Author Topic: The Queensr˙che Discography Thread  (Read 107102 times)

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Offline bosk1

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Re: The Queensr˙che Discography Thread: LIVEcrime & Building Empires
« Reply #420 on: July 20, 2017, 12:51:10 PM »
^I think you may be right on the AS tour.  They were basically playing all (or most) of Empire, Rage, and AS on a rotating basis, so that makes sense.
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Re: The Queensr˙che Discography Thread: LIVEcrime & Building Empires
« Reply #421 on: July 20, 2017, 03:19:02 PM »
Oh, and for completists out there (TIM, this may be of interest), the entire Nov. 14, 1990 show on audio is available. If you buy the 25th anniversary box set of Operation: Mindcrime, and the 20th Anniversary box set of Empire, the live tracks on both combine to be the ENTIRE Nov. 14, 1990 show if you want to create an iTunes playlist or a compilation CD. It's completely unedited (no overdubs) so you get the full on, live Queensryche performance. It's also a treat because it features one of the very limited performances of "Hand on Heart." So if you can find both those anniversary editions (which are still available), it's worth it.

Just ran through this on Spotify.  Good god this thread is worth it for this post alone.  Love this mix of Mindcrime (notwithstanding the somewhat dampened audience participation - though it's without doubt cranked up on LIVEcrime as a result of post-production).  I'm now beginning to question whether Moore was lip sync'g on LIVEcrime, because she absolutely nails it here.  There are a handful of subtle cadence and pitch changes here and there, but otherwise it's virtually identical to the studio version.
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Offline Samsara

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Re: The Queensr˙che Discography Thread: LIVEcrime & Building Empires
« Reply #422 on: July 20, 2017, 05:35:58 PM »
Re: moore...are you saying you think she did, or because of the nov 15 show, you think she did not? Pamela is an amazing singer. I dont think she ever lip synched. They may have substituted her live vocal for the studio vocal on livecrime (i dont know), but knowing her, i doubt she would have faked it on stage. Shes too good, and too honest of a person.
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Offline jingle.boy

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Re: The Queensr˙che Discography Thread: LIVEcrime & Building Empires
« Reply #423 on: July 20, 2017, 06:16:39 PM »
Re: moore...are you saying you think she did, or because of the nov 15 show, you think she did not? Pamela is an amazing singer. I dont think she ever lip synched. They may have substituted her live vocal for the studio vocal on livecrime (i dont know), but knowing her, i doubt she would have faked it on stage. Shes too good, and too honest of a person.

Yeah, the latter... let me clarify.  I'm NOT in any way saying that she would have lip-sync'd the actual LIVEcrime show(s) in Wisconsin.  Just (as you correctly pointed out) that the CD/video could be dubbed with the studio tracks (ergo, watching the video seems like she's lip-sync'g).  However, after listening to Hammersmith, she performs it so meticulously close to the studio version, it wouldn't surprise me if the LIVEcrime CD/video is what was actually recorded in Wisconsin those three nights.

Make sense?
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Offline Samsara

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Re: The Queensr˙che Discography Thread: LIVEcrime & Building Empires
« Reply #424 on: July 21, 2017, 07:41:52 AM »
Re: moore...are you saying you think she did, or because of the nov 15 show, you think she did not? Pamela is an amazing singer. I dont think she ever lip synched. They may have substituted her live vocal for the studio vocal on livecrime (i dont know), but knowing her, i doubt she would have faked it on stage. Shes too good, and too honest of a person.

Yeah, the latter... let me clarify.  I'm NOT in any way saying that she would have lip-sync'd the actual LIVEcrime show(s) in Wisconsin.  Just (as you correctly pointed out) that the CD/video could be dubbed with the studio tracks (ergo, watching the video seems like she's lip-sync'g).  However, after listening to Hammersmith, she performs it so meticulously close to the studio version, it wouldn't surprise me if the LIVEcrime CD/video is what was actually recorded in Wisconsin those three nights.

Make sense?

I gotcha. Yep. And I agree with you.

OK folks, anything left on Building Empires/LIVEcrime/Empire -- get on it through this weekend. Come Monday: "The road to the Promised Land is a long one. Shall we...continue?"
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Re: The Queensr˙che Discography Thread: LIVEcrime & Building Empires
« Reply #425 on: July 21, 2017, 07:45:34 AM »
Searching for the answers
but there's damage ...
Must've been Kwyji sending all the wrong songs.   ;D

Offline bosk1

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Re: The Queensr˙che Discography Thread: LIVEcrime & Building Empires
« Reply #426 on: July 21, 2017, 08:29:55 AM »
I just hope we don't break the forum with all the discussion of the Promised Land CD rom game!  :caffeine:
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Re: The Queensr˙che Discography Thread: LIVEcrime & Building Empires
« Reply #427 on: July 21, 2017, 08:42:37 AM »
Picking up the pieces of the forum....no direction...no direction...no direction...no direction for re-assembly.
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Re: The Queensr˙che Discography Thread: LIVEcrime & Building Empires
« Reply #428 on: July 21, 2017, 08:50:15 AM »
I just hope we don't break the forum with all the discussion of the Promised Land CD rom game!  :caffeine:

Are you sure the forum won't break when we dissect Geoff's choice in stage attire for the album's tour?


