THE WALKING DEAD - Season 6 - Full Discussion

[Fluffy Lothario]

OK I rewatched the whole scene a few more times...

Glenn and Nicholas get backed up to the fence by the oncoming horde.
They try shooting some of the walkers but THEY BOTH RUN OUT OF BULLETS. You can clearly hear both guns clicking because they're both EMPTY. So they both switch to knives, yadda yadda yadda, Glenn "dies" end scene.

How could Nicholas shoot himself without a bullet to do so?

This didn't occur to me. Honestly, if Nicholas had run out of bullets, which was the case from memory, that is a FAR bigger problem with that scene than Glenn potentially living.

But let's all go on speculating and getting butthurt about that instead.

[Chino]

So. If Glenn did make it out alive, is he going to survive the season? Imagine if they got him out of that situation only to have the now armed Wolf randomly pick him off out of no where a few episodes down the line? No warning whatsoever. Just like...

[kaos2900]

A hallucination would be even worse. That show is better than going to a day time soap opera trick. There is no way he should survive. I won't quit watching but my opinion on the over all quality of the show will drop unless they have valid explanation.

[BlackInk]

I hear people complaining that it wasn't "worthy" death for a character as big as Glenn (I'm going to assume that he's dead until proven wrong because I want to like the episode), but honestly, the brutality and seemingly meaningless death he had is what I loved about it. People don't always die in some grand gesture or while saving a baby or something. In this world, sometimes shit just doesn't go your way and unfortunately you just die. That's how it should be sometimes and I thought that was perfect here.

[Chino]

I hear people complaining that it wasn't "worthy" death for a character as big as Glenn (I'm going to assume that he's dead until proven wrong because I want to like the episode), but honestly, the brutality and seemingly meaningless death he had is what I loved about it. People don't always die in some grand gesture or while saving a baby or something. In this world, sometimes shit just doesn't go your way and unfortunately you just die. That's how it should be sometimes and I thought that was perfect here.

That's exactly how I felt when watching it. I actually liked the fact that Maggie would likely never see his body. I liked that no one got to give him one last look before he died, even if it was agony (Glenn and Noah in the revolving door (fuck you Nicolas)). I liked that he's been part of this group for so long, helped so many people and just died in isolation. I liked that he failed while trying to be hero. I like that it was brutal and not something noble like taking a bullet for Maggie. I'm hoping that leaving the viewers up in the air and not being 100% sure he's dead is just a move to make us feel like the other characters. No one knows where he ended up. The group doesn't have the slightest clue as to whether he's alive or dead, and that's how we all feel.

[TioJorge]

I couldn't agree more, Ink. That's what I love about the comics. Except the way in which Glenn acted in the episode and subsequently caused his death completely retconned his character entirely. In my eyes, at least. The Glenn in that episode sure as shit isn't the one that has lead team after team, treacherous run after run through near death situations and very similar ones to this one at that. It's not the actual death I have a problem with, it's the way that the character was handled. (Hell, I didn't have a problem with how Tyrese died and that was very much an 'everyday death'; it does happen, but the death itself did not negate the character the way that Glenn's death did, to make my point clearer) Either way, it's going to go however the writer's want, that's just how I see it. It's just funny that said aspect is a particular love of mine for the series (both comic and TV, but more in line with the comics given the show's recent bout of character safety); but when it defies what they've built up in a character for the entire series...it kind of loses its meaning to me.

If Glenn had taken every course of action possible and was truly boxed in, fucked, no way out (and I'm not talking about the moment they're on the dumpster...course at that point they are but until then there were multiple missed opportunities; gleaming ones), I'd be singing a very different tune. But for as many times as I've watched the scene by now...that's very clearly not the case. It's amateur hour, which Glenn was not. Hence my issue...not the actual death itself, which was (would be? is?) glorious. I'm with you on the believing he's dead until the actual show proves otherwise though; and like I said, in a really odd way I hope he is dead if only for the fact that I really hate being played in that way. But there's the rub, no matter what happens, that writing was just not in his character.

