Star Trek: Thread Space 9

[Adami]

Sam is Kirk's brother. He didn't really have much story in TOS, other than dying. They went to a planet where Sam lived with this family and some weird alien things killed most of them including Sam. That's about it.

Gotchya.  So, again... nice fan service, but nothing too threatening involving him will happen if this series is also canon to TOS.  Again, I didn't watch Discovery, but seem to recall there were some timeline deviations introduced.  So, is SNW linear to TOS?

SNW is years before TOS. Looks like around 8-10? Not 100% sure when Pike is supposed to have been disfigured in TOS, if it was long before or during the show. I think during. And we're 10 years from that.

I think the Sam Kirk thing was mostly to throw off fans, but it seems James T will be joining us next season, which I'm not fond of, but such is life.

[Progmetty]

Ehh….first season of Discovery wasn’t bad…..second was decent……but since then it’s a mess. There’s quite a bit of co tent in this thread detailing why so no need to rehash……simply put…..it’s Horribly written and acted.

That's why I made sure to mention I've only seen the first 6 episodes of Discovery, it may indeed go to shit for me later as well.

Progmetty

You should at least check the newest episode of The Orville. Seth pretty much jettisoned the comedy altogether. At first he was trying to do his homage to TNG with a bit of his own style of humor wrapped around it…but I think since he knows this is his last hurrah, he’s doubled down on the drama and made a pretty heavy intro to his third and final season. I’m curious to see what you’d think. I don’t think I laughed once. But I was pleasantly surprised.

You may have misinterpreted what I wrote sir, or most likely I didn't phrase it good. I love The Orville as a parody of Star Trek, I enjoy McFarlane's brand of comedy in it's every incarnation, heck you're talking to one of the few remaining people watching new Family Guy episodes as they air heh

What I meant was that I didn't want what The Orville offers to also be present in actual Star Trek. SNW has way too much humor for my Trek-taste.

I'll definitely be watching the new Orville episodes when I get home, I'm out in the middle of nowhere for work so I can't stream or download anything, I only watch the physical media I brought with me, but I'll sure post about it once I've seen it 

[Progmetty]

Sam is Kirk's brother. He didn't really have much story in TOS, other than dying. They went to a planet where Sam lived with this family and some weird alien things killed most of them including Sam. That's about it.

Gotchya.  So, again... nice fan service, but nothing too threatening involving him will happen if this series is also canon to TOS.  Again, I didn't watch Discovery, but seem to recall there were some timeline deviations introduced.  So, is SNW linear to TOS?

SNW is years before TOS. Looks like around 8-10? Not 100% sure when Pike is supposed to have been disfigured in TOS, if it was long before or during the show. I think during. And we're 10 years from that.

I think the Sam Kirk thing was mostly to throw off fans, but it seems James T will be joining us next season, which I'm not fond of, but such is life.

It should be 13 years before The Menagerie, I went back and rewatched The Menagerie recently.

"This is thirteen years ago. The Enterprise and its commander, Captain Christopher Pike." Spock, while footage of The Cage was being reviewed for his hearing on The Menagerie.

However, the events of The Cage should be the tail end of SNW, so we could possibly be 15 years or so before TOS.

[Adami]

I dunno when The Cage happens, but they said his accident will happen in 10 years.

[El Barto]

It should be 13 years before The Menagerie, I went back and rewatched The Menagerie recently.

Big fan of The Menagerie. Great job of overlaying the Kirk crew with the original story. And Spock's part of it is excellent.

As for "not really Star Trek," and I'm a big part of that camp, Adami wrote something out a year or two ago that pretty much nailed it. I therefore won't dig into it too much, but the universe that Roddenberry created doesn't really seem to exist anymore. There's not really any optimism. There's no enlightened humanity. Everybody in the federation acts like 21st century Americans, and it doesn't work for me. DS9 was somewhat serialized, though not as much as people think, and it was fantastic. No problem with long story arcs (theirs was 4 seasons or so). It was also quite dark, at times, what with the war and all. The crew actually did things they probably shouldn't have. At the end of the day, though, it was still Roddenberry's universe and they tried their damnedest to maintain the more enlightened attitude that he wanted the future to portray. Nowadays these things seem to have become something of a crutch, though. Season long stories. Fan wank. Dark and brooding. It just seems to me that they abandoned what made ST unique and recreated it for much younger, more modern audiences.

