New Mike Mangini Interview

[CB]

Eh, I get what you guys are saying, if MP was to rejoin the group I think the guys would lay out for him how it's different now in terms of responsibilities and roles. But to be honest, I'd guess that after a certain amount of time, everyone would kinda just fall right back into the roles they had been playing for the last 10 years or so of MP's tenure with the band. It's human nature.

I hope that never happens. MP is who he is, I don't think he could change even if he wanted to. He always said himself he's a control freak. Then there's the friction between him and JLB and JM. I remember after MP left in 2010, in an interview he compared being in DT to a marriage and said he has fallen out of love with a couple of the wives. It was totally clear he meant JLB and JM, he didn't want to be in a band with them any more. As far as I know both haven't spoken a word to MP since then. I love MP in Flying Colors and the Neal Morse Band, but I fear if he'd return to DT the chemistry in the band would be completely destroyed.

[emtee]

I'll adopt MP's philosophy of 'never say never' but I think it would be less than 1% chance given all that has happened.

More likely scenario to me is that JR lets JP know he is done. MM decides it's time to go to. JP ends up pulling the plug on DT but
he and MP put something new together with a new vocalist, new bass and keys. JR is getting up there and it's got to be getting
tough to be in a constantly touring metal band. I have felt for some time that he is nearing the finish line with DT.

But even this scenario is very unlikely.

[Funkafonik]

... there's the friction between him and JLB and JM. I remember after MP left in 2010, in an interview he compared being in DT to a marriage and said he has fallen out of love with a couple of the wives. It was totally clear he meant JLB and JM, he didn't want to be in a band with them any more. As far as I know both haven't spoken a word to MP since then.

Because of that, I think we'd have a way better chance of getting a 3rd LTE album before we get to hear a new DT album with MP.

[Setlist Scotty]

I do see MP coming back to DT, but *only* if DT gets to a point where they are more or less forced into doing it.

In other words, even if MM leaves on his own, there's no way the rest of the band is gonna go back to MP, and MP's not gonna approach them about rejoining the band. First, DT will try at least one more drummer. However, if they continue to play to progressively smaller audiences in the future, they'll eventually get to a point where they'll realize or management will tell them that the only way to bring back bigger audiences is by reuniting with MP. Not unlike what happened with Van Halen, who, after a failed attempt with Gary Cherone, eventually returned to David Lee Roth.

If that happens and the band approaches MP about it, I'd imagine that he'd be willing to rejoin, but he definitely would have some stipulations for his return and largely want to return to the role he played previously, which the rest of the guys would have to accept to a large degree. I doubt that JL would willingly leave DT since it's is his bread and butter, but one thing that would be addressed would be their relationship. Same thing to a lesser degree with JM. It seems unlikely, but then again, it seemed unlikely that Roger Waters would ever play with Pink Floyd again, that DLR would ever return to Van Halen and that David Ellefson would return to Megadeth, but all these happened. So it's not out of the question. But if it does happen, it won't be any time soon.

[TAC]

  First, DT will try at least one more drummer.

I agree. But probably only one.

There would have to be a meeting regarding division of roles. It would be an extremely business-like arrangement.

[gzarruk]

Eh, I get what you guys are saying, if MP was to rejoin the group I think the guys would lay out for him how it's different now in terms of responsibilities and roles. But to be honest, I'd guess that after a certain amount of time, everyone would kinda just fall right back into the roles they had been playing for the last 10 years or so of MP's tenure with the band. It's human nature.

I hope that never happens. MP is who he is, I don't think he could change even if he wanted to. He always said himself he's a control freak. Then there's the friction between him and JLB and JM. I remember after MP left in 2010, in an interview he compared being in DT to a marriage and said he has fallen out of love with a couple of the wives. It was totally clear he meant JLB and JM, he didn't want to be in a band with them any more. As far as I know both haven't spoken a word to MP since then. I love MP in Flying Colors and the Neal Morse Band, but I fear if he'd return to DT the chemistry in the band would be completely destroyed.

