Author Topic: Westworld  (Read 73925 times)

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Offline Phoenix87x

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Re: Westworld
« Reply #385 on: May 28, 2018, 07:33:23 PM »
I love Alpha Teddy. He don't take no shit. "Thought I would never leave this place, but I guess you fixed that too" Get her Teddy

I could definitely see him turning on her and trying to take power when the timing is right
« Last Edit: May 29, 2018, 07:29:39 AM by Phoenix87x »

Offline BlackInk

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Re: Westworld
« Reply #386 on: May 29, 2018, 11:29:21 AM »
Also confused about the Shogun World story. That was strange, if there isn’t any more that is.

Also, something occurred to me now. Am I the only one who sees Dolores as the villain of this story, not the hero? You guys speak of ”rooting for her”, but I’m questioning if that’s the point. Am I onto something here or nah? Perhaps that might explain why I have no issues with her story and it seems that many of you do, because I’m really diggin’ it.

Offline The Walrus

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Re: Westworld
« Reply #387 on: May 29, 2018, 11:37:32 AM »
Also confused about the Shogun World story. That was strange, if there isn’t any more that is.

Also, something occurred to me now. Am I the only one who sees Dolores as the villain of this story, not the hero? You guys speak of ”rooting for her”, but I’m questioning if that’s the point. Am I onto something here or nah? Perhaps that might explain why I have no issues with her story and it seems that many of you do, because I’m really diggin’ it.

I've been trying to think of 'heroes' and 'villains' on this show and I've realized I either just don't properly understand the characters, or they're purposely making them complicated enough to avoid such labels. I see Dolores and Ford as the villains (whereas Dolores was a protagonist in the first season). I initially saw William as ???, then a villain (once it was revealed he is the MIB), now a kind of anti-hero in season 2. I'm still not sure what to think of Maeve. Bernard and Elsie are protagonists I suppose? I only have an issue with Dolores's arc because it seems to be all Wyatt and no Dolores, but maybe they're trying to make that contrast with Maeve clear (Maeve seems more 'real' and organic with her thoughts, and allows other hosts to choose their fate, whereas Dolores is hard set in her disposition and where she stands against humans).

Basically, I'm rooting for the Man In Black, turning against Dolores and her battalion of death machines, and not really sure what to think about Maeve. I guess Bernard and Elsie could be considered protagonists? Not certain about them either, but I do hope they stay safe, because I really like Bernard and those two play off each other well.
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Re: Westworld
« Reply #388 on: May 29, 2018, 11:56:35 AM »
Also confused about the Shogun World story. That was strange, if there isn’t any more that is.

Also, something occurred to me now. Am I the only one who sees Dolores as the villain of this story, not the hero? You guys speak of ”rooting for her”, but I’m questioning if that’s the point. Am I onto something here or nah? Perhaps that might explain why I have no issues with her story and it seems that many of you do, because I’m really diggin’ it.

I've been trying to think of 'heroes' and 'villains' on this show and I've realized I either just don't properly understand the characters, or they're purposely making them complicated enough to avoid such labels. I see Dolores and Ford as the villains (whereas Dolores was a protagonist in the first season). I initially saw William as ???, then a villain (once it was revealed he is the MIB), now a kind of anti-hero in season 2. I'm still not sure what to think of Maeve. Bernard and Elsie are protagonists I suppose? I only have an issue with Dolores's arc because it seems to be all Wyatt and no Dolores, but maybe they're trying to make that contrast with Maeve clear (Maeve seems more 'real' and organic with her thoughts, and allows other hosts to choose their fate, whereas Dolores is hard set in her disposition and where she stands against humans).

Basically, I'm rooting for the Man In Black, turning against Dolores and her battalion of death machines, and not really sure what to think about Maeve. I guess Bernard and Elsie could be considered protagonists? Not certain about them either, but I do hope they stay safe, because I really like Bernard and those two play off each other well.

Yeah....there is no clear cut hero or villain to be seen. The lines have been blurred so well that in any given moment or episode the 'main' characters could be either. They've done a good job of creating that 'mood' around them all.