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Re: The Queensr˙che Discography Thread: LIVEcrime & Building Empires
« Reply #429 on: July 21, 2017, 08:52:18 AM »
If not now than probably at the time we reach the cabaret thing  ;D
Must've been Kwyji sending all the wrong songs.   ;D

Offline bosk1

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Re: The Queensr˙che Discography Thread: LIVEcrime & Building Empires
« Reply #430 on: July 21, 2017, 08:54:20 AM »
I just hope we don't break the forum with all the discussion of the Promised Land CD rom game!  :caffeine:

Are you sure the forum won't break when we dissect Geoff's choice in stage attire for the album's tour?



:lol  Yeah, there's that.  Although, in context of the set, it at least made sense and didn't really hint too much at the future creepiness that would be the Cabaret.  And speaking of "the context of the set," it was actually pretty cool how he got to that particular wardrobe choice as part of the story.
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Offline Samsara

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Re: The Queensr˙che Discography Thread: LIVEcrime & Building Empires
« Reply #431 on: July 21, 2017, 09:20:57 AM »
Thank god this is a DISCOGRAPHY thread...so...I'll sorta be like...skipping the Cabaret. I know you're all SO disappointed.  :lol
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Re: The Queensr˙che Discography Thread: LIVEcrime & Building Empires
« Reply #432 on: July 21, 2017, 09:22:29 AM »
I even forgot it existed  :lol I know they did some concerts as a cabaret act, but I'm unsure of the specific details and I'm not sure I wanna know them  :biggrin:
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Offline bosk1

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Re: The Queensr˙che Discography Thread: LIVEcrime & Building Empires
« Reply #433 on: July 21, 2017, 09:26:11 AM »
Thank god this is a DISCOGRAPHY thread...so...I'll sorta be like...skipping the Cabaret. I know you're all SO disappointed.  :lol

Not so fast, sir!  Mosh already set the bar in the Maiden thread about discussing the relevant tour for each album.  And you've thus far followed suit.  You CANNOT miss out on discussing the Cabaret shows.  Especially since there will probably be more discussion of that than the album itself.
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Offline Mosh

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Re: The Queensr˙che Discography Thread: LIVEcrime & Building Empires
« Reply #434 on: July 21, 2017, 09:28:31 AM »
I've wanted to check out Livecrime but its been a busy week and I haven't really had time. Maybe tomorrow.
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Re: The Queensr˙che Discography Thread: LIVEcrime & Building Empires
« Reply #435 on: July 21, 2017, 09:42:04 AM »
Thank god this is a DISCOGRAPHY thread...so...I'll sorta be like...skipping the Cabaret. I know you're all SO disappointed.  :lol

Not so fast, sir!  Mosh already set the bar in the Maiden thread about discussing the relevant tour for each album.  And you've thus far followed suit.  You CANNOT miss out on discussing the Cabaret shows.  Especially since there will probably be more discussion of that than the album itself.

No no no. The Cabaret debacle was NOT "in support" of anything (heh). So nope, nope, nope. The tours discussed will coincide with the records. Not one off legs that had nothing to do with any record. (I love me some loopholes.)  :lol

I've wanted to check out Livecrime but its been a busy week and I haven't really had time. Maybe tomorrow.

I haven't watched it in a long time. The Mrs. is really soured by Queensryche these days because of the last several years, so I avoid putting any on with her in the room. But tomorrow I need to build some furniture and she'll be gone for the day, so I am going to crank up both LIVEcrime and Building Empires back to back. My home stereo set up is pretty powerful, so it should be awesome (I have yet to crank anything Queensryche on it).
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Offline bosk1

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Re: The Queensr˙che Discography Thread: LIVEcrime & Building Empires
« Reply #436 on: July 21, 2017, 09:59:36 AM »
But tomorrow I need to build some furniture Empires.

Do tell.  :mindcrime:
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Re: The Queensr˙che Discography Thread: LIVEcrime & Building Empires
« Reply #437 on: July 21, 2017, 12:41:27 PM »
Re: moore...are you saying you think she did, or because of the nov 15 show, you think she did not? Pamela is an amazing singer. I dont think she ever lip synched. They may have substituted her live vocal for the studio vocal on livecrime (i dont know), but knowing her, i doubt she would have faked it on stage. Shes too good, and too honest of a person.

Yeah, the latter... let me clarify.  I'm NOT in any way saying that she would have lip-sync'd the actual LIVEcrime show(s) in Wisconsin.  Just (as you correctly pointed out) that the CD/video could be dubbed with the studio tracks (ergo, watching the video seems like she's lip-sync'g).  However, after listening to Hammersmith, she performs it so meticulously close to the studio version, it wouldn't surprise me if the LIVEcrime CD/video is what was actually recorded in Wisconsin those three nights.

Make sense?

I must say that I never thought her vocal on livecrime was lip synced. There's a raspiness to the "to" part of "tonight" that isn't there on the album.

