Dream Theater entered the studio in February v. No News is Good News

[ariich]

I find it really funny that people have been complaining for years that they want DT to get out of the routine of all going in the studio for a short burst where they do all the writing and recording and then buggering off. Now that it's all more sporadic and scattered, people are complaining about that instead.

WILL YOU NEVER BE OPEN AGAIN HAPPY?

[rumborak]

My theory is that *this* is the routine, and that previous albums' other member's contributions were somewhat overstated for the sake of pleasing the fans.

[BlobVanDam]

I find it really funny that people have been complaining for years that they want DT to get out of the routine of all going in the studio for a short burst where they do all the writing and recording and then buggering off. Now that it's all more sporadic and scattered, people are complaining about that instead.

WILL YOU NEVER BE OPEN AGAIN HAPPY?

Neither of those approaches are particularly good. I think people would just like to see the full band writing together and give the songs more time to develop.

[Skeever]

I think typically, JP writes most DT songs himself, and then brings the others in to fill out and expand on his parts. We'll never have confirmation of this, because JP is the type of humble guy who's not going to come out and "that was ALL ME" like MP would have. Ultimately, though, I think JP is being generous by letting the music of the songs be credited to "Dream Theater". I think it's probably 70% JP, 15% JR 6% JM, 5% MM, and maybe 4% JLB.

[erwinrafael]

I find it really funny that people have been complaining for years that they want DT to get out of the routine of all going in the studio for a short burst where they do all the writing and recording and then buggering off. Now that it's all more sporadic and scattered, people are complaining about that instead.

WILL YOU NEVER BE OPEN AGAIN HAPPY?

Neither of those approaches are particularly good. I think people would just like to see the full band writing together and give the songs more time to develop.

If those approaches are not good, why were they able to produce good songs?

[BlobVanDam]

I find it really funny that people have been complaining for years that they want DT to get out of the routine of all going in the studio for a short burst where they do all the writing and recording and then buggering off. Now that it's all more sporadic and scattered, people are complaining about that instead.

WILL YOU NEVER BE OPEN AGAIN HAPPY?

Neither of those approaches are particularly good. I think people would just like to see the full band writing together and give the songs more time to develop.

If those approaches are not good, why were they able to produce good songs?

Just because the approach isn't ideal, doesn't mean it can't produce some good music, after all they're pros. But for me the hit rate has been dropping off on recent albums, and it could benefit from that change in approach.

[Prog Snob]

We really don't know the thought process behind everything.  This is all just speculation. We don't know what was decided ahead of time, if James and MM are sending ideas to the rest of the guys via email or downloads, or if even MM and JLB wanted to be there if they weren't needed at that moment in time. It's a lot of time away from their families if their presence isn't truly needed.  I'm sure if James had some lyrical or melody ideas he wanted to be considered, he sent them over to the guys. When it's time to record, they'll work out any kinks and what not.

[erwinrafael]

I find it really funny that people have been complaining for years that they want DT to get out of the routine of all going in the studio for a short burst where they do all the writing and recording and then buggering off. Now that it's all more sporadic and scattered, people are complaining about that instead.

WILL YOU NEVER BE OPEN AGAIN HAPPY?

Neither of those approaches are particularly good. I think people would just like to see the full band writing together and give the songs more time to develop.

If those approaches are not good, why were they able to produce good songs?

Just because the approach isn't ideal, doesn't mean it can't produce some good music, after all they're pros. But for me the hit rate has been dropping off on recent albums, and it could benefit from that change in approach.

Who is the authority to judge what is an ideal approach to creating music? What works for you doe not necessarily works for them. Just like the hit rate dropping off for you could very well be DT getting a second wind for a lot of others, a lot of which are not vocal posters.

From my personal experience, the last thing I would want is somebody lecturing me on what an ideal approach to doing things is when it is obviously working for me.

[ariich]

Yeah I don't understand why any approach would be inherently better or worse than another. Blob (and a number of others) may well find that they're less keen on the more recent output, but I see no evidence or even indications that this would have anything to do with the sorts of things we're talking about.

[BlobVanDam]

I find it really funny that people have been complaining for years that they want DT to get out of the routine of all going in the studio for a short burst where they do all the writing and recording and then buggering off. Now that it's all more sporadic and scattered, people are complaining about that instead.

WILL YOU NEVER BE OPEN AGAIN HAPPY?

Neither of those approaches are particularly good. I think people would just like to see the full band writing together and give the songs more time to develop.

If those approaches are not good, why were they able to produce good songs?

Just because the approach isn't ideal, doesn't mean it can't produce some good music, after all they're pros. But for me the hit rate has been dropping off on recent albums, and it could benefit from that change in approach.

