*Official* The Astonishing discussion thread

[erwinrafael]

Daryus ends up deaf, but he still is the Crown Prince, right? So that evil bastard is the future king of an Empire where music will rise again… and he's deaf? I don't really think he'll stick to Nafaryus' plan the future… trouble is coming

And why does Gabriel's music cure stabbing, but not tinnitus?

Because his gift only works when his music can be heard.

[CDrice]

having Xander flying on the back of a raven (or whatever) has nothing to do with the story...right?

I have same question about this 

My theory back when the video was posted is that Ravenskill is called that way because their people literally have skills at riding giant ravens.

[BlackInk]

Entr'acte left no real impression on me, but my overall impression with Dystopian Overture is that it feels disjointed. While the seperate themes within are cool, all the sudden tempo changes gives me the feeling it doesn't flow very well.

[Shooters1221]

And to those that complain there isn't ONE track on here that's amazing all the way through, I think the whole album is intended to be "watched" like you do a movie, from start to finish, without trying to take scenes by themselves and then lament when they don't stand on their own.

The more I listen to this, the more I hear this as a Broadway type stage play. It's pretty great!

[BlobVanDam]

Daryus ends up deaf, but he still is the Crown Prince, right? So that evil bastard is the future king of an Empire where music will rise again… and he's deaf? I don't really think he'll stick to Nafaryus' plan the future… trouble is coming

And why does Gabriel's music cure stabbing, but not tinnitus?

Because his gift only works when his music can be heard.

So he can go around curing blindness, but not deafness. That's a shame.

[Gromit1710]

And to those that complain there isn't ONE track on here that's amazing all the way through, I think the whole album is intended to be "watched" like you do a movie, from start to finish, without trying to take scenes by themselves and then lament when they don't stand on their own.

The more I listen to this, the more I hear this as a Broadway type stage play. It's pretty great!

Yeah! Exactly! I was originally going to posit that the tracking indexes on the album is just there to help us understand what scene is playing and that's it 

[DarkLord_Lalinc]

Daryus ends up deaf, but he still is the Crown Prince, right? So that evil bastard is the future king of an Empire where music will rise again… and he's deaf? I don't really think he'll stick to Nafaryus' plan the future… trouble is coming

And why does Gabriel's music cure stabbing, but not tinnitus?

Because his gift only works when his music can be heard.

So he can go around curing blindness, but not deafness. That's a shame.

People need to read the small text at the bottom of the contract before requesting his healing services.

[Cyclopssss]

Stuff like this is what made me fall in love with this band in the first place. Not the crunchy riffs, although they were cool, but exactly things like this. 

[bosk1]

I just re upload it here https://vimeo.com/153834854 

Pringka this is better than anything we officially got so far, certinly better than the trailer they gave us, great work dude 

Thankyou man 
But I still hope second video from astonishing website page is a great animation video, I always hope it will be Dystopian Overture Video Clip 

You will find out what it is soon...

Do you know something we don't Bosky?

Of course.  That should be clear.  I know exactly what the video is, and I know it is scheduled to be posted very soon.  On the original schedule, it was supposed to have already been released.  But, again, marketing schedules are typically fluid and subject to change, and things have been moved around a bit for various reasons.  The other video is going to be pretty cool.  Nothing earth-shattering.  But I am confident most people will really enjoy it.

I am seeing very little chatter about Dystopian Overture, probably them doing another overture isn't as chatter-worthy as much of what they did elsewhere on this record, but the middle section where the orchestra plays one of the main themes followed by the full band coming back in with the choir singing is freaking AWESOME.

I know it is easy to get lost in all that has been posted, but I raved about it a week or so before release saying that, IMO, it could very well be the best overture they have done and is up there among the best pure instrumental songs. 

A thought on the live production of this album. I mean, I love JP and all, but it would do the show a great disservice to have him as the only other singer to JLB. A few really skilled backup singers would just push this album over the top.

Thoughts?

I agree with you that that would be best.  But I am not sure they plan on bringing any other vocalists, so I am trying to temper my expectations in the likely event that the backup vocals are simply done by JP and a backing track.  I think that is the most likely scenario even though it may not be optimal.

