Mike Portnoy's "Prog Metal" supergroup: Sons of Apollo

[bill1971]

I agree regarding MP back in DT. It would be too much drama. Mike is a good-hearted person I could see him when he turns maybe sixty or so regretting some of the things he has said and maybe felt more happy that DT was able to carry on and be happy for Mangini.

[Madman Shepherd]

I mean if Slash and Axl can makeup then maybe anybody can but Slash and Axl also had hundreds of millions of dollars at stake.  Also, even at their worst, they never insulted each others music and Slash is also playing post-Slash songs. 

In DT, I could see a Portnoy reunion bringing a temporary bump of a few hundred people per show maximum but it would level off after the first tour and go back to normal numbers.  With the added problems I doubt it'd be worth it for them unless Mike had a big change of heart like bill was talking about. 

[Mosh]

MP around an hour ago on his forum:

DTF?? That's still a "thing"
Hahahaha worse trolls than Blabbermouth over there...   
 
Life is so much better without reading their negativity every day...
And the music world is soooooo much bigger than the silly little bubble they all seem to live in...
Their loss!   

I guess he can't help himself

FFS. I just don't know what to say anymore.

I give Mike a lot of credit on a lot of things and try not to harp on the negative aspects, but shit like this just makes it difficult.

Edit: Not to mention than this forum that's "still a thing?" is more active in most if not all common metrics than his forum currently is.

This. What a stupid comment.

[PetFish]

All kidding aside, I think this is why we will never see Mike Portnoy back in Dream Theater.  He says he is friends with three of the members but I can't see that as anything more than them trying to keep the peace.  While Petrucci doesn't keep up with the online musings of people like us, I doubt he is totally oblivious to Mike's outbursts like this one.  I doubt it's worth the temporary bump in ticket sales to deal with this not to mention the inner workings of the band.

"Is your name 'Hammer'?  Cuz you hit the nail on the head."  I think I read that somewhere here. 

MP has totally lost his marbles and it looks like he's taking Derek along with him.  He's so bitter and grudge-filled I'm sure he'd make a great psychoanalytic thesis topic.

And, yes, he does read these forums but it's not a secret, his user name is well-known.

[The Silent Cody]

All kidding aside, I think this is why we will never see Mike Portnoy back in Dream Theater.  He says he is friends with three of the members but I can't see that as anything more than them trying to keep the peace.  While Petrucci doesn't keep up with the online musings of people like us, I doubt he is totally oblivious to Mike's outbursts like this one.  I doubt it's worth the temporary bump in ticket sales to deal with this not to mention the inner workings of the band.

"Is your name 'Hammer'?  Cuz you hit the nail on the head."  I think I read that somewhere here. 

MP has totally lost his marbles and it looks like he's taking Derek along with him.  He's so bitter and grudge-filled I'm sure he'd make a great psychoanalytic thesis topic.

And, yes, he does read these forums but it's not a secret, his user name is well-known.

I don't know his user name

[Bolsters]

I don't know, that recent comment makes me think he doesn't have a clue what actually goes on here.

• Where are the trolls he mentions? Anyone making posts like that here gets swiftly told to cut it out, if not being outright banned for it when deserving. This forum is not a haven for trolls.
• We're worse than Blabbermouth? In which universe? Certainly not the same one I'm in. We're at least constructive in our criticism here, all they do is talk shit in any Blabbermouth comments I've wasted my time reading.
• I'm not entirely sure what he's implying with the bubble comment. That we only give a shit about DT and anything that sounds like DT? There are definitely people like that here, but I find this forum to be pretty diverse in tastes and discussions on a lot of different styles and genres of music once you leave the DT subforum and spend time in General Music. Significantly more diversity and less bubble-like than his own forum is.

I think he maybe read a thread about himself on here once, ages ago, only really noticed the negative ones and the lack of blind fanboy praise that he gets from his own forum, and decided that we're all trolls. I'm not convinced that he actively reads this forum at all.

[rumborak]

Interesting how the Trump comparison has come up, because I actually think the two have some strong personality similarities. They both desire public adulation, and when they don't get it to the level they feel they deserve, they lash out at the people withholding it and construct a "me vs the world" narrative. They both also view themselves as PR masterminds, but on a regular basis stick their foot in their mouths with predictable results.

