Star Trek: Thread Space 9

[Cool Chris]

The Voyage Home was fun, and meant to be a fun conclusion to the ST II-III-IV movie trilogy.  Lots of great moments in that one. 

Definitely. It is the one that feels most like a TOS episode, and after the gravitas of II and III, the fans needed some lightheartedness, which TOS always featured.

I even like the new Saavik better than the original.  I just think Robin Curtis makes a better Vulcan than Kirstie Alley.

I don't know if she was a better Vulcan but she stepped in to the role admirably and delivered.

Come to think of it, I also have no idea why Kirk, an admiral, is still in a captain's chair of a starship

He is in the captain's chair because he hijacked the ship. Which probably shouldn't be as easy as it turned out to be. It's not like he and the crew were on assignment for III. They ended up facing a court-martial for it.

I could talk about the I-VI movies forever (well, maybe not TMP and V). But when it comes to any of the other series, I'm out. We need two different threads 

[El Barto]

As far as The Search For Spock goes, that movie has a remarkable abundance of plot holes, but it's emotional drive -with Spock at it's center- sufficiently compensates. I know they wanted David's death to hit me harder but I had totally forgotten that Kirk had a son in the first place when I started watching this movie, that's on me though. Come to think of it, I also have no idea why Kirk, an admiral, is still in a captain's chair of a starship.. I need to read some recaps on the first two movies.

In TMP he pretty much stole the chair from Decker. RHIP. In Khan Spock pretty much insisted that he take the chair, yielding to Kirk's immeasurable skill and experience (I am a Vulcan. I have no ego to bruise.). In TSfS he stole the ship.

Bird of prey uncloaking next to that small ship = the stuff nightmare are made of, it's magnitude is Lovecraftian as fuck.

I'm not sure I recall the scene exactly, but I damn sure remember the music.

[El Barto]

Robin Curtis was certainly snootier. I didn't think Kirstie Alley was a bad Vulcan, but if you want Vulcan arrogance, Robin Curtis was definitely the way to go. That said, Kirstie was smokin hot back then, even with the ears and the eyebrows. She gets the nod from me.

[Orbert]

I liked Kirstie better for a while, but the more I watched the movies, the more I got used to Robin and her different approach to the character.

[Kotowboy]

He is in the captain's chair because he hijacked the ship. Which probably shouldn't be as easy as it turned out to be.

Yeah no tractor beams in space dock ? WTH !!! STUPID ALEX KURTZMA..oh wait.

[Dream Team]

Robin Curtis was certainly snootier. I didn't think Kirstie Alley was a bad Vulcan, but if you want Vulcan arrogance, Robin Curtis was definitely the way to go. That said, Kirstie was smokin hot back then, even with the ears and the eyebrows. She gets the nod from me.

The novelizations of those movies did a great job in fleshing out her character.  They had to leave most of it our for the screenplays.

[Orbert]

My DS9 watch continues.

Now into Season 4, which from what I've heard, is where things really take off.  Worf is now on board, due to and following the events of the two-hour season premier.  I have to admit, I'm kinduv intrigued and drawn in by the more serial approach, but I prefer less political bullshit with my science fiction.  The Cardassians were this series' main bad guys, but now in the face a mutual and greater threat from The Dominion, we are uneasy allies of sorts.  Meanwhile, the Klingons, as boneheaded as ever (pun possibly intended), have basically declared war on both the Cardassians and the Federation, all because they suspect that the Cardassians have been infiltrated by The Dominion and we (the UFP) weren't going to help them attack the Cards without at least some kind of proof.  Great, so the Klingons at war with literally everybody, including The Dominion.  And they (the Klingons) thought this was a good idea?

Then in the next episode, we take a breather with "The Visitor" which I'd heard was a great episode, one of the best.  It was, absolutely.  A very unusual episode, one with something of a built-in reset button (and which probably should have had more longer-lasting impact on Sisko), but it's about the journey, and it was a great journey.  Tony Todd as the older Jake Sisko was excellent, and I was moved to tears more than once.  Maybe because my own father passed away earlier this year, but probably not, since I'm actually a softie when it comes to that.  Losing someone, then getting them back for a few minutes, only to lose them again, repeat, that's gotta suck.  Didn't have much to do with the Dominion arc, but I'm fine with that.  I don't want every single episode to be part of a grand story; I actually like when they figure out how to fit "regular" episodes in, and this was a great episode, so cool, I'll take it.