Very curious to see/hear the conversation between Ford and Bernard in the saloon.
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Offline Phoenix87x

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Re: Westworld
« Reply #389 on: May 29, 2018, 03:22:24 PM »
Also confused about the Shogun World story. That was strange, if there isn’t any more that is.

Also, something occurred to me now. Am I the only one who sees Dolores as the villain of this story, not the hero? You guys speak of ”rooting for her”, but I’m questioning if that’s the point. Am I onto something here or nah? Perhaps that might explain why I have no issues with her story and it seems that many of you do, because I’m really diggin’ it.

She's an absolute villain in my eyes and I look forward to seeing her go down. I don't care that she was "oppressed" or whatever. that doesn't give you license to go on a genocidal crusade. In contrast Maeve is who I can root for as a hero, or a protagonist. She was also "oppressed" but yet is working toward something positive.


Offline The Walrus

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Re: Westworld
« Reply #390 on: May 29, 2018, 05:14:02 PM »
I'm gonna throw this out there: I think Teddy Redux is gonna bring the Dolores back out. Dolores is fighting between Wyatt's programming and Dolores's programming, and Teddy being so dangerous and cold seems to shock even her. Maybe there will be a point in the future where the 'Dolores' side regrets making Teddy so deadly, or changing him in the first place. I think it would be interesting if instead of achieving full 'true' consciousness, it just ends up being a battle of multiple personalities, maybe some schizophrenia, between Dolores and Wyatt.

I'm probably 100% wrong, though (and I hope I am, because every twist and turn has been great so far).
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Re: Westworld
« Reply #391 on: May 30, 2018, 05:19:08 AM »
Also, something occurred to me now. Am I the only one who sees Dolores as the villain of this story, not the hero? You guys speak of ”rooting for her”, but I’m questioning if that’s the point. Am I onto something here or nah? Perhaps that might explain why I have no issues with her story and it seems that many of you do, because I’m really diggin’ it.
I think part of the issue is that some people are looking for "heroes" or "villains" which has never been the point of the show.


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Re: Westworld
« Reply #392 on: May 30, 2018, 05:19:52 AM »
Also this is looking rather prescient:

I also think that Ford is somewhere inside the park, not necessarily in the boy, but as a kind of god that can jump between hosts, as he did with the men William was trying to recruit for his campaign.

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Offline orcus116

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Re: Westworld
« Reply #393 on: June 03, 2018, 07:47:53 PM »
Not only are the Delos folks stormtrooper levels of marksmen but why do they even both wearing armor? They get wasted in like one or two shots.

Offline The Walrus

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Re: Westworld
« Reply #394 on: June 03, 2018, 08:09:00 PM »
Just wrapped up the new episode. Immediate thoughts: I'm a little confused by the timeline so I'm going to replay it in a few minutes. But that was an amazing episode, so much to unpack, and a lot of moments that had me on the edge of my seat. Damn that was fun.
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Offline Phoenix87x

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Re: Westworld
« Reply #395 on: June 03, 2018, 09:44:52 PM »
God damn. What an episode  :metal


Not only are the Delos folks stormtrooper levels of marksmen but why do they even both wearing armor? They get wasted in like one or two shots.

At this point its beyond believable for me. How can these security forces be such total shit?  They started with automatic, high tech weapons, with future armor and shit and were originally going up against wild west people with six shooters. Remember WWI, you know, the first time people on horse back went up against automatic weapons? didn't turn out so well and I'm just not buying it. But whatever. Everything else was awesome.

Offline The Walrus

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Re: Westworld
« Reply #396 on: June 03, 2018, 09:50:38 PM »
The hosts' abilities have been heightened. Perception, cruelty, all that stuff. Superhuman abilities. See: how Teddy beat the living daylights out of the chief. Angry robot strength. That's what I attribute it all to, anyway.
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Offline Phoenix87x

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Re: Westworld
« Reply #397 on: June 04, 2018, 04:47:34 AM »
The hosts' abilities have been heightened. Perception, cruelty, all that stuff. Superhuman abilities. See: how Teddy beat the living daylights out of the chief. Angry robot strength. That's what I attribute it all to, anyway.