Watching it back now I'm not sure.  But I need to know. Damn you dtf 😀

Offline bosk1

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Re: The Queensr˙che Discography Thread: LIVEcrime & Building Empires
« Reply #438 on: July 21, 2017, 01:27:22 PM »
I had never even thought about it until the question was asked.  My only point was, given the logistics of the tour (i.e., that they had a backing track that included her vocals, and that it likely didn't have her vocals separated out such that they could be removed at those few shows where she was actually there), it makes sense to me that it likely would have been lip synced.  And that option still makes the most sense to me, notwithstanding her singing ability.  But, again, I am only speculating.
« Last Edit: July 21, 2017, 01:33:10 PM by bosk1 »
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Re: The Queensr˙che Discography Thread: LIVEcrime & Building Empires
« Reply #439 on: July 21, 2017, 02:27:04 PM »
Ok terry, we need an answer mate 😀

Offline Setzer

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Re: The Queensr˙che Discography Thread: LIVEcrime & Building Empires
« Reply #440 on: July 21, 2017, 05:13:22 PM »
You could always ask Pamela Moore herself ;)

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Re: The Queensr˙che Discography Thread: LIVEcrime & Building Empires
« Reply #441 on: July 23, 2017, 07:12:07 AM »
So I finally got around to checking a few clips of LIVEcrime on youtube. I must say, that as a video, I'm not really in love with it. I hate slow motion added stuff to concert vids. Just not a fan of the camera shots.
Audio wise it seemed very good though.
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Offline Samsara

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Re: The Queensr˙che Discography Thread: LIVEcrime & Building Empires
« Reply #442 on: July 24, 2017, 07:55:59 AM »
You could always ask Pamela Moore herself ;)

Doing so is, IMO, disrespectful. There's no need to do that. Obviously, the woman can sing incredibly. Most of us have seen it. The only purpose asking her serves is to make her feel self conscious. Even if the answer is no, the fact someone would seek her out and asked if she lip-syched something is kinda wrong, at least in my book. It's very common, particularly back then when it was expensive to put out live videos, for studio vocals to be swapped in for a live vocal, just for consistency's sake. So, if that did indeed happen (and after re-watching, I tend to think it did), it is what it is. :)
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Re: The Queensr˙che Discography Thread: Promised Land (1994)
« Reply #443 on: July 24, 2017, 08:06:13 AM »
Promised Land (1994)



Lineup:

Lead Vocals – Geoff Tate
Lead & Rhythm Guitars/Vocals – Chris DeGarmo
Lead & Rhythm Guitars – Michael Wilton
Bass & Vocals – Eddie Jackson
Drums & Percussion – Scott Rockenfield

Pre-Promised Land Overview

Following Queensryche's one-off performance at the Rock the Environment show in June 1992, the band was not publicly heard from again for a year. Then, on June 8, 1993, the motion picture soundtrack for The Last Action Hero was released featuring “Real World,” a tune co-written by Queensryche and Michael Kamen. Although no real information exists on when and how the song was written and recorded, “Real World” was put out as a single and did very well for Queensryche, peaking at #3 in the U.S. Mainstream Rock chart.

Featuring both acoustic and electric guitars, the song begins fairly mellow before picking up in intensity toward the end with Kamen's orchestration. Lyrically, “Real World” is quite melancholy, ironically summing up where some of the band (notably, Geoff Tate) were at mentally at the time. The vibe would continue throughout Queensryche's next studio album, Promised Land, which would be released 14 months later on Oct. 18, 1994.

To better understand why it took four years from Empire to Promised Land, a brief “behind the scenes” look is required. Following the long Building Empires tour, the band went their separate ways for a while. During that time, Geoff Tate and Scott Rockenfield both got divorced, Eddie Jackson's video game stores that he had invested in went under (or were on the verge of going under), investments made by Michael Wilton in chocolate and coffee went south, and Wilton was also trying to recover from some dependency issues (he had an alter ego called “SPIKE” back in the day that reared its head when he had consumed too much alcohol – on the Promised Land tour, he had a statement that “SPIKE IS DEAD” on his guitar picks, if I remember right). Chris DeGarmo was the most stable of the group, but even he was starting to feel the strain of being out on the road and having a family grow up without him (Chris' dad left him, his brother, and his mom when Chris was young, and Chris didn't want to be an absent parent and husband). It was during this time that he earned his initial pilot's license, setting the stage for his future profession.

So, while Queensryche had its most successful period as a band, there were a lot of personal issues that the five guys were going through that affected their ability to get creative and write a follow-up to Empire. In fact, Tate went from stardom to living on his boat, with his ex-wife having been awarded all his royalty rights to all material through the Empire album (which was a tidy sum back then given how big album sales were and how popular Queensryche music was). Out of respect, I won't get into what led to the divorce, but trust me when I say -- don't feel bad for Tate on this one. It's rumored that DeGarmo helped keep a roof over Tate's head during this period, and ultimately, it was Chris that would help keep Queensryche together. Had he not, Empire might very well have been Queensryche's swan song.

The Promised Land Sessions

Eventually, Chris was able to get all five guys together, along with whatever song ideas they had and they went up to the San Juan Islands in the Pacific Northwest to write and record. The initial idea was to get away from the  distractions of home and focus on music. For the first few weeks, it didn't go as planned, however. The guys were consumed with various issues at home and it took a while to get everyone on the same page. According to some of the legal documents stemming from the Tate v. Queensryche lawsuit in 2012 (https://www.anybodylistening.net/lawsuit.html), there were allegedly some violent outbursts by and issues with Tate and other incidents that really derailed the initial attempts at creating an album.

