Official NHL 2016-2017 Thread

[pogoowner]

It will be a fun series. Pens have the best forwards in the NHL, Preds have the best defensemen in the NHL, goaltending is a toss-up between the two teams at this point. I give Pitt the edge but I'm pulling for the Preds!

The Preds D matching up with the Pens forwards will be something to watch for early on, match ups will be key.

I have to deal with Pens fans who are my friends.  Pens fans are more annoyingly obtuse and suffer from tunnel vision worse than fans of other teams.  A guy breathes on Crosby "THAT'S A PENALTY!  HOW DID THEY MISS THAT!"  Every time a Pen falls on the ice "WHY DIDN'T THEY CALL THAT!".  A Pen commits an obvious penalty "OH SURE, CALL THAT!"  It's old.  When they had shitburgers like Cooke on the team, they look the other way.  They bitch and moan about Fleury.  True, Murray had better numbers, but Fleury won you two cups and is probably the best #2 in the league and he gets treated like a bum by their own fans.  As a Steelers and Pirates fan, I don't see the same dumbassery other than the typical football fan who knows jack about the game but thinks they are an expert, but football just seems to do that to idiots everywhere.

....Thanks..? Sounds like you have some friends that annoy you with this stuff, but once again, there are sectors of every fan base like this. Do you live in the Pittsburgh area? I only ask because Steelers fans around western PA tend to be far, far more homerish than Pens fans. And Pirate fans....well half the time they don't even admit they are fans. 

As someone who lived in Western PA for about 25 years, I will say that Steelers fans are by far the most homerish, obnoxious Pittsburgh sports fans. It's not close.

[mikeyd23]

As someone who lived in Western PA for about 25 years, I will say that Steelers fans are by far the most homerish, obnoxious Pittsburgh sports fans. It's not close.

  no doubt!

[LieLowTheWantedMan]

Baby Habs win the Memorial Cup. I'm soooo excited for Sergachev.

[Jarlaxle]

Baby Habs win the Memorial Cup. I'm soooo excited for Sergachev.

Didn't watch the game, or any junior hockey all season, but I have Sergachev in my fantasy league. What's your opinion of him, and how well he'll translate to the NHL?

[LieLowTheWantedMan]

Baby Habs win the Memorial Cup. I'm soooo excited for Sergachev.

Didn't watch the game, or any junior hockey all season, but I have Sergachev in my fantasy league. What's your opinion of him, and how well he'll translate to the NHL?

He's definitely got the skillset to be a great NHLer. Very talented and can play a smart defensive game too (which was on full display tonight). I think his biggest obstacle will be the speed of his decision making. Sometimes he takes a second to make his move and he won't have that in the NHL. Otherwise I think he was the best defenseman in his draft year, and I think he'll be a great pick. He's just gotta learn the NHL game, and depending on what happens in the off-season he could be in the lineup for the upcoming season.

[mike099]

The sidebar to this series is to see how Gary and his brother in law interact with each other as the series progresses.

[TheCountOfNYC]

Two pictures of similar plays from the same Stanley Cup Playoffs. One picture is from Game 5 of the Eastern Conference Semifinals series between the Rangers and Senators. The other is from tonight's game. The Ottawa goal was allowed. The Nashville goal was overturned due to being offsides. This isn't to start an argument over what constitutes offsides because that doesn't matter here. The problem is that two plays that look almost identical to each other can be called differently from game to game and from ref to ref. This is the biggest problem in the league today. Too many games are decided because of refs instead of being decided because of the players on the ice and the coaches on the benches. The league needs to take as much referee discretion out of the game as possible. Make every rule black and white so we can complain about missed calls instead of poorly interpreted calls. It's ridiculous that this is even an issue in the league today and it needs to end before it further ruins the product.

