2017 NFL thread v. Patriots Dynasty

[Dublagent66]

While I'm certainly happy to see the Giant's season collapse out from under them, it's a shame to see ODB2 go down. Always a loss when somebody so exciting goes out.

He's a good player but highly immature.  Maybe the injury will humble him and give him time to grow up a little.

[PowerSlave]

I don't hate Tomlin. Much of the fan base despises him, but the answer is yes. The problem, in this case, lies at the top. I hope he gets it figured out soon.

I think, at this point, Tomlin is who he is as a coach.  Like Colin Cowherd often says, the Steelers under him are never "buttoned up."  Heck, Roethlisberger has taken several indirect shots at him in the past year.  I think Ben is frustrated at seeing his last years play out on a team that often looks unprepared and/or unfocused.

  Tomlin is Haley's boss, so yeah... And I don't mean to harp on Haley, but seriously, there is valid criticism for him at this point.

I think the coaches, starting with Tomlin, are too worried about keeping Antonio Brown happy.  He throws that tantrum last week, and boom, gets 19 targets the following game. Between his FB nonsense last year in the playoffs and his tantrum last week, Brown gets away with everything, and Tomlin refuses to do anything to get him to knock it off. Can you imagine a player pulling that nonsense under Belichick??

I miss Bill Cowher. He wasn't anymore successful than Tomlin has been, but I prefer how he handled these kinds of situations. He was too much of a hard-ass to allow these kinds of things.

That being said, I do believe it's within Tomlin's power to right the ship. When jobs get put on the line it could be the perfect situation to see what he's made of.

Couple of things. First off, I think Ben is frustrated with several things Steelers-related at the moment. Tomlin is one, AB is definitely one. And I think he's clearly frustrated with himself, and rightfully so. Second, it should be clear to most at this point that AB is a distraction at best, a locker room cancer at worst and has zero interest in winning, only interest in his own gain. How many SBs have the Steelers won with AB? Oh yeah, none... and they clearly don't look like they are on the brink of doing so. And lastly, no way Cowher would have put up with this stuff, but that said, every coach is different and handles these things differently.

Imagine if Cowher had a QB the caliber of Roethlisberger for all of his career like Tomlin has.  I am actually shocked he hasn't made the Hall of Fame yet.

Bingo. Cowher had years and years of horrible talent to work with at QB (Slash!!), if Bill had Ben through the entirety of Ben's career I'd wager Ben would have possibly 4 championships at this point rather than 2. And in terms of championships, 4 is way, way more than 2.

I hold a very unpopular opinion when it comes to the qb's that the team had prior to Ben while under Cowher. I don't think that they are as bad as most people think. Neil O'Donnell was a great fit for the team, and if he hadn't left after the super bowl season I believe that they would have went to another.

As far as Kordell Stewart goes, yes he was a disappointment, but he played mvp caliber football the year that Tom Brady emerged and beat them in the afc championship.

[mikeyd23]

I hold a very unpopular opinion when it comes to the qb's that the team had prior to Ben while under Cowher. I don't think that they are as bad as most people think. Neil O'Donnell was a great fit for the team, and if he hadn't left after the super bowl season I believe that they would have went to another.

As far as Kordell Stewart goes, yes he was a disappointment, but he played mvp caliber football the year that Tom Brady emerged and beat them in the afc championship.

Fair points. I wasn't a fan of Neil and outside of that one really killer year, Stewart was average at best. But good point about Brady, I forget sometimes that he's been killing the Steelers for that long. That was what, 15 or 16  years ago?

[PowerSlave]

I hold a very unpopular opinion when it comes to the qb's that the team had prior to Ben while under Cowher. I don't think that they are as bad as most people think. Neil O'Donnell was a great fit for the team, and if he hadn't left after the super bowl season I believe that they would have went to another.

As far as Kordell Stewart goes, yes he was a disappointment, but he played mvp caliber football the year that Tom Brady emerged and beat them in the afc championship.

