Iron Maiden Discography Thread: Senjutsu

[Mladen]

My second favorite right behind Somewhere in time.

Can I play with madness and The Prophecy are extremely underrated.

Nothing much to say. Mosh nailed it. 

[devieira73]

It seems that already it was said it all, but I will just say that to me the album has a fantastic sound production wise and 7th Son and Infinite Dreams are my 2 favorites Maiden songs.

[kaos2900]

This may just be my favorite Maiden album. The Evil That Men Do is my favorite song of theirs and the whole album has such a perfect flow.

[Lowdz]

So I'd been a Maiden fan since the first album, and things were going very well. Then SiT came along and whilst it was ok, it was only ok. Then I heard that they were doing a concept album and I thought this would be cool. I wasn't a prog fan at the time (other than Rush) but as a fan of books, films etc I was excited to see what Maiden would do with it. Let's face it, they could do an epic so a concept album should be cool.

And in the end, not much was the answer. I wouldn't have known it was a concept album if I hadn't been told. I couldn't follow a story, other than the basic theme. If it was meant to be a double album, where's the rest of it? They couldn't put a story together to fill 45 minutes.

And the songs were generally ok again, certainly better than SiT, but not much that leapt out and screamed 'hey... hey... listen to me'.... 

But the real killer of this album was that it came out at the same time as Operation:Mindcrime. An album I was worshipping - still do.

I remember the Kerrang review of SSoaSS. They were gushing about it and how it was more cohesive and a better story than Mindcrime but I couldn't see it. Was there a story?

So yes, it's an ok album, but there was a new kid in town, who's albums were getting better and better, and Maidens were slipping. They were still a great band but Queensryche were the new king.

Now, it's still not an album I go to often, but it's a very good album, probably comes in at 5 in my ranking, and it's better than anything since from Maiden.

[bosk1]

This is the only Bruce era album I have that I don't like (FYI, I don't have FOTD or No Prayer).   I listened to it a couple of times, and nothing clicked.  And I've heard quite a few of the tracks live and didn't care for them either, other than The Evil That Men Do.  I don't recall hearing much of this album back when it first came out either. 

[jjrock88]

As good as a metal album gets.  Head to head with Somewhere in Time as my favorite from Iron Maiden.

[MirrorMask]

I remember the Kerrang review of SSoaSS. They were gushing about it and how it was more cohesive and a better story than Mindcrime but I couldn't see it. Was there a story?

I will always love Seventh Son and defend it to death, but I just can't agree with this. Storyline wise, Mindcrime overshadows Seventh Son.

[Stadler]

For the record, I LOVE Seventh Son.  Loved it then, and love it now.   (SiT as well, I might add). 

As for covers (I smell LIST!), of the albums talked about to date (no singles):

1. Powerslave
2. Seventh Son
3. Killers
4. Piece of Mind
5. Number of the Beast
6. Somewhere In Time (I LOVE the references, but it's unsatisfying).
7. Iron Maiden


(And FYI, nothing that would come after would unseat the top two, though Brave New World might break the Top Three).

[cramx3]

Amazing album.  The concept always seemed a bit too loose to really compared it to other concept albums so I never really dug into the whole storyline besides a light understanding.  It didn't really matter, the music was just so good that I can't say I care about a cohesive storyline.  The songs just rock.  Infinite Dreams is such a fantastic song.  Moonchild is one of IM's best openers and the ending to SSoaSS is some amazing music that can bring a tear to my eye.

[MirrorMask]

Moonchild is one of IM's best openers and the ending to SSoaSS is some amazing music that can bring a tear to my eye.

Any musician who is guitars wise knows why, with three guitars, they still couldn't play the very ending the way it is on the album? with the "high" notes, live they played it, both in 1988 and 2013, with "low" notes.

[Samsara]

Another great write-up, Mosh. Iron Maiden are completely progressive. They've gotten more progressive since reuniting in 1999, at least to my ears. So many people define "progressive metal" differently. To me, if a band changes moods, tempo, and gives you something to think about, the band is progressive. Maiden totally fits that bill.

I was very late into Maiden, and 7th Son in particular. I'm still not as versed with it as I should be. I picked up that bit on the storyline -- it seemed odd to me that it was a concept, when it followed no particular storyline. I usually refer to 7th Son as a themeatic album based on a concept. Sorta like Queensryche's Promised Land.

[bosk1]

Moonchild is one of IM's best openers and the ending to SSoaSS is some amazing music that can bring a tear to my eye.

Any musician who is guitars wise knows why, with three guitars, they still couldn't play the very ending the way it is on the album? with the "high" notes, live they played it, both in 1988 and 2013, with "low" notes.

