Metallica Thread

[nobloodyname]

I just finished listening to Death Magnetic. I don't know what happened between St. Anger and this one, but I think this album is pretty good. Definitely a step up from the last three, that's for sure. I don't mind at all when a band tries new things, but this album feels like they went back to making stuff like their first four albums, and I think the album benefits a lot from it. While there weren't any standout tracks I can think of, they were all good. It was quite refreshing after the relatively lower quality of the past three albums. Also, apparently this album is infamous for having bad production/compression, but it sounded just fine to me. I have mentioned before that I don't usually notice album production, though, so maybe that's just me.

The problem is actually the mastering. The original was brickwalled to absolute fuck. And then a bit more on top of that. If you listened to the original release, I would contend there is no way you couldn't have heard it. The easiest way to describe it is like a white noise on top of the music. It's possible you listened to the quietly released 'mastered for iTunes' version (which I've personally never heard) or the version taken from the Guitar Hero 3 stems. The latter was certainly much better.

As another reference point, try Baroness by Purple (the original Vapor Trails by Rush, of all bands, is also cited in this way but I think Purple is even worse). If you can't hear the brickwalling there, make an appointment with an audiologist

[Revenge319]

I just finished listening to Death Magnetic. I don't know what happened between St. Anger and this one, but I think this album is pretty good. Definitely a step up from the last three, that's for sure. I don't mind at all when a band tries new things, but this album feels like they went back to making stuff like their first four albums, and I think the album benefits a lot from it. While there weren't any standout tracks I can think of, they were all good. It was quite refreshing after the relatively lower quality of the past three albums. Also, apparently this album is infamous for having bad production/compression, but it sounded just fine to me. I have mentioned before that I don't usually notice album production, though, so maybe that's just me.

The problem is actually the mastering. The original was brickwalled to absolute fuck. And then a bit more on top of that. If you listened to the original release, I would contend there is no way you couldn't have heard it. The easiest way to describe it is like a white noise on top of the music. It's possible you listened to the quietly released 'mastered for iTunes' version (which I've personally never heard) or the version taken from the Guitar Hero 3 stems. The latter was certainly much better.

As another reference point, try Baroness by Purple (the original Vapor Trails by Rush, of all bands, is also cited in this way but I think Purple is even worse). If you can't hear the brickwalling there, make an appointment with an audiologist

I went and listened to a side-by-side comparison of the original and a remaster, and while I did notice the white noise-sounding stuff in the original, it didn't really feel that noticeable to me. That said, that kind of noise is certainly something I wouldn't want to hear in music, so I can totally understand why people would have a big problem with it.

[ZirconBlue]

It's an impossible thing to actually measure, but I'd be curious if "ReLoad"  was released with a whole new marketing scheme - instead of following the artwork and vibe of "Load" - if there would be a different (better?) reaction.   I kind of think back that so many bands released records that could have been "re-" versions, but they didn't, and they're viewed today as stand alone records and we treat them as such.

Reload was where I got off the Metallica bus.  I was fine with Load being a new, experimental direction, but when Reload, the new tracks on Garage Inc., and "I Disappear" all sounded similar to Load, it changed my perspective from "something different they tried" to "I guess this is what Metallica is now".   I checked out St. Anger as I heard it was a new direction, but didn't care for it.  I haven't even bothered with anything since.

[425]

I mean, Reload is pretty clear about the fact that it comes from the same songwriting session as Load, even from the title alone, so I wouldn't have expected it to be that different, and wouldn't have concluded that "this is what Metallica is now" since it's literally still just one session.

Virtually everything since St. Anger has been an attempt to recreate the songwriting approach and basic musical direction of their 80s output, so if that's what you like from Metallica, that material would probably interest you more than the 1996-2003 output.

[Kotowboy]

I just finished listening to Death Magnetic. I don't know what happened between St. Anger and this one, but I think this album is pretty good. Definitely a step up from the last three, that's for sure. I don't mind at all when a band tries new things, but this album feels like they went back to making stuff like their first four albums, and I think the album benefits a lot from it. While there weren't any standout tracks I can think of, they were all good. It was quite refreshing after the relatively lower quality of the past three albums. Also, apparently this album is infamous for having bad production/compression, but it sounded just fine to me. I have mentioned before that I don't usually notice album production, though, so maybe that's just me.

