Star Trek: Thread Space 9

[abydos]

That episode where 7/9 was the doctor was both stupid and hilarious. I enjoyed it quite a bit.

[Adami]

Forgot to post my Discover season 2 thoughts!

I mostly liked it! A a huge major improvement over season 1.

They had to re-write a bunch of the characters, but it was for the better.

Tyler Ash was still a meh character but they did the best they could with the mess they inherited. His romance with Michael was REALLY forced though. Didn't believe it for a second, sadly.

Pike was amazing, as I've pointed out. The new Spock was.....fine. As his own character, he was really good. As Spock, he just wasn't Spock in the slightest bit. These shows just don't seem to get Vulcans sadly. But like I said, call him Slock and he's a good character who just happens to look Vulcan mostly.

The new Enterprise look was good. I know I had issues at the end of season 1, but that might have just been my hatred for season 1 carrying over. Once they got on the ship, it was lovely.

I honestly didn't have a problem with the Red Angel stuff, being her mom and then her. All fine by me. I didn't, however, like Control as the villain. Just felt kind of weak. Also made the overall bad guy really similar plot wise to Picard. They did an okay job with Control, I just didn't care for it. Though, I am glad they didn't go the direction I thought they would when he was all like "Struggle is Pointless" and I began very quickly shaking my head.

So yea, liked it. Was sad to see it go. I would be interested in a Pike/Enterprise spin off. Maybe they can make Spock a little more Spock like.


However, it actually made me even MORE angry at Picard. Season 2 demonstrated that they listened to a lot of the complaints, made the necessary corrections, and tried to get back into the spirit of Trek. Then they follow that up with Picard? Picard feels like they didn't learn a god damn thing and just double downed on everything wrong with season 1. Ugh.

[DoctorAction]

Cool. Glad you liked it. I agree with all of that. Can't wait for season 3. 

[masterthes]

So, Space Seed, Checkov was never on the Enterprise during that episode, so how did Khan recognize him in the movie? i also found it laughable in the fight scene between Khan and Kirk, you can clearly see Shatner's stunt double

[Orbert]

That issue came up while they were making the movie, and it led to the very careful wording that Khan uses when he sees Chekhov:

"You... I never forget a face.  Mister... (dramatic pause) Chekhov!"

The implication obviously is that he recognizes him, and we know Chekhov wasn't on the show until the second season.  "Space Seed" was a first-season episode.

You could get all technical and say "Khan doesn't actually say that he recognizes him; he just says that he never forgets a face."  That's a cop-out and we all know it.

The best answer I've seen is that Chekhov was on The Enterprise, somewhere in the lower decks or something, before he was promoted to the bridge in the second season.  During Khan's time on board, he was given free access to the ship's records.  We know he went through the technical manuals.  It's possible that he went the through the personnel files as well.  He has an eidetic ("photographic") memory, so he knew every face of every person on board.  He never met Chekhov, but he never forgets a face.  He recognized him despite never meeting him face to face.  Or maybe he actually met him during his time on board.  We didn't see every minute of every hour Khan was on board.

[masterthes]

never even thought of that. after all, there are more than 400 people on the ship. good call

[El Barto]

Chekhov might have been the guy in charge of serving tea to Indian visitors. They could have been buddies. In any case, it goes both ways. Chekhov recognized Khan, and new the specifics of what had transpired. In fact, he went into a panic as soon as he saw the Botany Bay seatbelts. Pretty clearly it was intended that he was a part of the crew. Since every episode introduced new crew-members, unnamed bridge crew, strangers wandering the halls, attractive historians, redshirts, his presence is certainly plausible.

[DoctorAction]

I just read that the Captain Pike series is well under way and will be called Star Trek: Strange New Worlds. 

(And that the Section 31 series has been put on hold, which is also good news, AFAIC)

[Adami]

I just read that the Captain Pike series is well under way and will be called Star Trek: Strange New Worlds. 

(And that the Section 31 series has been put on hold, which is also good news, AFAIC)

I am excited about the Strange New Worlds one, but holy god they need to diversify that creative team. It's basically the same few people doing everything and they aren't great.

[abydos]

Classic Star Trek show about future and optimism.. from the same people that gave us Picard and Discovery? I am hopeful but.. at the same time I don't believe it.

[Adami]

Classic Star Trek show about future and optimism.. from the same people that gave us Picard and Discovery? I am hopeful but.. at the same time I don't believe it.

The 2nd season of discovery had a good amount of that, and largely thanks to characters like Pike.

Honestly, if all I had seen was season 1 of Discovery and Picard, I would just laugh this off. And maybe season 2 was a fluke since they went SO backward with Picard, but maybe not? Who knows?

[DoctorAction]

I'm pretty nervous about season 3 of Discovery... But I'd be surprised if they couldn't make the Pike show work. I'd like to think that they've had enough experience in it to see what works and what doesn't now. It's in a weird place.

I cant imagine who's interested in seeing what Picard is up to next... Shopping for slippers and doing a crossword while the crew battles a race of savage warrior fascists? Running into Geordi and comparing artificial eyes? Picard falls asleep in the middle of the final space battle but no-one notices as he wasn't doing anything anyway.