[IDontNotDoThings]

All kidding aside, I think this is why we will never see Mike Portnoy back in Dream Theater.  He says he is friends with three of the members but I can't see that as anything more than them trying to keep the peace.  While Petrucci doesn't keep up with the online musings of people like us, I doubt he is totally oblivious to Mike's outbursts like this one.  I doubt it's worth the temporary bump in ticket sales to deal with this not to mention the inner workings of the band.

"Is your name 'Hammer'?  Cuz you hit the nail on the head."  I think I read that somewhere here. 

MP has totally lost his marbles and it looks like he's taking Derek along with him.  He's so bitter and grudge-filled I'm sure he'd make a great psychoanalytic thesis topic.

And, yes, he does read these forums but it's not a secret, his user name is well-known.

I don't know his user name

chaossystem

[The Silent Cody]

All kidding aside, I think this is why we will never see Mike Portnoy back in Dream Theater.  He says he is friends with three of the members but I can't see that as anything more than them trying to keep the peace.  While Petrucci doesn't keep up with the online musings of people like us, I doubt he is totally oblivious to Mike's outbursts like this one.  I doubt it's worth the temporary bump in ticket sales to deal with this not to mention the inner workings of the band.

"Is your name 'Hammer'?  Cuz you hit the nail on the head."  I think I read that somewhere here. 

MP has totally lost his marbles and it looks like he's taking Derek along with him.  He's so bitter and grudge-filled I'm sure he'd make a great psychoanalytic thesis topic.

And, yes, he does read these forums but it's not a secret, his user name is well-known.

I don't know his user name

chaossystem

OK, it was quite easy to figure out

[Elite]

All kidding aside, I think this is why we will never see Mike Portnoy back in Dream Theater.  He says he is friends with three of the members but I can't see that as anything more than them trying to keep the peace.  While Petrucci doesn't keep up with the online musings of people like us, I doubt he is totally oblivious to Mike's outbursts like this one.  I doubt it's worth the temporary bump in ticket sales to deal with this not to mention the inner workings of the band.

"Is your name 'Hammer'?  Cuz you hit the nail on the head."  I think I read that somewhere here. 

MP has totally lost his marbles and it looks like he's taking Derek along with him.  He's so bitter and grudge-filled I'm sure he'd make a great psychoanalytic thesis topic.

And, yes, he does read these forums but it's not a secret, his user name is well-known.

I don't know his user name

chaossystem

[AngelBack]

All kidding aside, I think this is why we will never see Mike Portnoy back in Dream Theater.  He says he is friends with three of the members but I can't see that as anything more than them trying to keep the peace.  While Petrucci doesn't keep up with the online musings of people like us, I doubt he is totally oblivious to Mike's outbursts like this one.  I doubt it's worth the temporary bump in ticket sales to deal with this not to mention the inner workings of the band.

"Is your name 'Hammer'?  Cuz you hit the nail on the head."  I think I read that somewhere here. 

MP has totally lost his marbles and it looks like he's taking Derek along with him.  He's so bitter and grudge-filled I'm sure he'd make a great psychoanalytic thesis topic.

And, yes, he does read these forums but it's not a secret, his user name is well-known.

I don't know his user name

chaossystem

     I miss him....

[KevShmev]

I thought he was back under the Stadler handle...

[Stadler]

MP around an hour ago on his forum:

DTF?? That's still a "thing"
Hahahaha worse trolls than Blabbermouth over there...   
 
Life is so much better without reading their negativity every day...
And the music world is soooooo much bigger than the silly little bubble they all seem to live in...
Their loss!   