If you listened to it online - they've cleaned it up since 2008 and put a better mix online. If you listened to the original CD it still sounds fuzzy and brittle.



Also I feel that Reload gets all the hate as it was the 2nd of the two.

Reload is overall faster and heavier than Load and if it came first I think it would be more loved.

As it came second it "must be all the leftovers LOL"...

It's my opinion that Load has weaker duds than Reload like Cure, Ronnie, Poor Twisted Me. Load mostly has a crappy second half apart from Wasting My Hate, Mama Said and Outlaw.

Reload doesn't really have a weaker second half.

And yes - if you took the 7 best songs from each album - you'd have one that would have matched 'The Black Album'.

[MirrorMask]

Something like this?

Fuel   
The Memory Remains
The House Jack Built   
The Unforgiven II   
Ain't My Bitch
Bleeding Me
Devil's Dance
Until It Sleeps   
King Nothing   
The Outlaw Torn
Where the Wild Things Are   
Hero of the Day
Low Man's Lyric   
Fixxxer


The problem with these albums is that the best songs are either epics or slowish songs, so you'd get an unbalanced album, to make it more coherent you'd have to drop one of the long songs, an album like this is heavy to digest, but surely has its charm.

[Zydar]

It's an impossible thing to actually measure, but I'd be curious if "ReLoad"  was released with a whole new marketing scheme - instead of following the artwork and vibe of "Load" - if there would be a different (better?) reaction.   I kind of think back that so many bands released records that could have been "re-" versions, but they didn't, and they're viewed today as stand alone records and we treat them as such.

Reload was where I got off the Metallica bus.  I was fine with Load being a new, experimental direction, but when Reload, the new tracks on Garage Inc., and "I Disappear" all sounded similar to Load, it changed my perspective from "something different they tried" to "I guess this is what Metallica is now".   I checked out St. Anger as I heard it was a new direction, but didn't care for it.  I haven't even bothered with anything since.

Give Death Magnetic and Hardwired each a shot, I'm sure you'll find something there to your liking.

[DTA]

Something like this?

Fuel   
The Memory Remains
The House Jack Built   
The Unforgiven II   
Ain't My Bitch
Bleeding Me
Devil's Dance
Until It Sleeps   
King Nothing   
The Outlaw Torn
Where the Wild Things Are   
Hero of the Day
Low Man's Lyric   
Fixxxer


The problem with these albums is that the best songs are either epics or slowish songs, so you'd get an unbalanced album, to make it more coherent you'd have to drop one of the long songs, an album like this is heavy to digest, but surely has its charm.

This is a great track list, but everyone sleeps on 2x4 and Prince Charming. The main riff of 2x4 is one of their ballsiest and wouldn't sound out of place on a Pantera album (in fact, someone already did this mash-up - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EnOdymeOE8w). And Prince Charming is so damn catchy with a really cool bridge. Someone pointed out the similarity to Creeping Death and it does seem to use the Creeping Death song structure as a blueprint similar to Enter Sandman/King Nothing but less obvious.

[Mladen]

If I had to combine Load and Reload into a single album, there is no way I would exclude Prince charming. That is a really good song.

[KevShmev]

Something like this?

Fuel   
The Memory Remains
The House Jack Built   
The Unforgiven II   
Ain't My Bitch
Bleeding Me
Devil's Dance
Until It Sleeps   
King Nothing   
The Outlaw Torn
Where the Wild Things Are   
Hero of the Day
Low Man's Lyric   
Fixxxer


The problem with these albums is that the best songs are either epics or slowish songs, so you'd get an unbalanced album, to make it more coherent you'd have to drop one of the long songs, an album like this is heavy to digest, but surely has its charm.

Eh, ...And Justice for All is loaded with longer songs, many of which are way too long, so it's not like that would be a first for Metallica.

If we are combo-ing Load and ReLod into one album, Bleeding Me, The Outlaw Torn and Fixxxxxxer are all must-haves, IMO.  On the other hand, Fuel and The Memory Remains can both be dumped in the garbage can that Lars used as his snare on St. Anger.

[Revenge319]

I finished listening to Hardwired... to Self-Destruct just now. It was alright, but I've heard better from Metallica. I think my only real issue with the album is that it felt like there wasn't much variety. A lot of the songs kind of sounded the same. There were some good highlights, like "Dream No More" and "Spit Out the Bone", but I've heard more exciting and interesting stuff from past albums. Maybe it'll grow on me more as I give it more listens, but right now my impression is that it's good, but not great.