Yeah, now that I think about it more. That makes a lot more sense. They are basically terminators.

I really loved that episode though. Terminator teddy is awesome and Its sooo good having hopkins again

« Last Edit: June 04, 2018, 06:18:40 AM by Phoenix87x »

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Re: Westworld
« Reply #398 on: June 04, 2018, 07:07:20 AM »
So Ford hitchikes out of the hive in Bernards mind because he knows (probably directed) Dolores is going to come and blow it up.

Does that mean that Bernard is now going to start going skitzo like Dolores’ Dad? He basically has (2) ‘minds’ now....one of which is a former human mind now electronically copied.

Speaking of Ford....it seem like even he has gone all ‘Wyatt’.....very brutal and out for blood. Curious as to if that’s some sort of indicator that AI (or whatever it is) can’t interpret some aspects of humanity and just defaults to over the top violence.
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Offline Phoenix87x

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Re: Westworld
« Reply #399 on: June 04, 2018, 07:19:10 AM »
I'm really curious if you copy your consciousness, but your original body/mind dies then I guess "you" are dead, or your current experienced consciousness is gone. The copy is just that, a copy. It is you in a way, but you prime's experience of reality is ceased.

So in a way you are living forever, but its not really you, its your copy. But that's kind of what kids are anyway. A partial genetic copy of you, that live on after "you" die, where as in this case, its a full copy of you living on after "you" die.

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Re: Westworld
« Reply #400 on: June 04, 2018, 10:11:30 AM »
I was so hoping that Dolores was gonna carve up Charlotte also. I thought that was the end of her for sure. She's a little  :censored


And, how many gunshot wounds is that now for the MIB? That was (4) in the last episode alone. Didn't he have one or two from the previous episodes? You'd think he'd bleed out by now. I'm sure his daughter will find him and patch him up....but he was gut shot this last time so if he's doing anything but laying around in the upcoming episodes it'll be tough to believe.
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Re: Westworld
« Reply #401 on: June 04, 2018, 10:15:16 AM »
I mostly really liked the last episode.

Making Ford super blood thirsty was...I dunno....I didn't like it.

But then when Bernard "woke up" in that office near the end, I just got completely confused. The hell is real and made up?
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Offline The Walrus

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Re: Westworld
« Reply #402 on: June 04, 2018, 11:27:11 AM »
I was so hoping that Dolores was gonna carve up Charlotte also. I thought that was the end of her for sure. She's a little  :censored


And, how many gunshot wounds is that now for the MIB? That was (4) in the last episode alone. Didn't he have one or two from the previous episodes? You'd think he'd bleed out by now. I'm sure his daughter will find him and patch him up....but he was gut shot this last time so if he's doing anything but laying around in the upcoming episodes it'll be tough to believe.

He did take a health pack earlier in the season - maybe he used that?
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Re: Westworld
« Reply #403 on: June 04, 2018, 11:41:23 AM »
I was so hoping that Dolores was gonna carve up Charlotte also. I thought that was the end of her for sure. She's a little  :censored


And, how many gunshot wounds is that now for the MIB? That was (4) in the last episode alone. Didn't he have one or two from the previous episodes? You'd think he'd bleed out by now. I'm sure his daughter will find him and patch him up....but he was gut shot this last time so if he's doing anything but laying around in the upcoming episodes it'll be tough to believe.

He did take a health pack earlier in the season - maybe he used that?

His first wound from the initial Host rebellion he did stop and find that health pack. But still....it's a gunshot wound.....then add those from last episodes. He's a human, not a host. He should be hurting a ton and left unchecked should die for sure.
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Offline The Walrus

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Re: Westworld
« Reply #404 on: June 04, 2018, 11:46:48 AM »
Maybe William is a host.  :hat
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Re: Westworld
« Reply #405 on: June 04, 2018, 12:15:16 PM »
Maybe William is a host.  :hat

The thought did cross my mind. Maybe he never let on to anyone that he perfected the 'project' and just hasn't shared the fix?
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Offline The Walrus

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Re: Westworld
« Reply #406 on: June 04, 2018, 12:23:38 PM »
Maybe William is a host.  :hat

The thought did cross my mind. Maybe he never let on to anyone that he perfected the 'project' and just hasn't shared the fix?