Who is the authority to judge what is an ideal approach to creating music? What works for you doe not necessarily works for them. Just like the hit rate dropping off for you could very well be DT getting a second wind for a lot of others, a lot of which are not vocal posters.

From my personal experience, the last thing I would want is somebody lecturing me on what an ideal approach to doing things is when it is obviously working for me.

Calm down, it's called an opinion.
Obviously their current approach works for their schedule, but I don't feel it's the best approach to create the best music they're capable of as a band, and the last couple of albums support my own opinion. Don't care if you agree with it or not.

[hefdaddy42]

The only thing we know about what they've been doing in the studio is that we don't know anything. 

Everything else is speculation.

We know that MM hasn't been there due to snow.  We know that JLB just got there.  That's all we know.

Once it was apparent that they wouldn't be there, maybe everything else was put on hold.  Maybe the other three guys wrote some stuff.  Who knows?  Well, the 5 members of DT know, but no one else knows shit.

Either way, the only ones they need to satisfy in whatever writing/recording strategy they settle on is themselves.

[rumborak]

I always find these "we can not infer anything unless we have a notarized document by DT" notions weird.
JP, JR and MP had been the core writers since SFAM essentially. With MP gone, that left JP and JR. And while they said publicly that the other guys were more involved in the process, evidence for that is spurious at best. JM wrote some lyrics, but James' or MM's influence is not really evident.
I think the basic assumption should be that things were kept as they always had been. JP and JR write the basic songs, and once they got the songs in decent enough shape, they bring in JLB and MM to integrate them.

[Prog Snob]

I always find these "we can not infer anything unless we have a notarized document by DT" notions weird.
JP, JR and MP had been the core writers since SFAM essentially. With MP gone, that left JP and JR. And while they said publicly that the other guys were more involved in the process, evidence for that is spurious at best. JM wrote some lyrics, but James' or MM's influence is not really evident.
I think the basic assumption should be that things were kept as they always had been. JP and JR write the basic songs, and once they got the songs in decent enough shape, they bring in JLB and MM to integrate them.

And I happen to think that idea works very well. 

[rumborak]

I think it has served them well for a long time. But I think a lot of fans have that "been there done that" feeling. For me personally it's frustrating to watch a band of such talented guys box themselves in like that.

[Prog Snob]

I think it has served them well for a long time. But I think a lot of fans have that "been there done that" feeling. For me personally it's frustrating to watch a band of such talented guys box themselves in like that.

well let's take a look at their most revered releases and see how they recorded them.  We can look at I&W, Awake,  Metropolis 2, and Six Degrees.

[rumborak]

I think repeating something they've done before is exactly the opposite to what people would like to see

[erwinrafael]

Calm down, it's called an opinion.
Obviously their current approach works for their schedule, but I don't feel it's the best approach to create the best music they're capable of as a band, and the last couple of albums support my own opinion. Don't care if you agree with it or not.

The opinion card again. Just like the so many times that somebody pushes very authoritative strong claims phrased as if a truth proposition like the ideal approach, MM has no groove, MM lacks commitment, HDtracks is a sham, etc. and when somebody actually attempts to engage, the defense becomes it is just an opinion.

[Prog Snob]

I think repeating something they've done before is exactly the opposite to what people would like to see

That could be true.  Though I am also honing in on what worked for them the best.   Who would complain about them taking the same measures they did when recording Metropolis 2 or Images and Words?   

[BlobVanDam]

Calm down, it's called an opinion.
Obviously their current approach works for their schedule, but I don't feel it's the best approach to create the best music they're capable of as a band, and the last couple of albums support my own opinion. Don't care if you agree with it or not.

The opinion card again. Just like the so many times that somebody pushes very authoritative strong claims phrased as if a truth proposition like the ideal approach, MM has no groove, MM lacks commitment, HDtracks is a sham, etc. and when somebody actually attempts to engage, the defense becomes it is just an opinion.

Nobody is making authoritative claims. I only pointed out that it's an opinion since some people don't seem to recognize one without a big bold disclaimer that says "IN MY OPINION", regardless of how clear it is that it's an opinion. Counters to these opinions are also just opinions. Now let's move along.....

[Prog Snob]

[erwinrafael]

I think repeating something they've done before is exactly the opposite to what people would like to see

Who are these people? Are they many? Do a substantial amount of DT fans actually even care what they do in the studio?

I mean, the DTF album ranking thread seems to show that many people hate DT12, but if you look at the DT 12 poll, the above average votes  significantly outnumber the below average. This has been an observation for a while, that vocal posts are full of negativity about the last record but silent polls tell a different story.

