2016 NFL THREAD - Super Bowl 51 - Patriots' Day: V - Screw Goodell

[King Postwhore]

BTW, not being brought up in the Pederson 8th circuit appeal in MN, that is about Article 46 which could change everything about the power of the commissioner.

[El Barto]

BTW, I wore my Patriots Moss jersey when I was traveling and had some great interactions with various people. I liked the Jets fans better because I can give them shit. Giants fans and I generally maintained quiet respect for each other and left it at that. One guy at the car rental place was a Jets fan but commended me anyway for it being a Moss jersey (and also thought the deflategate thing was bullshit).

[cramx3]

BTW, I wore my Patriots Moss jersey when I was traveling and had some great interactions with various people. I liked the Jets fans better because I can give them shit. Giants fans and I generally maintained quiet respect for each other and left it at that. One guy at the car rental place was a Jets fan but commended me anyway for it being a Moss jersey (and also thought the deflategate thing was bullshit).

Well if you approach people and say "Im a patriots fan because Dallas is my closest NFL team" then you are certainly going to get along with Giants fans. 

[Hyperplex]

Bradford wants out of Philly; Eagles "blindsided"

https://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000655664/article/sam-bradford-requests-trade-eagles-blindsided?campaign=fb-nf-sf25002236-sf25002236

[King Postwhore]

Face to Face it's fun ribbing.  For more fans they hate the Pats but know how corrupt the owners and Goodell are.

Funny thing though, I took more crap for my Red Sox shirt in Columbus, OH then my Pats T-Shirt or Hat.

[El Barto]

BTW, I wore my Patriots Moss jersey when I was traveling and had some great interactions with various people. I liked the Jets fans better because I can give them shit. Giants fans and I generally maintained quiet respect for each other and left it at that. One guy at the car rental place was a Jets fan but commended me anyway for it being a Moss jersey (and also thought the deflategate thing was bullshit).

Well if you approach people and say "Im a patriots fan because Dallas is my closest NFL team" then you are certainly going to get along with Giants fans. 

   I suppose that's true, but it was a Rams fan that asked me about it.

[TheCountOfNYC]

BTW, I wore my Patriots Moss jersey when I was traveling and had some great interactions with various people. I liked the Jets fans better because I can give them shit. Giants fans and I generally maintained quiet respect for each other and left it at that. One guy at the car rental place was a Jets fan but commended me anyway for it being a Moss jersey (and also thought the deflategate thing was bullshit).

As a Jets fan, my hatred of the Pats comes from how good they have been for the past decade and a half. The way I see it, if you don't hate your favorite team's biggest rival, they're doing something wrong. I don't hate the Dolphins anywhere near as much as I hate Nee England. Regardless of whether the Patriots cheated or not, they still won four Super Bowls, six conference championships, thirteen division titles, and earned 10 first round byes under the Brady/Belichick rule. That has nothing to do with cheating. That has everything to do with good roster building, good team chemistry, good coaching, and good football playing. The simple fact is, the Brady/Belichick Patriots were gonna be a dynasty anyway.

[KevShmev]

  Regardless of whether the Patriots cheated or not, they still won four Super Bowls, six conference championships, thirteen division titles, and earned 10 first round byes under the Brady/Belichick rule. That has nothing to do with cheating. That has everything to do with good roster building, good team chemistry, good coaching, and good football playing. The simple fact is, the Brady/Belichick Patriots were gonna be a dynasty anyway.

Very true. That'w why it is unfortunate that they had to do Spygate, because it calls into question the legitimacy of their greatness for some*, and that is the Patriots own fault.

You have to wonder if deep down, Brady isn't kicking himself a little bit for how he handled the Deflategate story right after it broke.  I can't help but think this story would have been over a long time ago and he would have gotten just a fine had he been fully cooperative.  And I hope anyone isn't obtuse enough to ask how he wasn't cooperative.

*Not me...I still think Belichick is the best NFL coach since I started watching football in the mid 80s, and Brady is one of the best two or three QBs ever (possibly the best, depending on what day it is).

[El Barto]

  Regardless of whether the Patriots cheated or not, they still won four Super Bowls, six conference championships, thirteen division titles, and earned 10 first round byes under the Brady/Belichick rule. That has nothing to do with cheating. That has everything to do with good roster building, good team chemistry, good coaching, and good football playing. The simple fact is, the Brady/Belichick Patriots were gonna be a dynasty anyway.