Band members (notably Tate and Rockenfield) also were getting into new relationships at the time, which began changing the dynamic between the band members. As Dan “Shag” Birchall (an old friend of the band) once said (paraphrasing): Not everyone liked and supported the new people now in their lives, which ultimately could have had an impact on the working relationship within the band.

As time went by, however, Queensryche's stay at “Big Log” started to pay off. The moodier direction the band was taking was embraced, and songs started to take shape. At the helm of the sessions was James “Jimbo” Barton, who acted as co-producer, engineer and mixer. He was more of a “sixth member” of Queensryche, helping Chris unite everyone. It wasn't easy, even when the band was being creative.

For example, according to a friend of mine who asked Tate about the song “Promised Land,” back in the late 1990s, Tate recalled that he couldn't quite capture the emotion that Jimbo Barton was looking for and it got extremely frustrating. The two went out drinking, Tate got hammered, came back to the studio and nailed the vocal in one take. Tate also (seriously) warned my friend to never listen to the song while in a depressed state, alluding to suicidal thoughts prevalent in the tune.

The Songs and Theme


Promised Land is not a concept record. Fans initially thought (and wrote some interesting theories how) it was a sequel of sorts to Operation: Mindcrime, but it isn't. Promised Land is a theme that follows a person's life from birth to maturity, taking the listener on a trip through all the emotions of reaching the pinnacle of “success” only to learn how much that success cost a person. Although the record is not completely autobiographical, much of the record is driven by Tate's own self-examination, with some tunes featuring experiences by DeGarmo.

Although I hesitate to do song-by-song recaps, as they are obviously really subjective, for Promised Land, to give an idea of the theme and what the band was trying to express, I decided to do a brief one, for clarity and discussion purposes (again, these are only my interpretations):

9:28 a,m. - birth. This is actually the time Scott Rockenfield was born, and he composed the instrumental interlude that starts the record.

I Am I – The lead single from Promised Land. A song about self awareness. Coming of age. Making that statement that you are your own person and committed to being that person.

Damaged – the title pretty much sums up the song meaning. The recognition of a traumatic event in someone's life that has injured them mentally, emotionally, and having to pick up the pieces of their life and move forward.

Out of Mind – this song deviates from the first person narrative of the record. During Tate's 2017 acoustic tour, he talked about the genesis of this tune. Apparently Tate's mother worked in a mental hospital, and back in the 1960s, she took Tate to work with her. Tate explained what he remembered of the patients' behavior to DeGarmo, who got inspired and came back the next evening with “Out of Mind” completely written.

Bridge – this song was the second single from Promised Land and tells the story of a deadbeat parent who comes  back into the life of their grown child, wanting a relationship after having abandoned the child years before. Tate introduced this song in 1997 by saying: “This song was written by my good friend Mr. DeGarmo here, who was man enough to write it, and share it with us all. This is called “Bridge.”

Promised Land – the centerpiece and title track of the record, “Promised Land” is a mixture of Tate's personal angst upon achieving success with Empire, and the band members' experience. In a nutshell, the track examines life after the pinnacle of what people call “success” and what's left once you reach that mountain top. It showcases the darker side of success, touching upon alcoholism and suicide.

Dis-con-nec-ted – Lyrically, it's pretty self-explanatory. A person, after going through whatever life troubles they have, is in a bad state, is likely loaded and self-medicating to get through life, coming to the realization of the shape he or she is in. It was the third of three videos shot for the album. Obviously, everything is open to interpretation...

Lady Jane – probably to some the track that would lyrically be the most debatable on the record. I've seen synopsis that range from as simple as a child getting high to sexual abuse. You'd have to ask DeGarmo, but given the amount of drugs the band consumed at one time (they didn't earn the nickname “Krellryche” from Metallica for nothing), there's certainly a theme of self-medicating going on...

My Global Mind – the one track (maybe two if you consider Lady Jane) that doesn't quite fit the overall theme of the record, unless you stretch it. Social commentary by Queensryche on the way the Internet is changing the way humans interact with one another. Pretty interesting if you look at it through a 2017 lens...and how right they were...

One More Time – a song of regret, of wisdom, of second chances. Are we better off than our parents were at the same age? Yes...and no. As we wind down, the character present throughout the theme of the record is awakening to find himself.

Someone Else? - a tune about finally coming to peace with who you are, Realizing the mistakes made in youth, and the sacrifices that were made were, in some ways, regrettable. Looking back at the life you led and not recognizing the person that's there. The move forward into the second half of life.

CD Singles



The Music

If Operation: Mindcrime was the more Iron Maiden/Judas Priest side of Queensryche, then Promised Land features the more cerebral hard rock, Pink Floyd-like portion of the band. It retains some aggressive, metal moments (“Damaged” in particular), but embraces a more introspective, dark and mid-tempo vibe overall.

The writing for Promised Land took place mostly in 1993 and spring/summer 1994, during the height of the “grunge” movement. Curiously, while past records from Queensryche incorporated elements of whatever trend was popular in music at the time (the band always changing styles to a degree from album to album), Promised Land was an oddity. The 11-track effort builds off of Empire to a degree (mostly in production), but the songs are clearly not influenced by grunge, nor do they harken back to Queensryche's “metal years.” They stand alone as what could arguably considered the most “pure” snapshot of the band's “own” sound.