You're right about them not talking at all. I even have a screen shot from an MP tweet from when he was asked if he still got in touch with the DT members after the split. His exact words were: "Jordan frequently, JP ocasionally".
Also, it's no secret that the relationship between MP and JLB was bad already before the split, and after it just ended completely.

I'll adopt MP's philosophy of 'never say never' but I think it would be less than 1% chance given all that has happened.

More likely scenario to me is that JR lets JP know he is done. MM decides it's time to go to. JP ends up pulling the plug on DT but
he and MP put something new together with a new vocalist, new bass and keys. JR is getting up there and it's got to be getting
tough to be in a constantly touring metal band. I have felt for some time that he is nearing the finish line with DT.

But even this scenario is very unlikely.

I think this is taking it too far. I'm almost sure that, if MP rejoined the band, James would leave and would probably focus on his solo band, but even if Myung's relationship with MP isn't too good, actually, I think they would be able to work again, unlike James and Mike.

The Jordan case is different. I agree with you on the fact that he's not going to be forever with the band, but I don't see him leaving soon either, he seems to be really enjoying his role in the band, specially with an album like TA. The deciding factor would be his age (he just turned 60) and his will to explore other projects. Let's keep in mind he's been the one from all the current DT members to have more external projects and guest appearances with other artists. Also, his albums with Levin Minnemann Rudess have been some of the most keyboard crazyness-heavy albums he's ever done since his solo music. He's even said that, even though he loves being in DT, he really enjoys being able to express some of his ideas outside the DT style and without the big walls of heavy guitar.
I can see him focusing more on that on the next years, but I would give him, at least, one more album and tour with DT, which would end with him being 63 or 64. I assume he would like to explore other projects before turning 70.

If that ends up happening with:
- MM leaving
- MP rejoing
- JLB leaving because of MP
- New (heavier?) singer
- JR leaving a few years after that
- New keyboardist in with not big contribution to the songwriting
I think the band would be considered as one of those "revolving door bands" where it just can't keep clasting members. Also, without JR, the main writing would be 80% JP, 5% JM and 15% MP with his usual changes and production directions. Don't really know how that would end up, but not that interesting, imo.


Again, this is just crazy speculation, but, If any of the things we've been talking actually happens, we have to project which effects would those changes affect the band in the long term

[emtee]

When I said something 'new' I meant under a totally moniker than DT. New band. New name. New energy.

[TAC]

When I said something 'new' I meant under a totally moniker than DT. New band. New name. New energy.

Shattered Fortress?

[rumborak]

"Enough" will be the name. Because you know, Never Enough, but now it's actually happening.




I'll show myself out.

[CB]

Just wondering, if the band reads this thread, will they censor MMs interviews from now on?

[TAC]

I'm actually surprised the one in the OP was released.

[Dream Team]

I do see MP coming back to DT, but *only* if DT gets to a point where they are more or less forced into doing it.

In other words, even if MM leaves on his own, there's no way the rest of the band is gonna go back to MP, and MP's not gonna approach them about rejoining the band. First, DT will try at least one more drummer. However, if they continue to play to progressively smaller audiences in the future, they'll eventually get to a point where they'll realize or management will tell them that the only way to bring back bigger audiences is by reuniting with MP. Not unlike what happened with Van Halen, who, after a failed attempt with Gary Cherone, eventually returned to David Lee Roth.

If that happens and the band approaches MP about it, I'd imagine that he'd be willing to rejoin, but he definitely would have some stipulations for his return and largely want to return to the role he played previously, which the rest of the guys would have to accept to a large degree. I doubt that JL would willingly leave DT since it's is his bread and butter, but one thing that would be addressed would be their relationship. Same thing to a lesser degree with JM. It seems unlikely, but then again, it seemed unlikely that Roger Waters would ever play with Pink Floyd again, that DLR would ever return to Van Halen and that David Ellefson would return to Megadeth, but all these happened. So it's not out of the question. But if it does happen, it won't be any time soon.

Well, it's not like MP is some famous front man like DLR. If their popularity sagged to that point I don't think bringing back MP would save them.