I don't know that it is an issue of "can't" as opposed to them simply wanting to play it the way they do, and that could be for a variety of reasons. 

[Grappler]

Seventh Son never clicked with me for a long time.  I loved the singles and classic sounding songs right away - Evil that Men Do, Moonchild and The Clairvoyant, specifically.  The rest of the album finally fell into place over the years, though it tends to be a forgotten album.  I have my go-to Maiden albums, and then when I get sick of them, I always think "Oh yeah, I can listen to Seventh Son and still hear classic Maiden." 

[MirrorMask]

Moonchild is one of IM's best openers and the ending to SSoaSS is some amazing music that can bring a tear to my eye.

Any musician who is guitars wise knows why, with three guitars, they still couldn't play the very ending the way it is on the album? with the "high" notes, live they played it, both in 1988 and 2013, with "low" notes.

I don't know that it is an issue of "can't" as opposed to them simply wanting to play it the way they do, and that could be for a variety of reasons.

Well, with 22 years of being a Maiden fan it's impossible for me to remember the details, but I swear I must have read somewhere and somehow how they couldn't duplicate all the harmonies live and so the ending of the song had to be played that way.

That made me think it was a necessity, because if it was a choice, I find a very weird choice to "tune down" the very climax of such a long and wonderful solo section.

[Mosh]

I don't think there was anything preventing them from playing that particular part, they just chose not to. There are three part harmonies earlier in the song that they couldn't recreate in the 80s but did in 2012.

[TAC]

Phenomenal album, and one third of the TAC Iron Maiden Holy Grail.

I said it previously, but I was never more of a Maiden fan than I was when this album came out. I ate, slept, and drank Iron Maiden. This was the spring of my college sophomore year, and the only thing that mattered was the album you were listening to.

Moonchild was such a beast of an opener. Not sure what the timing of it is, but I have NEVER been able to hold the beat on that. For such a stinger, it just feels so loose. The studio version has such a live feel on it.

Infinite Dreams has always been a favorite. From Day 1. Scratches the progressive itch like crazy.

Amazing to witness it live.

The title track is incredible. Pulling up any live version on youtube, it is really breathtaking. I just remember getting so lost in it. Iron Maiden, AGAIN, raised the bar.


If I have a bitch or two, here they are. And I had them back then, even though I consider this a top album.

CIPWM is just weak. It is. It just is.

The only other thing I think is that I expected an epic to close this album. Even om my first listen, I was like..what? it's over?? That's it??
I like the verse, I like the chorus, but they just don't go together. This track needed a pre chorus to bridge the two and avoiding the awkward transition. That said, This track has really grown on me. That verse is amazing.

But the real killer of this album was that it came out at the same time as Operation:Mindcrime. An album I was worshipping - still do.

I remember the Kerrang review of SSoaSS. They were gushing about it and how it was more cohesive and a better story than Mindcrime but I couldn't see it. Was there a story?

I never was stuck comparing the two albums. I loved them both. O:M relegitimized Queensryhe in my eyes after RFO. 7th Son took my favorite band and improved on what they do.

And I know you'll appreciate this Paul, but in 1988, Kerrang was basically an Iron Maiden fanzine at that point.

[cramx3]

CIPWM is just weak. It is. It just is.

Yea, I really liked this song when I first got into IM.  It was included on Edward the Great (the first IM CD I owned).  But over time, I really turned to disliking it.  It's not terrible, but besides being a somewhat catchy chorus, there really is little to come back to on this track and I think that's what kind of happened after hearing it and seeing it live so often.  I'm glad it's been shelved in the live show.

Also, Only The Good Die Young, I love this song.  I don't see it as very popular, but I've always enjoyed it.

[Setlist Scotty]

SSoaSS is a good album, but couldn't hold up against SiT for me personally. Overall, I like the album, altho for me, the worst song of the bunch happens to be the 4th track again, and this is where I started to notice the lame/lazy lyric writing for the choruses. Terrible, IMO. Only thing worse was the chorus for the title track, which brings down an otherwise stellar track.

Funny side note - I was really hoping that MP would include an excerpt from the instrumental section of the title track when DT was touring with Maiden in 2010. I figured it would make sense since they did the same for their tour with Yes (covering a part of Machine Messiah), but it wasn't meant to be. 