Acoustic guitars played a critical role on tunes such as “Bridge,” and “Out of Mind” (to this writer a clear attempt to capitalize on the success of “Silent Lucidity” and the MTV unplugged sessions - albeit a natural artistic progression for DeGarmo), but the record as a whole really seemed built more on creating an overall mood than looking for a hit single. The result is a roller coaster that really runs the gamut of emotion and style from the quirky sitar-laced opener “I Am I,” to the aggressive metal guitars in “Damaged” to the piano-only closer of “Someone Else?” Instrumentation-wise, Promised Land was the most adventurous in the band's career to this point, also featuring cello, saxophone, and keyboard arrangements.

Of note is “Dis-con-nec-ted.” Although a single, albeit not a popular one, it is distinct in the Queensryche catalog. It features a shuffle beat and a quirky spoken word vocal delivery by Tate (not the first time – think back to Rage for Order's unreleased demo title track). As the story goes, Rockenfield composed the song on keyboard, and DeGarmo translated it to guitar. I don't recall exactly, but I think there was some disagreement on that move between the drummer and guitarist. Rumor has it Rockenfield had gotten a little jealous of DeGarmo's status after the success of “Silent Lucidity,” and made a focused effort to become a full-fledged songwriter starting with Promised Land. He'd gravitate toward film/game/TV scoring in the future on side projects and achieve some success (more on that later).

It should also be noted that Promised Land marks the decline of Michael Wilton as a major songwriter in Queensryche. From the EP through Empire, Wilton was a significant writing force for the band, both on his own or in tandem with DeGarmo. Wilton usually provided the more aggressive, straightforward metal riffs and you could tell a song was likely something he wrote when you heard it. He was typically credited on at least half the tracks on all those previous records. But on Promised Land, Wilton took a back seat, getting just co-writing credit with the entire band on the title track, and with Rockenfield and Tate on “My Global Mind.” Wilton's contributions would ebb and flow from this point forward, until Queensryche's self-titled release in 2013. At that point, he became a steadfast major contributor again. 

Interesting fact: If you search YouTube, or play the Big Log disc of the Promised Land CD-Rom game (see below), you'll catch a clip of DeGarmo singing lead vocals on “Bridge.”

Four b-sides exist for the record. The aforementioned “Real World,” is the first (I count it as such, some may not). Another is a track called “Dirty Lil' Secret” that was erroneously (in my opinion) placed on the Empire remaster in 2003. That tune was written at some point in 1993, and has a vibe (albeit using some social commentary lyrics) quite like “Last Time in Paris.” If you haven't heard it, I encourage checking it out. That vibe probably is why it was put on the Empire remaster, even though chronologically, it doesn't belong with it. It has a snarky feel to it that didn't fit Promised Land, but it is a lost “gem” of a tune.

The third b-side is the full band version of “Someone Else?” What folks may not know is that “Someone Else?” was actually originally written with the full band, and that version (which has extended lyrics and running time) was to be the closer of Promised Land. However, with some extra time on his hands at the end of the recording sessions, DeGarmo ended up doing a piano version of the song and was so enamored by the emotion of it, he and the band decided to use it as the “main” version of the song to end the record. So the originally-recorded full-band rendition became a b-side.

The final b-side is a little acoustic ditty called “Two Mile High” that I consider to be with Promised Land. We'll get into what this track is a little further down below. However, it was technically written after the Promised Land sessions.

Interesting fact: The vocals for the piano version of “Someone Else?” were not re-recorded. Chris and Jimbo Barton simply spliced the vocals onto the piano track from the initial full band version. That's likely why it sounds like Tate is singing a little harsher at times on the track than the piano really calls for - he never had a chance to re-record those parts for the more low key version.

In addition, a third version of “Someone Else?” exists. When the band played the song live, they combined the two versions, with DeGarmo and Tate starting it, with Eddie and Scott coming in gradually (and understated), with Wilton coming in and accentuating the emotion of the song with a lead guitar. This version was played throughout the band's 1995 tour in support of Promised Land.

Queensryche released three videos for Promised Land: “I Am I,” “Bridge” and “Dis-con-nec-ted.” While the first two got fairly regular play (at first) on MTV, the latter was barely played at all. In addition, as seen above, "Someone Else?" was a promotional single.

Miscellaneous

The iconic tri-ryche totem pole was created by Victoria, British Columbia artist Harold Alfred – https://haroldalfred.com/. It was then digitally illustrated by Hugh Syme for the cover of the record. Taking the liner notes from the CD, it opens to reveal the full cover art, which acts as a poster on one side, and the lyrics on the other. On the opposite side with the lyrics, is the “nailhead” guy, inspired by the line in “Damaged” that goes “driving the nail into my head, memory flows...like a river.” Both the totem cover and the nailhead guy served as popular t-shirts during the record's support tour.

See Part II below (original post was too long)
« Last Edit: July 24, 2017, 10:32:13 AM by Samsara »
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Offline Samsara

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Re: The Queensr˙che Discography Thread: Promised Land (1994)
« Reply #444 on: July 24, 2017, 08:06:36 AM »
Promised Land (1994) - continued...