[soupytwist]

Personally I thought Picard was the best first season of Star Trek we have had since TOS.  I want Worf in Season 2 though.

[abydos]

So.. I just finished Voyager. That ending is so bad it's hilarious. Worse than Enterprise's. Did they suddenly cancel the show and they had to finish the arc fast or what? There's no buildup, there's no resolution. Hey, we're back lol - the end.

[soupytwist]

So.. I just finished Voyager. That ending is so bad it's hilarious. Worse than Enterprise's. Did they suddenly cancel the show and they had to finish the arc fast or what? There's no buildup, there's no resolution. Hey, we're back lol - the end.

It's a bland ending for a generally bland show.

[Polarbear]

So.. I just finished Voyager. That ending is so bad it's hilarious. Worse than Enterprise's. Did they suddenly cancel the show and they had to finish the arc fast or what? There's no buildup, there's no resolution. Hey, we're back lol - the end.

Nothing is worse than the Enterprise's ending!

But yeah, it was pretty awful. Voyager deserved a much better ending. I enjoyed Voyager for the most part, and it had some standout characters. Still, there are a few episodes in that show that belong to the very bottom of awful Trek.

[soupytwist]

When the awful writers on that show decided to put Seven with Chatotay you knew they were just trolling the fanbase.

Very occassionally you saw what Voyager could and should have been during its run, but 90% is uninspired slop.

[DoctorAction]

Personally I thought Picard was the best first season of Star Trek we have had since TOS.  I want Worf in Season 2 though.

Fair enough. 

I'd tune in for Worf.

[soupytwist]

Personally I thought Picard was the best first season of Star Trek we have had since TOS.  I want Worf in Season 2 though.

Fair enough. 

To be fair first seasons of Star Trek shows aren't up to much.  ToS is the only one that hit the ground running.  DS9 first season is as OK but is the weakest season of that show.   TNG first season is laughable, Disco was a mess and Voyager and Ent are bad shows whichever season!
Picard for me was coherient, tonally sound and introduced some decent new characters.  Also it did in one episode what TNG couldn't do in 7 seasons - made Troi a proper character!!

[Adami]

I’d put Picard as the worst first season of any Star Trek. Boom.

[SoundscapeMN]

Alex Kurtzman needs to go bye bye.

[soupytwist]

I’d put Picard as the worst first season of any Star Trek. Boom.

I wouldn't have expected anything else from you 

[abydos]

Personally I thought Picard was the best first season of Star Trek we have had since TOS.  I want Worf in Season 2 though.

Fair enough. 

Picard for me was coherient, tonally sound and introduced some decent new characters

Like who? The show barely had Picard as a character. Or do you mean Broody guy Template 1, Attempt at comedy relief template 2, etc? Two things Picard lacked the most - Star Trek and character.

[Polarbear]

One thing that is bugging me about Picard, is how the Synthetic plot is ripped straight out of Mass Effect..

Was it the second to last episode, where Soji's sister has the vision of the synthetics waiting in the space between galaxies, for a signal to come and wipe out the organic civilizations? Literally the exact same plot as Mass Effect! It's so blatant that it hurts to watch.

I liked some things about Picard, but I wish they would have come up with something else other than a blatant ripoff of another Sci-Fi property..

[Adami]

So, continuing on my (almost) all encompasing Star Trek rewatch, I'm back to TOS. I've seen most of the episodes once or so, a few twice. Not even sure I've seen the third season. I'm MUCH more familiar with TOS crew from the movies.

So after Discovery and Enterprise, I was really worried that I wouldn't be able to get back into TOS because of the extremely low production value, cringy acting, and questionable plots that were there just to save money.

That said? I'm loving it. I obviously recognize a lot of these flaws, but they don't bug me for the most part. I'm just super invested in the characters and what's going on.

Miri was the last episode I saw, and it really wasn't great, but I'm still loving most of it.

I doubt I'll be singing this tune by the time I get to season 3, but we'll see!




Also, if anyone wants to check out the Mr. Plinkett review of Picard, it really contains a lot of my issues. It goes too far on some stuff, and obviously has a lot of humor insults, but it really touches on my major problems with Picard.

[abydos]

I was hoping they would review Picard as they did before, this Mr Plinkett thing... not as good of a format, imo.

[El Barto]

So, continuing on my (almost) all encompasing Star Trek rewatch, I'm back to TOS. I've seen most of the episodes once or so, a few twice. Not even sure I've seen the third season. I'm MUCH more familiar with TOS crew from the movies.

So after Discovery and Enterprise, I was really worried that I wouldn't be able to get back into TOS because of the extremely low production value, cringy acting, and questionable plots that were there just to save money.

That said? I'm loving it. I obviously recognize a lot of these flaws, but they don't bug me for the most part. I'm just super invested in the characters and what's going on.

Miri was the last episode I saw, and it really wasn't great, but I'm still loving most of it.

I doubt I'll be singing this tune by the time I get to season 3, but we'll see!

