- " The Astonishing " - One Year -- er, SEVEN YEARS On.

[Ben_Jamin]

We will definitely hear songs from The Astonishing live in the future. There's no way DT is going to pretend that album doesn't exist.

I find it hard to believe the album will be ignored, but they dropped those couple songs early the next tour and NOTHING has come back.  To me, that is Astonishing from DT. 

Also, to me, it's sad.  The album is pretty good for my ears, but being so long and with most of the tracks not being stand outs on their own (usually best to listen to groupings of songs) it's very easy to see why people don't like it.  Even with me liking it, I don't think I've listened for years now.  There's just no reason to go back if you aren't going to listen to the whole thing and that's just very time consuming. 

I'm still just annoyed they didn't let fans take video of this tour.  There's just very limited options to seeing these songs live on youtube now.  The band really needed to either let go of stopping fans or released their own live recording.  It's a shame IMO.

They also dropped To Live Forever and Don't Look Past Me, and let's not forget they dropped The Great Debate as well during their first tour back. I wouldn't read into songs being dropped. If so, I'd blame the fans for not reacting the way the band expected to those songs so they decided to drop them. For myself, the band can play whatever the hell they want, even if it's a set with all their least fan favorite songs including, You Not Me and Raw Dog. I'd still go to that show, while I am sure many would not because the set isn't great, and then you wonder why the venue isn't sold well. 

I don't know, but I can listen to the songs without needing to listen to the album in full. I can put on The X Aspect and still enjoy the song. What ends up happening when I do play a single track from The Astonishing is I tend to want to listen to more songs from that album. 

It's not a shame they didn't let people record. It makes those shows more special, and it's not the bands fault. To me, this shows a lot about the fans entitlements and regrets.

If a band wants to make a show special and wants to keep it that way for the fans who did attend the shows, then why not keep people from recording and posting videos online? Just so entitled fans can bitch about the recording not sounding good, thinking thats how everything exactly sounded at that venue. Recordings can create some certain tonal changes and can make singers sound off-pitch.

The only way to get an actual live replica is to get the soundboard recordings.

I actually like what Tesla did one time, they offered up a Live cd of their show that night. You paid when you got to the venue, and if I remember correctly, you showed them your receipt before Def Leppard came on, which was after Scorpions, and then you got a CD-R of the show that night in a nicely designed digipak with album art (it wasn't anything intricate just black with the band logo and the title Live, Loud, and Proud). No mastering or mixing done whatsoever, just a straight up soundboard recording of the live show.

I have no idea if people bought the cds, but I did and I still listen to it quite a lot.

But as was also stated by Boskman...It was intended to be recorded, but then the whole booking snafu happened and the venue they probably had in mind maybe wasn't booked as well.

I find it fascinating how people now get upset if a band doesn't have live videos up on YouTube. I can't find hardly shit anything for God Forbid, but I am not upset, I find it fascinating that not many recorded their live shows. It's also funny how many people record the shows compared to how many actually get uploaded into YouTube, and if it's even easily possible to find the video without having to include the tags, because I am not scrolling through all those unrelated videos just to find the one in the depths of YouTube videos.

[KevShmev]

We will definitely hear songs from The Astonishing live in the future. There's no way DT is going to pretend that album doesn't exist.

I am not counting on it. They seem to have no problem ignoring songs from newer albums nowadays (1 from the self-titled and 3 from both Distance over Time and A View... all have still never been played), and they used to be a band that played everything at one point or another, even if something only got played a few times (see: You Not Me).  Granted, that was when they had less songs and albums, but with their dependency on static set lists now, it is just hard to cover too much nowadays, and they have to know by now that a lot of the fanbase wasn't wild about TA, so it will be easy for them to put it aside and just pick songs from their many other albums going forward.  It sucks, but it is what it is.

[nobloodyname]

Just so entitled fans can bitch about the recording not sounding good, thinking thats how everything exactly sounded at that venue. Recordings can create some certain tonal changes and can make singers sound off-pitch.

You know they're digital recordings rather than C90s in Walkmans these days, right?

[EPIC Outro]

Just because DT hasn't yet played certain songs from DT12, DOT, and AVFTTOTW doesn't mean they won't. I believe it will all happen in due time.

[Ben_Jamin]

Just because DT hasn't yet played certain songs from DT12, DOT, and AVFTTOTW doesn't mean they won't. I believe it will all happen in due time.

With the way people are talking about JLBs vocals and playing songs suitable to his voice. Those songs not played are pretty vocally demanding. So if they did get their way, none of these songs would be played. Especially S2N and Answering The Call. 