[dparrott]

One of the reasons it's second for me behind SFAM is that I appreciate it as a large collective work, just like SFAM.  These albums are more than just a collection of random songs.  Whether you like it or whether you don't....

And dat artwork tho! I love that artwork for the places were created.  That wasn't necessary to the music, but it adds to the imagination. 

[Progmetty]

I'm always opposed to the idea of bringing guest vocalists due to how it would attach the specific songs to people who are not always going to be available in future tours. The lady from SFAM had about as big a role as I would like a guest vocalist to have on a DT album.

[Gromit1710]

I'm always opposed to the idea of bringing guest vocalists due to how it would attach the specific songs to people who are not always going to be available in future tours. The lady from SFAM had about as big a role as I would like a guest vocalist to have on a DT album.

Yeah... I can't watch the Live Metropolis version of Spirit Carries On without tearing up a bit at the end. Theresa Thomason and that choir MADE that song what it is. And it's never the same without them.

[bosk1]

Everyone mostly agrees that they'd gotten into a rut of sorts

Good post.  But as for the part I quoted, just...no.  Yes, that is a common opinion.  But it is also a minority one, even if it may be a sizable minority.  Personally, I have NEVER felt that the band was in a "rut."  Ever.

[Gromit1710]

Everyone mostly agrees that they'd gotten into a rut of sorts

Good post.  But as for the part I quoted, just...no.  Yes, that is a common opinion.  But it is also a minority one, even if it may be a sizable minority.  Personally, I have NEVER felt that the band was in a "rut."  Ever.

Eh.. the word "Mostly" was in there for a reason. I personally didn't feel that way either, but a good portion of fellow fans I know did. Your mileage may vary.

[FlyingBIZKIT]

It's hard for me to find time to sit down and listen to The Astonishing in full, and I still dont really know the album all that well. I feel like it's easy for me to break it down into several small chunks, like 3-5 songs at a time. Any suggestions on what would be good combinations ?

[bosk1]

Everyone mostly agrees that they'd gotten into a rut of sorts

Good post.  But as for the part I quoted, just...no.  Yes, that is a common opinion.  But it is also a minority one, even if it may be a sizable minority.  Personally, I have NEVER felt that the band was in a "rut."  Ever.

Eh.. the word "Mostly" was in there for a reason. I personally didn't feel that way either, but a good portion of fellow fans I know did. Your mileage may vary.

No problem.  But when people post something that assumes a general consensus that is probably not actually the consensus, I just feel the need to step in and point out that that assumption is not entirely accurate. 

Anyhow, that is largely immaterial to the discussion as a whole, so...carry on.

[bosk1]

It's hard for me to find time to sit down and listen to The Astonishing in full, and I still dont really know the album all that well. I feel like it's easy for me to break it down into several small chunks, like 3-5 songs at a time. Any suggestions on what would be good combinations ?

Personally, if I had to pick a favorite, standout section of the album, it would be the run of songs in Act I from Ravenskill through A New Beginning.  That is a good combo to get a good flavor for both the music and the story. 

To me, some of the "chunks" that I feel have good flow and I am beginning to gain the most familiarity are: 
-Act I, tracks 1-8 (yeah, I know that is a LONG stretch, but it makes logical sense in terms of story, and has a good pacing; to me, the pacing drops off a bit at Act of Faythe).
-Act I, tracks 14-19 (which is what I recommended above)
-Act II, tracks 1-5 (sets up the first half of Act II nicely and has really good flow)
-Act II, tracks 7-10 (these songs just feel right as one unit, and are unified by the action of the story)
-Act II, tracks 11-14 (as with the previous section, this section is very unified in terms of the action of the story; music-wise, it is less intense and doesn't feel as climactic as I would normally expect for the conclusion of an album. But it fits together well, so to respond to your question about logical "chunks," this one makes sense in terms of helping digest the story)

[Shooters1221]

Everyone mostly agrees that they'd gotten into a rut of sorts

Good post.  But as for the part I quoted, just...no.  Yes, that is a common opinion.  But it is also a minority one, even if it may be a sizable minority.  Personally, I have NEVER felt that the band was in a "rut."  Ever.

Eh.. the word "Mostly" was in there for a reason. I personally didn't feel that way either, but a good portion of fellow fans I know did. Your mileage may vary.