Reception

Let's be blunt – Promised Land wasn't well received initially. Critics and various fans didn't get what Queensryche was doing, particularly after a ton of pre-release hype and four years since Empire had been a smashing success. Then again, fans quickly forgot that Rage for Order and Operation: Mindcrime were also criticized when they were first released as well. So, slow starts were nothing new to the band.

Queensryche did a lot of promotional work leading up to Promised Land's debut, doing promotional gigs in Europe, along with a radio show tour to talk about the album. Ultimately, Promised Land sold over one million copies, which while notable, and platinum status, is a far cry from the 3.5 million sales of Empire. So, from a commercial standpoint, the record (unfairly in this writer's opinion) was considered a “flop.”

From a fan's perspective, Promised Land is divisive. Many of the mainstream hard rock fans Queensryche gained with Empire didn't “get” the weird vibe of “I Am I” and didn't purchase the record, or they had moved onto other bands by 1994. Long-time fans were also split. Those that considered Empire to be a bit on the commercial side and were looking for Queensryche to get “more metal” again were sorely disappointed. Whereas fans who liked the more mid-tempo, darker tone of Queensryche, or simply those fans who straddled the line, were able to embrace Promised Land a bit more readily.

However you slice it, Promised Land didn't resonate the way EMI Records, nor the band, was hoping it would.

Touring

The support to for Promised Land, dubbed “The Road to the Promised Land Tour,” was a visual spectacle. Building upon the dramatics of the Building Empires tour, Queensryche played the entirety of Promised Land, along with hits from Empire and across the rest of their catalog. The stage set consisted of various video screens depicting animations to go along with most songs, and a complete set change for the performance of “Promised Land” (it was a bar scene, with the band dressed up as a lounge act). Fans were invited up to sit at the bar as Tate and the band performed the song.Tate would change outfits every few songs, including having his clothes “ripped away” going into “Damaged.” He was also put into a strait jacket and wheeled around in a wheelchair during “Out of Mind.”

Time-wise, the show was a little shorter than the Building Empires tour, but still more than a full two-hour set, including a two-song encore. Tate publicly debuted his saxophone playing on “Promised Land,” and the band also played an abridged versions of “Neue Regel” and a medley of “NM 156” and “Screaming in Digital,” stopping each song (unfortunately) before their respective guitar solos.

Overall, and counting the promotional gigs in the latter half of 1994 that Queensryche played, the tour in support of Promised Land lasted just over five months – a dramatic decrease from the 14-month Building Empires tour. The main tour began on Feb. 9, 1995 with two months in Europe and Japan. That was followed by three months across the United States, starting on April 14, 1995 in Kalamazoo, Mich., and concluding on July 27, 1995 in Toronto, Canada.
 


Interesting fact: During the late 1994 promotional stops in Europe, Queensryche played (as an outro/intro to commercial) an instrumental version of The Rolling Stones' “Waiting on a Friend,” featuring Tate on saxophone.

Queensryche fans got a bit like fans of the Grateful Dead on the Promised Land tour. Many traveled the summer with the band, following their buses. Queensryche was much more accessible on this tour than they were on the Building Empires tour, and the band built relationships with many fans on the trek. Tate would say something in regard to those traveling with the band during most shows. They also played softball games and had picnics periodically during the tour.

During this time, Queensryche was extremely fan-friendly when it came to recording their shows. They opened “tapers sections” in many venues, enabling people to film and record each gig. There was also a request from the fan club that footage be sent to the band for a release they wanted to put together to commemorate the tour. Unfortunately, nothing came from this alleged project.

Promised Land CD-Rom




Once the tour finished, Queensryche began work on another project called the Promised Land CD-Rom. Released in 1996, it was a video game in the style of the 90s classic “MYST” where the player would adventure around and solve a mystery. In this instance, the player would walk around the island where Queensryche recorded Promised Land, visiting the various “worlds” assigned to each band member. The idea was to visit these areas, solve a challenge, collect pieces of the Queensryche Promised Land totem pole, and collect the prize. That prize was a song recorded specifically for the game – “Two Mile High.” The song is a simple acoustic tune about flying, most likely written by DeGarmo, given the topic.

On a second disc, players could examine a version of “Big Log” the studio where Queensryche actually recorded Promised Land. As players move around and check out certain aspects, they discover various video clips, including segments on the making of the album. All three videos shot for Promised Land were also hidden items meant to be found during the game.

Overall, the game was intended to tide fans over until work was completed on Queensryche's next album, which would arrive in 1997.

Samsara's top-3 from Promised Land: "Damaged," "Promised Land," "One More Time"

Next up: Hear in the Now Frontier...
« Last Edit: July 24, 2017, 08:33:21 AM by Samsara »
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Offline Dublagent66

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Re: The Queensr˙che Discography Thread: Promised Land (1994)
« Reply #445 on: July 24, 2017, 09:23:56 AM »
Wow, I never knew that game existed.  I was a huge fan of the Myst series too.  That would been fun to play.
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Offline Samsara

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Re: The Queensr˙che Discography Thread: Promised Land (1994)
« Reply #446 on: July 24, 2017, 09:30:11 AM »
Wow, I never knew that game existed.  I was a huge fan of the Myst series too.  That would been fun to play.

