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Post your controversial music opinions v. I couldn't find the previous one

Started by Super Dude, September 13, 2016, 05:07:18 AM

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Prog Snob

Quote from: twosuitsluke on September 15, 2016, 04:49:12 AM
A few more:

Iron Maiden aren't all that.

By the Way is the best Red Hot Chilli Peppers album

Tesseract are overrated

You dislike two great bands and praise one of the worst bands ever.  :facepalm:

twosuitsluke

Quote from: Prog Snob on September 15, 2016, 04:52:44 AM
Quote from: twosuitsluke on September 15, 2016, 04:49:12 AM
A few more:

Iron Maiden aren't all that.

By the Way is the best Red Hot Chilli Peppers album

Tesseract are overrated

You dislike two great bands and praise one of the worst bands ever.  :facepalm:

Yep, I also think My Chemical Romance are a great band  :corn

Also, for the record, I don't dislike Iron Maiden and Tesseract. I just think they get WAY more praise than I could justify giving. I still listen to both from time to time though.
Quote from: ariich on November 07, 2023, 12:38:53 PMJust popping in to say Luke, you were right.

Prog Snob

Quote from: twosuitsluke on September 15, 2016, 05:06:14 AM
Quote from: Prog Snob on September 15, 2016, 04:52:44 AM
Quote from: twosuitsluke on September 15, 2016, 04:49:12 AM
A few more:

Iron Maiden aren't all that.

By the Way is the best Red Hot Chilli Peppers album

Tesseract are overrated

You dislike two great bands and praise one of the worst bands ever.  :facepalm:

Yep, I also think My Chemical Romance are a great band  :corn

I never really heard them, so I won't judge.  ;)

twosuitsluke

Quote from: Prog Snob on September 15, 2016, 05:08:53 AM
Quote from: twosuitsluke on September 15, 2016, 05:06:14 AM
Quote from: Prog Snob on September 15, 2016, 04:52:44 AM
Quote from: twosuitsluke on September 15, 2016, 04:49:12 AM
A few more:

Iron Maiden aren't all that.

By the Way is the best Red Hot Chilli Peppers album

Tesseract are overrated

You dislike two great bands and praise one of the worst bands ever.  :facepalm:

Yep, I also think My Chemical Romance are a great band  :corn

I never really heard them, so I won't judge.  ;)

They just got lumped in with the whole emo=shit thing.

Most people who hated on them probably never listened to them.
Quote from: ariich on November 07, 2023, 12:38:53 PMJust popping in to say Luke, you were right.

Prog Snob


King Postwhore

I've never owned anything by them but the seem very adventurous and willing to grow from album to album from the songs I've heard.
"I don't like country music, but I don't mean to denigrate those who do. And for the people who like country music, denigrate means 'put down'." - Bon Newhart.

twosuitsluke

They were kind of an easy target. They always promoted each album with a new image which also brought criticism. The Black Parade was a fairly good concept album though.
Quote from: ariich on November 07, 2023, 12:38:53 PMJust popping in to say Luke, you were right.

Sir GuitarCozmo

Quote from: Super Dude on September 15, 2016, 02:01:26 AMToday is actually the period with the best music ever.

I'm going to assume someone found a way to reverse time and it's now 1986 again?

Super Dude

Quote from: soupytwist on September 15, 2016, 03:10:15 AM
Quote from: Super Dude on September 14, 2016, 04:22:32 PM
Oh, here's one: I find The Dear Hunter's Act II to be the least enjoyable of all the albums so far, including Migrant. It's also way overrated.

But. It's. The. One. With. Red Hands. On It.

Which, I'll admit, is the song that is the reason I listen to TDH in the first place, but it's gotten to be such a tired song. It's little wonder Casey no longer wants to play it live.

Quote from: twosuitsluke on September 15, 2016, 05:06:14 AM
Quote from: Prog Snob on September 15, 2016, 04:52:44 AM
Quote from: twosuitsluke on September 15, 2016, 04:49:12 AM
A few more:

Iron Maiden aren't all that.