I guess he can't help himself
 

 


Now I'm waiting for some of Mike's blind followers to comment on this and try to explain to us how he's not saying anything wrong and that we're overreacting on everything he says

You know, the quasi-hip, oh-so-ironic "Inb4 some of Mike's blind followers [followed by disparaging comment that proves Mike is at least on to something, if not outright correct]" is tired.  TWO OF YOU had to say "Mike's blind followers" as if it is incomprehensible why someone would be "Team Mike" at this point (there are 100 reasons, not least of which is the music which still flows like water, and is still the best part of all of this).   Mike makes his post - which to be honest, I have not seen personally yet - and there are no less than 27 (24 if you take out the jokey ones and the one that claims I am him, he is me, and we are all together, goo goo gajoob) that pile on, including comparing him (not favorably, I might add) to the least popular and most polarizing President in the history of the union, and that INCLUDES Nixon.

Whether it was "right" or "wrong" is a matter of opinion; personally, not my style (a little confrontational for me), but so be it.  But he's not so unrooted to be out of the realm of reality, like some of you are implying.  I stuck up for him on the last go round and it was BRUTAL.  I'm not at all easily swayed (go to the P/R forum; or ask Jingle) but I felt rather unwelcome, and all for simply having the temerity to give Mike the benefit of the doubt.   For all your snarky confidence that you are right, I think some of you - not all, but some - have lost some perspective on just how brutal you can be.  Only SOME of you are actually truly interested in honest discussion about him and his music.  There are some of you here, well, that signature that is floating around (something to the effect of "Mike is always wrong, except when he's right, in which case he's still wrong" or something like that) is spot on. 

[King Postwhore]

Well I can separate my love for his music to my disbelief of his posting.  I still can't believe he cannot filter his emotions in his posts.  (It's ironic thst it's self inflicted)

It still won't stop me from following 95% of what he releases.

[Nick]

I stuck up for him on the last go round and it was BRUTAL.

Have you considered that not everything he is done is with sticking up for? It's an honest question. Often times it feels like you are doing it partially for the edgy look of going counter to everyone else. I have been very supportive of Mike's music, and have even tried multiple times in threads like Shattered Fortress to pull discussion away from the other crap back to the music. But why, when something like this happens would you go out of your way defend it?

[TAC]

   I stuck up for him on the last go round and it was BRUTAL.   

The last go round was brutal. And it seems to be getting worse. I think as time goes by, people are less connected to MP. I know I am. Sons Of Apollo is the first thing I'm actually interested in, and it's been what, 7 years now?

But a lot of us here have been around for a long time and are not only big DT fans, but we're also big MP fans. He's a great musician, and as a fan, he was really a treat to follow while in DT with all the extras, etc...

I've always said that DT was my favorite band for many reasons, but Reason #1 was MP. Watching him perform, and the way he took care of the fans. That's why when he left it was such a blow. I was going to lose that.

I think a lot of people have moved past "disappointed" with his social media posts to "annoyed" with them as time and the connections drift away.

But I've also said that there's a fine line between criticism and being outright rude. I can't say there's aren't posts that are on the wrong side of it.

But MP insulting DTF is shooting himself in the foot. I've probably spent well over $1000 on DT between 1992 and 2010. I've been on DTF since 2004, and even joined the old board when SFAM came out.

I'm DTF and I'm insulted.

[mikeyd23]

I stuck up for him on the last go round and it was BRUTAL.

Have you considered that not everything he is done is with sticking up for? It's an honest question. Often times it feels like you are doing it partially for the edgy look of going counter to everyone else. I have been very supportive of Mike's music, and have even tried multiple times in threads like Shattered Fortress to pull discussion away from the other crap back to the music. But why, when something like this happens would you go out of your way defend it?

This. Stadler, I usually try to be pretty fair with MP (Nick is extremely fair and mostly positive with MP) but he (MP) basically dismissed and insulted a community you are apart of very directly. Not sure why you are cool with that...?

[The Walrus]

Remember, he's taking this life day by day to be indifferent. He's in diffa reeeent.

[IDontNotDoThings]

MP around an hour ago on his forum:

DTF?? That's still a "thing"
Hahahaha worse trolls than Blabbermouth over there...   
 
Life is so much better without reading their negativity every day...
And the music world is soooooo much bigger than the silly little bubble they all seem to live in...
Their loss!   


