The Official Yes Thread

[Orbert]

I don't say this to argue, but to contrast.... I find some of the earlier Yes to be muddy (though it's improved a lot with the various remasters) and I LOVE Going For The One.  It's my favorite album ever.  I can't say I "love" the trebly, but it does fit with the rest of the instrumentation.   Remember, Wakeman was having a torrid affair with a church organ in Switzerland at the time.   

For me, the organ is only an issue on Parallels.  It's so harsh -- almost to the point of being unlistenable.  I spent a lot of quality time with Yesshows before ever buying TFTO, Relayer or GFTO.  I thought Parallels on Yesshows was superb.  Once I bought GFTO, I thought, "what the fuck?!"  When I consider how much I like GFTO or rank Yes albums, I sort of think about the live version of Parallels, so the album gets more credit than it probably deserves.  The interesting thing is that Awaken is very organ-heavy, but it works perfectly, and I wouldn't change a thing about it (I've also never heard a live version that I thought did the song justice, except when they played it in the round on the Union tour and maybe also the version with the symphony).

Wow, I guess I'm kinda the opposite regarding "Parallels".  I love the way the pipe organ comes blasting in, like Bach himself rose from the grave to take the solo.  I guess it does sound pretty harsh, but I've never thought that that was bad, because pipe organs can be deafening.  They are the original heavy metal instrument.

In contrast, I like the live version on YesShows well enough, but always found the keyboard solo a bit lacking.  Maybe not surprising since for me the studio version was first.  I'd listened to it 100 times before I picked up YesShows, which came out years later.

[pg1067]

Wow, I guess I'm kinda the opposite regarding "Parallels".  I love the way the pipe organ comes blasting in, like Bach himself rose from the grave to take the solo.  I guess it does sound pretty harsh, but I've never thought that that was bad, because pipe organs can be deafening.  They are the original heavy metal instrument.

In contrast, I like the live version on YesShows well enough, but always found the keyboard solo a bit lacking.  Maybe not surprising since for me the studio version was first.  I'd listened to it 100 times before I picked up YesShows, which came out years later.

Yeah, I think it has a LOT to do with which version you heard first.  I didn't get into classic Yes until the mid- to late 80s and used Yessongs, Yesshows and Classic Yes as gateways.  I might not have found the organ quite so jarring if I had not become familiar with the live version first.

[KevShmev]

Even though I merely like the song, I love the organ in Parallels.  It feels like one of those songs where I wish a better song had been written around the organ. 

[ytserush]

I don't say this to argue, but to contrast.... I find some of the earlier Yes to be muddy (though it's improved a lot with the various remasters) and I LOVE Going For The One.  It's my favorite album ever.  I can't say I "love" the trebly, but it does fit with the rest of the instrumentation.   Remember, Wakeman was having a torrid affair with a church organ in Switzerland at the time.   

For me, the organ is only an issue on Parallels.  It's so harsh -- almost to the point of being unlistenable.  I spent a lot of quality time with Yesshows before ever buying TFTO, Relayer or GFTO.  I thought Parallels on Yesshows was superb.  Once I bought GFTO, I thought, "what the fuck?!"  When I consider how much I like GFTO or rank Yes albums, I sort of think about the live version of Parallels, so the album gets more credit than it probably deserves.  The interesting thing is that Awaken is very organ-heavy, but it works perfectly, and I wouldn't change a thing about it (I've also never heard a live version that I thought did the song justice, except when they played it in the round on the Union tour and maybe also the version with the symphony).

Wow, I guess I'm kinda the opposite regarding "Parallels".  I love the way the pipe organ comes blasting in, like Bach himself rose from the grave to take the solo.  I guess it does sound pretty harsh, but I've never thought that that was bad, because pipe organs can be deafening.  They are the original heavy metal instrument.

In contrast, I like the live version on YesShows well enough, but always found the keyboard solo a bit lacking.  Maybe not surprising since for me the studio version was first.  I'd listened to it 100 times before I picked up YesShows, which came out years later.

Now Paralells I dig. Awaken not so much.  It's been a while since I've given Yesshows a proper spin.  Should fix that.

[Stadler]

I'm in that boat, too.  I rarely listen to it, but perhaps I should.

[Architeuthis]

I've never heard Yes-shows,  but I have Yes-songs double disc set.  Which of the two are better?