[Kotowboy]

Not that anyone cares - but Disco S4 wont be on Netflix in the UK. 

Apparently it'll wait until Paramount Plus launches next year.

I'm really not bothered. I'm sure i'll see it eventually.

[El Barto]

My DS9 watch continues.

Now into Season 4, which from what I've heard, is where things really take off.  Worf is now on board, due to and following the events of the two-hour season premier.  I have to admit, I'm kinduv intrigued and drawn in by the more serial approach, but I prefer less political bullshit with my science fiction.  The Cardassians were this series' main bad guys, but now in the face a mutual and greater threat from The Dominion, we are uneasy allies of sorts.  Meanwhile, the Klingons, as boneheaded as ever (pun possibly intended), have basically declared war on both the Cardassians and the Federation, all because they suspect that the Cardassians have been infiltrated by The Dominion and we (the UFP) weren't going to help them attack the Cards without at least some kind of proof.  Great, so the Klingons at war with literally everybody, including The Dominion.  And they (the Klingons) thought this was a good idea?

Then in the next episode, we take a breather with "The Visitor" which I'd heard was a great episode, one of the best.  It was, absolutely.  A very unusual episode, one with something of a built-in reset button (and which probably should have had more longer-lasting impact on Sisko), but it's about the journey, and it was a great journey.  Tony Todd as the older Jake Sisko was excellent, and I was moved to tears more than once.  Maybe because my own father passed away earlier this year, but probably not, since I'm actually a softie when it comes to that.  Losing someone, then getting them back for a few minutes, only to lose them again, repeat, that's gotta suck.  Didn't have much to do with the Dominion arc, but I'm fine with that.  I don't want every single episode to be part of a grand story; I actually like when they figure out how to fit "regular" episodes in, and this was a great episode, so cool, I'll take it.

The Visitor was absolutely gut wrenching. It's one that I rarely watch, gotta be in the right kind of mood, but it's also quite possibly the best episode of the series. I rank it easily in the top three, alongside the also legendary Pale Moonlight. Between Kern and the older Jake, Tony Todd was one of the unsung heroes of the franchise.

The Klingons are only in a hot war with Cardassia. The Federation stays out of it, and the Dominion isn't really a factor, yet. And Gowran did back down and listen to reason in the end.

[Polarbear]

Not that anyone cares - but Disco S4 wont be on Netflix in the UK. 

Apparently it'll wait until Paramount Plus launches next year.

I'm really not bothered. I'm sure i'll see it eventually.

Same here in Finland!

I'm not so keen on spending money on Paramount+, so maybe I'll wait until they offer some free trials..

[El Barto]

Then in the next episode, we take a breather with "The Visitor" which I'd heard was a great episode, one of the best.  It was, absolutely.  A very unusual episode, one with something of a built-in reset button (and which probably should have had more longer-lasting impact on Sisko), but it's about the journey, and it was a great journey.  Tony Todd as the older Jake Sisko was excellent, and I was moved to tears more than once.  Maybe because my own father passed away earlier this year, but probably not, since I'm actually a softie when it comes to that.  Losing someone, then getting them back for a few minutes, only to lose them again, repeat, that's gotta suck.  Didn't have much to do with the Dominion arc, but I'm fine with that.  I don't want every single episode to be part of a grand story; I actually like when they figure out how to fit "regular" episodes in, and this was a great episode, so cool, I'll take it.

Spending a few more minutes pondering The Visitor. For one, does Sisko even remember the experience? I thought it was kind of vague on that topic, and if so, you're right, it should have affected him more than it did.

You mention the repeated losses Jake Sisko suffers. There's certainly a pathos to his plight, and as stated, Tony Todd (and Lofton) really brings that shit to bear. At the same, as we see Jake lose his old man time and time again, the emphasis kind of shifts to Benjamin Sisko being the one to suffer loss as he sees his son disappearing into something else. There's an interesting change that takes place where sympathy gets redirected as Jake resolves himself to the situation and Benjamin has his own resolution taken away. Also, it's perhaps the only time I'll say this about he guy, but Avery Brooks did a helluva job to that end.

[Orbert]

Yeah, the shift in focus was subtle, but once you notice it, it's heavy.  Jake gets his dad back, for a few minutes every t=f(x) years, which sucks, but from Ben's point of view, he's stuck in this undefined, white cloudy place, then every few minutes he drops in on Jake, somehow.  And each time, years have gone by for Jake.  There's the time he exclaims "You're older than me now!" and you realize what's gonna happen.  Or... once it's explained, you wonder what happens to Ben after Jake dies.