I guess he can't help himself
 

 


Now I'm waiting for some of Mike's blind followers to comment on this and try to explain to us how he's not saying anything wrong and that we're overreacting on everything he says

You know, the quasi-hip, oh-so-ironic "Inb4 some of Mike's blind followers [followed by disparaging comment that proves Mike is at least on to something, if not outright correct]" is tired.  TWO OF YOU had to say "Mike's blind followers" as if it is incomprehensible why someone would be "Team Mike" at this point (there are 100 reasons, not least of which is the music which still flows like water, and is still the best part of all of this).   Mike makes his post - which to be honest, I have not seen personally yet - and there are no less than 27 (24 if you take out the jokey ones and the one that claims I am him, he is me, and we are all together, goo goo gajoob) that pile on, including comparing him (not favorably, I might add) to the least popular and most polarizing President in the history of the union, and that INCLUDES Nixon.

Whether it was "right" or "wrong" is a matter of opinion; personally, not my style (a little confrontational for me), but so be it.  But he's not so unrooted to be out of the realm of reality, like some of you are implying.  I stuck up for him on the last go round and it was BRUTAL.  I'm not at all easily swayed (go to the P/R forum; or ask Jingle) but I felt rather unwelcome, and all for simply having the temerity to give Mike the benefit of the doubt.   For all your snarky confidence that you are right, I think some of you - not all, but some - have lost some perspective on just how brutal you can be.  Only SOME of you are actually truly interested in honest discussion about him and his music.  There are some of you here, well, that signature that is floating around (something to the effect of "Mike is always wrong, except when he's right, in which case he's still wrong" or something like that) is spot on.

1) The Trump thing was literally one post, & even then, there was context to that comparison (detailing how they portray themselves in an us vs them manner when not achieving their high self-standard for public reputation).

2) I only counted 12 posts (10 if you don't count posts just saying "I agree") since Mike's comment that were actually serious & not jokes

3) I don't see why the number of posts is relevant to how brutal we are. If 50 people replied to this quote saying "this post was kinda mediocre", are they being too brutal too?

4) Why are you acting like this is so out of proportion? After all, he directly insulted us. I'm not saying that two wrongs make a right, but were you honestly not expecting a reaction?

5) As some people have already pointed out, most of the thread when it isn't coming down to Mike's comments was actually speculating & discussing the new album. Clearly the implication that we don't understand his "music still flowing like water, and is still the best part of all of this" is false.

6) Even so, separation of artist from art is still a thing that should (& often does) happen.

7) Aside from those points, this statement doesn't really prove any of us wrong except "guys, you're being mean".

8) If that's honestly a concern to you that we're going too far, check with the mods, that's their job after all. They haven't said anything on the situation (at least not yet) & the rules explicitly state that stuff like name-calling & nonconstructive criticism (with direct reference to MP mind you). Hell, some of them have directly taken part in this thread, so I doubt it's really gotten too out of hand.

9) "Mike is always wrong, except when he's right, in which case he's still wrong" I'm pretty sure that's Hef's signature with Blob talking about him ("Hef is right on all things, except when I disagree with him, in which case he's probably still right"), so nice going there.

10) I sure do love how much of this post is dedicated to how the jokes we make towards you aren't funny. It really shows your objectivity in the situation


tl;dr git gud

Edit: wow, quadra-ninja'd 
Edit 2: Grammar is hard

[kaos2900]

It's pretty clear to me that MP is at war with anything Dream Theater related. The last few comments from him and Derek shows me that Sons of Apollo is in direct competition with DT, at least from their POV. I just don't understand the need to bash a whole community of people who may criticize his social media activity but for the most part still strongly support his musical output. MP is one of my favorite musicians of all time, hell just a week ago I met him at the meet and greet for the NMB show and he really was a nice guy. I just hope the Sons of Apollo camp quit with this childish snarkiness and let the music speak for itself. After all that's what it's all about right? A fan should never feel like they have to choose who to like because of some stupid high school type feud.

[mikeyd23]

It's pretty clear to me that MP is at war with anything Dream Theater related. The last few comments from him and Derek shows me that Sons of Apollo is in direct competition with DT, at least from their POV. I just don't understand the need to bash a whole community of people who may criticize his social media activity but for the most part still strongly support his musical output. MP is one of my favorite musicians of all time, hell just a week ago I met him at the meet and greet for the NMB show and he really was a nice guy. I just hope the Sons of Apollo camp quit with this childish snarkiness and let the music speak for itself. After all that's what it's all about right? A fan should never feel like they have to choose who to like because of some stupid high school type feud.