A note on the B-Sides: Black Bart Blues is quite absurdingly funny, and the cover of Massacre is absolutely beautiful. Prowler and Charlotte's remakes are good but nothing earth shattering

Agree on the B-sides overall. BBB is a fun track, altho I hate all the dialogue that was in the track; a long time ago I edited all of it out and made the song (for me) much more enjoyable. Absolutely LOVE their version of Massacre. And the remakes are OK, but frankly, I wish they would've chosen some other (better) songs to redo.
 
 

For the record, I LOVE Seventh Son.  Loved it then, and love it now.   (SiT as well, I might add). 

As for covers (I smell LIST!), of the albums talked about to date (no singles):

1. Powerslave
2. Seventh Son
3. Killers
4. Piece of Mind
5. Number of the Beast
6. Somewhere In Time (I LOVE the references, but it's unsatisfying).
7. Iron Maiden

Love ya Stads, but you completely lost me with ranking SiT so low and SS so high. Move SiT to the #1 slot and put SS before NotB and you'd have my ranking.

[TAC]

Agree on the B-sides overall. BBB is a fun track, altho I hate all the dialogue that was in the track; a long time ago I edited all of it out and made the song (for me) much more enjoyable. Absolutely LOVE their version of Massacre. And the remakes are OK, but frankly, I wish they would've chosen some other (better) songs to redo.
 

Massacre is awesome. But I hate when bands redo one of their older songs.

Scott, would love to hear your edited version of BBB. I agree with you. The dialog is distracting. That said, musically, a track like BBB is great. It's looseness shows a band simply flexing its muscles.

Oddlly, a similar song, a total B side, Holy Smoke, would somehow find its way on an album proper.

[Phoenix87x]

Ah yes, the legendary Seventh son. God damn, do I love this album. It is SOO damn close to being my favorite IM album, but its predessessor just barely beats it out. But whatever, back to seventh son.

The stuff they are doing on this thing is fantastic. Moonchild is a solid opener. I absolutely love infinite dreams, the intro part is so cool. Can I play with madness is lame, and WAY too commercial sounding, but oh well. 

Next is The evil that men do which fully redeems the song that proceeds it. Then there is the breathtaking title track, hot damn.

Next is my favorite track on the album, the Prophecy mainly because of that chilling and hauntingly beautiful acoustic outro. That outro is one of my favorite moments of IM's entire career.

The claivoyant is sweet and the last song is sweet too.

Overall, just and amazing and stunning album which I love beyond words 

[PowerSlave]

I firmly believe that bands shouldn't remain stagnant. More often than not I'm usually elated when they attempt to broaden their horizons. In this instance there were some fairly good results, but there's some things that I don't like, either.

First for the negatives:

The guitars are way over-processed on this record. There's so much crap layered on them that they lose their bite. I'm not opposed to the use of effects when it's called for. However, this is metal, and metal is always going to be guitar driven. By castrating the guitar tone they limit their ability to achieve dynamics. In other words, if the guitars were on a heart monitor they would have flat-lined and been pronounced dead on arrival.

The acoustic section on The Prophecy is easily the best part of the song, and if it had been developed separately sounds like it could have turned into a helluva lot better song than what it was attached to. Can I Play With Matches is one of the worst songs from their 80's output, and the title track is the weakest epic in that era as well.

The band should have never told anyone that this was supposed to be a concept album. If they would have said that it was thematic, then it would have come off looking much better in the long run.

Now for the positives:

Moonchild is a great opener with a lot of energy. The synths actually work very well on this song.

Infinite Dreams is probably their best attempt at a more "mellow" feel in their entire catalog. There's a lot to sink your teeth into with this song.

TETMD kicks ass, and is a classic IM song for any era.

OTGDY is my favorite song on the album, and has the best lyrics/vocal delivery of any song on the record.

[TAC]

  Next is my favorite track on the album, the Prophecy mainly because of that chilling and hauntingly beautiful acoustic outro. That outro is one of my favorite moments of IM's entire career.

Yeah, love the outro to The Prochecy. A little too close to the Heaven And Hell outro, but awesome nonetheless. A great additional piece to a Maiden album.

[PowerSlave]

  Next is my favorite track on the album, the Prophecy mainly because of that chilling and hauntingly beautiful acoustic outro. That outro is one of my favorite moments of IM's entire career.

Yeah, love the outro to The Prochecy. A little too close to the Heaven And Hell outro, but awesome nonetheless. A great additional piece to a Maiden album.

Speaking of that, there's a definite Sabbath nod in the middle of the title track. I'm wondering if anyone else has ever picked up on it.

[TAC]

Listening now, but I'm not sure I've ever picked up a connection.
Let me guess the passage you're talking about. 7:48-7:58? 

[PowerSlave]

Listening now, but I'm not sure I've ever picked up a connection.
Let me guess the passage you're talking about. 7:48-7:58?