That said, I've got no right to say who the character is, I didn't create him; but from a viewer's eyes, I don't see the man that died as the man who we've been shown throughout the series. Perhaps my view is skewed though. I just find it hard to believe that he'd rely so damn much on Nick when...time and time again, throughout this whole damn series, he's been in unfamiliar locations every time, situations that have seemingly no way out...and he makes it out, on his own and/or with the help of someone who actually knows his ass from a hole in the ground...not someone that, throughout half the episode was screaming his name and trying to get him to focus instead of pissing himself. Therein lies my issue...it doesn't make sense to the character. Nine times out of ten in the past, people relied on Glenn to find a way out; he's always been the one to save people and get them out alive.

[Chino]

Did we see Glenn in episode 1 show up to the house covered in blood in one of the other time lines?

[TioJorge]

I'm not exactly sure what you mean but not that I can recall.

[Metro]

Did we see Glenn in episode 1 show up to the house covered in blood in one of the other time lines?

In a black and white flashback in episode 1 he and Nicholas show up at the infirmary covered in blood from their encounter in the woods back in the S5 finale.

[Chino]

Did we see Glenn in episode 1 show up to the house covered in blood in one of the other time lines?

In a black and white flashback in episode 1 he and Nicholas show up at the infirmary covered in blood from their encounter in the woods back in the S5 finale.

Ohhhh okay. That's what I thought. My aunt just texted me saying she noticed that and I had no idea what she was talking about.

[Zantera]

Regardless if Glenn makes it out alive or not, his "death" was so obvious that I guessed it 5 minutes into the episode. TWD has really clumsy writing when it comes to foreshadowing. You could tell something was gonna happen when Glenn was so much in focus and he kept saying cliched lines like "I need to get home to my wife".

[BlackInk]

Indeed. When it comes to setting up deaths, this show is pretty amateurish, unnatural, and not at all subtle in its writing.

[Metro]

The writers want us to believe that he's dead so they threw in all the clichés of a main character death. There was even a callback to Glenn's first line in the series.
He's gonna live, but I think this is a red herring and he will die for real before the end of this season.

[Zantera]

The writers want us to believe that he's dead so they threw in all the clichés of a main character death. There was even a callback to Glenn's first line in the series.
He's gonna live, but I think this is a red herring and he will die for real before the end of this season.

I don't think it's a bad guess. I think they are waiting for a certain characters from the comics to make his appearance and I think he will be the one who ends Glenn's life, IF he is indeed alive.

[Chino]

He's facing Glenn


Blood comes from the completely wrong direction


Fuck up or intentional?

[kaos2900]

Maybe there was a strong breeze. I've never seen the blood spray pattern of someone shooting themselves in the head on purpose so I'm guessing it was just the effect used.

[Chino]

Does Glenn still have the flare gun? Any chance he can somehow use that as a last minute distraction?


Also, I saw some comments earlier on the fire escape/staircase they ran past before jumping on the dumpster. There was all kinds of shit (one thing being a mattress) stacked up at the base. It looked inaccessible. Could that be a possible intentional barricade? The people who attacked Rick, were they wolves? I didn't notice any Ws on their heads. Could their people possibly be held up where Glenn went down?

[Metro]

Watch the side of Nicholas's head when he and Glenn fall.
Call me crazy, but I don't see an exit wound.

[BlackInk]

He's facing Glenn
*stuff*

Blood comes from the completely wrong direction
*more stuff*

Fuck up or intentional?

My first thought was that it was an intentional thing to create the visual of Glenn with half his face covered in blood, which is admittedly a striking visual. But yeah, maybe they could have found a way to make that "flaw" less obvious, because I immediately thought of it when I saw it.

[Chino]

Interesting. I don't either. Glenn's face is still covered in blood though.

[Metro]

Does Glenn still have the flare gun? Any chance he can somehow use that as a last minute distraction?

He fired one back in episode 1. Who knows if they have more.