By the Way is the best Red Hot Chilli Peppers album

Tesseract are overrated

You dislike two great bands and praise one of the worst bands ever.  :facepalm:

Yep, I also think My Chemical Romance are a great band  :corn

Also, for the record, I don't dislike Iron Maiden and Tesseract. I just think they get WAY more praise than I could justify giving. I still listen to both from time to time though.

They're kinda "meh" for me. I like one or two songs off Three Cheers (specifically I'm Not Okay and Sleep), but they're my least favorite of the big three from the 2000s (FOB and Panic!). FOB is pretty rad btw.

Quote from: Sir GuitarCozmo on September 15, 2016, 06:16:25 AM
Quote from: Super Dude on September 15, 2016, 02:01:26 AMToday is actually the period with the best music ever.

I'm going to assume someone found a way to reverse time and it's now 1986 again?

:P This may shock you, but there are some great albums that were released in 2016, that weren't releases by bands from the '80s.

Oh, also: I hate RHCP. Their music is bad and they should feel bad.

hefdaddy42

Not sure if it's controversial or not, but Twenty One Pilots just released a cover of the My Chemical Romance song "Cancer", and it is, at a rough estimate, 1000% better than the original.

Also, the accompanying lyric video is cool as hell.

ReaperKK

Not sure if this is controversial but Twenty One Pilots is a pretty good band

hefdaddy42

Quote from: ReaperKK on September 15, 2016, 07:15:49 AM
Not sure if this is controversial but Twenty One Pilots is a pretty good band
The more I hear, the more I agree.

My 13-year old daughter is head over heels over them.

bosk1

Quote from: Super Dude on September 15, 2016, 06:31:54 AM
Quote from: Sir GuitarCozmo on September 15, 2016, 06:16:25 AM
Quote from: Super Dude on September 15, 2016, 02:01:26 AMToday is actually the period with the best music ever.

I'm going to assume someone found a way to reverse time and it's now 1986 again?

:P This may shock you, but there are some great albums that were released in 2016, that weren't releases by bands from the '80s.

Well, yeah, there were a few.  But it's hard to quantify.  Taking a quick look at the release date calendar, in 2016 so far we have gotten Megadeth, DT, Redemption, Lacuna Coil, Flotsam and Jetsam, and Fates Warning.  Yeah, you could maybe stretch a little and include Jelly Jam and Avantasia in there as well.  But at most, that's only about 8 really good albums in 2016 so far (and, yes, we can bump it up to 10 with the upcoming Epica and Neal Morse albums).  Now of those, we do have a handful of stellar albums that are arguably better than anything that came out in the '80s (DT, Fates, Redemption, and we'll see if Epica and NM qualify).  So maybe quality-wise, 2016 is "better."  But in terms of quantity of good music, we're not there.  So I guess it just depends on whether one appreciates quantity of quality or quality or quality.  And, I mean, 10 good albums in a year is a good year--don't get me wrong.  But I think it's debatable whether that makes it "the period with the best music ever."  But "controversial opinions," so...

hefdaddy42

If by "today" you mean "the modern era", i.e. the last (IDK) 10 years or so, I would say...maybe.

I certainly think there is more good music being released now than at any other point in history.  But that's a quantity issue, not a quality issue.

It's hard to say.  I mean, yes, 1986 was fantastic.  But now, living in 2016, some of the stuff that was considered to be great then now sounds dated, and I never listen to it.


Zantera

Not sure if it's a controversial opinion as much as it is a statement, but I feel like whenever people talk about "it was better back in the day" or talking about music being at an all time low point today, they really haven't explored that much modern music and they base that statement mostly on what they hear on radio or at the coffee shop.

hefdaddy42

And, some people are happy just listening to the same old stuff over and over again.

Some other people are the opposite, and seem to absorb new music at a rate for which I could never keep up and really appreciate any of the music, having such a quick turnover and not being able to absorb it.

Different strokes for different folks, I guess.

Kotowboy

When I used to listen to the radio - i'd listen to actual rock shows and guys like John Peel and Mark Radcliffe when he was on after 10PM or The Evening Session with Steve Lamacq & Jo Whiley.

Shows that played actual alternative / indie / rock ... and I discovered great bands all the time.