[Orbert]

That depends on your definition of "better".

YesSongs is a younger band on fire, touring the album which would forever cement their place in Progressive Rock history (though they didn't realize it at the time).  But the recording quality is a bit crap, and numerous remasters have never really solved that problem.  It's the way it was recorded.  Still, the musical performances are incredible.  For many years, this is all we had for live Yes, and it's still well-respected.

YesShows is a more mature band playing epics with the confidence and grace that comes with experience.  The performances are stellar, although editing and mixing choices cause problems for some people.

I'd say take a look at the song lists and decide which one you like better.  Then buy them both anyway, because they're both great.

[pg1067]

I've never heard Yes-shows,  but I have Yes-songs double disc set.  Which of the two are better?

Define "better."

Yessongs (no dash) was originally released as a triple LP, whereas Yesshows (also no dash) was a double LP, so the former has more material.  The former also has the entirety of Close to the Edge (both the song and the album, as well as some of the band's most iconic songs like Yours Is No Disgrace, Heart of the Sunrise and Roundabout.  You also get Steve Howe's Mood for a Day, an extended version of The Fish and excerpts from Rick Wakeman's Six Wive's of Henry VIII (no solo spot from White).  Yessongs was entirely recorded during the Close to the Edge tour (and mostly during a six week period in November and December 1972).

You get no repeats on Yesshows (other than the recorded Firebird Suite intro),* and most of the songs are from TFTO, Relayer, GFTO and Tomato.  You get The Gates of Delirium in its entirety and an extended (if you can believe that) version of Ritual.  There only a couple negatives about Yesshows (IMO).  The first is that, on the original LP version, Ritual was split between sides 3 and 4.  That was an unavoidable necessity given that the total run time is nearly 32 minutes.  On the CD version, Ritual is all on one CD, but it's still split between two tracks with the fade out and and fade in that you got on the LP version.  I have to assume (but don't really know) that this couldn't have been fixed when the album was mastered for CD.  The second negative is that it doesn't include a live version of Awaken.  On the other hand, notwithstanding the split track, the live performance of Ritual is OUTSTANDING, and the live version of Gates might be better than the studio version.  Note also that the performance of Ritual came from the Relayer tour and, therefore, featured Patrick Moraz, rather than Rick Wakeman.  Yesshows features recordings from the Relayer, GFTO and Tormato tours.

* - Looking at Wikipedia, I'm seeing that there's a CD version of Yesshows that has performances of I've Seen All Good People and Roundabout, both of which are also on Yessongs.  Although these are different live versions than you get on Yessongs, they are the same live versions from the CD release of Classic Yes.

I don't have any issues with production qualify of either album (although I can't disagree with what Orbert wrote), so the question "better" probably comes down to what songs you like better or simply the run time of the albums.

Then buy them both anyway, because they're both great.

Yup.

[pg1067]

DELETED

[Orbert]

I just wanted to add that later versions of YesShows have "Ritual" all as one track, correctly restored.

In a ridiculous comedy of errors (yet somehow not surprising for Yes), there are multiple CD versions of YesShows because of how many tries it took them to get it right.  The original CD simply preserved the LP tracks, which as pg mentioned included "Ritual" split into two tracks.  Later, this was partially fixed by putting them together as a single track on the CD, but they literally concatenated the original tracks together, so it faded down and then back up again.  I waited until they finally got it right and re-edited the two tracks together.  The newest CD versions have "Ritual" as one track, correctly restored as performed.

[Fritzinger]

I just wanted to add that later versions of YesShows have "Ritual" all as one track, correctly restored.

In a ridiculous comedy of errors (yet somehow not surprising for Yes), there are multiple CD versions of YesShows because of how many tries it took them to get it right.  The original CD simply preserved the LP tracks, which as pg mentioned included "Ritual" split into two tracks.  Later, this was partially fixed by putting them together as a single track on the CD, but they literally concatenated the original tracks together, so it faded down and then back up again.  I waited until they finally got it right and re-edited the two tracks together.  The newest CD versions have "Ritual" as one track, correctly restored as performed.

On Apple Music, the song is split into two tracks, but they flow into each other seamlessly, with no fade-out/-in. Gotta love our chaotic guys 

[ytserush]

I just wanted to add that later versions of YesShows have "Ritual" all as one track, correctly restored.