[Jarlaxle]

The problem with this post is that you don't quite know the exact rule. As discussed in this thread earlier, that Turris goal is NOT offside because he had full possession of the puck. If you control the puck you can skate in backwards and it doesn't make it offside. The Nashville goal is close. Personally I think it's offside, and since he was in the act of receiving a pass he does not have full control of the puck. I wad still a bit surprised that it was overturned though, it's really quite close.

[gmillerdrake]

The sidebar to this series is to see how Gary and his brother in law interact with each other as the series progresses.

All was quiet this game. I was preoccupied with knocking out the last four Episodes of Breaking Bad so didn't watch the game and I didn't hear a peep from him.

Had they won....I'm sure I'd have gotten the #smashville text I've seen a hundred times already. But tonight was quite.

[TheCountOfNYC]

The problem with this post is that you don't quite know the exact rule. As discussed in this thread earlier, that Turris goal is NOT offside because he had full possession of the puck. If you control the puck you can skate in backwards and it doesn't make it offside. The Nashville goal is close. Personally I think it's offside, and since he was in the act of receiving a pass he does not have full control of the puck. I wad still a bit surprised that it was overturned though, it's really quite close.

Oh Turris definitely wasn't offsides. I was just making the point that far too often this stuff is left up to referee discretion which should not be the case. Games should be decided by the players and coaches. Not the referees.

[jingle.boy]

The problem is that two plays that look almost identical to each other can be called differently from game to game and from ref to ref.

Here's where you went off the rails.  The two pictures are almost identical, but the two plays were not - similar, but certainly not identical.  With Turris, HE carried the puck to the position that you've screen-capped; with Forsberg, it was a pass that got the puck to the picture here.  My bigger beef is how the linesmen could definitively determine that his right skate was off the ice.  It certainly looks like it, but the resolution in the videos (imo) doesn't definitively show it.

Either way, Pitt got luck last night.  Rinne let a softie in (Malkin), then the bad luck with the puck going off Elkholm with 16.5 seconds left.  Then, they don't get a shot for 37 fucking minutes!?!?!  WTH?  Seriously, that is the worst effort I've ever seen any playoff team put forth.  They played decently enough defensively to stifle the Preds, but man... that was pathetic.

[mikeyd23]

That was the worst game I've seen the Pens play in these playoffs and still get the win. At the end of the day, that's all that matters, but they have to be better.

Couple lucky breaks for sure. I couldn't believe they overturned the goal on the challenge, I'm guessing the refs and Toronto had a different shot than the NBC crew because I didn't see anything conclusive enough to overturn the call on the ice. It definitely could have been onsides or offsides, I just couldn't tell.

Obviously, the Pens have to generate more scoring chances and SOG, but yikes, Rinne has to be better than that. His team played incredible in front of him and the result was the Pens scoring on like 45% of their shots. Sure the one off his man and the ENG aren't on him (clearly) but a couple other ones were weak, Geno and the one on Jake in particular.

I liked some of the matchups the Pens were getting in the first. Sully was doing exactly what I thought he would do, double shifting Sid with the first and fourth lines to get him out there vs the Preds bottom pair. It worked in the first and then absolutely nothing worked for the Pens. 

Weird game, looking forward to game two to see if things develop differently, I'd assume they would.

[LieLowTheWantedMan]

That was a very odd game. Disallowed goal, own goal, Pens went like 1 1/3 period without a shot. Very weird one.

[mikeyd23]

That was a very odd game. Disallowed goal, own goal, Pens went like 1 1/3 period without a shot. Very weird one.

Yup, those three things you mentioned right there are not things I would have predicted ahead of time.

Oh and I forgot to mention, the refs - I actually thought they did a good job in the early parts of the game calling things tight then at some point they just stopped and started to let the usual stuff go. I think this went both ways last night.

[jingle.boy]

That was a very odd game. Disallowed goal, own goal, Pens went like 1 1/3 period without a shot. Very weird one.

No, they went 37 minutes without a shot - 3rd goal to 4th goal.  Never seen anything like it.

[LieLowTheWantedMan]

That was a very odd game. Disallowed goal, own goal, Pens went like 1 1/3 period without a shot. Very weird one.