Fair points. I wasn't a fan of Neil and outside of that one really killer year, Stewart was average at best. But good point about Brady, I forget sometimes that he's been killing the Steelers for that long. That was what, 15 or 16  years ago?

Off the top of my head, I want to say it was January 2002. It was the game after the infamous tuck rule game between the Raiders and patriots. I could have the year wrong, though. I think the steelers had a really great record in the regular season that year.

Something else that sticks in mind about that game is that Jerome Bettis got a pain injection just prior to kick off, and whoever gave it to him screwed up and hit an artery. He couldn't play that day.

[mikeyd23]

Googled it. We were close, it was 2001. 2002 was the year he got benched for big bad Tommy Maddox.

[KevShmev]

Cowher had years and years of horrible talent to work with at QB (Slash!!), if Bill had Ben through the entirety of Ben's career I'd wager Ben would have possibly 4 championships at this point rather than 2. And in terms of championships, 4 is way, way more than 2.

I think a big part of Ben bemoans not having a great coach for most of his career. He was spoiled by Cowher early on, and now it is galling for him to play the Patriots and see them always get taken apart because they are so always so well coached and prepared.  He has to be thinking, "Dang, what if I had had that coach for my whole career."

   I don't have anything against Tomlin, though I don't like his "wolf pack" mentality as a coach, but this is where coaching comes into play.   Would you rather have Yngwie - really, REALLY good at one thing, and pretty much one thing only, or would you rather have Steve Morse or Steve Howe - very good at most everything in that context.   I think Tomlin is a Super Bowl coach when everything aligns for him.  Players are healthy, no controversy, etc.   I think Cowher is a Super Bowl coach even when NOTHING is aligning for him.

Agreed.  I mean, Cowher got to a Super Bowl with Neil O'Donnell as his QB and was thisclose to beating the Cowboys dynasty in that Super Bowl (if not for said QB throwing a horrible pick at the end). 

As far as Kordell Stewart goes, yes he was a disappointment, but he played mvp caliber football the year that Tom Brady emerged and beat them in the afc championship.

Yep, and he was really good in '97 until they lost to the Broncos in the AFCCG. 

Shoot, they lost that game in '01 thanks to the Patriots getting a blocked FG for a TD (that was possibly an illegal forward lateral) and a punt return for a TD. 

[DT2003]

While I'm certainly happy to see the Giant's season collapse out from under them, it's a shame to see ODB2 go down. Always a loss when somebody so exciting goes out.

He's a good player but highly immature.  Maybe the injury will humble him and give him time to grow up a little.

As a Giants fan and watching him from the beginning I’d be shocked if this humbled him at all. This guys talent is through the roof, but unfortunately he has gotten more and more immature over time. He is all about himself and he has proved that time and time again. I blame the coaches as well as from the time he became a Giant they have let this guy do whatever the hell he wants with no consequences and at this point I really feel like he’s too far gone to change.

[PowerSlave]

I just seen that Zeke Elliot lost his court case, and will start a 6 game suspension. Any thoughts on what this might mean for the team? I haven't seen any Cowboys games this year, and I have no idea how good of a season he's having.

[pogoowner]

I just seen that Zeke Elliot lost his court case, and will start a 6 game suspension. Any thoughts on what this might mean for the team? I haven't seen any Cowboys games this year, and I have no idea how good of a season he's having.

He's already appealing it again. They're on a bye this week, and it would not surprise me to see the suspension put on hold all over again. It's all up in the air right now.

[KevShmev]

Carson Wentz is really good and is just gonna get better.

Cam Newton is still a crappy passer.

[Destiny Of Chaos]

An ugly win but 5-1 is awesome!

[El Barto]

Cam Newton is still a crappy passer.

And a loser. That's a terrible combination. When things turn South he resigns himself, rather than getting fired up and trying to take the game back. Most quarterbacks would be really embarrassed about that last drive. Doubt he thinks much of it.