As for the reset, Jake figured it out and told Ben to stay clear of the thingy that's gonna blast him full of lightning, and Ben did.  18-year-old Jake had no idea what had gone on in that alternate timeline which we saw, but Ben remembered what Jake told him, so there's no reason to think that'd he wouldn't remember everything he experienced in the alternate timeline.  It was only a few minutes for him, maybe 10 total, but they were pretty intense.  He saw glimpses of his son growing old and eventually (almost) dying.  Suddenly I can't stop thinking about Ben's POV here.  Kinda like the movie "Click" only done better.  Actually, that aspect of "Click" was pretty well done, too.  The best part of the movie, really.

[DoctorAction]

Not that anyone cares - but Disco S4 wont be on Netflix in the UK. 

Apparently it'll wait until Paramount Plus launches next year.

I'm really not bothered. I'm sure i'll see it eventually.

Ah, fuck. I was looking forward to more Trek this weekend!

[Kotowboy]

" Voyager - J is so stupid. Why is it so flat ? Why are the nacelles just floating ? Programable Matter? What the hell is that? w..."



• It's fiction

• It's the 33rd century

• 1,000 years ago an iPhone would have been IMPOSSIBLE

• It's supposed to be entertainment.

• If you dont like it dont watch it.

[DoctorAction]

" Voyager - J is so stupid. Why is it so flat ? Why are the nacelles just floating ? Programable Matter? What the hell is that? w..."



• It's fiction

• It's the 33rd century

• 1,000 years ago an iPhone would have been IMPOSSIBLE

• It's supposed to be entertainment.

• If you dont like it dont watch it.

Did you just wake up while driving?

[Kotowboy]

what

[Kotowboy]

RE : The Scene where Kirk is cooking eggs in Generations.

I was thinking about this scene - and I may be reading too much into it. But Kirk has 2 eggs and breaks one.

Thus the saying you cant make an omelette without breaking any eggs.

Kirk dies helping Picard - who lives. They can't stop Soran without one of them dying.

[hefdaddy42]

RE : The Scene where Kirk is cooking eggs in Generations.

I was thinking about this scene - and I may be reading too much into it. But Kirk has 2 eggs and breaks one.

Thus the saying you cant make an omelette without breaking any eggs.

Kirk dies helping Picard - who lives. They can't stop Soran without one of them dying.

Jesus Fuck.

[Kotowboy]

At least i'm not a bald fat cunt.

[Adami]

At least i'm not a bald fat cunt.

Hey now, no one talks about Col. Kurtz that way! The man is a poet!

[hefdaddy42]

At least i'm not a bald fat cunt.

Well, if you didn't want to post here anymore, all you had to do was ask.

[ZirconBlue]

Well, that escalated quickly.

[YtseJam]

At least i'm not a bald fat cunt.

So what kind of cunt are you? A hairy skinny one?

[Orbert]

Meanwhile, Orbert is watching Deep Space Nine and is into Season Four

Holy Shit, this show is really firing on all cylinders right now.  Even when they revisit classic or clichéed sci-fi themes and tropes, they're doing them well and coming up with reasonably interesting and entertaining stories.

Hippocratic Oath - O'Brien and Bashir crash land and are captured by some Jem'Hadar who happen to be trying to beat their addiction to ketrecel white, which is basically what enslaves them to the Founders.  As the episode title suggests, there are disagreements about whether the priority is helping the Jem'Hadar or getting the hell out of there.

Indiscretion - Gul Dukat has a half-Bajoran daughter?  Dukat and Kira spend some quality time together?  Kasidy Yates might be finding a place to stay on DS9?  Well, two out of three ain't bad.

Rejoined - Torias Dax, one of Jadzia Dax's previous hosts, died in an accident.  His widow was another Trill, who eventually died and whose symbiont, Kahn, is now Lenara Kahn.  Trill law forbids Dax and Kahn getting back together, or acknowledging each other at all, but hey, they were in love then, and they still are, doesn't matter if they're both in new hosts now.  It gets complicated.  Apparently "the kiss" was controversial at the time (Lenara is female, and so is Jadzia) but in true sci-fi fashion, no one on the show has any problem with that; it's that symbionts aren't supposed to reassociate.  Pretty cool exploration into Trill culture.