Well, with that I've completed this marathon of sorts of Metallica's 10 studio albums. I'll get around to S&M and Garage Inc. at some point, but as far as the main studio albums go, I've heard 'em all at least once. Overall, I'm really glad I decided to do this. A lot of the music was really good, and I'm even glad I heard the albums I ended up not caring for all that much. It was just a good experience overall, and I'll definitely be spinning at least most of these again and again (I don't know how much I'll be willing to go back to Reload, but I digress). I wish I could've done this a lot sooner, but hey, better late than never. Maybe one of these days I'll have to do another one of these first-time marathons for bands that I've always wondered about but never heard before because I felt pressured to not listen to them (probably for The Beatles, specifically). Since I like ranking stuff, I'll do a first-impression album ranking for Metallica. (Well, I've heard a couple of their albums multiple times already, but you get the idea.)

1. Master of Puppets
2. ...And Justice For All
3. Ride the Lightning
4. The Black Album
5. Kill 'Em All
6. Death Magnetic
7. Hardwired... to Self-Destruct
8. Load
9. St. Anger
10. Reload

[Kotowboy]

Everyone piles on the St Anger snare sound - but i've heard way way worse from like hip hop / rnb / metal drummers and they don't get a single mention.

I actually think the Snare sound on St Anger adds to the overall vibe. It's just that it's not gated. It's meant to sound raw and in your face.

Danny Carey has his snare turned off a lot - the intro to Ticks and Leeches being a good example. But because the snare is gated - you don't get that boing & ring to it.

Whatever. The lol trash can argument will never stop. Nor will Lol napster. Even though they were right at the time. And everyone thinks it was about money -

- when in fact it was about people releasing un-finished Metallica songs without their knowledge.

My Top 3 are probably Master - Black / HTSD - Ride. I really don't care for AJFA at all. But although I do enjoy it - SA is easily last.

[soupytwist]

Worst song on Load/Reload?

I'm going for Bad Seed.

[MirrorMask]

Worst song on Load/Reload?

I'm going for Bad Seed.

It's hard to pick, but I tend to agree. It's not only a bad song, it's even irritating and annoying.

Also Cure is in competition for this one, same annoying style.

Poor Twisted Me is "just" a throaway song, it just drags and it's kinda useless but it doesn't actually annoy you like Cure or Bad Seed.

[Kotowboy]

Bad Seed has a good groove. PTM and Ronnie are both just meh.

All the worst songs are on Load though. Not Reload.

Reloads worst song - Slither is still better than PTM.

[Mladen]

I think I'm going with Cure. However, I dislike Poor twisted me just as much. There are too many average tracks on both records, though.

[DTA]

I love pretty much every song on both Load & Reload but I wouldn't mind if Slither or Carpe Diem Baby didn't exist.

[Dream Team]

Had this thought about Metallica today; has any band ever created an album as great as Ride the Lightning at such a young age? James and Lars were 20 at the time. They had already released a groundbreaking album at 19. But RTL is leaps and bounds of growth and maturity and quality. I mean even the Beatles weren't releasing their best stuff until their late 20s. RTL is generally considered a landmark of an album by the metal commnity, just wondering if you can think of other bands that had landmark albums when the key members were 20 or younger?

[DTA]

Had this thought about Metallica today; has any band ever created an album as great as Ride the Lightning at such a young age? James and Lars were 20 at the time. They had already released a groundbreaking album at 19. But RTL is leaps and bounds of growth and maturity and quality. I mean even the Beatles weren't releasing their best stuff until their late 20s. RTL is generally considered a landmark of an album by the metal commnity, just wondering if you can think of other bands that had landmark albums when the key members were 20 or younger?

I have that same thought often but about MoP. These guys created an enduring metal classic at age 23 that was so well-developed and executed.

One band I can think of is Dimmu Borgir with Enthrone Darkness Triumphant. A symphonic black metal classic and I'm pretty sure they were only about 19-20 when it was written.

[twosuitsluke]

Alexi Laiho was like 17 when he wrote Children of Bodom's debut, so like 19 when Harebreeder came out I think. Hatebreeder is not revered in the way Ride is, obviously, but it is a hell of a fucking album!