I rarely discover new bands new and generally just stick to my faves.

dtvoices94

1. No musician benefited more from dying early than Kurt Cobain (Jim Morrison is a close 2nd)
2. To get my hair metal fix, I go to Steel Panther or the Vinnie Vincent Invasion.  That's all I need
3. Widespread Panic > Phish
4. Guns N Roses = meh, Pearl Jam too. AC/DC as well
5. Saw Tool once.  Was bored to tears and almost fell asleep.  Left early thinking Fantomas blew them away.
6. No John Frusciante, No RHCP for me (Uplift Mofo Party Plan aside)
7. Love DT but don't care for most progressive metal
8. Ozzy has a double album of good material since Diary
9. KISS should have gone on Portnoy's hiatus after Love Gun
10. Van Hagar has one good album of material and most of it is from 5150.

hefdaddy42

Quote from: dtvoices94 on September 15, 2016, 07:43:12 AM
1. No musician benefited more from dying early than Kurt Cobain (Jim Morrison is a close 2nd)
They both died, so I'd say that both "benefited" equally. 

As in, not at all.

Kotowboy

I hate KISS.

VS is a terrible follow up to TEN.

Frusciante is a moderate guitar player. Nothing special at all. Dave Navarro is miles better.

I agree that outside of DT - I don't listen to any other bands in that style.

I saw TOOL on the 10,000 Days tour and it was really good but perfunctory. Nothing more.

Metallica are a much better band and way more consistent than Guns N Roses.

Kotowboy

Quote from: hefdaddy42 on September 15, 2016, 07:46:27 AM
Quote from: dtvoices94 on September 15, 2016, 07:43:12 AM
1. No musician benefited more from dying early than Kurt Cobain (Jim Morrison is a close 2nd)
They both died, so I'd say that both "benefited" equally. 

As in, not at all.

He probably means their legacy and people who benefit from their royalties.

Stadler

Quote from: Zantera on September 15, 2016, 07:34:30 AM
Not sure if it's a controversial opinion as much as it is a statement, but I feel like whenever people talk about "it was better back in the day" or talking about music being at an all time low point today, they really haven't explored that much modern music and they base that statement mostly on what they hear on radio or at the coffee shop.

I don't think that is necessarily true.  I think there is some truth - not an absolute rule, but some truth - to the notion that you like best what got you into the "thing" to start with.  I remember being blown out of the water by Genesis watching the "In Concert" film and then listening to Abacab.   To this day, the "Wind and Wuthering through 3SL" is by far and away my favorite period.     I got into DT back in '92 with Images and Words, and to this day it's still my favorite album (though SFAM and Octavarium are up there too).    Kiss.    Alive and Alive II were my first records, so the "Original Six" are my favorite (though Creatures is up there too).   Pearl Jam and Soundgarden - 10 and Badmotorfinger, and while I think I like Superunknown better, it's still the same era.   

So for me, I got into music in general with 70's British rock, Ritchie Blackmore, and GREAT songwriting (Billy Joel).   So for me, the music - even that made today - has to have great melody (HATE screamo vocals), has to have some coherence as a song (I don't go for the a-rhythmic, no structure type soundscapes), and it has to have decent, melodic, riff-based guitar (not a huge fan of the Tom Morello noise-scape guitar).  I don't hate music today, but something like Drake song or anything that the writer starts with "I got some beats off the interwebs" is kind of at a disadvantage with me.

ReaperKK

Quote from: Zantera on September 15, 2016, 07:34:30 AM
Not sure if it's a controversial opinion as much as it is a statement, but I feel like whenever people talk about "it was better back in the day" or talking about music being at an all time low point today, they really haven't explored that much modern music and they base that statement mostly on what they hear on radio or at the coffee shop.

Also the "back in the day" comment is taken out of context. The best music will survive from past time periods.

dtvoices94

Quote from: Kotowboy on September 15, 2016, 07:47:36 AM
Quote from: hefdaddy42 on September 15, 2016, 07:46:27 AM
Quote from: dtvoices94 on September 15, 2016, 07:43:12 AM
1. No musician benefited more from dying early than Kurt Cobain (Jim Morrison is a close 2nd)
They both died, so I'd say that both "benefited" equally. 