[jsbru]

Put in The Astonishing for the first time in about a year this weekend while sitting around waiting for the Porcupine Tree show to start.  This album is pure musical genius.  Gets better with age.

My post early in this thread stated I'd rate it my 4th favorite DT album.  I have to move it up to 3 at this point.  I usually don't care whether people like the same music as I do, but for whatever reason, I take the negative reception this album faced personally.  It's not that far removed from Metropolis 2 stylistically--an album that gets an almost universally positive reaction from DT fans.  If anything, the songwriting on this is more concise and melodic, and there's less meandering through aimless hyper-progressive jams, which have their place in DT's repertoire, of course, but I think they have a tendency to overdo them and have them in far too many songs just for the sake of having them, even if it doesn't fit from a songwriting perspective.  This is a stunning and dynamic epic, with multiple layers, traversing multiple styles, but the melodic hooks are simple and easy to digest.  Some specific highlights:

• I think Petrucci's outro solo in A New Beginning is possibly the best of his entire career.  Helps that the underlying chord progression lays a fantastic foundation.
• The much-maligned second act actually finishes very strong.  Losing Fayth through A New World is an incredibly epic and stunning finale, and Hymn of a Thousand Voices is one of the most beautiful snippets of music this band has ever written!
• I think this is Mangini's best album with the band, too.  His style of drumming matches this style of music really well.  There's a couple of fills in here that are absolutely astounding.
• David Campbell's orchestration is something to behold.  It really gives this album sonic depth, even compared to other DT albums/songs that used orchestra.

This is DT at their creative peak, and 100 years from now, will be looked upon as their crowning achievement.  Perhaps an album before its time.  Or maybe after it's time.  Since I really think the peak of rock music composition and listenership occurred during the 70s, when people's attention spans were not chewed up by a constant din of technological stimuli like social media and cell phones.  Perhaps this album belongs in the era of The Who's Tommy, Yes's Tales of Topographic Oceans, Rush's 2112, or Genesis's Lamb Lies Down on Broadway.  I think it surpasses all four of those albums though, and stands on its own as one of the best concept albums ever written.  This isn't an album that delivers instantly on first listen.  Like a lot of good prog rock, it has to be digested with patience and discretion.  And once it is, its melodic story really comes to life.

Why?

Or, perhaps a better question is, does someone else's opinion change how you feel? If not, why get upset if others disagree with you (for the record, I have the opposite take on this album, but I enjoyed reading your post and it reminded me that I'd been meaning to revisit this album).

Well, preceding the part you highlighted, I made the point of saying that I don't normally feel this way.  So it's rare.  This album is really the only one I feel that way about, to be honest.

I just don't see what's so different about this album and some of their earlier, less heavy work, especially from I&W and Metropolis 2.  I mean, if you think the sound is too "Disney" or too melody-focused, why don't people hate songs like Another Day, Surrounded, The Spirit Carries On, and Finally Free?  There's also corny sound effects in Metropolis 2.  Also, who cares about the story?  The story in 2112 is at least as bad, and that album gets almost universal praise from prog fans.  Lamb Lies Down on Broadway is arguably worse.  Operation Mindcrime?  Totally flaky story, but amazing music.  Tales of Topographic Oceans is about a footnote in some Buddhist text, for chrissakes, although to be fair, there are a lot of people that also shit on that album.  But you listen to prog concept albums for the music, not for the storytelling.

Nothing on this album is super different than anything they've done before, aside from the scope--but big scope is something I would expect prog rock fans, more than anyone else, would understand and connect with.

Oh well.  I think what makes me mad is the fact that this was exactly what I wanted the band to do--take a big risk with something different, and also go in a less heavy and more proggy direction, which is what I fell makes I&W one of their most popular albums.  But then a faction of longtime fans didn't just not like it, they felt the need to viscerally trash it in a way that was disrespectful to the band's creative genius and all the work that went into it.  It seemed pretty bratty to me, I suppose.

[TheOutlawXanadu]

I have no problem with The Astonishing being criticized, even though I personally think very positively of it. What did make me roll my eyes a bit was when the people who were criticizing the band for being predictable and not taking risks were the same people who were banging on The Astonishing the hardest. You simply can't win with some people, which I think is intentional at times.