You can still grab it if you're interested enough.

https://www.amazon.com/Queensryches-Promised-Land/dp/B000002UQ6/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1500910188&sr=8-1&keywords=Queensryche+Promised+Land+CD-Rom
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Re: The Queensr˙che Discography Thread: Promised Land (1994)
« Reply #447 on: July 24, 2017, 09:54:34 AM »
Album Thoughts:

When I saw QR for the first time in 1999, I still didn't have Promised Land.  I think I knew that it wasn't like the older records, but I liked when they played Damaged from it, so I bought it not long after the show.  Initially, I only liked Damaged, I Am I, Bridge, My Global Mind, and Someone Else.  The rest just wasn't heavy enough for me.  10 years later, I became very dissatisfied with my employment situation and I sat up late one night and listened to the album since I was in a mood for something dark and moody.  When I got to the title track, the song just spoke to me.  I now know the mistakes that I made while working there, but hearing those lyrics about keeping your nose to the grindstone and always reaching for the brass ring and coming up short felt so true then. 

I don't listen to it much anymore (same with American Soldier) due to the heavy lyrical content, but I'll have to remedy that soon due to this thread.

Tour thoughts:

I wasn't into the band when the tour originally happened, but have one of the bootlegs (Dayton video, and the San Jose audio) and loved it when I was really into the band.  It was a great setlist, with the entire album represented, a huge Mindcrime suite, and some nice selections for older tracks that really weren't featured on the Empire tour.  Looking back at the tour, and reading those lawsuit documents, I can see where Geoff's live performances started to veer off from the traditional performing and more towards acting on stage, but at the time, it was definitely a cool show.

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Re: The Queensr˙che Discography Thread: Promised Land (1994)
« Reply #448 on: July 24, 2017, 10:10:26 AM »
I had no idea that when I saw them in Kzoo that it was the opening show.

Samsara, I also didn't know that you could top your previous album write ups and background information.

Thank you.
...going along with Dragon Attack's Queen thread has been like taking a free class in Queen knowledge. Where else are you gonna find info like that?!

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Re: The Queensr˙che Discography Thread: Promised Land (1994)
« Reply #449 on: July 24, 2017, 10:16:53 AM »
I had no idea that when I saw them in Kzoo that it was the opening show.

Samsara, I also didn't know that you could top your previous album write ups and background information.

Thank you.

You're welcome! These are fun. Really enjoying trying to remember all this stuff. Plus, Mosh has uped the ante on his Maiden discography discourse, so I am trying my best to keep up. Ha ha ha.  :hefdaddy 

==========================

My story on this record begins on release day.  :lol  I didn't watch much MTV back in 1994. I worked full time, was going to college full time, and while my love for the band didn't wane, I was pretty dis-con-nec-ted from the latest going on with Queensryche, although I do remember seeing the video for I Am I and not quite liking it. I remember release date pretty vividly, however. I had two classes that morning. 7:30 a.m. - 9:50 a.m., and 10 a.m. to 11:20 a.m. I got done with class, and drove to The Wiz (it was a local chain on Long Island) on my way home. And there it was, a huge display of Promised Land. I had no cash at the time, and I had yet to apply for my first credit card. So I went home, and my mother had just come home for lunch from work. I asked her for $20 until I got paid on Friday, and then sped to The Wiz to pick up the CD.

I didn't have a CD player in my car, so the wait to get home (which was a 10 minute drive) was ridiculously unbearable. ha ha ha. Got home, closed the door, put the album on...and thought it was pretty shitty.  :lol :lol :lol

I was totally expecting something akin to Mindcrime and Empire, and while I had seen I Am I, I was hoping that the record would get better. I loved Damaged, and thought some of the other tracks were OK, but I just didn't get it. It wasn't a very deep listen. I just had it on my little boombox stereo I had in my bedroom. I also didn't read the lyrics.

Fast-forward a few days later. I got home from work (I kept a crazy schedule back then, going to class from 7 a.m. to 11:20, and then working from 2 p.m. to 10 p.m.) and just laid down in bed and put the album on my CD walkman on headphones, and just read the lyrics as the music played. It hit me like a...two-ton, heavy thing. I didn't quite understand at the time what was going on with Tate or DeGarmo, but the emotion in the songs hit me hard. This wasn't a record to rock out to. It was an album to immerse yourself in.

And that's what I did. For weeks. And I fell pretty hard for the emotional impact Promised Land gave me. I still thought Damaged was the best song on it (and still do), but the title track, Bridge, One More Time, My Global Mind and Someone Else really resonated. It was different, but it was certainly Queensryche, and I was all on board.

I can't recall if this was the Christmas (Christmas 1994) my mother bought me all the QR CD singles, but she could have. At some point, remembering that she didn't permit me to go to the Building Empires tour, she went ahead and went to a downtown music shop that I frequented and bought up all the CD singles from Queensryche that were in the store. Best I Can, JCW, Eyes of a Stranger, Another Rainy Night (I think those were it -- I bought the others later).

But it was announced (I guess a few months later) that Queensryche would be on tour, coming to Jones Beach for Promised Land. My mom worked at a local radio station, and she got me two tickets to see Queensryche as a gift, again, making up for Building Empires. What a treat. It would end up being my first concert, other than some oldies show years prior. July 18, 1995, my buddy Rob and I rolled up to the Jones Beach parking lot, hearing tailgaters blasting Queensryche, tons of people in tour shirts...man, I was in my element. We had such a good time. We bought t-shirts and tourbooks. I still have my original PL totem t-shirt).

