The Experimental/Avant-Garde Music Thread v. NEW BENT KNEE SONG!!!

[Sacul]

For the longest time I thought the forum needed a space dedicated to the weird and the unconventional, for those bands/groups that are "out there", and aren't big enough to get featured on an exclusive thread. So I made this

Some of my favorite experimental records are:

Death Grips - The Powers That B
Jenny Hval & Susanna - Meshes of Voice
clipping. - CLPPNG
Shpongle - Tales of the Inexpressible
Swans - The Seer
Kashiwa Daisuke - Program Music I
maudlin of the well - Bath

[Train of Naught]

Well, I know next to nothing about the genre avant-garde, but there's this one song by a band I love that I've been told is labeled as avant-garde metal, but I don't want to spoil it 'cuz roulette.

[Enigmachine]

I'm surprised you didn't mention Kayo Dot even though you mentioned motW. They're really good and Coffins on Io is probably my favourite even if it isn't particularly 'out there'. I've only just noticed that they're making a new album.

[Elite]

Bath is a gem.

As are Deathconsciousness (may that be labeled as such?) and, probably my favourite 'wacky' record ever, California by Mr. Bungle.

[Sacul]

I'm surprised you didn't mention Kayo Dot even though you mentioned motW. They're really good and Coffins on Io is probably my favourite even if it isn't particularly 'out there'. I've only just noticed that they're making a new album.

I haven't really delved into KD yet, but I plan to do so after my roulette is over.

Well Deathconsciousness has a pretty unique sound, and touches many styles so I guess it can be considered kind of experimental. I guess in the end, this thread works for any band that it's pretty tough to classify too.

[Zantera]

Some of these (Swans, motW) already have threads, though I guess I can kinda understand the idea for it, but there's also another thread with almost the exact same title (another Avant-Garde thread) so that might be confusing.

[Scorpion]

Definitely one of my favourite genres, some of my favourite artists (with recommended tracks, should anybody want to check them out) are:

- Dog Fashion Disco (Silent Film, Desert Grave, Struck By Lightning)
- Diablo Swing Orchestra (A Tap Dancer's Dilemma, Lucy Fears the Morning Star, Justice for Saint Mary)
- Polkadot Cadaver (Bloodsucker, Bring Me the Head of Andy Warhol, Slaughterhouse Striptease)
- Unexpect (Chromatic Chimaera, In the Mind of the Last Whale, Mechanical Phoenix)
- maudlin of the Well (The Ferryman, They Aren't All Beautiful, Banquet of Dis)
- Sigh (Ecstatic Transformation, Purgatorium, Amnesia)
- sikTh (Tupelo, Summer Rain, In This Light) 
- Stolen Babies (Lifeless, Push Button)

[Shadow Ninja 2.0]

Where the fuck is Devil Doll in this thread. Y'all are LETTIN' ME DOWN.

[Scorpion]

Be honest, you'd be slightly peeved if somebody other than you would be the one to mention them.

[Shadow Ninja 2.0]

OK, fair enough.

Seconding appreciation for maudlin, DFD, DSO, etc.

edit: Oh yeah, also any Mike Patton stuff I guess. That shit's pretty weird.

[Train of Naught]

Where the fuck is Devil Doll in this thread. Y'all are LETTIN' ME DOWN.

Right, that reminds me I still need to check out The Girl Who Was.. Death

[Fluffy Lothario]

Velvet Underground - White Light/White Heat
John Coltrane - Meditations
Tim Buckley - Lorca
Meshuggah - Catch Thirty Three (yeah, I know it's djent / prog-metal, but if C33 ain't experimental, I don't know what is).

I've still never gone as far as to check out an album, but I really liked some of what Estradasphere were doing.

Oh, and I assume Fire! Orchestra are adequately freaky.

[splent]

Anything by Jan Terri.

O Superman by Laurie Anderson

[seasonsinthesky]

One of the best avant-garde sorta things I heard recently is Akhlys - The Dreaming I. It's avant-black metal taken so far toward the surreal and formless that it sounds like an hourlong nightmare.