Try and go into S3 with an open mind. I honestly never thought of it as much different than the first two. There were crappy episodes in all three seasons, and some really good ones in each. There's only a slightly different ratio of crap to good. S3 still has some very good ones, some perfectly average ones, and some stinkers. The only real distinction I've found between the seasons is that the bottom third of S1 was consistently very good. Best string of great episodes they've done.

[Adami]

So, continuing on my (almost) all encompasing Star Trek rewatch, I'm back to TOS. I've seen most of the episodes once or so, a few twice. Not even sure I've seen the third season. I'm MUCH more familiar with TOS crew from the movies.

So after Discovery and Enterprise, I was really worried that I wouldn't be able to get back into TOS because of the extremely low production value, cringy acting, and questionable plots that were there just to save money.

That said? I'm loving it. I obviously recognize a lot of these flaws, but they don't bug me for the most part. I'm just super invested in the characters and what's going on.

Miri was the last episode I saw, and it really wasn't great, but I'm still loving most of it.

I doubt I'll be singing this tune by the time I get to season 3, but we'll see!

Try and go into S3 with an open mind. I honestly never thought of it as much different than the first two. There were crappy episodes in all three seasons, and some really good ones in each. There's only a slightly different ratio of crap to good. S3 still has some very good ones, some perfectly average ones, and some stinkers. The only real distinction I've found between the seasons is that the bottom third of S1 was consistently very good. Best string of great episodes they've done.

I think I've gone into all of this with as much of an open mind as I can. I certainly didn't expect to enjoy Discover season 2.

I think what happened last time was I was watching like 4-5 episodes of TOS a day and just became burned out on it. Now I'm doing one every day or two. This will hopefully help keep it fresh enough and not make me tired of it. But no, I'll be open. I just remember hearing a general consensus that season 3 was rough.

[El Barto]

Looking at S3 on Wiki there's a picture of the DVD set, and it's a redshirt. 



Really, though, I consider the seasons interchangeable. If you grew up seeing it on TV every day on syndication they were usually run out of order, and since there's no continuity you never really noticed.

[DoctorAction]

Looking at S3 on Wiki there's a picture of the DVD set, and it's a redshirt.

I tried watching the Mr Plinket Picard review. He definitely has some good points that i completely agree with but i turned off after half an hour - with an hour left to go! Really, that's more self-indulgence than i have the patience for.

[soupytwist]

Just been researching the Star Trek films.  Last night was Insurrections - only the second time I've watched it all the way through, I forced myself to the end last night.  This isnt just the worst Star Trek film (by a mile) it's probably the worst Star Trek fullstop.  The plot is dull and it makes no sense and it throw all the good will 'First Contact' created, it's a cesspit of bad choices.

[Adami]

Just been researching the Star Trek films.  Last night was Insurrections - only the second time I've watched it all the way through, I forced myself to the end last night.  This isnt just the worst Star Trek film (by a mile) it's probably the worst Star Trek fullstop.  The plot is dull and it makes no sense and it throw all the good will 'First Contact' created, it's a cesspit of bad choices.

It’s not great but it’s not bad. I’d put Final Frontier, Nemesis, Into
Darkness, and Beyond as worse. I’d tie it with Star Trek 09.


Edit: Maybe id also tie it with Beyond.

[King Postwhore]

Just been researching the Star Trek films.  Last night was Insurrections - only the second time I've watched it all the way through, I forced myself to the end last night.  This isnt just the worst Star Trek film (by a mile) it's probably the worst Star Trek fullstop.  The plot is dull and it makes no sense and it throw all the good will 'First Contact' created, it's a cesspit of bad choices.

It’s not great but it’s not bad. I’d put Final Frontier, Nemesis, Into
Darkness, and Beyond as worse. I’d tie it with Star Trek 09.


Edit: Maybe id also tie it with Beyond.

You are forgetting the 1st movie.  That was dull from start to finish.

[Adami]

Just been researching the Star Trek films.  Last night was Insurrections - only the second time I've watched it all the way through, I forced myself to the end last night.  This isnt just the worst Star Trek film (by a mile) it's probably the worst Star Trek fullstop.  The plot is dull and it makes no sense and it throw all the good will 'First Contact' created, it's a cesspit of bad choices.

It’s not great but it’s not bad. I’d put Final Frontier, Nemesis, Into
Darkness, and Beyond as worse. I’d tie it with Star Trek 09.


Edit: Maybe id also tie it with Beyond.

You are forgetting the 1st movie.  That was dull from start to finish.

I actually liked it. It’s not high on my list, but I’d put it at least higher than the ones I mentioned.

[DoctorAction]

Quite liked Insurrection. I felt it was fairly quiet, which was nice for a movie. Felt a lot like an episode to me.

I was thinking about rating all the films but I can't. Instead I went for 3 categories - how I feel about watching them again. Want to / might do / don't want to. No particular order within those categories.

Want to

ST:TMP
ST2:TROK
ST6:TUD
ST:GEN
ST:2009
ST:ID
ST:BEY

Might do

ST5:TFF
ST:FC
ST:INS


Don't want to

ST3:TSFS
ST4:TVH
ST:NEM