[gzarruk]

Also, who cares about the story?  The story in 2112 is at least as bad, and that album gets almost universal praise from prog fans.  Lamb Lies Down on Broadway is arguably worse.  Operation Mindcrime?  Totally flaky story, but amazing music.  Tales of Topographic Oceans is about a footnote in some Buddhist text, for chrissakes, although to be fair, there are a lot of people that also shit on that album.  But you listen to prog concept albums for the music, not for the storytelling.

This. The lyrics in TA are quite cheesy at times but the whole composition, arrangement and recording are pure gold. Sure, it's not the best concept album ever witnessed by humankind, but it does get a lot on unnecessary hate among DT fans, which leads us to...

What did make me roll my eyes a bit was when the people who were criticizing the band for being predictable and not taking risks were the same people who were banging on The Astonishing the hardest. You simply can't win with some people, which I think is intentional at times.

And because reception for TA was mixed at best, they're now back at "playing it safe" for what could be the rest of their career. Not that I'm complaining, I love those albums, specially the latest , but I just don't think they'll have another huge venture into uncharted waters any time soon.

[WilliamMunny]

Put in The Astonishing for the first time in about a year this weekend while sitting around waiting for the Porcupine Tree show to start.  This album is pure musical genius.  Gets better with age.

My post early in this thread stated I'd rate it my 4th favorite DT album.  I have to move it up to 3 at this point.  I usually don't care whether people like the same music as I do, but for whatever reason, I take the negative reception this album faced personally.  It's not that far removed from Metropolis 2 stylistically--an album that gets an almost universally positive reaction from DT fans.  If anything, the songwriting on this is more concise and melodic, and there's less meandering through aimless hyper-progressive jams, which have their place in DT's repertoire, of course, but I think they have a tendency to overdo them and have them in far too many songs just for the sake of having them, even if it doesn't fit from a songwriting perspective.  This is a stunning and dynamic epic, with multiple layers, traversing multiple styles, but the melodic hooks are simple and easy to digest.  Some specific highlights:

• I think Petrucci's outro solo in A New Beginning is possibly the best of his entire career.  Helps that the underlying chord progression lays a fantastic foundation.
• The much-maligned second act actually finishes very strong.  Losing Fayth through A New World is an incredibly epic and stunning finale, and Hymn of a Thousand Voices is one of the most beautiful snippets of music this band has ever written!
• I think this is Mangini's best album with the band, too.  His style of drumming matches this style of music really well.  There's a couple of fills in here that are absolutely astounding.
• David Campbell's orchestration is something to behold.  It really gives this album sonic depth, even compared to other DT albums/songs that used orchestra.

This is DT at their creative peak, and 100 years from now, will be looked upon as their crowning achievement.  Perhaps an album before its time.  Or maybe after it's time.  Since I really think the peak of rock music composition and listenership occurred during the 70s, when people's attention spans were not chewed up by a constant din of technological stimuli like social media and cell phones.  Perhaps this album belongs in the era of The Who's Tommy, Yes's Tales of Topographic Oceans, Rush's 2112, or Genesis's Lamb Lies Down on Broadway.  I think it surpasses all four of those albums though, and stands on its own as one of the best concept albums ever written.  This isn't an album that delivers instantly on first listen.  Like a lot of good prog rock, it has to be digested with patience and discretion.  And once it is, its melodic story really comes to life.

Why?

Or, perhaps a better question is, does someone else's opinion change how you feel? If not, why get upset if others disagree with you (for the record, I have the opposite take on this album, but I enjoyed reading your post and it reminded me that I'd been meaning to revisit this album).

Well, preceding the part you highlighted, I made the point of saying that I don't normally feel this way.  So it's rare.  This album is really the only one I feel that way about, to be honest.

I just don't see what's so different about this album and some of their earlier, less heavy work, especially from I&W and Metropolis 2.  I mean, if you think the sound is too "Disney" or too melody-focused, why don't people hate songs like Another Day, Surrounded, The Spirit Carries On, and Finally Free?  There's also corny sound effects in Metropolis 2.  Also, who cares about the story?  The story in 2112 is at least as bad, and that album gets almost universal praise from prog fans.  Lamb Lies Down on Broadway is arguably worse.  Operation Mindcrime?  Totally flaky story, but amazing music.  Tales of Topographic Oceans is about a footnote in some Buddhist text, for chrissakes, although to be fair, there are a lot of people that also shit on that album.  But you listen to prog concept albums for the music, not for the storytelling.

Nothing on this album is super different than anything they've done before, aside from the scope--but big scope is something I would expect prog rock fans, more than anyone else, would understand and connect with.

