deserve to lose the ECF.

It wasn't your best game, but you didn't suck, that game was a result of the Capitals turning everything up to 11 and the Lightning not being able to match. Backs against the wall on Wednesday I expect one hell of a game. I won't see it though, I'll be in Lehigh Valley hopefully watching the Phantoms claw back in their series against Chad's damn Marlies.

Man I wish the AHL games were televised.   

[YtseBitsySpider]

I hope the Caps get it done.
Ovi deserves it.

Vegas....it's more than a perfect storm. The GM absolutely fleeced the NHL. He has another and possibly ANOTHER full team of veterans/picks/prospects that he could throw to the coach and say "here...make another perfect storm".

go Caps.

[jingle.boy]

Vegas....it's more than a perfect storm. The GM absolutely fleeced the NHL. He has another and possibly ANOTHER full team of veterans/picks/prospects that he could throw to the coach and say "here...make another perfect storm".

Easy to say/recognize that in hindsight.  Did you feel/think this right after the expansion draft?  If so, you would've been one of the the very few.   

[TAC]

The GM absolutely fleeced the NHL.

No he didn't. How so?

He fleeced the Bruins out of Colin Miller?  They simply left him unprotected.


He did do a great job in making deals but I think fleeced is a bit overblown.

[mikeyd23]

Vegas....it's more than a perfect storm. The GM absolutely fleeced the NHL. He has another and possibly ANOTHER full team of veterans/picks/prospects that he could throw to the coach and say "here...make another perfect storm".

Easy to say/recognize that in hindsight.  Did you feel/think this right after the expansion draft?  If so, you would've been one of the the very few.   

Exactly what I was going to post. Hindsight is 20/20 - at the time it didn't look great. Vegas had several guys play WAY above their heads this year.

[gmillerdrake]

Vegas....it's more than a perfect storm. The GM absolutely fleeced the NHL. He has another and possibly ANOTHER full team of veterans/picks/prospects that he could throw to the coach and say "here...make another perfect storm".

Nah....what Vegas's leadership did differently was in lieu of trading away all the players they selected from all the teams for draft picks and more manageable contracts.....they stood pat, "coached up" the 'unwanted' players they selected and decided to make a run at it all right now rather than sell it all for the future.

And, as it's been mentioned......that horrific tragedy unified that city and team in a way that couldn't have been foreseen. THAT in itself is something that Seattle's team won't have. That event is a major cog in why that Vegas team started the way they did and from there they just had the belief and the moxi which really didn't stop all season but for a few games here and there.

[Nick]

THAT in itself is something that Seattle's team won't have.

Unfortunately this is America, so there is no way you can say that for sure. 

[jingle.boy]

Nah....what Vegas's leadership did differently was in lieu of trading away all the players they selected from all the teams for draft picks and more manageable contracts.....they stood pat, "coached up" the 'unwanted' players they selected and decided to make a run at it all right now rather than sell it all for the future.

They did a bit of both... keeping Neal and Murray are great examples of the above; trading Methot and Van Reimsdyk contradicts the above.  Also, they made a couple of deals for prospects and/or draft picks in exchange of passing on a good exposed player (eg, Eric Staal, Josh Bailey)

[YtseBitsySpider]

people actually paid them with picks to take Karlson and Fleury (fleeced). Only the Tatar deal looks "off"
 And while their stockpile of picks in next years' draft dips slightly it picks back up in 2020. Not one of their first round picks was forcefed into the NHL early. And they all look REALLY good.

he has a bunch of kids in junior..a couple with the Wolves.

I didn't know they'd gell like this - not all. I'm just saying the GM studied how he could get the most out of the expansion format. And he did very well.

[jingle.boy]

people actually paid them with picks to take Karlson and Fleury (fleeced).

Regarding Karlsson, it was a matter of 'pick-your-poison'.  Columbus was gonna lose someone they didn't want to, so they put their bet on Karlsson, and clearly VGK got the better of that bet - the dude hadn't topped 25 points in his career!  For the Pens, they bet on Murray, and wanted to ensure they didn't lose a key forward (since they decided to protect 4 d-men) like Hagelin or Rust - plus it also freed up a lot of salary cap. Same deal with Marchessault - though taking a $10M risk on Reilly + Marchessault was a big bet - one that clearly has paid off for Vegas.

Again... easy to say that VGK fleeced the rest of the league, but the reality is it has been a lot of EXTREMELY good fortune for the way things turned out in a significant number of the moves/picks.  Any one of them doesn't play out as it does, and they are struggling for just to earn a playoff spot

If Reilly and Marchessault don't both produce the way they did, McPhee looks like a doofus paying $10M for those two.