The Official Yes Thread

[Fritzinger]

So YES just posted this. I don't think this is a very good idea. How on earth is this band going to pull off The Gates Of Delirium and Sound Chaser?

UK TOUR ANNOUNCEMENT: THE ALBUM SERIES 2020
The Album Series 2020 Tour will feature YES' 1974 Relayer album in its entirety together with a selection of other classic YES favourites. (An extensive European tour will be announced soon.)
The show will comprise two sets by the band with full production and a high definition video wall. The first will feature favourite classic tracks from YES’ extensive catalogue. The second will feature Relayer, the seventh studio album by YES, and one of the band’s most distinctive.
Roger Dean will attend every show on the UK and European dates, and will have an exhibition of his iconic art, will be available to chat with fans front of house and sign merch, plus will be in the VIP meet and greets.
Tickets on sale tomorrow, Friday 11th October at 10AM!
See the full list of dates below and find out more at http://yesworld.com/2019/10/the-album-series-2020
The Album Series 2020 UK Dates:
Tuesday 26 May: Philharmonic Hall, Liverpool
Wednesday 27 May: Royal Concert Hall, Nottingham
Friday 29 May: Barbican, York
Saturday 30 May: The Sage, Gateshead
Sunday 31 May: Royal Concert Hall, Glasgow
Tuesday 2 June: Symphony Hall, Birmingham
Wednesday 3 June: Bridgewater Hall, Manchester
Friday 5 June: Royal Albert Hall, London

[Orbert]

They'll slow it down a lot.

[The Letter M]

Is Jay Schellen still subbing for Alan White? If not, he probably should, especially for Sound Chaser.

It'll be interesting to see the YouTube videos from this tour...

-Marc.

[Max Kuehnau]

With the current state of Yes being what it is (despicable IMHO), I'm relieved I got to see the band twice in the classic lineup (in 2003 and 2004)
And with Relayer being one of my alltime favourites by them, I agree that this may not be a great idea

[romdrums]

I'm going to go ahead and say "No" to this one.

[Fritzinger]

Is Jay Schellen still subbing for Alan White? If not, he probably should, especially for Sound Chaser.

It'll be interesting to see the YouTube videos from this tour...

-Marc.

He is. There is a YouTube video of the band playing The Gates from June. Schellen is playing and White is sitting next to him on an unmiked (is that how you say it?) drum set, playing ... something very irrelevant to the song. It's very hard to watch.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P9FeiU1ymu4&fbclid=IwAR3MLVogN7rV8199O_GdrpAwtpKUDCUfnFwMV953aLf7dhc8ldWvm5dylOc

So be fair, Schellen is not the best drummer ever, but he's playing this incredibly hard stuff quite well.

Oh- and Steve is still awesome.

[Orbert]

Yes is not what it once was, but I think "despicable" is a bit harsh.  Alan is reduced to "good days and bad days" but Steve is indeed still awesome.  Geoff Downes isn't Rick Wakeman, but then either is Rick Wakeman anymore.  I've always liked Geoff and think he tends to get ripped on far too much, usually just for not being Rick Wakeman.  Jon Davison to me sounds a lot like Jon Anderson, though not as good.  I think he has the "light side" of Jon A but not the depth.  Jon Anderson never gets "heavy" but he can rock out in his own way, and Jon D can't quite get there.  I've never really understood people's problem with Billy Sherwood other than him not being on the same level as Chris Squire.  Once again, who is?

I suppose that basically reduces the current Yes to mostly second-string players.  I get it.  Some people go to see a band because it's a band they love and/or have always wanted to see and/or always go to see anyway, but I tend to care more about the specific individuals on stage.  I'd love to see Steve Howe play live again, and I've never seen Geoff play live.  But that's not enough to get me to see Yes.

But... we're still talking about some great music being performed by some pretty amazing guys.  And I certainly won't fault the band for continuing to tour and play this music while they still can.  Some people say they should call it a day.  Fuck that.  Players gotta play.  I've seen some videos from recent years, some pretty good, some not so much.  But they're still out there playing, I'll give them that.

[Lupton]

For me the main problem with Yes is that Howe doesn't make a very good band conductor IMO. Yes never had super steady or super even sense of tempo. This sort of looseness was always part of their sound. It was at the whim of Squire who controlled the ebb and flow of the performance. He was (as I once read Bruford put it) the conductor of Yes. Now, they still have that loose-y goose-y sense of time, but it sounds random and unfocused...like a cover band out of their depth still learning the song and struggling to find the pocket in the music. I witnessed this during the battle section in "The Gates" on a Youtube video from a very recent Dallas performance. Billy's a great bass player, but the groove doesn't click-in until they get to the midpoint of the battle. They're all good musicians and players. But great players alone do not create solid band chemistry. The tempos seem to lurch around in an unwieldy way that is almost embarrassing to witness at times. In other moments when things do click, they sound awesome. A very uneven band now. 