[chknptpie]

I finished listening to Hardwired... to Self-Destruct just now. It was alright, but I've heard better from Metallica. I think my only real issue with the album is that it felt like there wasn't much variety. A lot of the songs kind of sounded the same. There were some good highlights, like "Dream No More" and "Spit Out the Bone", but I've heard more exciting and interesting stuff from past albums. Maybe it'll grow on me more as I give it more listens, but right now my impression is that it's good, but not great.

Well, with that I've completed this marathon of sorts of Metallica's 10 studio albums. I'll get around to S&M and Garage Inc. at some point, but as far as the main studio albums go, I've heard 'em all at least once. Overall, I'm really glad I decided to do this. A lot of the music was really good, and I'm even glad I heard the albums I ended up not caring for all that much. It was just a good experience overall, and I'll definitely be spinning at least most of these again and again (I don't know how much I'll be willing to go back to Reload, but I digress). I wish I could've done this a lot sooner, but hey, better late than never. Maybe one of these days I'll have to do another one of these first-time marathons for bands that I've always wondered about but never heard before because I felt pressured to not listen to them (probably for The Beatles, specifically). Since I like ranking stuff, I'll do a first-impression album ranking for Metallica. (Well, I've heard a couple of their albums multiple times already, but you get the idea.)

1. Master of Puppets
2. ...And Justice For All
3. Ride the Lightning
4. The Black Album
5. Kill 'Em All
6. Death Magnetic
7. Hardwired... to Self-Destruct
8. Load
9. St. Anger
10. Reload

Are we pretending Lulu doesn't exist?

[Adami]

I don’t think anyone, including the band themselves, consider LuLu a metallica album.

[twosuitsluke]

I consider Metallica my #2 all time favourite band, and have easily listened to them more than any band, by a long shot. I still haven't brought myself to listen to Lulu 

[chknptpie]

I don’t think anyone, including the band themselves, consider LuLu a metallica album.

 I mean.... they were all involved? lol

[Revenge319]

Are we pretending Lulu doesn't exist?

I was under the impression that Lulu wasn't a proper Metallica studio album, but rather just a collaboration project between Metallica and Lou Reed. I'm not really interested in listening to it anyway, based on how poorly received it was.

[MirrorMask]

Are we pretending Lulu doesn't exist?

I was under the impression that Lulu wasn't a proper Metallica studio album, but rather just a collaboration project between Metallica and Lou Reed. I'm not really interested in listening to it anyway, based on how poorly received it was.

You're under the right impression, that's all that ever was.

[KevShmev]

Had this thought about Metallica today; has any band ever created an album as great as Ride the Lightning at such a young age? James and Lars were 20 at the time. They had already released a groundbreaking album at 19. But RTL is leaps and bounds of growth and maturity and quality. I mean even the Beatles weren't releasing their best stuff until their late 20s. RTL is generally considered a landmark of an album by the metal commnity, just wondering if you can think of other bands that had landmark albums when the key members were 20 or younger?

Not a band, but Taylor Swift released her second album, Fearless, when she was 18, and that won Album of the Year and is considered a pretty significant album of the last 15 years.

[Stadler]

Doesn't really count, because Page and Jones were experienced musicians at that point, but Plant and Bonham were 19/20 when recording Led Zeppelin I, and Ozzy and Tony were 21 when they recorded their debut.

I'm not arguing that it's not impressive what Metallica did, but I'm not putting Ride The Lightning up there with Led Zeppelin I and Black Sabbath. 

EDIT:  It's interesting; I've been looking up musicians and their birth dates...  It's amazing to me to see where musicians fit into the larger time span.   You've got a window of '42 to '45, where McCartney, Lennon, Jagger, Richards, Blackmore, Page, then you have this window from about '48 to '50:  Plant, Bonham, Simmons, Iommi, Osbourne, Banks, Rutherford, Collins, Halford...    Then you dig deeper, and you see that Page and Jones - in the first group - teamed up with Bonham and Plant - the second group.  So did Jon Anderson - the first group and Squire - the second.   Meaningless, I guess, but fascinating.

[KevShmev]

What's amazing to me is to think about how prolific and influential the Beatles were, and then consider that they were broken up before Lennon or McCartney even turned 30. 

[billboy73]

Bad Seed has a good groove. PTM and Ronnie are both just meh.

All the worst songs are on Load though. Not Reload.