Very true. That'w why it is unfortunate that they had to do Spygate, because it calls into question the legitimacy of their greatness for some*, and that is the Patriots own fault.

You have to wonder if deep down, Brady isn't kicking himself a little bit for how he handled the Deflategate story right after it broke.  I can't help but think this story would have been over a long time ago and he would have gotten just a fine had he been fully cooperative.  And I hope anyone isn't obtuse enough to ask how he wasn't cooperative.

*Not me...I still think Belichick is the best NFL coach since I started watching football in the mid 80s, and Brady is one of the best two or three QBs ever (possibly the best, depending on what day it is).

Agreed on all parts (other than the timeframe of Belichick's greatness  ). The spygate thing hurt them twice. Not only did it call into question what they had accomplished, it made the deflategate thing impossible for many to see objectively. I really think without that first strike people are less quick to judge this time around.

At the same time I think the league does the same thing, just with more scorn hurled its way for being a joke. I've pretty much decided this was never about cheating at all.

[King Postwhore]

Though it was legal to film from the sidelines until the start of the 2007 season and null and voids all screamers of the Pats have no legit SB's.  Even Bill Cowher and Jimmy Johnson said they did it was well

[El Barto]

Though it was legal to film from the sidelines until the start of the 2007 season and null and voids all screamers of the Pats have no legit SB's.  Even Bill Cowher and Jimmy Johnson said they did it was well

Jimmy was up to a helluva lot worse than that. But it doesn't matter. If they all break the rules and the Patriots get caught, then the people who want to call them cheaters can legitimately do so. It just bugs me that it got expanded to include a made up offense.

And what's the ABV of your latest brew? Might want to tone it down a notch. 

[pogoowner]

And what's the ABV of your latest brew? Might want to tone it down a notch. 

I think my mind has developed a kingshmegland translator. I barely noticed anything until I went back and re-read his post.

[King Postwhore]

 

It's was more like half awake on my recliner and I should have gone to bed.

[kaos2900]

The Eagles better be careful or they're going to turn into the Browns.

[The Trooper]

IMHO it all comes down to the NFL just pushing their power around. I am no Brady fan. but he is just being used as the poster boy by the NFL to attempt to prove their power.

[King Postwhore]

The players association was dumb enough to sign this contract.  What should bother all NFL fans is the abuse of this power and uneven punishments.

[The Trooper]

100% agree King.

[cramx3]

The Eagles better be careful or they're going to turn into the Browns.

Fine with me 

[Dublagent66]

The Eagles better be careful or they're going to turn into the Browns.

Fine with me 

Philadelphia Beagles

LOL Brady.  The most exciting news of the off season so far.

The players association was dumb enough to sign this contract.  What should bother all NFL fans is the abuse of this power and uneven punishments.

Never gonna change man.  It's the culture in which we live.  It'll just keep on going until the next comet hits.  For now, just enjoy the game while it lasts...

[King Postwhore]

Well, in 2020 it will end in a strike.  It's headed that way.

[Dream Team]

To quote Daryus of the G.N.E., "justice will be served".

[King Postwhore]

It's not justice when the one with the gavel is corrupt.

[kaos2900]

Can all of the sports news entities PLEASE STOP TALKING ABOUT JOHNNY MANZIEL? The guy is a douche and was NEVER going to make it in the NFL in the first place. He does not deserve nearly the amount of attention that he's getting.

[Dublagent66]

LOL Manziel.  They couldn't stop talking about him when he got drafted and he turned out to be only a fraction of what they said he was.  Now that he's been indicted, maybe they should just open mouth and insert foot.   

[mikeyd23]

It's not justice when the one with the gavel is corrupt.

Eh, the players union is supposed to represent Tom. They signed a legal contract giving Goodell the power to do what he did. Goodell then exercised the power he had been legally granted. That's it plain and simple.

Now you might not like what Goodell did, you might say that his punishments are inconsistent, etc... but none of that negates the above. And that's exactly what this recent court ruling says. Honestly if I was Brady I won't necessarily be mad at Goodell, I'd be more mad at my union for signing that crappy deal.

[King Postwhore]

I'm not denying that at all.  There has to be a fair process and it is well documented that this process was not fair.  2020 there will be a strike.  It it can happen to one of the top 5 players in the league, it can happen to anyone.  Fair process is what is the next battle will be about.