Starship Down - The title comes from the movie "Gray Lady Down" which had to do with submarines sneaking around in the depths, trying to find and kill each other.  It was revisited in the TOS episode "Balance of Terror" and the Mutara Nebula scene in "STII: The Wrath of Kahn".  Here, it's The Defiant and two Jem'Hadar ships.  They come up with a few new takes on a classic scenario.  Also, Worf learns not to be such an asshole to the guys in Engineering who are just trying to, you know, save everyone's lives.

Little Green Men - Remember when the TOS Enterprise visited Earth back in the 20th century?  Wouldn't it be wacky if the Ferengi did kinda the same thing?  Better yet, it all plays out like in "Escape from the Planet of the Apes" complete with sympathetic scientists and sterotypical military asshats.  Yeah, I know, it's sounds horrible, but I found it to be pretty fun.

The writing has been tight.  The stories have been new like only Star Trek can do, old and worn, and everything in between, but always entertaining or at least interesting.  I'm really digging this.

[DoctorAction]

Nice. I loved DS9 to bits. So much great stuff in there.

Anyone seen any Disco S4? No idea when we'll be getting it in the UK at present.

[gmillerdrake]

Watched the first Episode of DS4 and it was alrighty. Nothing jaw dropping......in line with how the previous seasons have shaped up. Michael is the star of the show who is going to fix/solve it all.

[DoctorAction]

No gear change so far, then.

[soupytwist]

Nice. I loved DS9 to bits. So much great stuff in there.

Anyone seen any Disco S4? No idea when we'll be getting it in the UK at present.

Same boat.  Looks like we have to wait for Paramount + (or whatever it's called) to arrive in the UK, which is currently defined as 'early next year'.  To be honest I can't face yet another streaming service - I'm already on Netflix, Prime and Disney+.   I'm also guessing Prime will lose Picard and Lower Decks?

[The Curious Orange]

I'm nearing the end of Season 3 of my DS9 watch, and a few episodes ago there was a brief scene with someone named Leeta who is pretty and has large breasts.  She lamely approached Dr. Bashir about having a (fake) cough for a few days.  Bashir gets a lewd smile and offers to examine her right away.  That's all we see of her.

I've actually met Chase Masterton who played Leeta the Dabo Girl. It was at a Trek convention thingy.

[DoctorAction]

Nice. I loved DS9 to bits. So much great stuff in there.

Anyone seen any Disco S4? No idea when we'll be getting it in the UK at present.

Same boat.  Looks like we have to wait for Paramount + (or whatever it's called) to arrive in the UK, which is currently defined as 'early next year'.  To be honest I can't face yet another streaming service - I'm already on Netflix, Prime and Disney+.   I'm also guessing Prime will lose Picard and Lower Decks?

I feel much the same. If that strike season is there I'll sign up for a month but i won't keep another one on the go at all times.

[soupytwist]

Nice. I loved DS9 to bits. So much great stuff in there.

Anyone seen any Disco S4? No idea when we'll be getting it in the UK at present.

Same boat.  Looks like we have to wait for Paramount + (or whatever it's called) to arrive in the UK, which is currently defined as 'early next year'.  To be honest I can't face yet another streaming service - I'm already on Netflix, Prime and Disney+.   I'm also guessing Prime will lose Picard and Lower Decks?

I feel much the same. If that strike season is there I'll sign up for a month but i won't keep another one on the go at all times.

I know someone at work who has a hacked firestick, basically it's now a kodi box - he can watch pretty much whatever he wants, including all the new film releases.  I used to be dead against this kind off stuff - but I'm tiring of all these streaming site now and i'm toying with getting my firestick done too. 

[El Barto]

Meanwhile, Orbert is watching Deep Space Nine and is into Season Four

Holy Shit, this show is really firing on all cylinders right now.  Even when they revisit classic or clichéed sci-fi themes and tropes, they're doing them well and coming up with reasonably interesting and entertaining stories.

Hippocratic Oath - O'Brien and Bashir crash land and are captured by some Jem'Hadar who happen to be trying to beat their addiction to ketrecel white, which is basically what enslaves them to the Founders.  As the episode title suggests, there are disagreements about whether the priority is helping the Jem'Hadar or getting the hell out of there.

Indiscretion - Gul Dukat has a half-Bajoran daughter?  Dukat and Kira spend some quality time together?  Kasidy Yates might be finding a place to stay on DS9?  Well, two out of three ain't bad.