[KevShmev]

Well, it's not like MP is some famous front man like DLR. If their popularity sagged to that point I don't think bringing back MP would save them.

Agreed.  Reports that the European shows are selling well for the I&W and Beyond tour tell me that playing the classic material is what will draw the crowds.  As much as I like The Astonishing, the mixed reaction to the album by the fan base is the main reason sales were down this year, especially on this last U.S. leg, not because Mangini is there instead of Portnoy.

[Madman Shepherd]

I do see MP coming back to DT, but *only* if DT gets to a point where they are more or less forced into doing it.

In other words, even if MM leaves on his own, there's no way the rest of the band is gonna go back to MP, and MP's not gonna approach them about rejoining the band. First, DT will try at least one more drummer. However, if they continue to play to progressively smaller audiences in the future, they'll eventually get to a point where they'll realize or management will tell them that the only way to bring back bigger audiences is by reuniting with MP. Not unlike what happened with Van Halen, who, after a failed attempt with Gary Cherone, eventually returned to David Lee Roth.

If that happens and the band approaches MP about it, I'd imagine that he'd be willing to rejoin, but he definitely would have some stipulations for his return and largely want to return to the role he played previously, which the rest of the guys would have to accept to a large degree. I doubt that JL would willingly leave DT since it's is his bread and butter, but one thing that would be addressed would be their relationship. Same thing to a lesser degree with JM. It seems unlikely, but then again, it seemed unlikely that Roger Waters would ever play with Pink Floyd again, that DLR would ever return to Van Halen and that David Ellefson would return to Megadeth, but all these happened. So it's not out of the question. But if it does happen, it won't be any time soon.

Well, it's not like MP is some famous front man like DLR. If their popularity sagged to that point I don't think bringing back MP would save them.

It would serve a temporary bump in attendance no doubt but it's not like they would go from playing theaters to stadiums. 

If MP did come back though I seriously doubt James would quit.  Like has been said, this is their income.  I'm sure they live quite comfortably but they do rely on a steady stream of income.  There is nothing James could probably do that would match the earnings of Dream Theater.  Hell, I doubt there is much Mike could do to match the earnings of Dream Theater other than be in a billion bands and work twice as hard. 

[Jester]

- JLB leaving because of MP

Geoff Tate turns down the replacement offer, because of MP.  This despite the fact that they share the love of spittle.

MP doesn't work out, so they go with Ratt's Bobby Blotzer.  However, this starts a Blabbermouth war with Sebastian Bach and Nikki Sixx.

None of this actually happens because Rudess reads this thread and tells Petrucci "let's really make this Mangini thing work.  I've read the butterfly effect of him leaving and it is bad.  Like Vince Neil/Razzle bad."

[rumborak]

I'm actually surprised the one in the OP was released.

Well, what would they do though? If this interview was paraphrased by the interviewer, I could see them rejected the release. But, it's just a transcript of what MM said. They would have to entirely nix the whole thing, but that might not be as easy.

[TAC]

Well, not sure if they have final say on any interview being released or not, but the fact that it's on DT related site has to mean that ultimately it was approved. And frankly, I'd be surprised at that. The interview is unbecoming.

[noxon]

DT has no input as to what we publish. In fact, in the original proposal I wrote to DT about the fan club, this sentence was in it:

"And maybe most importantly: Editorial freedom. While it’s important that we work closely together, I also think it is important that the fan club is editorially free to publish any article, be it positive or negative. This is what gives the fan club the necessary integrity to be able to say “what we tell you is the truth”."

The site belongs to the fans. It is paid for by the fans.

[FsF]

If Mangini starts pushing to play 6:00 on the next tour, then we know something's up...

[TAC]

DT has no input as to what we publish. In fact, in the original proposal I wrote to DT about the fan club, this sentence was in it:

"And maybe most importantly: Editorial freedom. While it’s important that we work closely together, I also think it is important that the fan club is editorially free to publish any article, be it positive or negative. This is what gives the fan club the necessary integrity to be able to say “what we tell you is the truth”."

The site belongs to the fans. It is paid for by the fans.