[El Barto]

It's not justice when the one with the gavel is corrupt.

Eh, the players union is supposed to represent Tom. They signed a legal contract giving Goodell the power to do what he did. Goodell then exercised the power he had been legally granted. That's it plain and simple.

Now you might not like what Goodell did, you might say that his punishments are inconsistent, etc... but none of that negates the above. And that's exactly what this recent court ruling says. Honestly if I was Brady I won't necessarily be mad at Goodell, I'd be more mad at my union for signing that crappy deal.

I agree with your assessment. However there's room to be mad at both. I suspect there was an expectation that Goodell would exercise his discretionary power fairly and in the best interest of the league. He did neither here.

Also, there was an article about how that CBA came to be in 2011 recently. Punishment by the league, which had generally been pretty reasonable, was low on the list of priorities in favor of far more important matters. That won't be the case come 2020. 

[mikeyd23]

I'm not denying that at all.  There has to be a fair process and it is well documented that this process was not fair.  2020 there will be a strike.  It it can happen to one of the top 5 players in the league, it can happen to anyone.  Fair process is what is the next battle will be about.

I agree that in the future a "fair" process should be determined, but that doesn't really apply to the current situation, as it is under the current contract the union and league negotiated, that's all I'm saying. Also, whether or not the player in question is considered "a top player" should not be taken into account when it comes to player discipline. In fact, if that is taken into account, I'd argue you might be moving farther away from being "fair".

I agree with your assessment. However there's room to be mad at both. I suspect there was an expectation that Goodell would exercise his discretionary power fairly and in the best interest of the league. He did neither here.

Also, there was an article about how that CBA came to be in 2011 recently. Punishment by the league, which had generally been pretty reasonable, was low on the list of priorities in favor of far more important matters. That won't be the case come 2020. 

Agreed.

[King Postwhore]

There needs to be structure so an equipment violation is not 2 draft picks, 1 million dollars and a suspension of 4 games for "he might know something so he's guilty".  While other team, heat up the balls on the sideline on TV and get a "cut that out" and another uses stickum on towels and get $25,000 fine. 

There needs to be guildlines and not "at the digression" of the commissioner.

[mikeyd23]

There needs to be structure so an equipment violation is not 2 draft picks, 1 million dollars and a suspension of 4 games for "he might know something so he's guilty".  While other team, heat up the balls on the sideline on TV and get a "cut that out" and another uses stickum on towels and get $25,000 fine. 

There needs to be guildlines and not "at the digression" of the commissioner.

Agreed. But can we also agree that since Goodell was contractual given the power to hand out discipline pretty much however the hell he wanted, that he could have taken 200 draft picks, 100 billion dollars and suspended Tom until 2112 (nugget) if he wanted to? And that all would have been completely within in his power?

Because that's what this recent ruling said. It didn't say Tom deflated balls, it didn't say 2 draft picks and 4 games was too harsh. It merely determined that Goodell was in fact acting within his contractually awarded power. And that is accurate.

[King Postwhore]

Oh I agree.  We can also say that he's also doing the bidding of many of the owners who thought the punishment for Spygate was not harsh enough.  funny, at the time that was the biggest penalty ever.  Also it wasn't illegal to film from the sideline until the 2007 season.  It was BB's arrogance to try to work around that so he deserved it but it wasn't enough?

It bugs a lot of Pats fans when you hear Goodell say "The integrity of the game" when he and the owners have not acted with integrity at all.

[El Barto]

It bugs a lot of Pats fans when you hear Goodell say "The integrity of the game" when he and the owners have not acted with integrity at all.

Hear, hear.

[mikeyd23]

Oh I agree.  We can also say that he's also doing the bidding of many of the owners who thought the punishment for Spygate was not harsh enough.  funny, at the time that was the biggest penalty ever.  Also it wasn't illegal to film from the sideline until the 2007 season.  It was BB's arrogance to try to work around that so he deserved it but it wasn't enough?

It bugs a lot of Pats fans when you hear Goodell say "The integrity of the game" when he and the owners have not acted with integrity at all.

Yup, I agree with all that. Goes back to what was discussed earlier about the next contract negotiations in 2020, should be very interesting to see how those play out.

[axeman90210]

I'll be watching the draft tonight with my fingers crossed whispering "Please not Paxton Lynch" over and over again.

[hefdaddy42]

The draft is always a fun time.