Good post. And all that kinda sucks because SoA is really his first project post-DT that I think could be really good. But all this extra stuff is literally making it harder for me to be excited about that band.

[kaos2900]

Also, glad to see that a lot of people on the MP Forum are sticking up for the DTF and there are some pretty direct comments to MP. Of course the discussion got shut down quick, but it would be nice to see MP post a response.

[The Walrus]

I post regularly on MP's forum but am not afraid to call BS regardless of who says it... keepin' them honest. Wait, that's Cooper's line...

[King Postwhore]

He mocks anything involved in his past but he is the reason he is so hurt.  He caused his own pain and then he lashes back all these years later instead of focusing on the positive of his new band.


I will buy the cd of course, I am seeing The Neal Morse Band tonight, but I cannot say I am happy about Mike and him not letting go.

[Lethean]

I find this whole thing to be incredibly sad.  When MP left DT, I was upset, shocked, worried, you name it.  I decided I wasn't going to take sides, and everything at the (very very) beginning seemed like it was going to be friendly between the two. 

As things started to get heated, I probably vacillated between the two - sometimes I felt more on MP's side and sometimes more on DT's.  As time went on however, MP's comments started to bother me more and more.  There is no reason any of us should have to be "team Mike" or "team DT."  We should be able to be fans of both if we like the music.  That should really be the only consideration - I like Flying Colors, I don't like Adrenaline Mob, I like ADTOE, it's all good. 

Some people truly don't like DT's output since MP left - fair enough.  Some don't like any of MP's, and that's OK too.  But most of us, I'm pretty sure, like at least something that both have done in the last 7 years.  We shouldn't have to choose.  To be fair - MP isn't coming out and asking us to choose, and I realize that.  However, his own comments and retweeting of negative comments is like one of the parents in a divorce constantly badmouthing the other.  DT isn't pushing any of that, and Mike is, and it just puts a really bad taste in my mouth.  I try not to let it affect my interest in his projects, but I can't help it.  It does.  Why can't he just stop?  Say "the more the merrier" and welcome people who are still fans of DT and don't want to constantly see that crap?

I haven't even been on this forum for a whole year, have only posted a little bit, and even I feel that comment of his is totally ridiculous.

[AngelBack]

IF MP were smart about this, he would use DTF to his advantage.  I'm sure if he kept things civil and positive Bosk would have no problem with him here.  He could engage the fans, speak enthusiastically about DT and his post DT work, share info about his projects and in the end probably drive up his concert and album revenue by winning over those with a sour attitude toward him and maybe making some new fans.

[bosk1]

As I mentioned in a message to someone else who forwarded Mike's comment to me, sadly, this doesn't surprise me in the least.  Despite the fact that I allow people to express constructive criticism along with praise, this site is and has always been first and foremost a fan-run public relations vehicle to promote the band.  Sad that he doesn't get that and never has.  He also can't seem to grasp that this site is full of MP fans, including the guy that run it (i.e., me).  And that's a bummer for him because he's turning people off rather than taking advantage of the fact that this site could be used as another means to better promote all of his projects.  If he wanted us to, and would stop sniping at us (and me personally), I would be the first to say "Whatever I can do to help, Mike, just let me know and I'm onboard." 

[Stadler]

I stuck up for him on the last go round and it was BRUTAL.

Have you considered that not everything he is done is with sticking up for? It's an honest question. Often times it feels like you are doing it partially for the edgy look of going counter to everyone else. I have been very supportive of Mike's music, and have even tried multiple times in threads like Shattered Fortress to pull discussion away from the other crap back to the music. But why, when something like this happens would you go out of your way defend it?