Also, I think 'rut' is a tricky word as I believe in bands trying new directions/styles in growth through the years, but I also want to hear them as "them" by keeping to a certain familiarity that attracted me to the music in the first place, which some would call a 'rut', I guess, if that makes sense.

[Gromit1710]

Everyone mostly agrees that they'd gotten into a rut of sorts

Good post.  But as for the part I quoted, just...no.  Yes, that is a common opinion.  But it is also a minority one, even if it may be a sizable minority.  Personally, I have NEVER felt that the band was in a "rut."  Ever.

Eh.. the word "Mostly" was in there for a reason. I personally didn't feel that way either, but a good portion of fellow fans I know did. Your mileage may vary.

No problem.  But when people post something that assumes a general consensus that is probably not actually the consensus, I just feel the need to step in and point out that that assumption is not entirely accurate. 

Anyhow, that is largely immaterial to the discussion as a whole, so...carry on.

[

[erwinrafael]

It's hard for me to find time to sit down and listen to The Astonishing in full, and I still dont really know the album all that well. I feel like it's easy for me to break it down into several small chunks, like 3-5 songs at a time. Any suggestions on what would be good combinations ?

This may seem like a joke, but break it up based on the NOMACS tracks. It works.

[bosk1]

It's hard for me to find time to sit down and listen to The Astonishing in full, and I still dont really know the album all that well. I feel like it's easy for me to break it down into several small chunks, like 3-5 songs at a time. Any suggestions on what would be good combinations ?

This may seem like a joke, but break it up based on the NOMACS tracks. It works.

Yeah, that's not a bad way to do it either. 

[erwinrafael]

DTF overanalyzing time:

Listen to the much talked about extended intro jam of Trial of Tears during the South American leg of the Along for the Ride tour. What The Astonishing song could have possible been born out of that jam?

[TH1RT3EN]

Daryus ends up deaf, but he still is the Crown Prince, right? So that evil bastard is the future king of an Empire where music will rise again… and he's deaf? I don't really think he'll stick to Nafaryus' plan for the future… trouble is coming

And why does Gabriel's music cure stabbing, but not tinnitus?

Because his gift only works when his music can be heard.

So he can go around curing blindness, but not deafness. That's a shame.

People need to read the small text at the bottom of the contract before requesting his healing services.

I suppose there are no hospitals in T.G.N.E. anymore, just music venues for Gabriel to play his show

[Kotowboy]

I can't understand people complaining The Astonishing isn't technical enough.

It's their THIRTEENTH album.

if you want technical Dream Theater - go and listen to any of the past TWELVE albums....

[BlobVanDam]

Daryus ends up deaf, but he still is the Crown Prince, right? So that evil bastard is the future king of an Empire where music will rise again… and he's deaf? I don't really think he'll stick to Nafaryus' plan for the future… trouble is coming

And why does Gabriel's music cure stabbing, but not tinnitus?

Because his gift only works when his music can be heard.

So he can go around curing blindness, but not deafness. That's a shame.

People need to read the small text at the bottom of the contract before requesting his healing services.

I suppose there are no hospitals in T.G.N.E. anymore, just music venues for Gabriel to play his show

Heaven's Cove Hospital?

[Gromit1710]

Everyone mostly agrees that they'd gotten into a rut of sorts

Good post.  But as for the part I quoted, just...no.  Yes, that is a common opinion.  But it is also a minority one, even if it may be a sizable minority.  Personally, I have NEVER felt that the band was in a "rut."  Ever.

Eh.. the word "Mostly" was in there for a reason. I personally didn't feel that way either, but a good portion of fellow fans I know did. Your mileage may vary.

Also, I think 'rut' is a tricky word as I believe in bands trying new directions/styles in growth through the years, but I also want to hear them as "them" by keeping to a certain familiarity that attracted me to the music in the first place, which some would call a 'rut', I guess, if that makes sense.

Depends on what you got into them for in the first place. I'm always amazed when people say they got into this band for how heavy they are. Personally, I've never thought of them as such 0_o

Heavy at times sure. But it was their compositions and diversity that brought me in and have kept me here. TA has all that and more. 

[CDrice]

I can't understand people complaining The Astonishing isn't technical enough.