Now that would be a cool reveal...

Speaking of William, I loved watching him deal with Lawrence and Maeve after he got badly wounded. When Lawrence turns on him, he rolls his eyes and goes, "Christ... I'll do it myself" - such a William move. Ed Harris rules. I really hope he doesn't die and that there's a solid explanation for how he gets away; he's too important to kill off so early.

Although I was almost positive Maeve was gonna bite it especially after the humans swooped in and rained shit upon everyone.
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Re: Westworld
« Reply #407 on: June 04, 2018, 12:30:22 PM »
Maybe William is a host.  :hat

The thought did cross my mind. Maybe he never let on to anyone that he perfected the 'project' and just hasn't shared the fix?

Now that would be a cool reveal...

Speaking of William, I loved watching him deal with Lawrence and Maeve after he got badly wounded. When Lawrence turns on him, he rolls his eyes and goes, "Christ... I'll do it myself" - such a William move. Ed Harris rules. I really hope he doesn't die and that there's a solid explanation for how he gets away; he's too important to kill off so early.

Although I was almost positive Maeve was gonna bite it especially after the humans swooped in and rained shit upon everyone.

As far as William I'd be willing to bet his daughter will be the one to patch him up and save his life.

I thought the same about Maeve as well....but was then thinking that have been pretty much a waste of a storyline with her 'ability' and all that. I'm really curious about next weeks Native American slant. They've played a major role in the show thus far but have been pretty much an afterthought as far as any attention being given to them.
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Offline The Walrus

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Re: Westworld
« Reply #408 on: June 04, 2018, 12:44:59 PM »
I'm looking forward to that. Akecheta is a character I think we definitely need to see more of. I imagine it'll be a 'take a few breaths' kind of episode, coming off the heels of such an intense, deep episode 7. I hope I'm wrong though  :)
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Offline orcus116

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Re: Westworld
« Reply #409 on: June 04, 2018, 07:13:57 PM »
The hosts' abilities have been heightened. Perception, cruelty, all that stuff. Superhuman abilities. See: how Teddy beat the living daylights out of the chief. Angry robot strength. That's what I attribute it all to, anyway.

I can buy that to an extent but even so this seemingly elite security team should be able to at least put up somewhat of a fight. I thought the one guy getting seduced by a host bit to be somewhat lame as while he may be a horny guy you'd assume they would be aware as a team that these hosts aren't normal and they should be on their guard. Also it doesn't help that I have no sympathy toward the Delores/Wyatt crew and are actually hoping they get wiped out. It almost seems like you should be rooting for them but there's not really a likeable one of them in the bunch. When it comes to their storyline I'm all for the human characters regardless of how scummy the show tries to make them out.

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Re: Westworld
« Reply #410 on: June 04, 2018, 08:32:19 PM »
All caught up and enjoying the show. Nothing further to add at this point... lol so many questions for this season still.

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Re: Westworld
« Reply #411 on: June 05, 2018, 02:38:47 AM »
Y’all can say whatever you want, but I think Dolores is fantastic. Although yeah that soldier getting seduced was probably the dumbest thing on the show so far. Horny, sure, but you’ve literally just witnessed these things kill your friends and now suddenly one of the wants to touch your dick, and you actually roll with it? Come on..

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Re: Westworld
« Reply #412 on: June 05, 2018, 07:26:08 AM »
Crazy episode, finally caught back up and that last scene really has me confused as to what is going on really, but I was totally loving the episode up to that confusion point.  The Ford and Bernard scenes were excellent as well as the William and Maeve scene.  Just so much going on and wrapping things together in such a way that was starting to make sense.  I really loved how William was calling Maeve Ford too.  If William survives I hope there's some good explanation because I also am not a fan of him getting shot so much and left out there just for some cheap recovery.  I can't stand these type of "cliffhangers" where we all know he isn't going to die yet you left him in such a situation where he should die.  Dolores was pretty bad ass and I am starting to dig her character a bit more now.  She has seemed a bit more "human" with her father and realizing what she did to Teddy.  I do wish she killed Charlotte though.  That scene was also really good and had me at the edge of my seat.