Actually, same goes for the latest Abyssal album, Antikatastaseis.

[Sacul]

Forgot to mention, anything by Ulver 

[Nihil-Morari]

I was busy typing up short reviews on all artists that I could add in this thread, but my browser quit. So I'll just add the artists now   

Diamanda Galas
B. Dolan (relevant album: The Failure)
Bass Communion, Fear Falls Burning, Dirk Serries
Current 93, Nurse With Wound
Devil Doll
Fantomas
Omar Rodriguez Lopez
Sunn O)))
David Sylvian (check out There's A Light That Enters Houses...)
Scott Walker


Funny thing is that this is not an actual genre. It's more like Prog-liquor: extra strong.
John Coltrane, Meshuggah, Diablo Swing Orchestra, Ulver, etc. all operate within another genre too. Could be a cool discussion to sort of determine what Avant Garde music actually is. 

[Sacul]

I think avant-garde is not that different from progressive rock, in the sense they both seek to expand what's possible to make in music, but I feel the former is far more experimental.

Btw, two of my favourite avant-garde groups have announced new albums: Bent Knee in May, and Diablo Swing Orchestra later this year

[Scorpion]

What DSO is doing something

WANT

If it's anywhere near as good as Pandora's Pinata then this should be awesome. Justice for Saint Mary is one of my favourite songs of all time, I love the insane breakdown at the end so much.

[Fluffy Lothario]

 

Funny thing is that this is not an actual genre. It's more like Prog-liquor: extra strong.
John Coltrane, Meshuggah, Diablo Swing Orchestra, Ulver, etc. all operate within another genre too. Could be a cool discussion to sort of determine what Avant Garde music actually is. 

Wikipedia is your friend.

“The avant-garde (from French, "advance guard" or "vanguard", literally "fore-guard") are people or works that are experimental or innovative, particularly with respect to art, culture, and politics. The avant-garde pushes the boundaries of what is accepted as the norm or the status quo, primarily in the cultural realm.”

An avant-garde approach can be applied to literally any type of music, or art in general. Beach Boys’ Pet Sounds was avant-garde in its time, no-one had made pop with that kind of instrumentation before. Bitches Brew was extremely avant-garde.

On dtf though, the word seems to be almost exclusively connected with this niche corner of rock and metal vaguely connected to prog where, to use a description I’ve used in the past, bands are, in musical terms, painting photo negatives with their own shit.

[Zantera]

To me the main difference is Avant-Garde being more something that pushes the boundaries of what we define as a genre, whereas prog rock really hasn't been that forward thinking in quite a while. Don't get me wrong, there's still a lot of good prog coming out, but it isn't really THAT groundbreaking. A lot of things we have heard before, but in a new package. I remember the first time I listened to Choirs of the Eye by Kayo Dot (one of the best albums ever), it just blew my mind and I genuinely hadn't heard anything like it before. Death Grips sorta qualifies as well, but at this point they're becoming a bit predictable and boring as well, feels a bit like they used their ideas and there's not much more left.

[Mladen]

Velvet Underground - White Light/White Heat

Yep, this one is insane.

Would anyone be so kind to recommend some other oldschool 60s avant-garde? I've always liked Captain Beefheart and over the last few months I got into TVU, but I wonder what else is out there.

[Fluffy Lothario]

I don't think avant-garde was really a label people attached to rock at the time. So the stuff that was really boundary-pushing just gets labelled "experimental", which means it blends in with everything else because about 2/3rds of rock music written in the 60s was experimental to a reasonable degree.