It's their THIRTEENTH album.

if you want technical Dream Theater - go and listen to any of the past TWELVE albums....

And even though it may not be their most technical album, I probably still couldn't play more than half of it on guitar

[pantsofeternity]

My theory back when the video was posted is that Ravenskill is called that way because their people literally have skills at riding giant ravens.

I'm assuming it's just a cool-sounding place name JP came up with based on real places.  There are a lot of "kills" in the NY area and thereabouts -- it's a Dutch word for creek or river.

[mike099]

I've climbed the mountain that is this thread, and I'm not surprised by anything I've read. Lots of unique opinions, and for 2+ hours of music, I'm glad to see mostly positive reactions. I'm disappointed by the lack of love given specifically to the song Ravenskill (I think it might be my favorite, I'm still deliberating), but one thing remains clear: This album requires multiple listens. Unless you're the type of person who specifically seeks out analysis and breakdowns, there are so many nuggets in this album, and links and themes that the gravity of it is almost certainly something that bears weight (no pun intended).

RE: A New Beginning fade out - I have a feeling the fade out is 1) due to the time constraint of mortal CDs and 2) an opportunity for the band to take an extended jam session in the live show. I don't think it abrupt or out of place (especially given what it leads up to). I will say that I mistakenly coined it as the end of act 1 the first 3-4 listens, forgetting that The Road to Revolution is right after.

RE: My muuusiiiic plaaaaayerrrrr - I didn't find it as grating as I expected from early reviews, and my wife outright loves the song. This was discussed somewhere else, but I think there's just a certain level of 'cheese' that us manly metal men have problems digesting because we think it 'uncool'. When my wife said she started liking Act of Faythe more than Three Days, I started to gain an understanding from her outside perspective. Nothing on the album reached levels of "I'm just a poor girl..." or "Beginnings get complicated..." to me.

I'm still listening 30 minutes at a time to and from work every day, and this weekend I'll sit down again with the HDTracks version.

Speaking of the HD version, if anyone has the regular cd and the HD tracks, is there a significant difference?

[shadow1psc]

I feel like the DT 'rut' was most apparent during BCSL. I'm probably of the minority who thinks that ADToE was a feeling of revitalization in the DT camp. Did they play it a bit safe? Maybe, but I felt the fun and enjoyment in the music they made. DT12 felt like an attempt to buckle down and make something cohesive (Illumination Theory not withstanding) that could come across as their most radio safe record as a whole. The Astonishing completely surpassed all expectations set by the current lineup IMO. Nothing safe, standard or ordinary about this album.

[Kotowboy]

I remember thinking a while back that DT albums would slowly get less fast and technical so they could continue to play live as they get older.

[shadow1psc]

Post

Speaking of the HD version, if anyone has the regular cd and the HD tracks, is there a significant difference?

I A/B'd them very quickly, but it's so hard to give impressions when the production and mixing literally changes track by track.

[pantsofeternity]

It's hard for me to find time to sit down and listen to The Astonishing in full, and I still dont really know the album all that well. I feel like it's easy for me to break it down into several small chunks, like 3-5 songs at a time. Any suggestions on what would be good combinations ?

This may seem like a joke, but break it up based on the NOMACS tracks. It works.

Yeah, that's not a bad way to do it either. 

Doesn't seem like a joke at all -- that's how the band intended it to be broken up, yeah?  I assumed that's why they put the NOMAC tracks where they are.

[TH1RT3EN]

Daryus ends up deaf, but he still is the Crown Prince, right? So that evil bastard is the future king of an Empire where music will rise again… and he's deaf? I don't really think he'll stick to Nafaryus' plan for the future… trouble is coming

And why does Gabriel's music cure stabbing, but not tinnitus?

Because his gift only works when his music can be heard.

So he can go around curing blindness, but not deafness. That's a shame.

People need to read the small text at the bottom of the contract before requesting his healing services.

I suppose there are no hospitals in T.G.N.E. anymore, just music venues for Gabriel to play his show

Heaven's Cove Hospital?

"Heaven's Cove" sounds more like a spa resort to me. I wouldn't mind having a healing session in a place like that

[bosk1]

I'm probably of the minority who thinks that ADToE was a feeling of revitalization in the DT camp.

No, not at all.  That is the general consensus.