In a ridiculous comedy of errors (yet somehow not surprising for Yes), there are multiple CD versions of YesShows because of how many tries it took them to get it right.  The original CD simply preserved the LP tracks, which as pg mentioned included "Ritual" split into two tracks.  Later, this was partially fixed by putting them together as a single track on the CD, but they literally concatenated the original tracks together, so it faded down and then back up again.  I waited until they finally got it right and re-edited the two tracks together.  The newest CD versions have "Ritual" as one track, correctly restored as performed.

I just have the Gastwirt remasters. Haven't gotten all of the Rhinos yet.

I'm likely mentioned this before, but I really don't like how most of commercially released  Yes live recordings sound. Yessongs is the worst offender. Decent set, but it doesn't come close to capturing the magic of Yes live during that period.

Yesshows seems somewhat better to me sound-wise and I realy dig the songs on it.  I'm still totally blown away by that Progeny set from 1972.  It totally turned me around to Yes as a live band in those years.

[Stadler]

PG, sorry to be that guy, but there's at least one song on Yessongs NOT from that November/December time frame:  Perpetual Change has Bruford on it, so it is from an earlier date.

Also, the two "repeat" songs on Yesshows were originally available as a bonus 7" single with Classic Yes.  I know this because I had it, but the single had a split in it, so it wouldn't always play.   I was very grateful when the Gastwirt remasters came out because they put both those songs on the CD version of Classic Yes.  I cut my "Yes" teeth on Classic Yes; that was my gateway drug (then Fragile, because to this day Heart Of The Sunrise is one of my favorite Yes songs).   

EDIT: I looked it up; Perpetual Change, Long Distance Runaround, and The Fish are from February of '72 before Bruford left.  Also, the two songs on Yesshows are from '78, the Tormato tour.

[jammindude]

IIRC, I’m pretty sure that there is an actual drum solo on the album...but it’s on one of Bruford tracks. Which means that even though White’s picture is on the back of the album, the drum solo on the album is performed by Bruford.

[Orbert]

Yeah, the drum solo is in "Perpetual Change" and Bruford takes the solo.  That and "LDR/Fish" are from the Fragile tour.  The rest is from the Close to the Edge tour.

[pg1067]

PG, sorry to be that guy, but there's at least one song on Yessongs NOT from that November/December time frame:  Perpetual Change has Bruford on it, so it is from an earlier date.

Yup.  That's why I wrote, "Yessongs was entirely recorded during the Close to the Edge tour (and mostly during a six week period in November and December 1972).  But I was wrong when I wrote that everything was from the CTTE tour.

[ytserush]

Yeah, the drum solo is in "Perpetual Change" and Bruford takes the solo.  That and "LDR/Fish" are from the Fragile tour.  The rest is from the Close to the Edge tour.

That Bruford/White thing seemed to bother a lot of fans with this album. It never really bothered me, possibly because I'd much rather have Bruford in King Crimson/Genesis.  I was OK with not having more of Bruford on this album. Would have been nice in hindsight I suppose, but I never had strong feelings about that.

But then I wasn't all that broken up when Anderson was booted from Yes. I was sad for him I suppose, but I got off that boat around 2004 so it didn't make all that much difference to me.

[Architeuthis]

Yes lost me after Anderson's departure.  That's why I'm bummed we're not going to get a new album from Yes featuring Anderson, Rabin, and Wakeman.  I wish Alan White could have been in that line-up, but health problems take their toll.
White was on fire on the TALK tour, great drum sound and performance. The definitive Yes concert for me at The Gorge (7-10-1994). 

[Fritzinger]

https://SteveHowe.lnk.to/headlandsFA

Steve has released a new song.

I want to like the stuff they are doing nowadays, but I just can't. This is so boring, I don't know what else to say. Of course, guitars are played brilliantly as always. But the harmonies are brutally simple and the drums sound like a drum machine. At the end it gets faded out. It sounds like an exercise put together within a few hours. Sorry I sound so bitter. It's just, the guys in Yes have done such great things. I don't understand where those brilliant ideas have gone.

[Stadler]

Is this a solo song or a "Yes" song?   I'm a pretty strident Yes fan, but at this point I'm out.  No Anderson, no Squire... that's not enough for me. 