Reloads worst song - Slither is still better than PTM.

I really want to like Slither, but the "Don't go looking for snakes" bit just really kills it for me.  I love the intro riff for Ronnie, but it goes nowhere from there.  Poor Twisted Me is by far the worst song from the Load era.

I do enjoy Cure and Bad Seed though.

[Dream Team]

Had this thought about Metallica today; has any band ever created an album as great as Ride the Lightning at such a young age? James and Lars were 20 at the time. They had already released a groundbreaking album at 19. But RTL is leaps and bounds of growth and maturity and quality. I mean even the Beatles weren't releasing their best stuff until their late 20s. RTL is generally considered a landmark of an album by the metal commnity, just wondering if you can think of other bands that had landmark albums when the key members were 20 or younger?

Not a band, but Taylor Swift released her second album, Fearless, when she was 18, and that won Album of the Year and is considered a pretty significant album of the last 15 years.

You're right, not a band.

Now that I think about it, I seem to remember some 12-year-old releasing something awesome from his bedroom on Youtube . . . might as well include that.

[Zantera]

I like how you can't even escape Taylor Swift's name in Metallica threads these days

[Stadler]

Had this thought about Metallica today; has any band ever created an album as great as Ride the Lightning at such a young age? James and Lars were 20 at the time. They had already released a groundbreaking album at 19. But RTL is leaps and bounds of growth and maturity and quality. I mean even the Beatles weren't releasing their best stuff until their late 20s. RTL is generally considered a landmark of an album by the metal commnity, just wondering if you can think of other bands that had landmark albums when the key members were 20 or younger?

Not a band, but Taylor Swift released her second album, Fearless, when she was 18, and that won Album of the Year and is considered a pretty significant album of the last 15 years.

You're right, not a band.

Now that I think about it, I seem to remember some 12-year-old releasing something awesome from his bedroom on Youtube . . . might as well include that.

AC/DC, or UFO.  I think Michael Schenker was 17 or 18 when he started writing Rock Bottom and Lights Out.

[Skeever]

I like how you can't even escape Taylor Swift's name in Metallica threads these days

Probably the most funny development this place has undergone in recent years.

[425]

Worst song of the Load era? I have to go with Better Than You. Just nothing appealing about it at all, and a truly awful chorus. The other contenders would be Poor Twisted Me, which is just a nothing song, and Bad Seed, which has annoying elements of its own. I also do not like Carpe Diem Baby. I know some people do, but I just find it mildly irritating. Prince Charming is one that I barely remember but don't think I like. Wasting My Hate is kind of another nothing song.

I do like Slither; I actually think it's one of the sleeper songs on those albums. Cure sits right on the edge between good and annoying for me. I end up saying that it's not among the better half but it's not the worst.

One song that I haven't seen mentioned at all in the last couple of pages that I really think deserves more credit is Thorn Within. I think it flies under the radar because it's close to the end of a very long album and it's a stylistically unremarkable straight-ahead rock song in between two very unusual songs (Mama Said and Ronnie).

Something like this?

Fuel   
The Memory Remains
The House Jack Built   
The Unforgiven II   
Ain't My Bitch
Bleeding Me
Devil's Dance
Until It Sleeps   
King Nothing   
The Outlaw Torn
Where the Wild Things Are   
Hero of the Day
Low Man's Lyric   
Fixxxer

This is a good list for a combined album. I have two playlists that I've kept for years with only a few changes, one at 78 minutes and the other at 110; I think the track order for both could be improved, but I'm happy with the selections. I listen to the short version more often, but the long version contains some other tracks I like to return to sometimes.

Short version:
1. Fuel
2. The Memory Remains
3. The Outlaw Torn
4. Mama Said
5. The House Jack Built
6. Until It Sleeps
7. Hero of the Day
8. Bleeding Me
9. Where the Wild Things Are
10. Low Man's Lyric
11. The Unforgiven II
12. Fixxxer

Long version:
1. Fuel
2. The Memory Remains
3. The House Jack Built
4. Until It Sleeps
5. Devil's Dance
6. Ain't My Bitch
7. Hero of the Day
8. Bleeding Me
9. Thorn Within
10. Where the Wild Things Are
11. Fixxxer
12. Mama Said
13. 2 x 4
14. King Nothing
15. Low Man's Lyric
16. Slither
17. The Unforgiven II
18. The Outlaw Torn