These are all great albums:
Tim Buckley - Lorca (I already mentioned this, but I can't stress how great and strange this dude was)
Pink Floyd - Piper at the Gates of Dawn (if you haven't heard it, not to mention a lot of the stuff between Barrett and Dark Side, though I don't really like much of their stuff after Piper)
Grateful Dead - Anthem for the Sun. Or check out a live version of Dark Star.
Dr John, the Night Tripper - Gris-Gris

I didn't like these albums, but they all seem to have quite the cult following.
The Incredible String Band - The Hangman's Beautiful Daughter
Comus - First Utterance
Cro-Magnon - Orgasm (aka possibly the single weirdest album ever made)

[Mladen]

Thanks for the recommendations, man. Of those, I'm only familiar with Barrett-era Floyd.

[ThatOneGuy2112]

Cro-Magnon - Orgasm (aka possibly the single weirdest album ever made)

Always been a strange album for me. Even though it tries really hard to be boundary-pushing, maybe it tried a little too hard and even feels limited in that regard in being too focused on being weird. A bit of experimental just for the sake of it. I still think it's worth a listen though. It's certainly bizarre hearing noise and drone here, so it was certainly ahead of its time.

I'm not sure I'd call it the weirdest album I've ever heard though. It's up there, but that honor still goes to AMMMusic by AMM for me.

[Fluffy Lothario]

Yeah, whenever I've tried putting it on, there are moments where I'm like "these guys must have been geniuses to see that far forward" and then there are moments where the spell breaks and I'm like "this is just a bunch of twats fucking about and making noise".

[Nihil-Morari]

Yeah, whenever I've tried putting it on, there are moments where I'm like "these guys must have been geniuses to see that far forward" and then there are moments where the spell breaks and I'm like "this is just a bunch of twats fucking about and making noise".

Mostly that 

I've gotten a list of experimental stuff by a colleague of mine, who's very much into this stuff: Current 93, Dragged Into Sunlight, Esoteric, My Dying Bride (An album called '34.778%... Complete'), of which I only know the first one. Could be fun.

[Sacul]

New and final Swans album in May. Let the hype begin.

[Nihil-Morari]

What's the best starting place with Swans then, Sacul?

[Zantera]

I don't think there is a ultimate starting album with Swans, it kinda depends what you like. I started with The Seer and it worked just fine. Soundtrack for the Blind is their best, but also a tough challenge to get into. An album like White Light.. might be easier to get into, but also not overall representative of their sound as a whole.

I also don't buy that this is their last album. Last album with these musicians possibly, but Gira is too productive at this point to put Swans away completely I think.

[PuffyPat]

going to see animal collective tonight, actually.

death grips is great, but the powers that b as a whole is a little underwhelming. however, jenny death on its own is probably their best stuff.

[ThatOneGuy2112]

New and final Swans album in May. Let the hype begin.

Is there any confirmation for a May release? I don't recall seeing any announcements, unless I missed them.

What's the best starting place with Swans then, Sacul?

It all really depends on what you're already into. The Great Annihilator and White Light From the Mouth of Infinity are pretty accessible for Swans, but like Zantera said, aren't really representative of their whole discography.

If you want what the current Swans is all about, The Seer is a good start. I've seen a lot of people get sold on the band after listening to "Lunacy". From there, To Be Kind would be the next logical step and then you could try your hand at Soundtracks for the Blind.

If you want something more raw and noisy, their early albums like Filth and Cop are your go-to.

I also don't buy that this is their last album. Last album with these musicians possibly, but Gira is too productive at this point to put Swans away completely I think.

I don't think he'd put Swans as a whole to rest, but Gira has said that it's to be the last with the current line-up of the band.

[Nihil-Morari]

It turns out that I've already checked The Seer some time ago, although it really grips me, I'm not sure if I'd listen to this very often. It still lacks something, it's not post-rock enough to be heart wrenching, it's not monotonous enough to get me in a trance like state... I'm not sure.

[Zantera]

You should give another album a chance. I'd say their latest (To Be Kind) was even better than The Seer.

[Sacul]

This is all you need:



Bigger.

[Sacul]

Don't know where else to post it, but Bent Knee have announced their new album Say So it's gonna be released in May 20, and a new song has been premiered.

I'm quite hyped