Of course I do.  I'm not a real fan of the comment about DTF, and not just because I post here.  It's not necessary.  I'm more bugged by the notion that I can't stick up for ANYTHING without being a "blind follower".   I'm not defending what he said (I even said "not something I would have done; too confrontational" or something like that).   I'm pushing back on the TWO posts that said "Mike's blind followers", as if it is incomprehensible that anyone would give him even the slightest benefit of the doubt.    We can all disagree and be fair about it.  We don't have to engage in the sort of ad homimem arguments (that is, argue the merit of the DEBATOR as opposed to the argument itself) that seem to also spring up around these discussions.   We don't need the commentary. 

[bosk1]

MP around an hour ago on his forum:

DTF?? That's still a "thing"
Hahahaha worse trolls than Blabbermouth over there...   
 
Life is so much better without reading their negativity every day...
And the music world is soooooo much bigger than the silly little bubble they all seem to live in...
Their loss!   


I guess he can't help himself
 

 


Now I'm waiting for some of Mike's blind followers to comment on this and try to explain to us how he's not saying anything wrong and that we're overreacting on everything he says

You know, the quasi-hip, oh-so-ironic "Inb4 some of Mike's blind followers [followed by disparaging comment that proves Mike is at least on to something, if not outright correct]" is tired.  TWO OF YOU had to say "Mike's blind followers" as if it is incomprehensible why someone would be "Team Mike" at this point (there are 100 reasons, not least of which is the music which still flows like water, and is still the best part of all of this).   Mike makes his post - which to be honest, I have not seen personally yet - and there are no less than 27 (24 if you take out the jokey ones and the one that claims I am him, he is me, and we are all together, goo goo gajoob) that pile on, including comparing him (not favorably, I might add) to the least popular and most polarizing President in the history of the union, and that INCLUDES Nixon.

Whether it was "right" or "wrong" is a matter of opinion; personally, not my style (a little confrontational for me), but so be it.  But he's not so unrooted to be out of the realm of reality, like some of you are implying.  I stuck up for him on the last go round and it was BRUTAL.  I'm not at all easily swayed (go to the P/R forum; or ask Jingle) but I felt rather unwelcome, and all for simply having the temerity to give Mike the benefit of the doubt.   For all your snarky confidence that you are right, I think some of you - not all, but some - have lost some perspective on just how brutal you can be.  Only SOME of you are actually truly interested in honest discussion about him and his music.  There are some of you here, well, that signature that is floating around (something to the effect of "Mike is always wrong, except when he's right, in which case he's still wrong" or something like that) is spot on.

1) The Trump thing was literally one post, & even then, there was context to that comparison (detailing how they portray themselves in an us vs them manner when not achieving their high self-standard for public reputation).

2) I only counted 12 posts (10 if you don't count posts just saying "I agree") since Mike's comment that were actually serious & not jokes

3) I don't see why the number of posts is relevant to how brutal we are. If 50 people replied to this quote saying "this post was kinda mediocre", are they being too brutal too?

4) Why are you acting like this is so out of proportion? After all, he directly insulted us. I'm not saying that two wrongs make a right, but were you honestly not expecting a reaction?

5) As some people have already pointed out, most of the thread when it isn't coming down to Mike's comments was actually speculating & discussing the new album. Clearly the implication that we don't understand his "music still flowing like water, and is still the best part of all of this" is false.

6) Even so, separation of artist from art is still a thing that should (& often does) happen.

7) Aside from those points, this statement doesn't really prove any of us wrong except "guys, you're being mean".

8) If that's honestly a concern to you that we're going too far, check with the mods, that's their job after all. They haven't said anything on the situation (at least not yet) & the rules explicitly state that stuff like name-calling & nonconstructive criticism (with direct reference to MP mind you). Hell, some of them have directly taken part in this thread, so I doubt it's really gotten too out of hand.

9) "Mike is always wrong, except when he's right, in which case he's still wrong" I'm pretty sure that's Hef's signature with Blob talking about him ("Hef is right on all things, except when I disagree with him, in which case he's probably still right"), so nice going there.