Noxon, what is your read on Mangini during this interview?

[Cool Chris]

...and MP's not gonna approach them about rejoining the band.

Not directly, he'll do it via FB/Twitter.

[Setlist Scotty]

Well, it's not like MP is some famous front man like DLR. If their popularity sagged to that point I don't think bringing back MP would save them.

It would serve a temporary bump in attendance no doubt but it's not like they would go from playing theaters to stadiums. 

Exactly. Keep in mind that MP was a huge part of DT's popularity due to his personality and his reaching out to the fans. So I'm sure that would play a part in drawing the crowds. And with his point of view being largely that of a fan, there probably would be things that he would do or insist the band do to boost interest.
 
 

Reports that the European shows are selling well for the I&W and Beyond tour tell me that playing the classic material is what will draw the crowds.  As much as I like The Astonishing, the mixed reaction to the album by the fan base is the main reason sales were down this year, especially on this last U.S. leg, not because Mangini is there instead of Portnoy.

Not going to say that you're wrong, but while what you're saying might be true, how does that explain the overall fall in attendance? I recall reading/hearing about some shows that were played in Europe during the summer of 2014 that were not well attended. Noxon has a better pulse on these things than most of us, and I know he's commented in the past that this is the case. Part of it may be due to the same setlist being played throughout the whole tour (save for the festival gigs), but I don't know if that explains it completely.
 
 

...and MP's not gonna approach them about rejoining the band.

Not directly, he'll do it via FB/Twitter.

I'm sure you're half kidding, but no, not even that. After getting shutdown once a couple months after he left, he'd rather keep himself busy with his multitude of bands and projects rather than appear desperate to rejoin, which I don't believe he is anyway.

[gzarruk]

When I said something 'new' I meant under a totally moniker than DT. New band. New name. New energy.

That wouldn't work, imo.

I do see MP coming back to DT, but *only* if DT gets to a point where they are more or less forced into doing it.

In other words, even if MM leaves on his own, there's no way the rest of the band is gonna go back to MP, and MP's not gonna approach them about rejoining the band. First, DT will try at least one more drummer. However, if they continue to play to progressively smaller audiences in the future, they'll eventually get to a point where they'll realize or management will tell them that the only way to bring back bigger audiences is by reuniting with MP. Not unlike what happened with Van Halen, who, after a failed attempt with Gary Cherone, eventually returned to David Lee Roth.

If that happens and the band approaches MP about it, I'd imagine that he'd be willing to rejoin, but he definitely would have some stipulations for his return and largely want to return to the role he played previously, which the rest of the guys would have to accept to a large degree. I doubt that JL would willingly leave DT since it's is his bread and butter, but one thing that would be addressed would be their relationship. Same thing to a lesser degree with JM. It seems unlikely, but then again, it seemed unlikely that Roger Waters would ever play with Pink Floyd again, that DLR would ever return to Van Halen and that David Ellefson would return to Megadeth, but all these happened. So it's not out of the question. But if it does happen, it won't be any time soon.

Well, it's not like MP is some famous front man like DLR. If their popularity sagged to that point I don't think bringing back MP would save them.

It would serve a temporary bump in attendance no doubt but it's not like they would go from playing theaters to stadiums. 

If MP did come back though I seriously doubt James would quit.  Like has been said, this is their income.  I'm sure they live quite comfortably but they do rely on a steady stream of income.  There is nothing James could probably do that would match the earnings of Dream Theater.  Hell, I doubt there is much Mike could do to match the earnings of Dream Theater other than be in a billion bands and work twice as hard. 

I think he would. If the chances of MP returning to DT are very small, the chances of having James and MP on the same band are even smaller. They weren't in good terms before the split, and then things just got worse. If the band ever accepted Portnoy back, their relationship wouldn't feel good at all, and James would feel pressured (by himself) to leave. That's, again, speculation based on that time when they started "attacking" each other in interviews 

...and MP's not gonna approach them about rejoining the band.

Not directly, he'll do it via FB/Twitter.

  he'll do it... FOR THE FANS! 