I don't know what to think about the scenes for next week.  Looks like a one off episode focusing away from what we just saw but might give some good explanation to the rest of the westworld world.

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Re: Westworld
« Reply #413 on: June 05, 2018, 08:19:57 AM »
It's killing me not being able to discuss this. I'm still an episode behind. Victoria's CEO put her in charge of a new enterprise-wide initiative at her job, and she's been working 8am-10pm for the last 6-8 weeks. We haven't had time to watch it together, and I'm afraid if I progress without her, she'll cut my nuts off in my sleep. We were able to get caught up on Sunday during a hangover recovery day after a wedding the night before, but we weren't able to watch that night's episode.

I'm absolutely loving this season. The scene where Logan got sold on the park at the cocktail party might be my favorite scene of the series so far.

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Re: Westworld
« Reply #414 on: June 06, 2018, 01:55:45 AM »
Although yeah that soldier getting seduced was probably the dumbest thing on the show so far. Horny, sure, but you’ve literally just witnessed these things kill your friends and now suddenly one of the wants to touch your dick, and you actually roll with it? Come on..
I dunno about that, they'd already established pretty well earlier in the episode that the soldier character was a sociopathic dick who was really looking forward to killing hosts. I thought that scene fit the character perfectly. Still raises the question of why such a lunatic is in this elite squad, but then maybe its not really such an elite squad after all. They all come across as pretty mercenary so I get the impression they're off-the-books.

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Re: Westworld
« Reply #415 on: June 06, 2018, 06:00:58 AM »
All caught up. Man is this show good. Now time to go back and catch up on all the discussion I wasn't able to be a part of :(

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Re: Westworld
« Reply #416 on: June 06, 2018, 06:13:06 AM »
@ariich

I mean, sure, but personally I feel this isn’t just ’sociopathic dick’-stuff, it’s just plain old stupid. Over the limit that I felt I could suspend my disbelief for.

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Re: Westworld
« Reply #417 on: June 06, 2018, 06:16:56 AM »
I chalk it up to Angela/Talulah Riley being distractingly hot, which, well, she is  :biggrin:
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Re: Westworld
« Reply #418 on: June 06, 2018, 06:35:43 AM »
Not sure about the Shogun world either? Maybe it was just there as a step of Maeve’s evolution of her mind control? Or, to show the hosts are making choices of their own by staying behind and choosing their own path? Who knows?

Also, that ending was awesome! Was curious as to if he’d make an appearance this season....been waiting for that.

I'm guessing Shogun World was there as much for HBO as it was the fans or the story line. We got a small taste of the idea that there are other parks. We got just enough to create some excitement and for HBO to gauge whether or not the exploration of other parks would be something the fans were interested in. If fans are receptive to new parks, characters, and arcs, HBO can basically do whatever they want with the story.

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Re: Westworld
« Reply #419 on: June 06, 2018, 08:05:01 AM »
Although yeah that soldier getting seduced was probably the dumbest thing on the show so far. Horny, sure, but you’ve literally just witnessed these things kill your friends and now suddenly one of the wants to touch your dick, and you actually roll with it? Come on..
I dunno about that, they'd already established pretty well earlier in the episode that the soldier character was a sociopathic dick who was really looking forward to killing hosts. I thought that scene fit the character perfectly. Still raises the question of why such a lunatic is in this elite squad, but then maybe its not really such an elite squad after all. They all come across as pretty mercenary so I get the impression they're off-the-books.

Bingo!  I watched a youtube video theory that Charlotte is trying to steal the data for a 3rd party and those guys didn't have any Delos logos on their outfits and clearly put Stubbs to the back telling his men to stop working on communications and get out of the way.   This video is very good and seems very plausible https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jNnelCaxv5s