I was there with Rob, and we sang every song, note for note (probably pissing people off). I had one girl tap me on the shoulder and say I must have been some super fan, because I knew all the words to every song. I did. And I could sing on key, so hopefully I wasn't too annoying.  :lol

Of course, being my first show, I had no idea about the "encore." As soon as they played Lucidity to close out the main set, I elbowed Rob and said lets go, they were finished. We got halfway down the hallway, and of course, they came back on stage, so like idiots, we ran back to our seats for Take Hold and Someone Else. It was a pretty magical experience for me as a fan since 1987 to finally see them live and what a great set. It was just a great production. I'll never forget it.

Of course, I was dumb and put my tourbook on the ground in front of me, and some idiot spilled beer all over it. I still took it home and dried it out the best I could. I ultimately (stupidly) cut out the pictures and put them on a huge black acid-free card stock thing to make a poster for myself. And then I did something equally stupid -- I tried to laminate my ticket stub to protect it, and I ended up ruining it (it turned all black, of course). Over time, I replaced the tour book (thankfully), but of course, my ticket was lost forever. :-( I learned my lesson, and didn't do that on the HITNF tour.

The experience, like many firsts, was almost a religious one. LOL. I ended up buying the video bootleg at the local flea market (along with some others) a few months later, and then set out on my huge collecting binge. The summer/fall of 1995 started it all, and kicked off a 10-year run for me doing all that. It was a magical time, and I was looking forward to seeing the band again as soon as possible. Thankfully, it would only be another two years...
« Last Edit: July 24, 2017, 11:00:25 AM by Samsara »
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Re: The Queensr˙che Discography Thread: Promised Land (1994)
« Reply #450 on: July 24, 2017, 11:30:26 AM »
More great work Samsara.

PL is Queensryche 's Awake for me. Huge albums before them and dark, hard to get into follow ups. I struggled with both God a long time. Today, I wouldn't have bothered as I don't have the time.

The intro was just that, nothing special.
I Am I - didn't like it, don't love it now but can listen to it.
Damaged - great track. Loved it straight away and still do.
I loved the two ballads. As a newly qualified psychiatric nurse when PL came out, the subject matter was close to my heart and was well done.
I struggled with the title track at the time but eventually came to see it as the awesome track it is. A definite headphone song(and album as the last three had been)

Disconnected was and is shit.

Lady Jane is ok and I struggled with the lyrics. I always got a child abuse vibe from it but it certainly isn't a clear lyric.

MGM was an early favourite and still a great song.
SE - the piano sounds like shit, like a bad Casio, and the vocal never sat right in the track. Once I head the full band version I could see why. I prefer the piano version but would have preferred it recorded properly.

I loved the cover and had a giant poster of it on my den wall, but one of my pet hates is the one big sheet, foldout approach with cd covers. It gets mangled to bits and doesn't go back in the case very well 😖

I said the word struggle a lot in this piece and that was obviously the idea - it's meant to be an uncomfortable listen.



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Re: The Queensr˙che Discography Thread: Promised Land (1994)
« Reply #451 on: July 24, 2017, 11:31:02 AM »
It was the same thing for me with Promised Land.  After I bought the Greatest Hits in 2000, I went out and bought all of the albums over the next few months.  Promised Land was one of the last ones and I remember playing the cd in my discman in bed.  When it ended, I remember thinking that was terrible.  But something made me try it again and it clicked.  The title track is just awesome and of course, so is Damaged.  I can do without Lady Jane, but everything else is great.

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Re: The Queensr˙che Discography Thread: Promised Land (1994)
« Reply #452 on: July 24, 2017, 11:38:14 AM »
The main problem for me at the time was that the musical climate had changed. Grunge was in and I hated it. I was still a hair metal fan and life was still great. I was young and having a great time and had nothing in common with these depressives who couldn't play their instruments very well. I still wanted great guitar solos.

At the time PL came out I considered QR to be my favourite band but this would change now. DT took over, and QR died.

Most of my favourite bands went the same way to a darker sound. They would all be struggling with their demons, as QR were, and they weren't in a happy place either. And also they would chase the new sound for sales. I just didn't like it.

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Re: The Queensr˙che Discography Thread: Promised Land (1994)
« Reply #453 on: July 24, 2017, 11:49:57 AM »
What I found very unique about PL, and I mentioned it in the write up, was that in terms of sound, didn't set any or absorb much stylistic trend, apart from a heavier use of acoustic. Grunge was big in 1994. But it really didn't have any whiff of grunge to me. It had acoustic stuff, and that was in-style, but it wasn't really grunge-like. That would change a couple years later, but to my ears, PL was very "true" to what was going on with the band at that point.
« Last Edit: July 24, 2017, 12:21:21 PM by Samsara »
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Re: The Queensr˙che Discography Thread: Promised Land (1994)
« Reply #454 on: July 24, 2017, 12:57:21 PM »
I'll be in the minority here, but I absolutely love PL, and did from the first listen.  In fact, it's my favorite QR.  Darker, brooding, weird, expansive...and not overtly flashy.  The vibe really resonated with me, and still does.   :millahhhh
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