[KevShmev]

Well, it's not like MP is some famous front man like DLR. If their popularity sagged to that point I don't think bringing back MP would save them.

It would serve a temporary bump in attendance no doubt but it's not like they would go from playing theaters to stadiums. 

Exactly. Keep in mind that MP was a huge part of DT's popularity due to his personality and his reaching out to the fans. So I'm sure that would play a part in drawing the crowds. And with his point of view being largely that of a fan, there probably would be things that he would do or insist the band do to boost interest.

There is no way to prove that one way or the other, but I think you are drastically overestimating him. I think his presence brings enthusiasm to existing fans, yes, but does his mere presence bring in a lot more fans, as you suggested? I will say no, and his other projects post-DT kind of prove that. 

Neal Morse plays to less people now, reportedly, than he did when he was in Spock's Beard, despite the presence of Mike Portnoy.  Even Mike Portnoy himself expressed disappointment on social media that the new NMB album didn't sell as well as he hoped, despite his and their hardcore pimping of it (although it is still selling better than previous NM efforts).  I can't remember the last time Portnoy reached out to fans this much over the release of a new album he is on, yet the sales still didn't live up to what he hoped for (largely because I think he had unrealistic expectations, partly because I think he, like you, overrates his ability to sell records based merely on his name). 

Adrenaline Mob was a total flop.

Flying Colors is great, but I definitely get the sense that that project hasn't reached as many people as they had hoped, despite the presence of Mike Portnoy, as well as Steve Morse, who is easily the most well known member in the band.

Winery Dogs has done fairly well, and I think most of the credit there can go to the style: catchy hard rock that appeals to the masses.

Ultimately, songs are the reasons projects, albums, etc. do well, and when Portnoy is involved, his enthusiasm and fan-like attitude are added bonuses, not a main reason for them doing well.

Reports that the European shows are selling well for the I&W and Beyond tour tell me that playing the classic material is what will draw the crowds.  As much as I like The Astonishing, the mixed reaction to the album by the fan base is the main reason sales were down this year, especially on this last U.S. leg, not because Mangini is there instead of Portnoy.

Not going to say that you're wrong, but while what you're saying might be true, how does that explain the overall fall in attendance? I recall reading/hearing about some shows that were played in Europe during the summer of 2014 that were not well attended. Noxon has a better pulse on these things than most of us, and I know he's commented in the past that this is the case. Part of it may be due to the same setlist being played throughout the whole tour (save for the festival gigs), but I don't know if that explains it completely.
 

rumborak has posted some things in the past that show that interest in the band peaked around '04 or '05, I think, so the band's popularity and interest in them was already on a slightly downward trajectory prior to September 2010, and I think that was just the natural course of time working its magic.  It happens to just about every band that isn't named U2, the Rolling Stones or Metallica nowadays. Even Rush saw their live ticket sales start to decline in the mid 90s and then early 00s despite Roll the Bones and Counterparts both being very popular albums and then the return from the hiatus in 2002 (although Rush's ticket prices more than doubled in the 00s, so they still made a killing cause 12,000 x 100 is still more than 15,000 x 40, for example).

[Bertielee]

Agreed on everything Kev has said.

Now if MM was to leave and MP to return, maybe somme fans would return, but they'd lose one. If BJ was to join, that would be another story though.

B.Lee

[Siddhartha]

I really hope to have Portnoy back in the band again, to me DT was way better with him.

If Guns N Roses and Helloween can work it out then anybody can.

[Madman Shepherd]

I really hope to have Portnoy back in the band again, to me DT was way better with him.

If Guns N Roses and Helloween can work it out then anybody can.

There is a huge difference though.  GNR weren't even filling half of arenas towards the end of their run with only Axl as the original member.  With the old guys, they're selling out football stadiums.  They go from pulling in $100K a show to millions. 

With DT, as I said, they would see a temporary bump in sales.  How much I couldn't tell you.  A couple thousand or maybe even 10 - 20 thousand?  After the initial hype wore off, they would be right back to where they are now.  Filling up and occasionally selling out theaters.  For only a temporary raise, I don't know if they would risk the dynamic of the band.