10) I sure do love how much of this post is dedicated to how the jokes we make towards you aren't funny. It really shows your objectivity in the situation


tl;dr git gud

Edit: wow, quadra-ninja'd 
Edit 2: Grammar is hard

IDontNotDoThings, you nailed it 100%.  Stadler, as someone who more often than not (not always, but more often than not) backs you in P/R for your reasoning, you have not displayed that same reasoning and objectivity in this thread.  You are completely off base on this.  Criticism of Mike's specific statement and/or actions (or anyone else's, for that matter), whether well-taken or not, are allowed as long as they do not become personal shots at his character.  Those that cross the line are called out by the mod/admin team and promptly dealt with.  But constructive criticism is and has always been allowed, provided it is constructive and tactful.  Not everyone has the same ability frame things in a way that comes across as constructive or tactful, so there will always be borderline posts on a LOT of different topics here that may come across as a bit more harsh than what someone subjectively believes should be posted.  But that is VERY hard to regulate, and I typically err on the side of letting people talk and hash it out rather than me stepping in every time I think something toes the line.  I say all that to say that, yeah, the site isn't perfect.  But it is a far, FAR cry from being the bash-fest that you are implying it is.  It isn't and never has been anything close to that.  You really aren't being objective here.

[Stadler]

I stuck up for him on the last go round and it was BRUTAL.

Have you considered that not everything he is done is with sticking up for? It's an honest question. Often times it feels like you are doing it partially for the edgy look of going counter to everyone else. I have been very supportive of Mike's music, and have even tried multiple times in threads like Shattered Fortress to pull discussion away from the other crap back to the music. But why, when something like this happens would you go out of your way defend it?

This. Stadler, I usually try to be pretty fair with MP (Nick is extremely fair and mostly positive with MP) but he (MP) basically dismissed and insulted a community you are apart of very directly. Not sure why you are cool with that...?

Who said I was "cool" with that?  In fact, I'm not.  I'm (hopefully) meeting him Friday at the NMB concert, and - this from a guy that's been on stage, I've played in front of a thousand people, I've spoken to groups at least that size, I've met celebrities before, etc. - I'm actually nervous.  Do I say I'm "Stadler"?  Do I shut my mouth?  Is it okay to bring "Images and Words" to be signed (I bought it in '92 on release, and it has been a top ten album all time for me since that point)?   And then to hear him completely slag off a place where I have something like a brazillion posts... no, it doesn't feel good.  But then again, I'm not easily offended, and more importantly, the arbiter of whether something is right/appropriate/legit or not is not now and never has been "am I offended"?  Whether I'm offended or not in my view doesn't factor in. 

[Samsara]

It is really sad MP has taken that tone regarding this forum. Then again, it's not unique to this place. I remember Tate being the same way toward my old forum. The thing is, public figures (which Mike is, unlike most of all of us) with thin skin don't like not being in control of what is said about them. On one hand, I think we all get that. On the other hand, Mike could make an effort to see what really goes on at this place, and see that it does a fine job of PROMOTING him, it just doesn't kiss his ass.

As bosk1 said, had MP just reached out to him and tried to work together to promote MP's projects, I am sure that would happen in a positive manner, as long as people retained their right to be respectfully critical. But MP's ego (I assume -- I don't really know) doesn't allow for that. It really is a shame. I know MP has some personal friends on here. I'm not telling those of you who fit that description to do something you don't want to do, but it would benefit Mike and this community to broker a more positive discussion between MP and bosk1, so MP has a better understanding of how this place is run, and that it DOES support him, and bosk1 can better understand why MP is frustrated.

We're all grown ups. It'd be nice if a grown up approach was taken, instead of little spiteful comments. Just my .02 based on more than a decade in the same position as bosk1. 

[mikeyd23]

Who said I was "cool" with that?  In fact, I'm not.  I'm (hopefully) meeting him Friday at the NMB concert, and - this from a guy that's been on stage, I've played in front of a thousand people, I've spoken to groups at least that size, I've met celebrities before, etc. - I'm actually nervous.  Do I say I'm "Stadler"?  Do I shut my mouth?  Is it okay to bring "Images and Words" to be signed (I bought it in '92 on release, and it has been a top ten album all time for me since that point)?   And then to hear him completely slag off a place where I have something like a brazillion posts... no, it doesn't feel good.  But then again, I'm not easily offended, and more importantly, the arbiter of whether something is right/appropriate/legit or not is not now and never has been "am I offended"?  Whether I'm offended or not in my view doesn't factor in.