[soupytwist]

Think there is a difference between what Roddenberry created with ToS and what he wanted to create with TNG - It wasn't until control was wrestled from him (TNG season 3) when the show and that period of Trek (TNG - Ent) really took shape.   Roddenberry's TNG no conflict vide wasn't making for overly enjoyable scripts.   Also Roddenberry hated Wrath of Khan.

As much as I love Roddenberry for giving us Trek, I think his vision in the 80's was not the right direction.

He also had to be talked out of this...

[jammindude]

6 episodes, 6 home runs.

I’m pleased.

[Orbert]

I liked this one, too.  It had a few twists to it, or at least I thought it was going to go a certain direction, then went elsewhere, more than once.  I like that.  I want them to keep me guessing, and making me guess wrong sometimes.

[jammindude]

And again…it really felt like TOS 2.0 without feeling like a complete retread. It’s got just enough new to make it fresh again. I can’t stop feeling giddy.

[Orbert]

The Trivia for this episode on IMDb says that it's based on an unused TOS script by Roddenberry.  It definitely had a TOS feel to it.

[gmillerdrake]

So moving forward I guess I’ll just stop starting my comments about the weeks episode from SNW with “this show is so much better than Discovery and Picard”……. It’s just a given at this point.

Another solid episode. I think my favorite part was that they didn’t save the kid. That may sound sick and strange to say but I like that there wasn’t a last minute ‘save’ and a happily ever after. But then they end it with some hope for the Dr’s kid so…..really well done.

[Adami]

Yea. Really good episode.

Keep up the good work!

[gmillerdrake]

Another good episode…..although I have a feeling I should have known who those characters were but my limited ST knowledge has hindered that understanding

[jammindude]

STANDING OVATION AT THE ENDING REVEAL!!!!!!

[Orbert]

Another good episode…..although I have a feeling I should have known who those characters were but my limited ST knowledge has hindered that understanding

In the Original Series episode "Amok Time", Spock travels to Vulcan to officially marry T'Pring.  The Vulcan version of "if anyone objects..." is that the bride-to-be has the right to require that the groom-to-be fight for her.  T'Pring is basically tired of waiting for Spock to decide between his career and her, and she has chosen this dude named Stonn over him.  We met Stonn in this episode; he was the guy working with her at the rehab place.

The guy at the very end, Aspen/Angel's husband, is Sybok, Spock's half-brother from STV: The Final Frontier.

The fanservice and constant callbacks (callforwards?) to TOS canon is mostly well-done, augmenting lore while not really contradicting it, but it's starting to feel like they're stuffing in as much as of it as they can per episode, rather than letting it unfold more organically.

[gmillerdrake]

Another good episode…..although I have a feeling I should have known who those characters were but my limited ST knowledge has hindered that understanding

In the Original Series episode "Amok Time", Spock travels to Vulcan to officially marry T'Pring.  The Vulcan version of "if anyone objects..." is that the bride-to-be has the right to require that the groom-to-be fight for her.  T'Pring is basically tired of waiting for Spock to decide between his career and her, and she has chosen this dude named Stonn over him.  We met Stonn in this episode; he was the guy working with her at the rehab place.

The guy at the very end, Aspen/Angel's husband, is Sybok, Spock's half-brother from STV: The Final Frontier.

The fanservice and constant callbacks (callforwards?) to TOS canon is mostly well-done, augmenting lore while not really contradicting it, but it's starting to feel like they're stuffing in as much as of it as they can per episode, rather than letting it unfold more organically.

Thanks a ton for that background info 

[Adami]

It was an okay episode. Nothing as bad as Picard but weakest so far. Still very Trek though.

[Orbert]

Oh yeah, kinda obvious but still fun: Sybok and Spock and the sons of Sarek.  All are five-letter names that start with "S" and end with "k".