Oh well.  I think what makes me mad is the fact that this was exactly what I wanted the band to do--take a big risk with something different, and also go in a less heavy and more proggy direction, which is what I fell makes I&W one of their most popular albums.  But then a faction of longtime fans didn't just not like it, they felt the need to viscerally trash it in a way that was disrespectful to the band's creative genius and all the work that went into it.  It seemed pretty bratty to me, I suppose.

But then a faction of longtime fans didn't just not like it, they felt the need to viscerally trash it in a way that was disrespectful to the band's creative genius and all the work that went into it.

Who did this? That's a pretty sweeping generalization if you ask me.

"I think what makes me mad ....."

But why would you let something like the reaction to a record "make you mad?"

Listen, let me preface what I'm about to say with the following: I wasn't looking to pick a fight or call you out, and if my post came across that way then I apologize. My original question was born of sincere curiosity.

I literally know nothing about you, so what I'm about to say isn't to target you. That said, if someone truly gets upset/mad/annoyed with the reactions of others, I worry about them.

Perhaps it's generational, perhaps it's a sign of the times, but I've seen this with my own son: we, as a society, invest way to much time and energy in the perceived opinions of others.

So, without judgement or 'brattiness' or whatever else someone might perceive, I will say this: I think The Astonishing was a massive letdown. That is my opinion, and if it upsets someone else to read it, then so be it. 

Others love the record, and as a fan of Dream Theater, it pleases me that there's a portion of their fanbase enjoying The Astonishing–I wish I was among them, but I am not.

Alright, I've said my peace and I try my best to avoid repeating myself: carry on!

[Ben_Jamin]

Its more that there are people who use some pretty harsh word choices to express their opinion of it.

To me, this is one of the most beautiful, heart-warming, albums the band has done. I am one that does enjoy the story. I am also one who not only listens to the music, but I can enjoy the story for what it is. I don't need fancy, descriptive words. I do not mind a narrative that is straight forward. There's also so much you can do when creating a world with music, first off there's only so much words you can use to paint the picture, the music is utilized to paint that picture with the emotions music can convey.

[EPIC Outro]

I think it would be cool if they released a revamped version of The Astonishing with the gift of hindsight. I don't think they will, but it would be interesting to say the least.

[Awaken]

While there are definitely songs I skip when I revisit this album, I generally love a good portion of it.  I caught their live presentation in CT with my son and we both had a great time.  That memory definitely factors into my enjoyment when I do spin it.

[TheOutlawXanadu]

I re-listened to the first disc today. It's a lot for one sitting and there are a few songs I skip, but overall, I just really love this album. Dream Theater do cinematic, epic, orchestral music really well.

[cramx3]

Chosen just came on my random music library shuffle, first time I heard it in a long time, and I forgot just how good that ballad is.  The JP solo is    They really should throw this song into the live set for their ballad slow down part of the show.

[gzarruk]

Not my favorite of their ballads, but I agree it should be played more often, and I specially agree about that solo

No need to overplay TSCO when this one exists.

[Architeuthis]

I agree that Chosen should be a regular part of their setlist rotation. I prefer it over TSCO, and that's saying lot.

[TheBarstoolWarrior]

I have no problem with The Astonishing being criticized, even though I personally think very positively of it. What did make me roll my eyes a bit was when the people who were criticizing the band for being predictable and not taking risks were the same people who were banging on The Astonishing the hardest. You simply can't win with some people, which I think is intentional at times.

There's a right way to take risks and a wrong way. I am sure you wouldn't like it if DT16 turned out to be a reggae album.

The criticism was generally more about the specific direction of the Astonishing. They could have taken 'risks' in a billion other ways considering the genre they live in.

The band has gotten a little formulaic in some ways. I am sure it is very easy for them to change a few things around on the next album and keep things fresh, if they so choose. How about a bass solo for once after 16 albums? It's so predictable that the guitar and keys take all the solos, sometimes in the same order. That's just one small example off the top of my head. TA just went to far out to left field. It's one thing for DT to make an album that sounds like Planet X and another for them to make an album that sounds like Disney.

[KevShmev]

When did Dream Theater make an album that sounded like Disney?

Please note that answering "The Astonishing" is incorrect.

[TAC]

When did Dream Theater make an album that sounded like Disney?

Please note that answering "The Astonishing" is incorrect.

Correct. It was the Six Degrees Overture.

[Anguyen92]

I must reiterate.  Why is Disney being used in a way to express criticism?  Disney has had some pretty dang good songs in their soundtracks in their movies over their history.