Oops. I checked it, and I'm fulla shit. Disregard.

[TAC]

Listening now, but I'm not sure I've ever picked up a connection.
Let me guess the passage you're talking about. 7:48-7:58?

Oops. I checked it, and I'm fulla shit. Disregard.

 

Thanks for playing!




For years, I've been trying to convince people that Rush's The Main Monkey Business' main riff was a rip on Sabbath's A National Acrobat.

[PowerSlave]

Listening now, but I'm not sure I've ever picked up a connection.
Let me guess the passage you're talking about. 7:48-7:58?

Oops. I checked it, and I'm fulla shit. Disregard.

 

Thanks for playing!




For years, I've been trying to convince people that Rush's The Main Monkey Business' main riff was a rip on Sabbath's A National Acrobat.

There's a part in the song 7th son that reminds me of a section of War Pigs, but after checking them out next to each other I realized that I'm sort of exagerating the similarities. There are similarities, though.

[NoseofNicko]

Everyone is talking about the outro of The Prophecy, but what about the intro? Such a beautiful melody/harmony. The entire song is great though. Every song on SSOASS is great. Maiden's second best after SIT.

[TAC]

Everyone is talking about the outro of The Prophecy, but what about the intro? Such a beautiful melody/harmony.

Great point. Very true.

[DoctorAction]

Wonderful record. This was the first IM album that came out in my fandom. I was 14, Maiden was (and still is) the central art form in my being and i had rabidly consumed the existing back catalogue over the previous year or so.

I too think that CIPWM is weak but the riff is fantastic and the pre-solo Zeppeliny thing is cool. Apart from that, it's a perfect album for me.

MC, ID, TETMD, TP and OTGDY are my favourites but TC and SSOASS are ace too.

Things I notice:

The guitar sound is different from any other record. I think they were using Gallien Kruger amps or something? Quite like it though.
Bruce sounded at his absolute god-like best on this record. His phrasing is incredible. Seriously love listening to him on this.
The title track has a few features that I have become vexed by on Maiden records - the repeated phrase chorus; whoa-ohs (Heaven Can Wait was clearly THE watershed moment for Steve for this but I'll save my rant for TRATB off BoS); the mirroring of melodies too tightly across instruments (like WTWB on Final Frontier).

But yes, incredible album. Following this thread I pumped it up in the car on the way to work and screamed my lungs out.

[TAC]

Mosh's thread forced me to do a couple of things..
One was to go through my old concert pics and sort out, and two, was to scan them all in. Then assbucket fucks with me. Anyway, all of my Maiden pics have been moved to imgur and I reposted the pics I've posted so far in this thread. And I'm ready to go with the 7th Son pics and tour program, and my Bruce solo pics.

[Samsara]

Mosh's thread forced me to do a couple of things..
One was to go through my old concert pics and sort out, and two, was to scan them all in. Then assbucket fucks with me. Anyway, all of my Maiden pics have been moved to imgur and I reposted the pics I've posted so far in this thread. And I'm ready to go with the 7th Son pics and tour program, and my Bruce solo pics.

UP THE IRONS!

(and you're supposed to be chillin')

[Lowdz]

But the real killer of this album was that it came out at the same time as Operation:Mindcrime. An album I was worshipping - still do.

I remember the Kerrang review of SSoaSS. They were gushing about it and how it was more cohesive and a better story than Mindcrime but I couldn't see it. Was there a story?

I never was stuck comparing the two albums. I loved them both. O:M relegitimized Queensryhe in my eyes after RFO. 7th Son took my favorite band and improved on what they do.

And I know you'll appreciate this Paul, but in 1988, Kerrang was basically an Iron Maiden fanzine at that point.
[/quote]

I don't think it was really a case of comparing them - SSoaSS just didn't get a look in as I played the hell out of O:M. It didn't get the chance to become loved in the same way.

Thinking about it, I was also listening to all the Shrapnel label shredders and Maiden's guitarists didn't compare.so I think this didn't help the album at the time.

I certainly don't dislike it - far from it - but it suffered because of those other factors.

[TAC]

(and you're supposed to be chillin')

Oh, I'm chillin'. The down time was the perfect opportunity to do the assbucket to imgur thing.

Over the next few days, I'm going to start writing my discussion points for the next few albums. There is so much to chew on, I want to make sure I get it all down, while I'm laid up.

[PowerSlave]

The down time was the perfect opportunity to do the assbucket to imgur thing.

You have to quit calling it that. I keep getting a mental image of some strange fetish site every time I read that.