[Dream Team]

There is ABSOLUTELY. NO. REASON. to rewrite Spock’s backstory. It was established Vulcans don’t kiss. In TOS he hadn’t seen T’Pring since their engagement as children. They could have picked any other male character to depict navigating a relationship instead of shoe-horning Spock into it and ret-conning. That’s JJ Abrams level garbage. Not to mention as El Barto stated, everybody’s using 21st century colloquialisms. Show has great potential but they need to clean up some crap.

[King Postwhore]

You can only say this if you go 7 years with a kiss or contact.

[El Barto]

Not to mention as El Barto stated, everybody’s using 21st century colloquialisms. Show has great potential but they need to clean up some crap.

Did somebody refer to the pon farr as "Vulcans going cray cray?" 

[Orbert]

I'm okay with the occassional anachronistic phrase, as long as it's something that feels natural and like it's an expression we could conceivably be using hundreds of years from now.  I'm not a huge Discovery fan, but I remember one scene where Ensign Tilly was being shown some amazing thing and she just exclaimed "That's fucking cool!"  First F-bomb on a Trek show (I think) and it was perfect.  Perfect for the character and the circumstances, and I bought it.  Pike saying "Hit it!" also works for me.  But "Vulcans going cray cray" is going too far.  I'm not sure where the line is, but fucking "cray cray" is over it for me, too.  Hate that fucking expression.

[ZirconBlue]

There is ABSOLUTELY. NO. REASON. to rewrite Spock’s backstory. It was established Vulcans don’t kiss. In TOS he hadn’t seen T’Pring since their engagement as children. They could have picked any other male character to depict navigating a relationship instead of shoe-horning Spock into it and ret-conning. That’s JJ Abrams level garbage. Not to mention as El Barto stated, everybody’s using 21st century colloquialisms. Show has great potential but they need to clean up some crap.

I'm glad I'm not a purist.  It seems exhausting.

[jammindude]

There is ABSOLUTELY. NO. REASON. to rewrite Spock’s backstory. It was established Vulcans don’t kiss. In TOS he hadn’t seen T’Pring since their engagement as children. They could have picked any other male character to depict navigating a relationship instead of shoe-horning Spock into it and ret-conning. That’s JJ Abrams level garbage. Not to mention as El Barto stated, everybody’s using 21st century colloquialisms. Show has great potential but they need to clean up some crap.

I'm glad I'm not a purist.  It seems exhausting.

Right there with you.

Seriously. It’s the best Star Trek show in almost 30 years. That’s what I choose to focus on.

[hefdaddy42]

There is ABSOLUTELY. NO. REASON. to rewrite Spock’s backstory. It was established Vulcans don’t kiss. In TOS he hadn’t seen T’Pring since their engagement as children. They could have picked any other male character to depict navigating a relationship instead of shoe-horning Spock into it and ret-conning. That’s JJ Abrams level garbage. Not to mention as El Barto stated, everybody’s using 21st century colloquialisms. Show has great potential but they need to clean up some crap.

I'm glad I'm not a purist.  It seems exhausting.

I get what you mean, but at the same time, what was the point of laying all of the foundations of the franchis for decades if they were irrelevant?  Especially with this, the original fanatic genre fanbase?

[ZirconBlue]

There is ABSOLUTELY. NO. REASON. to rewrite Spock’s backstory. It was established Vulcans don’t kiss. In TOS he hadn’t seen T’Pring since their engagement as children. They could have picked any other male character to depict navigating a relationship instead of shoe-horning Spock into it and ret-conning. That’s JJ Abrams level garbage. Not to mention as El Barto stated, everybody’s using 21st century colloquialisms. Show has great potential but they need to clean up some crap.

I'm glad I'm not a purist.  It seems exhausting.

I get what you mean, but at the same time, what was the point of laying all of the foundations of the franchis for decades if they were irrelevant?  Especially with this, the original fanatic genre fanbase?

When they "laid the foundations" of TOS, it was a very different TV environment.  There was little concern for continuity and they were for the most part making it up as they went along.  The idea that there would be decades of spin-offs from TOS was probably inconceivable for the writers on the show.  Integrating TOS into the continuity of later shows is just naturally going to require some changes and retcons.  They have to do what's best for the current show and not slavishly stick to existing continuity.  I know you don't care for prequels, so would probably say they just shouldn't even do the show in the first place.  But in the context of this show, I'm happy for them to take liberties where needed to update for a more modern audience. 