Oh don't get me wrong, I'm not offended by what MP said, I just think it was out of line and that he shouldn't have said it. Oh, I also think what he said is simply wrong, as others have pointed out, his view of this place seems to be forever skewed for whatever reason.

[Stadler]

10) I sure do love how much of this post is dedicated to how the jokes we make towards you aren't funny. It really shows your objectivity in the situation

I was going to let this go as rehashing what we've already said, but I have to respond to this.   What "jokes"?   "Mike's blind followers" is not a "joke" and I'm not sure you can insinuate that it is with any credibility.  I have no problem taking jokes at my expense - in fact, I'm used to it from my offline life; it's how my friends and I interact (we've had, more than once, someone "outside" say "do you guys know each other?  Is everything cool?").  I have an exceedingly thick skin when I know there's at least a modicum of affection behind it.  There's no "affection" behind "Mike's blind followers". It's just contempt and thinly veiled at that. 

The only other thing I can think of is Kev's comment, which was hilarious (and I only mentioned it to purposefully exclude it from the serious post count).

We'd have been fine here if the thread was "posting of Mike's comments" and "suitable response to it, pro or con".   Instead, it was SO heavy handed that we had to make sure that we insulted those that felt a shade more compassion for Mike and who might be inclined to give him the benefit of the doubt.  That's the only reason I posted about it.

[bosk1]

The thing is, public figures (which Mike is, unlike most of all of us) with thin skin don't like not being in control of what is said about them.

This perhaps gets to the root of why I take Mike's attitude and comments toward this place very personally and find them very hurtful.  Yeah, as much as I try to let it roll off and keep positive, I'll go ahead and just say it bluntly:  I am personally very hurt by Mike's comments.  And a big reason behind that is that I completely get what you just said and try to be VERY aware of it.  As much as a lot of artists talk about having a thick skin when it comes to reading criticism of their own work, it's got to be VERY hard.  Yeah, they are public figures.  And on one hand, that means they SHOULD maybe just be able to be objective and let criticism roll of their back.  But the other side of that is, art of any kind tends to be a VERY personal thing.  You aren't "just a public figure."  As an artist, you are a public figure that often really puts yourself out there in the public in a very personal and vulnerable way when you share your personal art with the public.  That makes it hard to see your art criticized, EVEN WHEN THE CRITICS MEAN IT CONSTRUCTIVELY.  And to make matters worse, even professional critics often tend to be harsh and insensitive.  Then you add in the modern problem of social media where EVERYBODY has a platform and many do not have an appropriate filter.  It's hard for an artist.  It really is.

So that being said, the reason comments like Mike's bother me personally is because I have gone out of my way to acknowledge that I get that.  I have said as much on this forum repeatedly when I feel that "constructive criticism" is no longer constructive and crossed the line.  It underlies my very philosophy on how I run this forum.  And I have told Mike Portnoy that to his face.  I have gone out of my way to be sensitive to the feelings of the artists we post about on this forum.  So to more or less have that thrown back in my face doesn't sit well with me at all.

On the other hand, Mike could make an effort to see what really goes on at this place, and see that it does a fine job of PROMOTING him, it just doesn't kiss his ass.

Bingo.

I'm not telling those of you who fit that description to do something you don't want to do, but it would benefit Mike and this community to broker a more positive discussion between MP and bosk1, so MP has a better understanding of how this place is run, and that it DOES support him, and bosk1 can better understand why MP is frustrated.

Thanks for that.  But the thing is, somebody who posts here that is very close to Mike (I won't say his name in case he doesn't necessarily want to be drawn into this) HAS told him that in the past.  And I have told Mike the same to his face.  He has been told unequivocally that I and this forum support him.  More than once.  By more than one person.  The only thing I can conclude is that he is just too stubborn to look past his own feelings to care. 

[Skeever]

Mike's got a bad attitude, but he's not wrong about the music bubble. 

When I click on the music subforum here and see the bands with threads on the first page, I do tend to think to myself "huh... you'd think people stopped making good music 20 years ago"