Glenn is also carrying a bag/satchel/man purse at first as they're fighting off the walkers at the fence, but once they climb onto the trash can, it's gone.

[gmillerdrake]

Does Glenn still have the flare gun? Any chance he can somehow use that as a last minute distraction?

He fired one back in episode 1. Who knows if they have more.

Glenn is also carrying a bag/satchel/man purse at first as they're fighting off the walkers at the fence, but once they climb onto the trash can, it's gone.

He had the flare gun in the scenes when he and Nicholas were running in the streets....it was in his hand when they stopped at the already burnt down grain mill.

[Chino]

Does Glenn still have the flare gun? Any chance he can somehow use that as a last minute distraction?

He fired one back in episode 1. Who knows if they have more.

Glenn is also carrying a bag/satchel/man purse at first as they're fighting off the walkers at the fence, but once they climb onto the trash can, it's gone.

He had the flare gun in the scenes when he and Nicholas were running in the streets....it was in his hand when they stopped at the already burnt down grain mill.

Exactly. He was going to use that to start a fire. If he could get a shot off, starting a nearby fire, the walkers might get distracted long enough to let him escape.

[Chino]

I also read something that the "asshole" comment Glenn made toward Rick was near identical to the "asshole" comment Rick made to Glenn in season one. They got out of that situation by covering themselves in zombie guts. Possible nugget/link?

Speaking of zombie guts, it really bothers me how infrequently they use it as camouflage. I'd have a bucket on standby at all times. Why they don't have an army of jawless and armless walkers is beyond me. 

[gmillerdrake]

What continually bugs me about shows that use firearms is that they typically fail to show them operated correctly.....Nicholas had been firing that gun.....and the trigger is de-cocked when he's holding it to his head. I can't see a brand name but the make and style of the gun heavily suggests it's a single action weapon.....so, Nicholas in an effort to be safe de-cocked the gun while he was running. Then, I assume off  camera he pulled the hammer back prior to shooting himself.

[gmillerdrake]

Speaking of zombie guts, it really bothers me how infrequently they use it as camouflage. I'd have a bucket on standby at all times. Why they don't have an army of jawless and armless walkers is beyond me.

I do that quite a bit also....sit and think of the countless things they (or I would be) should be doing that could help. I guess it's a no win situation for the writers....but you'd think those two examples you gave....being tried, true and tested.....would be things they'd implement.

[Chino]

What continually bugs me about shows that use firearms is that they typically fail to show them operated correctly.....Nicholas had been firing that gun.....and the trigger is de-cocked when he's holding it to his head. I can't see a brand name but the make and style of the gun heavily suggests it's a single action weapon.....so, Nicholas in an effort to be safe de-cocked the gun while he was running. Then, I assume off  camera he pulled the hammer back prior to shooting himself.

I remember a similar scene with the governor. I forgot her name, but he shot that little girl in the head, the one that got bit by the walker hiding under the sign in the mud. That kill was so lame looking. There was no recoil on the gun when he fired it and he fired it so close to his head, he'd probably never hear out of his right ear again. I know it's something not really bitch worthy, but I feel like it's one of the easiest things to get right.

[Metro]

I also read something that the "asshole" comment Glenn made toward Rick was near identical to the "asshole" comment Rick made to Glenn in season one. They got out of that situation by covering themselves in zombie guts. Possible nugget/link?

Not exactly. When Rick is stuck in the tank in S1E1, Glenn uses a radio to talk to Rick and asks him something like "Hey dumbass. You cozy in there?"
In this episode Glenn says "Good luck, dumbass." over the walkie-talke as he's explaining the plan to Rick.

[Metro]

What continually bugs me about shows that use firearms is that they typically fail to show them operated correctly.....Nicholas had been firing that gun.....and the trigger is de-cocked when he's holding it to his head. I can't see a brand name but the make and style of the gun heavily suggests it's a single action weapon.....so, Nicholas in an effort to be safe de-cocked the gun while he was running. Then, I assume off  camera he pulled the hammer back prior to shooting himself.