[BlobVanDam]

I think repeating something they've done before is exactly the opposite to what people would like to see

Who are these people? Are they many? Do a substantial amount of DT fans actually even care what they do in the studio?

I mean, the DTF album ranking thread seems to show that many people hate DT12, but if you look at the DT 12 poll, the above average votes  significantly outnumber the below average. This has been an observation for a while, that vocal posts are full of negativity about the last record but silent polls tell a different story.

There is a huge amount of vocal praise for the latest album. The ranking thread is just a ranking thread, it's not some vocal minority speaking against DT12, it's any person on the forum giving an overall ranking of albums, that happens to include data about DT12, among other albums. Nothing is stopping anyone from posting their own list and showing their love for DT12.

In the DT12 poll, 58% of people voted it average or below, which given the relative strength of DT's albums, is consistent with many people ranking it lower. Ranking an album low doesn't mean people don't still enjoy it a lot, it just means they enjoy other albums more. It does not mean they hate it, or that there's an inconsistency between the two different sets of data.

[hefdaddy42]

I always find these "we can not infer anything unless we have a notarized document by DT" notions weird.

Of course you do.  You prefer speculating rather than just accepting that we don't really know.

Even if it turns out later that you were right, you still don't know now.  It won't mean then that you knew all along.

That's all I'm saying.  I don't care how they do it.

[BlackInk]

I always felt a bit "sad" when I found out that a band I liked has one member who contributes almost all of the material, like Opeth or Porcupine Tree or TesseracT. I think it gave me a sense that it's not a real band but just a group playing one of the guys' songs, but after learning that that is the case with most bands, I have abandoned that way of thinking. In the end, these are all bands whose music I thoroughly enjoy, so it doesn't really matter how it's written, or by whom.

But I still enjoy hearing about bands who write together, knowing from personal experience how fun it can be.

[TAC]

Just chiming in to say that MM IS involved and has been going back and forth quite a bit.
The album is well under way.

[Plasmastrike]

I always find these "we can not infer anything unless we have a notarized document by DT" notions weird.

Of course you do.  You prefer speculating rather than just accepting that we don't really know.

Even if it turns out later that you were right, you still don't know now.  It won't mean then that you knew all along.

That's all I'm saying.  I don't care how they do it.

I feel like that's an unnecessarily black and white way to look at it, but I see what you're saying mate

[lithium112]

Just chiming in to say that MM IS involved and has been going back and forth quite a bit.
The album is well under way.

Awesome! 

Btw, out of curiosity (and probably most people are aware already?) but how do you know this and what's your relationship to the band, if you can say?

[ReaPsTA]

I love DT12 and ADTOE.  Unlike when Portnoy was in the band, not a lot was released about how those albums were made, fueling speculation and controversy.  And I think DT's music's gotten a lot better since he left.

So basically, the more DT fans speculate and argue about the process, the better the music is?  If so, this album should be a classic.

I find it really funny that people have been complaining for years that they want DT to get out of the routine of all going in the studio for a short burst where they do all the writing and recording and then buggering off. Now that it's all more sporadic and scattered, people are complaining about that instead.

WILL YOU NEVER BE OPEN AGAIN HAPPY?

Shout outs to this post.

[rumborak]

Just chiming in to say that MM IS involved and has been going back and forth quite a bit.
The album is well under way.

Awesome! 

Btw, out of curiosity (and probably most people are aware already?) but how do you know this and what's your relationship to the band, if you can say?

I would like to hear that as well. Especially since it goes against what MM posts on FB.

[Crow]

Plot twist: TAC was John Petrucci all along! 

[mike099]

The only thing we know about what they've been doing in the studio is that we don't know anything. 

Everything else is speculation.

We know that MM hasn't been there due to snow.  We know that JLB just got there.  That's all we know.

Once it was apparent that they wouldn't be there, maybe everything else was put on hold.  Maybe the other three guys wrote some stuff.  Who knows?  Well, the 5 members of DT know, but no one else knows shit.

Either way, the only ones they need to satisfy in whatever writing/recording strategy they settle on is themselves.

We do know that JM has been there all along and has spent all of the coffee budget waiting and has now finished his solo album with no lyrics -  of course.

On a more serious note:  For DT is the music written first and then lyrics and who decides which songs go to which guy for the lyrics?

[Shadow Ninja 2.0]

the album is being written entirely by mike portnoy

[rumborak]

[JayOctavarium]

from Indonesia

[Crow]

Charlie Dominici is playing bass and Kevin Moore is playing lead guitar on DT13

clearly