It puts them in an odd place because Yes always had this reputation for being a great live act..and now they're lucky if they can pull off any performance that sounds professional enough to live up to their reputation.

[Orbert]

Those are all good points.  I never really thought about it, but Squire was the driver during live performances in just the way you said, and without that rock-solid base, the looseness gets sloppy and unfocused.

[Lupton]

One last thing. Because I don't want to offer only negative points. I was very impressed with how well Billy and JonD tackled the vocal harmonies together (Dallas 2019). To my (sometimes questionable) ears they sounded great. Maybe someone who is more of a Yeshead can verify...but they sound like they are singing the same parts that Chris and JonA would sing. I wonder how much work went on behind the scenes getting all the harmonies figured out? Or are these guys so influenced by Yes that singing those parts is already in their musical DNA so to speak?

[Stadler]

One last thing. Because I don't want to offer only negative points. I was very impressed with how well Billy and JonD tackled the vocal harmonies together (Dallas 2019). To my (sometimes questionable) ears they sounded great. Maybe someone who is more of a Yeshead can verify...but they sound like they are singing the same parts that Chris and JonA would sing. I wonder how much work went on behind the scenes getting all the harmonies figured out? Or are these guys so influenced by Yes that singing those parts is already in their musical DNA so to speak?

I can't speak for Davison (my criticisms of him are documented here; Orbert clearly agrees with me on those), but Sherwood is a long-time friend of Squire, who was his mentor in many ways.  I'm sure you know that Sherwood was "in" Yes previous to taking Squire's spot, and worked closely with the band and the man in other ways.   I'm loathe to speak for a dead man, but I would be stunned if Sherwood wouldn't be Squire's first choice to replace him if the need arose. 

Sherwood is the real deal, IMO.  He's not the weak link of the new Yes. 

[Fritzinger]

Sherwood is the real deal, IMO.  He's not the weak link of the new Yes. 

As long as he doesn't mix or produce anything...

I would be stunned if Sherwood wouldn't be Squire's first choice to replace him if the need arose. 

I THINK that's actually a fact. I can't remember where I read it, but I think prior to his death, Chris actually expressed his desire of Yes continuing with Billy.

[Orbert]

That is absolutely a fact.  Billy Sherwood was literally picked by Chris Squire as his replacement in Yes.  He told the other guys as much.  He knew his time was limited, and wanted the guys to know that Billy had his blessing.  I'm sure it helps that Billy was an official member of the band prior to that (one album anyway) and behind the scenes of a few more.  I don't know if the band had even thought about potential replacements for Chris, but this made it all much simpler.

Also, it's Davison, not Davidson.  And yep, Jon D is singing Jon A's original parts, and Billy sings Chris' parts.

[pg1067]

I would be stunned if Sherwood wouldn't be Squire's first choice to replace him if the need arose. 

I THINK that's actually a fact. I can't remember where I read it, but I think prior to his death, Chris actually expressed his desire of Yes continuing with Billy.

I recall that as well, although I couldn't begin to remember where.

[Lupton]

Wow. Thanks Orbert. I thought they might. I was all ready to dislike Jon D based on all the comments I've read in threads like these, but I found much to my surprise that I enjoyed his singing and performance -- not as replacement for Jon A, but more of an alternative that works well with the music. I actaully was really surprised I found myself digging on what Jon D was doing (You know what they say about expectation?) Also, his acoustic guitar playing at the end of Soon sounded very competent (I thought). He seems like an extremely talented and musical dude.

[Stadler]

Wow. Thanks Orbert. I thought they might. I was all ready to dislike Jon D based on all the comments I've read in threads like these, but I found much to my surprise that I enjoyed his singing and performance -- not as replacement for Jon A, but more of an alternative that works well with the music. I actaully was really surprised I found myself digging on what Jon D was doing (You know what they say about expectation?) Also, his acoustic guitar playing at the end of Soon sounded very competent (I thought). He seems like an extremely talented and musical dude.

I don't want anyone to think I'm disrespecting Jon D.   I have no doubt of his musical talent.   But just like Bono might not be the best fit for AC/DC, so here.  I just think that across the board with all seven of the main musicians in the classic era of Yes - Anderson, Bruford, Howe, Kaye, Squire, Wakeman, and White - the beauty of Yes for me was the ghost of a garage band (in the way that the early Beatles was a garage band) that was always behind the lovey-dovey, peace prog pretentions.  That's utterly gone with Jon D (in my opinion).

[Orbert]

Wow, I'm pretty much the opposite.  The main thing I like about Jon D is that he seems very spiritual and positive ("airy-fairy" is what I see too often) in much the same way Jon A was/is.  The fact that his voice has a similar timbre is a plus.