I remember a similar scene with the governor. I forgot her name, but he shot that little girl in the head, the one that got bit by the walker hiding under the sign in the mud. That kill was so lame looking. There was no recoil on the gun when he fired it and he fired it so close to his head, he'd probably never hear out of his right ear again. I know it's something not really bitch worthy, but I feel like it's one of the easiest things to get right.

Well.. they did just fire off a tank moments before. His hearing probably already shot

[gmillerdrake]

I'd like to see a half hour or so from the upcoming 90 minute episode on sunday clear this whole 'Glenn' deal up.....rather than have to wait another two or three weeks or however long it is until it's known for certain what happened.

but I can guarantee you one thing.....it accomplished exactly what they wanted because I'd bet we ain't be the only folk talking about this non stop.

[Chino]

Speaking of zombie guts, it really bothers me how infrequently they use it as camouflage. I'd have a bucket on standby at all times. Why they don't have an army of jawless and armless walkers is beyond me.

I do that quite a bit also....sit and think of the countless things they (or I would be) should be doing that could help. I guess it's a no win situation for the writers....but you'd think those two examples you gave....being tried, true and tested.....would be things they'd implement.

I'm not suggesting have a cast that is covered in zombie 100% of the time, but I feel like, at least by now, applying zombie gut camo would be just as standard of a procedure as not forgetting your weapon when going on a run.

[gmillerdrake]

What continually bugs me about shows that use firearms is that they typically fail to show them operated correctly.....Nicholas had been firing that gun.....and the trigger is de-cocked when he's holding it to his head. I can't see a brand name but the make and style of the gun heavily suggests it's a single action weapon.....so, Nicholas in an effort to be safe de-cocked the gun while he was running. Then, I assume off  camera he pulled the hammer back prior to shooting himself.

I remember a similar scene with the governor. I forgot her name, but he shot that little girl in the head, the one that got bit by the walker hiding under the sign in the mud. That kill was so lame looking. There was no recoil on the gun when he fired it and he fired it so close to his head, he'd probably never hear out of his right ear again. I know it's something not really bitch worthy, but I feel like it's one of the easiest things to get right.

Exactly. They are tiny details that really don't mean anything.....BUT.....if they are done correctly it just adds (for me) that much more to the narrative. Like, I bet you can only count on one hand the number of times they've shown Daryl re-loading that cross bow. That's a tough thing to do....and fast at that. But he's firing those arrows left and right like he's Robin Friggin' Hood. Not a big deal, but SHOW me his technique reloading that thing in the heat of the moment.

[Chino]

I'd like to see a half hour or so from the upcoming 90 minute episode on sunday clear this whole 'Glenn' deal up.....rather than have to wait another two or three weeks or however long it is until it's known for certain what happened.

but I can guarantee you one thing.....it accomplished exactly what they wanted because I'd bet we ain't be the only folk talking about this non stop.

That's the part that pisses me off the most. This was done for the publicity rather than the story. It's so fabricated. Everything leading up to the episode and then the episode itself. Glenn has been radio silent on social media since, and Gimple released the most vague statement possible. The Walking Dead is arguably one of the most successful shows in television history. The writers didn't need a stunt like this to keep people engaged.

[Mr. Ister]

I was annoyed at the lack of recoil when Rick shot the 2nd wolf in the RV

[gmillerdrake]

Speaking of zombie guts, it really bothers me how infrequently they use it as camouflage. I'd have a bucket on standby at all times. Why they don't have an army of jawless and armless walkers is beyond me.

I do that quite a bit also....sit and think of the countless things they (or I would be) should be doing that could help. I guess it's a no win situation for the writers....but you'd think those two examples you gave....being tried, true and tested.....would be things they'd implement.

I'm not suggesting have a cast that is covered in zombie 100% of the time, but I feel like, at least by now, applying zombie gut camo would be just as standard of a procedure as not forgetting your weapon when going on a run.

Or at the minimum have a 'kit' of some sort that when in a pinch you could apply and evade? Who knows....it's just fun to think about sometimes.