[Fritzinger]

Is this a solo song or a "Yes" song?   I'm a pretty strident Yes fan, but at this point I'm out.  No Anderson, no Squire... that's not enough for me.

It's a song from his upcoming solo album.

[Orbert]

For anyone who's interested, I picked up the latest release From a Page, and added it to The Yes Discography thread.

[DragonAttack]

Came across this while googling stuff for the Jethro Tull discography.  Hope someone finds this of interest (I did).

https://musicaficionado.blog/2018/11/28/relayer-by-yes/

[Eldomm]

Came across this while googling stuff for the Jethro Tull discography.  Hope someone finds this of interest (I did).

https://musicaficionado.blog/2018/11/28/relayer-by-yes/

A million thanks! It was a fantastic read

[romdrums]

Came across this while googling stuff for the Jethro Tull discography.  Hope someone finds this of interest (I did).

https://musicaficionado.blog/2018/11/28/relayer-by-yes/

A million thanks! It was a fantastic read

Relayer has always been one of my favorite Yes albums and that was an awesome read on the details of how that album came together.  Fun trivia: Patrick Moraz currently lives in Venice, FL and is a semi-frequent customer at the music store my uncle owns. 

[ytserush]

Came across this while googling stuff for the Jethro Tull discography.  Hope someone finds this of interest (I did).

https://musicaficionado.blog/2018/11/28/relayer-by-yes/

I'm one of those guys who would not have been sad had Moraz stayed with them for at least one more album.

[IDontNotDoThings]

Came across this while googling stuff for the Jethro Tull discography.  Hope someone finds this of interest (I did).

https://musicaficionado.blog/2018/11/28/relayer-by-yes/

I'm one of those guys who would not have been sad had Moraz stayed with them for at least one more album.

Same. Maybe it's just because the album he's on is just that good, but I really like the atmospheric element he added to the band, & I would've loved to hear more of that, though I have nothing against Rick Wakeman.

I really need to check out Patrick Moraz's other work.

[devieira73]

Came across this while googling stuff for the Jethro Tull discography.  Hope someone finds this of interest (I did).

https://musicaficionado.blog/2018/11/28/relayer-by-yes/

A million thanks! It was a fantastic read

I also love this Yes's encarnacion and  didn't know anything about the keyboardists auditions and how Relayer was made. Very interesting read, thanks!

[devieira73]

I found an excellent bootleg from the Relayer tour (forgive me if it was already posted before, I didn't research here):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O9slYwwUhSE
What a great fit Patrick Moraz was! The band was truly on fire then, very cool!

[Orbert]

Yeah, Moraz brought a whole different attitude to the keys for Yes.  I hadn't really thought about it in those terms before, but a couple of articles mention the jazzfusion influence of bands like Mahavishnu Orchestra (Jan Hammer on keys) and Return to Forever (Chick Corea on keys) and once that's pointed out, it's pretty obvious.  It's a jazzy influence, more adventurous than Wakeman's classical-based jamming, and obviously very different.

I've tried checking out Moraz solo stuff, and I can't seem to get into it.  He's got a good ear for sounds and patches, and everything's well-produced and all, but the music itself feels very sterile and in some ways simplistic.  I'm not in the same league as Patrick Moraz by any stretch of the imagination, but most of Story of I sounds like stuff I could do here in my basement.  Patterns, arpeggios, soundscapes, all very nice, sure to impress, but not exactly the groundbreaking, mind-boggling work I'd been led to believe it was.  Well, maybe in 1976 it was groundbreaking.

Moraz seems like the kind of guy who may do his best work in collaboration with others.  I loved what he brought to The Moody Blues, and I'm not even a huge Moody Blues fan.  Even the Moraz-Bruford Blue Brains stuff is pretty cool.

[ytserush]

I like a few of the solo Moraz albums that I have and I also have some of his work with Bruford - Flags and Music For Piano and Drums.

Tend to listen more to the Bruford related work than solo.

[pg1067]

Random observation:  Am I the only one who thinks Elrond from the Lord of the Rings movies looks like Yessongs era Steve Howe?

[Stadler]

Random observation:  Am I the only one who thinks Elrond from the Lord of the Rings movies looks like Yessongs era Steve Howe?

You are not.

[Orbert]

[Architeuthis]