[Trav86]

I must reiterate.  Why is Disney being used in a way to express criticism?  Disney has had some pretty dang good songs in their soundtracks in their movies over their history.

My thoughts exactly.

[Ben_Jamin]

I must reiterate.  Why is Disney being used in a way to express criticism?  Disney has had some pretty dang good songs in their soundtracks in their movies over their history.

Yes, Disney does have amazing songs. And some are even better when they're arranged as a metal song. Such as Jonathan Young's cover of The Bells of Notre Dame. He amplified that song to top tier quality because I feel that song, and also Hellfire, work extremely well in that metal style.

My favorite Disney soundtrack is Anastasia, I even bought the cd for it online. I've been pondering before, In The Dark of The Night would sound amazing as a metal song, so I searched YouTube for Metal covers, and this was how I discovered Jonathan Young.


I think it's funny though because the opposite is how I feel about The Astonishing. I wouldnt mind hearing a lot of these songs with different vocalists, mainly a female vocalist to sing Faythes parts. The iliminal (not capitalized because the "i" looks like an "L") cover of Act of Faythe with the female vocalist is the closest thing out there to what I hear in my head for the type of vocals I can hear for Faythe.

[Ben_Jamin]

I have no problem with The Astonishing being criticized, even though I personally think very positively of it. What did make me roll my eyes a bit was when the people who were criticizing the band for being predictable and not taking risks were the same people who were banging on The Astonishing the hardest. You simply can't win with some people, which I think is intentional at times.

There's a right way to take risks and a wrong way. I am sure you wouldn't like it if DT16 turned out to be a reggae album.

I actually wouldn't mind that at all. I think it would be neat, and they have done Reggae before with that part inserted into Learning to Live. I actually think it would be neat to hear a Progressive Reggae song.

The reason I don't mind is because first and foremost I enjoy music, regardless of genre. To me music is music and there's lots of fascinating music out there, such as the music of the birds, the music of the trees, and the music of the sea. Music to me just can't be grouped into a single category, music should be allowed to venture and explore the vastness of sounds these vibrations can make.

You are missing out on so much awesome music by limiting yourself to just one style of music.

[TheBarstoolWarrior]

I must reiterate.  Why is Disney being used in a way to express criticism?  Disney has had some pretty dang good songs in their soundtracks in their movies over their history.

I thoroughly enjoy my Disney+ subscription. The people who wrote music for Disney are extremely talented. The comparison itself isn't really a knock on Disney. Some musicians out there do this exceptionally well and have a ton of experience writing in this style and then picking the personnel to execute it.

I guess it's more a matter of expectations and execution. At the end of the day, I don't think DT can dip into this style very well. They don't have the personnel or songwriting experience for it. That's all I meant. I was trying to say the same thing with the Reggae comment. All musicians have their tendencies, strengths and weaknesses and DT are no different. When it comes to Prog Metal, they are the kings. It doesn't mean they can play everything and I think TA is an example of that. There is so much deadspace on the TA, where it's just keys and vocal. I don't find it particularly good. It really takes a lot to do a great Disney or Broadway inspired album. It's not likely that these 50 year olds who have been eating, breathing and sleeping prog and metal for 30 years are just going to pick up a pen and paper and successfully incorporate this foreign genre into the next DT album-- although they do incorporate Rush's style pretty damn well.

It works the other way too. The guys and gals who wrote and sang Hunchback and Frozen totally killed it but similarly, would they make a great prog metal Disney movie? I highly doubt this forum would rush out to buy it.

[Ben_Jamin]

I must reiterate.  Why is Disney being used in a way to express criticism?  Disney has had some pretty dang good songs in their soundtracks in their movies over their history.

I thoroughly enjoy my Disney+ subscription. The people who wrote music for Disney are extremely talented. The comparison itself isn't really a knock on Disney. Some musicians out there do this exceptionally well and have a ton of experience writing in this style and then picking the personnel to execute it.

I guess it's more a matter of expectations and execution. At the end of the day, I don't think DT can dip into this style very well. They don't have the personnel or songwriting experience for it. That's all I meant. I was trying to say the same thing with the Reggae comment. All musicians have their tendencies, strengths and weaknesses and DT are no different. When it comes to Prog Metal, they are the kings. It doesn't mean they can play everything and I think TA is an example of that. There is so much deadspace on the TA, where it's just keys and vocal. I don't find it particularly good. It really takes a lot to do a great Disney or Broadway inspired album. It's not likely that these 50 year olds who have been eating, breathing and sleeping prog and metal for 30 years are just going to pick up a pen and paper and successfully incorporate this foreign genre into the next DT album-- although they do incorporate Rush's style pretty damn well.