[KevShmev]

Yep, unless the refs called another chicken shit PI against Philly on either of those last two drives, I didn't think for a second that Newton would lead them down the field for a TD.  He was just chucking passes all over, with seemingly no clue how to run a 2-minute offense.  He is so easy to root against. I still take great pleasure in the Broncos having won that Super Bowl early last year by knocking the crap out of Newton, making him curl up like a sissy for that fumble, and then seeing him act like a crybaby in the post-game presser. So satisfying.

[Dublagent66]

LOL Panthers.  They had that game in the bag.  Superman strikes again.  Nothing more boring than watching the Beagles win.   

[Stadler]

Yep, unless the refs called another chicken shit PI against Philly on either of those last two drives, I didn't think for a second that Newton would lead them down the field for a TD.  He was just chucking passes all over, with seemingly no clue how to run a 2-minute offense.  He is so easy to root against. I still take great pleasure in the Broncos having won that Super Bowl early last year by knocking the crap out of Newton, making him curl up like a sissy for that fumble, and then seeing him act like a crybaby in the post-game presser. So satisfying.

I couldn't have expressed my feelings on the matter any better than that.  Perfectly said.

[TAC]

Yup. He should probably understand WTF a "rowt" is before he busts someone else's chops.

[KevShmev]

Cam in the post game presser:

"It's funny hearing female reporters talk about interceptions."

Okay, not really, but you can picture it.

[El Barto]

On Sunday, Russel Wilson through what should have been a game winning pick-six. He chased the guy down nearly 70 yards to save the game. Nobody could imagine Cam Newton doing that, boy has no heart, but more important is that the idea wouldn't even occur to him. He's just not a good football player.

[King Postwhore]

[TAC]

 

[El Barto]

Man, without St. Rogers I reckon Green Bay is a 4-12 team. They better hope he's alright.

[TAC]

Man, without St. Rogers Edelman I reckon Green Bay New England is a 4-12 team. 

Apparently.

[KevShmev]

I would ask if Edelman plays defense, but it appears as if no one on New England plays defense this year.

The injury to Rodgers sucks.  Hate to see the best player in the league get hurt.

[El Barto]

Man, without St. Rogers Edelman I reckon Green Bay New England is a 4-12 team. 

Apparently.

Edelman's not their problem. Least of their concerns. They're undisciplined as fuck. That's their problem.

[El Barto]

That McCown pass to burn Butler was a thing of beauty.

[TAC]

Man, without St. Rogers Edelman I reckon Green Bay New England is a 4-12 team. 

Apparently.

Edelman's not their problem. Least of their concerns. They're undisciplined as fuck. That's their problem.

Yeah, I was just playing on words. They are a total f'n mess.

[King Postwhore]

I haven't seen a Pats defense not disciplined like this in a long,  long.

[El Barto]

I haven't seen a Pats defense not disciplined like this in a long,  long.

When 2 yard runs always become 7 yard runs because you miss tackles you're going to lose every time. Miscommunications in the secondary are going to happen. Sometimes a QB/WR are going to burn you. These things happen. That's why you can't afford to give up plays by blowing the easy stuff.

[KevShmev]

Officials are on their side today, though.

Picked up a flag on a helmet to helmet that halted a Jets drive that could have given them a 3-score lead.

And just called a bull shit PI on the Jets in the end zone that basically gifted them 7.

Yay for the NFL.

[TAC]

Right. If they lose, they definitely can't bitch about the officials. At least not at this point.

[lordxizor]

The injury to Rodgers sucks.  Hate to see the best player in the league get hurt.

It does suck indeed. It really bugged me though that there was even a conversation about whether the hit should have been a penalty. It was a clean hit that the player followed through until the QB was down. Rogers was obviously upset about it. It bugs me so much how QBs are babied and how much they expect the be babied.

[TAC]

Another great call by the officials!

[KevShmev]

Looks like Kraft is calling in some "you owe me" favors.

[King Postwhore]

Looks like Kraft is calling in some "you owe me" favors.

What is this Chinese you're speaking?

[TAC]

Looks like Kraft is calling in some "you owe me" favors.