I'm not exactly sure what you mean about Yes having the spectre of a garage band behind their sound.  Maybe because I was getting into them around the same time I was becoming a musician myself, but they've always been on a level way, way above me in terms of musicianship and songwriting.  They came out of the gate with six original songs and two covers that completely transcend the originals, all masterfully arranged and performed.  I will never be more than a garage band musician compared to those guys.

[Lupton]

Wow. Thanks Orbert. I thought they might. I was all ready to dislike Jon D based on all the comments I've read in threads like these, but I found much to my surprise that I enjoyed his singing and performance -- not as replacement for Jon A, but more of an alternative that works well with the music. I actaully was really surprised I found myself digging on what Jon D was doing (You know what they say about expectation?) Also, his acoustic guitar playing at the end of Soon sounded very competent (I thought). He seems like an extremely talented and musical dude.

I don't want anyone to think I'm disrespecting Jon D.   I have no doubt of his musical talent.   But just like Bono might not be the best fit for AC/DC, so here.  I just think that across the board with all seven of the main musicians in the classic era of Yes - Anderson, Bruford, Howe, Kaye, Squire, Wakeman, and White - the beauty of Yes for me was the ghost of a garage band (in the way that the early Beatles was a garage band) that was always behind the lovey-dovey, peace prog pretentions.  That's utterly gone with Jon D (in my opinion).

Totally makes sense Stadler. Especially when you put in perspective of their whole career. In my mind no-one can actually replace Jon A. But still, I like what Jon D does though. It serves the songs well enough. My problems with current Yes performance have nothing to do with him and have everything to do band chemistry (see 1st post in thread).

[Stadler]

Wow, I'm pretty much the opposite.  The main thing I like about Jon D is that he seems very spiritual and positive ("airy-fairy" is what I see too often) in much the same way Jon A was/is.  The fact that his voice has a similar timbre is a plus.

I'm not exactly sure what you mean about Yes having the spectre of a garage band behind their sound.  Maybe because I was getting into them around the same time I was becoming a musician myself, but they've always been on a level way, way above me in terms of musicianship and songwriting.  They came out of the gate with six original songs and two covers that completely transcend the originals, all masterfully arranged and performed.  I will never be more than a garage band musician compared to those guys.

I mean it in the sense of... there was a lot of polish and sheen to them, the vocals were heavenly, but they were at their beating heart, a ROCK band.   Even with Jon A.'s pseudo-new-age lyrical nonsense, when they needed to close a show, they went with "Gimme Some" Lovin', or "I'm Down", or even "Purple Haze".  He'd run his voice to the edge, and there are countless examples of that pristine tenor running ragged.   I think Jon D.'s voice runs to the twee more than Jon A.'s, and I think Yes as a band needs more of the latter.

[Orbert]

Ah, I get it now.  That's what I meant about Jon D having Jon A's "light side" covered, but he can't rock out; he's got no edge or guts.  Jon A has a high voice, which he can't help obviously, but he can rock out.  First time I heard the Yes cover of "I'm Down" I was blown away.

That's my main complaint about Heaven and Earth.  It all sounds fine, and there are some nice melodies and of course great playing, but gets boring pretty fast.  It's all smooth and light and has no fucking balls to it, anywhere.  Yes has (up until recently) always had that contrast, the heavy and the light.  Benoit David, and now Jon Davison, are both fine singers, but they can't bring the rock and roll.  No balls.

[Lupton]

I think a lot of that is musical background. Look at the tunes Jon was covering back in his old bands. Jon Anderson has soul.  He's comfortable singing the blues. I mean "Have you heard the news? Yes is in the House of Blues!" [from the Ladder tour I think that one was!  ]

[Orbert]

Sharp!

Distance!

[Lupton]

Howe!

Can!

[Kwyjibo]

The Wind!

With its arms all around me!

[The Curious Orange]

UK TOUR ANNOUNCEMENT: THE ALBUM SERIES 2020
The Album Series 2020 Tour will feature YES' 1974 Relayer album in its entirety...

To be fair, given that they've played The Yes Album, Fragile, CTTE, as much of Tales as they could reasonably be expected to play, GFTO and Drama, this was to be expected, and we really should consider ourselves lucky they're not playing Tormato...

[Stadler]

UK TOUR ANNOUNCEMENT: THE ALBUM SERIES 2020
The Album Series 2020 Tour will feature YES' 1974 Relayer album in its entirety...

To be fair, given that they've played The Yes Album, Fragile, CTTE, as much of Tales as they could reasonably be expected to play, GFTO and Drama, this was to be expected, and we really should consider ourselves lucky they're not playing Tormato...

Honestly, with no irony or hyperbole, "Tormato" woudl be the one album that would get me to go see them at this point.   Other than "Arriving UFO" and "Circus Of Heaven", that's a stellar album in my book. 