It works the other way too. The guys and gals who wrote and sang Hunchback and Frozen totally killed it but similarly, would they make a great prog metal Disney movie? I highly doubt this forum would rush out to buy it.

Exactly, they're 5 guys who create music and perform it. They're not composers who look for, and work with, other people to perform their musical compositions, which is what the Disney music composers do.

MY issue is that I would have preferred this as a full on production. But I also understand why that wasn't going to happen and we got what we got. I can accept The Astonishing for what it is because it was the best thing it could've been. It takes a lot of focus to actually make these big dream concepts into reality, and JP does not have the time, or more so the opportunity, to focus on this project. I am one that thinks they executed this to the best of their abilities, and am glad they decided to incorporate other aspects as well such as the backstory on their website, the deluxe boxset, and the book.

I knew my expectations were never going to be met, but I can also sit and listen to the album and visualize it all playing out on the stage. What I would love to be able to witness one day is a performance with a full cast. For me, this would've been heightened by adding in other vocalists to play the characters, while keeping JLB as the Narrator. It makes sense to me to have JLB as the narrator, because it's like the band is telling the story. It's another reason why I felt it would've been best to release this under a weird ass moniker of..."John Petrucci presents The Astonishing as performed by Dream Theater". But why when "Dream Theater presents The Astonishing" is just as good, and this is what we got.

[bosk1]

I don't think DT can dip into this style very well.

Well, except for the fact that they did, and it was pretty amazing.

It really takes a lot to do a great Disney or Broadway inspired album. It's not likely that these 50 year olds who have been eating, breathing and sleeping prog and metal for 30 years are just going to pick up a pen and paper and successfully incorporate this foreign genre into the next DT album

Well, except for the fact that they did, and it was pretty amazing.

[ytserush]

I have no problem with The Astonishing being criticized, even though I personally think very positively of it. What did make me roll my eyes a bit was when the people who were criticizing the band for being predictable and not taking risks were the same people who were banging on The Astonishing the hardest. You simply can't win with some people, which I think is intentional at times.

There's a right way to take risks and a wrong way. I am sure you wouldn't like it if DT16 turned out to be a reggae album.

I actually wouldn't mind that at all. I think it would be neat, and they have done Reggae before with that part inserted into Learning to Live. I actually think it would be neat to hear a Progressive Reggae song.

The reason I don't mind is because first and foremost I enjoy music, regardless of genre. To me music is music and there's lots of fascinating music out there, such as the music of the birds, the music of the trees, and the music of the sea. Music to me just can't be grouped into a single category, music should be allowed to venture and explore the vastness of sounds these vibrations can make.

You are missing out on so much awesome music by limiting yourself to just one style of music.

I'd love it if they could manage a reggae song much less a whole album. I'll take what I can get. At this point there should be no boundaries but they obviously feel differently.

[genome]

The Astonishing is 7 years old in a couple of weeks.

Wtf?

[Mladen]

I will never forget the absolute trill of the first week of spinning the album. It stayed in regular rotation for about a month or two, and I even remember returning to it quite often during the summer of 2016. What a fantastic album.

[Trav86]

This is a weird album for me. When I put it on, I enjoy it. Albeit rarely in its entirety. There are no songs that I would rank up there in my top, whatever, of DT songs. But I like every song. I can’t rank it high, because I don’t like it more than my faves. But if I rank it low, it seems wrong because I don’t thinks it’s bad. There are DT albums with bad songs. This isn’t one. So I don’t even know where I stand with it.

[gzarruk]

I find that the MM era albums are so good, it's very hard to rank them against my favorites from previous lineups. I want to have 10 albums in my top 5

[wolfking]

You know, I hate this album but I think I only actually listened to it like......twice?  Do I dare?

[Mladen]

Go into it with an open mind. You might hate it again, but also, it might just slightly improve. 

Try to focus on the eccentric vocals and the beautiful musical themes, especially the piano passages. That's where the gold of the album is in my opinion, but there's a lot of it to love.

[wolfking]

Go into it with an open mind. You might hate it again, but also, it might just slightly improve. 

Try to focus on the eccentric vocals and the beautiful musical themes, especially the piano passages. That's where the gold of the album is in my opinion, but there's a lot of it to love.

Hmmm....sounds like a lot of work.

[Mladen]

That's why you might still hate it.