[DoctorAction]

Finally, SNW sent a landing party to my place in the UK last night. Watched the first episode.

Enjoyed it. Wasn't blown away but looking forward to more. Pike is terrific. The references to what happened in Disco S2 I found to be very effective. Love the positivity about the federation, and the first contact scenario was really well done.

Good fun!

[soupytwist]

Finally, SNW sent a landing party to my place in the UK last night. Watched the first episode.

Enjoyed it. Wasn't blown away but looking forward to more. Pike is terrific. The references to what happened in Disco S2 I found to be very effective. Love the positivity about the federation, and the first contact scenario was really well done.

Good fun!

I'm hoping to get beamed aboard later today (depends if Paramount Plus is on the firestick).  So I may join you on this 8 week mission to explore Strange New Worlds.

[DoctorAction]

Finally, SNW sent a landing party to my place in the UK last night. Watched the first episode.

Enjoyed it. Wasn't blown away but looking forward to more. Pike is terrific. The references to what happened in Disco S2 I found to be very effective. Love the positivity about the federation, and the first contact scenario was really well done.

Good fun!

I'm hoping to get beamed aboard later today (depends if Paramount Plus is on the firestick).  So I may join you on this 8 week mission to explore Strange New Worlds.

Nice. I needn't have been nervous about dropping in Trek verbage too liberally. 

I found it on Prime as channel add-on, in case that's an easy route for you.

[soupytwist]

Finally, SNW sent a landing party to my place in the UK last night. Watched the first episode.

Enjoyed it. Wasn't blown away but looking forward to more. Pike is terrific. The references to what happened in Disco S2 I found to be very effective. Love the positivity about the federation, and the first contact scenario was really well done.

Good fun!

Have they just dropped the first episode or have they released upto where the US is at?

I'm hoping to get beamed aboard later today (depends if Paramount Plus is on the firestick).  So I may join you on this 8 week mission to explore Strange New Worlds.

Nice. I needn't have been nervous about dropping in Trek verbage too liberally. 

I found it on Prime as channel add-on, in case that's an easy route for you.

[DoctorAction]

Watched ep 2. Liking the fun aspect. All very familiar. Looks amazing. Reminds me of when Nintendo re-release an old Mario title with souped-up graphics, in a way.

Found it a bit surprising that 2 of the characters' emotional back stories are rather similar, revealed on consecutive episodes.

Pike's hair is amazing. 

Like it. Will be really interesting to see how it pans out.

[gmillerdrake]

This weeks episode was 'ok'. Not bad by any means....just a 'different' type of story

[Orbert]

It had a lot of "classic Trek" elements to it.  Some kind of weird space anomaly, some kind of altered reality (probably related to the weird space anomaly), one -- or possibly a small subset -- of the crew is aware that things are altered, while the rest of the crew is altered.  And so on.  The only twist I didn't see coming was the ending with M'Benga's daughter, although obviously something was going to happen with her.  But it was fun.  I laughed out loud multiple times, and regardless of whatever else happens, if I laugh out loud, I'm being entertained.

[jammindude]

Shades of “Inner Light” with its own dash of flavor.

I really love this show!

[El Barto]

Perfectly good. I enjoyed the first two episodes. I kind of get the impression that the first six are going to be character development for each of the main crewmembers. Not a fan as I don't really care for that type of exposition. Reveal bits here and there naturally throughout the course of the series would be my preference. Still, I thought it was pretty good. Once they get past that it should be very good. Alas, we're probably looking at years before the next season. That's one thing I dislike about the new model of television.

I like that they returned to the original style phasers, rather than the pew-pew-pew variety they'd switched to.
Don't like Spock and his old lady making out in public. That didn't seem right at all.
I like that Sam Kirk's first instinct was to nearly get himself killed.
Don't like that Sam and Spock serve together, when originally there was no relation. That seems a bigger contradiction than the Spock/T'Pring thing.