I've seen Yes as much as any band, but that was with Squire (top five favorite musicians ever), and as much as I really like Sherwood, I have no desire to listen to Jon D. cutesy his way through songs that Jon Anderson owned then and still does (I saw him live a couple weeks ago, and although he looked like he was 86, he sounded like he was 26).  It doesn't help that Relayer is not really high on my Yes list (Tormato is, truthfully, higher). 

[Orbert]

Same here.  I recognize "Gates of Delirium" as a masterpiece, but Side Two has always left me a bit empty.  "Sound Chaser" is nuts, and I can see why people like that one, too, but to me it's very uneven.  Same with "To Be Over."  A cool song, but not one I really seek out.  Both of those songs shift moods pretty quickly, almost randomly, and while that can be very cool, it can also be overused as a musical device, and here I think it is just that, overused.  The pretty much leaves only "Gates" for me.  A great song, but not quite enough to push Relayer over Tormato for me.

I picked up Tormato during my initial Yes run, so as much as it gets slagged these days, at the time it was just the next Yes album.  After the glorious Going for the One and coming off the epic-crazed three-album run preceding it, a return to "regular" songs was fine with me, a nice change.  I skip "Circus of Heaven" just because it's so repetitive and never seems to pay off, but I kinda like "Arriving UFO."  That break where we actually get visited by the aliens is cool.  Howe is a madman.

[romdrums]

It doesn't help that Relayer is not really high on my Yes list (Tormato is, truthfully, higher).

I know "TASTES!!" and all, but that might be the most confounding thing I've seen you post, Stads. 

[Stadler]

It doesn't help that Relayer is not really high on my Yes list (Tormato is, truthfully, higher).

I know "TASTES!!" and all, but that might be the most confounding thing I've seen you post, Stads. 

Well, bear in mind that "Going For The One" is my favorite album of any band, ever, and like Orbert said, "Tormato is the next album in that run".  I wasn't a real-time fan at that point - I got in just after Drama came out, and primarily with a cheap cassette of "Fragile" - so I'm not really a "Moraz" guy.   I just thought it was missing the things I really love/loved about Yes.  It's not a bad album at all, but just not up there with the greats for me.

[pg1067]

For me, with the exception of A Venture and 3 of the 5 solo pieces on Fragile, the run from The Yes Album through Gates of Delirium is top 5 is pretty well perfection.  Side 2 of Relayer brought that to a fairly crashing halt.  I agree with Orbert's assessment of Sound Chaser, and To Be Over is an absolute dud.  The last two classic lineup albums are hit and miss (Tormato is spotty, I don't care for the song GFTO, and I think the studio version of Parallels is also fairly weak, although the live version on Yesyears is epic).

[Orbert]

Rick Wakeman confirms pretty much exactly what we were saying.

"The whole Yes thing has been a mess since Chris Squire died. Nobody knows what the hell is going on."

[Orbert]

Double post because it occurred to me that Rick is talking about Yes as a band overall and we were talking about on stage.  So not exactly the same thing, but that's where my mind went first.

[Stadler]

For me, with the exception of A Venture and 3 of the 5 solo pieces on Fragile, the run from The Yes Album through Gates of Delirium is top 5 is pretty well perfection.  Side 2 of Relayer brought that to a fairly crashing halt.  I agree with Orbert's assessment of Sound Chaser, and To Be Over is an absolute dud.  The last two classic lineup albums are hit and miss (Tormato is spotty, I don't care for the song GFTO, and I think the studio version of Parallels is also fairly weak, although the live version on Yesyears is epic).

What three (or two)? 

I like four of the five, and the fifth is too inconsequential to really "like" (Five Percent For Nothing).   I dig the Brahm's piece, I dig Mood For A Day, I dig The Fish (though it's better live) and I really like We Have Heaven. 

[KevShmev]

I agree that Sound Chaser is a bit of a miss, but it can be a fun one.  I like To Be Over a lot, and of course The Gates of Delirium is incredible; still a top 5 Yes tune in my book.  So yeah, I am a big fan of Relayer and don't think either Going for the One or Tormato come close to equaling it.  But that's me. 

[ytserush]

That is absolutely a fact.  Billy Sherwood was literally picked by Chris Squire as his replacement in Yes.  He told the other guys as much.  He knew his time was limited, and wanted the guys to know that Billy had his blessing.  I'm sure it helps that Billy was an official member of the band prior to that (one album anyway) and behind the scenes of a few more.  I don't know if the band had even thought about potential replacements for Chris, but this made it all much simpler.

Also, it's Davison, not Davidson.  And yep, Jon D is singing Jon A's original parts, and Billy sings Chris' parts.

Totally Chris' call.   Never been a fan of the guy myself but he made it pretty clear who he wanted.