Rejoined - Torias Dax, one of Jadzia Dax's previous hosts, died in an accident.  His widow was another Trill, who eventually died and whose symbiont, Kahn, is now Lenara Kahn.  Trill law forbids Dax and Kahn getting back together, or acknowledging each other at all, but hey, they were in love then, and they still are, doesn't matter if they're both in new hosts now.  It gets complicated.  Apparently "the kiss" was controversial at the time (Lenara is female, and so is Jadzia) but in true sci-fi fashion, no one on the show has any problem with that; it's that symbionts aren't supposed to reassociate.  Pretty cool exploration into Trill culture.

Starship Down - The title comes from the movie "Gray Lady Down" which had to do with submarines sneaking around in the depths, trying to find and kill each other.  It was revisited in the TOS episode "Balance of Terror" and the Mutara Nebula scene in "STII: The Wrath of Kahn".  Here, it's The Defiant and two Jem'Hadar ships.  They come up with a few new takes on a classic scenario.  Also, Worf learns not to be such an asshole to the guys in Engineering who are just trying to, you know, save everyone's lives.

Little Green Men - Remember when the TOS Enterprise visited Earth back in the 20th century?  Wouldn't it be wacky if the Ferengi did kinda the same thing?  Better yet, it all plays out like in "Escape from the Planet of the Apes" complete with sympathetic scientists and sterotypical military asshats.  Yeah, I know, it's sounds horrible, but I found it to be pretty fun.

The writing has been tight.  The stories have been new like only Star Trek can do, old and worn, and everything in between, but always entertaining or at least interesting.  I'm really digging this.

All good stuff. Seasons 4 and 5 are kind of the calm before the storm. There's plenty of Dominion intrigue, and some set piece episodes, but they've still got plenty of time for basic sci-fi stuff. It's basically the cold war half of the Dominion war.

Coincidentally, I watched The Enemy Below and Run Silent, Run Deep over the weekend. Balance of Terror was definitely a remake of TEB; even some of the dialogue (he's a devil this one. I must do everything in my power to get us home.). Sounds like I should add Grey Lady Down to my list.

Good throwback line to Nog discovering that Sisko is a dead ringer for Gabriel Bell in LGM. And it's hard to go wrong with Charles Napier as an asshole army guy.

[soupytwist]

I find the peaks and troughs on DS9 very similar to Next Gen.  First 2 seasons are the weakest, then they start to have a upturn on Season 3.  Seasons 4 - 6 are the peak and the final Season on both shows the quality drops.   The lows are much rougher on The Next Gen though.

[Orbert]

I'm nearing the end of Season 3 of my DS9 watch, and a few episodes ago there was a brief scene with someone named Leeta who is pretty and has large breasts.  She lamely approached Dr. Bashir about having a (fake) cough for a few days.  Bashir gets a lewd smile and offers to examine her right away.  That's all we see of her.

I've actually met Chase Masterton who played Leeta the Dabo Girl. It was at a Trek convention thingy.

I didn't mean to demean the actress; or maybe I did, but in an obviously facetious if not exactly humorous way.  It's just that her walk-on scene clearly accentuated her ample assets, and then a few episodes later she's sitting there with the main cast as an equal.  It seemed like we were just supposed to accept that she's main cast now, especially since she's "one of Jadzia's closest friends".  But we haven't seen her since, so now I'm wondering what the point of all of that was.

[ReaperKK]

Nice. I loved DS9 to bits. So much great stuff in there.

Anyone seen any Disco S4? No idea when we'll be getting it in the UK at present.

Same boat.  Looks like we have to wait for Paramount + (or whatever it's called) to arrive in the UK, which is currently defined as 'early next year'.  To be honest I can't face yet another streaming service - I'm already on Netflix, Prime and Disney+.   I'm also guessing Prime will lose Picard and Lower Decks?

I feel much the same. If that strike season is there I'll sign up for a month but i won't keep another one on the go at all times.

I know someone at work who has a hacked firestick, basically it's now a kodi box - he can watch pretty much whatever he wants, including all the new film releases.  I used to be dead against this kind off stuff - but I'm tiring of all these streaming site now and i'm toying with getting my firestick done too. 

I had a Kodi thumbstick for a while too and it was great, a little finnicky at times but it worked well. One thing that doesn't work well is the Paramount app, it's trash and probably the worst stream app out now IMO.