No, they went 37 minutes without a shot - 3rd goal to 4th goal.  Never seen anything like it.

God damn.

[mikeyd23]

That was a very odd game. Disallowed goal, own goal, Pens went like 1 1/3 period without a shot. Very weird one.

No, they went 37 minutes without a shot - 3rd goal to 4th goal.  Never seen anything like it.

I can't remember the last time I've seen this Pens team struggle to generate shots like that. I thing I find more odd is that outside of their PP time and one long shift at the end of the second, I never felt like the Preds were really, totally dominating.

[jingle.boy]

That was a very odd game. Disallowed goal, own goal, Pens went like 1 1/3 period without a shot. Very weird one.

No, they went 37 minutes without a shot - 3rd goal to 4th goal.  Never seen anything like it.

I can't remember the last time I've seen this Pens team struggle to generate shots like that. I thing I find more odd is that outside of their PP time and one long shift at the end of the second, I never felt like the Preds were really, totally dominating.

Agreed.  Dunno if it was a case of the Pens were so strong defensively, or if Nashville was simply playing 'good'.  They only had 20-something shots on net themselves, so it's not like Murray had to "steal" this one.  Outside of the couple of bad breaks for the Preds, it was their game to lose.  Really, only Sheary's and Guentzal's goals were 'good' goals.

[mikeyd23]

Agreed.  Dunno if it was a case of the Pens were so strong defensively, or if Nashville was simply playing 'good'.  They only had 20-something shots on net themselves, so it's not like Murray had to "steal" this one.  Outside of the couple of bad breaks for the Preds, it was their game to lose.  Really, only Sheary's and Guentzal's goals were 'good' goals.

Yup, I agree. Because the Pens had so few chances, the fact that the Preds didn't actually generate a ton is getting over looked a bit.

[Shooters1221]

Agreed.  Dunno if it was a case of the Pens were so strong defensively, or if Nashville was simply playing 'good'.  They only had 20-something shots on net themselves, so it's not like Murray had to "steal" this one.  Outside of the couple of bad breaks for the Preds, it was their game to lose.  Really, only Sheary's and Guentzal's goals were 'good' goals.

Yup, I agree. Because the Pens had so few chances, the fact that the Preds didn't actually generate a ton is getting over looked a bit.

That was a brutal win but I'll take it. Sheesh did the Pens look bad, I mean......5 goals on 12 shots?

[Jarlaxle]

The problem with this post is that you don't quite know the exact rule. As discussed in this thread earlier, that Turris goal is NOT offside because he had full possession of the puck. If you control the puck you can skate in backwards and it doesn't make it offside. The Nashville goal is close. Personally I think it's offside, and since he was in the act of receiving a pass he does not have full control of the puck. I wad still a bit surprised that it was overturned though, it's really quite close.

Oh Turris definitely wasn't offsides. I was just making the point that far too often this stuff is left up to referee discretion which should not be the case. Games should be decided by the players and coaches. Not the referees.

Fair enough, I misinterpreted your first post. The thing with the offside challenge is how could the league not see it being used for barely missed calls, and not the "Duchene offside" that it was put in for? Those kinds of offside slip past the refs one time in a million, and then they made a rule for it. If they tweaked the rule to as long as a skate is on top of the blue line, whether on the ice or not, is onside, then it would eliminate this controversial moments.

[TheCountOfNYC]

The problem with this post is that you don't quite know the exact rule. As discussed in this thread earlier, that Turris goal is NOT offside because he had full possession of the puck. If you control the puck you can skate in backwards and it doesn't make it offside. The Nashville goal is close. Personally I think it's offside, and since he was in the act of receiving a pass he does not have full control of the puck. I wad still a bit surprised that it was overturned though, it's really quite close.

Oh Turris definitely wasn't offsides. I was just making the point that far too often this stuff is left up to referee discretion which should not be the case. Games should be decided by the players and coaches. Not the referees.