[MirrorMask]

I agree, Portnoy returning would be huge news for the band and the fans, but a minor footnote when it comes to their album sales and worldwide reception.

DT has never been a "rockstar" kind of band or that experienced significative upswings (or downwswings) in popularity, I follow them since 1999 and when they play Milan they always play the same venue, a basket arena that hold up to 15K people. The only exception was in 2002, a slightly smaller arena, but in the last tours with Portnoy they played the very same venue they're playing now with Mangini, and where they will play next February for Images and Words.

[Siddhartha]

For only a temporary raise, I don't know if they would risk the dynamic of the band.

The MM interview seems to sugest that the current dynamic of the band might not be working all that good for him.

With Portnoy the band would be what it was for +25th years. It is difficult for an outsider to know how the personal relationships were inside the band, but I would tell that for the most part they were pretty good.

[CB]

For only a temporary raise, I don't know if they would risk the dynamic of the band.

The MM interview seems to sugest that the current dynamic of the band might not be working all that good for him.

With Portnoy the band would be what it was for +25th years. It is difficult for an outsider to know how the personal relationships were inside the band, but I would tell that for the most part they were pretty good.

But the relationships in DT (or rather MPs relationship with the other members) was one of the reasons he wanted a hiatus. He realized that while he was with Avenged Sevenfold. For me the chemistry on stage is much better with MM than with MP before the split, even during the TA tour, despite MM probably not being 100% happy with his situation.

[Madman Shepherd]

Yes.  I too sensed MM was not very happy but I think his disappointment could be easily remedied.  As for MP's issues with the band or their issues with him, that is a whole other ballgame. 

[Architeuthis]

I don't think there's a threat of MM leaving anytime soon. He was just keeping it real and saying that being in a band and touring vigorously isn't the life that it's portrayed to be.  I've complained about landscaping in the cold and suffering through aches and back pain and fatigue,  but I've been doing it for many years and still do it. I would love to make a living playing music but I could see how the novelty of touring could diminish after time.
 MM has one of the best gigs a drummer if his caliber could want with one of the best bands in existence, but I can see how the physicality and mental challenge night after night could get to him after a while.. Neil Peart said the same things about touring. I'm sure playing the drums at that level for three hours a night is like running a marathon. Like my signature suggests under all my posts. In fact, that quote is by NP from the song Marathon.

[Bertielee]

For only a temporary raise, I don't know if they would risk the dynamic of the band.

The MM interview seems to sugest that the current dynamic of the band might not be working all that good for him.

With Portnoy the band would be what it was for +25th years. It is difficult for an outsider to know how the personal relationships were inside the band, but I would tell that for the most part they were pretty good.

We know that at least they were not good between MP and JLB. Hey, MP gave JLB an ultimatum during the 6 Degrees tour for not keeping healthy (quite ironic from a former drug addict) and even dissed him for not being the singer he wanted when in the band. So, I just can't see how it could work if MP was to return.

B.Lee

[Architeuthis]

For only a temporary raise, I don't know if they would risk the dynamic of the band.

The MM interview seems to sugest that the current dynamic of the band might not be working all that good for him.

With Portnoy the band would be what it was for +25th years. It is difficult for an outsider to know how the personal relationships were inside the band, but I would tell that for the most part they were pretty good.

We know that at least they were not good between MP and JLB. Hey, MP gave JLB an ultimatum during the 6 Degrees tour for not keeping healthy (quite ironic from a former drug addict) and even dissed him for not being the singer he wanted when in the band. So, I just can't see how it could work if MP was to return.

B.Lee

How anybody could not want JLB as their singer is beyond me!   

[KevShmev]

I think it was around 2005 or 2006 when Portnoy said in an interview that he wished DT had a singer like Daniel Gildenlow.  Imagine the shit storm at the time if JLB had said in an interview that he wished DT had a different drummer. 

Kind of funny to think now that JLB has been on more DT albums than Portnoy was and is now a longer tenured member of the band.