As in, not at all.

He probably means their legacy and people who benefit from their royalties.

Exactly...more so legacy

Sir GuitarCozmo

Quote from: Super Dude on September 15, 2016, 06:31:54 AMThis may shock you

It does.  :lol


Quote from: bosk1 on September 15, 2016, 07:26:57 AMWell, yeah, there were a few.  But it's hard to quantify.  Taking a quick look at the release date calendar, in 2016 so far we have gotten Megadeth, DT, Redemption, Lacuna Coil, Flotsam and Jetsam, and Fates Warning.  Yeah, you could maybe stretch a little and include Jelly Jam and Avantasia in there as well.  But at most, that's only about 8 really good albums in 2016 so far (and, yes, we can bump it up to 10 with the upcoming Epica and Neal Morse albums).  Now of those, we do have a handful of stellar albums that are arguably better than anything that came out in the '80s (DT, Fates, Redemption, and we'll see if Epica and NM qualify).  So maybe quality-wise, 2016 is "better."  But in terms of quantity of good music, we're not there.  So I guess it just depends on whether one appreciates quantity of quality or quality or quality.  And, I mean, 10 good albums in a year is a good year--don't get me wrong.  But I think it's debatable whether that makes it "the period with the best music ever."  But "controversial opinions," so...

It's like I don't even know you anymore.

Sacul

Quote from: bosk1 on September 15, 2016, 07:26:57 AM
Quote from: Super Dude on September 15, 2016, 06:31:54 AM
Quote from: Sir GuitarCozmo on September 15, 2016, 06:16:25 AM
Quote from: Super Dude on September 15, 2016, 02:01:26 AMToday is actually the period with the best music ever.

I'm going to assume someone found a way to reverse time and it's now 1986 again?

:P This may shock you, but there are some great albums that were released in 2016, that weren't releases by bands from the '80s.

Well, yeah, there were a few.  But it's hard to quantify.  Taking a quick look at the release date calendar, in 2016 so far we have gotten Megadeth, DT, Redemption, Lacuna Coil, Flotsam and Jetsam, and Fates Warning.  Yeah, you could maybe stretch a little and include Jelly Jam and Avantasia in there as well.  But at most, that's only about 8 really good albums in 2016 so far (and, yes, we can bump it up to 10 with the upcoming Epica and Neal Morse albums).  Now of those, we do have a handful of stellar albums that are arguably better than anything that came out in the '80s (DT, Fates, Redemption, and we'll see if Epica and NM qualify).  So maybe quality-wise, 2016 is "better."  But in terms of quantity of good music, we're not there.  So I guess it just depends on whether one appreciates quantity of quality or quality or quality.  And, I mean, 10 good albums in a year is a good year--don't get me wrong.  But I think it's debatable whether that makes it "the period with the best music ever."  But "controversial opinions," so...
Well maybe he was including music outside the prog/power metal world - like, there are only one or two albums on my AOTY list that are barely metal or rock :P

hefdaddy42

Quote from: Kotowboy on September 15, 2016, 07:47:36 AM
Quote from: hefdaddy42 on September 15, 2016, 07:46:27 AM
Quote from: dtvoices94 on September 15, 2016, 07:43:12 AM
1. No musician benefited more from dying early than Kurt Cobain (Jim Morrison is a close 2nd)
They both died, so I'd say that both "benefited" equally. 

As in, not at all.

He probably means their legacy and people who benefit from their royalties.
You think so?

bosk1

Quote from: Sacul on September 15, 2016, 08:22:22 AM
Quote from: bosk1 on September 15, 2016, 07:26:57 AM
Quote from: Super Dude on September 15, 2016, 06:31:54 AM
Quote from: Sir GuitarCozmo on September 15, 2016, 06:16:25 AM
Quote from: Super Dude on September 15, 2016, 02:01:26 AMToday is actually the period with the best music ever.

I'm going to assume someone found a way to reverse time and it's now 1986 again?