Fair enough, I misinterpreted your first post. The thing with the offside challenge is how could the league not see it being used for barely missed calls, and not the "Duchene offside" that it was put in for? Those kinds of offside slip past the refs one time in a million, and then they made a rule for it. If they tweaked the rule to as long as a skate is on top of the blue line, whether on the ice or not, is onside, then it would eliminate this controversial moments.

And that's what should be done. Tweak the rules to make things more black and white. It will only make the game better. For all of the NFL's faults, one thing it does right is that it has very few rules that can be left up to ref interpretation. Almost all of their rules are very specifically spelled out and while you still get missed calls in every game, there are far fewer instances of referees making a head-scratching interpretation of a rule.

[mikeyd23]

^ Yup, I mentioned this very thing earlier in this thread about the NHL.

[jingle.boy]

I agree about the ridiculousness of the offsides challenge.  It's evolved the way NFL replays have, where if a toenail is on the line, the player is out of bounds.  Three things to fix it (imo)

1) Make it a vertical measurement as well - as has just been mentioned.  Like a football crossing the goal line... foot doesn't need to be on the ice.  This is a no-brainer.

On top of that, one of these would also help
2a)  2 minute review maximum.  If it's that close that the linesmen can't tell in 2 minutes, then the call should stand.  As was mentioned, the rule was put in place for egregious (Duchene) errors, not nit-picking things like what we see get challenged. 
2b)  Delay of game penalty for upheld calls.  That'll make coaches think HARD about challenging it.  Losing a timeout isn't much, and so many of the challenges are 'let's chance it and see if we win'. DoG penalty is fitting, and real punishment.

[TAC]

   
2b)  Delay of game penalty for upheld calls.   

I like that!

[SchecterShredder]

   
2b)  Delay of game penalty for upheld calls.   

I like that!

Agreed.  They could make it just like incorrectly calling an illegal stick on the other team.

[mikeyd23]

I agree about the ridiculousness of the offsides challenge.  It's evolved the way NFL replays have, where if a toenail is on the line, the player is out of bounds.  Three things to fix it (imo)

1) Make it a vertical measurement as well - as has just been mentioned.  Like a football crossing the goal line... foot doesn't need to be on the ice.  This is a no-brainer.

On top of that, one of these would also help
2a)  2 minute review maximum.  If it's that close that the linesmen can't tell in 2 minutes, then the call should stand.  As was mentioned, the rule was put in place for egregious (Duchene) errors, not nit-picking things like what we see get challenged. 
2b)  Delay of game penalty for upheld calls.  That'll make coaches think HARD about challenging it.  Losing a timeout isn't much, and so many of the challenges are 'let's chance it and see if we win'. DoG penalty is fitting, and real punishment.

Can't argue with any of that.

[TAC]

Nick Bonino can play on my team anytime!

[LieLowTheWantedMan]

Preds y

[KevShmev]

I am enjoying this.  Eat a ****, Predators. 

[gmillerdrake]

I am enjoying this.  Eat a ****, Predators. 

Yep.

[Nick]

Dear Pekke:

[TheCountOfNYC]

Come on Nashville. Get your shit together.

[jingle.boy]

Pretty crap game again last night. Whatever magic Pekke had in the first three rounds is gone. And what's with the Pens looking so dull for such long stretches??

I'm not even sure I care to watch on Saturday. These 2 games have been pretty lame.

[Nick]

Pretty crap game again last night. Whatever magic Pekke had in the first three rounds is gone. And what's with the Pens looking so dull for such long stretches??

I'm not even sure I care to watch on Saturday. These 2 games have been pretty lame.

I agree with Keith Jones after the game yesterday though. I really believe this comes back to Pittsburgh 2-2. You have a Preds team that has had the better of play, coming home, and with a goalie that has to step up after his two worst games of the playoffs. I honestly wouldn't be surprised if game 3 is 4-1 or 5-1 Preds.