:P This may shock you, but there are some great albums that were released in 2016, that weren't releases by bands from the '80s.

Well, yeah, there were a few.  But it's hard to quantify.  Taking a quick look at the release date calendar, in 2016 so far we have gotten Megadeth, DT, Redemption, Lacuna Coil, Flotsam and Jetsam, and Fates Warning.  Yeah, you could maybe stretch a little and include Jelly Jam and Avantasia in there as well.  But at most, that's only about 8 really good albums in 2016 so far (and, yes, we can bump it up to 10 with the upcoming Epica and Neal Morse albums).  Now of those, we do have a handful of stellar albums that are arguably better than anything that came out in the '80s (DT, Fates, Redemption, and we'll see if Epica and NM qualify).  So maybe quality-wise, 2016 is "better."  But in terms of quantity of good music, we're not there.  So I guess it just depends on whether one appreciates quantity of quality or quality or quality.  And, I mean, 10 good albums in a year is a good year--don't get me wrong.  But I think it's debatable whether that makes it "the period with the best music ever."  But "controversial opinions," so...
Well maybe he was including music outside the prog/power metal world - like, there are only one or two albums on my AOTY list that are barely metal or rock :P
Well, sure, that's fine.  But I am just focusing on quality music.  I don't deny that there may be a couple of good albums that aren't rock, metal, or prog of some sort.  But I am focusing on the rule rather than the exception.

Sir GuitarCozmo


hefdaddy42


Kotowboy

Quote from: hefdaddy42 on September 15, 2016, 08:30:41 AM
Quote from: Sir GuitarCozmo on September 15, 2016, 08:30:05 AM
Nirvana was vastly overrated.
I agree with this.

Me too. Bleach is on the same level as their contemporaries from the time. Nevermind had much better songs and Butch Vig's immaculate production.

In Utero is mostly blehhhh. Even the band were famously unhappy with it.

If Nirvana split up after the MTV Unplugged Show and Kurt didn't die. I don't think they'd be anywhere near as revered.

Sir GuitarCozmo

A lot of people celebrate Nirvana as one of the bands that helped bring about the death of 80's hard rock and usher in the flannel-clad crapfest that was 90's grunge and alternative, but yeah, I think their popularity is even greater due to KC's death.  I would be curious to see what would have become of them if he was still alive.  Is it possible there would be no Foo Fighters?

Stadler

Quote from: Sir GuitarCozmo on September 15, 2016, 08:36:22 AM
A lot of people celebrate Nirvana as one of the bands that helped bring about the death of 80's hard rock and usher in the flannel-clad crapfest that was 90's grunge and alternative, but yeah, I think their popularity is even greater due to KC's death.  I would be curious to see what would have become of them if he was still alive.  Is it possible there would be no Foo Fighters?

Of course it's possible, though I think they would have still been critical darlings.    The David Frickes and Jann Wenners and Kurt Loders of the world LOVE THEM some Kurt Cobain.  The prickly, pseudo-deep, pro-feminist (complete with obligatory nail polish and anti-rape song), anti-cock rock alternative superstar...

I think if Kurt lived, Ed Vedder's career wouldn't have been what it was, because he filled in nicely for Kurt when Chris Cornell wouldn't play the part.   

I've sort of come around to why they are regarded - I believe it is largely "right place, right time", more than anything - but I too think they are FAR too over-rated.   Cock rock was going to die one way or another, it was inevitable, but it just hastened the process.  There was just far too much of this to be sustainable:


Crow

bosk your argument falls apart because you base it solely on the albums you define as "good music". just from my own purchases i'd say there are at least 10 albums from this year that i like quite a bit, none of them mentioned on your list. now include everyone in the list. suddenly there's a lot higher quantity of good music, ain't there?

Sacul

Agreed on Nirvana, they're quite lame imo.

Quote from: bosk1 on September 15, 2016, 08:29:43 AM
Well, sure, that's fine.  But I am just focusing on quality music.  I don't deny that there may be a couple of good albums that aren't rock, metal, or prog of some sort.  But I am focusing on the rule rather than the exception.
Your personal biased rule I guess :P

Also what Parama said.